I did notice that eris actually modified oryx’s original design slightly which is what gives us the initial 10 regular rounds. If you notice in d1 there is a shield around the ravenous heart that weakens as the heart tries to lash out and take our health and eventually breaks on the final round. It also comes with a warning light that shows the integrity of the shield. Once it breaks and you keep firing the heart is able to lash out at you with tendrils which are what deals the damage. I do miss that detail in d2
The shield is still there. It’s just harder to see. I believe when you stand on the plates for the catalyst quest it brightens up and is more prominent
@@aenxiety I think the reason they are not showing might be due to field of view. I'm playing on xbox one s so I can't adjust my fov but I can see the tendrils while firing the gun.
i love that oryx's understanding of the darkness and light came close to witness level logic, only to be curb stomped by a couple of rogue quardians for a shiny self harming scout
The way I see it is the witness isn't the darkness I.E the vinnover itself rather kind of like a representative, and what auryx met before becoming the taken king oryx was the actual vinnover.
The Witness is the mouthpiece of The Darkness; meant to spread it's message to the universe through communication. Oryx was the champion of The Darkness; meant to *EMBODY* the message in his actions, to be the living example of The Darkness' philosophy.
@@aistikasmursu9432 nah the darkness is the winnower it was confirmed in a cutscene in game in the new season (season 21) ik this post is 9 months old but yeah lmfao
Getting touch of malic in d1 was one of my most memorable series of moments in the entire series. I appreciate it returning, and I understand why they couldn't do a quest for it, but damn do I wish there was one 😩
@@noonebob7530 that's why a mix of both is nice. You have vex, thousand voices, collective, eyes of tomorrow and all that shit to spend your rng on. Touch of malice could have had a quest 😂
I’m so stupid. I just realized that the reason ToM does self damage stems from Insight, where oryx states that he and his killer will defeat and correct each other until we become omnipotent
Guardians are so damn powerful that they wield 2 hive gods as Weapons and turned Savathûn's worm into a regenerating explosive. Damn things are hella powerful and we wield them like tennis rackets.
I just wish ToM was given via a pseudo-quest, where after clearing Kings Fall first time, we go on a Dreadnought exploration, Pyramid Mission style and collcet the pieces so that Eris can rebuild it for us. Instead, we have to pray to the Supreme One, The RNGsus to bless us.
They've gotten really lazy with their raids lately. Even Vow is just more of "I can see what you can't" but with more symbols. Don't even get me started with master raids.
Wait... Wait wait wait. Eat the Light, Eat the Path? That's a goddamn *Marathon* reference. Specifically to Marathon Infinity, the most confusing of all three Marathon games, but I do seem to recall that it's a part of the Marathon protagonist's process of... Apotheosis. Ascension to godhood.
There is so much cross over from Marathon lore. Verse 4:1 has Oryx call the Witness the waves which are battles and the battles which are the waves. And there's the similarities of Durandal and Rasputin. It's a rabbit hole.
How Ironic would it be if we end up killing the witness with touch of malice at some point given the witness tricked the hive into becoming the hive in the first place then he'd be ended by a hive God via touch of malice
@@wesb337 I think he'll come out on top... just not quite the way he wants, I expect us to be defeated and so we escape, but I don't expect us to beat him... I don't know though, all I know is he better be the best villain by ALOT. I don't want him to be a simple raid boss or something, it's gotta be special... I don't know what it could be though...
Xol isn't Whisper. The thousand wings ship lore says, almost literally, "the gun is not the god, it is an instrument of its will, and when we wield that instrument, what are we in turn being wielded by?" It's one of the most widespread misonceptions in the Destiny community and I have no idea how, given that the thousand wings ship released alongside Whisper as part of the catalyst quest for it.
I remember turning enemy body parts into weapons back in the original PSO where I would take an enemy part like Booma (or Bear) claws, big mantis arms, certain robot parts, even corrupted DNA to turn a shiny new gun. The love of turning my enemies into shiny or just flat out cool weapons or armor has not diminished. The only difference is that ToM has a Hive god that works for me with some vacation days from time to time.
Without knowing the witness deceived Em: "Come great enemy and enjoy your rightfully earned power of which you were chosen to take" When finding out the witness deceived em: "Bring hell upon that traitor who brought us to ruin with his own power and make him kneel to the true wielders of the darkness"
That’s so cool how the wormfood lore tab has a bunch of marathon references, including the title. The whole last part about eating the path is almost taken straight out of a terminal from Infinity
Hell, the back half of that lore card is just the, "Eat the Path," terminal from the dream levels paraphrased. Additionally, "I'll make sure," is what the phrase, "Aye Mak Sicur," the final level of Marathon Infinite, means. The motto of the Kirkpatrick clan. Granted this is an unsubstantiated rumor.
I really do miss the Bomb Logic idea, how we used the light to be smarter than Oryx and use his power against him. I can understand the changes in D2, now that we are the most powerful and have claimed our existence by fighting for it
Don't forget about Xol. This was Xol's plan as well with Whisper of the Worm. So the Hive have learned how to cheat death because guardians use their power for weapons fulfilling the sword logic.
Have you, or ever considered, uploading a audio only version of your content as a podcast i would love to just listen to lore for 12hrs a day at work lol
On one end im happy ToM is back….. on the other end after all i went through on that quest to get the ToM, just for it to come back and now ive gotta raid all over again for it with a daunting RnG, Lack of ability to find a Level headed group of 5 to play with, much less the time needed to raid *sighs* I’ve got my work cut our for me if ima wield this again.
A lot of people post LFGs for Oryx CP mate, worth going on the app and looking for a team. As long as you've watched a video/tried the fight before you've joined, a lot of people are understanding, you just have to be straight up with teams mate 👍
I love TOM and King's fall lore. And now with that we got it back. Perhaps the Witness shall think twice. Because when my Guardian gets this gun. I am going to use it in Lightfall and the Final Shape. I will prove that Oryx's understanding at first was right. But that we The Guardians of light and Dark are the ones who shall be the Final Shape itself!
I kinda wish the Vow of The Disciple raid exotic was Lubrae's Ruin. Same function as Collective Obligation, but on a Glaive. It would be so much cooler since the weapon has so much lore. And it's the weapon the boss actually uses, so it'd make sense to be an exotic. You could also make the exotic version of it instead perform Rhulk's Beam attack after landing a few hits with the projectile.
Part of me wants to see Oryx just straight resurrect via the Touch of Malice, Books of Sorrow-style. “I am knowledge, and you have brought me back through knowledge.”
Never, and I mean never since vanilla D1, have I EVER gotten a raid exotic drop on my first clear. How fitting that Touch of Malice was dropped for me on my first clear of Kingsfall in D2, when it is my favorite raid, and Oryx is my favorite character. What a high that was and still is.
I want ALL of the videos you have prepped Byf! I love listening to your takes on the lore, and I wish I could join you in a lore discussion someday. You do an amazing job as the Destiny Loremaster, and I hope to be watching your videos 10 years from now!
The way i see it we "The Guardian" have inherited Oryx's will, we aren't the taken king but we took the dark we embody death to many. I feel in a way Savathun sees that and if she ever returns may call us "Brother" when we battle the witness
We are the final shape confirmed. Half joking but I'll over explain why, we walk between light and dark and yet we are kinda outside both of their control, they can only try to influence us. Savathun is a great example of someone who has also learned this lesson
The more I reread the Books of Sorrow, the more I rewatch Dynasty (again, FANTASTIC JOB Byf and Crew!), the more the Sword Logic makes sense to me. I don't know what that says about me. But I'm so happy King's Fall is back and I can teach my newbie clan members all of this amazing lore!
I want to see an interaction between ToM, Parasite, and the Whisper followed by Ruinous Effigy. Them out of no where Xenophage comes in just screaming at them. Lol
Have you noticed that the Delicate Tomb looks like the PKE meter from Ghostbusters when it changes up? Lots of spirits and returning ghosts of the past this season.
While Eris at that point had reservations in ensuring Oryx would live forever through the Touch of Malice, she found comfort in knowing Oryx’s essence would be used to, ironically, slaughter more Hive in the future. But as Eris is now? She wields Stasis, and Hive magic. She’s created many foul weapons of destruction to purge the Hive from Sol, and used ancient relics like the Crown of Sorrow. Her outlook of Light and Dark changed when the Hive took everything from her, when was aided by Elizabeth to prevent her from falling to corruption. Now she will do anything, within reason, to destroy all the Hive. The Lucent Brood? No difference to her, in fact, she probably hates them even more, as those Hive were given the very power they stripped from her. With all her arcane knowledge and dark powers, she is determined to end the Osmium dynasty, and purge all Hive. Until they are nothing more than a memory to future generations. She is the bane to all Hive. Oryx may yet underestimate her desire for revenge.
There is something shortsighted about her outlook now though. The Hive are not just a people but an idea they express through themselves and upon others. Eris is an embodiment of the Hive. She’s become what she hated.
I recently learned about lore from bungie's older games such as marathon and the "eat the path" bit made my brain go full pepe silvia corkboard with possible connections with destiny's story (said connections have probably already been made before though)
me and my bestfriend in 5th grade always wanted to beat kings fall and get touch of malice it has been our favorite weapon for a long time I recently got it first try and was so happy I wish my friend was here to see it
@My name is Byf, can you do a breakdown of the lore in the mechanics of the final fight with Oryx? Like why is Toland there? Would Oryx not have shown up? What about the platforms? Why are they there? What's the origin of the vessel and where does his immortality come from? What about the corrupted light? Why are the ogres there? What was Oryx gonna do with them(since I doubt he called on them to be used against him.)
Touch of Malice: “What is my purpose?” Us: “We’re gonna use you to kill yourself in the final encounter because it’s an easy strat.” ToM: “By the worm gods...”
Oryx literally be like: "I was the number one, now the one who killed me is. If they are the number one, I will make sure there is no number two by becoming their weapon"
There is only one path and that is the path that you take, but you can take more than one path. Cross over the cell bars, find a new maze, make the maze from it's path, find the cell bars, cross over the bars, find a maze, make the maze from its path, eat the food, eat the path
What if oryx succeed? There nothing left? There’s nothing left to kill? He’d be killed by his worm eventually, he was destined to die either by us, someone else or because of his worm, that’s the fault of the hive, they’ll run out of food
What I'm wondering is if the Nightmare harvester from Season of the Haunted was crafted from the Ravenous Heart at the core of the Touch of Malice. it's kind of suspicious that the Nightmare Harvester starts beating like a heart after Eris does the binding ritual...
Wait. That part about the cell bars and path at 5:00 or so... that's a marathon: infinity reference. Jeez how much of that game series is referenced lol
I remember Luke mentioning the gun and how proud they were of it and the quest. It's too bad they didn't bring it back by a quest instead of just bad rng.
I think this is something D2 is missing, while crafting the exotics could be obnoxious and taxing at times, it made them so much more satisfying to get, as well it weapons that were "crafted" through quests gave them a deeper significance than just another random weapon drop
I remember talk n the community about the possibility, however slight, of hive guardians becoming allies with us. But I worry that IF that were to happen that might b just what is needed, n this timeline, to push Eris over to the dark. Just a random thought while listening to u talk about Eris’ hatred of hive.
I know it’s video games,…..but I have a theory/question….. Is oryx’s will his own? I believe the last moments before we defeat him in he casts a spell (so to speak) that Takes him. Meaning while we face him the reason he slams plates instead of just grabbing guardians and destroying them. So I believe while we fight him in the raid he gave up his will, hence game mechanics but why also the plates “weave” his soul to our frame and shape him into the Tom we know an love.
Lore fiend rambling ahead... I want to know, with all the paths that Oryx has taken, which one leads to his resurrection? We know he learned to Take himself, we know he deliberately made a pact with Riven rather than taking Riven by force which would have been easy for him, but he willingly "wished to take" Riven in order to be bound to a creature that death had no finality on. He left bread crumbs to craft a weapon that could very well be feeding him the way that Black Hammer, I mean Black Spindle, I mean Whisper of the Worm feeds Xol. By the time we "kill him" in Regicide, he laughs and abandons his sword, but why? I believe in that moment of near defeat, he realized he could bypass death by taking himself. That his banished son, Nokris had been right after all this time, that the sword is not the final shape in the universe, but magic is. Deep, ancient, and powerful magic. I think he realized that Necromancy was only blasphemous if you didn't open your mind to a power beyond the sword. That immortality is the final shape. That the sword logic is flawed because we as guardians proved that. We are paracausal BUT death does not mean we were not meant to be the final shape, death is just another mold for us BECAUSE we can be resurrected and grow stronger still. I think that is what Oryx's laughter was at the end of the campaign in D1. The part that really makes me think that Oryx will return, besides the hints in the Bad Juju lore, is the lore surrounding Oryx wishing to take Riven we got back in Forsaken. And the existence of the Touch of Malice. I just don't know how or when, but I feel like Oryx is too important to the lore, and to Bungie. He reminds me of a mix between Diablo from the Diablo games, and Malthael from the same franchise. Which I know is no coincidence considering the team that made Diablo:Reaper of Souls helped Bungie with The Taken King expansion back in D1. But even in the old, and I mean OLD "playtest" footage when Bungie showed that very scripted Cosmodrome footage, they made a point of one of the devs joining in as "bng_Oryx" and Joe Staten always sprinkled the name out there as well. I believe Eris, in her hatred, in her moment of Revenge and spite, crafted the Touch of Malice and by doing so, opened to door to Oryx possibly rising again.
The mention of the books of sorrow made me realize something. The Witness had a “broski” type of speaking when it spoke to Oryx. I find that fact hilarious given what we know about the Witness.
The Witness seemed to consider Orxy as a loyal servant. One he was proud of, despite his “main man” not being an official Disciple. Even in death, he’s immortalized as the Touch of Malice. Though we use it, ironically, against the Witness’ forces, his legacy is still felt. As the Taken still haunt Sol without relenting, the horror and blight that Oryx unleashed may never end. As long as life exists and the Witness lives, there will always be unwilling victims to fill the Taken ranks. Like Eris said before: “any you kill will be replaced as Taken”. We killed the King, but many took his throne. First Savathun, now Xivu Arath holds the Taken’s reins. Even if the Osmium dynasty and the Witness are killed, the Taken may never be truly gone.
Do you think that Oryx's contingency plan was actually a way of killing The Witness? Like Touch of Malice is Oryx's betrayal against the witness much like Savathun. All of the Hive Gods becoming weapons so in the end they can Sword Logic the Sword Logic.
Heh - Oryx is going to cackle mightily when one of us uses The Touch of Malice to slay The Witness lawl. Though I really wish they'd included the full mission to craft it, because damn, it could have very fun.
Has it ever been our guardian's idea to turn hive shit into guns? Eris made Oryx into a gun, Mara made the worm into a gun, and Xol made himself into a gun. Right?
