This video wins the prize. What prize? The PRIZE! Not only is it the only "non fire" Ember build guide I've found, it is thematic to the character, it's effective, and it's fun. And that's not all, Bonus Points for explaining the meta magic system which was just above and beyond! Players like me who just started the game and are wondering WTH is this meta magic thing all about, this was perfect! Thanks for making this video, and it most definitely earned a like, sub, and all that jazz!
I would personally suggest getting Selective Metamagic first before you get Persistent or Heightened Metamagic because being able to cast AoE CC spells without worrying about your own party getting caught in them like GB, Web and Grease is amazing, or more exactly I'd go Selective => Persistent => Heightened in that order
@@Menthur Because Selective increases things by one level and makes it so all your CC effects your enemy while not affecting anyone on your side, Persistent adds two levels and makes your enemy save twice and use the worst, Heightened does one thing and one thing only, increase the DC because it treats the spell like it's a higher level, which is nice but Selective and Persistent both do that enough at low levels that you don't really need heightened for that right away, only once you start getting level 5+ spells do you need to stack all three to get them usable for your new higher spell slots
This is the best Ember build I've seen. I tried the Fire/Evocation build but it just felt wrong. This build is much better both thematically and mechanically IMO.
Honestly man, I usually don't write comments, but I have to say that unlike you, most of the youtubers that make "guides" for this game claim to be experts but have actually no idea what they're talking about. Your builds stay lore-friendly in addition to being sound in terms of gameplay. Great job with ember, I haven't thought about going all-in on glitterdust with her but it is a smart idea if you want to complteley forego spell pen and focus elsewhere. In addition, I should mention that this focus on Glitterdust is a hugre relief on your party - it means your entire party can skip on going Dazzling > Shatter Defenses, a 2 perk investment, one of which is completely useless and serves just as a pre-req. For those who do not understand - shatter defenses is a perk that enables your damage dealers to consider shaken opponents flat footed and thus be much more likely to hit them. Since glitterdust blinds opponents and makes them flatfooted as a consequence, there's no need for that - in fact, compared to kingmaker, shaken is much less useful in this game as more enemies are immune to it.
IT'S FUNNY HOW PEOPLE KEEP SAYING EMBER IS A CHILD WHEN SHE IS LITERALLY OVER 112 YRS OLD AND I'M AND SO SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING SHE ISN'T A ROMANCE BECAUSE SHE IS MENTALLY ILL🤣😂 LIKE SERIOUS, IF YOU ACTUALLY PLAYED THE GAME YOU WOULD NOTICE SHE'S THE ONLY SANE ELIGIBLE CHARACTER IN THE (YOU GOT A HALF ELF/HALF DRAGON WITH MOMMY ISSUES,....A ATTRACTIVE FEMALE ELF SERIAL KILLER THAT GETS OFF ON KILLING HER ADMIRERS.....A CANNIBAL HALF SPIDER THING WITH A KILLING BONER, A DEMON WITH AN IDENTITY CRISIS AND LAST AND THE LEAST A SELF ABSORB SPOILED STUCKUP PLAYBOY AND YET EMBER ISN'T A ROMANCE OPTION BECAUSE SHE'S MENTALLY ILL🤣🤣😂😂😂 THAT'S FUNNY
@@Demiurge13 You don't really need one. Take ascendant element, get the pyromania ring from the act2/act3 vendor, there's a relic belt that bolsters fire damage, and then it's just a question of taking abundant spells, spell pen feats, weapon focus ray, etc. There's items that improve attack rolls with ranged touch attacks too, and spell pen items and the like. You'll come across it naturally probably. But you don't really have to build that carefully for it to work. Just lean on scorching ray early and hellfire later.
Another sweet build, love the keeping of the theme...Ember really should be like this in the build. Curious question are you by chance a high school math teacher? Just a feeling.
I love the alchemist choice for the +4 for charisma I didn’t even think of that. I really don’t t use ember cause her CHA is kinda low and her hexes/spells often get resisted. This should fix that problem.
@@bolshyplays1733IT'S FUNNY HOW PEOPLE KEEP SAYING EMBER IS A CHILD WHEN SHE IS LITERALLY OVER 112 YRS OLD AND I'M AND SO SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING SHE ISN'T A ROMANCE BECAUSE SHE IS MENTALLY ILL🤣😂 LIKE SERIOUS, IF YOU ACTUALLY PLAYED THE GAME YOU WOULD NOTICE SHE'S THE ONLY SANE ELIGIBLE CHARACTER IN THE (YOU GOT A HALF ELF/HALF DRAGON WITH MOMMY ISSUES,....A ATTRACTIVE FEMALE ELF SERIAL KILLER THAT GETS OFF ON KILLING HER ADMIRERS.....A CANNIBAL HALF SPIDER THING WITH A KILLING BONER, A DEMON WITH AN IDENTITY CRISIS AND LAST AND THE LEAST A SELF ABSORB SPOILED STUCKUP PLAYBOY AND YET EMBER ISN'T A ROMANCE OPTION BECAUSE SHE'S MENTALLY ILL🤣🤣😂😂😂 THAT'S FUNNY
Another option is to go 1 level of Crossblooded Sorcerer and grab Fey / Serpentine bloodlines for +2 DC on all compulsions and to expand compulsions to effect animals, magical beasts, monstrous humanoids, and vermin (Expand this even further with the Mythic Second Bloodline (Undead) to undead as well). Then do Spell Focus / Greater Spell Focus (Enchantment) and expand that to Conjuration later with the Mythic Expanded Arsenal (Conjuration) feat. This path will supercharge Slumber, and later make Mindfog far more reliable, which will benefit glitterdust and other will based CC as you stated in your video. This benefits also from the Improved Elven Immunities for another +1 DC to enchantment spells.
In my playthrough I did something similar before I can up with this build. I went fey/arcane because I use metamagic so much. Unfortunately slumber does not get any benefit from enchantment focus or the fey dip and if you specialize in enchantment, you have to pick up spell penetration feats.
@@bolshyplays1733 Slumber specifically states it is a compulsion, so if it isn't benefiting from Fey Arcana's +2 DC to compulsion , then that should be listed as a bug. As for Spell Penetration, I pick those up instead of the summoning feats as her focus is mainly for CC and backup healing in my party. Summoning a bunch of monsters and telling them to go forth and murder doesn't seem very Ember to me. ;)
Awesome build, super glad I found this channel as I'm super new to the Pathfinder system. Great explanations and cool build ideas as well. You deserve so much more views! Do you stream anywhere? Would love to show support
In regards to cave fangs, just wanted to add that it is currently broken in an advantageous way in turn based mode. After you set the trap before combat once you get in, it's a free action to use stalactites which you can spam to your hearts content. There's a vid on youtube to show how to pull it off. IDK from personal experience though as I didn't pick up or use cave fangs.
If you add selective and/or persistent first, and then apply heighten last, you can keep the same spell slot level while increasing the DC. For example, a selective glitter dust/web uses a 3rd level slot, but has the DC of a 2nd level spell. You can heighten that so that it now has the DC of a 3rd level spell while still using a 3rd level slot. I generally prioritize taking selective before heighten, if only because selective cc makes early levels far more manageable.
I'm during a lich playthrough and your DK build is lots of fun. Was thinking about doing a Conan the barbarian build next time. Will definitely check your other vids for inspiration.
Cave fangs is a bit broken right now, you can use as many times as you want as it is a free action and if you use at the feet of your enemies it insta-damages them, you can just have infinite damage lol When I use it I limit myself to using it only once per turn like it was a swift action but without actually burning swift action turn
The ui says its using up a free action for me which you can use any number of times. But there is a limit, the timer reduces every time you use it, but with enduring spells it becomes 24 hours and you have A LOT of traps, soooooo yeah effectively infinite damage. Kind of bonkers.
Meanwhile, I made her a charisma-based kineticist and have her do 400 damage crits xD If they die fast - it's also merciful xD Still, this sounds like fun, so thank you =)
Really cool, thanks for sharing. Do you have background with DnD rulesets or did you just play allot of Pathfinder? Your knowledge of mechanics is impressive.
I don't think the fortune hex is really that good. It can only affect a creature once per 24 hours. Protective luck doesnn't have that restriction, ssemingly, so picking it early is justified. But... not taking eveil eye at witch 8 is a massive misplay imo. It's a repeatable, unsavable, SR-ignoring -4 attack rolls, saves or AC that can be extended with cackle to forever. It solves so many problems!
Fortune affects every action same as protective luck as long as you maintain it on a character. I just retested it over several rounds to make sure. The once per 24 hours limit is to reapply it same as protective luck or slumber.
You're probably right. I might switch fortune and evil eye when I actually play her. I was just prioritizing group support over debuffing while theorycrafting
Do take note that those Summon Monster spells take a full round to cast, so you won't using Cackle to extend your hexes that round, unless you quicken them.
I would definitely work in Improved Initiative - it is so good to go first and get those debuffs out. I'd also pick up Favorite Metamagic for at least Selective to complete remove the +1 level penalty - lets you get it on everything for free.
I had the skill point problem as well. You can solve it by exiting out of the level up screen after level one and clicking the level up button on the character portrait.
I think making her into a alchemist doesnt fit her. She is the more persuasive character ever able to make a big evil demon stop being evil, so putting the points in k knowledge world instead of persuasion feels wrong imo.
Fair criticism. I haven't completed her full story arc yet. You do have enough skill points to invest in persuasion as well, my points were kind of glitched so I sped through that part. As far as chirurgeon levels, sometimes I do deviate from the character theme to achieve a mechanical goal. I wanted her brewing potions and I really wanted cognatogen to make her CC more effective, so I went with the alchemist archetype that fit the most. Feel free to drop those levels though.
This looks like a fun build. I've been getting a bit bored with using her as a straight nuker and, as you said, it really doesn't fit her character. Definitely going to give this a try!
in case you didn't know expanded arsenal lets you double stack feats, so if you get school focus enchantment after you get expanded arsenal enchantment it stacks twice letting you get even higher DC's. something to consider if you want to stack enough DC to work super reliably on unfair
Boshy, if you X out of the leveling sequence after the first one and go back in, it'll fix the skill point bug Respec > make choices for one level > close > open leveling interface again and should be fine for the remaining levels
thanks I was wondering how to fix that myself. I was also seeing a bug where I would respec with the mod, level up to max and then when I was done I would be level 1 with only the selections I made on the first level saved.
A Suggestion for the next time, is to show some equip options if its available. But great build, I like my Ember as a fire/enchantment witch, fire because of her story with it. But will try it in my next playtrough. And why did you give her a quarterstaff in your Demo?
*So. I am lvl 15, did everything as you showed and the difficulty of glitterdust spell is 25 meanwhile average enemies "will" is about 25-30 and literally every single one of them can dodge it without even rolling a dice. Mind Fog never gonna lend neither. What difficult you playing at??*
I like this build a lot, given the theme for the character. The one problem I've run into with it, at low level, is you run into a LOT of enemies that either have Will as their highest save (most of the demons and/or casters you run into are of this sort), or are simply immune to mind altering effects (undead). She basically just became a Protective Luck monkey for the first 6 levels or so. And at lvl 7-8 I'm still running into problems with simply not breaking through their saves, or running into walls of immune enemies. From my experience so far, at least in Act 1, Will focused debuffs, just isn't very viable. I've been trying to find some kind of non-lethal trick for her to focus on, that either works off Fort or Reflex, and I am bouncing between Ray of Enfeeblement, and Web. So maybe get those earlier perhaps, instead of Glitterdust ASAP? Then pick up Glitterdust closer to Act 2, when you've got more things to stack onto your Cha. Anyway, love the thought behind the build, and the roleplay aspect for the character.
IT'S FUNNY HOW PEOPLE KEEP SAYING EMBER IS A CHILD WHEN SHE IS LITERALLY OVER 112 YRS OLD AND I'M AND SO SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING SHE ISN'T A ROMANCE BECAUSE SHE IS MENTALLY ILL🤣😂 LIKE SERIOUS, IF YOU ACTUALLY PLAYED THE GAME YOU WOULD NOTICE SHE'S THE ONLY SANE ELIGIBLE CHARACTER IN THE (YOU GOT A HALF ELF/HALF DRAGON WITH MOMMY ISSUES,....A ATTRACTIVE FEMALE ELF SERIAL KILLER THAT GETS OFF ON KILLING HER ADMIRERS.....A CANNIBAL HALF SPIDER THING WITH A KILLING BONER, A DEMON WITH AN IDENTITY CRISIS AND LAST AND THE LEAST A SELF ABSORB SPOILED STUCKUP PLAYBOY AND YET EMBER ISN'T A ROMANCE OPTION BECAUSE SHE'S MENTALLY ILL🤣🤣😂😂😂 THAT'S FUNNY
Actually it isn't, Level 6 is the 2nd Alchemist level. I thought the same thing when I looked at the spreadsheet the first time too, so don't feel bad.
Idk she isn’t the bard type and the fact she spent so long as a demon double agent kinda fits with rouge or ranger. Still there’s an option on the toy box mod that will let you fully respect anyone for your future playthru
Maybe I am missing something, but what is the point of skipping 2 levels of witch (2 caster levels) just to get mutagen for +4 cha which will give you 2 DC ? I mean you would get the 2 DC from your 2 caster levels if you just stayed witch, no?
No you don't get DC from caster level. But after playing this build, I wouldn't delay my spell and hex progression for that +2DC. Probably just go a full 20 in witch or take the alchemist levels last
Hi great video, just don't really get one thing here. Why dip 2 lvl in to alchemy here? Sure I understand that most to get the +4 CHA that is +2 CHA modifier. But I see more drawback then benefits from this, Example: My Ember is lvl10 and currently have CHA 21 and CHA 5 modifier. With alchemist +4 CHA I get 25 and 7 modifier for 20min. With spell focus + greater spell focus + Mythic Spell focus and Heighten Spell to Max lvl4 = DC25 Glitter dust 20min then DC23. If I don't get the 2 levels in alchemist here and take the same feats, I can Heighten Spell to Max lvl5 due to the extra 2 levels in Witch, giving me 1+ to DC = DC24 Glitter dust. And this is not just for 20min but constant. Also I get access to higher level spells in witch class 2 levels earlier and more spells to cast, +1 extra curse, +more spells to cast on highest level. So if I'm not missing something here, I really don't see the benefit with the 2 Alchemist levels. =) I guess it come down to how much you value brew potion, the lvl1 and lvl2 alchemist spells can you easy have on another character or really sheep potion/scroll.
awesome build but a bit micro heavy but think im going to go with this one for my ember. Also can you re-do the dragon knight build you did for kingmaker as a wotr build along with mythic paths.
I agree that this is much more thematic with her character. Have you considered quickly going over good team comps these builds would work well with? I always find I have too much melee or archers and no arcane casters
Im interested in this build, and ill keep it in mind for later but my current playthrough has a melee MC, 2 dogs and Lann as a drovier druid so the heal/protects are nice but id be overcrowded with multiple summoners
Why multiclass her with alch and go through all of the trouble if you can just prebuff her with the eagle's splendor for the same bonus? Or am I missing something?
I have an issue, relating to the ai that governs npc actions on real time with pause, that is when I put cackle on auto cast, Ember uses every other action she has available to try and run into melee and smack enemies.
You probably have her AI turned on and either a melee weapon equipped or no weapon. I think you can fix this by turning her AI off, the little brain icon, or by equipping a ranged weapon
to fix the recpec point issue, respec the character then exit out of the level up menu then go back in and level up as usual. Every time i don't exit the level up menu on respec i get that error
i think Bolshy just likes to wait for others to put up builds, so he can then blow them up with one of his game breakers. Guilty pleasure to watch. But I may follow 90% of your builds. I never do the 2 lvl dips into something for a mere stat buff. You do not seem to cover what you give up with the level dips. Any caster levels etc?
Glitterdust and pit spells ignore SR. Those are the two best spells we have. You could drop a summoning feat and pick up greater/normal spell pen and the mythic feat, but since we will primarily be buffing/hexing and casting glitterdust, I didn't pick it up
I'm thinking if respec-ing her to lvl 1 and taking Protective Luck and Cackle instead of Slumber and Vulnerability Curse would be fair or not to do, since she will get the best 3 curses at lvl 3-5 that way but i feel kinda cheating :c Though could hire merc same way from lvl 1, but still.
Thx god for this... I'm playing suport ember and every ember video is about Damage Ember... I tought i was missing the point about her. My Ember build is pretty similar to yours tho =) but i leaned mine a litle bit more on buffs them debuffs
it seems that potion brewing is restricted to what she knows to cast in the alchemist spellbook which is enlarge/reduce person, cure light wounds and something else like a true strike or whatever you pick. That's really not that useful. The charisma buff from the mutagen is nice though.
She can brew any spell she can cast that she can cast as a buff on someone else, so no false life or shield, but she can brew heroism, death ward and things like that.
You only get to cast one a couple of alchemist spells per day and they last a maximum of 2 minutes. At that point of the game enlarge is one of the best buffs for melee and having more casts per day is helpful
You lose two caster levels but you get to brew potions and +2 DC to all spells. Keeping your spell DCs competitive with rapidly scaling enemy saves is one of the hardest things to do. I consider it a good trade
Our Main spells, glitterdust and pit spells with the earth ring, are not affected by spell resistance. You could fit it in the build by dropping the level 19 feat and persistent and grabbing both spell pen feats + mythic
hey guys, is there any revelation about the nature of ember's pacifist behavior? and who is the mysterious patron of hers? I finished the campaign and these still remain uncovered.
Given that she's not really right in the head, I can easily explain my pyromaniac build for Ember by saying that she's got a bit of a split personality. One side of her is naive and kind, the other side is basically Carrie, but luckily only comes out in combat.
I have a noob question, isnt better to leave them in automatic build? this game is so overwhelming to build all you companions and youself. i mean in my case a casual weekend player i cant really invest time on EVERY character developing. But in any case this kind of videos make me believe that im playing the wrong way!!
Yes absolutely, it is harder to use because it can hit your party though. The blindness spell has it's upsides too though, it targets a fort save if you need to attack fort, and it is permanent unless dispelled.
@@bolshyplays1733 was pretty sure I did, but maybe I messed up, I was confused because the description on selective says something like "you can chose the number of characters equal to your ability score modifier ..." and I didn't see any way to select targets, is the description not correct?
Great stuff! My frustration with Ember has been the difficulty of using hexes effectively while playing real-time instead of turn-based (I prefer real-time). I tried auto-casting Evil Eye, but she autocast it on my own party. :( I appreciate the advice of auto-casting cackle. That's hopeful. Any more advice on using her in real-time?
Get all your metamagic spells and summons out first because they are full round actions. Then make sure she gets a hex and a cackle every round. That's pretty much it. I have it set to pause at the start of every round which helps a lot.
