Discussion with Steven Erikson on my Old English translation of his poem "Book of the Fallen" 

Erikson’s fan engagement is elite. As are your videos, Phillip.

Absolutely fantastic discussion, Philip. A beautiful translation, and a wonderful discussion afterward. This is really great.

This is such an original concept, away from the typical author interview format. You rarely see an in-depth, academic analysis of the work with the author himself. I am so stoked by this. Thank you Philip!

Wonderful to hear two poets read their works! Thanks 🙏

Well that was stunning. The Old English has so much power and thought behind it. Congratulations Philip, very well done!

Omg my 15-yr.-old conlanging self foraging around the early internet to learn how to get bits of the Edda into a format I could understand well enough to translate it into the Romanized version of my Itty bitty baby language so that I could then practice writing it in my own script characters (whew!)... would have died and gone to heaven over this kind of content!

This has the feel of an escalating arms race with A.P. to it. So what will his answer to this be? Singing an irish translation of this poem while playing his harp?

My favourite author too, Philip. Can't thank you enough for this. Steven Eriksson , for the win!!! 💜. Watching it right away.

I love when Steve gives book recommendations. They usually go to the top of my to read list. Suggestion Philip. Could you put the books you talk about in the notes

I'm halfway through my first read of Gardens of the Moon and I'm loving it. Once you let go of the fact you're not supposed to understand anything right off the bat, it's an extremely enjoyable read. I love the mystery of it. And of course, Steven Erikson's prose is beautiful.

Hearing you speak Old English brings tears to my eyes. It's breathtakingly amazing. I'm glad that there are people like you, keeping the fire of our past aflame, and doing that beautifully. Thank you.

More interviews like this could really revive literature in the age of streaming.

I've watched many conversations with Erikson, but the ones with Philip stand head and shoulders above the rest. And the Old English translation is a brilliant addition to the Malazan world. Keep going, Philip! You've got a fan an subscriber in Ukraine)))

Thank you for this Philip. Just finished. One of the best convos I've heard with Steve

Fantastic poem and discussion! Bravo to you, Philip, for your wonderful translation and Old English reading of this poem! I thoroughly enjoyed the discussion as well and look forward to watching the spoiler section once I complete the series. The topics of evolving consciousness and free will always fascinate me. Thanks to both of you!

Holy vultures... this chat would fit perfectly in a Congress, Philip. Thanks for that translation and for the great interview! Now I feel like trying to translate it into Old Spanish 😂 It's great listening to Erikson talk about things that are peripheral to the series. He'll end up making my TBR nonfiction list explode 😂

So many good vibes from this video! First of all, Steven Erikson and Philip having a casual interesting conversation about the kind of books they like and then me, who likes to learn new things about languages, going "oh s**t, Old English is hella interesting!" Thank you!

Thank you for this wonderful video and for the translation, read so musically. The idea of Erikson's melancholy at seeing the world he and Esslemont built together possibly lost as they went on their separate paths, that this melancholy informed the poem and perhaps the series to a degree, is incredibly moving and enlightening to consider. It certainly caused me to reflect on my own worlds lost to the passage of time!

This is my favorite video. It’s awesome. Great job Phillip.

Thank you so much for this Philip. As someone not familiar with Old English it was a fascinating discussion and I loved the reading. You could really tell Steve got a kick out of the idea of someone telling the tale to a few people around a fire. This is the language of my ancestors and to hear it felt natural. It's hard to describe.

Your channel is a blessing. It's not always easy to find a place where you hear such intellectual conversations that does not sound intentional or kind of boring. It's just two scholars having a chat sharing fascinating ideas about literature and consciousness and language and neurology and human brain development! My God!

Well, this must be one of the best Malazan videos ever. Revelatory. That whole Malazan world was almost not there... We're very fortunate that Erikson persevered, and forced Oponn's hand(s)! Impressively done, Philip, your translation! The word that occurred to me when you two discussed the 'understated' nature of both Erikson's and Anglo-Saxon poetry was 'laconic'. As for the absence of enjambment, 'end-stopped line' is the term I suddenly remembered (I came across it when I read about the difference between Marlowe's and Shakespeare's blank verse). Finally, in Dutch and German (and the Scandinavian languages, too, if I'm not mistaken), making a noun of a past participle is common. In Dutch the verb is 'vallen', the past participle 'gevallen', and 'gevallenen' are the fallen. I enjoyed this tremendously. A video for the ages.

I just now discovered your page but I am so thrilled to see Malazan channels on RU-vid and I can't wait to dig through all of your videos. The Malazan books are on their own highest tier of my personal list of favorite series, and it's such a treat to see someone intelligent and entertaining give their take on this complex series. Not only that, but you've had the author on multiple times and I can't describe how awesome it is to hear one of the creators of the series give insight on his own work. Thank you!

Oh boy, oh boy! What a wonderful surprise.

That was fantastic Dr Chase! It was great to see Mr Erikson so thoroughly engaged. He is always enjoyable to watch, but he seemed completely enthralled in this conversation. Great video!

Philip, your reading of the poem at the beginning brought a tear to my eyes. As Friend Kruppe said, "It starts the eyes". I'm very much keen for you to translate and read the final poem paragraph at the end of The Crippled God -- it may be the most stirring part of the series for me. "Remember Us" Beautiful work as always. Keep churning out this unique content!

Wow 😮 u had a great video with Steven Erikson on ur channel!! Happy reading to you!! 😊📚📖🎬

The way SE describes how that Bicameral Mind work was derided reminds me of how many 'hard scientists' try to pick apart the 'postmodern' philosophers by completely missing the point of what they're trying to do. Anyway, this was so awesome! Thanks for doing the translation, hosting this, and putting it in a place where we can all enjoy and learn from it!

Oh, and one more thing: between the four of you (Steve, AP, Cameron and you), you truly elevate literature, particularly in the muddy waters of RU-vid. Listening to you people is like sitting in a university classroom. If only there were more book reviewers who could see things in a similar manner!

Sublime!!! This must be the most unique video on YT. Your translation is awesome and I think really captures that haunting beauty that Old English poetry and the Malazan epigraphs share. And as always when you talk to Erikson you seem to be able to ask the questions that enable Erikson to give us really interesting background information. I found your thought process about feallanra especially interesting. Can the past participle be used as a noun? From a German language point the answer is yes. In modern German we have 'die Gefallenen' which is the exactly that -- past participle as noun, and means the fallen soldiers. But already in Old German (Althochdeutsch) we have gifallan the past participle of fallan (fallen-to fall) used in conjunction when talking about persons in the sense of to perish. So I think those Anglo- Saxons would have had no problems with that. Also if you and Erikson ever make it to Dublin (again) you're very welcome and we have that pint.

Such a wonderful video. I feel no comment I make could actually do it justice. Erickson's explanation of how the poem tied into his own life as well as the story of The Fallen, and your explanation which words were chosen and why for your translation were both just beautiful.

This is great thank you for the video. I absolutely agree with SSJ94 that Erickson's commitment to interacting with fans is amazing . I don't think I've seen an artist that is willing to interact with their fans like he does. These videos get me through my work day. Thank you so much 🙏🙏🙏

This was absolutely fascinating. Other than just fun engagement with fans and the public, this must be so fun as an author to have your text transformed like this (not even to speak to the fascinating conversation that followed about the brain and things, I could spend countless hours on those topics). So cool.

And here I am still having not read any Malazan. This is awesome.

This is awesome, thanks so much for this!

I appreciate this video a lot. It’s opened my eyes to concepts I never would’ve come into contact with or synthesized on my own so that has been wonderful (Jaynes idea, etc…) Malazan has done the same thing for me. It has been incredibly enriching in ways I can’t describe in one simple comment. Thanks for the effort you put in. I’m glad that Erikson enjoys your engagement with him so much. We enjoy it as well. I’ve been searching for insightful analysis of the series by experts like you and AP, and the fact that I have access to so much knowledge and understanding in the form of the malazan book tube is wonderful and truly humbling. Thanks for your hard work. Erikson, if you end up reading this, thank you for being you. I’m not knowledgeable enough or insightful enough to engage with you on the same level as so many others and to “give back” as he put it, but the series has been so important to me emotionally and intellectually. So thank you as well. I don’t comment much but I was moved by the video and outpouring of love in the comments. Once again, I give you guys a huge thank you from an appreciative college student.

Very interesting discussion. Your videos (also A.P’s) always get me interested to go look up more literary and linguistic topics even though I usually am more drawn to reading fantasy and sci fi as an escape

This video is fantastic! On so many levels, Absolutely loved it, thank you!

It took me a while to find some time to watch this due to the length. But I'm happy I found a spot. Loved this video. Old English is so beautiful, thanks for your fantastic effort and insights!

A milestone for the channel. This is your best video yet.

excellent! than you both so much

Wow, this was such a treat, Philip! :-) while you were reading your translation, I found myself closing my eyes, as if listening to an old tale :-) it evoked all sorts of imagery, and scenery; I could just imagine a travelling bard or maybe the local sage telling the story around the firecamp, and the people gathered there, being enraptured by the tale :-) I was not aware of the (partly) personal nature of the poem, to be honest; but that, in my mind, just helps add another layer of complexity to the poem, specifically, and, The Book of the Fallen, as a whole :-) Again, such a treat! :-)

This is very cool. The poems really are an unsung highlight of the books. I have a notebook where I wrote down my favorite poems from all 10 books. I like to take it out and read through them sometimes.

Philip, I had a wonderful time with this video. The care you put in to your translation was inspiring, down to fretting about word selection. It was also so interesting to find out about how Steve's mindset crept into the poem. Thanks for this the both of you.

I'm Swedish, and I absolutely see the connection to Old Norse in this, even though I don't speak that language. I'm sure an Icelandic person would recognize much more.

Phillip, your approach to booktube is perfect. Your understanding of the text is deeper than any other content creator I have found I hereby knight thee ‘The Professor of Fantasy’

Incredible! So glad I got to watch this. What a treat!

I'm not nearly as educated on these subjects but this was so interesting and fun.

I'm totally ready to buy my special edition of the MBOTF in old english.

Thank you, this was brilliant! A very meaningful intersection of fantasy worldbuilding and language/literature history. Re the word gehygdas, it is indeed related to a modern Swedish word, through Old Norse, just like many other words in English. In Swedish, it's håg, which means mind, although it's an obsolete word by itself. Today mostly found in the phrasal verb komma ihåg, "to remember".

What an amazing video! I just realized that reading the poem now (or hearing it read) is so different from when I first read it in GotM. After Mr. Erikson read it, I had to pause and wipe my tears... I am not even done with the ten... can't wait to see the whole video (minute 7 right now)!

This is one of the most interesting discussions that I have heard on RU-vid. Thank you both. It is really great (and rare) to listen to a discussion between two experts approaching something from their own angles of expertise.

Yes, Gödel, Escher, Bach! It's one of the most interesting books I have ever read. Though I would urge people to either skip or skim the chapter on formal systems, or at least tell them that they don't need to understand it fully. By the end of the book, you will understand it.

Amazing discussion and and analysis by two incredibly competent individuals!! Wow, i'm sitting here, absolutely blown away by the articulate nature of this entire video! I am so thankful i get to consistently watch such great content from you Philip. Love the discussion, your channel and the comforting vibe of this video. Thanks Philip!! :)

Well this was just fantastic on so many levels. Thank you 🙏👌

Liked this a lot, interestingly great stuff guys.

Connecting ancient Norse oral tradition to modern urban rap tradition is just brilliant. Phenomenal work gentleman.

This is so good

Wow! that was awesome!

This is exceptional, very nicely done. I have to revisit my dog eared copy of Godel, Escher, Bach again dammit. And it sits next to a similarly worn Guns, Germs and Steel as well as The Drunkards' Walk. This re-read is going to take me ages if you and AP and Lundin are going to keep stacking my tbr 😁

This was such an amazing video! Probably the best interview of Erikson I have ever seen. And I have so much to say about it I must apologize in advance for the wall of text :))) I loved the way you mentioned in the intro that you feel like these books have given you so much that you feel like giving something back. Because I feel the exact same way. I always feel in Steve's debt, as there is nothing I could ever do that would even remotely even out that balance. Then there is the translation of the poem. To be clear, I know nothing of old English. The closest I ever got to anything remotely resembling it was a fragment from one of Shakespeare's works. I can't remember which one, but it was hadly half a page worth of text. And no, that was not old English. But I always had a love and a gift for languages (English is not the only foreign language I am fluent in, but it is the one I master the best), so I tried to keep up. I too have noticed the similarity in sound with the North European languages. And while it doesn't sound like it, some words were reminding of German as well. And I must say I enjoyed the challenge a lot, despite the fact I don't have what it takes to have an educated input. I would say your work was outstanding, for whatever it's worth coming from someone who has no knowledge about it. However, as a muscian and someone who loves the study of languages, it sounded amazing. And that, at least, does lie within my abilities to analyze. The part about the shift of consciousness was absolutely fascinating. And the thought of the Malazan books never making it to printing always makes my heart shrink a little. That would have been a loss not only to Steve and Cameron, not only to us, the fans, but to generations to come. Because I have no doubt these books will rise to the glory they deserve, sooner or later. Rather sooner than later, I would hazard. As far as I am concerned, the story they have built is a massive contribution to the cultural patrimony of all humanity, and I like to believe that I am objective about this particular assessment. And then there is the view on history and archeology that Steve was talking about when he mentioned the rings of stones. You can't walk around these places without considering who else could have walked there and how their lives were. I grew up, in part, on the shore of the Danube, and my father, who was quite passionate by history and archeology, had taught us girls (my sister and I) to walk along the shore and look at the things that the waves bring out. Sometimes you can find little archeological treasures like pieces of Roman pottery. There is a power that the Danube has that I haven't felt with any other river (or sea, for that matter). I am a grown up now and as I stand there on the shore, taking in the smells, I look at those silver grey waters and I still wonder how many lives has she swallowed. How many lives has she taken into hersel over her thousands of years. How many souls sing their story with each wave that crashes on the land? And there is an eeriness about it, so intense you can almost sense these ghosts. We are taught in history how the weather was different back then and how the Danube would freeze solid during winters. That was when the Romans would cross over and carry raids into our territory prior to Dacia's conquest. And so I think of the people who died in those battles and stained the ice red, how their lives were and what grief their death has left behind. You can't be an archeologist without feeling these things. Or at least this is how it should be. In closing, I absolutely loved this interview and I can't wait for the next one, especially given the way that the two poems mirror each other. And congrats!

So amazing to discover this tran-creation of this poem into Old English!! I'll buy your books now if for no other reason than to say thanks. And maybe I'll find these books interesting :) Reading the Malazan series for the first time right now.

Because of the length of the video these two shortcuts might be useful: Reading by Mr. Erikson: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-okvCoaWaSgo.html Reading by Dr. Fantasy: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-okvCoaWaSgo.html However, there is so many interesting points and informations which make me feel like I should give twenty more links.

"The other person says 'the god told me to', and then the first person says 'Oh' and walks away. That is a mindset in terms of motivation and character that is as alien to us a you could imagine." Ironically, that is sometimes how I feel when reading Malazan Book of the Fallen ;)

Love this!

I watched in suspense as over an hour passed when AP was mentioned now and again. Great restraint was shown by Mr. Erikson! Until... that final praise of AP by his (estwhile?) nemesis broke the dam at the last minute...

For those interested, the 'Fall of Civilizations' youtube channel has a good episode on the bronze age collapse.

Really interesting experiment! Had no idea Old English was so drastically different from modern day English! I thought the Lament for Theodred from LOTR was a made up song maybe in Elvish!

Wow this was such a fantastic chat. Great work on the translation and reading Philip! Can I ask what translation of Homer's work would you say is the best? I see different translations but never know who to go with

I'll be back for this once I've read all of Book of the Fallen! Almost done with House of Chains.

Wow maybe I've misinterpreted the explanation of the Bronze Age shift in consciousness from Jaynes book, but it sounds like the theory was that people may have believed the voice in their mind was the voice of gods, spirits etc? Sounds like I should get the book!

I saw “Freestyle Rap” coming. I’m a huge hip-hop fan and I got so many vibes from this poem. I think it’s become a joke to call rappers poets and rap poetry. But good rap contains stanzas with rhyme schemes set to various, sometimes changing, meters. With rhythmic beats added for effect! It will be interesting to see how future civilizations look back upon rap.

Do older narratives than the Illiad fall into the same lack of mental landscape? Do we have a similar lack of a mental landscape in Gilgamesh or the Torah or Avesta or Upanishads? Or does the level of economic development and complexity of the society have an impact on the process? Does the transition from smaller-scale societies to larger ones initiate that transition? If so do we see examples in hunter-gather /band-level societies throughout history? Does the transition from oral to literary tradition account for some of these effects? presumably, you would see the inflection point at different points for different societies.

Did he say his ' Krupp-ee' background referring to the painting? The discussion on how to translate fallen was very interesting. It has many meanings depending on context. Reminds me of the old joke 'you are writing about a woman who has fallen, not a fallen woman'. This also becomes problematic if you would be translating just at the start of the series or after completing it. On a side note, how do you determine the pronunciation of Old English or other dead languages? My New Testament professor also taught ancient Greek and the only reference was modern which is likely much different.

Aren't the accounts of the demise of the empire premature though? While I haven't read Esselmont's books yet, what I've read about them is that the empire has a considerable resurgence under the leadership of the man who's name is always to be accompanied by an expletive?

And of course Norman in the mix which would have been maybe the earley French, spiced with some old Scandinavic, And Gaelish too. Confusing.

Well, thinking about it, old english must be mainly Saxon and hence tribal references to old Norse. There are other references of.c , namely the vikings.

Jaynes’s idea seems shaky to me because it doesn’t look like there was such a significant shift in culture between what we see in the Iliad and the time when Homer was living, and because evidence for bicameralism in 20th century tribal cultures doesn’t seem strong (although there hasn’t been much research).

Was old English really that inspired of old Norse, or was it the other way around? Prob. a lttle bit of each.

b y

Give up. I have given up trying to find the friggin books. All you can buy is either ebook, which I have no interest in, or mass paperback with font so small I have no chance of reading. Not at my age. Checked them out and Gardens font is decent because it is so short but the rest, forget about it. Ridiculous that there are no other versions being made for what is supposedly such a great series. Considered audio but reader slurs names so much could not tell who he was referring to. Really sad.