For those of you on the fence about purchasing a binoviewer, I won't comment on the best or worst. I will say the power switch is a game changer. It allows one pair of eyepieces to become three. Right there is a huge savings, thus lowering the price. The unit is very well made but I think the real game changer is the customer service. When can you call a number and have the owner and developer answer? Russ is one of those rare breeds, honest, passionate about his product and just generally a nice man.He will spend time with you not to sell but to teach Try that with a large company. This is like having the store down the block, there when you need him if a problem arises and assurance that he will solve it.
The power switch certainly is intriguing. I use an Orion linear binoviewer with their parfocaled zoom eyepieces, but I also use regular eyepieces in that binoviewer a lot. This binoviewer could have interesting implications for BOTH eyepiece types...
I’ve had the pleasure of using the 21mm 3D eyepieces and it is a game changer for me. First of all it was not subtle. M22 was a religious experience. Diamond pinpoints floating in space detached from the surrounding stars. Changing magnification did not lesson the effect. It was really interesting seeing this effect on different objects. M11…wow. The Omega nebula literally floated around the eyepiece. I’ve been looking at it for 30 plus years but it felt like I was discovering it for the first time. In 3D. I was using it on a 7” refractor and it just rocked. Globulars are just crazy with this setup. I highly recommend calling Russ. Tell him exactly what equipment you have and he will build you a bino setup that will blow your mind. I was really apprehensive due to recent cataract surgery and he talked me down. Everything he said turned out to be right on the money. You can trust Russ. This stuff is not cheap, but man what a huge difference it will make in you observations. Respectfully, Doug Finch
Excellent Review Ed! I must say that the Binotron has transformed my Urban stargazing and has kept me in the Hobby ( I live in a Bortle 7-8 in SE mass). the Binotron system with power/filter switch is a game changer. Trust me when I say that your first look at a star cluster through the 3D eye pieces are unforgettable! Russ says this system is maximized in Dark skies, but I give a personal endorsement for all my friends struggling under light polluted skies! It brings so much value to the much smaller assortment of deep sky objects available to us! It also feels great to support a small business. For those who don’t know Russ designs, assembles and hand collimates each unit. Russ IS the factory Ed ! Haha .
Observing planets, moon, sun (with appropriate front aperture filter of course), clusters the apparent perceived increase in contrast and detail is simply astounding!
Russ is a great guy, I love a business owner who will spend the time personally to help a customer. I talked to him for 20 minutes, he assessed my needs and sold me the appropriate equipment.
Elon Musk used to be like that back in the day with Tesla. Company grows exponentially, Russ is now CEO and no-one deals or hears from him directly anymore. Products become diversified and quality drops in favor of profits. Happens all the time. We must be grateful for Russ for this moment.
Thank you so much Ed for this informative video on the Denkmeier B27 binoviewer system. I've had mine for a few months and am only now getting a chance to use it (due to living in a northern coastal cloudy climate). I really appreciate your showing how to configure the system for all three types of scopes since I have one of each. There are so many parts and adapter pieces that it's confusing without some guidance. Your description of the many parts, eyepieces, 3-D effect, and how they all function is extremely helpful. I now want to get out there are see how well it works on each of my scopes. Russ at Denkmeier has been very helpful answering my questions as well.
I just bought this exact bino just before Ed's video. I'm taking it on a trip to Bortle 2 skies during the March New Moon and I cant wait! On my two tedt runs, one with a 16" Dob, the other and 8se, the only quirk was figuring out the extentions to use, or not, to get it to focus on all 3 powerswitch positions. I'm only using 24mm Televue Panoptics.
Another outstanding review. Thank you Ed. It came at a great time for me. I've been thinking about getting a binoviewer to help my wife get more interested in astronomy. I think she would like the viewing experience better then with a single eye piece.
Ed spoke truth about spending more time staring at a target. First time some of my family members (who'd looked through plenty of my gear before) experienced a binoviewer they spent way more time staring (as did I!). I recommend the moon as a first target. It's easily the best crowd pleaser. Starting off with Jupiter? Not so much.
Great review, Ed. Very thorough description of the setups for different types of scopes. Personally, I have an inexpensive (Orion branded) binoviewer that I regularly take up over 300x on the moon. I like the power options on this unit, and the option to re-collimate. Want!
I bought the complete set last year including the 3D eye piece, I mostly image but have really enjoyed it. I find the 3D effect very nice and enjoyable
My friend has a Denkmeier and he asked me to bring my C6-N f/5 reflector to our next Moon-Gaze. Note, my C6-N had the mirrors refigured to 1/12th wave and .98 Strehl, it is like a refractor on how sharp it is. I brought it and he had an EQ6 mount for it, which was good as my iOptron AZ Pro wouldn't hold that weight way out there very steady nor would my CG-4 mount hold it steady either. Anyway after I did collimation he put it in my scope with a spacer and racked it out and had me look. I was amazed at how good it looked and it wasn't the 3D eyepiece, but it felt like it. I thought it would dim the view significantly, but nope. Moon is so bright you wouldn't notice anyway. We were in the town square, but for the Moon light pollution doesn't matter, but I want to use them on Orion. They are amazing.
Interesting video. I fancied using a binoviewer until I was told what should be really obvious on a previous video of Eds. The light being shared by 2 eyepieces only gets 1/2 the light. Great on the moon, jupitor etc. but not so good with dim objects maybe. They're also a bit too expensive having to have 2 eyepieces as well. Great video Ed, many thanks for posting. Clear skies!
Rather less than 1/2 because of all the extra glass and optical surfaces. I am extremely sensitive to miscollimation so I don't even much care for actual binoculars. I have yet to look through a binoviewer that did not seem artificial to me.
in my experience with using them to observe brighter objects is that the dimming is largely due to the barlow element increasing magnification. I moved from a 4" f/10 to a 6" f/5 for the rough effect of collecting enough light to be equal to a 4" binocular pair but the image was still much brighter than my 4" scope from brain tricks like summation and having double the receptors(let alone the lower focal ratio increasing my used exit pupils). @@ultrametric9317 Obviously this isn't the best for dimmer targets so YMMV. also multi-coatings greatly reduce light reflections causing attenuation.
Your brain is able to reclaim some lost light in its internal “processing.” Most agree the number is around 70% of the original light, so it’s not exactly has bad as a 50% loss. This can vary by individual though, since our brain image processing varies. I experience very little apparent light loss, what I do experience is normally made up for by increased contrast of two eyes. Only exception is if the object is just at the limits of being seen in the scope.
@@ryankoch1874 Can you explain why there would be a 30% light loss? We're not talking about multiple mirrored surfaces where your average mirror "only" reflects back 91-92% of the light. These are clear - and I'm going to guess, multicoated - optics, including the prism that's splitting the light in two. Where does the 30% light loss come from?
The 30% light loss was in reference to the binoviewer beam splitters, which split the light sending 50% to each eye. The light loss due to coatings, prisms, etc should be negligible. Even though each eye is only receiving 50% of the light, the brain “combines” some of that light back together, so the net loss for most people is closer to only 30%.
Thank you Ed for a most enjoyable read (?). Regarding the SCT and, especially, the refractor, Tron configurations. As Yoda said, "There is another"....configuration that is. Simply screw the OCS element directly into the 2" nosepiece of the Tron and not in the nose of the 2" diagonal. This reduces the power switch magnification levels to about 1.15X, 1.7X and 2.5X and less out travel is needed to reach focus. Give it a try with your refractors and cass's. You will be able to reach focus in the mid and high power modes, but, with some refractors, you may not have enough in travel to reach focus in the low power mode. But you might. Regarding the 3D eyepieces, what a hoot they are! I love them for doubles like Alberio where I can put one star in front of the other and Uranus & Neptune where I can put the planets in front of the background stars...as it should be. Also the 21MM neutral eyepieces are excellent in their own right, sharp, with low scatter and a neutral tint. Thanks again!
Great video, Ed! I have an older Denk deep sky binoviewer that mostly goes unused. But when I bother to drag it out I'm always surprised at the 3d effect that my brain creates. I've always just used regular plossls and it works fine! Some nice tips on using binoviewers! 👍👍
What a large cumbersome design in my opinion. I don't like the long extended nosepiece. The Baader has the GPC fit directly inside the binoviewer so no nosepiece is required. The binoviewer then attaches directly onto the diagonal. This allows for a very short light path.
I've had that unit for about 10 years. For lunar and planetary observing there's just no comparison, I see so much more with the binos. With the power switch I do 99 percent of my observing with just a pair of 18mm Delites in 12" and 16" scopes. Espensive, a bit of a pain to set up, but worth it.
Another great review, Ed! Really appreciate the thorough overview of the components and the considerations for getting into binoviewing. Two things I was hoping you’d cover: How did the setup generally fare on SCTs? (I have a CPC 1100.) I appreciate your objectivity and mentioning that each person’s experience may differ, but did using the Binotron bring YOU enough enjoyment to go back into a binoviewing phase? 😄
Thanks for this review. I’ve been considering the Denkmeier and a skywatcher 12” Synscan collapsible dob. This scope has a dedicated bino-viewer position that gives you about 4 inches of back focus so you can use the binotron without the Barlow. This gives you 6 different magnification options instead of 3 by using it with the Barlow in the standard position. The goto and tracking feature makes higher magnifications more appealing too, especially with a 12” scope. I would appreciate your thoughts on the quality of the standard eyepieces, including the 14mm, and in comparison to a similar Tele vue. Thanks again!
Hello, Mr. Ting; "Thank you", for another interesting video. But it also brings a question to my mind; How would a bino viewer compare to a true bino 'scope? Maybe like the one NASA used to photo some launches? Or one of the home built we've seen in magazines (remember those?) or videos? The reason I ask is, adding a bino viewer (eyepiece holder) is actually a substitute for an actual binary telescope. So while your review is excellent (& very interesting, too!) I think the 'real test' is comparing it to an actual binary scope. Just a thought. Have a GREAT day, Neighbor!
I hang out occasionally with 2 clubs and a community college planetarium and I have yet to see someone set one of these things up so I can sneak a peek thru one.
I notice you handle this equipment with such great care to avoid damage. If I was in your shoes I probably would have used white soft gloves like the referee of a major snooker game LoL
Typically there isn't enough in travel, so reflector owners have to get a shorter pole set. Does this binoviewer require that? Also what to do with f/3.3? Stack a corrector in series?
HOW MUCH SHOULD I PAY FOR NATIONAL GEO. 130mm EQ AND DO YOU THINK IT WORTH. DO YOU HAVE A BETTER CELESTRON ALTERNATIVE?( ORION IS NOT AVAILABLE IN MY AREA)
Hi ed ting I am from Iraq and I want to buy a telescope but there are not any telescopes brands but there's a Chinese company is called Kson ti is a good company or not ? Pls help
Ah that's too bad, I'm having fun with it (though the planetary mode is practically useless). I also have a Celestron Evo 8 but that's not so useful on my balcony in light-polluted Montreal. The other night I showed my young grandchildren the Orion and Horsehead Nebulas live-stacking , they were enthralled!
Great Video Ed,Those Are Sweet,I Saw Someone Build A Set Of Bino’s,With 2,8 SCT Opt Tubes,Diagonals On Both,Bent In Together To View Thru At The Same Time,No Clue Of All The Work That Went Into The Build,But Can Just Imagine How Amazing That Will Be,Thank You And Clear Skies❤️🪽✨🙏🏻🔭🌎
Since spotting scopes have internal prism type erectors and focusers, there is no way to place the OCS optic before them so typically, one cannot use any binoviewer I designed a biocular spotter but was to heavy to be practical. Birders consider a TV 85 to be Gargantuan!
It’s possible, but expensive and more complicated than it seems. You have to have a special mounting arrangement to get both scopes precisely aligned to one another, and special prism devices instead of diagonals to get the light to your unique eye spacing requirements. In the end buying a slightly larger scope to make up for the light loss in binoviewers is a cheaper solution. You also enjoy the better resolution of the larger aperture (only brightness gets better with a bino scope, not resolution, which is unaffected by binoviewers).
"Is it possible to put 2 refractors side by side and and have 1 for each eye" Well, binoculars exist ;-) Technically you then have one telescope per eye so no bigger diameter but twice the amount of light. Some of them have interchangeable eypepieces like telescopes.
There is a telescope company called TEC that does just that. They can take two 140mm refractors and make a pair of binoculars out of them. But they cost $18,000 and it takes over 2 years to build.
Great review! I’ve been binoviewing for 20 years, this is the best overview of the challenges I’ve seen. The binotron is also my favorite unit after using nearly all available binoviewers. One error I’ll point out, merging trouble is not related to magnification like he mentioned at start of review! It’s related to eyepiece focal length only. Let’s assume Ed needs a 15mm eyepiece to reach is max 120x he said he can merge in the video. If he used the 15mm eyepiece with the 3x amplifier setting on the binoviewer, his ability to merge would be identical as it is at 120x, but he’d now be at 360x and able to merge. He would not be able however to merge an equivalent 5mm eyepiece without an amplifier. This is why it’s essential to use some sort of amplifier ahead of the binoviewers to reach high powers (there are other optical benefits to doing this too). The longer the focal length of the eyepiece, the easier the merging. The power is irrelevant, and any amplification ahead of the binoviewer is immune to causing merging problems.
Thanks for that. I'll run some experiments with magnification. There is one guy in the club who cannot merge the images in *any* bino-type optics, including 7X binoculars. Is he an isolated case?
Yes, I’d imagine he has an eye or brain processing related issue if it applies to all two eyed options. The long focal length eyepiece trick also works to get around poorly collimated binoviewers. I have some old Binovues that I can’t merge with even medium focal length eyepieces. Can still reach high/medium powers with them as long as I barlow ahead of the units though, and use long focal lengths. Makes them still useful and not expensive paperweights.
