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First vs Second Order Desires (Frankfurt's Volitions) 

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An explanation of Harry Frankfurt's First and Second Order desires including higher order desires generally (also referred to as volitions) and how to distinguish between desires about objects and desires about desires.
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Information for this video gathered from The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, The Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy, The Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy, The Oxford Dictionary of Philosophy and more!

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15 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 23   
@RandomStreak-eo
@RandomStreak-eo 3 года назад
I've always thought of my second (and higher) order desires as evidence of my free will as opposed to just what my body wants to do, but obviously it can be argued that having desires about desires just part of the body/brain and therefore is just part of the illusion of free will. Either way it was pretty interesting to see something I've thought so much about actually have a name. There really is nothing new under the sun lol. Good video!
@ohemgeeitsharis
@ohemgeeitsharis 3 года назад
That's the beauty with desires. You can make a free choice without even having an option. Example: If I lock you into a room that has two doors: one on the left and one on the right, and set the room on fire, what would you do? Obviously you would leave the room through one of the doors. Let's say I lock the door on the right when I also light the room on fire. And let's say you choose to go through the door on the left. You had no knowledge the door on the right was locked. If I asked u after u left the room if u made a free choice you would say yes. Why, because u had a desire to go through the door on the left. Even though the door on the right was locked and u could have never gone through it, u felt like it was a free choice. So even in a predetermined world, one can still have free will as long as their desires line up with their actions.
@opinionate-by-thesyllogist
@opinionate-by-thesyllogist Год назад
@@ohemgeeitsharis No, you had free will only because you thought that the right door was an option
@aaaaaa2362
@aaaaaa2362 3 года назад
I love this kind of stuff!
@lbdeuce
@lbdeuce 3 года назад
Oh, we all know what you love homie...
@Neurost
@Neurost 3 года назад
Great! I’m excited
@CarneadesOfCyrene
@CarneadesOfCyrene 3 года назад
Awesome! :)
@pavlova717
@pavlova717 3 года назад
I came to a similar idea. I wanted to explain how happiness can come from attaining values when values can be destructive. The solution is to say that happiness is the fulfilment of the highest order of values. A drunkard has the value to drink, but if they regret drinking the next day, then they had a higher-order value not to drink. My hypothesis was that there is an ultimate value, eudaimonia, that we may not be of conscious of but is nonetheless entailed in the very activity of living. A hedonist might object by saying that first-order values are more genuine -- a base that makes the notion of happiness even possible. However, it seems there is not a base because valuation is a result of rational thinking, and rational thinking can be done in the smallest or broadest context at any given time. Here I think is where 'desire' is misleading because it implies there is a base, like an animal instinct. Now humans may be born with some animal instinct but the definition of a human is a rational animal. I might argue that values don't begin with animal instincts, but are rather generated from the ultimate value. The language of first and second-order desires can easily confuse because it would seem impossible to have the highest order desire prior to a lower order desire but that seems more a problem for that distinction. I am quite satisfied in thinking that there are values that deal with narrower or broader contexts, and values in the broadest context generate the values in the narrower contexts when rational thinking is applied.
@skepticedge2792
@skepticedge2792 3 года назад
To me it is just a series of causation leading to a motivation for some act or another
@CarneadesOfCyrene
@CarneadesOfCyrene 3 года назад
The question for Frankfurt will be how our desires are different when they are aligned and when they are not, and what that means for free will.
@ErnolDawnbringer
@ErnolDawnbringer 3 года назад
Third order desires sound like guilty pleasure. Or i could be wrong lol. Haven't put much thought into it yet. Too abstract. Gotta sit and think.
@CarneadesOfCyrene
@CarneadesOfCyrene 3 года назад
Haha! I like it!
@thephilosophermma8449
@thephilosophermma8449 3 года назад
Have you created a playlist on Philosophy of Mind videos?
@fluxpistol3608
@fluxpistol3608 3 года назад
Sounds similar to doxastic logic in the sense of a “belief of belief” so are there first order beliefs etc?
@WoodenHorst
@WoodenHorst 3 года назад
I wish all orders of my desires would align ... my transfinite dream come true
@Rebholtz
@Rebholtz 2 года назад
Perfect except you didn't touch the person/wanton distinction
@2222cream
@2222cream 3 года назад
Dont ever stop bro, despite the cringe atheism.
@CarneadesOfCyrene
@CarneadesOfCyrene 3 года назад
Thanks! I'm glad you enjoy for the most part. As a skeptic I doubt everything, God included. Anyone that's not a skeptic disagrees with me on something, so I'm used to it. :)
@ErnolDawnbringer
@ErnolDawnbringer 3 года назад
@@CarneadesOfCyrene given the tremendous concepts, patterns, laws of universe there could verily easily be an intelligent agent behind it's origin. Given that all of this existence to come about require tremendous capability.. So, such an agent wielding tremendous power, it Can very well be God.
@zainabamiri7845
@zainabamiri7845 3 года назад
Great as always May I have your email?
@Dayglodaydreams
@Dayglodaydreams 3 года назад
Someone should tip for Heterophenomenology and the scientific method.
@nadieanonimo7883
@nadieanonimo7883 3 года назад
Second.
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