With the smaller sensor you've effectively increased your crop factor quite a bit. Maybe 5x or more! So your 35mm lens is giving you a telephoto image, I'm guessing something like 200mm. If you could get a larger sensor (ideally full frame, i.e. 24x36mm) it would be more zoomed out and like the image you would expect on film. Really cool project! I've seen several failed Kickstarters that tried to promise this, but here you are with a working prototype. Well done!
@@sigilvii Indeed, this would improve the issue. But only by a factor of two, so we would still have a 250mm focal length. Together with a 24mm lens you could maybe get to somewhere around 120mm, which could already be useful.
@@godsinbox exactly. If you only cut low quality corners, image quality increases, but if you are looking only through a tiny spot in the middle, quality quality decreases. You are also loosing a lot of light, this leads to longer exposures and/or ISO increase
I believe several were made in the late 1990's, but were not commercially viable. The image quality was ok, but due to the lack of electronic feedback to the lens and shutter, it was tough to regulate the exposure. With the price of DSLR's dropping to under $400 by 2000, it didn't make any sense to use the old equipment just to preserve the great glass. Of course now, film is back!
@@RAkers-tu1ey Yes, indeed! I remember having been on a photography trade fair with my dad, where such a product was presented. Never made it to the market because of the fast drop in DSLR prices, as you correctly guessed.
Me too. I'd buy one. In fact if there was a place where I could buy the 35 mm blank pre-printed I would be doing it right now... Or on a print to order site
I doubt that it's highly patented. These peices are made for developing products and hobbyists. With anamorphic lenses and a diopter you could make it work. The pixel size of 1.5 microns combined with the 10 and 12 bit depth could make for a nice image if the software were developed further.
I remember reading 15-20 years ago a company had developed this exact idea. I cannot remember who (think it was Kodak) bought the company including patents and we never saw the product hit the market.
In fact it wasn't uncommon 20 years ago when analogs was so popular but it costed to much due to a size of the sensor comparing to trashy digital cameras with smal sensors and the concept failed.
@@Pawel_Mrozek Digital backs are still a thing, but they're mostly on more expensive cameras, like the ones from Hasselblad. There's little point in doing this with 35mm or smaller cameras, as the only real upside is that you can use the camera you've already got and upgrade just the sensor at the cost of not being able to have the entire thing engineered to work together as well as possible.
@@Chuckq1 Yep and the other problem being you'd need one for each make and model of camera, each would have to be precisely set to the focal point of the lens for a perfect image, probably the reason why no corporation has taken the idea up. BUT, there is a market for them!!
I seen where people literally stuff a digital camera into old SLRs. For example, ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-DzhH_MV22qo.html Of course this is rough and permanent.
I have several film cameras with very expensive lenses left unused in a drawer. Sooner or later a large camera company will figure out how to convert film cameras to digital cheaply and effectively. This man has made a good start.
Best proof of concept I have seen for something like this I have seen. You find a method to take digital stills and increase the sensor size and you have something truly spectacular that there is a market for. In the meantime, you have quite the achievement and you should be proud of the attention you are getting. Well done!
Patrick. The author has not made a working prototype for a digital film replacement. He has made a working prototyp for a WebCam. And unfortunately, there are much better WebCams for sale, and with microphone.
Glad someone is making functional prototypes of this. Learning photography during the transition from film to digital I had thought of this in the early 2000's, but never had the digital hardware or programing skill to test it out. Would love to see a full frame sensor version, with the ability to use the original shutter and change ISO so that you could use the full functionality of the camera.
I have loved film cameras, but a conversion just doesn't make sense--it would be hard to fit the electronics and power source for full frame into an SLR, and impossible for a proper camera like an M Leica. The way to do hybrid surely is to use film and then scan the negatives, so you also get the film image capture effects. Which is what the cool kids are doing now. It's expensive, but then film photography always was, and nowadays there's no point in using film for anything but very careful, thoughtful work. Those wonderful old lenses might, too, turn out to be not quite so wonderful by comparison with modern equipment. I've digitised a lot of b + w negatives, and have found that quite modest technique (that captures the film grain sharply and so is working fairly well) shows the limitations of the best 35mm lenses of the 1970s.
@@michaelwright2986 Yepp, the digital film is a VERY HARD project, probably impossible. There are so many things that needs to work before it is a useful camera. There have been several tries, and all have failed. Because .... it is not really possible.
If this was developed to the point of accepting maybe a micro 4/3 sized sensor at first, then moving into full frame 35mm as tech is developed, I would be so on board. There have been film back replacements for just one camera but being able to choose any of my 35mm cameras to shoot with (particularly my old folding ones), would be absolutely incredible. You are a great mind to come up with something like this. Thank you for at least showing the concept in action
Love it! been talking about this exact idea for years, but you did it! Now if you can fully encase it in an adjustable cartridge with a full frame sensor along with software that responds to the shutter release and film advance of the camera… you’ll put it through the goalposts. FANtastic!
I actually imagined a device like this back I'm the early 2000's but had no clue how to make or implement this. So glad to see it come to life very simular to what I thought up. Although mine was slightly smaller in my head.
@@daniel.maitheny There is only the Leica M10-D as FF Camera out there, which matches my requirements (by approximation), and this one is very expensive.
Wow this is bonkers, the fact that its all contained in the film compartment without the need to remove the film door for a large digital back. Really impressive!
Not really. Film is hitting the mainstream currently and the prices of film cameras are skyrocketing due to the limited supply of them and a huge demand right now.
there was a student that made a website with this concept for his web-design class a decade ago... it blew up. I so glad someone is finally actually doing something like this. If developed further it will be a massive hit.
As an amateur photographer I thought of this years ago but had no clue how it could be achieved. I really thought that one of the quality camera manufacturers would do something. I've gone digital now but have still got some decent 35mm and medium format cameras. Would be great to see them in use today!
I guess like many of you I have been thinking of a setup like this for years, at least the concept. It is nice to see the results of someone actually achieving to build something with off the shelf components. At some point this will work with an actual high quality 35mm sensor. The really hardpart will be the integration of the (minimally required) mechanical components of the camera to make it full functional. One thing is sure, this technology will not be offered by the camera industry :) Great for the nostalgic enthusiast.
Somewhere around 30 years ago, maybe 35 a startup company announced they were going to develop this device. Or an early version of it. They advertised in computer magazines for a couple of months, I think they were looking for investors, then disappeared. I don't think the technology was there yet back then. Interesting to see someone has successfully revived the idea.
I would love to see this be developed more, I have an analog camera at home from my grandparents with multiple lenses (5 or 6) so having a conversion like this instead of buying a new camera would be amazing
Amazing discovery in photography ......in no time all the old analog cameras from the 60s will be alive again, thanks for this genus invention...well done ......danke.
There is no way to ever make this full frame 1 - the ff sensors are expensive and require more processing power. ff cameras were bulky back in the day, but even nowadays they're full sized cameras and very few get compact sized 2 - Battery, this cartridge barley has space for any battery, the best place would be the film casing equivalent, but even then it's to small to run the sensor for any reasonable time 3 - The biggest flaw - we're talking about a full ass sensor slapped just right onto a small adapter plate. Sensors are hidden inside full cameras and well protected against dust, even one large particle could ruin it and require a very delicate cleaning process. This adapter would mean that you pretty much have to never remove the adapter after instalation Everything I mentioned could be as well said about any crop sensor other that what we see on this video. This idea just doesnt work Either buy an old style digital camera like fujifilm, or just buy cheap film and scan it
Forty years ago I was using a camera like this to shoot and develop black and white photos. Each step of ISO, exposure , negative, affected the print. If you had told me then that I could take that camera out and stream live video without a wire.... I would have told you the Earth was flat. Absolutely amazing!
This is so great. I remember that your concept was actually under development somewhere in the late 90’s, but somehow failed. The prototype looked very similar to yours. I finally gave up waiting and bought a small digital camera and sold my Olympus OM2SP and Pentax cameras. Wish you the best of luck in developing this further. 🙂.
Yes, I was going to mention that as well. Probably got dropped, once the accountants at camera companies realised how much more money there was to be made selling you a brand new camera (and compatible lenses of course), rather than an insert that allowed you to use the equipment you already had.
It was heart breaking retiring my Olympus OM2n SLR …… BUT I can use all the lenses on a Canon full frame with an adapter, in fact I bought more OM lenses off E-bay! They are stop down manual operation only but are perfectly usable especially with live view. (Nikons cannot focus to infinity).
@@tinkerman1790 To be fair, this design is wholly dependant on today’s WiFi to work (being entirely located inside the SLR body). The first WiFi protocol didn’t come out until 1997 and was only 2 Mbits/s, so any solution then, would probably have required actual modifications to the camera, to allow wired access. Either that, or you wouldn’t have been able to close the back.
@@steveNCB7754 For the specific solution in this video, yes right! What if we are not going for the WiFi but onboard memory or even memory card likes MicroSD? I think it would be more interesting if the solution is ride on memory/card due to "NO Live-view is available". By which, it even provides more fun especially "mystery" as we were using film in old day. A Kickstarter business solution "I'm Back" for Leica was launched in 2020 btw.
The Algorithm bought me here, and I am really gad it did. I took photography in college in the 90's and it was an expensive hobby. This is the most "Epic" thing I have seen today!
Wow! You should absolutely develop this further. I would definitely buy this. A bigger sensor, or an arrangement of sensors might produce even wider images.
What's an innovation; it's just stepping into the water before jumping into the ocean!! Looking forward to the upgraded meteoric rise of the unique invention!!
as a professional photographer. mentor to students, and collector of vintage cameras, with an appropriate sensor, I would purchase one or more to demonstrate how much fun people with older cameras (like my 30+ Minoltas, Canon's, etc) could have getting digital images through their analog cameras! Great Job! Charlie J.
I'm really happy to see you do this. When I suggested it in the early days of digital cameras, people thought it was totally stupid. I'm glad to see someone with real skills actually did it.
wooo dude, i agree with you, when digital cameras recently was in the market i say same as you, to put an electronic device inside the analog cameras to keep using the machines but everybody told me that the idea was stupid, look, finally we was not wrong hahaha, :D
The first DSLR were made like this in the 90s. The problem with the approach in this video is that the crop factor is enormous. Rendering it practically unusable (everything will be very zoomed in)
I have a Canon and a bag full of EF lenses that I would love to play with, with this setup. I'll bet my 100-300 mm would create insane photos with this crop factor. Outstanding job sir!
I remember shutter bug had an article about such a thing, and never heard another thing about it. I forget how long ago it was , i would guess around 20 yrs ago
this really shows how the image quality of a camera is not from the sensor, but its from the optics, this get a better zoom quality than my phone 108mp camera and zooms a lot further
"Patent"? This is a 25 years old idea, many top quality cameras brands have sold this concept in the past (Hasselblad, Leica etc...), but full frame or medium format solutions are absurdly expensive... do not worth the effort (remains an amusing DIY experiment, anyway).
This is a great proof of concept. I really like the fact that it doesn't require that you to modify the camera. You can try it on an expensive film camera without worry and can use the same camera for film or digital with a quick change.
Worth a kickstarter campaign to get to m4/3 sensor mate!...pitch it to fujifilm to have baked colour profiles like velvia etc...revives old film camera....game changer!
Fantastic! since Digital cameras became the new Standard I briefly pondered selling my Minolta 7000 for something "newer and more featured", but then I read a few years ago that some of the newer bigwigs in the cinematography field had discovered that digital had some drawbacks and I was glad I hadn't swapped out. Now I look forward to making my own and seeing what I can do. I look forward to your conventional experiments and seeing if I can glean a few more secrets. Thanks for doing the heavy lifting and starting me off. I look forward to chatting with you about this topic. Cheers.
That adapter concept was promised as "coming real soon now" in 1973. Every year it was promised next year. Congratulations, after 48 years you've made one!
This is great innovative solution for using old slr cameras of high quality lenses. I was thinking of this thing theoretically and you brought it in reality. With more R&D, it can be high quality full frame. With millions of old slr cameras just lying idle, it can be a new photography marvel! Wish you great success..
This is genius! I have a few old analog cameras I would love to use with something like this! Need to look into this, thank you so much for the inspiration! 🙏
I remember when I was 5 wondering why something like this didn't exist... well now it does and color me impressed it actually works really good for a prototype.
If he develops a really good working model, the big manufacturers will pay millions to him for the rights and then bury it, they don't want us using our old cameras as they won't sell their new, evermore expensive ones!
Was für eine geile Idee! Schnell weltweit patentieren lassen! Allein die Bedienung der analogen Kameras ist wesentlich logischer als das mühselige Menue - Meandern. Ich drück die Daumen! Lass uns wissen, wann Du mit dieser Erfindung in Serie gehst!
Adding a film canister style block to the other end might reduce the shaking a bit as I believe it’s probably caused by the unsupported weight of the raspberry pie. You could probably fit another battery in it too if that’s the case.
A full frame version would be around 400 bucks if my approximations are correct and production is high, which it probably won't be. So you're already at the price of a second hand full frame camera like a 5D Mark II.
Please go into production with these, I would love one for my vintage cameras. I am unable to try and build my own as I have medical Issues with fingers , hands and wrists, and apart from that I wouldn't know where to start. 😊. Brilliant idea and product.
this is great! when digi cams were introduced , for me THIS was always one logical way to go. using the old prestine hardware base of slr cameras. but it never came - untill today. kudos!
If you could make these with a Micro Four Thirds or larger sensor, and include a still-capture feature that incorporates the camera's shutter, you could sell them by the thousands! I'd be your first customer! I'd gladly pay $300.00 or more for something like that!
@@tobiasnietgen wow, thats a scammy :) its a small webcam that shoots at a ground glass :) people go for anything these days... the image quality will be horrible, even as dof adapters (in cinema use).. the ground glass is made so that it moves/rotates, so the coarse grain of it wont be showing all the time.
unfortunately, i looked into this, the hardware just isn’t available to someone trying to hack something together, and perhaps more importantly, no sbc or microcontroller for hacking stuff together is powerful enough for the large sensors
surely there are some older sensors that aren't as high density that are still large in the capture surface that would give same image output as pi camera, just not cropped to the center that would work. No-one is expecting 8k from version 1.
amazing idea, i have this idea thousand years ago when the first digital cameras start in the market with fucking 600.000 pixels of resolution, finally this is posible, would be great to can use a bigger sensor but the concept finally is here, my old nikon and yashica analog cameras and lenses will be work again, so great, thank you dude :D
I genuinely didn't know this idea has been around for a while..till reading the comments. I had an old Pentax super A, with a 50mm(?) pancake lens. That would make a great compact digital camera. I want to make one.
Interesting video. Back in the noughties when film cameras were on their way out, I thought it was such a waste to have such great cameras in my collection, an Olympus OM4 & OM2 made redundant. I wondered if a third party manufacturer would remove the back of the camera and fit a new back with a sensor attached, to sit close behind the shutter. When technology improved you would just replace the back with a newer more powerful MP sensor. It was fascinating to see that you'd come to the same conclusion but thought of a less invasive / destructive way of doing this. Well done.
Most 35mm SLRs had backs as accessories, date backs, large film rolls, etc. A back would give you a lot more room to play around with. You could put a small screen on the back. Also put a rotary switch line up with the film advance. When you "wind" the film, the RPi can send the image to the computer.
Indeed. I still hope that this will change in the future with the plans of the RPI foundation to open up the camera pipeline. Would be spectacular eith an APS-C or even full frame sensor.
@@ufukkiblat Unfortunately, you will never get them close enough. A pixel of these sensors is roughly 1um in diameter. So even if you get them as close as 1mm, you will have a "black bar" in the middle of the image in the order of 1000 pixel width.
Absolutely great to see a working example of this. At least twice, and possibly more, in the past twenty five years, I've seen vapourware / RSN versions of this promised but they never made it to market. As one with a drawerful of 35mm cameras I'd like to breathe some digital life into, I'm following developments with interest.
As I recall, this was the route that Kodak took in the mid 90s to provide Associated Press photographers with digital image capabilities. They took Nikon cameras and retrofitted a sensor where the film would go and a large battery/storage system where you'd expect a modern vertical grip. I believe it was called the Kodak DCS.
Quite a few years ago someone developed to this point but it was an extension on the back but that was as far as it got, now the proof of concept that it can fit in the actual camera is great. Brilliant technical achievement, however, you’re reinventing the wheel, however, techies and electronic nerds would love this, but the minimum size sensor isM43.
Nice work! With the sensor used here (Sony IMX219) you've effectively created a 1/4" image plane, which gives you a crop factor of approximately 11x, compared to the standard 35mm film roll normally used in this kind of camera. Additionally, you're only capturing about 1/11 the amount of light which could lead to a noisy image. Are you planning to add a shutter trigger to the Pi and coordinate that with the mechanical mechanism of the camera to be able to actually capture still images?
I bet that was a fun project! Yashica had a Kickstarter campaign a few years ago with a 'digifilm' hybrid, and I have seen a few others try to make digital cartridges. The crop factor on that frame is pretty insane lol.
I still have a complete set of Olympus camera from 40 years ago.... dont need the electric winder for this solution ;) but all the lenses are ok. GREAT IDEA!
Amazing project! A question, do you need to position the sensor precisely (in terms of depth, i.e. proximity to the shutter), or an approximate position where the film used to be is sufficient? Or maybe it doesn't matter because when you focus the lens, any difference is compensated. I guess the labels on the focus ring would be slightly off because of this, maybe it's small enough to not matter.
It's amazing you were able to make a working prototype of this idea! If you continue iterating, there is a significant (but niche) market for a device like this, with improved image quality.
