One of the my biggest gripes was how much they hyped up functional convertible tops, and then only having a small handful being actually available. Still no convertible MX5, Z4, MB SLK, etc.
Ironically, NFS Rivals had functional convertibles, but they weren't mentioned in any marketing or advertisements at all. Still, Rivals had the same gripe as Forza: hyping up undercover units that is just a regular police unit with radar stealth, solid paint, and worst durability.
The way I see it, what we need is a shitload of Wagons. I wish i could drive around in an Impreza Wagon from every generation of the Impreza that has one, or any of the BMWs and Mercs. Alfa Romeo would be so cool too, if they ever decide to bring it back.
I can justify Unbound having fewer cars than Most Wanted 2012 because Unbound has FAR more customization options. I just hope they add more cars in the future
@@dan44zzt231 Toyota, as well as being *very* Expensive to License, it appears also, possibly, that they do not want to be in Games that Contain Cop Chases either anymore (if you look at the Games they have come back to, some do indeed have Street Racing in them, but *none* have Cop Chases!) and given EA broke a *Massive* "Using the N Word" Level, Societal Taboo in terms of Japanese Culture with that "Pfft, Nerds" Rubbish, (Insults, even made in Jest, are Equivalent to using the *N Word* in Japanese Culture! a *massive* Taboo!) , I would not be surprised if Toyota even blacklists EA.
It felt like back then you got a complete game and a few dlc packs to spice things up now you get a half completed game and it’s finished over a period of time
Thank you moses, for a time i couldnt quite put my frustration into words but you did just that. Its so sad to see the lack of effort from them recently.
Couldn't say it better about GT7. I put blind faith in Polyphony magic and now my 25th anniversary steel book serves as a hollow reminder that even your heros could give less of a shit. I think the worse offender is they added a weather radar that works for like what, a 1/3 of the maps because they couldnt be arsed to program rain? Like you're telling me it wouldnt rain in a boreal-ass Deep Forest Raceway? What a joke.
What I have noticed is that Forza Motorsport 7 was the last game of the paid dlc era. I am not sure how much of an impact it had, but it is worth noting the the game was a disaster for turn10 compared to what they were used to. To those of you who still own it, go back and try it now as the bugs are pretty minor now and it is awesome. More importantly, because of the bugs and the paid DLC, I don’t think people were willing to go back to it. Subsequently I wonder if Motorsport 7 was the catalyst for free updates in horizon 4 and 5
Thanks for giving this some attention, FH seems to get away with it more than any franchise out there. But people had the chance to make noise about this 4 years ago when it arrived in FH4 and not enough did so it's no surprise it's carried on into the next title, changing to live service hasn't been a good thing for any AAA series to date and FH is no exception.
FH5 is the perfect example of developers being forced to work on something they do not like and/or are tired of. Ever watched their streams? That's the vibe I am getting from that.
I think i can say for the high majority that we liked post launch DLC's It was the norm for us to pay a few quid for a small selection of newly added cars to the games. As much as everyone likes free content and not saying that game studios should scrap the ideas away, but we'd be more than happy to purchase DLC's again as long as all the content is new to the franchise. Forza Horizon 3 is a perfect example because we were able to get access to monthly DLC's of new additions to the game, the Forzathon segment was born and after every update there were 1 or 2 free additions to earn through the selected weeks
I dont like paid DLCs much, and now with the battle passes ir got even worst I prefer the free system, at least I don't need to pay a trying beyond what I had paid for at start, they only need adjust this mess
I think there is a potential for expansion 2 to come with a lot of new content, hopefully that may explain the lack of content in the before months while it was being worked on.
I wouldn't count on it, considering that Playground is currently in the middle of development on Horizon 6 (which will run on a new engine), it just may be the case that FH5 was doomed from the start - a rushed "last hoorah" for the 8th console generation, with most resources being pulled to FM8 and FH6 immediately after release. Would explain the recycled theme for the first expansion (less time spent in pre-production), the lack of new-to-forza vehicles, and the fact that it feels like 95% of the budget went to the map instead of actually pushing the game forward gameplay-wise
I fully expect Expansion 2 to just be Lego Valley, with the same Lego Cars as FH4, just with some Hastily (and Badly) "Mexicanized" Scenery added here and there where the UK assets do not match. Nothing More. I just Hope I am wrong.
@@tugzzcouncil485 Yup, 10 Years to build an astonishing reputation, all to be Destroyed in just a Year. This is what happens when you hand a AAA Franchise to a "B-Team" (as the "A Tream" at Playground are doing Fable) Instead of another, well established, Racing Game Studio, or just keep the Previous Game going even longer until the A-Team is done with its current Project. The Reputation of the Developer and the Game goes straight down the old Porcelain Tunnel. What a Tragedy.
After watching your videos and bought Forza Motorsport 4 and enjoy it so much; I'm getting so nervous to find a used copy of Forza Horizon 1 for my Xbox 360 and in Italy is little bit difficult. And I hope in future with my Xbox series S to play at least FH2 and FH3 when Microsoft and Playground will understand that good wine can be good also after some decade (sometimes even better than new ones). Continue with your videos, they are amazing!
9:35 Me and Forza Horizon 1... nearly every year I return to play through the game again. By FAR the best Horizon game imo, and the point where I think they best understood what Horizon was and represented. 3 cranked it up, 4 was still fun, 5 was... WTF? I still try to go back and give 5 a chance but it NEVER pulls me back in. Like not even just in cars and crappier maps vs. 4, last year I wanted to get my reindeer antlers back for my character that I had. Did the event, thought it unlocked-- went back a week later and the event was over, and the antlers were not in my inventory. So after that I lost 98% of my interest in FH5. This year I also forgot about it until it was just too late. Then I also saw that my favorite car of all time, the Javelin, was back-- yay! But I missed the season to get it and I can't get it any other way... FUCK. Anyway, gonna head back into FH1 rn
I feel like that biggest problem that we're witnessing with FH5 and others with post launch content is that it's between two things, money and a lack of interest between all kinds of gamers and the media. Money can be sometimes a issue because games are becoming more expensive to make these days and it still isn't helping because of COVID. Plus it also sometimes explains why some racing games have cars and content come and go. Remember when GT5 had this problem before release? For the second reason, it's just that racing games don't have the mainstream attention then they use to. Which is why we don't get a lot franchises in this category. The causal players would normally play Mario Kart or a non-racing game. Racing games these days are in it's own bubble and the only time racing games ever catches interest is car culture, which is why we don't hear anything from the devs making these games in fact look at Test Drive Solar Crown, after it's most recent trailer we still got nothing from them. Yet the mainstream media doesn't want to dive deep why and/or even call out the errors or issues that these racing games have because of their small popularity.
this is the most deadass video about this game, it kills me bc the game is so beautiful. The game itself has so much protentional, but I swear these people aren't true enthusiasts like we are (assuming). The map is so open, even with a sim rig, I'm able to drive around the map so quickly somehow. I really hope theyve noticed the player drop and what is wrong, but its forza so idk
It’s kinda funny how everyone hated the map in Horizon 4, but it’s still somehow better than the one in Horizon 5, despite the latter being 1.5x the size and more biome diverse
The "whole game feels the same to the previous one" is also what I feel about Grid Legends. Surely the game improved upon 2019; adding new cars and tracks, improved the handling, adding more disciplines, but the whole game still has the same feeling of the previous game, and thus makes you think that it's just a lazy cash grab. Customization is still poor, no team management system that existed on the first Grid, AI that has the same negatives from 2019, and the general lack of depth for a $60 game.
I was slightly disappointed with fh5 when I got it about a month after launch. I played fh4 with some friends all the time, and have so many great memories on that game. I like fh5, but I don’t love it like I loved fh4. The friend I played fh4 with most didn’t get it at Christmas, and I recently told him not to bother getting it at all. There’s something about it that just isn’t the same. This post launch content issue is a major part of it.
What's insane to me is how clearly guilty they are of literally copy and pasting the exact same content every single game since Horizon 2, making a new map, and calling it good. EXCEPT the CANT EVEN DO THAT, every game has its own set of steps BACKWARDS! Cars being removed, car parts being removed (like body kits in H5), less race types, downgraded features, etc. Aren't game SEQUELS supposed to justify NEW content? Added on the foundation built in the last game? I feel like being a Horizon fan the past decade has just turned into a form of gaslighting lmao. The entire racing genre seems like it's poisoned with laziness, incompetence, and greed, and that has led devs to default to making boring, soulless track racers, with not a single game on the last 2-3 generations being able to top games like Most Wanted or Underground 2 in multiple aspects. How a game from 2004 has yet to be surpassed in terms of car customization seems to tell me all I need to know about these developers and their attempts to appeal to car enthusiasts.
They wanted to make everything into a "live service" YET more often than not failed to deliver a good "service". 👍For having NFS High Stakes OST as the background music.
The calculation of „1.X new cars per month“ perfectly matches with my usual FH5 playing style: I basically tune in maybe every month to get the new car and… that’s it. Having played FH2, 3, 4 (and FH1 somewhere in between) I’ve really bet let down by FH5. It’s not a bad game, I haven’t experienced any technical difficulties and the new cars are indeed nice (finally new Audis) but somehow it is just not interesting to me. Maybe it’s the map, I really liked playing 3 and 4 and cruising around but fh5 just doesn’t catch me at all. Oh and thanks to the YT algorithm for recommending this channel… I‘m basically binging it haha
personally, i dont mind unbounds small carl list, they have a good selection. fh5 wore me out with constant cars just being thrown at me all the time. its quiet refreshing to drive a car, and actually see it for more than 10 minutes. thats just my two cents lel
Having playing Horizon 5 since it’s launched in November 2021, the numerous bugs and the free and paid content included has been abysmal. The removal of older vehicles present in prior titles for the sake of “new” returning content is unacceptable. I prefer the old method of paid car packs as those had brand new Forza cars. As for Unbound’s car list, most are from Heat though the new vehicles added in are brand new and not recycled assets, so here’s hoping to future post launch support that brings in new and returning vehicles that isn’t FOMO.
Translated by Google: What annoys me the most is that they don't take much advantage of expanding the map by adding cities, new roads, new tracks, new races, changes to the map to make it feel different.
Not sure what language you translated from but that translated really well. Also yeah that's a very common complaint the world is small, dead and lack luster.
From very little after the release it was clear this "live service" game was only maintained by a handful of people this is how cash cow AAA games are handled nowadays, no need to spend more, people have already bought the game and car pass, no profits to make
im not even a veteran, playing horizon 3 demo at 20 fps on lowest settings on an awful set up for an hour at most, horizon 4 with gamepass on xbox for at most 20 hours and finally horizon 5, with over 100 hours spent on the worst financial decision i have ever made. what i have heard about horizon 1-3 was not there anymore, and instead of wanting to open the game i instead dread it, knowing all i do is just the festival playlist for an hour, get bored and never end up getting any cars from it. there is a lot more issues i havent pointed out, like the economy, awful singleplayer campagin, and somewhat broken ai as well as broken timers for rivals with a lot of exploiters. this game franchise used to be something i wanted to play and own. and now its dead to me.
I just wish they made it to where we’d actually get new cars like the newer cars like the GR 86 and the new brz and I wish they actually took notes from nfs on customization for the cars like adding more body kits to lots of other cars that really could use one
7:07 the reason behind this is how Forza licenses cars, and how GT licenses cars. GT takes very long contracts from what I understand, that is why you still see both SLRs (which are still in actual limbo regarding rights, neither Benz, nor McLaren agree who actually owns these models) in GT7. Forza usually has 4 year contracts, and I assume it just ran out Same reason why NFS Unbound still has the Giula actually, NFS do 8 year contracts afiak
Well it gets trickier than that, forza delists games after 4 years due to that, yet Forza horizon 4 is still on sale over 4 years since launch, bit of an odd coincidence
@@UltraViolet_Moses I honestly believe that Forza delists their previous entries not entirely because of car licensing, but also because of Music, maybe even primarily because of Music. Overall a game itself being entirely delisted is a whole 'nother can of worms, there are myriads of factors in that, which we don't know I just wanted to clarify, that Forza doesn't have Alfas because of their business model, and shorter licensing cycles, which presumably cost less due to the sheer amount of cars Horizon has. I'm not defending 5, it's shit, it's probably my least favorite racing game at the moment. Just adding stuff I know, and speculation to the conversation, y'know
One thing that's disappointed me pretty much from launch about FH5 is the Forzathon shop cars. That used to be a great way to get exclusive cars that you missed, but I can't remember the last time there was a car worth the points in the Forzathon shop in FH5!!! Plus, they STILL haven't fixed the damn drift zones!!! That was one of my favorite things to do in FH4, to try to beat my old drift zone scores and get higher on the leaderboard. I can only do that in the new Hot Wheels land in FH5 because they messed up the drift zone scoring a while ago.
I loved Each Horizon games, ( especially the first and 3rd ) but I have to admit that Forza Horizon needs to be more creative and add separate modes with cops à la NFS , and not rebrand hot wheels like they did , I was so dissapointed that I didn't played it since ...
I completely forgot that nfs heat barely got and post launch content because the game was just so fun and the grind just felt right it was the perfect balance between not being too grindy or being way to easy. I miss loading out at night with nfs mw bmw with my friends and getting that high heat level reward.
I don't mind the cars being free but when I pay 100 dollars for the game I expect something different than the standard edition that's what pisses me off. So far haven't even got $70 worth. I mean people who bought the ultimate edition should get extra stuff. And no not f%$%ing clothes. I mean why didn't they tell us before we bought it. Would've got the $60
I believe that Forza Horizon preys on a young audience for revenue. Having 500-700 cars is not a bragging right. All it does is highlight how the game prefers quantity over quality, and how lazy the developers are when it comes to adding content. On the topic of laziness, the Festival Playlist may be one of the worst features to ever exist within a racing game. It's a combination of being extremely grindy, time-consuming and the cherry on top: the fear of missing out. This content model is a perfect way to draw in younger players and keep them attached; scare them into playing and unlocking cars before they're gone. I fell for this practice _myself_ with FH4, being only 12 at the game's release. After having played the entire reboot franchise of Need for Speed (2015 - Unbound), I can finally appreciate the effort that Ghost & Criterion put into their games, and realize how lazy and manipulative Playground Games is with their Horizon series. Regardless, there's nothing that can be done to change it. Horizon 6 will release in 2024, being yet another reskin of Horizon 3 with even less content at launch to be added back as "new content" post-launch, and Microsoft's CEOs will enjoy all that sweet, sweet cash generated from preying on the minds of children.
Hey Mosey, I enjoyed this video and I was wondering if you could do a Ridge Racer retrospective mini-series after you're done with the NFS mini-retrospective, just wondering. Keep up the good work and be well!
I have a need to defend Polyphony Digital with what they're doing with new content for GT7 - when it comes to cars all of the models, even if the car is returning from games before Sport, are completely new 8k models. And unlike Forza PD doesn't just take the same model from let's say GT5 or 6 and put it in the game (they've learned their lesson with "Standard Cars" from GT5&6). Yes they've made blunders like with Spa 24h Layout, but I'll forgive them due to the quality of said updates.
It’s funny another RU-vidr did a video on how the recent glitch to get 999,999,999 cash ruined the game which it did shut down the auction house but what was funny to me is no one replied to my comment. I simply said I did it because the updates are predicated on FOMO and have been the same events for almost 3 years now. Literally every week you complete the same roster of events. And the biggest gripe I have is the AI. I can easily win these races on expert but it’s boring and here’s why.. assuming you don’t come in first and driver XYZ starts in the pole position driver XYZ will 99.99999999999% of the time finish in first.. you might ask well on the rare occasion that doesn’t happen (almost always on off road events) what happens? Well guess what driver XYZ gets to start in pole position again and guess what? Driver XYZ will finish those next to races in first. LITERALLY EVERY TIME. What’s the point of a 3 race event if you have to come in first everytime just make it single events. Even then it’s so boring because the AI never make mistakes it just following the race line to a T with no mistakes. Wreckfest for example (kind of bad because it’s about wrecking) the AI after jumps spin out or after taking turns wrong will mess up so it’s always a unique race no matter how many times you do it. FORZA IS ALWAYS THE SAME!! No variety. So I did the glitch because every week yes I just want to buy the cars because most are recycled anyway but I still want them. The playlist got so boring I don’t know how you can enjoy the same thing happening over and over again. My biggest issue hands down is the AI. You can go off a 200 ft cliff hanger and your car spin out but the top 3 AI drive like it was a continuation in the road albeit that’s unrealistic to do a 200ft drop that just wouldn’t be the case. I wanna see AI wreck or flip over if they mess up is what I’m getting at
honestly it seems like ever game coming out recently is unfinished shit holes and I'm surprised that the gaming community don't start sueing devs for lying to our face for false advertisement like bf2042
As a huge fan of NFS, despite the car list being mostly recycled, the car list in Unbound is a huge improvement over Heat for multiple reasons. While new cars are a huge part of it, there’s other little things about the car list that add up, ultimately making it better then Heat’s car list The return of fan favorite cars from previous games like the Eclipse GSX, RX 8 Spirit R, and the Ford Crown Victoria, among others. They trimmed the fat of Heat’s car list, which was bloated with multiple copies and “special editions” of cars that were already in the game, like three Corvettes, three 370Zs, multiple Huracans and Aventadors, etc. Some of these still exist in Unbound, but it’s not nearly as prevalent as it was in Heat. Customization available for cars that previously had no customization options. Previously DLC cars from both Payback and Heat are included in the list, and unlike Playground, Criterion doesn’t brag about them being “new”. Then there’s the significant new additions to the list that are just exciting for a NFS player, like the Bugatti Chiron, the new Countach, the Charger Hellcat, the BMW M1 etc. etc. While looking at the lists side by side it’s easy to write off the car list as recycled from Heat, but if you look into it you can see that Criterion has made some improvements to the existing car list and expanded upon it with new additions. Even though there’s only 9 or so new cars added to the list, the improvements made pushed Unbound’s car list and made it better then Heat’s.
@@uhm175 It is for me too, and Heat has that issue. It still rears its head into Unbound, but they cooled off on it enough. In fact the only car I can think of off the top of my head with multiple copies in it is the Aventador. I believe it has the Aventador S, the SVJ (both coupe and roadster), and a special edition of the Aventador. I believe the Corvette Stingray also has the coupe and roadster as separate cars, as well as a third version of it. It’s disappointing and annoying to see, but Heat took it to an obnoxious degree
I still stand by the fist Horizon as the best of the franchise and none of the sequels have been able to match it. It had a kind of magic to it that just hasn't been there since. They had a good list of cars to start with and the DLC packs added plenty of unique and cool new cars to the game. Sure, the customization options werent as in-depth as later games, the world was smaller, and you were restricted to the roads for the most part, but it was still a fun game to play. The world felt alive with named characters and an actual objective: beat the champ. Visually the excessive color saturation makes the entire environment pop. Plus, the soundtrack hits all the right nostalgia markers.
@@uhm175 Racing- Grid Legends , Rally- Dirt Rally or WRC, street racing- NFS Rivals or Heat. I honestly don't see a reason to play Forza outside of the community made maps
@@averagebohemian5791 NFS Heat was terrible & can be finished within short of time & then there isn't much to do, NFS rivals was ok, but it had potential to be better Grid Legends is an entirely different genre, it's an arcade game with closed tracks, it was good, but not enough to keep me playing it, WRC is basically copy paste from it's previous sequels, nothing much on it improved or changed So by the end of the day, i still enjoy Forza Horizon 5 more & still come back to it from time to time, imo the racing games market is very weak rn because there isn't a real competitor to Forza, i believe FH5 can get better because i don't play it much like i used to or any racing game in general, Hopefully NFS Unbound & TDU Colar crown will give the Forza Devs a wake up call
devs dont understand car culture . i want a game where people can build and sell cars , engine swap what ever engine it fits on the other car .. make a widebody or bodyparts for any car . endless costumization and fun progression . i want to win wheels and bodyparts on the wheelspin and not fkn skirts and dresses lmao i want to build a car and gift it too my buddy and not give it to some random . thats your job forza team . plus i dont care if we dont get too many 2020 and up cars . there are soo many old jdm and non jdm cars and the fun is to express yourself with your car and turn a fkn shit box in to the coolest ,racing or drifting machine ever and unfortunatly the forza devs are choir boys they dont get it lmao imagine when they do japan with no costumization lmao atleast give us a damn mod support
Unbound might have a smaller list, and sure a lot are carried over from Heat. But as of right now, Unbound is the only game I can drive the new Z without having to find a mod for Assetto Corsa. The new Z has been with us for almost a year now, there’s no excuse as to why that’s not been added to Horizon yet. And that’s just one example. No widebody Hellcat Charger/Chellenger (I know the demon exists, but the hellcats are from 2015). No new Continental GT. No new M2. No new Raptor or Raptor R. It’s easy for Playground to brag about a massive car list when the majority of said list is assets they’ve been using since Motorsport 6. Probably the main reason why I’ve been playing Unbound. Is it perfect? No, it’s got it’s problems. But right now I enjoy it way more than FH5. At least Unbound has the production model Q60. I miss the Q50 Eau Rouge and G37 IPL from Horizon 3. FH5 has so much, but also so little.
@@jaysway8972 I’ve never really thought about GT7. I haven’t had a PlayStation since 2016. I’ve been PC ever since. Last GT I had was 5 on the PS3. I can’t say anything about GT since it’s been a hot minute since I’ve played.
I dont really agree to your opinion - 100+ cars in racing game is more than enough. How many do you drive regularly I would guess that 10 at most. If developer wants to add some more ( for some little paid money ) why not ? Especially in Fortza case you have 500+ cars to play with - just dont buy that pack. I have much more issues with releasing games in unfinished state and then ( maybe ) fixed post launch. Like Fortza having problems with multiplayer for several months and Unbound straight up has cut version in multiplayer ( no night, no cops, etc ) In my opinion "lack of new content" is better solved nt by new cars but by new ingame content, new ways to enjoy game, new challenges to overcome
I disagree, Forza biggest selling point is it's large car list I would rather they add more cars, but also keep on improving the game play-ability & content
It's cool to see the FOMO being brought up on this topic, since the integration of FOMO (Fear Of Missing Out) its the main difference between paid content from previous forzas and the free content from the current ones, because although it increases the player retention, it affects the overall experience and opinions on the game from the player base, because it forces you to enter the game in order to get that car, instead of coming back to the game at will, getting returning cars as a reward for playing certain objectives in the festival playlist doesn't make it fun. One of the main solutions PGG could make is: - Bringing the returning/new to forza cars to the autoshow (since their announcement on a festival playlist or the next month) - Having special events for new to forza cars (changing the pace of the gameplay in order to mix things up, instead of making a championship or getting to 50% of the playlist in order to unlock that car) - the introduction of new type of events, increasing the amount of things you can do, improving the gameplay. - An overhaul on this festival playlist system, analyze it and see what can be changed or improved (prob for next title) - Better planning (there's this good video from JakeMG about this topic named "Why The Forza Horizon 5 devs aren't lazy")
I feel like fomo is ruining games. I hate when a game says I have to do X to unlock Y before Z real world date and time. I play games for fun. Adding that real world date and time deadline is introducing an unnecessary level of stress to a leisure activity. This isn’t just a Forza Horizon problem but a games as a service problem. Games that use fomo are psychologically manipulating their players. People should be playing games. Games shouldn’t play people.
The Fomo stuff is one of the things that annoys me the most in Forza Horizon. I also play other things besides Forza. With me, the developers achieve the opposite of what they actually want to achieve. It makes me feel like I have to play the game rather than actually wanting to play it. Besides, I've never had the feeling with any car that it's worth it to drop everything for it because I'm running out of time. Then I'd rather just not play at all...
The Crew 2 seems to be on the path to getting rid of it's own FOMO model, with the Motorpass now being able to be bought with in-game currency and cars previously exclusive to the pass are returning, also purchasable with in-game currency.
I really hate it. 1) What if I didn't follow what is happening that week and miss a car 2) What if I don't have enough time 3) What if I find out but point 2 happens when I find out. The FOMO part is just really annoying and hurts the player in the long run especially if you're a new customer. Imagine buying the game now and not knowing how to get your favourite car because it was an exclusive during week 2 at launch
No, I mean maybe. But mostly I think they are woke AF. Well maybe not woke but insanely bad writing I am beginning to think 5 high school that likes to read can wright better lines then this extremely happy dumb ass tone. go watch white line review it’s the best
I'm guessing the reason Unbound added a small amount of cars is because of customization, they have to make every bumper fit every fender and splitter, or exhausts fitting different diffusers and that def adds a lot of work. The reason Rivals added 27 new cars is because they didn't have any customization. I hope EA sees the success of Unbound as a reason to give Criterion a bigger budget and more staff
I'd much rather have a smaller selection of cars and have more customisation options and improve the performance of a given car as you progress through the game. This is something Heat and Unbound have got right in my opinion. Forza having 500 plus cars has got a bit ridiculous really.
can we also talk about that "huge donut" update? they force you into an event when you boot the game, the event is nothing new at all, just another "get there in x time" thing and then the characters look nothing like their real life counterparts. and that was supposed to be a huge deal of an update
Thank you for mentioning Lancia and Alfa. They're very dearly missed in FH5. I remember back when the whole 'Country Grand Prix' series had really bad car choices with the italian team, which primarily only focused on Lamborghini, Ferrari, and Maserati; all of which offering very little in terms of 'offroad' cars, while other nations had their full-on rally cars (and more manufacturer diversity), the italian team had to settle for 2 Lamborghini SUVs, and a Maserati SUV.
Modern gaming is in a constant trap to make live service games, and the racing genre has been no exception to it, it's just finally rearing it's head when it comes to issues relating to lacking content, and Forza is the poster child right now. I remember the concept of post game content being interesting new content, such as in the form of an expansion, or DLC packs that add more content that was either requested by the community or was being cooked up by the developers, like the Big Surf Island dlc for burnout paradise, the monte carlo pack for DiRT 3 (I hope you can make a video on this game btw), and so on, but now it's being relegated to stuff that was either promised, oh which was cut deliberately, or stuff we've already seen before, and if there's one thing I'm seeing people want, is actually new content, whether it's cars, a new map expansion (the hot wheels stuff was fine and all, but FH3 already had it as well), etc
and not having people that know about car culture making racing games . forza has amazing handling but lacks the style and the costumization .. nfs has amazing costumization and look but it lacks the handling even just a simple one .
@@tugzzcouncil485 nfs sometimes even lacks good cop chases, which was supposed to be it's main selling point, and sa huge part of what made that franchise unique to begin with
@@rijjhb9467 that's a whole can of worms on it's own, but to sum it up, it's another thing to add up in the decline of video game preservation and true ownership, quite possibly
The funniest part is there are some accolades where you need cars that were cut from FH4, meaning that some of them are unobtainable to this date. Also in the FH2 anniversary there's a 2012 AM Vanquish which isn't in the game neither. And I'm still surprised to continue watching people defending the updates like they were the biggest thing ever, when they only add content that were cut and not giving new gameplay features like genuine new stories (with cutscenes, not like Donut Media one) and many more.
Lets be blunt and call it by name: Its the Console Fan Wars... People who have never played a certain Game defend their Game and attack the other Game for no reason at all. (I play both GT7 and FH5, tried a bit FM7, but that I didn't enjoy). And I agree that the Problem with both Games (FH5 and GT7) is content and how the Content is used and how/what kind of Rewards you get... In GT7 the Rewards are a bit low for many races, in FH5 the Rewards are a bit high and make the Cars feel cheap...
the only thing i could see defending is most of the licenses are likely by game, not a perpetual or universal license in most cases, but this would only be the case for a few cars/brands
The way Forza has been handling it's car lists since FH3 is one of the reasons I have grown cold to the series. I preordered FH4 only to find that the cars I really loved in FH3 were not there, some never to come back again. Seeing the same thing happen in FH5 is one of the reasons I not only didn't pre-order, but played on game pass for two weeks then never went back to again. It reflects really badly on the dev team when they take the player base for fools, whom they can take away content from just to put it back in like they've done us a favour. It wouldn't be so bad if it was logical, such as one brand (like lancia for example) but there seems to be a 'throw a dart and the car it lands on becomes post launch content' approach which makes me not want to give them any money.
Agreed, but it's not the dev team that make these decisions. Those guys just code/design/make stuff. It's probably upper management or a dedicated content delivery team
I'm glad FOMO is mentioned in the video. That is by far the biggest problem I have with forza for example. I honestly would prefer no update at all then an update that gives me chores to get a reward I already had in the last game. I personally get on fh1 up to fh3 for this reason. I can go at my own pace without having any problem of FOMO. Fh3 did it the best with the old Forzathon system (longer period of time with enjoyable challenges).
And develop also fools themselves since they doing this they royals customer player will go to others game now since they already not longer trust them since how downfalls they became and forza keeps ignore community I have to say next horizon game will not sale well since most players mind didn't want other same game since horizons 3 over and over again with cut cars content
@@mrjdmtunerboy.1463 forza devs dont know us bro . we just want to turn and old jdm sht box in to something crazy with a widebody or whatever .. . they dont know car culture and the game will die because of it nfs as well for not having decent handeling
I recently got into a discussion with someone defending FH5 for the recycled cars. They said "who cares? It's free updates and free content." And this video perfectly encapsulates why that mindset is a problem. Just because it's "free" doesn't mean it's good. I paid for the game to find cars cut from the last game and being drip fed to us once a week for a month. The most recent 2 (aka December 2022 and January 2023) updates and the previous 2, before that, we're getting a total 17 total cars. Of that 17, 5 of them are new to Forza and 12 of them are "new to Forza" meaning recycled. And this isn't a problem to the developers at all??? They aren't updating these out of date car models, they aren't giving them new customization from real life parts with licenses they already have in the game, it's literally just porting the old models into the FH5 engine and calling it a day.
If the same treatment were given to a fifa, nba or madden game people would be so upset, but since it's a racing game no one really respects it for some reason
@@en3myspott3d54 fr, which is why I'm glad games like NFS Unbound and such take risks and change what they do with each game. Even if it misses sometimes, they're not trying the same shit over and over
@@succulenttrash3343 I think it's just the nature of the sport and it's niche, most car people just mod their own car instead of playing games, and while all sports are complex and strategic, racing has double the barrier of entry because you need to understand the car itself and read your opponents strategy, whereas in things like football you just need to be able to play well and have a capable body (that's another barrier in itself, but most sports fan's aren't health nuts y'know? but in racing games you are forced to be a mechanic)
It feels like this game is just a map update of forza horizon 4 but somehow less enjoyable. I think they should just put fewer updates but make them higher quality to engage people.
More than cars, i would actually prefere that horizon 5 recieves new event types, tracks or something of a progression system like in the hotwheels dlc. Or better yet bug fixes and a cleaner rivals leaderboard. I own about 350 cars in the game, just adding more to them doenst do anything for me.
Yes! New event types and new things to do is as good, if not better than getting new cars, it doesn't need to be something breathtaking, just something like a new "dakar" inspired cross country event, or rally races with joker laps could be quite fun. Those bug fixes and cleaner rivals leaderboards that you mentioned are still happening, just not to a big degree because it takes effort to analyze those cheated lap times. The one thing I would like is to them being more open with that subject, because they mention the cleaning leaderboards topic on the forza monthly streams, it would be cool if they talk about it on Torben Tuesday or another time of the month.
Yep. I dont understand this car collection fetish people have. As if it matters that there is one or two more cars in your garage that can collect dust, as they usually have the same boring customization options (khm Forza Aero and Front Splitter) as any other car. As for the tracks, they could just improve the eventlab, simple as that. Make it easier to build tracks, especially smooth surfaces like roads. And a better menu view for the eventlab creations. That alone would mean many new tracks
fr i already said this on alot of fh5 criticism videos that the game is justoverall unfun, wish rally was actual rally with co drivers again (imagine multiplayer co-op where your friends have to warn you with pre voice recorded messages for the track)
Hot wheels DLC Was so bad Would've preferred a F&F, even if it's the same thing, but it's a street racing theme which fits Horizon setting perfectly, giving FH5 a hot wheels expansion again was a big mistake
God i feel so ripped off for buying FH5 Ultimate, for a game that gives koenigseggs and bugattis to every player, has clear issues with money, bugs, glitches and wheelspins, getting 2 wheelspins and double credits for races giving you 10k for 30 dollars feels like paying a fucking dominatrix to spit and step on me
Just some small corrections about Unbound. 1) While there was a difference of 3 years from Heat to Unbound, the game technically didn't get developed in 3 years, but instead, on 2 years. This is because in one year Criterion had to help on the development of Battlefront 2042 because EA said so, forcing then to temporally stop the project. Unbound got delayed because of it (and there were people asking to not be delayed). 2) Unbound actually got 13 new cars, not 9. Not trying to defend that small roster (because that's the thing that disappointed me the most), just a small correction.
Honestly, with the amount of new high-quality visual upgrades added to cars in Unbound, i am completely fine with only having 13 new cars total. imo, having 150 super-customizable cars is much better than having 250 cars that can only be upgraded internally (for NFS, at least)
They didn't have to help BF2042 for one year. It was announced in early March 2021 and in mid November 2021 Tom Henderson reported that studios that helped BF2042 were transitioning back to their own projects. I seriously don't know where people get that they helped them for one straight year when there is clear proof laid on the floor that they clearly didn't. Also in addition to that, if you really think there wasn't a small team of NFS devs still working on NFS22 bts, you don't know how big projects are managed
When it comes to GT7 with returning cars I wouldn't complain as much cause usually these are remade, completely new models, with even more detail than before, going for as photorealistic results as possible (there's a reason they don't put out 10+ cars per update). Meanwhile Forza, reuses the same models, sometimes with the least effort put in. We still have awful 15yo models from FM2, which are the worst models you can find in AAA racing titles today.
Some of those old car models date back to as far as the *original* Motorsport, just with a bunch of optimizations to make them look a little nicer. It’a also why some cars like the S14 have really weird 2000’s tuner style body kits (The ones that I recognize are the Silvia S14, Skyline R32, and blobeye WRX, but there are probably a few more)
@@natecollins9331 pretty much yeah, GT models compared to Forza's are lightyears ahead when it comes to accuracy and detail (although, not always perfect, there are some mistakes made but generally, they're just great).
As someone who plays mobile games like CSR and Asphalt 9, I think the difference in car lists is honestly a part of the same FOMO issue that Forza has. The car list has hundreds of the most current concept cars unlike Forza, but they have similar limited time events to unlock said cars that can be really time consuming and even convince players to spend real money to get ahead . Of course the cars themselves are great, but the path to get them is much longer and relies on player retention in a much more taxing way than the Horizon games ever did in my opinion
The lack of new models of existing cars is infuriating. FH5 still has the old Fiesta ST, the old Continental GT, the old Golf R etc etc. I haven't been on the game in ages (which is telling in itself) but last I looked there was still no GR Yaris which seems like a huge omission
@@eugeneanderson8706 Funny you mention Motorsport 2, I went back and played that game for nostalgia a few months ago, and it is absolutely INSANE how many cars STILL have same exact customization or don't have any customization at all to this day 15 years later.
I hope test drive unlimited solar crown is good I think one of the devs said there won't be that stupid wheel spin crap Edit: basically saying your gonna have to work for what you want
If the gaming press were willing to call these companies out for their lack of after sales service and content, maybe things would change ? But it looks to me like they have all being bought off, maybe that is why they give glowing reviews and ten out of ten scores, for bug ridden, boring games, that they have barely played ? Good video by the way, well presented too.
You can't just blame the "Gaming Press", as they have to work with the Companies in some way. (that isn't a defense, just to keep in mind). You have to talk about the Users and the people defending Forza at all cost, always and every time. And all the bad things that Forza does. FOMO is one thing, but also the worth of cars gets completely skewed and cars feel kinda worthless as you get really expensive cars far too easy, after just 10-15min of Gameplay...
Dude nfs unbound makes this game feel so stale in comparison from it's interesting aesthetical choices to it's progression system requiring me to WORK to get a new lambo rather than being handed one almost immediately in forza.
7:05 I mean there’s always depth to these stupid licensing cases. The SLR McLaren has been in The Crew and GT for years yet hasn’t been in Forza since 2015 - sometimes these companies refuse to be in games over things we (players) can’t even imagine. 7:50 is because CSR2 doesn’t need to program handling or physics. 8:51 wasn’t it the 2018/19 GT-R? 10:25 I understand and agree on the lack of new cars, but Unbound 1. Only had a 2 year dev cycle 2. Has customization for cars now and 3. NFS has always been extremely slow at adding cars after the launch of NFS 2015.
Yup that’s absolutely true, but still Forza doesn’t get an actual car from them from my knowledge. There’s no way a team with their experience needs years just to program handling and physics for one car. In any case more clarification from Forza would help endlessly. I appreciate the comment and thanks for watching Jake!
@@UltraViolet_Moses They definitely don’t need years, but I also imagine getting deals with mobile games is easier there’s no potential car damage and the massive market on mobile will promote the car more. Communication, again, would fix this problem though.
I get the feeling that playground games has gotten complacent after horizon 3. Every new horizon game that comes out is always met with unending praise from game critics, journalists and casual fans who would usually never touch a racing game. Playground has no reason to improve the game’s formula, they’re getting the sales, the good reviews and the praise from those casual fans, they don’t have a reason to act on the feedback of hardcore fans.
Only the second expansion can save them at this point, I haven’t launched Horizon 5 and played for more than 10 minutes in months. I didn’t feel that way about Horizon 4 until 3 years in. The playlist is lazy, Anniversary was lazy, Donut was lazy. Fans are just tired.
Blame the lack of competition. With the type of racing game Horizon is, it's the only game in town. There's no other game on its caliber. PG can rest easy and do whatever because we can't take our business elsewhere since there is no "elsewhere".
@@rodracer4567 Just wait for TDU. With its map and realistic feel such as Dealerships, Interior options and ACTUALLY HAVE STOCK RIMS OPTIONS, it will probably be great, Hopefully.
@@uhm175 numbers don’t lie my guy it’s very easy to check. Why do you think they started putting the shit on game pass? Fh5 has had the lowest player count of any horizon release. Facts
Don’t really understand your claim for little post content considering playground games releases new cars, events, patch updates, every week. Updates events, event lab, customization everything, paints vinyls etc Yeah playground games is insane at post launch content. Probably the industry leader.
cool video, however i think you focus too much on the number of cars added to the games. just adding more visual stuff is not enough for a quality update. I'd rather have new interesting gameplay than a thousand cars
I'm fine with how Horizon is right now but I do admit it can be MUCH better. The reason it isn't in my opinion is the lack of competition. Not a lot of motivation to put in effort if doing the bare minimum won't lose you any players to the (non-existent) competition. Also I realized the recycled cars would be much better received if they were cars that haven't been in a game in years (say since Horizon 1 or Motorsport 4). And communication is DEFINITELY a problem, remember we didn't even know Horizon 5 existed until E3 2021. Not once did they tell us it was in development.
The only meaningful new feature in Horizon 5 was the route creator update. Outside of community maps, the only events that are remotely fun are rallycross events and even those didn't improve at all.
Well I guess you could say the map was an update. Though it sure depends on your perspective. One thing is for sure, there was never a bad map in any Horizon game imo. Sounds also improved, though it wasnt that difficult given how bad FH4 was. The weekly playlists are a tiny bit more interesting (not by much), and there are some small improvements here and there. But I agree with you, in 3 years of development, this isnt a lot
@@horvathr95 I personally think that the map is bad. There aren't that many fun roads. The big exception is the hill climb, that one is really great. In Need For Speed Heat, almost all part of the map had interesting roads, especially the mountains. Forza lacks technical roads so much
This video just reminded me of the tweet from the Forza Horizon Twitter account, where they were essentially trying to gloat about all the stuff released in the past year, that felt extremely disingenuous when you actually looked into it
Interesting video. I mean i don't play Forza but i always though they were having new cars until i saw many videos, including yours talking about the lack of *new* content
I think I'm just done with FH5. This just doesn't feel like a true NextGen Forza title and I kinda regret spending $100 for the Big Baller Edition. They recycle older content way too often, they introduce game-breaking bugs and then don't fix them for weeks on end, and they don't really listen to the fan base when it comes to user requests for updates. PGG has completely lost my trust and patience as a consumer. I'm just gonna wait for FM8 to get my Forza fix, FH5 is just too stale for me to warrant sinking more hours into it. I already spent 400 hours in-game, I got all my use out of it. Goodbye FH5. I'll reinstall the game in a year and see where you stand then.
funny thing that evolution with Forza content is just weird. Adding all the dlc cars from horizon 3,2 to the new games (horizon 5,4) as free. Like the NSX, or the Viper etc
I know im late to this video, but having just watched ThatDudeInBlues's video about how car culture has changed, you can clearly see it in a lot of modern racing games. As TDIB stated, car culture seems to be more about clout or fame than actually about cars now a days. The same problem is relevant in a lot of modern racing games. I cant tell you how many times games like forza or gran turismo show off their "amazing new graphics" only for the base of the game (tuning, upgrading, ect) to be the exact same it always has been. Besides of adding a few new options and redesigning some things, forza hasnt changed AT ALL when it comes to tuning. The menus are basically the EXACT SAME as the original menu's from forza motorsport 3. While im glad physics are getting updated in FH5, i REALLY hope T10 re-work all of the tuning for the new motorsport game. If a game like fucken Carx can have better tuning and physics than a triple A dev company, then i truly dont know what to say. I just want the series that got me deep into cars to be good again :(
Games like FH5, Pokemon Scarlet/Violet, Cyberpunk, No Man's Sky, Callisto Protocol, and sports/FPS series like Battlefield, Fifa, etc. are driving us to an inevitable Video Game Industry Crash part 2. They break sales records right now, but those same audiences tend to become quickly disenfranchised by the next release. You only buy the new Fifa or 2k because the roster has changed. You only get one racing game over another because of the physics and car roster. You buy the new FPS because that's how you play with your friends who are also buying the new title. One thing that's consistent between all these facets of the industry, is that you're not really buying the game for its content anymore. The lack of competition because companies like Ubisoft and EA absorbed smaller studios, means you're buying the new titles because that's your only option. The content drip-feed is just the little bonus that bigwigs give you so they keep player retention. It's insidious and disgusting.
The magic word here being "Games As A Service". Whoever came up with that deserves a special place in hell. Sure, there are good examples how to pull this off, but most are just lackluster attempts and the developers make you feel like an idiot because it just seems they charged you the full price for half a game and depending on how well it sold, you get the other half over time. Or not. I've got no problem with big expansions, I've also got no problem with payed DLCs as long as they are good. I wouldn't pay for recycled and obviously withheld cars, though. Sadly I think Forza, especially the Horizon series got a bit too successful and now we are in the phase where the devs think, they are too big to fail and they can get away with everything. The Donut Media update was the absolute showcase of this hubris. It was plain lazy and I don't know why. Either they don't bother anymore because somehow this game will sell or be played anyway (And they already got the sponsoring money from Donut Media, so who cares, right?) or they don't care because the player base is in decline and they either shifted their focus on the next Motorsports or Horizon and are just doing the bare minimum for FH5 to somehow keep it alive until the next game is ready, which again will be bought by the millions, because, granted, the base game is fun, it's fun to cruise around with friends. I had fun with FH4 for a long time but FH5 is frustrating me so hard, not only because of the car list but also by the boring map and the lack of any new features compared to the fully updated FH4. It just feels like it could have been an expansion to FH4, rather than a fully developed new game, this also leads to the problem - there just isn't enough to do and I basically play the game only on Thursdays to unlock the cars and that's it. I'd rather have more features, more races, more places for games, more challenges, different lists for different classes for PR-stunts etc. than cars but this just isn't happening and because of that, I won't buy the next Forza Horizon.
Forza Horizon getting perfect scores from the media and praises to high heavens from fanboys don't help either. The competition will copy highly rated and praised games. Sad but true. Prepare yourselves for more Forza Horizon model racing games.
are seriously saying forza 5 shouldve launched with 700 cars?? And then what? Should forza 6 launch with 1000? There is a point where this becomes unsustainable
NFS hasn't made a good game since Hot Pursuit in 2010. Everything after that has been mixed review, negative, or okay like Unbound. Unbound added like 10 new cars to Heat's list. There's a reason why the game is advertised for audiences like children and tiktok influencers now, we gave up on that series a long time ago.
For me horizon 5's lack of new cars issue is the least of the game's problem. The map design sucks, no new features, pretty much the same festival playlist, performance problems and glitches since launch and i could go on and on.. Basically 90 % of the problems transfered to a new game just with a different map. When 5 launched i expected to be at least as good as horizon 4 even tho i had played around 150 hours at the time of horizon 4. Its just the game dont meeting expectations. And the post launch updates were mid at best with a few updates in between that actually added something exciting. I suppose i was fooled to think horizon 5 will be at least as good as horizon 4 if not better
