I think some people, especially me, need "permission" do delve into what they are interested in in their target language. I have read books far above my level, just marking every instance where I don't understand, and then going back and looking up the words or phrases and filling in the definitions. I just think people like to get "permission" to do what they want to do in the language. So I say this: There is no law! Do whatever you want! I think extensive reading appeals to many language learners, but maybe they feel a novel or even a news article is "too hard". Well, let it be too hard! Work through it. Where I have struggled the most in the language has given me the biggest benefits. I have went through sentence by sentence in Japanese and took HOURS to go through them and translate them, and I saw such a huge leap in my comprehension. Don't be afraid of struggling!
As far as I know, extensive reading isn't supposed to be 'too hard', In fact, the most effective extensive reading material is one that provides a 98% automatic comprehension environment for the reader. You're supposed to read material in or slightly above your comfort zone, and read a lot.
@@kaedreaming8341 The main problem is to find these "98%". It is near to impossible. That's why I prefer reading something interesting to me, with google-translation, even if there were 30% of unknown words. In the flow of the time this number lessens (descends) naturaly
To get to a level where you understand 95-98% of the text in your target language, especially when learning a foreign language, you have to go through a LONG process of intensive reading sessions. Extensive reading is helpful to really solidify the words and the different contexts they can be used in, in your memory, while intensive reading is to help you get familiar with new structures and vocabulary. One can't do without both of these methods. =)
I've done extensive reading for english for the past years by reading fanfictions, and now im basically doing the same thing for german. Currently im utterly obsessed drowning myself in german fanfictions, that it doesn't feel like learning at all, just focusing on the characters and the plot. Although there was a time when I was intensively reading and translating every single paragraph like a maniac (i think i was still B1, it was excruciating), but im glad that (torturous) phase is over and now extremely comfortable in reading any fictions :) P.S. I've tried looking for classic novels and literatures (the little prince, etc etc) but it was so boring for me. You *really, really* have to find a compelling reading material to keep you reading... Never force yourself to read something that you don't even care about!
@@suheylayalcin7149 Ich entschuldige mich für die späte Antwort. Graded books sind für mich sprachlich eher steif. Ich würde dir Bücher empfehlen, die eigentlich für Muttersprachler aber trotzdem noch in einem einfachen Niveau sind. Damals hatte ich "5 Books that will improve your German" von Tom Copeland geschaut und hatte mit "Supergute Tage" angefangen (der Roman war eine Übersetzung von Englisch... Aber es war mir in Ordnung). Ich war damals quasi A1/A2, und ja hatte ich bemüht, das Buch mindestens zu verstehen. Erstens das Audiobook auf Englisch zuzuhören (um das Grundverstehen der Geschichte zu haben) und danach auf Deutsch zu lesen. Wenn du noch Schwierigkeiten hast und wahnsinnig viel fremde Wörter findest, dann könntest du nichts dafür, außer Google-Übersetzer zu öffnen und sich auszuhalten 😂 Ich glaube "Supergute Tage" war faszinierend und ein guter Anfang, darum lohnten sich die Bemühungen :) Werke wie Fanfiktion oder klassische Romanen zu lesen, ist nicht für jemanden, der noch Anfänger ist, weil die Frustration nur zunimmt. Die sind (ehrlich gesagt) für B2, aber ja war ich noch in B1 und hatte die "ganze" 420k Wörter Fanfiktion, Abschnitt für Abschnitt, übersetzt. Es brauchte 2 Monaten alles zu "lesen-übersetzen" Aber damit hatte ich die Brücke zwischen B1 und B2 durchquert und es lohnte sich :) Wenn du schon endlich in B2 bist, benutz einsprachiges Wörterbuch statt Übersetzer. Trotzdem stehen Durchhaltevermögen und Geduld im Vordergrund! Du kannst es schaffen :) Ich wünsche dir alles gute!!
I've switched to extensive reading lately in my 3 year long German learning. It makes a big difference.. Coming across a word more than once in one sitting and possibly in different contexts is what lights them up, and reduces the need for dictionary. I've been reading the 1001 Nacht (2000 Pages) with great pleasure. I strongly recommend it.
I started with the essential things you need in life: online prospects of grocery stores, items at home, body parts, asking for directions, city traffic vocabulary, then slowly weather forecast, news headings, popular songs' lyrics etc.
I agree. Coz that's how I achieved C2 level in English. I'm a non native speaker of the language. I used to love reading lots and lots of books in my childhood and that helped me develop my vocab in English.
bro i swear language learning is magic. i study on lingq, currently arabic. if input isnt comprehensible, i make it comprehensible by using translation and repetition. but it seriously feels like magic when i can hear and read sentences in arabic and understand them without parsing, just straight meaning going into my brainhole
I like to create flash cards of sentences from my books that I want to read in my target language. Study them over and over again. About one page until I understand the sentences for that first page that week. Then I can usually learn the language quickly using this method. It is how I taught myself Japanese when I was in high school. I learned by copying manga to flashcards.
I like buying a book in my target language and the same book in my native language. I like to "make" my own parallel exercise books. But I guess this is intensive study, not extensive reading. One of my "Ah - ha" moments in my language learning, happened when I was reading a information page on the Internet in Esperanto and when the text changed from Esperanto to French at the some point in the information sheet...I didn't know that I had changed languages. My reading seemed seamless. I realised I was in the French section of the notice after I was half way through the French text!
Always love your videos! One of my language goals this year has been to up my extensive reading! I'm currently reading Sapiens in Chinese and am aiming to read 5 books in Chinese this year. Of course there's (quite) a few words per page I'm not 100% sure of, but I'm usually able to get the meaning without checking. If an unknown words really hinders my progress, or if it pops up many times, then I'll check. Otherwise I will also sometimes write down words on a piece of paper next to me, or just underline them. Kindles are also good as there is a dictionary feature, so you can also just tap on the word to see what it means!
I looooove this videos. This is one of the best I've seen on RU-vid in so long! A lot of what Krashen does is so important. In my opinion traditional study is next to useless. I mean, it serves some purposes, but it teaches you more about a language than it teaches you the language. Because of this you have to use traditional study techniques in a specific way, and most people don't. Comprehensible input is THE best way to learn, even in other things than reading (shows, talking, games, etc.). I was working at making something similar to this the topic of my next podcast episode, but honestly, I'm gonna find another topic and start researching that now. This was so good.
Every time I read a book and come across a word or grammar structure that is not familiar to me, there's no way I can skip those and move on without looking them up in a dictionary or a grammar book, or I would feel like a traitor. I must be overintensive, because it takes me two years to read a 600-page book.
I would just encourage you to fight the urge. I know it can feel wrong at times, but it really is not worth your time to look up every word. You can do it! I believe in you :)
Reading for language learners? "Short Stories in _your target language_ " by Olly Richards and his team look interesting; you also can buy the audio book on for example audiable, and combine reading and listening.
Great video. I'm curious though about two things. Firstly, if you use extensive reading with LingQ, do you look up every word you don't know (which i thought stops it from being extensive reading) or do you skip them and then have a higher known word count than is true but ultimately that not really mattering. My second question is how often do you reread texts. What's the trade off of re-reading vs experiencing something new. Many thanks,
S. Krashen is right, however this is an old theory, described in the 1st half of the 20th century, and described to every detail including statistics, study groups, optimization of the process etc.
krashen has done a lot of original research in this area for decades, so I think he deserves some of a reputation for developing our understanding of it, but also, I've heard him say over and over again that he wasn't the first person to discover the ideas and he owes a lot to those researchers who came before him and who work alongside him, so he's definitely not shy about that truth. he's always citing their work like you would expect a good researcher to
You can find ‘graded readers’ in whatever target language. Generally these start with the simplest syntax and vocabulary, including illustrations so that the language input is comprehensible from the outset. That is where you might start with the extensive reading method. For example, one can learn to read Latin by reading through Lingua Latina, which is written entirely in Latin. It is a proven method. I do agree with your sentiment however, that flash cards are not ‘bad’ and can be a useful tool in conjunction with comprehensible input.
My sentiment exactly. He actually said 90 to 95% and I thought great so you basically have to first excel in the language first before you start reading. Good. But how do you learn it though?
Flashcards and extensive reading are good also. For a complete beginner, you should probably use a program like Pimsleur or Assimil, and learn basic vocabulary, then once you have 1,000 words, start reading with very simple texts. Even then, you might be below 80% comprehension for a while before you get to a level where you can get over 80% comprehension. Try reading something you already know in your native language. Or re-read the same text several times to increase the comprehension level. This video was intended for people who are beyond a beginner level, but you should move to doing extensive reading as soon as you are able to.
It's even more difficult, because 80% is nowhere near enough to read fluently. That's 1 out of 5 words being completely unknown. Pretty slow going! I think the previous comment basically has it right: it would probably be good to start the standard way, by getting some 'basics in 3 months' or whatever type course, building some simple foundations. And then moving onto the easiest end of a graded reading system, if you can find them in your target language... If you've discovered anything else since you asked this question please share!
You got a point here . it would be hard starting from the very beggining . I wanted to do it with korean but first I started learning it a bit on my own before changing to reading . It helped me improving my english to a point where I can easily comunicate with people .
I agree. I would probably suggest taking a basic language class for a year to establish a foundation of correct pronunciation and vocabulary and start reading and the basic level. Picking up a reader with zero knowledge of the language would be frustrating and demotivating.
While this might sound a little degrading at first, children's books can actually be a good place to start, they usually have pictures to illustrate the words they're teaching and you will start to learn the most basic words in the language. Simple children's comic books can be great too, and as you start to learn you can move onto more mature graphic novels
If you drop the ”extensive” and just focus on reading without any limiting labels, you can do anything. Reading is HOW you learn the language. I started reading Spanish beginner stories after 1 week. I used Language Transfer to get a super good start and have been doing 1000 XP a day in Duolingo, so it’s an intense journey, but so fun! With the stories, I read a chapter, understand the main plot usually but very few words. Read the summary, and then read the same chapter again. This time I understand more, read the summary again, then read the attached word list. Then I read the chapter a third time and understand even more. After this I answer questions about what I’ve read and so far I’ve gotten all of them right. Then, even though there’s still a bunch I don’t understand, I move on to the next chapter. It’s all about just understanding the main gist of the stories, and I learn SO much every time I read. It’s like magic!
So, how would someone who is a beginner use Extensive Reading if you suggest that one must understand about 98% what is being read and not pause or stop to look up words. What is your suggestion?
6:15 ... So how did you learn the first 95% of the words on the page? ... If one understands ZERO words in the target language, how, pray tell, does one commence?
This is the most important part of the process that I don't find discussed almost anywhere on RU-vid... I think the truth is though that some intensive reading and basic work is always going to be needed. Even with graded readers, a complete beginner can't pick one up and read it. There is a missing step here that is probably using a basic language primer or beginner course plus some intensive reading. Maybe intensively reading some of the easier graded readers will allow you to move into the 95 to 98% ish range eventually?
Different languages are different. Sometimes a sentence is comprehensible if there's content. Obviously you need to start somewhere. The sooner you get to easier materials the better and from that point you can learn as you go.
I felt like I shouldn't focus too much on reading if I don't have native audio for the same text, because I could be missing details of the pronunciation, kinda pronouncing it wrong in my head.
After 18 months, I´m nearly fluent in Spanish, the love of my life. Obviously, passion is required for rapid fluency. Passion or, having a government put a gun to your families head like China would do. Both are motivating. It´s not that the «old ways» don´t work. It´s that they don´t work as they have become. Flashcards? Whatever idiot thought that up! Vocabulary is required. It´s not optional. However, vocabulary in a context list, climbing up to 10,000 words. THAT works! I know because I wrote one. Context is the power and Flashcards are devoid of it. All grammar of a language should be learned FIRST, in a language framework with a few but not extensive exercises. I learned all Spanish grammar in 4 months. Grammar is finite. After this point, where the context list is started, constantly being improved, and you have all the grammar, you start INTENSE (reading and grammar). Intense is a phase, not a competition for Extensive. Extensive is next. And that´s it. In the Intensive phrase, you must take Academic grammar apart and throw it away. Like the Spanish subjunctive, which has become a mess because of the way it´s taught. It only has three rules. All that emotion and triggers and all that? It´s garbage men have added on for profit.
I LOVE reading children's books. It might sound goofy and feel dumb at first, but they have some good stuff out there with fun art. It also helps you pick up cultural touchstones that are hard to learn as a nonnative, but kids know their whole lives BECAUSE of these books. Obviously you're not going to absorb the whole of pop culture and general beliefs from kids books, but you can get some common symbolism used throughout the culture from them.
Excellent video, my man! Glad to hear what I was taught as a pre-service teacher holds up. We were encouraged to give students plenty of free reading time during the school day. Not only is it effective, but it is also relaxing and fun for students, which means they stand a much better chance of keeping up with it and loving learning. I also think extensive reading is awesome for my Mandarin! I have a Mandarin/English Little Prince haha. Thanks for making this vid!
Hard to find videos that deal with how one gets to the point where they can understand 95 percent of a graded reader or real source...isn't that achieved via "dusty old text books"? I find that to get to 95 percent there is a stage where I'm doing intensive reading, looking up word after word, delighting in the discovery of how to say things.
Someone please help me, I have some questions, do we have to read out loud or read in our minds in extensive reading. And also for eg I want to learn Japanese through ER reading so in what language shall I read the Japanese book, do I have to read a book written in Japanese alphabets or written in English but with Japanese words.??? So confused please help me
You should probably be reading out loud, it’ll help with pronunciation and getting used to hearing the language. Preferably, if the language you’re learning is not using the English alphabet, you should always be reading it in the actual script, as that is how it would be read by natives and would defeat the purpose if you didn’t do so imo.
Depends how much you read! At a comprehension level of 98% you are encountering 2 new words for every 100 words you read. If you read 500 words a day (around 10-15 minutes of reading time) that's 10 new words. After 90 days that's 900 new words. You should definitely be noticing a difference by then, but your mileage will vary depending on how much you read :) You might benefit from picking some metrics to test your progress on. Reading speed might even be a useful one, among others. But there are lots of ways to measure progress. Good luck!
How do you learn to read ancient languages like Latin and Judeo-Aramaic? Finding a text with high reading comprehension is not a possible option there, all of it is high academic texts.
For latin look for interlinear texts or Hamiltonian System books on archive.org, bilingual books with facing translation (loebulus) or even bilingual version of the vulgata
Gosh.....if I could just lay in my hammock and read a book in my target language all day, I probably wouldn't need to learn my target language. I would already know it. But alas, I am just starting out (3 months) and I have to look up 90% of the words in children's stories or else I have no clue what is going on. I highly doubt if they make any books with the 20 words that I know in 95% of the story. (I am being a little facetious here but you get the point) On a slightly different note, I notice that sometimes (quite a bit actually), a phrase of words can mean something completely different than what each word individually means. Very frustrating. Without a teacher to tell me that, I wouldn't have a clue as to what it means even if I know the meaning of each word.
How learn a new language by reading and not knowing a single word? At 7:00 you say, “your level of understanding”. You do not explain what you mean by that. And that I have to understand 70 to 90%. How to do that as a beginner? I don’t get it, obviously.
Steven Krashen didn't really invent the idea of "comprehensible input". It's basically the same as the "direct method" which gained prominence in the late 19th century.
he didn't say "Learn JAPANESE by reading." He's probably talking about languages that English speakers can actually acquire (Spanish, French, Italian...), languages with the same alphabet, similar linguistic background. Stop being silly, B.
