To celebrate the arrival of The Last Guardian, Digital Foundry Retro revisits the Ueda Collection on PlayStation 2, starting with Ico. Subscribe for more DF Retro: bit.ly/DFSubscribe
@@daverhodus Nice! These days I do have the Ico/Shadow of the Colossus Re-Master for the PS3, the PS2 version and the PS4 Re-Make. I still prefer the PS2 version. It's almost unbelievable that it runs on the PS2. Witchcraft!
ICO isn't ugly, but there are far more technically impressive games on the PS2. Let's take God of War II as an example. Tons of enemies and effects on screen and massive setpiece moments all that at 480p, 16:9, 60FPS.
Wow man after watching this retrospective all i can say is what professionalism and attention to detail, such good blend of tech knowledge but also extremely passionate. Makes me proud to be a fellow gamer.
I would love to see a DF Retro of F-Zero GX on the Gamecube. That game to this day, is still one of the most impressive looking games from that gen. 480p, 60fps, wide screen support, 30 racers, and fantastic art direction. It holds up well even today.
Nice! I'm actually just playing ICO right now and I was not expecting it to be so awesome! It's good in a very different way than most games. It's like the realistic weight to everything that just makes it feel so real which makes simple platforming maneuvers often feel as scary and thrilling as it would in real life. Also the way they convey emotions and themes through its visuals work so well! When those monsters grab that girl, my brain instantly goes "LET GO OF HER YOU MONSTERS!!!" there is a connection to everything that most games don't have and that's what makes team ICO games so unique and masterful. However, this doesn't translate well to everybody. Some people connect a lot better to media that just blatantly explains everything in front of their face and those people often have a hard time appreciating team ICO games including TLG. Like when people say "The whole game is an escort mission and escort missions are trash." Those people for sure have no idea what the game is. It's so much more than just an "escort mission" and not all games where you help a girl get somewhere suck. Anyway I'm really rambling and I could go on forever. Amazing video! I fucking love the choices of games for this series!
Perfect DF Retro. I actually loved ICO and Shadow of the Colossus, but especially ICO was like a wonderful, playable fable. Heartwarming and cute. I will never forget the ending of the game (and of course i will not spoil it). I just say: For me it was perfect.
Ah this masterpiece will be forever in my heart as one of the best gaming experiences I had. So beautiful, clever puzzles and a really deep emotional story.
I just wanted to say that, opening the video with SotC's "Epilogue" brought tears in my eyes, no joke. This game made me a better person. I just wanted to say "Thank You" for that alone. And what an amazing insight. The debug mod analysis was very good, and it's amazing what Team Ico was able to achieve. Look forward to your next video.
Thank you very much for making DF Retro episode on one of the most influential game in gaming history. Big, big respect to Mr. Ueada and team around him. Ico, Shadow of the Colossus are unforgettable experiences. The Last Guardian is a must, if you have played previous games.
Watching this makes me wonder why we don't get PC style advanced graphics options in console games. Alot of people would like to be able to tone down the quality in order to hit a steady 60fps. Sure it caused some problems here but that was a debug mode that wasn't intended for common use.
They don't even have to do advanced graphics options. The developers could just figure out what's needed themselves and offer a simple option that lets you pick between "full graphics and unlocked framerate (expect drops from 60 down to low 40s when things get intense), full graphics with 30 FPS cap, reduced graphics and 60 FPS". A lot of PS4 games have the first two options, but sadly drop the ball and don't include the third one which is the one I'd use.
Yeah that's kind of what I was thinking. Uncharted 4 is half way there. It does full grapics quality at 30fps in the single player then tones down the quality to give stready 60fps in multiplayer. All games should give you option to choose between these in whatever mode you're playing in.
Because they can later sell you the improved ico and shadow of the colossus classic pack on PS3. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ico_%26_Shadow_of_the_Colossus_Collection
I don't know the first one was pretty impressive for a 2000 game. 4 player coop at decent framerate. Online MP on the PS2, The map editing tool was also impressive for a PS2 game. I'd say it's possible to do one. :)
fair point. the gamecube version of timesplitters 2 is still a favorite of mine and it is very impressive how solid the frame rate is. i guess im just hoping we might get a metal gear solid trilogy episode soon :)
Okay, thank you for confirming that the WIP early build of ICO was indeed at E3. I vaguely recall seeing it as I passed by Sony's booth tucked away as a WIP with no one really noticing it. That was one of those moments when I wish I had a camera to at the very least tried to get a photo for posterity!
its not their fault that PC only gets indie and mobile game releases and Xbox none at all. Ofc they will analyse PS4 games if they release week after week.
PS4pro videos will happen as frequently as Xbone/PS4 videos, the sooner you get used to them the better. They are here to stay. Same thing will happen once the Scorpio comes out. Dozens upon dozens of Scorpio videos, and PS4pro comparisons, etc. This is mostly a performance analysis channel, what are you expecting, seriously?
I always thought of Team ICO's games as tech demos. Ico, especially, because it's short and linear, but both ICO and SOTC are great examples of what the PS2 is capable of. SOTC is particularly impressive to me due to its expansive environments, giant creatures, and fur effects which basically had to be cleverly faked to work on the PS2. They're both impressive in their own ways and The Last Guardian is no exception. It may not be graphically impressive on the PS4, but Trico, in particular, is the most realistic animal I've ever seen in a video game. It acts very similar to my real life cat and dog. The individually moving feathers, how they look when they get wet, and how the boy can influence the animal, it's all very impressive. In fact, Trico makes me think of TLG as a tech demo for animal physics and AI.
Exactly what I was going to write. Even if some graphical effects are missing, it's still an amazing looking game when you turn off that hysterical motion blur (with the patch). I'm kinda shocked that RPCS3 runs this well. They really are phenomenal developers. It's a very easy way to play ICO & SotC today, while PCSX2 is also a valid option, RPCS3 is waaay easier to just setup and go!
Can't wait to see you guys re-analyze Shadow of the Colossus framerate to show haters complaining about Last Guardian that SotC ran at 18 frames per second, yet people still loved the game same with Ocarina of Time.
Douglas Harris Heh, it's actually worse than that. SotC is regularly 15fps and sometimes even 10fps. It goes very very low. Still impressive but...yeah, too ambitious for PS2 in a lot of ways.
KaNawogirusa I played the ps2 version then and the PS3 remaster. The resolution kills it on ps2. It DOESN'T EVEN run at 640x480. It runs at 320x240, clearly a hold over from its ps1 origins. That resolution is so disgusting that I could never play the original again after experiencing the remaster
Sweet, another DF Retro! AKA the only reason I'm still subscribed now that the PS4 Pro is the only thing this channel covers in its regular videos (seriously, no look at Watch Dogs 2 on PC, no look at Dead Rising 4 on PC, and only one video of Dead Rising 4 on Xbox One, but plenty of videos of FF15 and Last Guardian on PS4 Pro; even a video comparing what a map on PS3 looks like compared to a map on PS4 Pro in Uncharted multiplayer, WTF?!). Keep up the great work on these videos John, your DF Retro videos are the only thing keeping this channel alive right now.
Thankyou for an excellent episode,i somehow missed this when i had my PS2, i still have my PS3 which i bought when it first came out and have just ordered the HD remaster so really looking forward to playing both games.
I Just bought the HD collection yesterday, I've been putting it off for too long now. The game will come up in price now that the last guardian came out to, can't wait to try ico.
Anything that is created is art, it's starts with an artist designer therefore it is art that leads to an ending product representing the art of an artist.
Could you do the Soul Reaver series at some point? I seem to recall reading about how they basically invented a way to stream directly off disc for Soul Reaver one or something. I'm sure the series has some interesting back story.
Actually, the first game Fumito Ueda worked on was the Director's Cut of "D". I can't confirm what exactly he did, but, I believe he did the animation on the fire balls in the menu section. Possibly he did some work on one of the cut scenes that only appears in the Director's Cut of the game. Whatever it was, Fumito Ueda did indeed contribute some animation to the game before working on "Enemy Zero". There is also a slight chance that he might have done a little animation for the unreleased version of "D2". By the way, nice retrospective of "ICO" & "Shadow Of The Colossus". Hopefully these two games will get remastered for the PS4 with some new bonus material included.
I watched a couple minutes of this yesterday, then closed it, realizing I have the PS3 Remaster and have never beaten Ico before. Played a demo back when PS2 was the latest, but that's it. Beat Ico in a marathon sitting yesterday. Fantastic game. Took 7-8 hours for my blind playthrough. If you like team Ico's work, but haven't played Ico.... DO IT!
Looking at the comparison between the PS2 and PS3 version, I feel that the PS3 version lost part of the game's charm, areas looked too crisp and clear compared to the PS2 version.
This is the same complaint I always hear about the crash bandicoot n-sane trilogy. How does looking crisp and clean suddenly mean a game has lost its charm?
For me personally, it depends on the game, for example I love how near pixar-esque the new Crash Bandicoot trilogy looks, in case of this Ico remaster, however, I find that clarity takes away part of the game's atmosphere. In the case of Ico I felt that the blurry and dreary nature of some of the areas helped set, and accentuate, a certain mood for the game and its environments. I guess there's also the part about how we can fill in the vague and blank spots in games with our mind. As for parts where I find the PS2 version to look "better", even though it looks blurrier at parts; from 15:55 to 16:05, on the PS2 version, the sun's glare as reflecting on the environment is much stronger, maybe done to hide detail to make the scene render more easily as it zooms out, but I like this overly sunny look to the PS3 version's look as, to me, it makes the scene look more like a twilight scene. from 16:08 to 16:18, I liked the washed out grey look better, as it seems to accentuate the storm and mood of the scene better. It is storming outside, and you just woke up, alone, in an unfamiliar place, your outlook on life at that moment is, no pun intended, rather bleak. Which I feel the grey filter accentuates, maybe by coincidence, or maybe by design. And then there's the sun at 17:10 to 17:12, which creates a warm and soothing scene on the PS2 as the boy sees another human being, whereas on the PS3 version, well, nothing really happens.
@@nightcrawler1924 No, he has a point. The remake is all crisp and fresh. The original though, is dreamy, and mysterious. I mean really weird and dreamy when you get in the sands. You Don't really get that in the remake. It's a fucking shame.
I’d love to see some DF Retros on classic cinematic games like Flashback & Fade to Black, with their unique 24fps gameplay, and of course Another World.
Ico isn't what I call a darling of mine, but I do admire its artistry, especially from the PS3 remaster. Which, thankfully, carries the extra content made only for the UK and JP release.
I've read that a beta version of the game was leaked which included the debug menu to allow it to run at 60 fps. It was leaked with the title "ICO Limited Edition [Widescreen & Debug Enabled]". However, I could only find one site which had previously hosted this file and if you visit the page it says the file was deleted. Hopefully somebody out there who managed to obtain a copy of this version can reupload it so we can all enjoy Ico in 60 fps.
If it's Sunday then it's DF Retro! Love these games, that times games were developed well with passion, not just for crowdfunding and DLC moneyhunting.
I am confident that years from now, The Last Guardian will serve as a role model as an artist game for other game makers just as its two predecessors have done.
I hope ICO will get the same treatment as SOTC got. This game deserves a full remake on a modern hardware by the studio that understands its cultural value.
wielkus Ico was made to run at 30fps and runs at double the speed at 60fps. This video explains it. That is why it wasn't 1080p60fps on PS3 but was 1080p30fps. It can run at higher resolutions though on PS4.
Yeah I dunno what that guys saying, ofc with some work you could get the pretty minor issues shown in the video about the 60 fps mode smoothed over. That'd be amazing for sure.
I started playing ICO at the PCSX emulator and later switched to the PS3 remaster, which is great. Although I like shadow of the colossus, I have to say I enjoyed ICO even more (and I played ICO AFTER playing shadow of the colossus).
Very nice. I had no idea this game was similar to Another World in its approach to gameplay. I have the game but have never played it, so this video may give me the push to finally do so.
Here is a few suggestions of games released with technology ahead of their time for future DFRetro episodes: *Outcast* (1999), *Severance: Blade of Darkness* (2001, the true Demon's Souls predecessor), *Ultima VII: The Black Gate* (1992), *The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall* (1996), *Frontier: Elite II* (1993), *Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger* (1994).
I LOVE this series! you really need to do Dark Souls 1. A master piece in level design and to some degree tech. unlike demons souls there are no loading screens, for example! PLUS there is a debug build for the FULL retail release you can get and do really deep dives into the world and design process.
A look back at No One Lives Forever series would be neat. That game went through many changes during it's development and it would be cool seeing some history on the Lithtech and Jupiter engines. Plus maybe it could lead to a SHOGO episode!
