did the New York Times close KPOP the musical? | analysis of the controversial review and closing 

The problem with comparing KPOP and Fiddler on the Roof is that A) super titles and B) almost no one seeing Fiddler on the Roof in Yiddish is seeing the show for the first time. They're probably intimately familiar with the plot and lyrics already. Whereas when something is new you don't want to miss info.

While being an Asian myself, I could already see the show coming to its end (though I didn't expect it to be this soon). I think the show has been struggling to find its target audience. However, I found Jesse Green complaining about the use of Korean language very intolerant. If you can handle Spanish in "In The Heights" or "West Side Story", the use of Korean in "K-Pop" is nothing different🤷

I get the impression KPOP sprinkled in Korean in the same way that West Side Story sprinkled in Spanish. Not required to understand the plot, but setting a mood and a nice Easter egg if you know the language.

I'm headed to NY in January and was contemplating seeing KPOP.... Ultimately decided against it not because of the premise, but because I saw performance after performance being cancelled in previews. The writing was on the wall for this show even before it opened. They even had to move opening night because half the cast were out with covid on their scheduled opening. I like that it was supposed to be something new and different to the typical broadway show and while it may not have been the biggest hit, we need theatre makers to keep trying new things. If they didn't, we wouldn't have shows like Hamilton, for example. As for the NY times article, I'm in complete agreement that the squinting comment was more careless than anything else. I don't think the critic was intentionally trying to be racist, but just didn't think. There are a myriad of different phrases that could have been used to describe what I can only take as flashing lights moving into his eyes! He and the NY Times should apologise for the carelessness, but not the overall critique as it seems to be fairly in step with other critics.

I'm Korean-American, I've been listening to Kpop since 2004. I think the use of "squint-inducing" is a fair, non-racist phrase to use in this regard.

I saw the Off-Broadway production a few years ago and was really excited to see how they would transition it to Broadway. The original conceit was that the audience was being taken on a tour through a K-POP music factory as a focus group for the label trying to break its way into the American market. It was incredibly well put together and charming but there was no way it could be directly translated into a space where an audience would be seated the entire time. A lot of the songs for this Broadway version were presented as a concert (or as a rehearsal performance for the upcoming concert) and as happens in concert lighting, bright lights are flashed into the crowd as a way to hype them up. So while I think that Jesse Green's turn of phrase was more unfortunate than intentionally racist, it did show a lack of understanding of what the vibe of the musical was supposed to be. I attended an early preview performance and really enjoyed it even though the book WAS clunky and some of the multi-media aspects seemed unnecessary (especially since they were prone to glitches). The fantastic music and choreography overtook everything else and made it an overall fun experience that, before the closing announcement, I was planning to revisit in a couple of weeks. I really hope that this early closing doesn't derail the plans to record a cast album because I have wanted one for these songs since 2017!

As a Korean-American, I don't think the NYT article was racist. The description of the lighting being "squint inducing" is in my opinion just a poor choice of wording since the imagery of squinted eyes and racism directed towards Asian are so interlinked, and I don't think it helped that the critic's complaints about parts of the show being fully in Korean parrots (whether intentionally or not) real life ignorance and soft xenophobia towards non-English cultural products. That said, given the whole context of the article and knowing how harsh theatre critics in the US can be - especially at highly esteemed newspapers like the NYT - I wouldn't say it was racist. As for the closing, I'm not that well versed in the business side of musicals so I can't say much. What I will say is the moment I heard about it (despite being Korean and a huge musical theatre fan), I knew the chances of it succeeding was slim to none. Kpop as a genre and industry is built on fanfare - fancams and idol biases, rigorous training with idol bootcamps and major labels training these groups from young ages, expensive well choreographed music videos and a distinctive Korean flare from its language to presentation. There's no way (that I can think of) where you could recreate these major points in a musical threatre format on Broadway with a storyline that would have people coming to see it every week.

How in the world did that “squint enduring” line get past editorial at the NYT?

It would have at least been worth having a critic that has some basic interest in kpop as a genre. This would be the equivalent of sending a critic to an opera if they had no interest in opera whatsoever, and were reviewing only on their knowledge of contemporary musicals. They're entitled to their opinion but you're not going to get a particularly useful review

I'm not really into KPOP but I am happy that music from a foreign country that doesn't speak English is making its way into the mainstream. That said this definitely is a niche show in that sense just because while it is HUGE it's something popular with a specific audience and that doesn't always resonate with everyone. Look at how long traditional rap took to make its way onto Broadway and be accepted by large appeal theatre crowds. I think it would have made more sense to test the waters with this show in a different state than New York and then let it play off-Broadway and see if it could have found an audience. Not every new musical NEEDS to start its life on Broadway and in that same sense not every hit musical NEEDS to transfer to Broadway once it gets popular. A lot of the shows that have been darlings from Off-broadway runs in the last decade or so should have just stayed off-Broadway and they would still be running.

1) The NYT's mild (even gentle) critique did not kill this show. It was already dying from lack of interest and negative word of mouth (and expensive overhead). Previews had apparently been cancelled, partly due to lack of an audience. I suspect the review isn't even what hurt the performers' feelings, that it just provided a focal point for the frustration that comes with realizing they are in a failing show. No apology is owed or should be given for the artists' unreasonable reaction to a review. 2) The show shouldn't have gone to Broadway until it was a hit elsewhere. You referenced Wait in the Wings' analysis of what is/isn't a flop. That piece correctly suggested that some shows have to thrive elsewhere, or to put it more accurately, become a commodity that Broadway needs more than the show needs Broadway. KPOP wouldn't be something I'd think of going to on a weekend trip to Broadway, but it is exactly the sort of entertainment I'd check out between dinner and a late night in Vegas. Non-theater folk who would balk at paying Broadway prices in NYC think nothing of dropping hundreds on slick spectacles and reviews in That's where this show should have started when they decided to scale it up form the small, immersive show it was off Broadway. It could run for years on The Strip

I don't really think the Times review really caused the closure. This show wasn't pulling in much money at all well before the review.

"we don't know many details about why Kpop is closing early." It's not complicated, I doubt there are "details" they've been hiding. Simply look at the grosses. Its highest weekly gross so far was just under $200K, which is far, far too low for any show - play or musical, but especially a large cast musical like this - to sustain itself on Broadway. It's running costs are likely in the $600-800K range. It's economics, surely not helped by the fact that it was such a bad show I felt genuinely embarrassed for the performers.

I truly always appreciate your take on controversial issues like this. You make sure to spread the facts of the situation & remain as impartial as you can. Then also give us things to think about! Things like this are always hard to report about, so thank you Mickey Jo for all the hard work you put into videos like this (and in every video you do)!

I saw the show on my 30th birthday last month. I admit, it wasn’t great. The lights were so awful that some people in the audience were actually wearing sunglasses. I am epileptic so I had to shut my eyes for many parts. Also, as a long term KPop fan, it felt more like a mockery instead of a true representation of the actual global phenomenon so many people fell in love with. Very cliche plot, cringey bubble gum pop songs, etc. I’m a huge fan of Luna and Min (cast members and former real life KPop idols) so I was just happy to see them. I didn’t have high expectations for the rest of the show. I wasn’t disappointed, but I also wasn’t impressed. I am sad to see it all go down like this after their hard work. I hope they consider maybe doing a tour. They have tons of fans from around the US who wouldn’t have been able to see it unless they travel to New York. I guess we’ll see what’s next for KPop the musical. I’m wishing them all the best

If you do end up making a post-mortem (sorry) video, I hope you discuss the grosses that Kpop had through its short run. I think to imply that reviews alone would cause the show’s sudden demise would be a disservice to those watching and don’t know how the business works. I like how you break things down and are very considerate of all factors; I hope people who are unfamiliar would watch your channel to learn more about how the Broadway business works.

This discussion about Jesse Green really kicked off after his review a few weeks ago of The Public Theatre’s off-Broadway revival of A RAISIN IN THE SUN. Tonya Pinkins wrote the controversial open letter in that case. If you want to do a second video on this situation, take a look at that.

I disagree with the notion of a "correct person to review the show". I do agree that there should be more diversity within the critic community regarding ethnicity, gender, sexuality, age group etc., but I don't think one type of person should review this show and one another. In an ideal world you would get reviews for every show from all kinds of people, not select who reviews what based on content. In any case, the "squint-inducing" comment makes complete sense in the sentence he used but was certainly unfortunately tone-deaf in the context.

I also thought it was interesting to look at his comments on the lighting in SIX -- he thought the "arena style" lighting there was great. (It was in his review of the Chicago pre-Broadway run -- he didn't mention it in the Broadway review.) (I'd thought to look for it because one of my friends had complained about the lighting in SIX giving her a migraine, and Andrea Macasaet recently mentioned in an Instagram Live that she'd seen people in the audience wearing sunglasses to deal with the lighting.)

I love Kpop but after watching some of the performances, I can see why this show was closed. Yikes.

The title didn't seem terribly compelling as someone who doesn't know much about KPOP. Something like... (Insert Title): a KPOP Fantasy... maybe that would have captured audience attention better. As it stands, it sounds like it's just going to be a concert or something.

they needed to have a pre-broadway run somewhere else to work out their issues with transferring from immersive, intimate staging to something more traditional - like the great comet’s run at ART. green’s review was harsh but not baseless, and i think more preparation and consideration could’ve made kpop a cult favourite.

What did it for me was that Good Morning America performance. I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. I cringed throughout the entire thing, and this is coming from someone who has been a fan of the kpop genre for many years. I’ve heard the actual atmosphere towards the end of the show is better, but why would I sit through that just for a little bit of fun at the end? I can understand why it’s closing.

Ahead of the review Ticket sales were down. Wasn’t doing well financially

I would love to see this have a new and better life on tour or in Los Angeles, where it's more accessible physically and economically to Kpop fans.

The NYT issued its own letter in response to KPOP's letter demanding an apology. They had a panel meeting to see if Greene's review violated their standards and practices. They stand by Greene's review and say it was "fair." And YES-- KPOP is quickly closing.

I really hate this culture of one theatre critic or newspaper being the kingmaker for shows. It happens in the UK in some way too and I really think it does a lot of shows a huge disservice.

I still don't see "squint-inducing" as a micro-aggression if the guy really did just want to say "the lights shining into my eyes were so bright that I needed to squint the whole time." It's weird to me that people see that and think "IS THAT A REFERENCE TO THE FACT THAT THEY'RE ASIAN?!?!" Like... no? It isn't? And complaining about a lighting design when the designer happens to be Asian is also not a micro-aggression if you really didn't like the lighting design. But I still agree with you that this dude was not the right person to review this show for the NYT. I'm supposing that he is meant to represent the tastes of many Broadway goers who are not fans of K-Pop music or well versed in the genre ("will the typical non-fan care about or like this show?" is a valid place to start), but it would have still been better to have someone who is enthusiastic about K-Pop music in general to let the many American K-Pop music fans know whether or not they will find the show enjoyable. I personally love K-Pop music and was hoping to see this show in January, so I'm particularly sad that it will no longer be playing when I am in the city.

Saw the show - wish it had embraced the immersive camera rehearsal structure throughout. They try to include a flashback narrative and it falls into cliches etc. but when the songs and the dancing happen, it’s super fun! Shame it’s closing this soon

I agree the phrase "squint inducing" was a poor choice of words. I don't know if Jesse Green has hate in his heart for Asian people but he certainly has hate for a lot of shows I loved so I don't mind if the cast and producers want to drag him for it on social media.

Representation in our criticism is so important. Always and forever.

Love your content and telling the stories from across the Pond. This is a thought I had about your piece here about the controversy concerning KPOP the musical. The NY Times has many resources when it comes to reviewing books, Broadway, music, art, and other cultural entertainment. They also as the most influential newspaper in the US it does or at least should stay ahead on trends. Shouldn’t part of the discussion be about why the editorial assignments weren’t looking at K-POP The Musical theater from different audience perspectives in this way. K-POP is a generational sound that brings with it it’s fans of a younger age in particular not to disregard even older fans. In addition, the musical is also a potential entertainment focused through a Broadway Lens. In addition, the format is a concert venue POV option. So my question is why didn’t The NY Times assign its critics of music/concerts and it’s theater arm to review this cross cutting audience? Someone coming to NY is deciding to spend their money. The NY Times reviews assist in those choices. So a reader could look at K-POP The Musical through two or three POVs. Someone who likes K-POP or looking for a great concert opportunity could be informed if the musical stays honest to the genre, style, performance standards, and unique qualities of the music genre. This tells that reader what they are looking for. The theater writer reviews based on the staging and the acting and technical qualities unique to telling a live musical theater experience. That tells the review reader looking to make a decision to but a ticket if it’s something worth taking a chance on. It would be the same way the editors should or could have reviewed a play like Red about the artist Rothko. Does the play honestly or uniquely represent Rothko as an artist and their aesthetic, process, and even tools and mediums. The theater critic looks at how the play performs and is presented. This again shows something from two POVs and tells a more well rounded story. Instead the tales of these works determining where audiences spend money just show it through tunnel vision. The editorial team failed here because it failed to seize the opportunity to see special ways to challenge their readers and attract new ones. It’s a sloppy way of telling this production’s story through review writing as well as reaching out to a newer reading audience. This didn’t allow a music reviewer who understood the genre of K-Pop and the unique cultural story connected to it to be covered and not risking a review that recycles a POV a different reading audience is looking for. Did Jesse Green show lack of understanding of the genre, cultural insensitivity and bring bias to his review? That is in the interpretation of the actual article. And who read the article before it was printed? The editor. That is where a questionable word choice for instance of “squinting” vs “blinding” in describing the lighting design is one area where the editor works with their writer to consider what is fit to print. And that is the guidance the editor is supposed to give the writer. And seeing a trend in how that writer reviews how maybe a foreign language use discussion trend in how a writer looks at a Yiddish , Korean, French, etc referential play script informs and presents itself to an unfamiliar audience and ends up including them. Juggling the demographic make up of the writer narrows a review for a wider audience while trying to honestly portray the POV of a cultural driver of a work. Instead, editorial should pair writers and assignments based on skill set and knowledge with an eye for unique situations to sell papers or push clicks online. This doesn’t mean a diversity campaign of promoting new writers isn’t necessary. It is and is in many many professions. Because diversity challenges thought and perspective and therefore creativity. But, here it is that editorial failed in the end in its assignment, content review, and sensitivity to response. Just my take…

Jesse green was involved in this similar situations before the actress Tonya pinkins wrote a open letter last year to Jesse criticizing his review of the play she performed a raising in a sun as being racially and culturally insensitive and said that his review played a major factor to the play’s premature closing in addition she also called out the New York Times and other major media publications for more diversity in their department.

Some disparate thoughts: 1. "Squint-inducing" is a weird phrase if he merely meant that the lighting was glaring for him in the audience. I read that as a criticism of how the lighting seemed to be impairing *the performers* and their ability to communicate with their eyes. If that interpretation is correct, then I'd argue that it's something like the opposite of a racially charged meaning. (Though I agree that it has, in any instance, created a very unfortunate dynamic, with at least the lingering appearance of insensitivity, whether accurate or not.) 2. Regarding Mr. Green's variable responses to Yiddish vs. Korean, it's also worth noting that to any major American theatre critic, Fiddler is already *extremely* familiar. Viewing a known work in translation is not the same as viewing an unknown work in another language. A more telling comparison might be made with The Light in the Piazza, in which the language barrier is actually a plot point, and non-Italian speakers are deliberately excluded from some of the dialogue. I found an article of Green's from 2003 that's mostly a profile of Adam Guettel, but it includes his (rapturous) thoughts on an early version of the still-in-development Piazza -- he makes zero mention of the language barrier, though I can't be certain it existed in that incarnation. 3. Finally, a word on whether The Times can close shows ... In his superb book of collected reviews, Frank Rich disputes that purported power, listing in his appendix both a number of shows that ran considerably despite his mixed to outright pans; and, more poignantly, a number of shows that flopped despite his raves.

So sad this show is closing. Kpop is an important genre that should have been welcomed with open arms to the Broadway stage. It's very disappointing that this was Luna's (a true Kpop idol) first experience with American theatre; she (and the whole cast) deserved better. Let's hope this unfortunate and tragic circumstance doesn't dissuade other Kpop and AAPI composers and creators from bringing their stories to the stage. Long live Kpop!!! (That cast album BETTER still be coming out; I need a true Broadway Kpop bop!) N.B. wasn't the shortest Broadway run in the past two decades Glory Days that closed on its opening night?

It was just a horrible musical. We have to accept it.

As a cis white male, I happened to see both productions on my visits in New York. The off Broadway production was fun, fresh and exciting. It literally gave me chills at certain points and I raved about it to everyone. I went to the Broadway production expecting to like it, although I really do not like the Circle In The Square and aside from "25th Annual Putnam Spelling Bee," haven't really seen a show "work" in that awkward space. I was curious to see if they would be able to over come it. They did not. It was just loud and charmless and felt like a generic pop concert desperate to constantly "dazzle" until you're just numb. Seems to me they just got butt hurt that it was a negative, albeit accurate review. Something tells me that the "micro aggression" wouldn't have come up if it had been a rave. A bad show is sometimes just a bad show. It closed because it wasn't making money and forced to sell tickets at highly reduced prices. Broadway 101: you've got make money.

If KPOP was on in the west end would you review it as one thing you said would rule you out from reviewing it, we should be careful who we say should or shouldn’t review a show, we should ensure that fair representation is forefront and a decent editor in place then then hopefully good journalism will prevail

It is getting a cast recording, so there might be some life to it. Without commenting on the quality of the show (I haven't seen it, so I can't) remember that good shows don't always have long runs and horrible shows don't always close overnight. I doubt the review tanked the show. Of course, anything is possible.

I saw the show. Had not read the NYT article, before Micky Jo read it in this video. Funny thing - I did notice the people opposite me in the theater squinting, covering their eyes, looking downwards, shielding their eyes because of the lighting. It was so noticeable to me at the time that I watched the lighting as it hit people directly in the face, how far it went up into the audience, and if it was actually going to hit where we were sitting. Sadly, I remember it taking my focus away from stage and into the audience. This happens in theater. I have been blinded many times. As far as K-pop, I've had discussions with Asian Americans, Korean Americans, Asians about the show. I haven't talked to one person that's loved this show. The second act was definitely better than the first act. It kind of felt that 100% wasn't being directed into the show. I think there's potential there though. I think this needs to be a little bit more interactive with the audience. One suggestion I had is to pump the bass into the seating. People need to feel like they're at a concert and feel the thumb thump of the bass in their butts. It was the opposite in this show. There was a big disconnect. You didn't feel involved, you felt voyeuristic. That said, I probably would have seen it again later and it's run after the Kings had been worked out. Unfortunately, that is not to happen as it will close tomorrow.

I have a macular degenerative eye condition that makes me sensitive to darkness. It actually hurts to watch some things, I will have to walk out of a theatre or turn off a movie if the lighting is bad. I do see a real issue if the lighting was off particularly for those who need corrective lens or have disabilities. I don't know if squinting is an offensive term but what is the alternative to describe it? Eye-straining?

To the people saying that because kpop tends to have a younger demographic who probably doesn’t have money it is why Kpop the musical failed, using this logic is failing to recognize that being part of or associated with a music genre won’t make people be willing to shell out money for that. Kpop concert tickets too costs a lot especially with Ticketmaster making things complicated yet there’s hundreds of thousands of fans still going to those concerts and buying expensive tickets. They just didn’t even market to the demographic they aimed to have correctly. Just because someone is a Pop fan doesn’t mean they would go to every pop stars concerts, people have a certain artist they are attached to, same with kpop, unless an artist the fans care about is there they would bother to go get tickets. And surprisingly the musical does have ex kpop artists, if they had advertised it as something like “F(x) Luna in the new Kpop musical”, but then again the cast members who used to be in the kpop musical tend to be from the 2nd generation and other than Luna from Fx and Min from Miss A,they tend to be from less known groups during the time they debuted. Current kpop fans don’t know a lot about 2nd generation kpop let alone the not so popular ones. If it included someone in the kpop industry who is relevant then kpop fans would’ve went out of their way to check it out. Honestly I could see from a distance that it probably would not work out.

Living a handful of blocks away from Broadway, I've seen numerous Broadway shows. I saw KPOP a few weeks back. It was not a good show nor was it entertaining. The description your read about the show was much more exciting than the bland melodrama that was KPOP. I would have loved an accurate show with KPOP. This wasn't wonderful or horrible--it was very mediocre.

As an Asian American / Eurasian American, I agree with Mickey Joe. It was an unintentional micro-agression. As I have shared before, I think it would have been better had the critic used a verb version of the word squint rather than describing the whole performance with the adjective. Had the critic Saud that the lighting was overly bright and pointing directly at me, I had to squint on order to watch the performance. The word squint in itself us a good word. Even my mother who is 100% Asian American has said to me "Derek, why are you squinting when reading the street signs?" As you may have observed, the verb in itself is a regular verb meaning to have your eyelids more than 1/2 closed. It's not a word that's not supposed to mean anything harmful, nor does the definition refer to something racist. Let's say for example, you call your brother a fool. When you call him a fool, it brings om a different context as opposed to calling someone foolish. In fact, they might even agree that their behavior was foolish. But if you call them a fool, then works more like an insult to make one feel bad rather than pointing out their foolish behavior. So as an Eurasian American, I get where the cast feels insulted because he's calling the whole production squint inducing as if it was attack on Asian American identity, but this could have been avoided had the NY Times critic said the lighting was too intense that he had to squint his eyes in order to watch it.

I enjoyed your comments and thank you for your recommendation of Howard Ho. I have been happily dipping my toes into the videos.

Now, I can see how a K-pop musical could work, but…is K-pop popular enough in general to carry an entire Broadway show? Personally, I see it working more as a touring production, since K-pop fans tend to more spread out than centered in certain areas.

Thank you for your perspective. I appreciate your sensitivity and empathy towards other minority communities.

I still remember that Glory Days closed after its opening night performance back in 2008. So not the fastest to close on broadway in 20 years but still pretty fast.

As always appreciate your breakdown of the situation!

A cardinal rule of the theatre is never, ever, ever, ever, ever, _EVER_ respond to a critic. Do not argue. Do not complain. You will not win this battle.

Circle in the Square is a Broadway theatre venue in the round that sits below ground.

Where is the link to the recommended channel and critics you mentioned?

I'm not a fan of KPop but I did see numbers of the show as they were presented on GMA- and from that I would not be interested in it- obviously I'm not the audience target for this musical- did the review kill the show- well it did not make me want to see this either. Why did the show close? Obviously there weren't enough KPop fans buying tickets. I'm surprised it did not stay over at least until after Christmas- when a lot of tourist flood the city.

I think KPOP thought if they could create some kind of drama (With the NYT, and making something out nothing) It would help them get more butts in the seats. All it did was make things worse. I feel sad for anyone who weren't part of the drama making over a non-racist review, but don't feel sorry for the ones crying over the problem they created themselves. I love theater, but the community can get on my nerves sometimes!

Why is it closing early?! Mixed reviews, box office not as great as they hoped and it just wasn't ready for Broadway. It probably would have done better as a regional tour, or stayed in Off-Broadway where it may have prospered more and for a longer run. And as for 'squint inducing ' , the critic was referring the visuals as the strobes and flashing lights were hard on his eyes. With a high profile job like his,making a blatant racist comments would end his career at The Times. Clearly this show was not for him!

'We have less drama on the west-end' ...cough Cinderella cough...

I think we have to realize this was not a review of Kpop, the genre or a specific Kpop performance, this was a review of the Broadway musical, called Kpop. It had great songs, but as a musical, it fell way short in the book. Often lyrics in a musical help to advance the story, but in this case, but having half of the songs in Korean, it took away the ability for audience have a deeper understanding of the plot. You are left with the book, which was frankly boring. This was more of a play with singing, then a fully developed musical.

I remember going to see Wicked in September and I saw the theater for KPOP right next to the one for Wicked. So when my mom of all people told me KPOP closed just after 2 weeks after the opening day I was taken aback Thx for the explanation!!!!

There's a bit of a disconnect between your statement that people should find a critic they're on the same page as, and your suggestion that shows representing minorities should be reviewed by them. The critic has to represent the audience, not the show. And whether you think that was done well in this case, the last thing a show needs if it has a minority interest, is for people to get the impression that only people from that minority are liking it. No Broadway or West End show can survive that way.

Coincidentally, I saw KPOP today, and I was not entertained. The show seemed clueless about Broadway audiences' expectations and ultimately failed to bridge the gap between K-pop and the general public. For example - the first male solo by a guy who may leave the boyband was set up as a soliloquy, an "I want" song, but then he sings a generic love song. I wanted to be moved and relate, but everything here seemed superficial. Even attempts at depth were basic. There was a part of the audience that hollered at every move - but I doubt there are enough of them to sustain a Broadway run. Shoot the messenger all you want - the producers seriously misread their off-Broadway success and decided now to cut their losses.

Okay having gone and watched one of the songs from this musical, I'm pretty confident in saying that it would be a fucking nightmare for anyone with hearing or audio processing issues. Out of a song sung probably about 50% in English, my autistic self could understand maybe five lines (although some of those lines repeat, and repeat, and repeat...) It's the combination between the K-pop music and singing style and the quick changes between languages. If I was trying to watch the show and decipher lyrics *and* having lights shone in my eyes I definitely would not be having a good time. Which is fine, not every show has to accommodate me, and people with audio processing issues aren't a huge percentage of the population. But a lot of older people have upper frequency hearing loss. And there's not a lot of base in K-pop singing. So, in my opinion a lot of people would essentially be watching a play with some random unknown pop songs thrown in. I think it would make a big difference to a lot of non K-pop fans to put it on a normal stage and include supertitles.

Surprised this isn’t a bad Cinderella cast announcement reaction

I saw KPOP at Ars Nova in 2017, and that immersive experience was entirely memorable (the songs not so much, though in the moment I was very into it!) but the experience was so different. When I heard KPOP was going to Broadway, I did have high hopes, but was unsure how the initial experience would transfer. Having seen KPOP on Broadway, from the front row no less, it obviously did not. The book is the one of the worst books that Ive seen on a Broadway stage in years, and while I loved the costumes and choreography, and those performers are working their butts off....as a book musical, it was ultimately a failure. I did enjoy the music, and look forward to listening to it once (or maybe if) the Cast Album is released (as that seems a sketchy prospect at this point) but will I ever be able to sing along....no but I dont know Korean, so that seems logical) but it does bring to mind the potential of a show like that to sell well in NYC, and if it couldn't make it here, I do not see it having a life on tour, at least here in America. In regards to the NYT Review, I think while unfortunate, The NY Times response in standing with Green was the right choice. When my coworkers and I all read the reviews (theater professionals) we saw nothing wrong (again, all non AAPI folks) and I personally found the KPOP issue with it a bit of a stretch. A publicity stunt, an "all press is good press" kind of promotion. I saw KPOP for $19, as they did a promotion on the day the box office opened and sold tickets for that low price with the tag line "in honor of the 19 performers making their Broadway debuts" However, I got to the box office at 5:30pm, and assuming the box office was open from 10am on all day, there was a huge line, and every person in front of, and presumably behind me got this price. It's no wonder why their average ticket price was $40...they seemed to have sold an infinite number of tickets at $19. WHY?! Why not limit it to select previews (instead of every preview) or maybe only the front row, instead of practically the entire 800 seat house. The bad decisions seemed top down to me. Heck, they are giving away 200 free tickets to AAPI people on Sunday for their last performance (I assume this was planned in advance, and couldn't be helped given the closing )but still. It's not how a show makes money. Bottom line: the show was bad, and the NYT Review did not spell the end for this show, the writing was on the wall from practically Day 1 before a rehearsal had even begun.

We went to the show a week ago, loved it. Singing, dancing all great. Ticket sales are everything and they were not selling tickets. Bad marketing. Wasn't racism, wasn't a NY Times article. I did notice very few Asians in the crowd which surprised me.

I saw the show a couple of months ago. Even though I am a K-pop fan. I don't feel the show represented anything about the genre in a good way. The songs were ok and the individual performances were acceptable. But the plot and storyline was an absolute mess and convoluted. I didn't expect it to last at all.

Ngl, I never saw this show making it longer than a couple weeks or months at most. I don't care for the genre or this musical, but I do feel sorry for everyone soon to be employed.

While the article was careless in its language, I can't help but feel that the show itself was a cashgrab from jump. The representation on stage is nice, but it feels hollow when all the music and lyrics are by a white guy (Max Vernon).

I feel like his way of describing kpop is fairly derogative- It's clear he views it as an inferior form of music jsut from the way he describes it. Kpop is hugely popular, all over the world, and I think it's fair to assume most people have been exposed to it (at the least) by now so anyone buying tickets for kpop won't be surprised at the sound and dance style, because he doesn't like kpop doesn't mean he should disparage the musical for sounding like that. If I went to frozen I'm not going to be surprised it sounds like frozen Also kpop isn't exclusively english anyway- maybe some form of subtitles might be helpful if it's not clear from the contect, but I'm not surprised that some of it is in korean 🤷‍♀ seems like a weird thing to get upset about I'm really suprised that squinting comment made it through all the edits- I'm almost certain no one at NYT is dumb enough to make deliberate racial microaggressions but somehow they still let it through, and it's fairly well established that that can be a slur. Just a shame because there are lots of other ways to tell readers that the lights were (in your opinion) too bright- say you should have brought sunglasses, that it was retina searing, like looking into the midday sun or just advise people to choose their seat carefully because the side ones will be in the crossfire of the lights.

As an Asian American, the word feels very intentional. It's the kind of language we learned in the first grade. As the New York Times is still the newspaper of record here (despite its recent transphobia), it seems like an extreme oversight that the reviewer, editor, copyeditor, and publisher all saw this language and thought it was okay. It feels very intentional, especially considering the reviewer seemed already predisposed to dislike the musical purely on the basis that it was not in English. In New York especially, Asian Americans have been unfairly targeted in the last few years and I completely agree that NYT needs to at least change the language in the piece.

One big issue with his review is how much he raves about the 2017 off-Broadway production in comparison to this newer Broadway production. Apparently the original production centered more around explaining KPOP (because KPOP did not have the international attention in 2017 that it does now) with a white character being used as the audience surrogate having things introduced to them. He seemingly can't "buy" a production unless it's spoon fed to him from a perspective that he relates to directly. Overall, it's a very self-centered review.

"somehow racist" in a response to an open letter literally spelling out how it was racist. Do better NYT.

He talked about how he enjoyed the off-Broadway version a lot more in his review, which you didn’t discuss. I really don’t think it’s as simple as “man doesn’t like show because it’s KPOP” like a lot of people are claiming. Proven by the fact that he actually enjoyed a different version of the same show. I saw the show, and am a KPOP fan and thought his review of the show was fair. In my opinion, the music was the only good part of the show, and if you weren’t a KPOP fan, there isn’t much there to enjoy. It’s all done in the classic KPOP style, which I loved, but if you aren’t interested in it all you have left is a bad book and horrible acting (which I know is rude to say, but it’s truly the worst acting I’ve seen in any Broadway show.) Also in regards to the use of the Korean language I don’t think it should deter anyone from seeing the show, because the plot was easy to follow. However, I disagree with the statement that there was “barely any Korean.” I’d say like 30% of the dialogue at least is in Korean. I could see how people who wanted a fuller picture would want subtitles though I didn’t find them necessary. I think adding English and Korean subtitles could’ve been a good compromise and could have made it more accessible to Korean audiences as well.

Excellent commentary.

My biggest take-away here is that regardless of opinion or truth, the NYT's response to the open letter was a masterclass in how NOT to respond to accusations of racism. Even if they wanted to double-down on the defense of the specific language, they made no good-faith explanation of how they reached their internal conclusion that the comment was not racist beyond "Because we said it's not." I'm reminded of the diversity disclaimer that came with the first few Assassin's Creed video games, telling players "This game was created by a team consisting of diverse racial backgrounds and religious beliefs." NYT made no acknowledgement of AAIP voices on their staff, gave no insight into the checks that their articles clear before publication, and no respect to the writers of the open letter. Something more along the lines of "Yes, we agree that it's important for all of us to be culturally sensitive to one another, but we use THESE SYSTEMS and THESE STANDARDS to support diverse voices and our staff writers" would have still been really disappointing, but at least it would have demonstrated the NYT heard the complaint. And there's a thousand other ways to describe lighting that makes you want to close your eyes, "squint" is not so essential a descriptor that a competent writer couldn't have found more interesting ways to get their point across. It's all weird and disappointing is what it is. :(

I’m both Asian and a kpop stan (and a fan of Kevin in particular) and I agree - the language was careless and offensive but might not have necessarily intended to be racist. I agree with Howard Ho’s view on the whiteness inherent in the previous narrative framework, which the critic continued to assert as superior. In general, I feel that the critic entered the show with a negative preconception about kpop and carried it throughout his review, which is frustrating as kpop and kpop artists often experience a lot of xenophobia in the west and I felt that the review was rooted in those sentiments. I think that the comment about Korean is frustrating when a number of shows incorporate lines in other languages in much the same way, but don’t face the same comments. This is reflective of an issue in the genre as a whole - people say that about kpop but have much less criticism for songs like despacito or dragostea din tei. I also find the assertion that the show is a ‘mimicry’ of kpop interesting. I have yet to see many fans, if any, have a problem with it, which is unsurprising considering members of U-KISS, fx, Miss A and spica (some of the biggest 2nd gen groups) are in the cast - it is an authentic representation born from years of experience. The sudden closure of the show was definitely a shock and was likely impacted from the review, but the writing was on the wall in some ways - it must be an expensive show (especially getting Luna in the cast) and was quite reliant on the star power it wielded. I could see it closing soon, especially since they just finished recording the cast album, but not THIS soon when it has barely opened and won’t have the opportunity to sell the cast album at the theatre. All in all, I hesitate to call it racist, but it was certainly insensitive towards kpop as a genre, reflecting a lot of the perhaps ignorant reception that kpop already gets in the west, and likely damaged the longevity of the show’s run. And the choice of language was definitely careless at best - I don’t see why they doubled down.

I mean, if it’s a Broadway musical surely any theatre critic’s opinion is valid regardless of their race?

It is so tone deaf of the Times to be unaware that how a message is received needs to be considered. And you make a valid point about considering how well an assigned critic fits the assignment. Nathan Lane tells the story (I'm paraphrasing) of a reporter who was visibly unhappy about being sent to interview him and it was obvious he did not want to be there. He said to Nathan, "My last interview was with Joan Didion." Nathan replied, "Well I'm funnier than Joan Didion."

So let me get this straight only reviewers of the same racial background as the performers in the show should be reviewing it? That's definitely not the move. That only broaden the divide between racial groups.

Thanks!

As someone who lives overseas, the show didn't feel like it would ever go anywhere in the first place. After all, the song they perform during appearances already gives me a headache with the Korean-English mix and subpar pronunciation. I listened to it 3 times in a row, and I still had difficulty picking out which line was Korean and which line was English (only sounding Korean because my brain needed time to switch). The lyrics didn't seem to mean much from what I could see, so what is there for an audience who didn't care for the music? What kind of story is being put on when their big number says nothing about the story or characters?

No hate on the cast. But broadway is considered high art, and shows like this or like Spiderman don’t last long. It was an interesting concept but Broadway is a different animal and bringing pop into it is a challenge in general.

People should always have in mind that reviews are to some large part, opinion. Sure they might have a eye for more technical aspects, but some things are just horses for courses.

Kpop never found a big enough audience. Its box office numbers were consistent, around $150k a week, and that's through the entire ten-week run. The cost to put on the show was probably double, or more. So keeping the play on Broadway would have required someone to lose more millions of dollars. It wasn't even paying for itself in the holiday season. In this context you can see that the New York times review wasn't important. A fantastic review wouldn't have saved the show, unless you think the times has enormous influence.

Im not really sure there’s a need for the lengthy cultural disclaimer at the start of the video. Anyone with any sense can tell you’re not Asian.

It is all very sad, and probably avoidable! Could it also be that the Broadway producers didn't really understand the genre and thus the quality of the show suffered? Also, it grossed $126 493.40 last week. 71.8% capacity. An average of $32.06 per ticket. Did the NY Times close the show? No, I doubt it would or could have. But I also doubt it helped get a new audience. The days of Frank Rich being able to dictate flops and successes are, thankfully, over. I'm sure a lot more will come out over the next few days.

I also don't know if they should have just brought in an asian critic to take over this one job. While there may be a lack of diversity as you say, cherry picking critics here and there might pigeonhole reviewers down the line, and that could be avoided. Perhaps maybe give some wordspace over to more than one critic with their own scores (like videogame magazines), then readers may find an identifying take. As you say, audiences are a mixture after all. It might lead to less ego driven reviews too.

I disagree thoroughly with the idea that only Asian critics should review Asian shows. Are we, therefore, saying that only white critics review white shows and black critics review black shows etc? I think this is far too simplistic and actually unsavoury.

I’m not a fanatic fan of KPOP music but I do enjoy a shot of BTS on a regular basis however I’m sorry to learn that the producers decided to close the musical based on that one critic’s review. Considering the cost of tickets I think it put the play out of reach for the general fan base for KPOP. I hope the producers decide to bring it to a more welcoming locale like LOS ANGELES where there is a large and strong fan base. I appreciate your sensitive and careful analysis of the controversy. 👍🙏

Hi, I saw the show yesterday. I really loved it. I have a feeling I am in dorama . It’s so pity they close the show. People who love anime , and this culture will love it. We don’t have enough time to see the show. Its so different and it gives you chance to experience ideals culture. It so real. I hope show will survive.. what about language, come on we are watching anime on Chinese Japanese And Korean movies with subtitles. Korean movies are very nice. Millions of people are fans of Kpop. Why Broadway should not have something new and unique, it will find its fans. I am one of them. Thanks

Would love to see a matilda video soon

Go to 5:30 if you wanna skip all the tiresome caveats and pleas for your subscription and get to what you came here for.

Hi mickey joe hope you are well and having a good day! I went to see come from away the other night for the last time and dressed up as beverly bass😂it was a bit embarrassing but it was worth it,I even made the cast ,come from away baubles as a leaving gift😂 Have a good day:)

As a Korean American, I found this outrage so produced. They knew tickets weren't selling and wanted to create this faux outrage for publicity.What word could he have used instead of squint when it was a complaint about lighting. If people actually read the whole article it doesn't come off racist.

A critic can only speak to his own thoughts, he or she cannot compile everyone's feelings and use them like a melange to review anything. Critics' beliefs must come from the singular. To say that an Asian show should be reviewed by an Asian critic is absurd, with that in mind only African American critics could review Porgie and Bess, and only Gay critics could review a gay musical. This is the antithesis of critiques and a really antithetical idea.

Can't wait for the next matilda video

Oh YES! I like Ellie!! I don't always agree with her, but I like her very much.

I saw this show EARLY in previews and the longer I sat and thought on it... the more I really liked it. Dare I say, loved it. It had book issues for sure but the really root of this problem is that it doesn't chatter to the, pardon my rather forward statement... rich white boomer NY theatre patrons which is show Green is a reviewer for. We have big issues over here with reviewers NOT being for a wide range of people and patrons within the major publications. As a 30 something, I never trust in a Green review as someone that is going to speak for ME when it comes to shows. He is not open minded enough to write his reviews with the mindset that "this one might not be for me but it might be for someone out there." Kpop is everything that we (Millennial and Gen Z) WANT for Broadway. Diverse voices in the creatives and on the stage. Accessible ticketing. But not being able to drop $200 on a ticket to keep the lights on is not something that we can do. So theatre made for US gets left in the dust compared to things that cater to rich patrons. Trust me, when the cast album comes out, it's going to take off like a ROCKET with people under the age of 40. EVERY song is a bop!

Oooh, will it closing stop it coming over here? I know they were casting it a while back….

I think its failing, because it's not the kpop fans love and know.

who buys tickets????????