Disability and Queerness in Nimona 

I don’t really cry at movies. But that line made me sob. It hit me close and made me feel so connected to Nimona’s story.

same bro that line hit SO DAMN HARD AAAAA

after hearing her say that Bal's dad hug ripped out my heart. the apology too but the dad hug the most.

Everytime I watch the ending I just choke up

@@hydrofalls8154 I know **hug** I laughed so hard when it ended on "HOLY SHI!!*" I knew she was coming back. I just really love how. hey does anyone know the name of the song Bal was listening too when she first showed up?

!!! I was about to comment about this! Also I love Double Trouble I wish I was them :((( Also heads up ND Stevenson uses he/him pronouns now and not they/them anymore :) not trying to be rude or anything, I also just found out recently too lmao

@@kiwipomegranate oh! Thx wasn't sure where he stood anymore but I know for a long time they them was a consistent pronoun so I used it imma fix the post lol

Yeah, Nimona's character was basically his way to explore stuff he did not yet realize about himself when he was younger. The allegory was made more explicit in the movie years later, because Nate now understands what that was about. And yeah, he has talked about how he has always loved shape-shifters. For example, he really liked that random shape-shifter bounty hunter (Zam Wesell is her name) that appeared in one of the Star Wars prequels and Double Trouble was partially inspired by her. I understand it's frustrating when trans and non-binary characters often are allegorical fantastical beings and stuff, but many of them are not that way just for the comfort of cis audiences and the creators have talked about how it's a cathartic way to express their own identities (like Nimona's fluidity and the Gems from Steven Universe being non-binary women.)

@@vilmublues752 Yeah I can definitely see the reasons people (including non-binary people) dislike Double Trouble, and there is something to be said about so many of them being shape-shifters, but I'd take that choice of power any day tbh.

@@saltydinonuggies1841 As an Enby I would LOVE to have shapeshifting powers. So I don't really mind if the characters are shape shifters instead of humans. Not to mention... the majority of people in that She-ra serie are NOT human, so it doesn't really make Double Trouble an other, just because they are able to shapeshift.

>it might as well have been explicit We should not have to search for a trans flag in a background of one shot in order to get explicit trans rep

@@BAVy11037 As someone who is both trans and asexual, believe me, I get it. I will never not be a bit bitter that both Steven Universe and The Owl House, shows otherwise praised to high heaven for their excellent, in your face and unapologetic representation, had characters that were apparently supposed to be asexual the whole time, but we wouldn't know that without word of god. To the point that the whole fandom ships Peridot with Lapis and flagrantly ignores her canonical asexuality because it wasn't clarified until after the show had wrapped. And the fact that there are people out there who completely missed Nimona's obvious genderfluidity is demonstrative of the fact that we need in your face, loud and explicit representation, because any shred of deniability will be grasped by anyone with an agenda to do the denying. That does not negate the fact that this movie is SO steeped in trans culture and the trans experience that it means a very great deal to a lot of people, myself included. And I've known people like Nimona who don't identify as cis, but refuse to label their gender otherwise, and that's completely valid. To conclude, yes, I 100% agree with you, but I still love this movie for what it is.

I totally agree with your last point but I guess technically we could imagine that he properly apologized in the timeskip but yeah I do still wish we saw it and yeah your other points are so good and real!!

"And you're a boy now." "I am today" What a lovable little gremlin

@@shinkoryu14 oh yeah, for sure, it's a great movie. Among other things, I like how it shows that NB people can use binary pronouns, and that doesn't make them not NB. In shows like SU, TOH, SPOP for example, NB *people* use only they/them. Idk who was supposed to be ace in TOH, but in SU, I think Peri not wanting to fuse with anyone is supposed to mean that she is ace, right? And she can still be shipped with Lapis, since she's not aroace, is she? This does not extend to people who ship them and then also imagine/draw a fusion of the two.

Frickin Well said.

Wow that is such a valid take and fits SO WELL, it makes so much sense I feel so stupid for not noticing that XD

For me, Nimona is much more of an allegory for furries. I mean, she literally turns into her fursonas.

That's such a lovely point of view. I'm going to view it that way too I think ❤

@@Jasmin-lg3gf She can be a trans furry

I have absurd and often vulgar verbal tics. I always encourage people to laugh at them, but they always apologize anyway. I mean sure, I wouldn't want strangers doing it, but I don't even have to know you that well, I just have to know it's coming from the right place and we're chill.

That is one upside to the subtleness of the allegory is that anyone with similar feelings can relate for different reasons. Nimona’s character definitely felt like a warm hug for the “weird” folks 😌

How many allegories are we talking about?

Yes! Exactly how I felt, too. When Nimona explained how it felt to hold back from shapeshifting, I related so hard, not with just being queer and hiding it from people in my personal life, but with my autistic quirks. Even just today, I felt like a little bit of the odd one out in a group. I'm just me. Back as a kid I didn't feel comfortable being me. I held back, even just 2 years ago. So Nimona's quotes hit me in the feels.

⁠@@iclynnxyup as an autistic person I relate to the experience of not quite fitting in within a group

* solidarity fist bump * from an AutDHD & agender Finn

"And you're a boy now." *"I am today* 😈"

Honestly, I haven’t seen much genderfluid representation in the media, so seeing Nimona made me so happy! Of course it wasn’t directly stated, but it was implied enough that I’m sure everyone could tell.

As a gender-fluid person I agree

Yeah aside from the time she's pretending to be Bal I think it's pretty heavily implied that her shapeshifting abilities are not her pretending to be something she's not. When she's a shark she's literally a shark. When she's a whale she's literally a whale.

@@lake4433 i'm surprised that not many people are pointing out that line

* solidarity fist bump * from an asthmatic in Finland, EU

I too am asthmatic and used to get within the top 6 of my class with the pacer test, though now as an adult I can't really run anymore xD

It does have Ballister's face, but it's from when he was a kid rather than the adult that most people know. So I think you might be right.

The billboard has young Ballister (along with the other knights)

That's super cool

Oh yo they did that? That's awesome, I'm polish but only saw the english versiom

@nectarinn3 i recommend seeing it in polish! The dub is super nice

Yesss! I view myself in Nimona in terms of being neurodivergent.

Yeah, Nimona works as a metaphor for various forms of neurodivergency, both in the movie and the comic (which has some plot points that hit close to the themes of psychiatrist abuse that really got to me) and it makes sense that it does since the author is bipolar (and possibly ADHD??? He never made that clear) and poured so much of his feelings at the time into her. Also, yeah, the fact that Ballister is design to have a lot of "stereotypical villain traits" that just boil down to discrimination against certain groups of people is a great choice. Like, he's a scarred, disabled, queer person of color and in the movie there's also the thing with him being the first commoner to train as a knight. He's the kind of person society chooses to see as a villain.

Yeeeees. No notes. Just agreement. I love how there are layers in this story.

definitely strikes me as autistic

SO TRUE!!

same lol

Yup

🤡

@@LauraPoulter hello there clown, how are you today

@@LauraPoulterwow so nice of you to show me a self portrait of yourself

Reading this drained my social battery I'm so sorry for you

I mean, as a trans guy I agree that Nimona could be interpreted as a trans allegory but it can also be an allegory for any other social issues where other groups of people are discriminated against.

Idk, ur friend didn’t say your interpretation was wrong or bad, they said it was possible and cool. That’s kinda how most art works, the meaning for the author can be different from a spectator. No matter who creates it, it can be art that relates to anyone. I personally love allegories, it makes me feel like no matter what routes we take, we can reach the same points in life, makes me feel like we’re all connected in some way.

whatever their interpretation, can't erase the fact that Nimona's creator stated that Nimona the character was an exploration of their own transness. and can't erase how explicit some of her dialogue is. Like Oakwyrm said, "anyone who tries to argue it's not a trans narrative is being willfully ignorant" (and ofc Nimona is about more than nonbinary trans people so I don't think I personally would say it's "quite obvious")

also maybe work on getting other friends cause that group sounds super draining when you're unable to relate to them about key parts of your life experience and thus have to consciously restrict what you say (if you'd describe the experience as feeling unsafe, that's a pretty strong hint)

It is SO relatable The AMOUNT OF TIMES I’ve told people who questioned me that “I’m a person” is abhorrent

My agenderness is more “I have no gender so technically I could be any gender, idc really”, but I agree it’s so annoying when people just can’t grasp that no gender means NO gender

She made up the story about the witch, Nate said so in a very old post. Nimona's language around it is weird though, it makes me think that she might have _made_ herself believe it at that time

I swear this year has been soo good for animated movies we've got Nimona,the new TMNT movie,Spiderverse 2. There's probably more.

@@trixxart777 YES the last few years in particular have given us so many animated movies that have pushed the media.

@anokartist2352 hell I know people hate on Pixar and Disney's stuff recently but I really like most of their animated stuff. It's why I am excited for Wish because it looks pretty interesting.

@@trixxart777 you and me both, with the exception of movies like Wendy Disney and pixar are still really good, even if they aren't lion king and toy story good

Sometimes they do. If they feel the glasses can be used as a weapon they will take them away. I remember asking about that when I was younger when we had officer’s at my school. When I asked what they would do if the person genuinely couldn’t see without them they said “they shouldn’t have committed the crime if they can’t handle the consequences.” It made me mad as someone with glasses because the crime could be as little as theft all because someone *might* use the glasses to harm someone else.

@@ramsiethegremlin4310 does not surprise me in the slightest. Though weaponized contacts are an interesting concept XD

Wow that officer sounds like an asshole

HELLO i use a non-yt app to watch yt because i started getting some absolutely awful ads but like, i re-installed to hunt down your comment because this is one of the best ways to explain alternate ways of thinking about disability, especially the social model of disability!! It's really exciting to see people out their starting to make these connections on their own--poor eyesight _is_ a disability! it can impaor ones ability to perform certain tasks, and make wearing certain headgear, like dafety goggles or helmets, more difficult. It can also make certain physical activity impossible without potentially breaking them. But, a lot of the reason we dont think of this as a disability is because we have transitioned to a normalization of slightly or somewhat poor eyesight (at least, up until the point of being legally blind, or near that.) It's now common sense that someone who needs glasses but doesnt have access to them would perform worse in almost every area. It isn't weird or out-there to see characters wearing glasses in media, even main characters. And, of course, it feels absurd to demand someone take out their contact lenses after imprisoning them! Most of society can correctly identify ableism (both systemic and individual) as the real problem. This is the basic idea of the social model of disability. disability is created by the barriers around the disabled person that makes them disabled. understanding this, we should let these disabled people innquestion kead the charge against ableism, so that we can give them what they need to thrive. The social model acknowledges that people with poor eyesight who need glasses or contacts _can_ thrive as they are, without needing, say, eye surgery. Now, most disabilities are ones that are not normalized, lets say for myself that's chronic pain. the medical modle of disability identifies the probpem not as being the barriers I face, such as a building with another floor i need to access but no elevator, or a workplace refusing accomodations without like 8 abled doctors saying i definitely have the thing, but it says the problem is my own body, and its attempts lt protect itself from long-gone threats in the form of pain. The medical model says that as a result we can't trust disabled people tonhave knowledge of their own disabilities, be independent, or succeed under the right circumstances; under the medical model, society at large believes I should find a way to cure my own chronic pain, rather than be accomodated for a permanent fixture only body and its workings. this is oversimplified of course--some disabilities cannot, in fact, be cured by removing all ableism. Like, having many types of chronic illness still sucks even in an ideal world that is extremely accomodating of that disability. but yeah, its that medical model that identifies prosthetic users as inherently other, not to be trusted withnthe management of their own disability, compounding with societal conceptions of criminality, and therefore having the dehumanizing outcome of police _taking away their limbs!_ long 3 am ramble, but like, yeah. really cool to see people starting to connec tthe dots on their own! its noce to remember epople can learn and change and grow and i can be optimistic and look toward a world that is less ableist. I recommend reading up more on disability if you read this all the way through! the sociology and politics of it is fascinating, and only becoming more relevant.

I didn't see that, that's so cool

“I am today”

afaik Nimona was made by Blue Sky Studios (also known for Ice Age, Rio) before the studio's parent company, 21st Century Fox, was acquired by Disney and the audio ultimately went under. Disney didn't have a whole lot to do with the making of it -- they did fuck with the initial distribution of it though.

Even if you somehow look past the obvious trans allegories there’s an explicitly on-screen kiss involving the protagonist and his same-sex love interest lol

The thing with there not being blood in kids movies is so weird because no one is even calling for that to be censored or anything

Gender fluid*

Yeah but since it's an algory and I'm not trans myself I was going of the terminology used by the video Not that your wrong, I just don't want to be.

Fun fact nimonas refferred to as they in the audio description

You can't "teach" somebody to be gay they either aren't or they are

Centaurworld also had an attempted suicide scene which made my jaw drop, very unexpected

I certainly wasn’t expecting it either. However, it’s not the first I’ve seen that happen in a PG/family-friendly movie. The Incredibles had a scene like that at the beginning of the movie. However, in that movie’s case, the character who attempts it is a minor character. He’s only appears twice, and he’s never shown- or even mentioned- again after that.

It's also at 13:20!:]