For the Katelyn Lauder case, that REALLY sounds like untreated schizophrenia. My aunt was perfectly functioning, happy, brilliant English professor at Texas A&M for 15 years and then one day she accused the staff of placing a lookalike of her dead sister in the room across from her to spy on her. That was the first incident that indicated she was having some kind of mental health situation. She refuses to get treatment and to this day, she hears things that no one said by people who aren't there. She has full conversations with herself. She fully believes the hallucinations and her kids, my 1st cousins, refuse to get her any kind of help or treatment. My biggest fear is something like the Lauder case happening to my aunt. Schizophrenia is a horrible, horrible, heartbreaking affliction.
I was dating some one who I thought I would spend the rest of my life with. I loved him. One day he went missing for a full day which was completely unlike him. His sister did not know where he was and neither did I. The next day he called and told me he went to a party with uber and left his phone in his car. And I knew that was a lie. Over the next few weeks it became clear something was wrong. And then he broke it to me that he has schizophrenia where he sees things and he sees people talking to him. And he talks back to them and doesn't realise that they are just illusions. His father has the same thing. My heart broke when he said I would safer away from him. And he didn't want to continue the relationship because he was scared of what he may do when with me. And said I didn't deserve that. I'm still heart broken to this day. But I know that schizophrenia is a terrible thing to deal with. Especially when untreated like he was. Where ever he is now, I hope he's OK.
There's absolutely zero doubt in my mind that it was a case of undiagnosed and untreated schizophrenia. I've known two people who suffer from paranoid schizophrenia within my life; one is my best friend to this day and she's a sweetheart and is excellent at rationalising her paranoid delusions. The other was an ex-friend whom I'm glad to no longer be associated with, as he was a paranoid schizophrenic, whom also refused to take his meds, smoked weed and was a raging narcissist to boot. Any time that I'd try to gently explain that the TV wasn't talking to him or whatever nonsense he believed, he would become angry and abusive in response. Anywho, yeah; Katelyn Lauder was 100% suffering from paranoid schizophrenia and died from misadventure. The conspiracy theories surrounding her death are as absurd as... well, a paranoid schizophrenic's delusions.
@@PatD-3877 Yes, her sanity. She was like a sister to me. Now, she's completely untethered from reality. I want my aunt back. I begged my cousin to petition the court for power of attorney in order to force her to get treatment. I did the research to see what Texas law requires in a situation like this, I told them step by step what to do and they've done nothing. Plus she lives all alone here in Houston while her kids all live in Corpus Christi.
Idk, two kids who aren’t sober sailing in the middle of the night going missing, while it was tragic, nothing to me sticks out as pointing to foul play
Yeah, they know she drowned and that they didn't want to be held for a crime in Central America. I'd have done the same thing. Then again, I'd never go to Central America.
@@rcdune7132 Yep. Most likely. They are definately hiding something big. If the story was as simple as a drowning from strong currents, those people would not be behaving in such a suspicious manner. Doesn't take an IQ over that of a monkey to figure this much out. Also on the "Sofia" case, there is a reason why the authorities did not pursue analyzing the fingerprints all over the boat (because they weren't human).
After watching the detailed video some months ago, I emailed the Ng family that the group must have gone on an Ayahuasca retreat. These types of retreats are very popular now and the drug may have influenced Nancy to lose it for a moment and go for a swim. So I think that part of it is true. It also explains why the group hightailed it out of Guatemala immediately. If they signed waivers, they're not allowed to speak on it.
Patricia was very likely suicidal. Her making a therapist appointment doesn't mean anything... There are people who will go grocery shopping, make a whole meal plan for the week, and then do it. It's often an impulsive moment of feeling hopeless. Very, very sad. She probably was overthinking her life, feeling bad about it, decided fuck it and tried to get in an accident, and then either got head trauma or was in such shock that she left and abandoned her life instead.
Idk but I feel like the friends done something . Maybe some went wrong , or a mistake was made and that's why they killed her. But I don't understand the stupidity of the police. And also why were all friends not interrogated by the police why only Cristina. Also if it's true that Cristina saw her not coming back from the underwater she must have saw the moment she drowned. There's no way she wasn't trying to get out from the water ... she couldn't just sink like a rock. Also waiting 24 hours to raport her missing even if Cristina saw her not coming back from the water . That dosen t make any sense at all .
On Kayelyn Louder, I lived with a schizophrenic once who would hear voices outside and believed someone was going to break in and get him. He came to my door late at night more than once, genuinely terrified. It would take time and patience to convince him that what he was hearing was not real. If I wanted to go outside to show him no one is there he'd beg me not to go outside. I would go out anyway and walk around the house, opening the side gate and everything. I'd be telling him there's nobody out here at regular intervals. Then I'd go back in and assure him that what there was no one out there and what he was experiencing was not real. I reasoned with him until he calmed down. You need to understand this is not someone who's merely imagining things, they're having (in the case of my friend) auditory hallucinations and to them its completely real. One problem for him was that, even knowing he had a mental illness, the things he experienced were things you don't want to be wrong about. What if this time there really is someone trying to break in and you're ignoring it because you're reasoning with yourself that this is your schizophrenia? If hallucinations are not wildly out of touch with reality, there is that uncertainty. I don't know what happened to Kayelyn but wandering around outside in the rain in her state without someone who could help her was a terrible situation and the outcome was a terrible tragedy for her and her family. 😢
I bet a young guy who cut his ear off and was ready to do the other when his parents caught him just before he was about do to do his other ear , the voices told him to do it he said . i met him visiting a friend in a mental ward , so many had a sad story that jacked their life up and gave them mental illness .
Katelyn’s twin brother, Colton had many paranoid incidents that were made worse by drugs. He has since passed away. Many people aren’t diagnosed with schizophrenia until they’re in their late 20’s and older. It’s so heartbreaking for her family.
I was getting ready to say she may have been schizophrenic it makes a lot of sense because of how confusing her roommate sounded and how confusing her disappearance is
With the Patricia story there's a high chance she was a mental breakdown and the accident throw her over the edge and now she's basically either forgotten who she was all together or is extremely paranoid and delusional right now... oddly enough it happens a lot.
I'm responding to myself rather than editing schizophrenia can randomly pop up without warning around the mid-twenties to later in life. No signs beforehand. 1 minute the person's okay and then they're in full swing delusions.
As someone who has experienced months long psychosis, Kayelynn's story seems pretty similar to what I experienced. It is terrifying and everything feels 100% real. You never get a break from the delusions, it was the most awful thing I have ever lived through. It also made me extremely suicidal.
I had the same thing happen. I got very suicidal because it was so scary and stressful. I would also agree it was the worst thing I have ever been through. Thankfully it was temporary for me and it sounds like that was the case for you also. I'm glad we both made it.
Imagine going on what you think is going to be a relaxing vacation and then a tragedy happens. The "group" possibly had trouble processing it all because they didn't expect anything bad to happen. Nancy's drowning happened so fast and apparently out of nowhere. I don't think the group was being intentionally malicious but were just in shock. Everyone was quite fond of Nancy so they probably went home to feel safe. I don't think anyone was responsible it was just a tragic accident.
@@penelopes.9696 You’re either trolling or ridiculously stupid. Why no cooperate and doing everything you possibly can to A. Help find your missing friend and B. To help her family to get some closure. You’re insinuating that everybody that was present was so rattled up that they all shut down? Your comment almost angers me.
It's possible that Patricia witnessed it and felt really guilty about not doing anything to save Nancy in the moment. Could be true of the others as well if they saw it,
Witnessing these last footage videos of people that went missing completely in a very unknown way is truly a very terrifying experience, what makes it even more scarier is sometimes the people themselves in these footages act really eerie.
Why would people think the "sex trafficker" scenarios? Honestly if I am out sailing and I come across a young lady marooned alone on a rock/island/lighthouse etc. The last thing I'd be thinking is "Let's rescue her and sell her to sex traffickers?" Who even knows S.Ts?
@@HolytoasterThe fact her body wasn't found likely means she somehow ended up in the water and drowning, not falling through a floor or having something fall on her. Also, that's pretty callous of you. Idk if you have children or plan too, but no matter "how good" you raise them, kids and young adults will always do stuff like this. I hope it doesn't happen to them but if it does, I hope you aren't treated the same way you've treated her and her family.
@@governmentghost01I don't understand how parenting has anything to do with this. They're right, it was a very irresponsible thing to do, they didn't deserve it, of course, no one does. However, you're taking a huge risk by deciding to cross a no-trespassing zone (that's clearly labeled that way for a reason). They didn't “treat her or her family” any sort of way either. Yes, the statement was a bit harsh, but at the end of the day it’s true
@@Kay-sc8fiFair point, though I do appreciate someone for once admitting that a person will do what they want even if they were raised right. I sometimes watch police chest cam footage and the comment section is always a parade of people saying, “This is what happens when a child is never told ‘no.’” Like, dude, it’s never that simple.
The kayak incident of 'she hopped off her boat and that's how she died' makes zero sense. If that were the case, all of them would have been screaming for help once they got back to land, and would've called the cops immediately. Innocent people sound the alarm asap, guilty people keep their mouths shut and flee.
Not always man. Ive been there before, you keep your mouth shut because the cops will railroad anyone that even begins to open their mouth. The cops arent in it to solve crimes, but to clear a case fast as they can no matter who gets arrested
@@edenisburning yeah and I’m also 22 myself and me and my friends also did some stupid shit while under the influence, so yeah that is the best explanation
@@salsaproductions5859 This would explain a lot. It explains the upside down kajak and the drowned body of the guy. Given that it was night, and they seem to be under the influence, all of this add together to make this theory of the tipping kajak plausible. Espescially when they were without vests.
You can barely catch me in the car at night let alone on a damn boat I don’t care if captain Jack sparrow is driving. No sir you’ll have to wait till the sun comes up.
Kayelyn sounds like a case of a schizo-affected illness. Anyone is susceptible to mental disorders like bipolar disorder and the reason for her being let go from her teaching position might give more clues. Even though schizophrenia typically shows up in the early 20's, can still happen later ... also, it's possible she ended up where she did in the river because she went there herself and was hiding from whoever she thought was following her. The fear might have been so great that she thought she had no choice but to stay there and ended up passing out from exhaustion and drowning. If someone has no history of mental illness, it's likely they and the people around them would not recognize it when it starts to happen. She should have been evaluated right after she made that 911 call considering there was no evidence to support what she said she saw.
Came here to say what you say far better than I could here. I have a relative who has schizophrenia, and they have auditory hallucinations when their medicine is no longer doing the job. Many people have visual hallucinations with their mental illnesses. Also, the water temperature in late September is likely pretty chilly. At night, parts of Utah drop to the 40's (according to newspaper articles, she lived in Utah). Combine this with a soaking wet t-shirt and shorts, even if she climbed out, she could very well have succumbed to hypothermia. I feel terrible for her family, but I think this is just a very tragic chain of events brought about by her sudden symptoms.
I do wonder, if she thought she was being followed why’d she leave her dog? it’s possible she could’ve been in a hurry, but she seemed to really care about him
So, seeing someone drown isn't traumatic enough in your opinion? What is enough? A cryptid? Fuckin Lockness? I'd believe a fresh water reef shark got tidal waved into the lake and ate her before I believe Mermaids did. 😂 Too much tin foil hat shit.
The family is insane and accuses everyone at the retreat of murder and destroyed one woman's life. Crazy websleuthers even threatened to unalive her and the family just says "who cares, we want information". The woman drowned, those things happened.
Second last one: "Doesn't have a history of mental health issues" doesn't mean she doesn't have them, and clearly she did. The "family and friends say she was fine and normal" thing tends to not be overly reliable for many cases. Of course family and friends will say that; either the person who went crazy masks a lot, or due to simple bias the family and friends don't notice anything wrong.
Coulda been a serious drug problem also.... cocaine, Crack and especially meth can really mess a persons brain up... I've seen what all of those can do to a seemingly normal person and it's both sad and frightening
Due to the stigma attached to mental health problems, families, and friends might deny the existence of a problem, fearing the persons embarrassment once they're found Also they might feel like people/cops might be less sympathetic. Same also for being a drug user.
She was taken by the merpeople, same ones whose fingerprints were all over the boat. And that's why the corrupt authorities didn't analyze them, because they weren't human and they are hiding these things from the masses.
As someone who lived in Guatemala, specifically on THAT lake- I have one other theory based on the stories the locals told me… No one should be swimming there. In fact, my student exchange program (all of us at least 18) were not allowed to do anything in the lake. Yes, it’s a very popular tourist spot. And very often, people go missing at Lake Atitlan. One morning I woke up very early, and tried to take a swim at dawn in the lake. As I was walking into the water, I heard a man who was fishing on a dock nearby scream at me as though his life depended on it. “No! Get out! Stay away. It will take you.” Is what he yelled in Spanish. I then spent the rest of that year learning everything I could about this lake. Every single one of the locals will tell you the story of “El Diablo Del Lago.” It’s hard to discern if it’s a squid, a cryptid, or something else entirely. But it’s active, very old, and very protective of its environment. I even asked a professor why we wouldn’t snorkel, paddle board, kayak- or participate in any normal lake activities. He could never give me a valid answer, and it always was vague. On our last day of the trip, I told him I knew about Diablo Del Lago. And I asked him if that’s why we couldn’t go into the lake. He told me very simply: “When all the locals say the same thing, including the drunks in the market- you do as the locals say and do.” And I did notice that absolutely no locals frequent the lake recreationally. Only for tourism money, travel from one side of the lake to the next, and fishing to sell at the local restaurants and markets. I plan to return to Guatemala for one of my anniversaries, but I do not plan to visit this lake. While it is one of the most beautiful places I’ve ever witnessed- it is shrouded in ancient and sacred mystery.
It could even be an undercurrent, some kind of eel or sturgeon. If you watch Jeremy Wade, who is a British champion fisherman, biologist, and teacher-he goes looking for these mystery creatures. His shows are EXCELLENT. And it often is some kind of unexpected large eel-like fish behind these lake stories.
For the car accident case, my best bet is that she hit her head and something happened when the crash did, that caused her some type of memory loss or confusion or disorientation. She's probably lost in the woods somewhere.
@@iGoldenBen doesn't change anything. I just didn't state the obvious that "lost in the woods" means sadly she's dead. I was just trying to be tactiful.
I believe Katelyn Louder was most likely having a psychotic break. When she says that “the people” weren’t saying anything just looking at her, a chill ran down my spine. This is classic early visual hallucinations like one would experience with the first psychotic manifestation of schizophrenia, schizo affective disorder, and even bi polar disorder with psychotic features. Not only do I know this because of my education and profession (I’m a licensed clinical social worker), but also because someone I love very much has schizophrenia and her early hallucinations were nearly identical. She also called 911, and stated the “people” breaking in weren’t answering her. But instead of stealing belongings, she said they were there to steal her organs (yes, it was horrifying and scary for her, and for all of us who love her). Katelyn’s description of what she’s experiencing, coupled with her age, and stress level (when a person with a severe mental illness/disorder has their first psychotic break, it almost always occurs between ages 18-27, and when a huge stressor occurs; and they do not get well again without medication), truly lean toward mental illness as the culprit. The phone call, the paranoia, her disappearance, the hallucinations, and her continuing disorganized thoughts and unusual actions, a kind of spiraling deeper and deeper into psychosis, is heartbreaking and so, so tragic. My heart breaks for her, and for all people who endure and fight these insidious illnesses. And the families and loved ones who must endure right along with them. It’s truly a cruelty beyond what those untouched by mental illness will likely ever experience.
I'm guessing that the masked guy was already working there, or previously worked there and Dale recognised his voice and then the thief couldn't set him free.
I remember seeing Dale's case years ago on Unsolved Mysteries. Yeah, I have always believed that he was probably a victim. If he had participated in the inside job, then it wouldn't explain why he was never seen nor heard from again.
Even if he was in on it at the beginning doesn't mean he made it out at the end. I've seen speculation on other channels that he may have ended up in one of the furnaces
Yeah I agree. Looking at a camera is instinctual if you know where they are and in danger. I used to work retail and when we got robbed, we briefly looked at the cameras. The cops even commented this to us after they reviewed the footage that all 4 of us looked at the camera at different times.
About Kayelin: that she was "a bit depressed" in the months before could have been the prodromal phase to a full blown paranoid schizophrenia. That can be similar to a mild depressive episode. Also most patients have their first onset of schizophrenia in their early twenties, so this fits really well. My guess is she was starting to have a psychosis, ran away afraid and sadly had an accident.
In Dale's case, the intruder didn't need to know where the valuable items were because he was holding Dale hostage, so he certainly forced him to show him how to steal.
Yeah, a quarter of a million is a good chunk of change, but to drop your whole life and start again? Not to mention it would probably be even less after splitting it with masked guy. Masked guy might have been another employee that just got caught by Dale and people have killed for less. Organized crime likes to also get involved with stealing precious metals.
@@CobraCommander92 my thought is it was probably an employee that simply got away with both crimes, but consider that a quarter million back then with just raw conversion is nearly 500k today, and that's before considering that the us dollar has a lot more purchasing power in 1987.
@@CobraCommander92 - I like your theory about someone else who works there, or even better a ex employee. One that wouldn't be an immediate suspect due to time, or distance away.
Yeah super duper dick move. It seems the parents made it clear they weren't especially interested in "dealing" with whatever troubles she had. Very offputting. I'm quite sure that's what caused Patricia's behavior and disappearance.
Despite kayelyn not having a history of mental illness, mental illnesses such as schizophrenia can develop much later in life and into adulthood. My brother didn't develop it until his late 30s.
Sorry to hear your brothers situation. It’s upsetting the authorities didn’t recognize during Kaylins 911 call that she needed help ASAP. Instead they just labeled her as “mentally ill” and did nothing else. Plz watch over your brother closely we shouldn’t be losing ppl this way they can be saved before the situation gets to the point of no return.
@@TheD4RT a “targeted individual” is “gangstalked”. Gangstalkers use “Voice to Skull” (V2K) and Remote Neural Monitoring (RNM) to surveillance targeted individuals. The technology uses a form of synthetic telepathy that allows Gangstalkers and targets to communicate. The goal of a gangstalker is to commit a targeted individual into a psych ward, incarcerated, suicide, violence, and/or homelessness. I’m only bringing this up because you mentioned your brother developed signs/symptoms of schizophrenia in his 30s, which is very uncommon.
@@mariecolette9066 Absolutely a shame how the authorities handled her situation! I appreciate you though! Thankfully in my brother's case he was able to get great help and has been able to manage his illness and leads a great life with a wife and two kids :)
I think everything about the death of Nancy is true, except where she gets out of her kayak. It still seems accidental but the group has more to do with it then they’re letting on. I can see Christine being playful and poking Nancy with her paddle not really thinking about the fact she didn’t have a life jacket, and not knowing about how dangerous the currents in the lake were. Nancy *actually* capsizes and it all gets out of control from there. People underestimate nature and it’s very easy for a regular excursion to turn deadly if you’re not prepared.
How are these people not being investigated further?? Even if it were by accident, it should be known what happened to her. Her family is owed that much. For the whole group to be acting shady is also kinda weird. How could 8 other people be completely silent about it? The guy who organized the thing saying cagey stuff to the family too... what happened to you Nancy?! Lol
I can imagine after it happens Christine encounters the rest of the group in a panic and repeatedly says it was an accident. That explains why they would all be nervous. In my opinion still unjust as Christine will probably never reveal the truth.
@@DPSFSU "people not being investigated further" The problem is there are no other witnesses, CCTV or physical evidence. If everyone sticks to the story, the cops have no leverage
For Kayelyn Louder, it sounds like she was having a schizophrenia episode. I had a friend who did similar stuff Kayelyn did even though none of it was actually happening. It’s scary to see and sad to see, all at the same time.
I got a theory on 1st story… don’t go paddling around in a john boat at 2am ANYWHERE without a life jacket, personal protection, and more personal protection! Edit: thanks for the comments, don’t get this kind of response much, funny how that affects the insecurity of some dopamine dopes 🫤 having kids this age I worry a little but try to keep them prepared and self aware, RIP to the victims in these incidents and God bless your parents and families I can’t imagine what you have endured and maybe this will nudge someone to take up self defense with their children or just to say something that we need to while we can
I think Spencer and Sofias boat got loose and got away, leaving them stuck at the lighthouse, and they then decided to try to swim back to the land, resulting in both ofvtheir drowning deaths. Sad.
Or one swam after the boat and started struggling and the other jumped in and were drowned by the one struggling who then drowned themselves. It wasnt like they were stranded on an island in the middle of the ocean. Not sure why it was so urgent. Then again weed and alcohol was involved.
I think Spencer went first, trying to get the boat back by swimming. When he didn't get back she tried swimming back to shore. And maybe he let his phone with Sofia, which explains why she called her mom with his phone. But that doesn't explain why she didn't use her own phone, maybe she didn't bring it? Or maybe her batteries went dead.
Why would they feel the need to swim back? They've only been there a short while, they'd wait until daylight for a boat to pass nearby. Hardly starving to death were they?
@@Coxy-b34exactly I don’t why they didn’t just wait till the day…. they had a phone and could have just chilled there and watched the sunrise with each other…
More likely that mistakes were made getting back into the boat, Sofia initially tried calling, panicked, went in the water to try to help Spencer, then they both drowned. If it's that far it wouldn't make sense to swim back in pitch black water.
I'm amazed at the amount of people who genuinely think "I don't know any of these people or what's going on, better doxx, harass and send death threats to this complete stranger" is a reasonable way to go through life.
Most people are really not all that smart and the fact that they’re not that decent either makes matters worse. We have an epidemic of stupid sociopaths.
Even if they’re being 100% honest about what happened, no one will ever know what happened to Nancy, her family will never have a body to bury. All because of choices they made.
same, people on the internet are really scary, none of them feel any remorse or anything about what they do, they're hidden behind their screen and just harass other. worse is that they still believe they're good people
The "intruder" case was a psychotic break. An intruder wouldn't stay in her apt while she's on the phone with cops, much less lock the door behind himself (why?)
@@bambooexpress To make Kayelyn look like she is mentally unstable. What if her roommate and Kayelyn grew to dislike each other and her roommate wanted her gone. It's not far-fetched.
5:46 So, let's say this scenario played out: Spencer went swimming after the boat, and something happened to him, he drowned. You are Sophia, stranded but with a phone. Are you really so terrified of a possible trespassing charge that rather than calling the police, you'd rather die slowly in agony in a deserted lighthouse?
@@77Creationwhy would Austin and his dad pay for the search right away no one looked into it if they can afford an entire search then they can afford to pay people off
I Agree! Especially because Austin and his dad paid for the search that's not cheap maybe they could afford to pay off law enforcement unknown fingerprints no effort to search at all
The problem is this scenario is imagined by you with no proof. Two drunk kids drowned at night, that's the whole secret. Why are peole so dumb to imagine stupid conspiracy theories about everything.
Missing people cases always intrigue and scare me the most. Just the fact that we may never know what happened to them and how their final moments played out. I'll never stop thinking of possibilities that could've happened to them
My ex girlfriend has a psychotic break all of a sudden. She was completely normal one day and the next morning she woke me up for work and said the TV was talking to her all night. She also said there was writing on the walls and windows when there wasn't! She was put in a psych ward for 6 days and released. She told me while she was in there that she thought everyone was scheming against her and told me when she talked to me on the phone that she didn't think it was really me. It broke my heart to see someone I love have a break with reality like that. They put her on medicine but she only took it for one month and quit. We broke up a year after she had her break after being together for 8 years.
It makes you realise just how fine the line is between our conscious and subconscious selves is. It’s like dreaming, or having a nightmare, but while being fully awake, but not awake to reality. I realised that while I stayed with my sister at the hospital when she had a psychotic break. I’m a prolific dreamer, and it made me realise how nuts it would be in the world in our dreaming state instead of tucked up in bed asleep.
@@armyvet8279 one of the things I find fascinating is how similar the experience is between those who experience a psychotic break or schizophrenic episode. The talking tv, the writing on walks and windows, the voices suggesting that people are plotting against them, that they are in danger and everyone is the enemy. It’s a strange mental state to be in, but there’s to be some commonality in the symptoms. And yes, it is rough seeing someone you love in that state.
You don’t have to have a history of mental illness to have your first psychotic break. She was right around the age when schizophrenia first presents itself in women. People try to rationalize the state of mind she was in which doesn’t work because she was behaving extremely paranoid and irrational. No one really knows what triggers the onset of schizophrenia. Whether it’s genetics, and emotionally trying time, a traumatic upbringing, brain chemistry.
A trifle confused - Nancy Ng - they went home eight hours after the excursion. But they called the Guatemalan police 'immediately?' Or not until 24 later? So they called them from back in the US?
That stood out to me as shady. If they were not guilty they would have gone to the locals for help, not leave immediately then call the police. Granted, the local police would have held them for questioning, but usually when people are innocent they want to get help right away.
Maybe they jokingly pushed her off the kayak or something and it ended up killing her. Because obviously if she had fallen off herself or she was taken by a croc or something they would immediately get help, and why did they all look shaken up if only one of them witnessed her “going for a swim”
@@koalaplays8855 The details that were highlighted in Christina's story are interesting, and I'm not sure if it's her actual story or this channel's retelling of it. Stuff like, 'She suddenly hopped off her kayak and went to swim', then shortly after 'I warned her it was 1000 feet deep and doing that would be dangerous'. Those are the details that Christina felt apparent to make clear in her story, stuff like knowing the lake is 1000 feet deep where they are, and that she's a good person who would warn someone if it was dangerous. Personally? I think many of the details are correct in her story. They were probably out there alone, the water was probably rough and choppy. I don't think either of these women were very skilled in a kayak, and I'd wager something might have happened where Christina's kayak collided with Nancy's, sending Nancy into the water. I'd wager neither of them had much control, and Christina was unable to save Nancy, probably watching her slip right under the currents as she herself got pushed away. Her story where she goes to track down the boat to bring it back makes zero sense at all. You hand that person a paddle if that's all you have. I don't think it was nefarious, but I do think she was unable to do it for some reason. For the rest? I imagine it has to do a lot with legal issues and being held criminally liable. Christina probably did come back as fast as she could, but lord only knows how long that took. She probably told everyone exactly what happened. And then one of the retreat directors probably made the case that none of them wanted to end up in a Guatemalan prison, ultimately believing he would be on the hook for safety regulations he failed to enforce. I don't suspect any foul play on the part of her death, but I do suspect a bunch of moral cowards who chose what seemed like saving their own ass over giving this young womans family closure. Just my two cents, though.
I live in Connecticut and the disappearance of Sophia is not considered a mystery. They were out doing dumb shit, after getting high, in a boat not meant for this. They drifted off, drowned, and the little boat, more like a dinghy, washed up on LI Spund. His body was recovered; hers was not. There are many things that can become of a dead body in the open seas. I could write you a list, but you can use your imagination. They were just kids, and it’s really, really sad and a tragic loss, but boating drunk is even more dangerous than driving drunk, and EVERY KID in a costal community is made aware of this by the time he/she is in third grade. Plus, it’s kinda common sense. The entire state mourn Sophia and Spence’s loss, but few consider this a mystery. Thanks for covering this sad event.
250k of pure platinum in 1986 would have been about 42lbs. BUT the volume of that material is about the size of two typical water bottles. Accounting for the material being tubing; if the platinum tubes take up about the same space as a 24 pack of water (12x more volume), there’s no way that bag didn’t contain the security guard’s body :( Which I know is the obvious conclusion.
Kayelyn. Paranoid schizophrenia. If you work with people with this condition you can recognise the signs. Barefoot. Talking to self. Hand gestures. And imagining things that are not real
Been to Lake Atitlan in Guatemala. It's so beautiful, but you wouldn't catch me kayaking in the middle of that Lake. Even in a large boat the waters are really choppy.
I've heard of Kayelyn's case before. Even if someone doesn't have a history of mental illness or a prior diagnosis, enough stress and trauma can trigger a psychotic episode. I've had one before, and have even had the auditory hallucination where I thought people were talking in my house when no one else was home. I heard footsteps like someone was walking around upstairs but there was no one. I was more aware of what was happening to me, but it is still a scary thing to experience. Thankfully I did not have any serious visual hallucinations, but they are possible. The human brain can sometimes only handle so much before things go a bit haywire in there, and it happens more often than people realize. When you are in such a state, it is so hard to think logically and you can get very paranoid. The fact that her parents refuse to accept that explanation when there is evidence she was going through something just goes to show how little people understand mental health.
Me too, the stigma is insane. I don’t even have schizophrenia or anything, but when I lived in a very abusive stressful environment I swore I could hear fights and escalations of violence when I’d be alone. I’d go downstairs fearful, to find nobody arguing, sometimes people even laughing (kinda like katelynns first 911 call mistaking the wedding reception for a fight) and I would be described very similarly as her resilient, going through a lot but stable. But appearances are deceiving and even our own minds trick us.
I remember the UM episode about Patricia Meehan, and her family stating she was a very soft-hearted person, and they guessed that on top of all her other psychological issues, the accident and the possibility she hurt another living being sent her into a complete breakdown. Thinking she had hurt someone would explain all her "stay one step ahead of the cops" behavior.
Funny thing is, it doesn't even seem like she was trying to do that. Someone trying to stay "ahead of the cops" doesn't hang out at truck stops and diners along highways. It just sounds like that's the way everything fell. It wasn't anything she was doing- she obviously wasn't avoiding police if she's hitching at places law enforcement is known to be at. She didn't even leave the region. It just happened that the people who saw her didn't realize she was "missing" until after they'd seen or talked to her. Some by weeks.
"One of the most disturbing 911 calls ever made" You sure about that? It's just that poor woman being paranoid and her roommate trying to talk sense into her. I feel for her and her family, but this channel *really* pushes the definition of 'disturbing' sometimes.
kayelyn is so clearly having a mental issue or a drug issue and it angers me that all of the people around her are doing the bare minimum or just brushing this off. if my roommate was swearing up and down that our apartment was broken into when there’s no evidence i would be doing everything in my power to get her help and not just ignore her.
If the person is of legal age, it's impossible to get help for them. Police ask if they will hurt themselves or anyone else, if they say no.. police leave
As someone with a family member with schizophrenia, it sounds like she had sudden onset paranoid schizophrenia. In my experience with said family member they were fine and then boom, they started hearing voices, having hallucinations. Even to the point of saying that someone injected them with something. drugs and stress can make the dormant illness active.
If you mean the "intruder" story, I don't think schizophrenia can reach the level of running into a river in the first episode. They said she had been stressed, but no earlier delusions. Psychotic break, yes.
@@Creatures1504 Her own family even said she was stable and didn't have any mental conditions, so how would you know if her family said so? I mean, people on RU-vid diagnosing somebody they've never met is pretty ignorant.
Even these comments r kinda driving me insane. These people are REAL their families are real and not some tv show for us to theorize and accuse and act like the law 😭 I hate internet detectives sm
Any one else almost feel weird liking these videos⁉️ on one hand you genuinely like the adrenaline from being spooked out and on the other hand you get a eerie feeling about the ppl involved in these videos‼️
what does that even mean??... you either like the video or you dont, you either think the video is good wellmade or its not, what are you talking? You actually thought it means you like what some people do to others in videos, cause thats crazy for real, just pls stop making up weird stuff and be rational. Thats the least logical or valid statement for while.
Katelyn Louder, in my home town she was killed for sure. You cannot drown in the creek she was found in. It is so shallow and never even crazy on stormy days.
It's just sad that neither the roommate nor the police jumped to this conclusion. She should have been brought to a psychiatrist immediately after that call.
Yep it’s kind of a sad story. What people with mental health issues go through. They start hearing voices or start hearing things that are not there seeing things that are not there.
@@annabellelee4535 Doesn’t sound like anyone cooperated. I understand not jumping in the water after her if the other woman did not have a life jacket (if she did, shame on her, she should have tossed it to her if possible). If they didn’t trust the country, they should have found the nearest U.S Consulate or U.S Embassy. No way in hell I would have left one of my friends or coworkers out there without knowing I tried everything in my power within reason.
@@Flatline74 Who do you think told them to leave? That is the first thing any consulate tells you, go home. They told the resort what happened and expected the resort to know where the authorities could be contacted. They told what happened, the American lady contacted the FBI to tell them and get them involved. Stop witch hunting, it's barbaric.
My theory is that Nancy was maybe push by accident and the others saw and Fell in the water and couldn’t get out . Maybe that’s why the others were being weird about the situation idk just my theory .
I agree it's the only real like theory that makes sense, doxxing is wrong and but it's not wrong of the parents being suspicious about everyone involved that day especially Christine, I understand what a lawyer does but the fact that she won't even tell the police or a private person about the event is worrying. Staying silent can either be good for you but bad for others
the second one is really strange and creepy. WHY they act so weird ?? just why was that needed ?? only if they had to cover someone, out of fear or guilty reasons ?? I don't say they did it, but to be so silent, leaving the country all together and not choose to speak for so long is all very, very weird and suspicious.
@@taquitobandito6054they reported it 24 hours after the fact, they were out of the country after 8 hours. They would also be charged with murder (if they had done it) regardless if they went back to their country because the law still applies (especially murder, that’s just global)
So the only people we're believing is the people who owned the business? Kind of funny to me that because you just heard someone say in a RU-vid video that "these 2 people said they looked nervous and left quickly" that you just accept that as fact, without any other verification or anyone else saying "yes, this is what happened". Police didn't verify that. And who has something to lose? A bunch of folks- who don't know each other at all, btw- on a kayak trip in a foreign country or the people who own the business this happened at? And I'm not trying to place blame on the owners either- I'm just encouraging people to ACTUALLY LISTEN to what info was given (which wasn't much) and maybe use a tiny bit of common sense when applying some critical thinking. What makes you think that 10 people who are all unrelated and only met a day or 2 before would suddenly be all "sure, we'll cover up this death you caused. None of us have a conscience and we totally won't get in trouble if we get caught lying for you, person we just met"? As for the one girl not talking to the family- I would do the same and so would most of you, if you weren't so eager to turn everything into a drama series. What is one thing you know about people who have had a loved one die? All are looking for someone to blame. And you should all also know that no matter what you say or how you act, there will be plenty of folks who make decisions about your "guilt" based on absolutely asinine things. You should know because a ton of you are doing exactly that and do it on other cases as well. You just haven't put yourself in that place yet. Or if you have, you automatically believe that everyone will see your words and actions as "the right ones" and just have sympathy for you. Sorry buddy, that's not at all how it goes. You'd be raked across the coals and accused of things you couldn't imagine, all because you couldn't cry at the "right" time or because you say X instead of Y because that's just how you talk.
Kayelyn was definitely experiencing psychosis. people don't realize that you don't necessarily have to have a history of mental illness to experience psychosis. additionally, schizophrenia and other illnesses related to psychosis, hallucinations, and delusions don't often show symptoms until later in life. mine was diagnosed in my early 20s and I had no symptoms in childhood or even as a teenager. so not having a psychiatric history doesn't mean they can't still develop a mental health condition later in life.
Listen. If you watch someone drown, refuse to inform authorities immediately, immediately go back to your home country, and report the person as MISSING (not even having died or in danger) only to way later on say that they drowned without help, then I feel the family has the absolute right to do what it takes to get answers. She made the wrong move at every turn and I personally feel that the names of all the others in that group should be public. While death threats arent ever justified, they need to face some sort of jailtime for either neglecting duty to rescue/save or failure to report an accident.
Nah I disagree, if someone jumps out of a kayak with no life jacket knowing the possible consequences, that's on them. I'm not leaving my kayak to end up in the same scenario as them. Plus once a kayak flips it fills with water and those weren't 2 person kayaks
@@IamUrLeaderthat would make no sense for nancy to do that though? Christina is obviously lying under protection of her lawyers just so they could lay low until the cyber bullying calms down. it was Nancy’s 2nd or 3rd time doing this retreat I believe, and the only reason she didn’t bring the life jacket was probably because she was confident enough from her past experiences that she felt like she didn’t need it. i feel like christina pushed her paddle at her as a joke and the canoe turned over. unaware of the serious depths, she grabs her kayak and pushes it where she fell laughing, until she realizes that she’s not resurfacing. freaking out and crying. she tells the group and they decide to flee since they don’t want to be responsible in foul play. even if it’s accidental. so no, i don’t think nancy purposefully JUMPED in the water. she is aware of the depth and wouldn’t do that.. it was christinas first time so she wouldn’t be aware!
@@two_legit1832 I call it involuntary manslaughter. Not murder. You just proved my point exactly - there are other terms for accidentally causing someone's death.
26:02 According to psychology, for someone to develop a psychotic episode there needs to be 3 criteria present in their psyche. 1. a genetic predisposition toward psychosis or lack of care during their early childhood (0-5y/o) (Melanie Klein, Margaret Mahler) 2. a major traumatic event during their childhood-early puberty 3. a trigger we don't fully know if she had a predisposition, but she had a traumatic event, and she had a trigger for the episode to happen, one can go years, even decades without presenting symptoms, but if you have this criteria you definitely can go into a psychotic episode and develop schizophrenia, she needed help. (source: 6th semester majoring in psychology)
Sometimes people with delusional thought disorders won’t recognize their own face. I wonder if Kayelyn was seeing her reflection in a mirror or reflected off of the windows. That’s why the “intruder” is just standing there but not saying anything because she can only hear her own voice and could also explain the stalkers she was seeing outside of her windows the night before (seeing her own reflection). My four year old once said something like, “will you shut the blinds because of the ghosts outside?” I was so confused and asked if she could see them right then, and she said yes. I looked at the window and noticed our reflections, so I waved at the windows and asked if one of the ghosts was waving at her and she said yes. 🤷♂️
For me, the shocking part of Patricia's story is hearing someone reference Circle, MT. I'm 1 of 5 people who's ever heard of that place, including the folks that live there.
I vaguely remember the first story with Sofia & Spencer, as a CT resident. I gotta say I love these internet theories, they're always so outlandish. I think it's pretty obvious they were partying and decided to go do some risky shit they were unprepared for. We've all been in a similar situation around that age, but most of us learn not to do that eventually rather than die. I guess my biggest offender was freeform rock climbing in places I could easily fall to death. As a complete amateur that has no idea what they're doing.
I did a lot of very stupid things when young and drunk, to be honest, I'm shocked that I'm still alive. One time I climbed up onto my mates roof to try and wake him up, his sister started screaming that they was someone on the roof. His parents started shouting out the window to ask who it was. My drunken response was to ask what date it was, and then apologize that I was Santa and was early for Christmas. If I had slipped and fallen from that height, I'd be dead.
@@Rick_ClelandI can confirm. Because of what you described you were pretty stupid when young, luckily time sort of cures that. I’m sure many of us can relate to that.
The story about Nancy Ng was just weird and sad because Christina literally paddled off to leave Nancy in the deep end in her attempt to get help. Also the group is shady as well, not even batting a eye about Nancy not being with them
She paddled off to immediately go get help but before that she tried to get Nancy her Kayak. Unless you are a trained life guard, it is advised you don't try to jump in and help people. Seems like Christina did the best she could to get her something to grab onto and then go get help.
@@Tampafan33 What does this even mean, bud? Do you have any evidence or reason to doubt her telling of events or do you just spout out conspiracies and fanfic for everything?
I like how chilling scares doesn’t ask for subscribers he just starts the video and when the video ends he doesn’t ask for any. This is why I love this channel
wtf??? Dude describes a literal psychotic break and still calls it a mystery. Her roommate was literally there saying no one broke in. Just because you aren’t formally diagnosed or have a history of mental illness does not preclude you from having it. I’d say a lot of people are not formally diagnosed in the U.S. because mental health is a luxury expense here, sadly. I really, really, REALLY wish people researched more about psychotic breaks and mental illness when it comes to odd behavior. It’s not a mystery or “creepy” at all.
Christina could’ve easily talked to a lawyer first who told her not to say anything outside of giving the police a statement. Not speaking to the family is mad disrespectful, but it could be out of shame and guilt.
It probably isn't shame or guilt or disrespect. It's probably exactly as you said - her lawyer more than likely told her not to give any statements she did not NEED to give. People are acting like it is shady for her to keep quiet but that is what people are typically instructed to do by lawyers in these types of situations.
@@keychain3039 No, not really. What are they guilty of? From Christina's story (that we have no credible reason to doubt), she attempted to help Nancy by bringing her kayak to her, realized she was in more danger and then went to go get further help. They make it back to the states, she gets a lawyer since she is the only and last person to see Nancy alive, works with them to give her official statement to the police. It's probable and likely that her lawyer said to not say anything to anyone else as that is typical in these types of situations. I am failing to see anything that makes anyone look sketchy here.
@@Alex-us2qz There’s like 5 comments I replied to. But also people are making the worst arguments for saying Christina is guilty of something and I just completely disagree.
I will say, about Patricia scheduling a therapist before a potential attempt. Before my first attempt I was at my therapists two days before. There's not really a lot of logic that goes into things like that. You just suddenly can't do it anymore, some people act entirely fine for a week leading up to trying to take their life- others have sudden impulses and just do it on a whim following a bad bout of depression. Her scheduling an appointment honestly makes sense even if she tried to take her life shortly after- sometimes you try hard to maintain normalcy and just realise minutes after that you can't.
If Patricia's family said she didn't have problems with drink or drug and had no problems, why did they stipulate she had to she a therapist before they'd let her move home?
Kaitlyn Louder case: I think the calls are unrelated to her death. I think her dog fell in the river and was being swept away and she ran out of her complex and down the road to try and access her dog, got into the water and drowned further up. The dog returned home and was found wandering around outside her front door. A witness who was interviewed said Kaitlyn was seen running from the river highly distressed and screaming and trying to open her gates to get to the road. Typically what you would expect to see if your dog had slipped on the river embankment and into the moving waters.
Nah, waaayyy too many people are feeling more sorrow for CHRISTINE rather than the actual fucking VICTIM -- that's the truly messed up part. I've never seen a case where the actual victim is just viewed as just "another accidental death" meanwhile the people at the damn scene are given SO MUCH benefit of the doubt, SO MUCH compassion and way too much leniency. Y'all are treating Nancy like somebody lost a damn shoe in a ballpit rather than an ACTUAL HUMAN DEATH and that is so messed up! If y'all are gonna treat Christine and the rest of the group like humans treat Nancy and her family like humans too and not just some people who don't matter in comparison.
Reminds me of the old story of a group of women having a sleep-over (I forgot the name of the case). All white women, except one black woman -- the black woman is the only one that dies and sOmEhOw it's a big fucking mystery and nobody knows who did it or how it happened 🙄 those of use who know, know.
Yeah there's definitely so much victim blaming, even in the damn narration from Chilling Scares he pretty much victim blames and coddles Christine like wtf bro give us an unbiased story at least
@@Camp-Rock-Groupie Chilling Scares literally used the grief and anger from Nancy's family to fuel the attitudes against Nancy too, which is a fucking shitty to do when you're reporting a death, just make people mourning a death look bad. Meanwhile, Christine who's been nothing but sketchy as hell is given so much love.
Christine is also a defense attorney. She is not going to do or say anything to incriminate herself in any way even if it was an accident. I do think she seen what happened so people sympathize with that.
