After reading some of the spicy takes on Stephanie’s writing deficiencies re: jasper’s confederacy backstory, now I really want to comb through the book(s) for textual evidence and write a story. There is a lot of discourse in this comment section about racism, but as someone who has studied and is studying the period (antebellum to reconstruction-era), simply changing Jasper’s allegiance to the union side would not, necessarily, exonerate him from allegations of past racism except in that he would not be on the side specifically fighting to keep black people enslaved, rather the side that fought to keep dominion over a set of states that wanted to leave. Emancipation was not what union soldiers, generals, or even Lincoln went into the war planning: it was a power move halfway through (a very morally good one, I think we all agree). And occasionally, you see records of Union officers acting in blatantly racist ways-take for example Gen. U.S. Grant, who barred Jewish men from enlisting in one state, I think it was Tennessee but I could be wrong, simply based on his own antisemitic opinions (this was before he was the big guy in charge). People have all kinds of reasons to want to enlist during wartime, and while I can’t deny that any way I can spin it Confederate Jasper would be at the very least complicit in the institution of slavery, it’s entirely possible that at the time he would see himself as standing up to a tyrannical government. Does this make confederate jasper less racist or problematic? Not really, given what I know about the situation now. Best case, he was just ignorant/brainwashed. Worst case, he was actively malicious. Either way, it sounds like Steph fucked up by leaving details out that she probably thought were implied. Like a lot of the Cullen backstories, sadly. I think someone in a thread here said that all of the Cullens would, by nature of existing in historical periods, have racist ideologies to unlearn, and Jasper is no exception, he just catches more attention than the others because of his association with the Confederacy. I firmly believe that there are two kinds of civil war buffs: those who stan the confederacy (yikes) and those who used to do so when they were young and naïve and thought the war was really about “states rights” (cringe). I have my reasons for thinking this, my own experiences (I’m the latter case, in case anyone was concerned) but I think what can be so appealing about the confederacy as a historical entity are the stories, not about the horrific institution of slavery, but about “southern gentlemen” “fighting for their homes” and such. Of course, it’s all propaganda to distract from what really matters (the fact that slavery is objectively morally wrong), but propaganda is effective when it has an aesthetic that people vibe with. And ultimately, I can’t blame Stephanie for falling for that aesthetic because I fell for it once, too. This wasn’t as big of a discussion in mainstream politics 2007 (though, what do I know, I’m a zillennial) so I can understand why Stephanie might think the confederacy was some long-dead ideology that she could use to emphasize how old Jasper was without needing to go into his character growth beyond that point or how he had to de-programme himself from that way of thinking to exist in the modern world because of course he did that work, it just isn’t as important as Jacob being weird and possessive and petty... I’m getting off topic. My intention was to unpack a little of why we (I) feel what we feel about one of my pet historical eras and the care with which even 160-year-old conflicts need to be treated because we’re still feeling the impact even today. (Out of curiosity, if any of you book-readers could tell me what rank jasper had, I’d love to know to further contextualize these opinions.)
I FUCKING LOVE YOU! Seriously thank you so much for contextualizing this even more with your historical knowledge, it is much appreciated!I pretty much agree with everything that you said. To add on to it though, I feel like Gone with the Wind is one of the huge pieces of propaganda for like the southern gentlemanly aesthetic. Scarlett O'Hara is a force to be reckoned with and as much as I adore her I can still acknowledge the racism of the rest of the movie. The thing about the south is that both things can be true at the same time. Southerners can be charming and value hospitality but they can also be racist af. Like they are not mutually exclusive. Also Jasper was a major in the Texas calvary I think, i'm not sure about his unit but I know he was a major. Any way I loved every word in this comment if you have any more historical insights please feel free to share!
So alice shipped a stolen car from italy to the states? did she drive on the bottom of the ocean? did she carry the car in a backpack? we stan a logistic queen
But she DID love him ?? There is literally a whole section in the book detailing when she finally comes to terms with her love towards jake, the movies definitely didn’t depict her feelings toward him correctly.
Steph Charles but her feelings towards Jake were more affectionate rather passionate love like she had for Edward. It was clear that she was going to choose Edward over Jacob every time, but he still pushed the idea to them.
But... she actually was in love with Jacob. Bella said it, Edward said, Stephanie Meyers said it. In fact, Meyers was specific enough to say that Bella fell in love with him during the course of New Moon, and that Jacob was right along in saying she was merely refusing to admit it (because she “loves Edward MORE.”)
Riley Lisica yeah he was meant to smile way more but he wanted it to be rlly moody, and they almost fired him bc he refused to listen to them trying to make him smile more or something lol
@@tigistaronica6413 that freaky scrunched up toddler face actually isn’t CGI. That version is an animatronic doll that they tried at first but gave up on because it was too creepy. They nicknamed it Chuckesmee lmao. It was never actually in the final version of the movie.
Charlie trying to have the “talk” with Bella is literally my favorite scene ever especially in the book she was so MORTIFIED and Edward knew what was gonna happen it was pure comedy
For me it's finding out the actors that played Alice and Jasper liked eachother but never told eachother and found out after she was already engaged to another guy. 🥴
The scene of Bella and her dad having "The Talk" was my favourite scene out of all movies. To me, it was like the only time that Bella really showed any character, and it was actually pretty funny to me.
“OMG i love your ring where did you get it?” Edward: “It was my moms in the 1800s” “Vintage, so adorable 😍” Edward: “Thanks!” “That is the ugliest effing ring I’ve ever seen”
i hated it too!!! if you look at the extended version of eclipse they go over the ring and they had two options before that were super pretty. Than stephine drew up that ugly shit and they made it for her.
Yeah a southern country boy with a southern accent born in Houston, Texas becoming a soldier in the union army, that seems historically accurate. Lol, You know you guys can disagree with what the confederate army stood for and still acknowledge it happened and is a part of history, right? Cause honestly to ignore it happened is kind of insensitive, kind along the vein on ignoring the Holocaust because boo Nazis bad..if we don't remember the horrors of history we are doomed to repeat them. Jasper was a confederate soldier, its part of his character development, coming from a dark place, going to an even darker place in Maria's army, and having to find the compassion in himself to break free, with Alice's help of course
@@TheHumorgod Same, idk why people are so pressed. I might not be the right person to judge American history, being Polish myself, but he was literally born into that time. It shaped him, he was manipulated by Maria after his turning, but knew better and changed for the better.
@@alloffor Thanks for saying that. I was just shocked that someone would call Stephenie Meyer racist just for including a confederate soldier in her story...Meyer may be a lot of things but racist I don't think is one of them.
Lovely Cryptid Lovely Cryptid idk if this is supposed to be a joke and if it is, then I'm sorry for not getting it. I don't think that's being racist lol. It just belongs to the story - Cullens don't like the tribe because they're natural enemies, same goes the other way. I suppose Meyer made vampires pale and white because she just imagined them like that when writing the book. I think it really doesn't have anything to do with racism
Considering Jasper describes his early life (both human and after) as hateful, angry, full of death, etc. I got the impression that the fact that he was a Confederate soldier was supposed to emphasize the change from what he was raised with and the new, peaceful life he had gained with Alice and the Cullens.
bro, I showed my friend twilight for the first time and the way she described Jacob was and I quote "A whiny puppy who lost his favorite toy" the toy is a metaphor for Bella.
@@amyturner2034 for real. Especially the pregnant scenes. I always knew she was lesbian in twilight even tho I don't know much about her. I think the pregnancy scenes are traumatizing
I remember being like damn why do y'all wanna crawl on each other bones so badly, I don't see the appeal like just watch a movie or soemthing? geez this ain't normal 😃 it's too much and now I know I'm asexual so hey ho😎🤌🏳️🌈✨
Y'all crying over Jasper being a Confederate while I'm just sitting over here like, "Y'all didn't say a word about Bill from True Blood being a Confederate."
I think the reason everyone loses their shit over jasper being a confederate is because SM didn’t give too much background nor did she give us any character development or more insight into the ‘side’ characters like jasper. Damon from Tvd deserted because he didn’t believe in what they were fighting for plus Damon was the main character of his show, same with Bill though I didn’t watch true blood that often so i don’t really know his story.
Jasper was like 16 when he joined the Confederate Army. I like to believe he was just young and believed the propaganda because he didn't know any better, but that he understood the full impact of the war after the fact.
THIS! I actually like the backstory because it adds human flaw. It like he’s always been a “monster” (for lack of a better term) even before he was turned. I like to believe it’s something that motivates him to be better, knowing that he was on the wrong side of history. That was poorly explained I feel like but ✨redemption arc✨
Jake F it matters because we, as an audience, can NOT dismiss him being in the confederate army as something insignificant/unimportant. it’s important to recognize how wrong it was so that we remember to not dismiss it so easily in future movies/impactful media/entertainment that’s so influential on the youth!! your comment is pretty ignorant lol, it’s like saying ‘why does anyone even care that he was a nazi? stupid 12 year olds just watch the movie’
There's a short on it. with Meyer's blessing and Yulin Kuang's Fabulous cinematography ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-mc6XsWqwHV0.html
sunlight omg wait are you talking about the movies or the books? cause I just finished reading the first twilight book and I want to move onto New Moon soon but Ion wanna cringe with anger if jake is gonna act like a dick😭😭
Carina oh no I’m sorry we’re talking about the books they really do be anger inducing (if you liked the first one tho I think the rest of the series is still worth the read despite Jacob)
sunlight I personally think it was Bella who didn’t give a shit about Jake’s personal decisions. Jacob had a crush on Bella, and she knew this of course and still kept him in an unhappy position. Jacob also knew that Bella didn’t feel the same way, but I felt like Bella should have just left Jacob alone instead of leading him on. In the movie New Moon she literally told Jacob that she didn’t want him to “ stop trying “ ONLY because she wanted to keep him around. Jacob helped by keeping Bella happy which is more than what Edward was doing. Then after she left Jacob to save Edward she’s completely offended because Jacob no longer wanted to talk to her, which is absolutely ridiculous after he spent copious months with her TRYING to make her feel better again after she was deeply depressed. Bella also said in the books plenty of times that she was selfish for keeping Jacob around and putting him in an unhappy position.
THANK YOU i thought the ring was ugly too but everyone was like “waaa its his moms!!!” like,,,,,,,,,, then his dad had bad taste what do you want me to say!!!
the sentiment behind the ring is really sweet but like its so gaudy and huge! Bella could do some real damage if she punched someone with it. Lol maybe that's why he chose it haha
There's a different version of it out there that looks more like the book description. Idk why they thought the book description meant a modern huge statement ring.
I need to say that Bella and her dad having the 'talk' was probably the most accurate depiction of her in the book. The movie script really did Bella wrong and often only showed her only being super moody, stand-offish etc. Whereas the books made her dorkier around the people she was close to which was what she was in that scene, a bit dorky but still has a really good sense of humour. This might be an unpopular opinion, but the book had wittier dialogue and I think that's what they're missing from the movie. It was too tense all the time because they only included the serious or cringy parts but they didn't include the lighthearted interactions.
Alice didn't keep the porsche that she stole. In the book (newmoon) Edward said that he would give alice a yellow porsche as a gift. And in eclipse he told alice to take Bella hostage for a couple of days while he hunted. And he rewarded her the porsche
Also I totally believe that being a general Jasper knew where Alice was so that’s why he stayed standing in the exact spot so if she fell from the tree he could catch her.
So Stephenie's trying to tell me that Carlisle, being a billionaire couldn't have loaned a boy $20 for a space heater?? PS The edits had me SCREAMING!!!
@@lkcullen1918 I did a Twilight marathon over the weekend and went on a huge Twitter rant about how Bella should've gotten a job. The things you know when you're older...
@@dystoniacdiaries The funny part is that, in the books, she *did* have a job (for a little while, at least). She worked at a sporting goods store, which if I recall correctly is where she got the tent they were staying in lol
@@lkcullen1918 yup, she worked there almost all of eclipse and only quit before the fight with victoria I believe. Thats one thing that has always made me angry was how to movies make bella seem less mature and intelligent than she actually is and made her really awkward. She was just quiet and didn't fit in with other teenagers which is why her and Edward got along, because he didn't either.
Dystoniac Diaries she worked at the Newton’s sports store (whatever it was called) throughout New Moon, too. It’s how she paid to fix the motorcycles she took to Jake. Also all the hiking gear were never got to see to find the meadow Edward took her to in the first book/movie. They just cut that out of the movie.. we never saw her hiking with Jake to find the meadow, sadly. Should’ve left that bit in because I had no idea that’s where she saw Laurent until I read the books as an adult.
I mean we just gotta admire jacobs confidence in this, like this girl shows up pays him barely any attention and he’s like ‘yep, she loves me’ Also side note I do believe jacob and edward ✨got it on✨ in the tent that night
Because sexual chemistry is important and does actively factor into how the relationship works? Sex can and does break people up regardless of their marital status. Like some people like sex and other people don't (stan for ace folk and folks who can't becuase of medical reasons), because of a variety of reasons, but not knowing until you sign a legal contract, where there are multiple legal implications, seems backwards. Like for real people, there is money, time and effort put into a wedding, combining assets and divorce proceedings. Hisotrically, marriage is mainly about money, controlling women, and insuring an heir be born, not about love. To each their own and all, but waiting till marriage is an antiquated tradition at this point in time. If you wanna wait for whatever reason (religion, sharing the loss of virginity together, arranged marriage), good on you but know what you may be getting into.
@@kraziiXIII wouldn't you know if you have any interest in having sex or not, though? I knew that I had the desire to before I actually did so wouldn't an ace person be opposite?
@@yippehanako There are a variety of factors that influence sexual and romantic desire. Medications that killed my libido led me to thinking I was grey asexual because I'd been on them for the entirety of puberty and several years down the line. It wasn't until I got off those meds suddenly that I realized I felt sexual attraction. I was 21 by then. Some folks don't even have the words to describe what they feel towards sex until they are much much older and already married. Sex is so often expected in society that you are told things like "you just havent met the one yet" "did you try foreplay" "maybe you have a hormone issue" "maybe your partner is just bad in bed" "wtf is wrong with you". "Maybe you're just a late bloomer" Some folks who are sex replused due to trauma can feel still sexual attraction if they aren't ace. Some ace people have sex because they want closeness to their partners or to have children. Asexuality is a spectrum and not all people who are ace realize it until much later in life. Some people know from an early age. It is harder to determine why you have a lack of sexual desire than it is when you determine you have sexual desire.
I do believe that sexual chemistry can be important but I also believe the gap can be closed by honest communication and a willingness to explore. But to each their own, you make decisions on how your relationship goes and what are your needs. If you can and really want to wait, wait. If you want to have sex before, have it. Edward wants to wait and Bella's ok with that, they at least already have listening part down which is incredibly important. I also really like the subversion that *Edward* is the one that wants to wait and Bella could care less but is still willing to because she loves her vampire boy. I also don't like the clowning on Edward because it shows how people are biased towards dude's being virgins which is antiquated in its own right. I don't think its ok to make fun of somebody's experience or lack of in general. Essay over ':/
