You should get yourself on one of these movie review podcasts to discuss this stuff - that community really needs this kind of in-depth analysis of Dune.
Thank you for articulating what I have wanted to put into words since I read Dune (the first three books especially) over three decades ago. You have more than earned my subscription.
This is Kyle btw, Great insight into the movie. I thought this movie was better than the first one. I thoroughly enjoyed it and I went to go see it at the Vista which is the New Beverly’s sister theater. They showed it on 70mm and it was truly amazing! But again, love the analysis bud.
I loved that line between the great mothers at the end because it so true. The story is about characters that make difficult choices and we see the consequences of those choices, no obvious heroes or villains. The only redeeming aspect of Paul’s ascendancy to the throne is that he does terrible things to justify the end goal, to put humanity onto a golden path. Revenge for his house was a selfish reason and he also doesn’t seek power and wealth for the sake of it but to use them as tools for a perceived greater good.
Great review and very timely for our own political scene in the states. I loved your analysis of Paul’s refusal of the messiah mantle. In addition, I thought the scene was a little homage to Monty Pythons “Life of Brian”. There, Brian screams at the crowd (paraphrased): “I am not the messiah! Honestly!” A woman responds: “Only the true messiah denies his divinity!” Thanks for your channel, it has been an amazing degree of insight and information while I slog through my dissertation.
It could be homage, or it could be simply repeating the same idea, as Life of Brian was a comedic critique of religion. While the " only the messiah would say they weren't the messiah" does warrant a facepalm, it's also how some will dig themselves deeper to remain a believer in something rather than question it (not just in religion). It's a human trait and one that takes effort to avoid.
In a similar fashion, it is ironic that the Russian invasion of Ukraine, which was stated as a way to stop NATO expansion (among other things) actually catalyzed NATO to expand.
I agree that everyone's master signifier is power in the traditional sense, yet it is not Paul's. And this is where conflict in the story as well as in fan interpretation comes in. Paul's master signifier is control of time, and he rejects that ultimate power; he rejects following the Golden Path and becoming the worm. Yes, the rejection of rejection of Chani is to reject the Golden Path as she will lead him down that path. The Fremen, the Atreides, control of the known universe is insignificant compared to the control of time; they are next to nothing to Paul. It is much more apparent in the book, and particularly in later books, than in the movie.
Loved this! I really loved all the messiah jokes in the movie, which hides in itself the critisicm to it as well- as you call it, the master. I also liked how the reverand mother is emphasizing that there is no real good vs evil, really showing how the women hood of the bene women shapes religion, survival, conflict, history through their talents. The world presented is manipulated by the bene jeserict but also they are influenced it. Paul doesnt want to become the messiah but at the samw time, his mother spreads the prophecy and his continous winnings only help the myth become larger and larger, as paul understands through this ordeal that he can use it to his advantage. Thus the bene geserict created an ball of snow that falls down a mountain and becomes larger and larger with each step. Cant wait for next film and next video c:
Any thoughts on David Bentley Hart’s rehabilitation of notion of telos, of formal and final causes, and his challenge of voluntarist free will? It (imo) kinda undermines the worst of late modern thought (cf Nick Land).
Nice insight, I’m curious on your perspective specifically related to the book and whether or not Paul is this binary of “good” or “evil”. A big theme of the book series is a cautionary tale on blind faith towards powerful leaders. However specifically related to the movies, there’s been a lot of arguments related to Paul being a bad person, the bad guy, evil or villain. I’m curious if you have any sort of opinion or perspective on whether you think Paul is actually a bad person. Do you have any arguments to argue that it could go either way and isn’t necessarily “evil”? Based solely of the movies?
I picked up on the idea that Paul’s patch is a dreadful negative dark side when listening to the music in the movie especially when he road the worm. With the hopefulness and cheer there was always this undertone of darkness and that with every success is closer to evil coming about in future events. It’s as if the movie was saying “this is bad”
While watching this movie the one word I am left with is "Daring". Dennis Villeneuve is so damn daring. All the problems and reservations with the movie industry goes out the window. It's a punch in the nihilist heart.
As a German who has always been interested in philosophy I really appreciate your analysis and the fact that you actually use the German terms ('Verstand', 'Vernunft') made me subscribe to your channel instantly.
That's a really valuable debrief. Thank you! Will suscribe, I'm interested in understanding more accurately the philosophical backgrounds of artworks like this one
What is Destiny but a self-fulfilling prophecy? Upon what you believe or don't believe but fear greatly; your conscious actions, subconscious non-actions, and society reactions blend together to dance a discord of life's journey. Perhaps we all should learn to use the word "inconsequentially" more purposefully. As in, it is inconsequentially whether my life is fated or without faith. I will still wake up exactly tomorrow, go to work punctually tomorrow, and plan-do-act-check as precisely as per my maximum capability, semper always.
I immediately think of Monty Python’s The Life Of Brian, and I would bet real money that many of the gigglers in your audience did, when Paul says he’s not the Messiah only for that to be taken as evidence for his messianic credentials. I haven’t seen the film yet, but that scene will be doubly loaded for me. Did anyone in that audience say, “He’s not the messiah. He’s a very naughty boy!”?
Great thoughts, I realize that growing up through Hollywood I was conditioned to see my life's destiny as being a hero, therefore I was blinded by the ways I turned out to be the villain. Your thoughts helped crystalize this. Thanks
Thank you! You focus on the two main scenes that struck me, and that I found most interesting (the "humilty" scene and the "uber-leader" scene). Now I understand why 😉 You've got my attention! 😮
“Evil is simply the good which believes itself to be absolutely good!” This phrase reminds me of the game Diablo. The player plays the hero but after winning the game becomes the monster that he just defeated
Thanks for talking on that. I recall Frank Herbert saying something about answering yes it was a Heros journey but one where the reader in taking into it. So I always thought he knew at a shallow level what he was writing but indicated that isn't so simple.
I love this philosophical analysis. Not everyone will think about the movie in this way, but they're missing out on a very rich bit of perspective here.
Would love another video thst tackles ontology in Dune, which I guess takes off more in Messiah. Been trying to pin that side of things down a bit myself.
The second part of Dune adaptation is much more better than the first. All the ingredients blended well, maybe the war ( two wars) that are going right now made Vilnu a much deeper person, maybe the movie had better scenes that were easier to make deeper movie from.. As a person who very much dislikes previous Vilnu movies I really like Dune B. It is cinematically simpler but poetically deeper if that makes any sense ;) Thank you for your videos.
I disagree with you very much. Your view seems very shallow and blind of the philosophy that was OBVIOUSLY there and a huge part of the first movie. The ukraine and israeli war made denis a deeper person? Even though the only difference between Dune 1 and 2 are the faster pacing and more action? What about the religion, politics, betrayal, eugenics and prophecy all in the first movie? Dune 1 was a political intrigue movie with a deep philosophical theme on religion and charismatic leaders. Dune 2 was an action movie with a deep philosophical theme on religion and charismatic leaders. BOTH movies revolve around a deep criticism of society and beliefs.
@@Despotic_Waffle Don't get me wrong.First I did not liked first Dune, I recognize what Vilnu was going for and I have read Dune more than once, so I know what you are trying to say about all the parts. For me the Dune B was better in a sense that the parts was easier for Vilnu to make a movie from. I am not certain if more action equals less deep. For my taste B had more for me than Dune A. While I do not especially like A( few scenes are great and I give V that) B for me better lives on the "videotape" :)
Gosh, Mr Medeiros, I do know you are a true philosopher, and I am really thankful for that. Your brain is the size of Andromeda. Ok, enough boot licking. What I would like you to do is to be more mundane and practical. Hegel and Zizek and all other philosophers you quote, well, it is fine, I guess. It is wonderful you talk about Dune 2 (I haven't watched it yet) as a good thing. It is oh ever so cool. The thing is, not everybody follows your broadcasts, which is a pity, me included. A bit more easier language? Hegel and Zizek are not really that important to us common mortals, are they? They do not, actually, give us factual easily understandable paths to be part of the world in a philosophical and, more importantly, practical way to fight against the problems we face everyday. Zizek's psychology and Freudian analyses are just that, presumptions of what is supposed to be facts, but are just assumptions and not, actually, scientific hard evidence. They are just opinions and wishful thinking. Love you, do not be annoyed by these simple words. Ben, Portugal.
