I've seen a lot of aoe4 videos but this one is the greatest one I've ever seen. You explained it perfectly. I only wonder if an often rushing civ like French were to do a turtle, would they make early farms too. I know it's intrinsic to archan chapel play style but what about other civs. Brilliant vid. I look forward to the boom guide.
@@Valdemar1902 im just thinking if you're in a French mirror and you know a predictable rush is coming then it would make the most sense to turtle id assume.
@@chrisnewtownnswit's a fair thought, But those pocket resources are juicy enough for the French that a french turtle by definition is giving up a lot. This being said some defensive tips are applicable at least where I'm at (early platinum) I tend to enjoy defences at hunts captured at the maps center etc just to make life easier. Its not a full turtle but some of the principles can apply and even light fortifications can turn the tide in a fight.
@@catbiscuits4424 something to also consider is pocket resources like deer can be brought back to your turtle via pro scouts e.t.c. collecting relics works on that similar concept. Bringing resources to safety vs collecting them fast at the expense of vulnerability.
@@chrisnewtownnsw One of the problems is that for the... I think 450 resources to get pro scouts plus a couple more scouts to make the collection of deer timely and not too apm intensive. For that much you could collect just a little more and get an early second town center, Something much more valuable economically, Especially if you throw it down on top of a close deer (or boar) hunt. Secondly seeing as Turtling is designed to counter hard aggression by the time your scouts are ready to be bringing back deer that aggro player should already be sniffing round your base so there's a decent chance they might intercept your scouts and kill them.
Couple of questions: 1. Why do you place the Aachen so forward? Yes, it accelerates your 2nd TC timing but it seems super greedy as you know you will have to defend and that Aachen is basically at your frontline and receives major damage during the second push. 2. Why do you go Castle right after the first push? You are already on 2 TC and have a significant eco lead. Isn't the risk reward of Castle at that point too high? You know he will push again since you are booming anyway, would units not be the better call here? 3. You have very few production buildings going into castle. Does Regnitz make sense here or would Burger have been the better call? Seems like you are struggling a lot after you found out that your horsemen were basically useless and you had no production buildings to adapt.
Okay, a lot of questions, I will answer them briefly: Aachen placement front is okay, if you can defend it. Castle after the first push is allowed becaues he lost way more than I did, so I can exploit that advantage, as he will either go back or keep attacking. Burgrave is not good vs malians as feudal musofadi wreck MAA, and I can just make more production when I have 30-40 vill lead. Reignitz is fine, as relics will play an important role in the scenario, where I don't have access to gold (see map layout). Also, Reignitz is fine too, as production was added.
Thank-you mate! I'm an older player with reduced APM and a beginner. I've only played AI on Easy and Intermediate ( which I have beaten a couple of times, but only by attacking quickly ). It looks like to win I need to play attacking and defensive at the same time whilst also building an economy which is a lot of APM? Any suggestions, as I would like to play online but don't feel like I would be competitive till maybe I can be AI on hard?
In this game, wasn't Regnitz the wrong call and you should have gone Burgrave? You've already secured an sizable eco lead not only through 2TC but also because of the engagement (besides army, you destroyed 1000w in rams). This didnt allow Kiljardi to go castle. So you secured yourself a tech lead as well. The only thing that could have killed you would have been an all in during feudal because you invested 1800 into age up. Burggrave would have mitigated this danger.
Burgrave is not good vs malians as feudal musofadi wreck MAA, and I can just make more production when I have 30-40 vill lead. Reignitz is fine, as relics will play an important role in the scenario, where I don't have access to gold (see map layout). Also, Reignitz is fine too, as production was added.
@@Valdemar1902I understand your points in the general aspect of the matchup, however not so in this specific match. Is musofadi advisable when you are behind and the enemy has spears + horsemen? Do 2nd age musofadi do enough dmg against 3rd age MAA to stop the flood of MAA and an occasional landsknecht? Was Mali even be able to spot your castle age landmark? I don't really know how much vision you had since you lost your scout at one point. But as you always say: Scout before going castle, so I assume you rebuilt one and knew that Mali was massing spears and archers. Burgrave would have had an immediate effect and the 2nd fight wouldn't have been close (sure the mangonel saved the day, but you were close to losing it, you lost your whole army and had considerable idle time). You would have won on the spot or at least gained map control (giving you all the gold you need). What could Mali have done in this situation? He was stuck in feudal with an inferior eco and also lost the map. Regnitz didn't do a lot, except securing a massive lead into late game which under optimal play would never have happened because you were already miles ahead.
@@t3ss33 your analysis was spot on here. Part and parcel with a turtle is a counter attack that immediately follows the first successful battle. Otherwise you've converted your turtle into a boom which will be vulnerable to a second enemy aggro wave.
I am just getting into AOE, but I have played rts games for a long time. I'm curious, why does everyone place the 2nd tc so close to the first? Shouldn't you place it next to more resources? I get that it adds defensive vaule, but splitting up your eco and having more map control/positioning seems to be more fruitful in theory. Most of these matches never go the distance. There are so much resources left. The more resources the bigger the army.
On the map, Hill and Dale, the deer spawn in the base. As HRE setting up farms is quick to pay itself off due to inspiration, those things combined make sense on this map. If you place the TC outside of the hill spawn vs a hyper-aggressive-player your odds are significantly lower
@Valdemar1902 I can't disagree with anything you have said, but I have to choose the ladder. From my observation, most players win with numbers, but this game favors positioning. Again, my chances in success are lower, but practice makes perfect. Did you know that it is ideal to defend with heavy armored units and attack with the lighter army? I'm sure you can figure out why. It is interesting how man at arms forces out micro management....🤔
@chrisnewtownnsw That doesn't mean he is right. Light armored units are the fastest units in the game outside of calvary. They can get in and out of combat. It makes them great for patrolling the map. Heavier units are better in combat, but they are slow and cost more income and production time. If you engage in combat with heavier units, you will be more or less forced to fight. I haven't dabbled into AOE4 lately because of how busted some the mechanics are, but ppl play this game incorrectly. It is because of the broken mechanics. Games usually last up to 30 minutes, but a lot of resources are still on the map. Why is that? It is because games are ending much sooner than the devs intended. Concepts like 2 TCs on top of each other are unnecessary. You should be able to defend with 1. Placing your second TC to defend a key point on the map while gathering new resources is a far better strategy, but it is possible to be map dependent.
@@Valdemar1902 witch is annoying because the game just about tells you to play defensively with them in their videos with nearly every clip being of a bunch of bombards on a hill with a line of jans in a defensive position. They seem to have taken a different approach from AoE2 and 3. It even seems like they wanted to give them the option to play defensively with several options for food without leaving the TC area. *Shrug*
@@Valdemar1902seems the recent patch has given some potential to turtling ottoman. Fast imperial and military schools for free units are kinda in right now.
that's a refreshing opinion considering my experience has been the game being lopsided in rushing/aggro opponents and next to no turtles. 49% aggros 49% boomers and 2% turtles.
