Fake gramophone - tonearm fix 

Yes indeed. They are not really being sold for use, more as decorators pieces, however with a little adjustment they will play records. As for looks, compared to the real thing they look poor, however they sufficiently meet the general public's expectation of what a machine should look like and I have seen them used in films and TV series. Here in the UK, you almost never see a genuine horn machine anywhere. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff I like the horn elbow on yours better than the ones that I have. The 2 that I picked up for $40 dollars will play, as you noted with a little adjusting. Good to hear from You!

I don't know if you saw but I had to do a little repair on the horn elbow of my fake machine: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-g_F7XUuOI68.html The curved pipe of the originals seem stronger. Thanks 😀 👍

Yes, I don't think they are really made to be played, even the vendor's descriptions on ebay suggest they are more decorative pieces with moving parts, than actual practical players. Having said that I'm sure they can be reengineered into something usable. At the moment I am just doing a few quick fixes, but may find the time to properly sort it out. Thanks 😀 👍

Mine plays .i was rideculed in a facebook group told crap and would never play.

Yes, will be looking at the soundbox next. I have quite a collection I could use, but want to have a look at how this one is constructed too. The platter wobble is causing me some problems though. I can measure it and have had a few attempts at fixing it, but no luck so far. I don't plan on using this machine much, but would like to get it usable. Thanks 😀 👍

Yes, they are not really made to be played, and I think many people who do try them are happy to assume that people of the time were happy to accept a very poor musical experience, not realising that a proper gramophone sounds much better. At the minute I am mainly doing a few quick fixes on this machine, but may find time to properly reengineer it in future. You are right about the record, thanks. I was going on the information on 45worlds.com, which I can only assume manages to mix up a genuine 1915 record with what is presumably an electrical re-recording as it does have the embossed 'w'. Not looked in the soundbox yet, but it will be probably the next video. I'll find some proper accoustic recordings and also clarify that this record was electric. Thanks 😀 👍

heres a fact to spot a fake gramophone: its part of the horn in the back can be squished and the crank is not real wood and the thing that we might talked about a bit the horn.. yes its made of brass and the soundbox doesnt movev smoothly and its not supposed to move like i dont know how to explain but its supposed to move only right and left and fake one moves back if am correct and the decoration on the box is not real either its like made with a tape

@@goober890 THanks, the more who know how to avoid fakes the better. I have one, but more as a 'black museum' exhibit & its quirky appearance! I bought it direct, so was not duped into believing it was the real thing.

oh alright

Indeed 😉 😅. Thanks 😀 👍

I’m disappointed that no bailing wire was used

They are pretty bad the way they are built. I do find it interesting and a challenge to fix the various faults 😉😅

looks nice in my opinion, fits my room just nicely

Good question, though at least where I am (UK), you almost never see a genuine horn gramophone for sale. I was at RetroTechUK last year and did see some there, though you might see from my haul video that I didn't buy one: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-edZs0FSsXPc.html It might be worth you joining The Talking Machine Forum (forum.talkingmachine.info/viewforum.php?f=1) and I know there is a big Facebook group of gramophone enthusiasts though I am not on Facebook myself. Good luck 👍

@@mrrgstuff Much appreciated, thank you! I'll reach out to those communities.

Some original machines were very poorly designed as the manufacturer either didn't know or didn't care about how they would affect the record. 2.5cm is quite a lot though, so it may be worth checking to see if the arm has been replaced at some time. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff it's also a hmv, I don't know. I also saw another similar model and it had the same defect

Fair enough. Sounds like that was just the way it was designed.

They certainly have many faults, though I find them fun and interesting to play with. It would be nice to have a proper external horn machine, but so far I have not found one at a price I can afford. I really shouldn't buy any more internal horn machines as I am out of space 🤔😉😅. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff Good luck! You will find a machine. It took me a few years and a few auctions to finally get my Victor horn machines. I recently got the Victor O, but it needs to have the motor rebuilt. Summer job.

Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff Have faith; you will find one. By the way, I had two crap-o-phones; one with the horn attached to the travel arm and one with the tapered tone arm all with the lovely brass. I have since acquired many external horn machines from sellers on eBay. Good luck finding one and make a video when you get one. Thanks.

Thanks 😀 👍. I was at a collectors fair last week, and could actually have bought one, they were the cheapest I have seen, but still rather more than the cash I had brought. Anyway did pick up lots of nice stuff which will feature in a future video.

Not sure how old this fake is. Somewhere in the last 50 years I would say. It may have been made to look older than it actually is, or just stored in an outbuilding or attic 🤔. Thanks 👍 😀

oh alright no problem 😀

Glad you enjoyed the video 😀. Yes, they usually can be made to play, though quality control from the suppliers only really seems to extend to making sure the platter revolves. Usually, they spin much too fast! Unfortunately, they are pretty much derided by the community. However, some of us do make room for them and have fun making them play! This is my playlist of my fake machines and what I have done with them: My fake gramophones: ru-vid.com/group/PLsCYUbO6xxnSQxENr28Cg05DiRuC5O47w Hope you have fun with yours! Thanks 👍 😀

​@@mrrgstuffgives me a buzz hearing it play even if only replica! I think tone arm sits way to heavy on record its working mire like a lathe at the moment! Need to work out how to lift it a bit. More fiddling i guess.

@@stevejohnman68 Yes, the tracking is very heavy, though I have not actually measured it. Back in the later days of the gramophone era, some people used counterweights, but I suspect many records were just worn out by poorly designed machines.

I think probably it could. I haven't achieved that yet, though I did a straight comparison between a fake and a real one here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-1nzfZsRqF5g.html I've also done a playlist of things I have done on my fake, too: My fake gramophones: ru-vid.com/group/PLsCYUbO6xxnSQxENr28Cg05DiRuC5O47w It is entirely possible to fit a different soundbox, though some will be easier than others. There are a few other areas which can be improved on it. If I get a chance, I'll make a video going through the whole machine and what might be done to improve it. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff Thank you 😊

I think there really should be 2 nuts as I think there should be one supporting the tonearm and also at the bottom next to the bracket. I think I used 2 pairs of locking nuts, though it was a pain to get them all on the screw thread. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff Thanks, for the information. The problem with the nuts is that in the upper or lower part, sometimes cause the tonearm lock. At the moment I put only one nut in the upper part and every record I play, O adjust it again because of vibrations and tonearm movement the nut goes down. I will try to get more nuts to experiment….👍

There are quite a few variations, but I don't think I have seen one with a straight tonearm. These were certainly a thing in the past, like on this machine: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-vDpsJK8J7WQ.htmlsi=MoPuFnvde313Ftxn Fakes seem to be 100% new parts now but have incorporated real parts in the past. You might like this video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-t3FQ1F03QUI.htmlsi=zN94jpXpsxdSeqMU Thanks 😀 👍

Thanks 👍 😀. These fake machines are only really intended for decoration. Being able to play a record is very secondary 🤣, so quality control is poor. I have managed to straighten the turntable on this one. This video shows how: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-a_echDb_Hdg.html 😀

I​@@mrrgstuffwhat i dont realy understand about these if intended as decoration only why did they put a working motor in them? Would have just made manufacture cost much higher! Why they didnt improve them slightly into playable machines i dont know?

@stevejohnman68 It's a good point and I can only speculate. I think India never really stopped making gramophones. Less and less people cared whether they could actually play a record all the way through and they became decoration pieces. They still fit motors, partly because they always have, and partly because people do like to demonstrate these machines. If there was enough demand, I think we would start seeing better quality machines, and indeed, there are some signs of this happening with some of the machines I have seen online.

It could, but usually for a different reason. In the case of this machine, the tonearm is poorly constructed. On a genuine vintage machine the tonearm was probably OK when made, but some were made of a type of alloy known as 'pot metal', which swells over time causing the joint to jam up. It could also just be dried up lubricant in the joint. What machine is it? Thanks 😀 👍

Thanks 😀 👍

How can I contact you via facebook, so I can send pictures. thanks a lot.

I'm not on Facebook but you can email me. My address is listed in my channel's about section. You may need to look via a browser. I don't think it shows up on the phone app. Having said that, I don't think I can really help you with this. The machine is a Japanese one from around 1930, but I am not familiar with it at all. You could try asking on thetalkingmachine forum. Thanks 😀 👍

Thanks 😀 👍

I use Olive 0.1 which is free and very lightweight. It does have a few bugs but I have learnt to avoid them. Olive 0.2 has been in development for a good couple of years now, but looks to be more complicated and I haven't moved over to it yet. 😅. Thanks 😀 👍

@@mrrgstuff my wife thanks you

@@Mrpurple75 Can't seem to find your last comment, however I have seen a comment from him today.

Thanks 😀 👍