Recreate Mitch's Buffered Interface: bit.ly/3ieYskP Table of Contents: 00:00 Introduction 00:12 What is an Ampless Rig? 01:26 Holy Trinity of Tone 02:01 Layout 05:34 Power 06:10 Audio 08:01 Pedalboard Demo 21:24 Final Thoughts
An incredible board built for a really cool dude by a really awesome dude. Really enjoyed that episode! When mitch clicked the reverb+delay+chorus and hit that chord I had the same exact reaction as Mason: Mmmm tasty
My ampless board: Boss CS3 - Boss PS5 - Boss DS2 - Joyo AC Tone - EH Small Clone Chorus - Joyo Analog Delay - Joyo Atmosphere Reverb - Xvive DI / Cab Sim into mixer + venue's PA and or mine (Headrush FRFR-108 PA) and or optional amplifier. Planet Waves XLR cables, patch cables and leads. Sennheiser vocal microphone + Shure SM57 instrument microphone. Powered by Voodoo Lab pedal Power 2.
do you think the joyo ampsims need another cabsim in front of it? im considering to buy a joyo british sound, but im wondering if need another cabsim pedal on my rig. Ive seen people talk about how the joyo ampsims have an outdated cabsim in it.
On my latest electric guitar styling post, playing a 1978 Univox Les Paul JR DC/single-P90, I am playing a rather interesting signal chain, which I will call ampless, but not exactly. I have a 1964 Sears Silvertone 1482 in great condition (one cap needed replacement), which is fronted by a Behringer VT999 vintage tube monster (using a 1 amp dedicated power supply and a Genalex Gold 12Ax7), which I chain through a Bugera PS1, routing its line-out into the input-jack of Pod-Go (so that's three 12Ax7's and two 6V6's, along with the tube-tremelo circuit of the Silvertone [ plus tube rectifier on that puppy ] ) fronting a pod-go, where I use the "archetype" amp model on clean-switch and matching cab model), adding a DDR-600 spring reverb, all of which I then route through a Mackie DFX-12 (adding small room reverb and final EQ). In front of all that is my pedalboard (skb-25 velcro!), from G10 to Boss CS-3 and Aphex Aural Xciter / Big Bottom, two (not one, but two) NR pedals along the way, noting that the effects loop of the Pod-Go send/return bringing in my Arion SCH-Z chorus pedal (remember those?). So, it's kind of amp-less, chuckle! Have you heard of anyone using a Sears Silvertone 1482 as a distortion pedal? Chuckle. Oh, I recorded into a Zoom H1N (24/96) - straight to micro-SD card. Which is cool because the Zoom H1N is "signal level activated" to start recording. Not one general purpose computer in use (no DAWs, no nothing). Just pure guitar recorded onto micro-SD card. Of course, the main guitar part took me 5 months of practice to pull it off in one take (that's a ten minute piece). Whew. Chuckle.
I omitted a part of the signal chain -- what I will call the "wet / dry" part of the signal chain. The Bugera PS-1 has a cab-emulated XLR out. Introduce my UB-502 mixer (I have to give a shout out to the UB-502 mixer, which is about half the size of chocolate box). The cab-emulated XLR out represents the "dry" portion, while the "wet" portion is represented by the pod-go, with the Arion Chorus SCH-Z on the effects loop, along with the DDR-600 stereo reverb. I use the UB502 mixer (which has an XLR input for the "dry", along with stereo input coming from the "wet"), and then I route that mix into the Mackie DFX-12 (which then goes to the Zoom H1N line-in to micro-SD card).
I’ve got a Cabzeus stereo...and honestly, I don’t think I’m ever going back. Amps for practice space and recording, Cabzeus for gigging (and also some recording).
This is nice for geetar! Bass players have been doing this for years! I was using a Darkglass b7k with the cab sim but I’ve recently moved to a Cali76/Colourbox v2 combo, no cab sim but I find that it nails that direct to desk sound I really like. If I need an amp sound to sit in the mix, I’ll just use a different pedalboard preamp (Aguilar tone hammer) and a cab sim either in a pedal or DAW.
Doing the same thing for church and I just thought I would put it at the end of the chain before the soundboard but now I’ll put it after my chorus before the reverb
I trying to build an ampless board but ran into trouble. I have the Iridium and placed 2 delays and a reverb after it in the chain just as you suggested. I’m running into a Line 6 Powercab 112 Plus and they recommend using line level for most realistic speaker break up effects. A light shows you when you’ve reached the optimal level but the only way I can get it loud enough using the iridium is to crank the volume all the way, then use the secondary function to boost the level trim all the way, and even boost input gain slightly on the Powercab. I’ve just noticed doing this makes my delays sound distorted, maybe they can get overloaded by too much volume???
I have no problem driving standard JBL or QSC powered monitors for this application with no issues. Why not run the system to FOH and have them send you a line out to a wedge on the floor?
Hi Mason! I have NUX Solid Studio. It is good power amp and cab sim which has no preamp section Can You suggest what simple device it would be added to rich whole tone shaping? Thank you in advance!
Great video thanks. Sorry I’m late to the party so not sure if you’ll be able to respond but I’m having issues running unbalanced TS cables out of the Iridium straight into the back of two JBL 305P speakers - I’m not hearing anything. Folks at Sweetwater said I could run right out of Iridium into the JBLs with TS cables, is that your understanding as well?
Powered monitors should be just fine...the output may need to be increased on your Iridium and on your powered monitor as well. That's how we were doing playback during this video.
You would not be able to run it into a nonpowered speaker cabinet, as it’s a line level signal coming out of the pedalboard. But they do have flat response, full range, powered speakers (similar to a powered PA speaker) which you would be able to run directly into. I go out of mine into a high wattage, clean keyboard amp, which also works pretty well.
Just got a GT-1000 Core to switch to an ampless pedalboard. Or really it kinda blurs the line between ampless pedalboard and modeler+pedals but whatever.
@@Funkfreed should work too. The American Sound is a Tech 21 Blonde Sansamp clone. So it is a preamp with (analog) cabsim. You might get a bit fizzy drive tones out of it, because the cabsim is a bit outdated. Than i would recommend an IR loader or any modern cab sim Pedal at the end of the chain. I like the gfi cabzeus mono for that purpose.
@@aladinhellchicken7994 I still have to use a stereo pedal at the end of my chain. Plugging the joyo directly to my studio monitor only gives me left channel even if I use trs to dual ts splitter.
@@aladinhellchicken7994what if i use a mooer preamp? do u think i can go direct input on a live setting without adding another cabsim pedal infront of it?
I suppose you could look up the cost of each Pedal, the pedalboard and materials and have a good guess. Sweetwater provided all the materials for the build.
Need help….So if I have this similar rig except a Two Notes Cab M+ and a Kingsley Maiden preamp, where would those 2 pedals go? I assume Maiden into Two Notes then into H9 and Collider. Or H9 before he Maiden? I’m super confused 😅
Hey. Satisfied with your m+? Takes od/dist pedals well? Recently got a TC Electronic combo 65 which sounds really good clean, not too bad with ODS, but not ideal either... Wondering if m+ is doing a more realistic job.... ?🤔
Hey there. In the end I got rid of the M+. Chasing the tone become a nightmare and expensive. I went for a the UA Ruby and a couple other of their pedals into a DAW and could not be happier. @@trafalgar622
I'm curious about the interface box. I typically run stereo straight into the front of 2 amps, but sometimes like to run my pedalboard into a single amp with an effects loop. It appears I could build this same interface box and use for that purpose?
Just watched your mono sum video, so probably not ideal to build an interface box to do both a stereo and mono setup (unless I unplug R on the final pedal and run/pan L), thanks for the great videos!
@Andrew Stonerock if it doesn't, then you would benefit from having one. If you use a really long cable going into the unit, typically anything over 10 feet, then put a buffer on input. Same applies to your output, only if it's a TS cable. If you have an XLR out then you are all set.
Hey Mason,is there a way I can boost a line level signal??…..I have an old 1989 Marshall 9005 stereo rack power amp…..it was designed to pair with the matching Marshall preamp,which was -10db to -20db on the output,so the 9005 is expecting a loud signal on its input…….In my application,plugging a pedal,or load box into it,you have to really crank the volume to get the needed volume levels…it’s not putting out its full potential without a hotter signal going into it…….not sure how to do this…
@@VertexEffectsInc kind of…….It’s a wet dry wet system……my line out of a load box feeds a Micropitch,Delay and Reverb pedal,which connects to the A and B inputs of the power amp…..
You'll always want to add another pedal. Everyone will sound like everyone. Tubeless amps have no soul. If you're not in a hit-making band, life is tough.
Try any of UA/FX's amp sim pedals, Woodrow - tweed amps, Dream '65 - Deluxe Reverb, or Ruby- AC-30s. They are amazing (I have a Ruby and love it). Check out Rhett Shull's "The BIGGEST Amp Shootout I've Ever Tried (UA FX Vs. Real Vintage Amps)". I think you'll be a convert.
@@VertexEffectsInc Well, yes and no. Certainly, an AC-30, for instance, sounds like an AC-30 because it IS an AC-30. However, AC-3Os are notorious for overheating during ordinary use because their cabs are not properly vented. Also, they are wickedly loud even at clean settings. They were designed to help touring British bands like the Beales be heard over their screaming fans, accordingly raw volume is their raison d'être. AC-30s have no master volume, just a volume knob. They cannot be used to best advantage in an ordinary club or anywhere else that is not a large theatre, a stadium or outside. Also, they are wickedly heavy at 70 lbs. (5 stone). That's why there are three handles on the top, one centre one as usual, which is largely unusable as the amp can hardly be carried by one ordinary (not bodybuilder) person very far, and a handle at each end for two people to lift and carry it, which is what is usually done. That's not a gigging amp for me. So, if a pedal that weighs1.24 lbs. (like UA/FX "Ruby") can come even somewhat close to the real 70 lb. thing and can be used anywhere at any volume, you're on to something. When that pedal is virtually or actually indistinguishable from the real thing, as well-demonstrated in the Rhett Shull video I sited, it's a no brainer, you're going to use that pedal, mate. I have a 1964 AC-30, non - top boost, copper top, all original including Mullard tubes and blue Bulldog speakers. It's great and it makes a very nice shelf base in my living room along with my Fender '58 Super. They'll last forever that way. :D So, with all respect, amps are not always best unless you need a very nice shelf base. Cheers
I made me an ampless rig using the digitech rp360 with the option to run a dry amp alongside before the modeler (courtesy of my ventura vibe's stereo output). Nothing too fancy by comparison to Mitch's rig, but your vids really helped me think it through. It sounds great and it solved my gigging needs nicely!
Personelly I only use two pedals for my ampless rig, might add more later. I use an AMT M2 for Clean/OD with built in cab sim and a Neo Clone for chorus. I’m a minimalist and also don’t have too much money to play with, so this board with an Headrush FRFR-108 for monitoring live is perfect for me. Loud, sweet tones and portable af. Personally I find anything more than 4/5 pedals as messy, too many cables and stuff to carry
Make more videos about using various pedals that are amplifiers pedals. The Doug Aldrich Baroni Lab Miniamp is 120watts and suppose to sound just like a plexi. If they have really good fender tweed, blonde, blackface miniamp pedals like this to put on your pedalboard to go ampless. The problem is finding really good miniamp pedals that sound very close to tube amplifiers that uses JFETS or MOSFETS instead of digital processors. The picking dynamic range very touch sensitive is what to focus on.
I use a cheap board rig of guitar - boss sustain/comp - boss pitch shifter - joyo AC tone amp sim - joyo analog delay - joyo atmospheres reverb - looper/tuner - Xvive DI/Cab sim into my mixing board and or optional Orange amp & cab. Powered by a rechargeable power supply. Everything is mostly self powered and can mostly fit into my backpack.
Mason, I use a HX Stomp for all my amps sims and effects but I use a Gunshot for overdrive. The Gunshot is before the HX Stomp in the signal chain and it sounds good to my ears but is there a better option i.e. running the Gunshot into the loop of the HX Stomp?
It depends what effects you were using the HX for, if it’s all time best stuff then there’s no problem putting the overdrive in front of it, if you’re using some effects that would be before the overdrive versus after the overdrives in the effects loop might make more sense.
My ampless rig is based on the JDX Direct Drive. Guitar > pedals > JDX > interface. The JDX is not expensive, simple to operate & sounds great. I have no reason to upgrade. My eyes roll to the back of my head with every strum ha 😵
Hi Mason , I’ve got some pretty expensive pedals as most do , always concerned of wrecking the backing when it’s taken off , how is the Vertex Adhesive ?
The Power Grip is designed to be as gentle of an adhesive as possible. I've yet to pull paint off a pedal that's reasonably well powder coated. Some of the more DIY pedal makers do their own painting which isn't on par to pro powder places and don't always have as clean of enclosure which can lead to bubbles or bad adhesion of the paint. Even masking tape could remove that paint. To the degree that the pedal is somewhat well painted, our Power Grip will be great and comes off easy, no residue to speak of.
The output impedance of a lot of these amp simulators are so low that it could drive 100 feet of cable without much issue, you could also use a DI at the end.
really great job. loved the arrangements...I wonder by adding a switcher would be great to save some presets..anyway really a cool one..can you make a mini metal pedal board plz?
Thanks for watching! If you watch the video on Sweetwater with me and Mitch we talk about switchers and why we didn't use one. Mini Metal board...perhaps :)
@@VertexEffectsInc i would love to see a mini "metal music" pedal board too. I have taken many tips from watching your videos and they have helped me heaps in knowing to make it happen so many thanks and appreciation for that. For example i use my fractal units alot, but i love to also use "stand alone" stomp boxes like my favest one in all my board setups, a hughes and kettner TUBEFACTOR or TUBEMAN preamp, along with some other little goodies.! I would love to see one for the Hard Rock/Metal/Thrash and all stuff in between. Can you pass us onto any links you may have done i/we may have missed. Sorry for long spiel...awesome tips and turorials for us all to use...you guys rock..💖👌👍🤘🤘🤘🤘
Maybe a curve ball on the ampless rig: acoustic. I'm going to do a couple pieces on acoustic. I have a Fender La Brea from the mid-1980's and it has a 9-volt on-board pickup system. I'm thinking of running the line to the pod-go and dial that up, but then mic the guitar (I have a sure-sm58) and run the mic-xlr as the "dry" path. Hmmm.
Great vid guys! Both of you are very smart with the technical aspects of engineering this board and keep the pedal vibe vs say a Fractal. I have not tried this yet and either have my pedals and amps or my Fractal AX FX II for silent playing and recording. Love Strymon pedals and have that chorus which is great, haven’t tried it in stereo yet. Also love the Archer.
Bit off topic but since building an interface/buffer was mentioned I notice Mason uses the same solder station I have - a Weller which is invaluable to me. I've done PCB work on older DSL's which can be tricky, but pedal stuff is even smaller. I finally tackled an intermittent power problem on a Nobels ODR-1 today and resoldered the bottom input and power jack connections which fortunately seems to have fixed it. But things are so small that it's almost imperative to have an adjustable heat range and a small, skinny tip. Weller type stations are more expensive than a garden variety iron or gun, but IMO those can really do damage to small PCB boards and components.
In the "Which Power Supply is Right for You?" video you picked the Cioks as your absolute favorite power supply, but here you're saying that Strymon is "the best of the best" - how come you changed your mind? Did you learn something new about either of those brands that made you re-evaluate your choice?
I suggested several high quality options, and said I personally like the Cioks, but also said other were wonderful. Honestly any I recommend in that video will do the trick, I didn't land on an "all or nothing" recommendation on Cioks. Strymon is also great, some Truetone, even some of the new Voodoo Lab Pedal Power 3+ is great. Those could have all worked here bu this is what Mitch had and it's in the same category of quality as Cioks.
It's kinda like $400 sunglasses; if you own them you swear they are worth it (especially if other people see you in them). If you are cheap like me, a $25 pair accomplishes the same thing. It's just up to what you like.
Amp simulation is one thing but having the ability to use IRs or upload custom IRs is really what makes the difference when playing ampless. Not every multi effects unit has IR capabilities and instead just uses cabinet sims which aren’t even close.
Same here. I use the XLR outs to my mixing board: L/R stereo feed. If I follow your recommendation of putting the reverb after the Simplifier, I need a reverb w/XLR output. Or use a reverb plugin in the DAW. Anyone else out there doing this?
Mason, I still have not found a clip of that music that is playing in the back ground at the beginning of this video. Cool guitar music , What is that ? where can i get it ? Thanks, Dave (Vertex Boost owner . tow new ones and one older model ). I love my Vertex Boost pedals !
Thank you so very much for this episode!! The only set up issues would be if you want to 1. run the Iridium last to use as the output buffer and 2. If using the Iridium's headphone out, any effect placed post Iridium will not be heard through the headphone out for quiet play situations.
You can actually have 128 favorites with the Iridium if you are willing to use MIDI, something like a Morningstar MC6 (or in my case I use the presets on my HX Effects to each save their own Iridium favorite). I'm not directly familiar with the Multiswitch but I do know Iridium itself supports 128 different favorites. If you only want a couple physical button options to grab easily the Multiswitch is probably worth checking out.
AMT make some of the best "Amp in a Box" pedals....especially the V-1 and F-1 that is for Vox and Fender sounding pedals. They have a built in speaker emulator, Bass, Treble, Effects loop and multiple outputs....Its a no brainer. !
@Vertex Effects Mason, I’m surprised a midi/loop switcher wasn’t used, cost? need? Preference on his part? As usual, 👍 Keoki. PS love the “audition feature” I’ll have to check out that interface link you provided. Would there be any difference between amp-less and amped design on that circuit, my elderly brain is reaching for this one…
He didn't need one...he has a few basic tones for clean and dirty so there aren't very many switch changes needed. This was a deliberate choice. Mitch had an ES-8 rig for some time and found it overkill for his needs. The ampless rig vs. normal rig would only be different in that the time-based effects like Delay and Reverb would go in the effects loop versus after the Iridium.
Talk about timing. I'm literally. adding an Iridium to my board to be able to run ampless when needed. I've owned an Iridium for about a year and a half and it's been great for getting stellar guitar tones while teaching lessons on Zoom. Been doing more and more pickup gigs and having something more portable than amps and cabs is gonna be nice. The thought of rewiring my board is giving me hives, though. I built a junction box from your schematics so I can go from wet effects being in a loop or straight into the front. If I wanted to use my Iridium off the board and still have wet affects AFTER the Iridium, could I run my guitar into the guitar in, the out into the Iridium in, the Iridium into the effects in and then the effects out to a DI box? Does that make sense?
Very informative, and surprisingly rare to find info. Hobbyists like me not doing any gigs are looking more and more for this kind of stuff. I went a step (or two) beyond and built a « multilayer » board connected to 2 patchbays and a multichannel interface. Endless fun…
I'm having trouble setting up iridium. Is it necessary to select the line input in the setting to turn the drive volume because it is inputting in stereo? Also, I think there were -20, 0 and +3 in the master volume, but what did you choose?
Nice board! It's always inspiring to see designs from other players. I almost take the opposite approach and try to have more space in-between pedals which means less pedals more space. Very cool board and design. Great video.
I get why you want to run the Iridium before reverb and delay . To get results like you would in an fx loop but how does that effect impulse response? It seems like it would be equivalent to putting reverb and delay on a cab mic.
I’m not very familiar with pedals like the Iridium so I apologize if this is a basic question. If I built a board like this, could I go directly into a cabinet as opposed to direct?
Hi Mason, great video as always! What changes if any need to be made in order for the buffer to have the option of going into the mixer or into 2 amps? Thanks in advance!
If that last pedal is buffered and around 100 ohms output impedance you could probably just go interchangeably between amps and the mixer. If you have a higher output impedance pedals as the last pedals before the amp you could add stereo output buffers and it won't hurt anything in either application.
Your comment about trs for stereo in newer pedals solved a problem I had-won’t explain it and I don’t know how I overlooked it but thanks for the solution.
hello everyone! i was wondering if anyone can help me with my rig, im considering buying a joyo british sound, but im wondering if need another cabsim pedal on my rig. Ive seen people talk about how the joyo ampsims have an outdated cabsim in it. Or another alternative, should i just buy a mooer preamp 002, which already have a proper cabsim in it? *(currently building my first pedalboard and on a strict budget)*
Hello, I was wondering if you have any recommendations for setting up an ampless pedalboard when using a modeler with stereo outputs (I'm using an ACS1) together with a reverb pedal without mono output. Ideally I want to use the dual amp function of the ACS1 with reverb on both sides but I'm not sure how to do that if the reverb pedal is connected after the modeler. Should I just connect the reverb pedal before the modeler in the signal line?
You could also make it wet/dry and run the reverb/delay whatever full wet in one side and dryer guitar on other! Don't know the ACS1 well but iridium you can set it to duel mono which is perfect for doing this. Need to go full wet though and hope don't have any phasing issues at all!
Great video as always! How do we go about doing a Wet Dry setup with Strymon Iridium? Planning to have Round (Fender) as the Wet amp and Punch (Marshall) as the Dry amp. Do I need 2 Iridiums in order to have separate amp models for Wet and for Dry?
The best way to do it would actually be to run the iridium with all the dry effects into the mixing board, and then have an auxiliary send to collect the wet effects.
@@VertexEffectsIncNever used a mixer before, will it help with setting up two different Wet and Dry amp models working together at the same time? Which mixer would you recommend to go with the Iridium?
Can I get your advice and how to order these : big sky, timeline, möbius, Loomer, tuner, boutique fuzz Russian muff clone. Thanks also what should I add having not taken the step into running midi (yet)
@@VertexEffectsInc got it. I guess I need a buffer maybe. Looking at the Strymon power supply now too. Probably just need to get on a plane and come your way 😂
Hi Mason....Thanks so much for the videos! They have been most helpful in breaking old habits and learning new things! If I may ask a few questions: 1) I noticed Mitch wasnt running any sort of compressor on his board. Would one be best placed after the buffer but somewhere before his overdrives. Was this personal preference? I know in your other video you set a compressor there in between those pedal types. 2) If you ran chorus reverb delay AFTER your Iridium would you be best served sticking a buffer at the end of that chain but before the board? How would you manage the stereo signal at that point. 3) If you chose to run a chorus after the Iridium, would you just run TS cables til the end and then into 2 channels into the board via DI? Thanks again
1) compressors are fine post buffer normally. Buffer should come as close to the guitar as possible pending any impedance sensitive pedals like fuzzes. 2) You could put buffers at the end of the stereo chain (one for the left output and one for the right output), but some of those pedals have low output impedance already and are stereo, if the pedal is around 100-200 ohms output impedance you should be fine at driving an unbalanced cable to your DI or whatever you're doing to get the signal to your PA or interface. If the chorus is stereo you can run the stereo out of the Iridium into the chorus and continue the stereo path from there, if the chorus is mono you can run mono out of the Iridium and then start the stereo path after the chorus. 3) I think this was answered in #2.
@@VertexEffectsInc Thank you Sensei! I am learning so much from your videos. I clearly suffered from the Dunning-Krueger effect. Meaning I didnt know what I didnt know. As I move from unconscious incompetence to conscious incompetence, I am realizing how i coukd NEVER get my stuff to sound right. I would just turn up to overcompensate for what I didnt underatand.
