Ep. 32 Family Friendly: The History of the Minivan 

Somewhere on the net I saw a short video about the first ride of the original Daimler: Mrs. Daimler drove it (not Mr. ) with her kids & stuff to visit granma, so if you apply purpose as classification rule, the first car was a minivan.

@@foreyfriend145 @Forey Friend

@@foreyfriend145 Uhmmmm actually it was Mrs Benz.

HELLO EAR 🦻

Correct. VANity is a terrible thing!

Your absolutely right here even worse if someone buys just a front wheel drive crossover. It's like what's the point? Sure ok, by default the minivan isn't a sports car or anything sexy... but how many SUVs fit that bill let alone look unique? Nearly every SUV just kinda looks the same. At least the minivan market is unique enough that you can easily tell the difference between a Honda and a Chrysler with different ride dynamics to boot. Most SUVs just kinda look and drive the same. I think that will only get worse once everything is electric. They'll all share the same platforms and drivetrains. You watch and some call the minivan boring... lol.

Or is it the other way around? That Minivans want to be crossovers or SUVS first chanche they get?

@@EdsAutoReviews Some automakers keep trying to make their minivans more "Crossover-like" in an attempt to make them appeal to the CUV crowd. I don't think it ever really works though. GM tried it when they stapled a new longer "truck-like" nose onto their Venture and Montana vans and changed the names.

@@EdsAutoReviews Well the 2005 Chevy uplander definitely tries. It's got a long snout, and c pillar but that thing ain't fooling anyone. It's a face lifted Chevy Venture with less amenities. Think of simple things like cup holders in the doors, the Uplander doesn't even have that. Just an optional tray and two in dash cup holders. That's it. Believe it or not. Even the Venture gave you one in each door and if you want to talk about the lack of power the 3500 v6 that unfortunately graced these things runs out of steam almost as fast a Yugo. Rides like one too. Even in it's high end, heated leather seat configuration the thing absolutely rides like a drunken horse. Having that huge snout doesn't help parking any either. GM basically gave it the worst features of a minivan with the worst features of an SUV.. to make matters worse it doesn't add anything to the package. Even the Ford Freestar offered fold down to the floor seats! The Chevy Uplander? Nope. You can't even easily enter the 3rd row without snagging your clothing on some metal seat frame! Some might knock the Mercedes Benz vans for It's flaws, but that thing was designed to be a cargo van, not a passenger van so of course it lacks the features one might expect of one. Again this was a 2005 model, it was almost laughable that GM tried selling this. Clearly they didn't put much effort or time to consider what the market wanted out of a family hauler. The only good point I can say about it is the overhead DVD rail system is fairly nifty if you can get beyond the silly 6 inch screen and cheap plastics. It might have been GM at its worst, but this couldn't even pull off being a cargo van let alone some cushy crossover. It's clear to see why GM doesn't bother making minivans anymore. It's best attempt was as boring as unpainted dry wall and it's worst was an laughable pot belly pig or a dust buster.

My mom has hers and honestly that thing is probably the single most practical car my family has ever owned

I worked at a Dodge dealership in the 1980s, and our Dodge Caravan out sold everything and I still think it is the best vehicle ever made. Chrysler quality was unbeatable

I drive a '95 Chrysler minivan. It can haul longer items than most pickup trucks - which often require the use of a trailer.

If you have a 2003 Toyota Sienna, you’re lucky, it’s a large minivan. Siennas now are huge!

A happy customer!

Thanks!

There are plenty of grey import vans here. I love the look of the Nissan and Toyota's, low, fat & wide with tinted windows, too much chrome and alloy wheels to match...

Interesting! There are a few companies in the U.S. that do minivan conversions for ramps or lifts, but no vans are sold from the factory that way. I think the conversion companies work with the automakers to develop a standard process for the conversions, though.

Also in the Uk we have imported previas etc

@@DrJatzCrackers Nissan nomad?

So much of NZ and Australia's second hand car market are just grey imports from Japan. It's kinda crazy if you stop and think about the ammount of vehicles.

I get that but on the other hand it was exactly this behaviour which nearly resulted in the collapse of Citroën in the form of the SM. Without Peugeot we wouldn’t have Citroën…

"On the next episode of Ed's Auto Reviews... watch me watching paint dry!"

@@EdsAutoReviews like I said, I will gladly watch

K car allowed them to pay them back hella early.

That's true. Lee and Henry Ford II didn't get along well. So Lee got fired in the late 70s and took some of the talent behind the Ford Carrousel concept back to Chrysler. Not only Chrysler paid their debt in advance, they got so much money reserves they were able to purchase AMC, Lamborghini and release new platforms and powertrains after a decade of solely developing K-Car based vehicles. Some people may still think Chrysler Corporation's best era was the 60s to early 70s, but financially speaking the mid 80s to mid 90s were even better. Unfortunately, we all know what happened after that...

Lee had the scope of how important modular design and platform sharing was in a soft market

@@duncandmcgrath6290 To a ridiculous point. Remember the Le Baron charriot ? With "Corynthian" leather ? 🤣

@@luisinhoens90 Not so in the 70's oil crisis. They only had V8 gas guzzlers, dated cars. They then slapped together the ominious Dodge Omni (!) and sold rebadged Diamond Star cute but crappy cars.

@Kirk Wolfe i'm sorry who suggested something like that? Certainly not me. I think perhaps you're projecting. Or perhaps something else

@Kirk Wolfe Go to any SCCA event. You'd be surprised what gets raced.

School buses? Hard walls and floors, no seatbelts or safety devices of any kind.

@@jimjamauto you are quite wrong. School buses have been crash tested all the way back into the 1930s. Despite your uninformed opinion, they are extremely safe. Very hard to find an example of a child being killed while on one

@Kirk Wolfe Chrysler offered a turbo manual trans mini van for a while.

Most car designers and design historians would say that the Scarab was the first Minivan.

I love the Scarab. What a completely awesome and unique design.

My mom uses a late 90's plymouth voyager. It's on its last legs, but considering how she treats it, it's doing well.

@@henryfleischer404 (update) Just after posting the original comment I had an accident with it and had to retire it. 😀 I just replaced it with a 2015 Grand Caravan. All the newer minivans regardless of brand are the same length. About a foot and a half longer than the ol' Voyager. I'd prefer the more compact size.

Trends are cyclic

Doors on one side assume that parking will be along a street so the door is opposite the drivers position.

@@bobroberts2371 which makes perfect sense for a cargo van or large passenger van. But for minivans two sliding doors makes more sense - note that they all have them now.

Always looked leaky and faulty to me, especially the powered ones.

The Prairie not only offered a real third row seat, but also a front 3 seat option, so you could buy an 8 seater Prairie. In fact that was their development principle, being able to sit 8 adults inside. But those models weren't offered in the US or Canada, or many other countries... They only sold in Japan, Australia and other bunch of countries. And to be fair, the third row may be for Japanese adults, but not for taller people overseas. I own an 8 seater Prairie and it's great, I don't get why it couldn't be considered a minivan as well as the Chariot that was a 7 seater... And both Prairie and Chariot released before the Voyager and so...

@@rogersmith7396 I have no experience with the powered sliding doors, but my grandparents' minivan doors never leaked. After all, they don't just slide -- when closing, they push in too, much like a regular swinging door.

Needs a British butler serving tea.

In my country, you will be mocked if you drive those car, you had to have a driver

I remember those 1980s mid-engined Japanese vans...friend of mine in college had the Toyota Van. I also recall the Nissan Van was prone to engine fires and eventually Nissan bought all of them back from customers

And the Plymouth vans and K cars were CHEAP!

@@chrisfreemesser5707 A guy I knew with a Toyota van used to drive it like Dan Gurney at the Indy 500. The bumper only being a foot in front of the driver always worried me.

Knew a guy who bought the Chrysler van with every option. Nothing worked right. Don't know what he did with it.

I was a parts driver for a So. CA Toyota dealership in 89-90, Had this van as one of our delivery vehicles. Fun to drive as I recall, but in the cargo van configuration it had poor visibility to the rear and large blind spots.

Get her a thick seat cushion.

And the horrific gas milage too...

mine wants to downsize and get a BEV so its cheaper and easier to live with

Interesting. I also grew up in a minivan family and have one for my own family. My elderly parents actually perfect the seat height of the minivan but drives a crossover bc my mom prefers smaller vehicles. My dad usually drives my minivan to shuttle my kids even tho his suv is much fancier. He (as do I) love the versatility and functionality of the minivan.

@@Wasabi9111 mom had a chevy 2004~ blazer before this but it was costing to much to fuel/running costs ect and before that was a Oldsmobile hard-top/4-door cuttly but her excuse was is it didn't fit her single party/drunk moms needs but she's more historically a GT car buyer and would likely go back to that or a sports car or mini truck aka something like the ford ranger but all electric as now days she loves gardening something about being therapeutic and or keeping her out of trouble with the law ect

Yep, it looks nice. We never had those in Canada.

Indeed. Always it looks like some kind of land to to rover

yes, The Buick GL8 is a rather fascinating extension of it for example.

Most people.

The right attitude makes any car cool, well almost

POOR Chrysler american quality sell it fast

@@juansanchez-rm6wc I think he'll be fine. He's gotten used to poor quality. I mean, M-B ML...

Thanks! I will touch on this in a future video about the early aerodynamic cars.

@@EdsAutoReviewsgotta love some early aero

Because in general their cars don't last as long as some other brands

The question is are they really innovative these days? Apart from the Chrysler Airflow Concept and the Pacifica and Pacifica PHEV, they're not doing much. The Voyager is a Pacifica with less options at a cheaper price, and the 300 is outsold by the Dodge Charger and Challenger because they decided to drop the SRT8 for the North American market. I really hope they get innovative again so they don't go bankrupt again.

Its what they do. The 50s tailfin cars rusted out in about two years and no one would be caught dead in one after 4 years. Their muscle cars were completely over the top.

@@alphatrion100 So far my Jeep appears to be very good quality. Fingers crossed.

@@rogersmith7396 And you should just enjoy it. But personally i wouldn't keep a fiat/chrysler product for too many miles. I think its common knowledge by now most of their engines dont reach toyota mileages without problems.

The Astro and Safari were Mid Size Vans not mini vans, they were 18% smaller than the full size G Series vans of the time and shared much of their under pinnings with the S10 and S10 Blazer. The big difference with the Astro and Safari besides their size is that at the end of the day, they were designed to be a smaller G Series with creature comforts not found in a van, the Caravan, Lumina MPV, Winstar, Venture/Transport/Montana, and Uplander/Montana SV6 were from day one MPVs, meant to be people haulers with extra cargo space. Basically Astros are at the end of the day still light trucks and based on a commercial vehicle platform, where as the Caravan was a K Car with a Van body

I see lots of Japanese minivans.

My parents were given their cousin’s Aerostar. Yo me it was the most MPV like Espace style American vehicle.

We had an 86 Astro in blue and later mom traded it in and got a 2000 Astro in dark grey. They were excellent vehicles. Wish they still made them now!

Ford is selling those in Europe? They don't currently sell any of those models in the U.S. here Only SUV's, trucks, the Mustang, and SUV Mustang

@@danielpassigmailcom Yes thats right. Thats because its allways about that type of "big" cars in the U.S. There seems to be not enough demand/ profit margin for "small cars" except when there are crises and/ or you can't effort to buy anything but small fuel efficient cars. While here in Europe the trend is going towards SUV's and Crossovers too they are even smaller than what you guys would consider "compact" or "small". Just look at the 2014 EcoSport or 2019 Puma from Ford or the 2017 T-Roc, 2018 T-Cross and 2021 Taigo from VW. They are offered alongside the Fiesta/Focus and UP/Polo/Golf .

Many people live in a minivan year round.

@@timothykeith1367 Yeah this is true. They're a lot more roomy and comfortable given the same size compared to an SUV..

😂

Prius huh?

🤣

wtf that's hilarious

I don't like the way Stellantis is going. It seems all of their vans and some other cars are suddenly replaced by Peugeots, while both Opel and FIAT had nicer platforms and more innovative engineering. You can recognise the Peugeot platform very quickly from one of the symptoms of its idiotic budget design: a noticeable pause after you press the horn. You can almost get out the calendar, count the weeks until impact, have the collision and only then the horn will warn the other traffic. I haven't tested the latest Peugeot or Opel Astra for the way they drive but I severely disliked the handling of some modernish mid range Peugeots. Let's hope they at least improved on that.

The homeless will inhabit them for years to come.

Mercedes 250 with half a million miles on it for me.

Yup, luv that most pick ups can’t claim that.

& always a bitch trying to find a pick up truck when you need one, better to own one.

Aaaah, the same engine ?? A 5 liter Hemi in a mini van ? I doubt that...

@@marcryvon 3.6L V6 in both

​@@marcryvon never heard of a V6 RAM?

​@@mental_modeler2952you could get a pen to star V6 in the base model RAM until this year I believe

Pontiac version was briefly sold in Europe too, my granny's bro still owns one to this very day and uses it to pull a boat trailer. Even more interestingly, the european spec one comes with a 5-speed manual and a 4 cylinder (likely Opel?) engine.

I ran service calls for a major corporation and used my own vehicles for the first 26 years. In the first 13 of those years I went through 6 vehicles that I bought used. For the next 13 years I drove a 1994 Pontiac Trans Sport with the 3800 that I also bought used. Wonderful vehicle. Small outside but huge amount of interior space. When I finally stopped using it, it had 382 thousand miles on and the engine was still running fine. The transmission was slipping and even though I really would have liked to keep driving it, I couldn't justify the price of a new transmission on a vehicle that old and with as many miles as it had. Since my company paid me for driving it and with it being so reliable, I made money driving it for all those years. It broke my heart when I finally had to let it go. Oh, and with the plastic body, when cleaned up, it still looked new the whole time...

BAH-zil and to-MAH-to rather than BA-zil and to-MA-to, yes, but I draw the line at misspelling tires.

@@michelleeden2272 ffs, different english dialects have different spellings for certain words, "tire" being one. the above commenter is probably from a commonwealth country ("tyre" = british spelling) , let them be

@@michelleeden2272 Tires? become fatigued? , hehehe. Herb has a "H" at the beginning and there is a "L" in solder..... but lets not get bogged down with who knows how to English language better eh?

It was actually more like four or five years after the Chryslers and, I would argue, it was the first modern crossover. Think about it: -Modified passenger car platform (the HC-series 929/Luce) -Relatively long and flat hood (by minivan standards), something that became even more apparent with the 1995 facelift -Conventionally hinged rear door(s) (not a novelty in Europe or Asia, but very rare in the North American market) -The aforementioned 4WD option (and it was a true 4WD system with a locking center diff)

I'll trade you a microphone for a Mount Prospect police car.

As long as the lighter works…

Yeah my mom had one, total pos, bought it new too. I hated it

Whats the price of Gouda canonballs and a dozen tulips? Wooden shoes?

Sooooo wish they still made Astros! growing up we had an 86 and then a 2000.