Down Bits (Down Cut) And CNC Routers [What You Didn't Know] - Garrett Fromme

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When it comes to CNC router bits, the down bit is the workhorse. However, most do not understand how to best use it. This video explains what a down bit is for CNC routers and how to use them. Knowing this will help you immensely improve your CNC project outcomes. When you are having surface finish problems around letters and such in your pocket tool paths, it is almost always because of the down-cut bit and how it is used and programmed.
The down bit is very different from the up bit because of the forces that is applied by the spiral of the theflutes.
For better CNC router projects where a downcut router bit is used, you will have a completely new understanding of downbits.
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29 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 690

@PeteHowlett 3 года назад

I make two pocket passes. One rough cuts stepped down and undersize. Finish pass is full depth of cut rater - perfect sides and bottom.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Peter. You figured out the exact right way to do it!

@jasonthevideogameguy3363 Год назад

Thank you for this! I've been racking my brain trying to figure out what causes these lines and how to fix them.

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Jason, no problem brother. I'm happy to help!

@AlanAJRoberts 2 года назад

Excellent explanation

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Alan, glad to help!

@COLJimC 2 года назад

Thanks, the tiny final pass will help me greatly! I've spent hours cleaning the bottom of pocket areas to meet my standards.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Jim, that is great to hear my friend. Makes your life a whole lot easier doesn't it?

@1powelrainbow2 Год назад

I'm new to CNC (haven't bought mine just yet) and just discovered your videos and I'm so happy I did! Even though I have done some reading into it, so many of your videos have given me so much more. Subscribed!

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

1powelrainbow, welcome to the wonderful world of CNC. Happy to have you here.

@dougptankerengr759 3 года назад

great explanation

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Thanks Doug

@craigcameron7376 14 дней назад

Another great video Garrett😊

@IDCWoodcraft 13 дней назад

craigcameron7376, Thanks so much! I'm glad you enjoyed it!

@thehamlinwoodshop 2 года назад

Convinced me to start using the finish pass option. Thank you!

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hey Hamlin. It'll save you a but load of time

@Litriem 3 года назад

Great training Garrett. I saw this stair stepping but didn’t know what caused it so thank you.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Matt. You are welcome. It's one of those things that eludes us until we really look at the mechanics behind it.

@paulbramhall9157 Год назад

Again thank you Sir

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Paul, no problem brother! Glad to help

@randito70030 3 года назад

Great video and explanation. You my friend have helped me get a much better understanding of CNC related stuff. Your enthusiasm shows through in your videos and makes them a pleasure to watch.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Randito. Thank you so much for sharing that. Yes, definitely enthusiastic. Even more important...you have gotten much better at your designing and projects...the ultimate goal.

@patrickkemp8047 3 года назад

Just finished a project and had to do a bunch of sanding. Now I know how to do it right. Sanding takes a lot longer than doing a final pass. Final pass looks better too! Thanks Garrett. BTW... the one on one sessions are extremely helpful!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Thanks Pat. I am so glad the one-on-one's are helping! And it's great to see some projects come to life.

@richardwhitehead829 2 года назад

Hi Garrett, I am a beginner with a CNC router, Shop Sabre 23, and have been watching your videos for the last 6 months and they have been extremely helpful. Keep up the good work.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Thanks Richard! Glad that you like them.

@DavidStokely 11 месяцев назад

Really wonderfully helpful info. Thank you

@IDCWoodcraft 11 месяцев назад

DavidStokely, you are so welcome my friend!

@mickmac7204 2 года назад

As always, great content. Question: around the 5:20 make when you were measuring the depth differences between the Upcut and Downcut bits, what was the depth supposed to be? Thanks.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

MickMack, under ideal conditions with a very rigid machine, the difference in depth is supposed to be 0.00." I was showing you the drastic difference that just a change in an upcut vs downcut endmill can make with everything else being the same.

@robertflindall4692 3 года назад

Excellent, excellent video. I learned a ton with this video - really appreciate the great info. It's still early days for me with my CNC so this is invaluable information!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Robert, you have no idea how valuable it is until you have to sand a project twice as long as it took to make it. But you won't have to experience that now, thank goodness!

@robertflindall4692 3 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Agreed! I'm looking forward to my next project that I can put this into practice.

@clarkriccobuono3903 8 месяцев назад

Thank you

@IDCWoodcraft 8 месяцев назад

Clark, you're so welcome!

@robertstrickland1979 3 года назад

Outstanding video, I was having the exact same occurrence with my cuts and can’t figure it out . This video explains it. One question how would I work this when I use a a V bit

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Robert. V-bits are a little different because of the nature of the toolpath. I'll shoot a video talking about this shortly to answer that for you.

@alterstassfurter5743 2 года назад

thank you for teaching me that important things! What direction are you milling?? forwards or reverse ??Regards from good old germany!

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Alter. Forward and backward are unusual terms in machining. Can you clarify what you mean please?

@alterstassfurter5743 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft its about the direction the mill turns...run in the same direction and in opposite directions

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

@@alterstassfurter5743 The bit always turns clockwise unless you have a special left-handed bit. They do exist by the way. You're thinking of conventional cutting and climb cutting. In the case of that project, it was going both ways.

@alterstassfurter5743 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft LOL its different words for the same run...btw I know how the bit runs,what direction,but I am a metalworker with no skills in woodworking, ATM I am a student for CNC milling (3 and 5 axis) Heidenhain system ,but I am learning from everyone and everytime .

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

@@alterstassfurter5743 ah now I understand

@rwkron8424 3 года назад

Great Video!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi RW!. Thank you

@mikehalverson6775 3 года назад

great job , very helpful

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Thanks Mike!!

@dennisbjerke9602 2 года назад

Can I down the program Carvco maker plus to my PC and program and design projects and install them into my long mill Before my long mill arrives.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Dennis, you sure can! Once your longmill arrives you will be ready to go to start cutting all the projects you designed in Carvco.

@garryporter2591 3 года назад

Thank you so very much for the information and yes The Ah ha moment

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey Garry. You are welcome

@timorum 3 года назад

A lot of what you are talking about will be better or worst depending on the rigidity of the router.....

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey Tim. You are absolutely right. This video had to be done because many people do not have a router that is rigid enough.

@pmsilvei 3 года назад

What about straight cut bit? 😁

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

I stear away from straight cuts for the reason explained in this video so not sure if it will help here or not.

@pmsilvei 3 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft did i miss that part? Where in the video do you talk about it?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

@@pmsilvei sorry...I was thinking of a different video I made that discusses the straight cutter. This is it: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-wdQ-_hllmKY.html

@pmsilvei 3 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Thanks, will see it right now! I like these in depth analysis 😁

@joshuatrigg5551 2 года назад

You mentioned something about rastering it, I've seen that on my program but have no idea what it is. Can you explain for me please?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Joshua. Send me an email. Better to explain it that way. I discuss it in several videos. I think this one talks about it.

@wrapssignsandgraphics2019 2 года назад

I’ve been running a cnc for over 20 years and I am very impressed with your content! Love the downcut information! Just ordered a few new downs! Thanks again

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Wraps Signs and Graphics, awesome thank you! I'm sorry for the delayed response, it's been a busy week working on getting out some new content this week!

@realtyroyalty6153 2 года назад

When doing a V carve, on Vetric I dont see an option for adjusting passes that would you suggest

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Reality. Pass setting adjustments are made when you select the tool. You can also edit the pass settings for an individual toolpath while you are creating it.

@WindRidgeWoodCrafts 3 года назад

Great info, Garrett. I've been doing something similar by using a pair of toolpaths, a roughing pass and a finishing pass, for the paths where this is needed/relevant. The roughing pass will typically stop 0.01 above the final depth. The finishing pass will take care of the final 0.01, as well as have a smaller stepover and a higher feed rate. For instance, the roughing pass might have a 0.1 DOC, a 25% stepover and a feed of 60 IPM. The finishing pass will be 0.01 DOC, 10% stepover and feed rate of 100 IPM. Yes, it takes longer, but still shorter time than cleaning up without the finishing pass.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Excellent. You've got it figured out! It usually takes a painful journey of sanding and realising it is much more worth letting the machine spend extra time at it.

@johanklassen3373 2 года назад

On one of your video you mentioned you were selling Beats

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Beats and apples. lol

@casacustoms 2 года назад

This is great information and really appreciate the time putting this together. But for users that don't have Vcarve, like me and use Easel how does all this come into play? I've been struggling and can't seem to still get it. I am using a Vbit for my finish pass..

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi CAS. I am not an easel user so cannot give you direction. However, you should be able to dictate a finish pass in it.

@lehcim777 Год назад

I did have an Aha! Moment, you described my issue perfectly I even get artifact with an 1/8 bit. Unfortunately my software doesn’t have the second pass option. Thanks for the video.

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Michael, right on brother! Its always great to finally get that "Aha!" moment.

@Grumpyoldtwit 2 года назад

@4:15 That's weird. I had the opposite problem today. I'm making some stacked text signs, pocketting with a 1/4" upcut bit and finishing with a 1/8" downcut. The 1/8" bit seems to cut a tiny bit deeper, leaving ugly marks on the bottom. I'm using a probe plate. I figure I need to adjust my Z zero on the 1/8" bits up by about 0.2mm

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Muz, it may have something to do with machine rigidity my friend!

@resorter66 3 года назад

Question What are your thought on using 2 flute straight plunge router bit. This bit has a cutter all the way across the bottom of it .that his how it is able to plunge in to the wood. So it gives you a flat bottom cut. There is nothing about the bit that is pulling it down or up. Freud - FREUD 04-126 3/8" (Dia.) Double Flute Straight Bit with 1/4" Shank (04-126) Red They com variety of sizes with 1/4" shanks. a very good explanation of how those bit work. Thanks Jeff

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Jeff. The 2 flute up bit can plunge straight in and they work very well. The draw back is the burr left along the upper edge, leaving sanding work. The down bit leaves extremely clean edges along the top . Companies do not discuss this aspect. this simply comes from years of CNc machining experience. Hope this answers your question

@Harmonie-jg5jh Год назад

Hi Garrett - appreciate the great content. You’ve been a big help getting me started with my CNC journey. I was curious if you have revisited this issue now that you have the Phantom? I have a Shop Sabre 23 which is built like a tank and I don’t see the same deflection that you show here . Of course any time you examine a milled pocket you can see visible lines from the step over but for me very minute. Showing the differences from machine to machine based on rigidity and build quality would be good informative content. Thanks for all your help!

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Harmonie1814, I'm glad the videos have been helping brother. The Shopsaber is an awesome machine, definitely built like a tank! You bring up a great suggestion showing the differences from machine to machine. I'll add it to my video to do list brother. I appreciate the insight!

@kevinm3751 3 года назад

Just an FYI, at 7:30 you stated using 1/4 of the bit. Actually that is incorrect, you are using 1/2 of the bit. Mechanical engineering spec on bit & cut specification is based on diameter, not radius. Just thought you might like to know that...;)

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Kevin. Thank you for pointing that out. Yeah, I realized that. As always, I try to keep my videos for those who do not look at the engineering level. Definitely glad you commented about it. Helps so many others understand a little deeper.

@awesomesauce2935 Год назад

*psshhhtt* "This is your captain speaking, I'm going to guide you through the basics of CNC routing. We should have a nice flight and teach you to use your CNC router while enroute to our destination" *psshhtt* Great video, time for a new mic for the narrative bits.

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Awesomesuace, thank you brother! Glad you liked this one.

@johanklassen3373 2 года назад

Good evening I know it’s late but I was watching two of your RU-vid I just bought myself a CNC machine and I’m just starting up I have no beds but I don’t know if I really like the software I have I might change it to what you have

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Jonan. I've tried them all. This is the one I like best for this type of work.

@ApexWoodworks 2 года назад

Garrett, in a perfect world where absolute rigidity is the standard for benchtop CNCs, a bit shouldn't be able to pull itself downward, nor push itself upward. I am therefore wondering if what you're describing is the result of flexing in the CNC components that affect the Z axis movement: the Y-Z gantry, the Y-gantry and the Z-axis frame. My statement is based on my manual routing experience, where I frequently use a variety of router bits, both up and down-cut styles. Thoughts?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

You are correct. Regidity has a lot to do with it. However the other dynamics still come into play. Not as severe when the machine is strong. There are other other factors as well such as tool deflection which has nothing to do with rigidity. It's standard practice in machining to do a finish pass. In reality, many people have machines that aren't as strong as they should be. So this video is relevant to those people.

@BGraves 2 года назад

If you software supports it, Inner corner feed rate reduction will do wonders as well. Use the stubbiest endmill possible. I plow everything away with a 90% step over with a stubby 3/8 or 1/2 with a light chip load to reduce large tearout. All the same concepts apply with metal as well except the metal doesn't rip out chunks from the tool pressure

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Brian, Great info, thanks for sharing brother.

@johanklassen3373 2 года назад

Good morning I’m just curious I have a 60 x 60“ CNC machine and it’s by open built so I was wondering if you could have a look at their software if you would recommend me to go somewhere else or what your thought was?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Johan. I don;t use their software. I've very satisfied with what I have.

@johnjohnston7642 3 года назад

Why make a 15-minute video when you could be done in 5 -7 minutes. I spend more time fast-forward than watching, good information just long-winded .

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi John. Good question. People , for the most part, are appreciating in depth discussions. If I glaze over stuff, I'm like most yuotube channels out there.

@jimscott64 2 года назад

Thanks Garret, another good one!! I have noticed what you are showing and never knew there was a fix for that. I also have a question for you. I fall my own trees and have a friend with a Woodmizer saw mill who mills my logs for me. One of my favorite woods for simple not for show projects is Spruce. We can fall trees up to twenty four inches diameter with a wood cutting permit and in some areas even bigger. What I like most about it is that the bottom sections of the trees are almost knot free. I makes really nice clear lumber. And the best part is that it's free. Don't know if you have ever used it but I can tell you this, it is very, very strigy. In this video where you show the difference between the cuts of the up and down cut bits, you can see the top edge of the board where you used the upcut bit is a little rough. That same test on Spruce would leave one to two inch long fibers through the entire cut. So I have been thinking I could use a downcut end mill and set the toolpath to about 1/16" deep and go around the entire project at that depth, then change the bit to an upcut to accommodate the fact that the cut is going to 1/2 or more deep. That way I would have a clean crisp top cut, with no sanding, and a more even bottom cut. What do you think? Would like to hear your thoughts on this. Thanks again Garrett for all the videos. Jim Scott

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hey Jim, great question! Your thought process is sound and I think this could work really well for you. I haven't done a lot of projects using spruce so I'm not super familiar wit the way it tends to cut. I'd say best method is trial and error on tis one. Worst case is you might need some sanding at the very end! Let me know how this turns out, I'd love to hear!

@kennystamp8457 3 года назад

I’m impressed my ha ha moment is here’s a gentleman I can relate to I’ve been a carpenter 50+, a cnc operator not so long. RU-vid videos are great, but always leave a ton of questions and yet no place to get answers.....so I like the idea of one on one service your offering, how do I get to arrange this...????

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Kenny. I know the feeling of more questions. I wish I could answer them all in one video. You can set up a one on one here: calendly.com/garrettfromme/60-min

@mohammadlateef7543 2 года назад

Hi ser again. Hope you'r fine, first of all nice explaning and good job, one qustion that I have. Can we use an up cutting tool for the last thin pass? Thank you alot

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Mohamad. Yes you can.

@michaelowens3956 3 года назад

if the tool is moving that much your router is garbage. The z axis should not be affected by more than a couple thousandths. Work holding, on the other hand, can be greatly affected by the direction of bit. The up bit will suck the material up off the bed where the down bit is designed to push the material against the bed to accommodate light work holding and vaccuum systems. Your little (wood?) tabs that hold the sample piece are likely flexing. Don't see deflection in our industrial machine.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Michael. Thank you for your thoughts. Yes, rigidity makes all the difference in the world. Please keep in mind, there are thousands of CNC routers out there with this problem...hobby machines. That is the group this channel addresses. Not the industrial machines. Although the machine may be 'garbage', it makes amazing projects for what it is..

@rok1475 3 года назад

A sufficiently rigid and properly trammed machine will not leave any steps. If you get steps in your cuts it is not because you use downcut, upcut or straight cutter but but because there is flex and/or slop in the machine and/or the spindle is not perpendicular to the cutting plane. A light finishing cut is not a fix for a machine that is out of square. Start with checking the alignment of the spindle, learning how much your machine is flexing making cuts with specific depth, feed & speed in a given material. Optimizing the tool path is the very last step to a good finish.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Thanks Ro for your input. I do wish I refered to the other videos I made regarding tramming. I definitely forgot to talk about rigidity. Unfortunately, there are many 'not so rigid' machines on the market (including mine), and yes, this does affect the surface as described. Unfortunately, ya gotta be there. But thank you for sharing your insights as I always welcome corrections and additions to things I miss.

@rufustoad1 3 года назад

Mr G, can you just get 1/4" up endmills? Let me know if you can and I will get some from you.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Todd. I have 1/4" up cuts in stock. you can get them here: bit.ly/3sF2Y00

@ronc1231 Год назад

Another software moment.. additionally, this can be machine enhanced. If you have end play in the router shaft or if your tram system belts or screws, need maintenance; these pressures from the bit would be magnified. On more point. My interest is in making guitar parts and there are videos all over the web advising to never use a downturn. Reasons range from fire hazard to inappropriate for the work. My observation is they might not be using the correct tool path, i.e. spiral ramp, or maybe they like sanding. Thanks, Ron.

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Ron, all good points brother. Glad you liked the video.

@petemercer6377 2 года назад

Question When taking off, let's say .007 of material for final pass. Can you up the inches per minute quit a bit since only taking off a small amount ?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Pete, That's a very advanced question my friend so right on for being ahead of the game. And yes you can! Feeds and speeds is all about getting good chips coming out from your cutter to carry away the heat from the cutting operation. A shallow final pass at a slow speed causes tool rubbing instead of cutting leaving the heat in the tool instead of in the chips. From that you get reduced tool life

@nac4965 2 года назад

funny- I'm new to the cnc desktop world but I've been manual milling with a bridgeport for a decade, and i see the same deviation while milling soft metals with an up-cut end mill- and i just eventually learned it was the material pulling the tool into it- (another reason not to use an adjustable drill chuck on an end mill vs a dedicated collet- as the cutting force seen between the tool and metal will yank the chuck right out of the spindle!) it's far less obvious with metal vs wood especially between using a steel bridgeport milling machine vs a plastic & aluminum cnc desktop, but it does happen.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Just Another Day, those are all great points man! These desktop routers are definitely deflection limited! Just like you said a bridgeport can do things that a cnc router isn't designed to do! Great looking out!

@warreng3142 2 года назад

Hi Garrett, again great explanation of whats going on, but let's say you are using 2 or 3 different tools to do a pocket and letters, I get it with the 6mm for the main clearout, then I normally use a 2mm to finish off around the letters and tight spots, the again finish of with let's say a 60 deg 0..1 tip to give a slight angle on the letters. Do I then have to apply this to all the tools I am using??

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Warren, that is a very advanced question so right on for being ahead of the game. This will take some experimentation in your case. I would not apply this correction to the v bit as these are usually straight flute tools and don't push or pull into the wood. As for the finish tool, you might see irregularities if you use a different stepdown and stepover as a percentage of tool diameter than your roughing bit.

@aldomshy261 2 года назад

Great explanation. I’m completely new to this and about to buy a bit set. Where do I find the link to the set you talked about? I mostly want to make raised letter signs and such to start out. Not much 3D yet…

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Al. You can get the bits here → bit.ly/3ty7gpw You might want to watch this video → ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-C46zguYGM-o.html

@Grumplefut 3 года назад

Very informative, but honestly it's a bit of a chore to hear a thesis in a video, just get to it. Most people click by screenshot/title/searching, you don't need to describe what your going to talk about. I don't mean that in a rude way at all, I'm sure this would come across a lot less bluntly in person

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Jon. thank you for your thoughts and no offense taken. My methods for thunbnails and videos are not for everyone. I always break it down. It's what I do.

@chrismolloy131 3 года назад

Is the bit moving up or down due to machine rigidity and backlash. On a completely rigid machine with virtually no backlash, this should not be an issue?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Chris. Yes, it is a rigidity issue. This is not contained to my machine. Unfortunately there are a lot of home machines with this issue. It comes up in Facebook groups all the time. that's why I addressed this.

@watchingwasaga8770 Год назад

I'm very new at this and just wondering about through cuts. Which of the upcut or downcut is better or doesn't it matter? Are there considerations?

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Watching, if tearout isnt a concern on the surface of your project, upcuts are better because they eject the chips out of your cuts more effectively but in most situations a downcut will work excellent as well.

@kevinmatthews2620 3 года назад

Brillant Garrett so simple yet smart, you helped in my research into buying a cnc machine here in the Uk thanks i have subbed you too :)

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Kevin. Welcome to the community! So, what CNC are you getting?

@rickmath 3 года назад

Great video leaned allot will keep watching your vids. Thanks

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Rick. Welcome to the community! And for you, I will keep making those videos.

@haroldlanfear3618 2 года назад

I enjoyed the video and it had good information. A small negative was that I'd prefer less discussion. Some was repetition and I have to admit, I do have a short attention span. Overall, a good video and great explanation of the issue and how to fix it.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Harold. I do repeat myself. I'll work on it. Thanks for pointing that out, and for the compliment.

@onedozenwhickedwords 3 года назад

Following your channel as Im just looking into buying a cnc router, so bagging as much information as i can 👍 Great channel with good information thanks 👍

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Gaz. Thank you for complimenting. And welcome aboard!

@firefighter3b 3 года назад

Center cutting end mills. 3 flute high helix leaves a great finish, side and bottom, no loading up end mill.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hello firefighter. Thank you for sharing this. I'll give this type of bit a try. Please feel free to share your insights on any of the videos as I do miss things.

@richardmcdonald9410 3 года назад

Great video. After 40 years in machine work this wood stuff is a little different.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Richard. Yes, it definitely is. I had to relearn many things as well.

@johnlewis4256 3 года назад

Newbie here.... I am using free Carbide create. Can this be solved with the free software?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Yes, by setting the pass depth or depth of cut. for the bit you are using. Set the pass depth to .01" shorter than the depth of your design. It will generate a second pass at the finish depth.

@wilburmiller1191 3 года назад

thank you for the great information I ordered your bits and got them going try them in my ar8 axiom machine been playing with cnc for a year learning everyday thanks

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Wilbur. I remember writing your card. Remember to send pictures of your projects!

@bernieplatt8556 3 года назад

WOW! What am I going to do with all my free time now that I'm not sanding the pocket cuts.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Bernnie...You are going to make twice as many projects,!

@levijboyd Год назад

What about the circles the bit leaves? I notice you have them too. How do you eliminate them?

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Levi, you will never be able to achieve a 100% perfect surface finish. You will notice less of this issue with a more rigid machine too. Depending on the end result you will need to come back with sandpaper to get the result you want.

@randyhuffine8430 3 года назад

Very good information. I am going to add this video to my go to tips. Ah Ha, the finished product.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Randy. A finished product with a good finish!

@dalemanley9662 Год назад

Never ran a cnc but do have a mini mill and yes always account for a thin clean up pass to bring it to your dimensions

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Dale, true that brother! Always a good idea to bring it up to the dimensions you are looking for.

@MrStrizver 2 года назад

I was surprised to learn just how "inaccurate" the CnC can be.

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hey Chris. Much of it depends on the rigiduty of the machine. It is not an accuracy thing.

@christianprobst8130 3 года назад

Aha! Very informational. Thanks!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hello Christian. Thank you. hope it solves some issues you might be having.

@bvinduck 3 года назад

Thank you for your info! I greatly appreciate your help!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

You got it brother. More to come...

@gagcmetalworkwoodworkindus5683 3 года назад

Thanks very much for the video..... I learnt a lot.......I have a CNC router bought w years ago that I have never get satisfied with the 3D carving/engraving it only engraves like a distance of 450mm along Y axis,,, strange it starts either down cut or upper cut Chinese call shallower/up moving,,,,, tried with so many times to play around with feed rates/ plunge rates with no success....... For small project like 250mm by 250mm no sign of any problem however as it goes beyond that you start seeing significant changes in Z axis either digging into the material or moving upper........ Here is my WhatsApp for more details like video pictures etc.... I am Tanzanian from East Africa,,, I use Mach3 controller software..... I have bought another machine that uses DSP controller waiting in two weeks to arrive at my shop....... Thanks sorry for my vague English

@gagcmetalworkwoodworkindus5683 3 года назад

Here is my WhatsApp number +255621620910

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi GAG. Sounds like there may be some variation in you Z axis beyond this video.

@iwannaapple7190 2 года назад

You have a lot of videos. I don't know the correct one this comment falls under but I am sure you will get this message and I want to thank you! You should get with longmill programmers for their touch plate!!!!!!!!! I have been using your formula for finding the lower left corner. Works great (which I don't see others on YT doing). It even works when I divide the CUTTING diameter vs shank diameter. However, I just received my touch plate from longmill. I tested it out on a 1/16 bit which the shank diameter is larger then the cutting diameter which makes it irregular. But however you can put your own size in. I used .625 (already put on?? Must be a mistake), .0625 and the actual cutting diameter of .058. None of them got me near where it needed to be like it should have! Not until I typed your formula into the console did it attain a very acceptable position in the lower left corner. To make a long story short - their touch plate is absent of your formula to calculate irregular shapes. They can easily do this if they knew how. I know a lot about programming so I recognize the faultiness. Call them and get this fixed!! If I plug in values it needs to calculate for these values!!!!!! Do you know what I mean?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Iwannaapple, you bring up a great point. Unfortunately I don't have much say in the longmill touchplate. I would recommend reaching out to Longmill directly and telling them about this issue with the touchplate. Thanks for bringing this to my attention though and I definitely understand the frustration brother!

@iwannaapple7190 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft I already did! :)

@khurramejaz2944 3 года назад

Sir want to start cnc with zero experiance. Is it is possible for you to teach me

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hello Khurram. That's exactly what I do. In fact, I do one-on-one to teach people. You can go to my website www.idcwoodcraft.com and schedule personal training! How does that sound?

@dieterjaehn8886 3 года назад

W/o the trick, does the hardness also determine the size of the variation?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Dieter. Good question. Yes, hardness will exagerate the variations.

@larryandrews660 2 года назад

How do you resolve the hi/lo problem when using the "V-Carve / Engraving Toolpath"? The Clearance tool feature doesn't provide the ability to set the number of passes. Do I need to uncheck the "Use Flat Area Clearance Tool"? Do I then set up a separate tool path using the "Pocket Toolpath"? Do I then have to select two vectors to define the pocket?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Oh Larry...so many questions. I don't know what you mean by hi/lo problem When you are using the engraving tool path, you will not be able to set passes. It will be only one pass. Looks like you need a one-on-one

@larryandrews660 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft The hi/lo is the difference in the height of the cut from one pass to another. I solved it by not using the V-Carve / Engraving Toolpath for the clearance passes. I also used a DownCut 1/4" bit. Thank you for replying.

@scottvallie4495 Год назад

Thanks for the link this helped on some of the issues we discussed..

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Scott, glad to hear this one helped you brother!

@denisebrantley3276 2 года назад

Thanks for sharing this tip . It really does give a nice clean finish

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

you're welcome Dennis. You'll be happy you took the extra time on the finish cut for sure.

@daveroman7991 3 года назад

Soit seems that it would make sense to start out with a down cut and then complete with an up cut, right?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Dave. Not really necessary. That would mean a bit change when it is not needed. Down bit does fine on surface finish at second shallow pass.

@SuperBulegila 3 года назад

The Ah ha was when you explained the up and down pressure of the bit.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Isn't it funny. We don't see there are physics until it is explained. Thank you for giving me your ah ha.

@jasonoliver2769 3 года назад

Thank you for this advisory "trick". I think you're right as well. The people who find this out early on will have greater success on their projects, therefore, increasing their excitement and desire to create more. Well done Garrett!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey Jason. Yes, I hope every single CNC'er gets to this video for that very reason. I think this is the most frustrating thing people come across when they start CNC'ing.

@drkline69 2 года назад

Hey Garrett I use Carveco Maker. Do you know how you would configure the last past depth in there?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

David, i'm sorry i cant help you with that my friend. As you know, I am a Vetric guy! Have you tried reaching out to Carveco?

@drkline69 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Hey... no I haven't reached out to them yet. I thought that I would give you a shot first. Your video was very informative and I had actually just run across the scenario right before seeing your video. Good stuff! Thanks.

@Desert_Woodworker 2 года назад

Thumbs up and you are very good... thx

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

jlt85215, thanks brother!

@carlosrestrepo84 3 года назад

Good Stuff! I am a beginner and this turned on the light 💡

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey Carlos. I'm glad. It will make your CNC life much easier, for sure.

@kurtbutcher1061 3 года назад

Does the rigidity of the machine make a difference?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Kurt. Absolutely! However, all bits apply forces no matter how rigid the machine is and this always needs to be taken into account.

@vittoriosilva1454 2 года назад

That's Z axis backlash or Y axis flex ,,, sometimes if the material is flimsy it will lift off the table with an upcut bit , usually when you least expect it ...

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Vittorio, definitely make sure it's secure my friend! And keep on your toes brother!

@vittoriosilva1454 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Just when you thought it was safe to get coffee.....

@JCraftvfx Год назад

When cutting all the way through material, have you ever maybe cut halfway through the material with a down bit and switch the bit out with a up bit to finish cutting all the way through to get clean edges on both sides? Would this work? I know thats what a compression bit does, but if one does not have one on hand, would this idea in theory be a work around?

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

JC, that could definitely work brother!

@JCraftvfx Год назад

@@IDCWoodcraft I tryed it out this afternoon. It's an extra few steps, but the result is worth it. So much cleaner!

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

@@JCraftvfx It sure does make a difference doesn't it

@jer428 Год назад

Great info and very informative, love your videos

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Jer, thank you brother. Glad you liked this one.

@alperozzi1241 2 года назад

Yep up and down bit relationship big ah ha moment

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Al, so glad to help! I love those AH HA moments!

@sarahknight2586 3 года назад

Great job, thanks for sharing!!!

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Sarah, you are welcome :)

@vapoureyes Год назад

You will always get witness marks when machining but if the machine is perfect in alignment it will not be as noticeable but one would have to spend a lot of money to get a machine of this calibre.

@IDCWoodcraft Год назад

Vapoureyes, you are so right on that one. Sandpaper is still our best friend at the end of the day.

@vapoureyes Год назад

@@IDCWoodcraft I am a retired toolmaker here in Ireland and used a large cnc milling machine but have a small 300x 180 to play around with at home , as I never machined wood before your video explained a lot , another thing I learned is that one never knows it all .😁

@maxgarcia9512 2 года назад

Garrett, I've learned that using a downcut EM is great when you have applied Oramask 813. It cuts better than an Upcut EM when you have Oramask 813 on the wood because the upcut tends to want to grab and lift the Oramask 813. So is there another bit to use for what you are trying to do on this video when using the Oramask 813? Like a Tipped Flush Trim Plunge Bit. What would this bit do?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

Hi Max, Great question. I would not use a tipped flush trim plunge bit on a CNC, it is not designed for this. Something close you could try would be a straight flute end mill. This type of bit might shear the Oamask better than an upcut and leave you with a cleaner edge but I could understand the downside of downcut bit on some projects. I have experience the same issues with Oramask and an upcut endmill as well so I can relate!

@maxgarcia9512 2 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Thank you Sir, I did not find a straight flute end mill in the IDC Woodcraft shop. Do you sell one? Also where is the search button and login on your website?

@IDCWoodcraft 2 года назад

@@maxgarcia9512 I apologize. I misread your statement. You want to use a down cutting bit when you're using or a mask

@richardkanten3225 3 года назад

Thank you. Very helpful. Subscribed and liked.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Richard. Thank you for joining me. Another CNc'er joins the fold. What kind of projects do you make?

@richardkanten3225 3 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft Right now beds x 4. CNC is convenient for cutting the under bed rollout drawers. Getting ready to play with vcarve and epoxy.

@ollianddelphine 3 года назад

If your machine z height can be affected by up or down cut bits then surely it is fundamentally not strong enough ?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hi Ollie. You are correct for the most part. However, up/down pressure does come into play no matter how rigid a machine may be. For all intents and purposes, many hobby CNC machine owners suffer from this so they needed a way around it.

@ollianddelphine 3 года назад

@@IDCWoodcraft I suppose you are right for x carves and stuff like that. I like compression bits as it's like best of both.

@johnmarksbury1633 3 года назад

Couldn't you just make two passes?

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey John. Yes, if you make the seconf pass verty shallow

@bigmac1598 3 года назад

Hey Garret. For the downcut bit to pull down or the upcut bit to pull up or down by 0.040" as per your example surely there is either lots of play in the spindle bearings or backlash in the vertical (Z) drive or "give" in the construction of the machine

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

Hey Mac. Yes, it was exagerated due to the machine. It is not super rigid. However I have seen many many posts in CNC facebook groups about this issue so i was prudent to share regardless.

@jzclarke 3 года назад

Came here to say this. I have run a few different CNC machines now and none of them exhibited this problem with pocketing, either with uncut or downshear tooling. There should not be that much slop in the spindle or that much backlash in the z axis. If someone experiences this, my advice would be to have their machine serviced and checked for excessive wear in these areas. Also, in the first comparison shot where the upcut and downcut grooves are side by side, the super ragged top edge and rough sidewalls usually are a sign of a worn out bit. I typically use up cutting bits for that type of signage and get clean top edges unless my tooling is worn.

@IDCWoodcraft 3 года назад

@@jzclarke Thanks for the input hHighlighted. Yes, rigidity is a factor as well as bit condition. However, I see this issue all the time in facebook groups. So there are a lot of fo machines out there with rigidity issues. Gotta come up with a solution for these folks.