I audibly burst out laughing when Thaidakar showed up and, true to WoBs, he was nothing but a seon in a trenchcoat. (Transmitting Kel's image and voice, of course, but you get the idea)
It's gotta be another herald because the Storm father felt another herald die and they seem to have this connection because of the oath pact and we've seen it with jezrien's death.
I think it's Ishar, he would be capable of reproducing the visions for gavilar, and after he says he'd never trust another Kholin. The 1st thing he does when seeing Dalinar is attack ...
I don’t know this explains why he didn’t want to bond Dalinar. He was against it. He only showed the vision because he had to and Dalinar was a good choice. Considering that erasing his memories made him a different person.
Shallan didn’t heal QUITE like Kaladin in ROW. He swore a new ideal and had closure. Her wounds could still open again. If she comes to believe she caused the war, it could be enough to make her become weak and give her pain to Odium, becoming his champion.
That would he horrible but such a cool twist. Since the beginning we've always imagined the champion as an unstoppable dark warrior like Dalinar, Kaladin, Amaram, or Moash. It would really subvert expectations if it was a femme fatale Shallan who actually might be more devastating. Odium as more than enough warriors, but a conniving Formless with Lightweaving and Soulcasting, an immensely versatile set of powers, would change the game.
@@pck4491 Yes! And- if you go back and read the back cover of Way of Kings, it makes a definite statement in the text about the future of four characters. It mentions Dalinar, Szeth, Kaladin and Shallan. It says one of them WILL destroy us. My bet is on Shallan.
damn, I've been racking my brain for the herald who died!! Clearly I need to look more into theories as the thought of Shallan's mom being a herald didn't even cross my mind. Thanks for the ideas!
the real stormfather doesn´t know when a Herald die, but all the heralds do. The vision that Gavilar kept going back was the one that all heralds, but Taln saw. When they gave up their honorblades. Im pretty sure stormfaker was Ishar
I think it is totally possible that the Susfather is an agent of Odium. Because we know that if only one herald breaks then they ALL return and start a desolation. So it would be within Odium's interest to 'create' a herald that will just 'return' as quickly as possible. Then we hear that a herald died so that plan is no longer needed and immediatley after the Susfather drops Gavilar like a hotpocket with no cardboard wrapper thingy
@@Dovakinskywalker Yeah that's an excellent point. If this wasn't the Stormfather (which it very obviously is) and Odium has the power to just make someone a Herald of Honor, why wouldn't he pick someone actually devoted to him?
I never bought into the "Channa is Shallan's mom" theory, but now this prologue is really making me reconsider that. I'm pretty sure this prologue is confirming that refounding the Oathpact, and people becoming heralds will be a big plot in SA 5
They'd better not. What's the point of just refounding the Oathpact as it stood? Consigning these characters to eternal torture, combat, and eventual madness? Nothing ultimately changing regarding Odium's situation? Come on. I hope the story gets more creative than eating its own beginning.
Honestly think a good chunk of the POV characters we’ve met will become the new heralds but I don’t think it’s going to be a case of “hey we’re going to spend hundreds of years fighting and being tortured” I think it’s more a case of “we’re going to bare this torment for a couple of decades and give roshar the time it needs to prepare for the final war” we already know that the back five will follow a time skip and there plenty of stuff on coppermind that could corroborate this.
@@citizen-7xl5 well this is called a true desolation so I’d assume the heralds to rise up from this would be true heralds of honor and not be self corrupted or corrupted in general like most of the original heralds and they might end the desolations entirely
I‘m not to sure about your theory about the „Everstorm-Father“ because of two things: if I‘m not mistaken the Stormfather said that he only became the way he ist, with his powers and level of sentience, after Honor had been destroyed by Odium, so basically he is sort of a remnant of Honor, however if there was something like an Everstorm counterpart, wouldn‘t it be basically more like the Stormfather was before Honos death, more like a spren then an actual fully sentient being, due to the fact that Odium is still very much alive? And the second thing is that while the Stormfather and the Highstorm have always been a part of Roshar, the Everstorm on the other hand didn‘t really exist at that time, because it hadn‘t yet been summoned by the Parshendi, so I personally don‘t really think that this sort of being even exists, but then again, thats just my view on things^^ Personally, I think that it actually was the Stormfather, because a lot of the character traits seem to fit the Stormfather we know quite well, the things that don‘t align could just be him being more cautious around Dalinar and the others due to his prior interactions and experiences with Dalinar Anyway, I can‘t wait to find out more, until then I‘m probably gonna re-read all his other stuff for like the 5th time or so xD
I think the best theory I’ve heard regarding the storm father is he became a spren by absorbing honors cognitive shadow and that’s why he acts like soulcasted materials when dalinar first bonds him because he probably was originally just an investiture storm
i think somehow the stormfather knew that jezzrian would die and was prepping the next herald. he told gavilar and it made him think about immortality. Now he's not telling dalinar his end goal so he doesn't get swamped up in it, but he is prepping the replacement. I think the stormfather has more of the almighty's power than he has let on and is playing the long game. Possibly a little shardic prescience Edit: I actually found more to support this. In the brief moment of lucidity that ishar has when they confront them he tells them a few things. 1. he is not sane 2.He can recreate the oathpact 3. something something champion that we can't make out 4. He can be made lucid in that moment in which someone makes a pact and links the spiritual realm. In this fight he shows something very similar to atium shadows. I think while honor is shit at telling the future he can do a bit and is trying to get ishar and 1 new oathpact member to take the place of jezz to reseal the oathpact. But this must be done in the very moment of the duel and someone must ascend to knights radiant during the duel of champions.
Thas what i was thinking about. Theres 6 years between gavilar´s death and twok, me must consider that, the stormfather would did some other things in that time and he could be trying to do not make the same mistake with Dalinar and reveal important things to him. We could see this in the way of stormfather varely say important things to dalinar, he refuses to do it. In last thing, something that surprise me was the stormfather showing himself in the physic realm as a man, bc we only have seen him as a form of a storm, dalinar always says that. Sorry 4 my english xd
@@aaroncz8518 I put this as an addendum to the og post but I actually found more to support this. In the brief moment of lucidity that ishar has when they confront them he tells them a few things. 1. he is not sane 2.He can recreate the oathpact 3. something something champion that we can't make out 4. He can be made lucid in that moment in which someone makes a pact and links the spiritual realm. In this fight he shows something very similar to atium shadows. I think while honor is shit at telling the future he can do a bit and is trying to get ishar and 1 new oathpact member to take the place of jezz to reseal the oathpact. But this must be done in the very moment of the duel and someone must ascend to knights radiant during the duel of champions.
If it's a SF then it's strange. Dalinar before he bonded SF was able to see a visions only during storms. And there was no storm that night when Gavilar was killed. Plus, we all saw how much it takes to actually make a bond. Oaths are difficult and u need have a conviction to make it works. So SF, as someone who accepts the oaths, should kind of know that Gavilar doesn't mean any of this.
I'm not sure why nobody is considering the idea that Cultivation/nightwatcher had something to do with this. It aligns with her motives of containing Odium, lying is not totally out of character for her, and the mentions of futuresight make more sense. Also, the comment "stormfather" makes about Dalinar having potential sounds very Cultivation, and would be totally out of character for Odium, who would agree with Gavilar that he was simply a violent brute.
This is what I thought. This is not the stormfather, so who have we seen in the previous books as the “man behind the curtain”, manipulating the situation to set things in motion. Makes sense to me.
The issue with this is that the everstorm is a workaround for the oathpact, it will always act as a backdoor to roshar, hence why the voidbringers come back immediately instead of needing to wait until the next desolation like before.
@@Fieryxjoe no that’s wrong. They can come back as many times until a herald returns. The reason they can come back quickly is because the oath pact is broken and there are no heralds to seal them away. It’s the reason this is more difficult now. They can come back countless times.
I thought the Stormfather straight up said to Dalinar that he showed Gavilar visions? There was no question in my mind that this was the Stormfather. If it wasn't, then two beings showed Gavilar visions, which I guess is possible but would be pretty weird
You're right, there's probably the most evidence towards the simplest explanation being true here. But the strange behavior by the SF here creates plenty of room for considering alternatives
@@FantologyPodcast I agree, the Stormfather is being super weird here but it may just be because he isn't actually bonded to Gavilar? But I honestly think the weirdest thing we see is the Stormfather actually being able to see individual people coming up to Gavilar's door. I'm not sure if we've seen him able to see on that level of detail before. Plus the whole manifesting an avatar of sorts is really odd. So I definitely see your point. We'll just have to wait and see if we get some answers in book 5!
I think the accepted theory is that he is tied to the physical realm through Hemalurgy (at the end of Bands of Mourning there was a statue of someone with a spike through one eye). There’s some pretty knowledgeable people on our discord and Reddit that caught that one!
I’m glad I found your channel! I’m really looking forward to SA5. The prologue was very satisfying and answered some questions I had. Keep up the good work!
Because there is a faint connection between gavilar and odium just when he die what if odium drowned him in investiture like what happened to vasher..he still could be alive..
The Stormfather appears in the Prologue as a rippling, roughly-humanoid shape floating in the air. The Stormfather has NEVER appeared in that form before. Until now, he has always appeared in the sky.
Edit: found quote from Rhythm of War "The Stormfather appeared beside him, moving in the air alongside Dalinar-a rare occurrence. The Stormfather never had features. Merely a vague impression of a figure the same size as Dalinar, yet extending into infinity."
It’s the storm father 100% he’s shown to be able to lie and he’s being more difficult with dalinar because gavilar was a power hungry manipulative and short sighted monster that was given too much information too easily which led him in the wrong direction because the storm father was lying to manipulate him in order to get him to do what the storm father wanted basically both of them were manipulating each other and it led to the worst outcome
I just read the prologue - and from ive felt, after saying that the herald died, the stormfather started to act like his usual self. Maybe something happened to him, just like the heralds abd BAM
I'm still convinced it really was the Stormfather, and that he changed his mind. Dalinar's stormfather is more spren-like because he learned from his time with Gavilar. The whole transformation of the Stormfather into something more threatening at the end was the fragment of Honor coming through strongly, which he has not risked doing for Dalinar. This is all Brandon preparing us for the twist that "the Stormfather has secretly been guiding Dalinar to become a Herald and restore the Oathpact." If Brandon had revealed that the Stormfather was lying not out of spren-ish omission in previous books, we would have been too suspicious of him. If he deploys the twist without these preparation hints in book 5, it would feel unearned. Narratively, the Stormfather needed to stay a mysterious but ultimately ineffectual spren up until now so Dalinar would learn and grow on his own without divine intervention. I strongly doubt that Dalinar will become a normal Herald. Something will change about the Oathpact before the end of Book 5 and the Stormfather's plan, as so often happens, will not go off smoothly. It would be dissatisfying for this to be another "it was honor's plan all along" story: Brandon already kinda' did that in Mistborn, and I think Stormlight is too big a series to repeat it in a big way.
Definitely sense a big twist coming at the end of this one as well. Feels like Brandon's whole career has been leading up to this one and he's got an especially genius plan
I've only watched the video of Brandon reading the prologue once. But I'll have to read through it again in the newsletter email he sent out today. You have given me a lot to ponder with your perspective. Could the Stormfather talking to Gavilar be Odium or is that too on the nose? I don't think Brandon would make it Rayse, right after we got a new Odium at the end of the previous book. Although it seems well within his powers, I think the culprit will be a character in book 5. Which we'll get to know properly for the first time. Which leads me to believe it probably is one of the Unmade. Anyway, thanks for the video. I was itching to dive deeper into the Prologue. All the best ✌🏻
The biggest StormFaker theory is that Ishar is responsible for the fake stormfather, he (if anyone does) has the powers to make it work, he could give people the visions, he would sense the death of a herald, he can lie and has access to all this information. Perhaps he could be trying to trick Gavilar into replacing him as a herald so he is free to leave the system or die without returning to Braize.
I think people are thinking into it too much because the stormfather was more open and "innocent" than with dalinar. I don't think it's anyone except the actual stormfather
@@matthewmcb1089 That could definitely be the case. But however innocent the Stormfather might have been at the time, I think he would still be familiar with the Nahel bond. And how it is responsible for the Knights Radiant. If for no other reason because he remembers the Day of Recreance. So the notion of Gavilar thinking he's on his way to becoming a Herald could be either that he is an impostor or he is lying. Can you think of another explanation? 🤔
Does the Everstorm even carry that much Investiture? It’s not like the Highstorm which is like a mini perpendicularity and gives off Stormlight, the only investiture the Everstorm seems to carry is the Fused
Yes, it is definitely the Stormfather. There is no reason to suspect it's not. No, the Stormfather never said, I can't watch for people outside the room. He said he couldn't just sit and watch one particular room all the time no matter where Dalinar went. He's always been able to see the things that are just around the person he's bonded to. This is six years before the Everstorm exists, so how could there be an "everstormfather"? I don't personally like the idea of Shallan's mom being Chanarach, but I will grant that at least this one is somewhat supported by evidence. The one huge counterpoint is... how could a child kill a Herald? I know the blanket answer is "she was surprised" but... well that doesn't scan. We've seen the Heralds. They are, all, superlative warriors. Absolutely insane. Taln caught two darts out of the air when he wasn't even fractionally lucid. I simply don't buy that a Herald could be rushing at a girl she knows is a surgebinder expressly to kill her, sees this girl raise her hands, knows full well it's entirely possible she has a Shardblade, and just runs headlong onto the sword as it materializes, when she has the skills to run around this girl three times and slap her before she can react... no, I'm sorry, that is just not possible. Now, maybe there's some reason that didn't quite happen. Maybe something unavoidable happened and she had to let herself be vulnerable for a moment to deal with it, or something... but really, it's hard to imagine a scenario that a Herald couldn't deal with and still outfight a toddler. Why would Vargodium pick Gavilar as his champion? Especially if the reason for Gavilar to be the Champion is to be as evil as possible? Five minutes ago he was willing to sacrifice his own life to save humanity, so why would he suddenly decide, let me pick someone just because he's as evil as possible? Also, both the win and loss conditions of the contract are bad for Odium. At the end of the book, Vargodium was acknowledging this... and then said he found a loophole. So at least his plan is, not to either win or lose, and he thinks he has a way to force that. So, a fight that's just "Dalinar beats up someone and wins" doesn't really sound like it fits.
I'm sorry but two characters having the same hair color should not be considered "really obvious" proof of them being related. If this Chanarach theory does turn out to be true, I hope Brandon will come up with more to connect them, than simply hair color. Or, maybe instead, he'll make everyone feel stupid for assuming that there can only be one family line with red hair.
The theory is based on three things - hair color, the timeline of when she died, and the comment that Shallon had done something to doom the world (cause the desolation by killing Chana, who immediately broke in Damnation)
Also I think ishar is more of a red herring I don't think it's going to be him and I think Brandon will use this as a chance to introduce another herald in the next book maybe.
I hold the suckling child in my hands, a knife at his throat, and know that all who live wish me to let the blade slip. Spill its blood upon the ground, over my hands, and with it gain us further breath to draw. ” -Collected on Shashanan 1173, 23 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed youth of sixteen years. Sample is of particular note.
