Distance between horses shows much more about the other horses than it does about the front ruinner. Count Fleet and Citation won the Belmont in exactly the same time, but Citation won by 8 lengths and Count Fleet by 25 lengths. Cy had tougher competition.
"And Feodor is blazing along. A mile and a half in 2:42 and 1 fifth. Feodor is widening now. He's moving like a tremendous machine! Feodor by 12....Feodor by 14 lengths! Solar Maximus is dropping back. It looks like they'll catch him today as Brite Sabbath and Freud's Vale are coming up to him. But Feodor is all alone! He's out there almost a sixteenth of a mile in front of the other horses!"
@@emmaleahconnely5367 Absolutely!! Few races in America are more than 10f anymore, so fast to begin and set the pace. On the Continent, where races are still more than 2 miles, there are uphilles and downhills, the jockey's know how to pace their horses, and make sure they have enough to put it on around the last turn.
These are "starter handicap" races for horses who have run for a low claiming tag like $5k in the past two years. Sometimes they sandbag a much classier horse by entering it once to make it eligible and they romp. Peat Moss did the same thing in 1981 and then went on to miss in the JCGC by a nose later that year.
Peat Moss once ran with more than 40 lbs. on his back. He was that feared. He won the Display Handicap, 18f., twice I think. The opposition were unknowns, so it was a Grace III race. But look at the times. Excellent. He could have run in Grade I races, and proved that when he ran in the Jockey Club Gold Cup. The great John Henry beat him BY A NOSE (Henry is one of the best 100 horses of the last centurh according to BloodHorse). He certainly was of Grade 1 caliber in class and strength. I just wonder if any of today's horses would dare to race 16 or 18 furlongs, against ANY horse!! The distances have been whittled down over the last half century to nor more than 10 furlongs. An insult to horse racing. Horses, way back would race 4 miles in three different heats, the winner winning two of the heats. Endurance was cherished. Not any more. The stayers are loved in Europe. Here SPEED is everything. A great history, realm of racing is dead, and it is too bad.
@@brucerobbins6528 It was 145 and I was there. He was 3-5. thirty-five claims were put in for him at $10k and that made him eligible for all the starters.
Our horses don't try to set records; they try to win races. "Ben Jones, Calumet Farms. Feodor didn't have to run any faster than he did. That is obvious. The tracks was wet, he traveled wide much of the race. He was not asked to run fast. He didn't need to. The other horses were not his equal, at least not THAT day. Speed in racing: it is important to have fast speed relative to the other horses involved in the race, to get your nose first cross the wire. To win the race. Not to set records. Absolute time is important for the Guiness Book of Records. And of course, records are made to be broken, which they always are. All of the great Man 'o War's records have been broken. Secretariat's Belmont still stands (on dirt, not on turf). . A perfect 12-clip, 2:24, that is an average of 12 seconds per furlong. The closest is 2:26 by the great Easy Goer, two seconds off. All records BELOW 12f, are faster than the 12 clip. After 12f.,the are slower. The great Swaps holds a record at 1-5/8 miles, a couple of seconds OVER the 12-clip. The longer the race, the more seconds OVER the 12-clip the record is.
Yes. Two miles. They are run today on the continent. The Jockey Club Gold Cup used to be 2 miles, until it was reduced to a mile and a half, then a mile and a quarter. It is unuseal today here in the USA. Stamina and endurance have given way to SPEED.
A sixteenth of a mile is about 41 lengths. But distance is not how winning margins are calculated. Time is used for that purpose. Depending on distance and other factors, a lengths per second is assigned for a race. The time when each horse crosses the wire is recorded and the time separations are then converted to lengths. This is needed because not all horses finish in the same order as when the winner crossed the wire. That's why this horse won by 46 lengths, when it was clearly one sixteenth of a mile ahead (only 41 lengths) at the time it crossed the wire. Even though he had already finished the race, his margin increased because the other horses were running at a slower pace than he was when he crossed the wire.
Yes, this has to be a very slow two mile race. The pace was very slow. Compare this race with the 2 and a quarter mile race that Feodor won by 50 lengths. Feodor was in front most of the race, and to me at least, he was setting a fast pace. From Keniko, a really good horse.
@@emmaleahconnely5367 An 18f race. His jockey raced him around the last turn. He didn't have to gallop quickly. He could have just trotted and still won, not be 50 lengths, but Keniko looked very tired. All the horses finished, none were DNF. A trainer once said: Any horse can run any distance. The variable is SPEED. Feodor's 3:58 was pretty good for a distance that isn't run anymore!!!
I know what you mean about the wide margin of victory. Feodor's breeding on the male side: AP Indy was his grand sire, Seattle Slew and Mr. Prospector were his great grand-grand sires, and Secretariat was one of his great-great grand sires. No wonder he could go a distance!!!
@@duckshaker I agree, but his dam side is also damn good!!! Trempoline, Spectacular Bid, Northern Dancer>Native dancer, Never Bend, Nasrullah, Nearco, Ribot, The Tetrarch (Ire), some wonderful French horses that always helps in the pedigree, Rockefella (no kidding) who can be found in many stayers, Oh, you forgot the great sire, Mineshaft, who has all the other horses in him.
@@duckshaker Looking at Feodor's pedigree to determine why and how, he could do this is interesting. On the sire side some of his sires, like AP Indy, Secretariat, and Seattle Slew, are the same as other horses in the race. He also had Pincequillo and the great Nashua in him. On the dam side, he had a few French horses. The sire of his dam, won the Arc de Trimphe race, Spectacular Bid (who is not seen often in other distance horses), High Bid, a terrific race horse at distances. Those French horses, I think, are the ones that contribure stamina, endurance.
Dude, this horse won a race at Mountaineer by 50!!! I don’t understand how this horse did this TWICE, and it’s not the biggest story in the history or horse racing. Im confused as hell.
Feodor raced at 2 and 3 in Poland on grass. Longest race was 12 furlongs. The race, in 2014, was ridiculous in itself. At that time, horses were not, and are not, trained to race distances like 18 furlongs. Keniko, second, looked extremely tired going around the final turn. He won at 2 miles.
This horse would have been 50 lengths behind Secretariat by just the halfway mark. All these horses were incredibly slow. Never seen a race this slow before.
Nonsense. Secretariat never ran more than 1-5/8 miles. He never ran 16 furlongs or 18 furlongs. Hoses are paced so they have enough to have enough left to win around the far turn. We have no idea what Secretariat would do at 16 furlongs or 18 furlongs. Sheer speculation.
Anyone who actually knows horses can see all of the horses in this race are no match for any of the former great champions. In fact the time was so slow even a good allowance horse would have beaten them. Interesting race to watch but no superstars here. And just FYI this race was more than 19 seconds slower than the time Kelso ran it in the USA. That means this horse would have lost by almost 100 lengths to Kelso. 😊
@@cowboycash1985 Actually, Peat Moss ran in the first two Kelso Handicaps, which were 18f, and are now 8f. He won twice, once in a time of 3:30.4, close to Kelso's record 3:19 and change. It is a Grde II/III race even today. Sometimes you have to look at the absolute time to see how good a horse is!!!!!
Its a waste of time to debate this horse Feodor. He was no great horse period and the pro handicappers agree. He had a few good races and thats it. End of debate. Im am in this business. In his entire career (36 races) he only won 6 times !
Not to be Robbie Downer, it was a nice win...however, to card a 2Mile race at a track like Mahoning is borderline animal cruelty, and I love horse racing and can’t stand PETA. First off, if you scanned the breeding of every horse not named Feodor, you would probably find not one horse truly capable of running a couple feet past a Mile. Second, look at the fractional time of the 1 Mile and a Quarter split...2:15 3/5. Secretariat ran the same distance in 1:59 and change....which would put him approximately 80 lg ahead of the three horses locked in battle at that point in this race. Granted these horses are not Graded stakes caliber, surfaces vary in depth and thus times, and of course, Feodor had to save something for the addition 6f remaining in his race. Like everything in life, you need context to understand what you’re seeing.
I agree with much of what you said. I have been a Feodor far for a long time. Running 18 furlongs in 2014 was unheard of in the USA. But Feodor did it. I have a book that goes back to 1948, the year Citation, my fave, won the TC. The facts of just about every race course in America are in it. So of course, I looked up the times of 18 furlong races. Most, or all, of them were in the 3:5... range. The Amerrican record is 3:47 by Fenelon, whose sire is Sir Gallahad (Fr), and who has a lot of French horses in him. So Feodor's time is not bad with 119 lbs. on his back. The Display Handicapt was last run in 1990 and the last race run at those distances. Racers include horses you never heard of, claimers who had great endurance. Grade III. Terrible. If you want to continue this conversation online, I can be reached at albtruss2000@yahoo.com. I have done a lot of research on stayers and different horses. It is fascinating. Bruce Robbins, have a good day!!!!
