Don't be mad. I know I'm no weapon balancing guru. I just wanted to throw my 2 cents in. Channels mentioned: Rurikhan - / @rurikhan Caoslayer - / @caoslayer
This is taking into acccount that Rise/Sunbreak Gunlance has been the best iteration of Gunlance in any MH game so far. Blast dash has to stay 100% agree but also the leveling up Shell levels as an endgame upgrade. I must say that Rise/Sunbreak Gunlance finally did click for me after many failed attempts to get into GL since Trii.
i mean, if we are talking in terms of power, comfort, versatility ans so on, rise/sunbreak weapons are the best version of every weapons... gs using a counter hit to dal big damage is cool and everything, but it's basically not gs anymore. predicting a tcs head snipe is not a thing anymore. gs is indeed stronger, more versatile than before, but it lost any identity, would rather go back to when charge wasn't even a thing. similarly, iceborne overdid it with katana mechanics. it went from a simple and accessible weapon that reward clean gameplay with a flow mechanic, to a weapon that dump resources to deal damage and use other moves to build back up ressources. problem is, chargeblade is already a thing and it works much better. i'll stop at that because i could go on for hours on the evolutions of different weapons. so far the two that i can't really think of a bad iteration for are sns and db.
Allow me to draw a very brief comparison between two very fun to use weapon types to better draw the disadvantages and advantages of the Gunlance. Gunlance has: • Tons of prerequisite perks (limiting armor types for maximum perk-by-perk efficiency) • Great burst damage, but fairly precise windows, requiring a decent chunk of knowledge about monster movements and patterns/reactions to certain circumstances. A very steep learning curve that leaves noobs to the ways of the gunlance very scared to approach it. • Very good defensive capabilities, a tankiness and security in your blocks that no other weapon besides Lance can contest. • Sharpness getting destroyed faster than you can say "Great Whetstone Fish Farming" • Big funny Blast Dash. Sword and Shield has: • Freedom to pick whatever armor you'd like as a result of the weapon's extreme versatility in filling many different roles on the battlefield, allowing you to pick the perks and armors that fall into what you're comfortable with. • Consistentcy, more about sustainable damage output rather than DPS or burst damage. As such, it's not the greatest for speed-killing, but has a lot of leeway on your knowledge of monsters and how to best exploit their weaknesses and reactions. Veterans and noobs alike will get great mileage out of the weapon. • Great defensive capabilities, and access to plenty of counter-based moves with an extremely good block-frame/I-frame window. • Reliable sharpness that you'll always be able to keep in tip-top shape so long as you enter the fight prepared. If you're sweating about your sharpness, you might be using a weapon with less than preferable sharpness stats in exchange for great starting damage that quickly falls off after your Sharpness starts depleting. • Metsu Shoryugeki. Funny uppercut goes *SATISFYING HITSTUN* - This post was made by a Sword and Shield main empathizing with the Gunlance Bros. Association for buffing the boomstick.
I really think gunlance should have a guard point after the wide sweep. Animation wise, it already feels like the charge blade spin move, which also has a guard point. After the wide sweep is also one of the most vulnerable simulations while playing gunlance, so it makes sense to implement it. It would also feel amazing, if you could follow up the guard point with a fast and amped wyrmstake.
That sounds amazing, and probably moddable. Already a mod to edit moves. That said, would just be better if Capcom stopped having half their design team still work with stone age design philosophy
Big mood GL has what feels like the largest number of "mandatory" skills you need to squeeze in, it's a good thing endgame armor has multiple lvl4 slots to accommodate but still a pain with how restrictive it can feel in experimenting with builds
The situation with the skill tax has improved but it is still ridiculous. That's why I think loads shells needs a remake of sorts. All of that trouble for 1 extra shel? Not worth it anymore
I really love the effort you put into this video. The voice acting, build-up, humor, and editing quality, all made me stick around to watch a video about a weapon I've never even touched. I'm new to your content. Is she a voice actor? I was really surprised first thinking you ripped the voicelines from some game to match what you're saying, until it got so responsive it even made me think you hired a voice actor for this. Awesome job!
Oh my, such high praise, thank you! Ao is a voice actress and she has worked with me on a few videos. I recommend you check out my video on the Handler if you want more of her voice acting haha 💜
Some ideas for Gunlance: - after a Wyvern Fire, your GL is heated up and all your shells are charged. You lose the ability to charge shells since they now are charged as long as the GL is cooling down. - while cooling down, your raw damage output is increased but your sharpness will wither faster. - Wyvern Fire doesn't require the heat gauge to be empty anymore. Instead, the gauge is split into segments similarly to Velkhana's skill and the segment at which you're positioned at determines your shelling bonus and Wyvern Fire's power. In other words, the more segments you have, the weaker your WF but the stronger your shelling. At max gauge, your shelling output is maximum and you can't WF but that segment is small so you have little time to fully exploit it. Note: The more heat segments you have, the faster you can unleash WF (even if it's damage will be bad). - No nerf to shelling power when the heat gauge is empty. Just regular damage as per normal gameplay. You can charge shells also. For shield options, a counter that unleashes a full burst upward or forward depending on your input. This counter is delivered quickly when triggered successfully. There's also the possibility of a downward bash shell propulsed but that sounds bad from a health perspective; the hunter would break their arm and body. It would have high stun value.
I am a simple man. My blast dash into full burst is all I need. No Artillery. No Load Shells. Only me, my piece, and my armor set that I use for every other weapon I play.
Fully agree. Mained gunlance all the way through World… until I got to Testa who has a 1 shot move the gunlance can’t outrun. That’s the first time I thought maybe it was the weapon instead of me and now in Rise I see it more than ever. The normal LANCE makes the gunlance useless to me… and I came here LOOKING for gunlance. Also the hammer feels really bad too but I can’t tell what they did to ruin it .
Oh man, lots of thoughts on this one. Good vid, fun stuff, always happy with more people talking about the Gunlance. First things first, whenever complaining about Gunlance which I will also do here since I'm a Gunlancer and that's just what we do, I do also think it's essential to mention that power-wise, Gunlance is probably in the best place it's ever been in Sunbreak, which is a feat since it was already in the best place it had ever been in Iceborne, and then it was absolutely terrible in Rise, so I do appreciate the Sunbreak team a lot for what they've given us overall. Having said that, Iceborne still has the best Shell-type identities and I hope to Gog they give good Charged Shells back to Long on future games. Also hoping against hope they make good Elemental Wides without having to sacrifice our Shell Levels and our firstborns. The weapon tree balance is usually one of the biggest problems Gunlance has. Anyway... most of the issues Gunlance still has are Rise Team issues that weren't touched by the Sunbreak Team, which honestly, fair enough, they can't overhaul the entire weapon, and they've given us enough to show that they understand our problems at least to some degree. There are a couple of Sunbreak Team-specific issues I'll wanna talk about later, but let's do Rise Team first. So yeah, what the fuck is Load Shells? It's not enough that we need 3 points in Artillery; that we basically need Guard Up and some Guard and even then that Shields are generally worse defensive tools than no-investment i-frame counters just evading stuff like DB or LS; that our goddamn signature food is stuck on a 90% activation rate; that we have split-damage types where building for shells doesn't help raw and building for raw doesn't help shelling; and on top of ALL OF THAT, for some reason they still thought we weren't paying enough on our budget and HAD to turn Magazine into a 2-level skill? Yeah, I don't get it. Again, this is here since Rise, and by Gog, did we not have any fucking budget in Rise, and our Shells were so gogdamn weak. Now, we do have enough budget to deal with it, and we don't lose THAT much from it, but it's still annoying. You skipped over Wyrmstake but Imma be honest, Wyrmstake is one of my big issues with current Gunlance. And it's compounded by decisions from both teams to make it absolutely terrible. Wyrmstake has been completely relegated to being BB ammo and it's such a shame. Rise gave us the fast Wyrmstake animation which is fantastic, and then locked it behind Charged Shells, which were bad in Rise and made unusable in Sunbreak, or Guard Edge which has just been completely overshadowed by Reverse Blast. The Sunbreak Team chose to not give any relevant buffs to both Charged Shells and Wyrmstake, which were already not particularly strong by the end of Rise, even though I still really liked StakeLancing, and then made them entirely irrelevant with the addition of Erupting Cannon (which I love but it's literally just "better Wyrmstake") and Reverse Blast. So yeah, it's a combination of them being not good in Rise, not improved like the rest of the kit in Sunbreak, and having been given better tools for the same job in Sunbreak. Speaking of Wyrmstake being just BB ammo, BB itself is kinda not particularly good right now in the endgame for Sunbreak and that's a real shame. BB currently has a glitch where you can use it even if you only have a single Wirebug and even with that it's still a loss of dps because it doesn't get any contribution from Raw, just Artillery. It's the problem of having split-damage builds, there's a point where giving up on one of them becomes more efficient, which is why historically our endgame has been mostly Raw-investment SlapLancing. Admittedly, that's not entirely the case in Sunbreak, Fullburst is the only thing still kinda keeping pace, and it's entirely because of Reverse Blast, but it's also a bit sad because that's all we do now. Our 3 Shell Types kinda play the same right now and that's a real fucking shame. Reverse Blast into Fullburst is so good that even Wide wants to do it, regardless of the -10% penalty it gets on Fullbursts. Everyone plays like Normal, and for some reason Long does it the best now. Which is why regardless of us having actually a decent amount of power, and being reasonably competitive with other weapons, specially below the speed-running level which is where most of us play, I'm still really annoyed with what they did to the Shell Type identities which is, again, a Rise Team problem that the Sunbreak Team was just not able to fix with what they were willing to change. As for you 3-point fixes at the end of the video. More Shield Stuff would be cool, Guard Edge could easily become a base kit move. I also think instead of Blast Dash, just having Reverse Blast be the default along with its Shield Bashing component would be entirely fine. And the last point of having Blast Dash not need to be chainable is also fair, a single one would be enough in a slower environment like Iceborne, which I'm still hoping will be the case for the next game. For New Follow-ups, I think keeping the fast Wyrmstake animation and maybe adding it to other combos besides Charged Shell spam would be cool. It's also kinda dumb how we can't do Aerial Fullburst out of neither Blast Dash nor Reverse Blast, nor how we can't do Hail Cutter out of Aerial Fullburst. Hoping to Gog Erupting Cannon stays in some manner, even if it's nerfed and more balanced with Wyrmstake (though Wyrmstake still needs buffs to either usability, damage, or both). I really like how Wide got a unique Wyrmstake, but it's not a well designed one, and I do wish all types had something unique about them if they're gonna go that route. So yeah, I got a lot of issues with current Gunlance, but I also have a lot of praise for the Sunbreak team, the fact we have maximum Shelling Level on the entire tree now is completely unprecedented, and I hope they consider this as reasonable and don't make us wait until the end-game of the end-game to get it like we have to do in Sunbreak with gogdamn lv161 anomalies or whatever. I've generally enjoyed my time with Gunlance in Elgado, I would very much like to bring a lot of the changes we got in Sunbreak with me into an Iceborne-like base for the next game.
In my opinion, EC should just completely replace stakes. It meshes better with the rest of the kit overall. Wyvernfire also needs some love, maybe in a later game without the ability to refresh it so fast they can add in a buff where while it's on cooldown it boosts raw and shell damage?
@@Myrtneough I'd really like them to be complementary. With EC as an Artillery option fixed damage and the capacity for buffing, Wyrmstake could go back to benefitting from Raw and hopefully even the EC buff as well, and be THE damage option, rather than EC being everything at the same time. If we have to keep one or the other, yeah, EC is more interesting in general. But if that was the case, I guess I'd argue it could be the specific Wyrmstake to one of the Shell Types, like the Wide StunStake, it would need some balancing and heck, I probably would give it to Wide and move the StunStake to one of the others, but I do like the idea of 3 different Wyrmstakes on the types to help vary them. And it could even help with balancing, since at any point you can adjust the power of the move individually depending on how the specific Shelling type is faring. I do really like your idea of Wyvern's Fire cooldown taking over the place of Groundsplitter as an active Shelling buffer, not as fond of it also affecting Raw though. WF cooldown is already kinda of an "overheat" mechanic, and though the heat gauge itself should never ever not in a million years return, the idea of powering up our Shells with the excess heat from the Wyvern's Fire is really cool thematically, and it introduces an ebb and flow to our gameplay that can help avoid it getting too samey throughout a hunt.
Firstly, thank you very much for such a detailed comment! Really appreciate you taking the time to break down how you feel. I can't say much besides thanks and that I agree with every point you made. It's like charge blade, when you spend phials you usually get a pretty heavy-hitting move for raw damage. Whereas with GL is only full burst but then you lock yourself into that awful stagger. I am hoping for more mix up and just more fluidity in the weapon because it is such a fun weapon to play!
@@ArcVTuber Always glad to discuss Gunlance with peeps, it's really good to see the community grow, and it can only be attributed to content creators like Ruri and Caoslayer, and glad to have you now here too, the more the better, both to strengthen us, and to give a wider variety of opinions. I do have one extra tip to give regarding the recovery frames on Fullburst and Sweep, which yeah, are needlessly long and even Reverse Blast has to wait for them to finish before giving i-frames which compounds on them feeling clunky: Wyvern's Fire is an animation cancel for them and IMMEDIATELY puts up the Guard Point! I've been saying this on reddit for a while now but Wyvern's Fire is not a damage move right now, it's a loss of dps compared to RB>FB loop spam, but IT IS a fantastic defensive move that comes out faster than anything else out of our highest stagger moves, and the one reason I keep Hail Cutter on my second scroll, so WF is always available as a pinch save. (main scroll is Groundsplitter since it's the only thing that buffs the RB>FB loop). Doesn't fix variety of combos, which yeah, we do need, but it helps a bit with fluidity, gives us a different option at times.
This iteration of Gunlance is so amazing, like I just started on Rise and I didn't struggle at all, just waiting on the Sunbreak update now. But yeah Blast dash I definitely want to be a permanent addition.
Im happy with what the gunlance is in TU3. Needs Load Shells and Artillery still, but if focusing on shelling then crit skills arent as needed, which is what ultimately balances it out... Somewhat. And it is one of the most fun movesets, which makes up for not being on top of speedrun tier lists.
Never touched the Gunlance, HH/HBG main here, but hearing the problems reminds me of the issues I have with HH in RISE to the point I just don't want to touch the horns. Seriously hope they give y'all some love later on.
I agree with point 3 a LOT, also agree that something needs to be done about shelling and agree with point 1 somewhat. However I don't agree with point 2, I like the big staggers, having to find openings to pull of your big damage moves and when the opening isn't too big I enjoy the second to second decision making of "do I swipe and reload or do I have to move?".
You know, I remember a manga for monster hunter that had a character that used the gunlance and it was like an actual gun if anyone remembers this please post it below i would LOVE to read it again. Something about a "Wind" element dragon that wasn't Kushala Daora
GL's major issue in Rise is not how it plays, but just how fucked its skilling is. Most of the skills that you NEED are 2slots, and Load Shells & Guard Up becoming multi-level skills (in World, they were each a single level) is just unneccessary. The weapon itself plays like a dream, outside of some minor quibbles (eg WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO CANCEL THE END OF PRETTY MUCH EVERY ATTACK ANIMATION INTO SHIELD OR BACKHOP ffs, keep your fuckin guard points WE DON'T NEED EM; also I guess being able to more quickly cancel between shielding & hopping animations in general; the blocking for certain moves being more reliable when being done out of actively guarding [here's looking at you Guard Reload]; Wyrmstake being re-nerfed to the ground after the first Switch update; and Wide's new & unique niches not being good enough to use). Right now, it's easy to stick to the monster like glue & constantly shit out a consistent amount of damage. It's WAYYYY better than "just enough to be playable," at this point; it's more than capable of keeping up with the rest of the pack now. Not saying that some reasonable buffs wouldn't be nice, but yeah, GL is nowhere near as bad as this video is making. If this current version got just a handful of small tweaks, it'd be perfect. Re: wishlist, I don't think the shield needs to be anything but more reliable, maybe find a way to permanently work RBD into the kit as well as BD. Guard Edge also feels like something that would be worthwhile keeping going forward, at least in some capacity. As it is, the shield generally takes too long to bring up to be anything but a turtling tool, and the transitions between moves using the shield NOT having block frames is absolutely idiotic (hi again, Guard Reload). I mostly agree with what you're saying with "new follow-ups," think that's pretty much what I meant by cancelling the end of attack animations into backhops or shields, everything takes WAY TOO FREAKING LONG before it allows another input; I can't count the number of times that if my character would react even a millisecond faster, I would have been able to defend against an attack. Also the casual weaving in of Eminem is when I subbed.
I'm fine with the GL moveset right now, however there are definitely some build diversity issues. I wish shelling level was just not a thing or not that impactful, also wish like you that we didn't need to invest in so many skills to make the weapon work properly. Also wish that elemental GL was a thing, idk maybe make shells able to do water damages lol
But monsters die so fast either way. Yeah it's not as strong as other weapons but at this point monsters die so quick that i feel like it didn't matter.
It's more of an observation list for the game and such. Sunbreak has the best gunlance yet. My channel isn't "serious" but I just wanted to have a tiny rant with some comedy mixed in
@@ArcVTuber nah i feel you. I had a similar issue at first. I felt like why do I have to min max sooo much to get on par with the clear times with some of the more powerful weapons with sooo much less competency that i have with them to be comparable? But then it just clicked like boy these monsters die in 10 min or so. It's so fast already that I'm just going to swallow it. And you are right this is probably the most fun gunlance has ever been and that's good enough for me. But I will say Icebornes chill AF shelling only desperately needs to come back. Yeah charged shell only play style is too unoptimal that i wish they would address.
Sorry, but Blast Dash stays on during smex! Capcom, will probably keep the move in MH6 ... I hope , because goddamn does the weapon needs the mobility... And DAYUM HINOA GOT SOME SICK BURNS SHEEESH
My favorite defective thing about Gunlance is how you have a weapon that consumes a fuckton of sharpness doesn't have the benefits of weapons that usually consume a lot of sharpness: number of (blade) hits in combos. Like yes SnS, DB, IG and even LS consumes a decent amount of sharpness, but that means that elemental and status are better on these weapons. Gunlance sucks ass at dealing elemental damage, and isn't particularly better than Lance at proccing status. You have a weapon that has true damage on its attacks but such attacks don't scale with raw, when Charge Blade does the same thing but actually scales and isn't a problem. You have several attacks that have very little purpose because of how slow and non rewarding they are.
Desperately needs a level up shells mechanic and way too much skill tax for a weapon trying to be two things at once. It suffers trying to be another tank imo. If weapons get redesigned next game I hope they dump the shield so you can fully live the blast poke/slash dream. Movement speed would be increased but not too much to keep Blast dash as one of your main movement/offense tech.
As a Switch axe user, I feel blessed with the switch skills, but I still felt the absolute agony that is watching longsword users get buff after buff while greatsworss look around like, hey did you forget something?
I have to more problem with the shell : 1) unlike CB or bowguns sticky ammo, the damage of the shell DO NOT increase with raw damage And honestly juste WHY CB can even stun a Monster ! Just like a hammer but with a badass attak! Why capcom, WHY 2) the shell are not elemental Well in fact yes the shell a VERY LITTLE amount of fire element but ...comparaed to CB again or every other weapon it's shit Plz elemental gunlance be a thing one day PLZ Oh yeah and ground splitter The effect is lose when u rengain Why we must suffer this way?
I started using Gunlance from seeing a funny clip of someone Blast Dashing from the top ropes into a final hit to fell a monster. It has become a drug to hit hard and with fancy moves.
Ya know I have a friend that has mained gunlance in every game he's played, and in rise I decided to finally pick up the weapon. Now I'm a swag axe main and that will never change, but, my god gunlance is fun. learning gunlance has been some of the most fun i I've had In monster hunter, you are correct, this thing needs more love, shelling lvl 8 helped its damage and is now a solid weapon. But a smoother experience would help the player base for this weapon a lot. Just don't fuck up the move set like with what they did to huntinghorn, I hate new huntinghorn.
I'm a lancer and gunlancer I love doing 3 damage per poke and take 1 hp damage per nova I laugh at you lbg and longsword try hards not buffing and dying in the first 30 seconds of the hunt while use my sick lance skills to block counter and poke any monster slowly to death while you rush back on your max damage optimized palamute only to die when the monster charges at me while you are hiding behind for some reason taking away 2 carts and rage quitting leaving my and my thick kebab stick alone in the face of the most fearsome creatures the world has ever seen. Yeah I'm still salty about that one quest.
Make the GunLance noob friendly, just like the POPULAR NOOB FRIENDLY Long Sword, Swd n Shld, Transformer Long Sword, Transformer SnS and Jump Spammer Stick.
This... feels like a non-issue. Speaking as someone who went into gunlance the second he got into MHW and is now doing the same with Rise, Load Shells feels FAR from necessary, just spec into Artillery and Bombadier and use a Normal or Long shell GL. As for the other stuff: - Blast Dash should indeed stay. - while it would be nice for the shield to have more stuff to do, I don't see what it could do that the gunlance itself doesn't already do. If we're keeping Blast Dash for mobility I can take the shield being just a shield. - this might just be my personal playstyle talking, but I feel the recovery time is a good size, makes you think more about when you're committing to a combo.
I played gunlance regularly (secondary weapon, I'd say) in MH3, 99% of that being full burst into wyrmstake combo and never doing anything else (aside of the occasional wyvernfire). In Rise, I started doing that but eventually dropped the weapon because, without the skills required to -remember blast dash exists- use blast dash, I spent more time running after monsters than actually attacking them. It doesn't help that the one good combo leaves you vulnerable for half an hour after it ends, or after half of its steps for that matter (can't transition into guard reload after full burst? Seriously?), and takes forever even if you don't get interrupted. There's only one viable build (artillery-load shells-protective polish-speed sharpening-whatever attack boosts fit to spam full burst) unless you're a dodging god who can dance around monsters while poking them with long shelling (in which case you can remove load shells but must add evade extender, nothing else changes). As a Lance main I feel like the GL's shield is just a brick wall you can kind of hide behind for 80% of the battle because there's just no window for your Dragon Ball Z combo ("Will Full Burst be interrupted? You will find out in the next episode!"), while my main weapon has an actual shield I can use to block, bash, slam, counter and charge with. I don't want the gunlance to be a lance with shells, but at least some way of transitioning from full burst or wyrmstake into a blocking shield attack would be a saving grace. And yeah, make Artillery have no effect on shells (except wyvernfire, which is more niche anyway), and add the Artillery buff to baseline shells and wyrmstake (and that swap variant I barely remember exists). Also, make long shells actually long to give other playstyle options. I think Load Shells is fine as it is, or rather it would be at that point, because long style doesn't need it (it's just that long style is bad right now). Though as I read other comments, I realise my understanding of gunlance is a bit too limited (I have no idea what half the wirebug or swap skills are or how to use them, which may be why I struggle so much).
I don't think you should best yourself over "not knowing enough". There's plenty of great thoughts here! For starters, since I also play lance I have to agree that I still want both weapons to be separated, not just the same but with explosions. The main problem you addressed is the fact that gunlance has decent moves, but they can't be chained at all or very poorly. That's what needs fixing right now.
how to fix gunlance, fix the forward lunge attack also the heat gauge wasn't that bad... if they didn't nerf the weapon and kept it the same as 4u but now with heat it'd be pretty good. heck if they balanced it to world which changed alot of stuff about every weapon anyways it'd have been accepted more easily.
This is why I actually like gunlance. Not a weapon you can swap to and easily use it without any previous experience. It’s damage is kind of lackluster though.
Yes and fix the lance too.. the guy that though making the slap the best move on the THRUSTING weapon and made those expansion moves should be shoot into the sun Also I made a mod for myself where the shells damage scale a bit with raw attack. With the long shells getting the most out of it. So a full slap build still get better shelling. Also yeah the balancing of weapons is just abysmal the difference between the good weapons and the bad ones is Soo big.
the moveset is actually fine, and I only hope blast dash stays if they keep up this shitty version of monhun Rise has created in the future, but if it goes back to being an actual slow and methodical game again, GL wont need bd in the slightest. one huge step to making GL better would be making shells inherit elemental types, that'd be huge. also for improving the moveset, we dont need anything new, we just need to make every shelling attack have a purose with the different shelling types, because right now, basic/charged shelling is useless on normal so you only have one linear combo, full burst is useless on wide so all you have is the poke combo, and long is primarily good for wyrmstake, although its been buffed to be good with full burst too so there's a start. also rename "normal" shelling to "rapid" for the love of fucking god. so here's some ideas to fix the moveset predicament: for rapid, have repeat normal shelling speed up per shell, like valor in GU. for wide, make full burst have a really short animation, since it's less shells. for long, add the ability to charge full bursts so long can be the charged shelling king. those handful of changes would only add to the existing playstyles without taking anything away. in addition to inherited element, we'd be in a good boat. referring to skills like artillery and load shells, I think they should be entirely removed honestly. maybe keep arty, but load shells only serves to waste the players slots, and arty is blring so maybe we can instead replace it with something that increases shelling damage when certain conditions are met. but if we're going to be removing skills that are dead simple "this only serves to buff your weapon" type skills, we might as well clear out half the skills roster, because most of them are pointless or detrimental to the game experience
You do bring up some good points. I e joy your revamp idea on shelling types but I don't think Load Shells should be fully removed. Rather it should be buffed, revamped or truly removed of they never change it
Gl need so buff, gl feel like cheap imitation HBG with shield mod, HELL even HBG spread/pierce use 5 guard, 3 guard up, and 3 embolden + 3 MoH roll augment hbg can still deal super massive damage while shrugging monster attack as long you don't greedy to keep firing Funny thing i rolling 2 powder mantel on hbg armor and it damn increase total damage to monster, i check it with Hunter pie
I never tried gunlance after mhu4, hearing your build problems seem like what I hate with bowguns in rise which makes me like world implementation way more. Like why I have to put so many useless 1 gems to make deviation and recoil playable. In world it was mods and within a weapon unique thing, here it's wasting space and still a must have. Tho I'd sure givd you that bowgun is at least op with all that so it's managed. I feel sorry for gunlance nkt being such a good weapon despite being so cool in design. I sure loved it in mhu4
Honestly, I think Title Update 3 really made gunlance amazing. And about movement, Reverse Blast Dash not only puts you far from danger, it also has i-frames at the start. And with qurious crafting, slotting in artillery and load shells isn't such a big deal anymore. Hell you can even roll for artillery if you really want to.
That is true, and I do agree. But it leaves problems related to the long staggers and lack of fluidity to be discussed. Reverse BD is great and the new end game system does save you some hassle, I agree. But the problem of the hassle being there with load shells is what gets me. Its like having skills that increase your total bowgun ammo rather than it just being dependent on the ammo type, you feel me?
@@ArcVTuber i think you got a point here, but a total weapon overhaul as proposed in the video will do more harm that good, at the end of the day a weapon that can use a shield so easily should no be doing tons of damage, unless is counter damage and that is a different weapon
@@wakyuubi A reminder that the heavy bowgun and Greatsword exist. As a CB user myself, you want to talk about shields being strong? Our default skill in Rise is a Free, Max level shield, that can interrupt any combo completely safely. If we use it correctly, it fills our phials, and can be immediately followed up by UAED. Shields in general aren't quite as good as they seem, especially if you don't use slots to bulk up. Mobility is king, especially in Rise.
@@wakyuubi You remember that you can literally block with a Greatsword right? It's a better block than sword and shield gets 😅 Not that it actually gets used, the counter is way better, but that's the point. The available counters in rise are all fantastic, and it's generally safer to use a counter, (or invulnerable skill like switch axe's spin), than it is to actually block. I'm not saying that shields aren't a benefit. My point is that currently, all the weapons have access good defensive options. If skillful game play equals damage output: shouldn't every weapon, if played well, be comparable? Not everyone is, or ever will be, good at games. Is it fair to make them suffer through tediously long hunts, because they chose a "safer" weapon? I don't believe so. Regardless... As long as people are enjoying themselves, that's what's most important.
As a Lancer, I feel your pain (they keep giving better weapons our guard counter, why do they hate us). It’s rough down in the under 3% play rate club.
At the very least it does make you feel pretty goat'ed when you play with some randoms and stomp a monster with lance or another rarely used weapon. I had that happen pre-sunbreak with fights like Apex Mitzu and people would legit stop to stare at me while I insta-guarded everything. The damage was never good, but I almost never had to sheathe to recover.
@@hennyzhi2261 That's the trade-off for (on paper) the strongest defense in the game. Granted, the other problem with Lance is that it's nowhere as flashy as other weapons, which leads a lot of people to consider it boring as a result.
@@TornaitSuperBird That's also true and it makes me really hate how stale it was presented in both it's base Rise trailer and Sunbreak trailer. And I get that's probably the last thing they do in development and they grab people quickly to get footage... but I think it would help the game more if they reached out to really good players for footage to help make their trailers because a big draw of the game is the 14 weapon types. I'm not even implying that would be me for lance but there are so many better, more consistent players like Techlancer who could showcase how cool the weapon can be if your good (rather than that lame crawling thing they do every time). Part of the reason why Hunting Horn was heavily shunned in World was because the tutorial videos told many new hunters it was a "support weapon" and it got pegged unfairly into a corner. Now lance is BiG sHiEld, slow poky stick that sometimes does a meme charge attack.
@@hennyzhi2261 The funny thing is that the fifteen-second ads/tv trailers they had for Sunbreak actually showcased someone dunking Rathalos with a Skyward Thrust. Wish they showcased the move against any monster other than Barroth (a monster with terrible hitzones on the head). Lance isn't going to be more popular unless the weapon gets a massive rework that basically guts it completely out. It's mainly the flashiness of the weapon- lancers trade super flashy flips and spins for precision and utility, especially with Insta-Block being the most versatile counter in the game with how many moves you can branch out into. You also don't even need to use a wirebug for it, like Iai Spirit Slash for Long Sword.
I think GL and Lance should be good at blocking from the start...when I have to put guard +5 or guard up into it...i could block with any other weapon too. Lance and GL should have block +3 from the very beginning. You have to put so many skills into it that its harder to fit the "usual" damage skills as well.
@@ArcVTuberT H I S Honestly the way I play the gunlance as a defensive wall is fun and all. But I pretty much have to put ALL of my skills into guard and guard up, not to mention evade extender. And after ALL of that work… Longsword is still safer than gunlance cause you can pretty much just counter anytime.
While i agree that blast dash should be a permanent addition to GL, home consoles team didn't focus too much on fast paced combat that portable MH games have. Switch skills or silkbinds they are exclusive to portable games. I hope they implement blast dash into MH6 as it's so much fun and adds a mobility option to Gunlance that suffered the most compared to other weapons. I wouldn't call SunBreak GL the absolute best, but it's the best it has ever been and hopefully developers work to refine the weapon furthermore from here.
100% agree on the shield needing some love. It's a strong tool and I love guard reload, but it does just feel rather tacked on compared to the other shield weapons that incorporate it into their kits.
You know what I think gunlance needs? Guardpoints. Which can transition into either a quick reload or a wyrmstake, because hell wyrmstake is so underused right now it could be taken out of the moveset and most wouldn't care. Maybe its a horrible idea but gunlance shield really is just a lance shield but without all the bling so it just ends up being completely an afterthought. Or maybe they can make it into a gun as well? Honestly at this point I feel like gunlance would benefit from just not having a shield and just 2 handing the thing.
@@alephkasai9384 that's exactly what I was about to say. We need a spear in this game bro. Gunlance can easily do that, since the shield serves no purpose practically. And by removing the block, you can instead have an aim feature to have it be an ACTUAL gun, with just hard hitting big shells without any variation so it's not Bowgun with melee capability.
@@alephkasai9384 I got an idea Wyvernfire counter Enter counter stance, get hit, immediately counter with frame 1 wyvernfire that knocks you back away from the monster a good distance Further blocking and shelling reduces cooldown time for wyvernfire, but blocking and shelling while wyvernfire’s ready will increase its damage by a % amount up to 50% There, Gunlance is good now, as it always should have been.
I'd add another wish in there: Make shells (Or at the very least, the wyrmsteak cannon) able to inflict elemental/status damage, even if in the next game you'd need Free Element for it.
I always describe watching my Coaslayer and Rurikhan videos as "doing my homework". Almost no other weapon has channels dedicated to them that way. Haha. Good video Arc!
every weapon has a channel dedicated to it...unfortunately, the channels "dedicated" to GL are run by the two biggest whiners in the entire MH community who take every chance they get to downplay and shit on their own main weapon!
The complaint about the shield is for real. In 4U they gave a bunch of guard point options to CB while they forgot the supposed shield weapons aka Lance & Gunlance. In 5th gen they realized that, and made Lance a proper counterattack option. But they somehow forgot to give the same treatment to Gunlance
"Okay I only get to use this extremely damaging move once every two minutes so I best make it count." Charge Blade: UED's every few seconds Longsword: Spirit Helmbreaker spam
Arc - complaining about not having enough combos, following stuff in Sunbreak while having the potential of many playstyles Arksor - still in Iceborn with only melee dodge style, full burst, stab-boom, piou piou style That’s why I’m the better Ark 😎
More moves that quickly and fluidly reload your shells. CH and bowguns have special moves outside of the default reload. Oh and bring back Wyrmstake Blast. I loved planting that on a monster and more shell damage.
I am fine with longer recovery animations as they added new skill called redirection,which lets you get out of attacks really fast plus recovers your wirebug but... the issue being 1. That's another 2 level of skills that you need to add to your build. 2. That it has activation window same as insta block for lance(which is difficult since you have to press 3 buttons to skill swap compared to 1 button for lance). 3. You get repositioned by the evade that redirection does after activating which ultimately forces you to use RBD to get back to monster and hit them and lastly... after all of this hassle you do such less damage. Weapons with longer recovery animation like GS and CB tend to also do massive amounts of damage, whereas with GL you can get tired of this playstyle physically as it requires soo many button inputs and still do the least amount of dps compared to other weapons,its really a shame that the weapon damage is so low and having to use ground splitter every few seconds which wastes even more time just to maintain some sort of damage is just pitiful. The weapon is still soo much fun to play with but I'll be honest,while doing anomaly investigations of higher level,when the hunts start taking 15-20 mins with GL compared to 8-10 mins with other weapons,its hard to find a reason to play GL
Agreed. Again, the weapon is fun and I don't really have a problem with the damage. My problem is the maintenance required. Gameplay wise it's incredibly fun but look at the breakdown you just gave. It proves a point.
u can use lv1 redirect to stay in one place. also u can use bottom right menu for 1 button redirect use (it will also actually use redirect instead of other swings/moves. with DBs it can start blade dance if u will press 3buttons mid combo for scroll swap... with menu trick it never happens)
@@Zamoxino the thing with redirection only one lvl is that you get stunned pretty fast(remember it hyper armors through attacks and you still take 30% of the damage compared to redirection lvl 2 which completely negates the damage)and for that you gotta invest in 3 levels of stun resist. Also about the menu skill swap,i don't use it because i swapped the how item bar and action bar work,so now i go through items same as world with just dpad and i'd have to press L1+Y for the menu skill swap to work now,which also won't allow me to move my camera because L1 also opens up radial menu. but either way i don't really find all of these things that tedious,its just going through soo much stuff and having to do that for 15+ mins perfectly in higher anomaly hunts does tire out. That's just how i enjoy the weapon though,it can be played in many different ways which is why i love it even more.
@@AshR0X u already have very good superarmor in bullet barrage if im not wrong, wont it get affected by stun as well? if yes then it just seems to be worth af to go for stun res anyway. also i have other main comment here somewhere and i know one very good GL player that did insane damage with GL even if i myself am speedrun tier player with DBs. i bet my %%% that most of you are missing some kind of critical information about GL playstyle just like ppl were sleeping on IG drill tech with slow kinsects in iceborne sadly im keyboard and mouse only player so no idea if i could find other tech for 1 button redirection. ah and there is food for healing with redirection anyway and it should be good enough even at last food slot. redirect counters absorb a lot of damage and of course u dont need to always use it anwyay... after all you have other defensive moves on GL
I'm still waiting for a Gun-Hammer. like the one Hammer we got in MH3U but with an actual Shell mechanic with the option to fire all shells at once on hit for big damage.
Gunlance is my favorite weapon in Monster Hunter ever since I played MH Freedom Unite. My second favorite is the switch axe. I love the amount of mobility options the gunlance has now, like the Blast Dash, and the Full Burst move, I think the one that lets you rocket forward and unleash absolutely everything you have in your gunlance at once; all shells, stakes, and wyvern fire, all at once. I can deal with everything, even having to put on your own artillery and load shells skills, that's fine whatever, makes for more customization if you want. I think they just need to implement an easier way to upgrade the shell levels to increase damage, or, have load shells with extra levels so you can add more shells for more damage. The Qurious Crafting system is great for end game but it's just extremely time-consuming material grind for leveling up shells that can only be done once and isn't a huge damage increase to make the gunlance super-worth using.
They are addressing it in the end game but it takes ages to grind man and it beats the fun out of it...but yeah we can always hold out hope in the monster hunter team
The core problem with Gunlance is that shelling damage is designed to ignore hitzones. At first glance it may look like an advantage, and it actually is during the early and mid sections of most MH games, where Gunlance actually shines quite a bit. However, once you reach the endgame and start optimizing your sets, that's when Gunlance falls apart because shelling damage is very limited and there are very few ways to increase it, in comparison to most other weapons
4:23 im still gonna remind you that the longsword main damage kick and go up (I don't remember the name lol) got nerfed, and in a way is not like longsword is op the thing is that everyone use it because is cool xd there are alot of op weapons and longsword is mid on that list (Im looking at you bowgun users) But the only problem what you are saying is going to make it a better lance, sooo the lance is going to be in a way usseles the gunlance is like a risky one but has in a way defensive capabilities but at the same time no, they need the upgrade the stagger on the shield of gunlance in that im 100% in.
as a GL main, honestly, I don't think that's really a problem, maybe compared to other weapons, a slight increase in damage wouldn't hurt, that's maybe because I'm not really into speedrunning or something. I wouldn't complain about the current GL, the weapon has never been as strong/fun as it is now, I'm more scared if capcom decides to give the Gun Lance the Hunting Horn treatment, all about dps, and remove most things that make the weapon unique.
If they keep the stagger at least they can give the i-frames back. When gunlance was introduced in MH2 you have i-frames after every shell and after Wyvern Fire. You were able to charge wyvern fire and use the i-frames of the knockback to dodge even a Plesioth hip check or if you have timing poke shell a rathian and use te shot s to dodge her fireballs
The biggest issue is skill tax. Want decent damage? Artillery + Load Shells only buffs half your kit. Want to hit the monster EVER? Max Evade Extender or Blast Dash required. Want to use the shield for Guard Reload or Wyvernfire? Say hello to BOTH guard skills! Other weapons like GS function right out the gate and don't have any extra management. GL needs a dozen skill points just to have a half decent time (leaving less for comfort / DPS) and then you still have THREE different ammo types to manage on top of the usual sharpness and wirebugs. Hella fun but it just feels bad...
Since gunlance is kind of like an offensive counterpart to the lance, it would be nice to see it get a guard stance that gives you offensive guard when hit (like how lance has its stance that gives guard up).
Okay Arc, completely unrelated, but your sibling that likes to go by the name of Ceruledge Is currently in pokemon Violet and wants to check in on you. XD Honestly, good video. I hope it gets at least some of the attention it deserves.
One thing that kinda bothers me is that the wyrmstake is incredibly weak in Rise. In Iceborne, the late game wyrmstakes hit hard, they really mattered as a combo finisher that's hard to pull off unless you use them on a good opening, maybe after one or two full bursts in a combo. In Sunbreak I can just... hit the fullburst again, the damage is simply better. With sneak attack, it's actually not even close anymore. Use wyrmstake on the mecha tetranadon's head and you'll get roughly the same damage as you would from a full burst, and that thing has a hitzone of 100. That's with a 330 raw gunlance and attack boost 7. Level 8 shelling without sneak attack is just as strong since you can add the slam and still be around as quick if not faster that way. No way wyrmstake can be that weak, it's a move I rarely get to use anyway unless I utilize the wirebug counter. But then again, I can just use the i-frames on the reverse blast dash for a quicker slam into fullburst (minus one shell from the reverse blast dash) and actually do more damage in far less time plus reposition at the same time, AND SOMEHOW reverse blast dash has a far lower cooldown despite being both better AND less fun to use than actually throwing out a wyrmstake Dxxxxxx WHY
HIT THE NAIL ON THE FUCKING HEAD. I only use erupting cannon since it's fast and buffs you. Haven't used regular wyrmstake in ages cause it doesn't live up to Iceborne. Hard agree on the counter cause I would love to use it but it has higher cooldown, lower dmg and less utility.
If theres one thing i love about GU gunlance is the heatgauge... Ok for real this time valor guard reload and rapid fire shells are so much fun i know the damage is kinda bad but so so enjoyable
It's funny that you mentioned charge blade having max phials for Rise because in MHW you need capacity boost to get your sixth phial. I haven't played enough Rise so this makes me think they removed the sixth phial from CB entirely which if that's true that sucks for CB
Gunlance is also way to determined by the gun half in my opinion. if your shelling isnt Lv8(the max in this game) it feels a sub par choice. yet by default the game has 3 Lv8 normal, 2 Lv8 wide(why Seething bazels isnt 8 astounds me tbh) and 1 Lv8 Long. it also boggles me why no GLs added in TUs had a default Lv8. all were Lv7. Yes in TU3 they gave them their own augment to increase thier level but that to me shows the weapon is flawed that thats even needed. Also I despise Load shells cos Lv1 only works on Bows/Bowguns while Lv2 only works on GL/CB. its a poor design of a skill. i would make it either the capacity jewel from late Icebourne again. 1 level adds 1 shell/phial to GL/CBs or rework Lv1 Load Shells to only work with GL/CB. Example: Lv1 would make reload a bit faster on GL and lv2 still adds the extra shell. for CB it would be the current Lv2 effect now at Lv1 and Lv2 is the extra Phial. I've been thinking having the shelling damage tied to the weapon rarity like the rest of a weapons stats could fix the imbalance of viable gunlances. again before those augments your choice of Lv8 Gunlances is 6 out of the couple dozen available to make and use.
GunLance inspiration: A rifle with a bayonet, with shield. Real life exaggerated. Transformer Long Sword and SnS. God Eater + Transformers... Wft. Jumping spamming stick: Men of culture will know about pole jumping female sports.
I really feel this as well. I main Insect Glaive and second Hammer and I feel disappointed everytime I hear about Rise because of how awful the weapon balancing is. Glaive and Hammer was really fun and enjoyable for me in World and Generations ultimate. I quit Rise early into sunbreak because spamming the same move to not make my hunt last an hour or having to learn a whole new weapon with mechanics I don't enjoy isn't at all fun or even worth dealing with. Overall, It just feels awful and unfair to see the hyped weapons get more and more while the other weapons get less and less.
