Yea, like I know general public don't know what 200-300hz is. But I do. And guess what, because I work with audio all the time, I'm the guy people ask for speaker and headphone recommendations. So it helps me help those people.
i love that he has high standards for audio, i'm tired of random youtube reviewers saying every audio gadget sounds great but when i buy the thing it has lots of flaws they didn't pick up.
@@WhiteG60 really truly good audio will not come from ear buds for a very long time or some alien invention in tech revolutionizes speaker technology.....theyre just too small and materials and design at those sizes with the tech we have is just not possible for reasonable prices....in the end its still copper wire a diaphragm-esq thingy and a magnet... ill bet if you buy 5 pairs of the new airpods youll hear the difference between them if you sit down and be persnickety on purpose. you bought for the correct reasons....and theyll be correct for a long time
Still kinda disappointing to see the lack of room treatment, though. Bare walls, no bass traps, no diffusion. I suppose it's _kinda_ what you'd expect some foolish end user to do, but a lot of those frequencies are gonna dip simply because they're fighting and canceling out their own reflected waves within the room itself. Expecting a flat response curve is folly. Or foley? *rimshot*
@@pirojfmifhghek566 Those people that have all of the things you mention will never buy speakers from sonos. This is for people who say that the TV speakers are not enough and don't want to spend thousands of dollars in audio equipment and room treatment. You're mixing the wrong people with the wrong devices.. IMO the way they test this does reflect the "normal user" way more than any treated room they could use..
@@GreenCinco12Official I would posit that people don't need to spend thousands or even hundreds of dollars like the low-tier SONOS system here is charging. And for people who are ready to shell out that kind of money, I think it's important to at least cover these issues. There's a price point where end users will get majorly diminishing returns in audio quality when they could easily save a few hundred bucks getting a lower tier model with proper sound treatment. It's a bit of information that would be helpful to teach the audience somewhat regularly. Even demonstrations of "good room" vs "bad room" now and then would make a difference. I mean, if they're trying to do reviews and demos showing frequency response, they're practically at the enthusiast level already. It's worth it to go that extra inch. Basic room treatment can be pretty darn affordable too, as long as a person's not trying to turn their room into some kind of amateur blackbird studio. In fact, I think they should start doing some videos specifically detailing this stuff, because some of the 'sound treatment' products out there are absolute highway robbery while other options are ridiculously affordable and effective. Even thoughtful placement of basic household items can make a big difference for almost zero additional money. And then, of course, there are always the pure DIY solutions, but that's a rabbit hole.
@@pirojfmifhghek566 The issue is that these aren't reviews. They're just product showcases that are meant for the everyday consumer. If you're looking for technical, in-depth reviews, you'll have to wait until LTT LABS is up and running (which is what I assume Dan will be a major part of for the audio side).
Love his humorous sarcasm 😂😂 you hire the best employees Linus (Disclaimer: Let’s keep comments nice please, dont worry already reported the one that said some nasty stuff about linus”)
>is critical of the walled garden ecosystem >Doesn't use an iphone >Seems to know his stuff about audio >Can identify dips with frequencies super easy Please, please, please, give us more Dan. Quickly, my favorite ltt host.
I love Dan. Seems like he's more recent in front of the camera but he's really a great addition to the team. Fits right in and seems so knowledgeable. Keep up the work LMG!
Dan has a specific gift: He can compress his vast technical knowledge into a digestible format. His explanation includes a short technical point, e.g. specific frequencies getting squashed by bass, followed with the practical effect that matters to you. Very impressive. Kudos to the editor(s) as well for capturing this!!
Right now Sonos refurbished has a Beam Gen 1 for $191. It’s a better option than the Ray with HDMI connectivity and better sound. If you’re lucky, the page may also have the Arc and Subwoofer back in stock too.
It's still a Sonos. It's still a locked-down eco system that's - and the end of the day - overpriced for what you get. And don't forget that Sonos could just drop support for older models. It's nothing we haven't heard of before.
I can't get my head around a soundbar for $350 does not have hdmi ARC support. just got my old parents a cheap $129 soundbar that has ARC and starts with the tv and adjusts with the tv remote etc. Seriously wtf
@@VaydaladaVodalada it's a Sonos related video, that doesn't mean we don't get to criticize Sonos and the, frankly, idiots who buy them. Willingly spending MORE money to buy products that are WORSE for both humans and the environment is monumentally stupid.
Dan showed up pretty recently and I love him. He gives off kind of a "older Alex" vibe, the type of guy you can ask about a cnc router, filleting a fish, tiling a bathroom floor or sewing, I got you, no problem.
Huge HUGE appreciation for this very well timed video! I was looking at a Ray as an option for our home, but this makes me much more inclined to go for the Beam. Thank you for excellent and thorough content! 👍
Please, we need more Dan and more audio equipment reviews - I’d love it if LMG started reviewing Audio Interfaces and professional studio monitors (Genelecs, Adam, Yamaha, Focal, Presonus, Tannoy speakers etc.)!
This guy is naturally funny with his matter-of-factness. I watch a lot of speaker reviews but this is hands down the best I've ever seen with a mixture of his dry humor, straight talk and ability to incorporate "subjective science" without losing his audience. Kudos on a great job!
This review or first look pretty much sums up my experience with sonos, especially with the bass and the lack of adjustability. The speakers I have (Play:1 and Symfonisk) dont't have any IO, so WIFI is the only Option. But they frequently stop working completely if you don't update the app and the speaker firmware - even if you just want to play music from your NAS. Which actually is a bit of a a security risk, since it only works with SMB1, which has been deprecated for more than 10 years. Also I now have to use two different apps and for some reason one of the speakers bricked and I can not connect it to my network anymore, or I can connect it to the network, but the app always fails to connect to it. Their support also couldn't help me at all. I am done with them.
I got the Sonos Arc connected to my TV via eARC, I got the app, pushed all the updates, did the Trueplay calibration and I was in love with the sound from the very first second. It has been flawless ever since. It's basically the Apple of sound product, you can't do shit but for regular use cases it just works as easily as humanly possible
Soo…this is disingenuous at best lazy at worst. The the play:1 has ethernet. The play:1 and all Symfonisk speakers are S2 compatible so you don’t have to use both apps. If a firmware update bricks a speaker I’ve never heard a story where Sonos didn’t replace it after a support call. But you have to contact them so they know something went wrong
Regarding the whole calibration using the app thing, you can calibrate the sound to frequency response of the mic on a dozen different iPhone handsets but you can't for the thousands of different Android handsets
I'm not an audiophile but the way Dan presents the information, I have a better apprectiation of what audiophiles listen for. Also I learned stuff which is always good. I would like to watch Dan reviewing a range of mid-price headphones.
There is little point testing low frequency sweeps unless the room is acoustically treated exceptionally well. The dips and spikes in the low end are most likely attributed to room modes rather than the speaker's performance.
What a coincidence, one of my friends on Discord just got a Sonos sound bar. That said, I might have to upgrade the sound bar in the Media Room of my house soon. Not just because of how old it is, but it also lacks Dolby Atmos support.
the video was miss leading, optical doesn't support atmos nor does youtube, so idk what he was thinking. If you want atmos go for the ARC over the beam (gen2), since the arc uses sealed speakers and the beam uses passive radiator speakers. you'll get more crisp sound from the arc whereas the beam you'll get more unnecessary bass. I myself use beam gen1 for my 5.1 setup since i'm not interested in atmos and dislike how long the arc is under my tiny 27" monitor
small Note: Dolby atmos outside of cinemas and very dedicated home-cinemas is basically just an EQ with reverb and so on - just like the atmos on smartphones. It's not a reinvention of sound from every playback device as it oftes is talked about. While it can make music or movies sound a bit better on lower end hardware, you would be better off with some decent hifi bookshelf speakers and a small amplifier that are way less limited in terms of speaker size and thus in their frequency response (not having these heavy dips/ peaks) and in their clarity because they are not being pushed to their limits. @Avenue is also completly right about optical not even being capable of transmitting the dolby atmos standart - at best only up to 5.1 standart surround sound - again the atmos here is only the new mixing of a otherwise normal stereo or potentially 5.1 surround sound
It 'exists' but it's not the same as an actual Dolby Atmos setup. It is 100% not worth hunting down a soundbar that has Atmos support for just that reason
@@puffnpluky76 indeed in a true dolby atmos theatre there is a total of 64 speakers the best we can achieve at home is 7.1.2 to reproduce/mimic that sound
I have a denon DHT S316 and im really happy with it, it was 200 euro's (discounted to 130 because it was a showroom model). I wonder how it stacks up against this one as it comes with a sub and the price seems way more reasonable for a "entry level" model. $350 seems really steep for one center channel.
I already have a few sonos speakers around the place, and for me the Ray made a lot of sense to really upgrade the audio for the bedroom TV, whilst also adding an extra room to the Sonos network. I don't think it would ever make sense to add a couple of rear channels to a ~£300 soundbar.
People stopped hearing it about 15K - 16K Hz because the compressed audio format that most streaming audio and video providers use, drops audio frequencies higher than 16KHz. You can see this visually if you download the file and use the Spectrum Analyzer of most audio-editing apps. The default stereo encoding is also Joint-Stereo which reduces stereo separation. The default for most MP3 encoders has been 128 Kbps Joint-Stereo with 16KHz frequency cut-off. This has carried over as default to AAC encoders too. For true sine-wave audible signal generator, you should either use an 1) Dedicated signal generator with analog amplifier or 2) Audio Editing App like Audacity + High-quality DAC. The range and bias of the signal generator curve is affected by the amplifier circuit too, hence high-quality DAC and amplifiers are required. Kudos on being able to capture the audio from 30Hz though, not many mic setups are capable of doing it well. Individual Mics also have their own bias when capturing audio. Were you using Mics that are typically used for home-theatre calibration? Most of these have a near flat frequency response.
This is a new level of in-depth, yet short-ish review. I absolutely love it and it makes me super excited about lab content, expecting that to match or exceed what we just saw. Also, Dan just hit that sweet spot of high competence high sarcasm! Feels LTT, great video! Side note: This does not mix well with SC content. I thought SC explicitly makes "unboxing, not review". Is there a lab channel coming for this kind of in depth high technical content? I suspect it could become overwhelming for many consumer-background watchers. Very happy and excited for what you are doing rn thanks guys!
gotta buy a AV receiver also which will run you up to 1k-2k and the wires you'll get tired of that look and going to spend money to hide that as well so I wouldn't go for a budget setup in any case scenario.
Bit of constructive criticism, I’m not sure if you tested the width of the sound spread beyond what was shown in the video, but lower frequencies below about 250hz tend to almost be omnidirectional due to their long wavelengths. It would be interesting to see how the speaker performs further off axis at higher frequencies where the drivers are expected to begin beaming and the directionality changes.
Dan = The man...I really hope to see him reviewing other products in his realistic persona. Keep it up...maybe Samsung frame with one connect audio integration next?
for 300 bucks, get yourself a used receiver/switcher/home theatre hifi box and its speakers from the 00s and slam a bluetooth receiver and a chromecast/roku into the back. fantastic way to get good sound on a budget. sometimes people are just tossing the whole set on the curb and you can get last decade's top end stuff for free
I hope the LABS audio projects doesn't do copywrite song replacers. I mean yeah everything will sound different to each individual viewer's set up but it's nice to hear the same stuff as your favorite LTT personalities. I know its hardly feasible but I already typed it out so now whoever wasted their time reading this will
I’m an audio engineer who regularly mixes music for bands and artists and have previously mixed in Dolby atmos for a few small films and projects Honestly, bought a cheap $160 Samsung soundbar with wireless sub and I’ve been nothing but impressed It’s not flat by any means but there’s full bass and clear miss and highs and it has a surprisingly wide throw… I recently added two satellites and in small to medium rooms can hardly tell a difference in directionality from your average 5 channel surround The only step higher for me from that is a full 7.2 or 9.2 system that’s properly tuned and time aligned which is easily over $2000 of speakers, amps, and signal processing So for $160ish can’t complain at all about my soundbar
Around 2:03, from the way he reads it it sounds like "class-D amp" is something nonsensical that Sonos marketing made up. That's not the case. It is the code letter for a particular type of amplification circuit.
Can you comment on how much of the dips are because of room modes vs issues with the speaker itself.. not defending Sonos, was just curious.. it would be nice if you had a second device for comparison..
i wish these so called cheap soundbars and setups in general would be compared to good old logitech z906 sets. everytime i search for a budget setup to replace that, i come up empty handed. i bought the z906s for 250 euro years back.
Dan should do a "shopping list" of speakers one should get at different price points (entry, mid, high end etc) and for different uses (movies, music, games etc)
I used to have a ~$50 soundbar for my PC, just enough to get by as I mainly used headphones for anything important But then once I consolidated multiple screens into a 55" LG B9, I shoved the sound bar in storage as the built in speakers are.. actually better? I'm sure a GOOD soundbar would destroy it, but honestly I've been super impressed by the inbuilt ones this comes with
I would love a series about the interview process that LMG has, as you guys always find (recycle..I'm looking at you Riley Murdock) the funniest people.
