Exactly what happened to us. We bought BCV when our daughters were toddlers. They just graduated college. We sold BCV, made back all of our money -- and bought Aulani, (the vacation that suits my husband and I in our empty nest phase of life). What other timeshare would have made that possible? None.
Pete, we own Grand Cal 100 points...$620 annual dues...We have booked June 12-16 and June 19-24 for Galaxy's Edge Grand Opening, which we missed, but heard might be there for Rise of the Resistance Grand Opening...9 nights = 180 points...annual dues costs = $1116...actual price for a Standard room at Grand Cal for 9 nights with tax and parking (which DVC members don't pay) = $6561.00 plus Tax $1115.37 plus parking $225.....Tax alone is the price of our annual dues!!! #buydvcstayforfree #shhhhhhhhh
I use a simple formula to calculate my cost per point. I bought 130 points at $98 per point (total $12,740) with 25 years left on my contract. This equals 3250 points (130 X 25 years). $12,740 divided by 3250 points = $3.92 per point. So each year my point cost is the $3.92 per point plus each year's maintenance fee per point. Currently my maintenance fee is a little over $7 per point so at the present time my total cost per point is about $11.
But this does not take into the Present value of money. Our county goes into great debt but smart about it because they also inflate the money supply to devalue their debt.
Nicholas Lujan ..it’s not change, but if you actually invested the initial cost and the yearly dues, you can possibly use the proceeds to book a resort and retain the capital!!
Easier equations: total cost of contract / (years remaining * total points) + maintenance fees = cost per point. All other variables will cancel out. You can assume maintenance fees and the price for a resort stay will increase at the same rate.
Jerry’s value calculation makes a lot of sense assuming the contract will hold or increase its value a contract can always be sold and the value can be returned or a profit could be made. So the only thing you are paying for the resort stay is the maintenance dues
Aulani is why my wife and I joined DVC. It’s just over a 5 hour flight from our home in Sacramento (direct to Honolulu). Our current maintenance fees plus the amount we had to spend on points over the life of the lease works out to $11 per point. This fall the cash rate for our 1 bedroom villa is $538 per night (which includes a Disney 30% discount off of rack rate) plus $37 per night parking. We’re getting that same room for $300 per night with free parking through DVC. So DVC is saving us $2,500 for the length of our stay plus we have points left over. Sure, we can stay in Honolulu proper for $150 per night. But Aulani is amazing and worth it. So it works for us. Does it work for everyone? Absolutely not. But I’m happy with my choice.
Jerry reeled when Jackie said that you shouldn’t do DVC if you’re going to stay at the cheaper hotels. I think she’s right, though. They said on the previous episode that studio availability is hard to come by. And you can just rent points. You should have everything else in your life taken care of before going and prepaying for Disney trips.
We are value resort people who usually only go during free dining. We found our resale that we bought ($90 a point AKL) to be pretty much a wash money wise over the length of the contract, but for what we would spend at All Star or Pop we could stay at a Deluxe resort. It doesn’t save us money immediately, but over the life of the contract we can stay at a nice resort at a value price.
I am definitely a Disney fan & plan to use our points for future Disney trips, however-our first trip with points was an RCI exchange and we were VERY pleased with the accommodations. Hope you touch on RCI in a future episode!
Staying at the Grand Californian for 3 nights is about 2000$ during the times of the year I like to go (Sept, Oct, Nov) for the cheapest room. For what we paid to buy in for 50 points, our initial buy in cost will be paid for in basically 5 trips to DL. After that our yearly dues is all we will pay for our trips. Right now thats like $350 a trip.
Not gonna lie, at the 12:05 mark, I heard a cellphone buzzing/vibrating and I thought it was my phone but then realized it was in the video!! The vibrating noise was picked up by one of their microphones lol.
Pete, 1-DVC point is worth up to exactly $19. If the room is 20-points per night then the room should be priced at $380 (20 x $19 = $380). You don’t need a fancy algorithm, because there is an open marketplace of several brokers who will rent you someone else’s DVC points for $17 to $19 per point. Anyone can rent DVC points, you don’t need to be a DVC member, so with planning, nobody should pay more than $19. Disney’s cash price is only something people should consider when there is no DVC availability.
Not quite. Points are based off the initial purchase price, total interest paid, cost of maintenance, all spread over the life of the contract. Although, $19 per point is probably a good estimate, if on the high side.
@@GhostHostMemories Cost of maintenance is the great unknown, and building this into an estimate of value is uncertain. What also is uncertain is the future cash price of renting points, or the cash price for staying at a villa. However, renting points is the way to go for many people, especially if they need to finance.
I have dvc . I still can’t decide if this is a rip.off or not !! I Pay so much in maintenance . Make sure you are going to use it !!! If you decide not to go to Disney one year , yes you can bank that yr . , but you better use it the next yr or loose it !!!! Sometimes it feels like it “ makes” me go to Disney when I am thinking I’d rather be going somewhere else !! I also wish there were more perks in owning DVC . You get hardly any perks . The dvc moonlight nights at the parks look great ....there’s 1 per park per yr and of course I’m never available to plan my trip fitting these times !! You get none of the discounts ( like free dining ) they offer reg resort guests . Make sure your use yr is right for you because they aren’t kidding ....you can’t change it !!! My use yr is March -March . I must bank my unused Pts by oct . I can not touch those banked pts until next March ( my use yr ) . This affected me once when my sister decided she wasn’t coming so I canceled trip and banked the pts in Oct . Dang if 2 weeks something changed and plans were back on with her . I could not use the pts I banked because our trip was in beginning of feb . It’s limiting and very expensive !! I love the rooms and I love Disney ...but I’m not sure I like the constraints and I’m not sure if it’s worth the money .
For some “cash buyers”, they may have taken a signature loan with a financial institution such as a credit union. The interest rate can be better in that case. I took that approach.
It’s hard to say right now without doing research. I would get the rate that the companies they mention would offer and then the rate from your financial institution.
Thank you so much for talking about the anxiety of life. My husband sometimes just does not get it. I use to be able to ride T of T now it give me panic attacks. I need more open space than in years past. Glad to know it is just not me ❤️
We always stayed in value hotels before we bought into dvc. We couldn't have ever stayed deluxe without dvc. We look at it that we have payed for our hotel for our next 40 years of vacation.
The problem with DVC is the problem with all timeshares: constraint on your time and unnecessary long term commitment. You are basically giving up freedom and flexibility of when you can (or want) to go to as Disney in order to try and save money. You have to plan your life around this thing you are paying and committed to. My advice? Stay off property and build loyalty with a hotel chain program like Hilton, Marriott, Hyatt, etc. Go when and where you want to go. DVC is just a way to keep Disney fans tied to an ecosystem and make them believe they own a piece of Disney...but it's just a term contract. Life changes and the way you feel about Disney now may not be the same in a few years.
We paid cash for our contract (resale, several years ago at what now feels like a steal), so like Jerry I don't factor that cost in when I figure the "value" of my points (although if I wanted to, I'd just take my purchase price and divide it over the number of years I had on my contract when I bought it.) I just consider the dues the "cost" of my points. So for what we pay for dues on 200 points, we get 2 weeks in Disney every year at a deluxe resort, for almost the same price as it would cost for one week at a value resort. (Or about 3 nights at a deluxe.) And when we bought into DVC we were value resort people. Every few years we'd splurge on a couple nights at a deluxe and it whet our appetite for the "better life." DVC was our way of getting the deluxe life at value prices.
Jerry is a total salesman like all others. He said it's an investment because you can sell it for more. Controversial statement because he said earlier that if you are going to Disney at least once every other year then buying DVC is the way to go. if you are such a die hard Disney fan to where you buy DVC you are not buying it to sell it later for profit, you are buying it to use it.
Great show :) I had a few ideas regarding future episodes. I wouldn't be hurt if you didn't use them LOL. For those who are visual learners it might be nice to see the process of buying a contract, buying a second/multiple contract, managing your points in various scenarios, renting your points, selling your contract. Maybe a video journal of Pete's journey :) I realize for some of these there are so many factors that influence decision making but a basic video on each subject would be awesome. I LOVE the FAQ shows. They have helped me and has me all fired up on buying in (Thanks a lot Pete LOL). I feel though a more focused video on specific subjects where you can go deeper into the particular subject matter would be amazing. Thanks for considering.
yes im a dvc member also love it very much.. now if you want to stay in the bungaloo for a night yea its almost $3000.oo a night but also it is AROUND 115 points per night. Well if you only have 200 points well your only going to be able to stay 1 night. Thats alot sorry thats just me . I end up paying cash for the bungaloo for one night and then stay for a week at polly at a studio for around 135 points lets say. Thats how i do it..
Its still a timeshare no matter how you look at it, you are basically prepaying for 10 years worth of hotel stays based on the current cost and no matter if you pay cash or finance. You really dont start getting your moneys worth until after the resort costs equal your purchase cost.
I see dvc as s prepaid hotel room and I've found if I was traveling to other places around the country rci has places to stay. There is an exchange fee but totally worth it when you get to use your dvc points.
Renting can be as easy or as complex as you make it. for the simple, you go to a DVC "rental store" and tell the agend where and when you want to stay. you'll probably have a downpayment to make. Then they will advertise to the DVC owners of your desire to rent points (they may send out email blasts every few hours with all rooms people want). If a DVC owner has the particular points you need, they will contact the rental place, say "hey ill take that vacation". Store will then verify dates/location are available, and ask the DVC owner to book it, with the actual vacationer's information (name/ address etc) . Once DVC member has a confirmed reservation, they send that confirmation to the rental store, rental store tells renter about it, and gets payment (maybe x% now, remaning % #days before you arrive). Renter should have the reservation on their MDE account, and will be able to do things like book restaurants and fast passes, etc. And then just go on vacation. It's really like booking a hotel room, except you may not get it immediately. Alternatively, renter can look for points on their own (forums, craigslist, etc) and basically do the same thing. But now the renter has to do all the leg work, and takes a larger risk. Why? Even with store rentals, the DVC member can just cancel the room if they decide they need the points, or if they don't pay their dues, or w/e. and the renter now doesn't have a room. With store rentals, you at least have a champion in your corner to get you a room, as they have legal teams to go after the DVC member for breaking a contract (and i hear it can be pretty bad for the DVC renter) IF you rented on your own, you'd be on hyour own to get a new hotel room, and try and sue the DVC member.
You'll save more by renting directly from people on DIS boards, but it is harder to find someone to rent you the points for your trip. I used one of the rental stores for $17 per point and I'd recommend it due to the convenience and resort selection available through those stores. You will spend $2-$3 dollars more per point, but it's much simpler and they allow you to pay it off over a period of time, if that suits you.
"It's going to cost me $105 to stay at Polynesian for a week." Yeah if you completely ignore the tens of thousands of dollars in upfront investment plus the thousands per year in maintenance fees you pay, sure, you got a steal... -_- Most forums I've read say you need to go yearly for 15-20 years, before you start seeing any real savings. DVC is not an investment. It is a splurge, and if you make peace with that fact, you will enjoy it far more than you will if you're trying to justify how much it costs.
As yall are talking about the interest rate on the financing for the DVC purchase, I am questioning would it be a good idea to do a home equilty loan, and use that money to purchase a DVC membership outright and then you can have a lower interest rate on the finance......just my thoughts as you were talking. You stated that DVC to date has kept its value well, so if you get into a bind, you can always sell the membership and then pay off what you borrowed through the equity loan. What do yall think?
Can any of the DVC members out there answer this for me? Say I wanted to stay in a DVC 1br Studio by renting from an owner? Would the price of let’s say a weekend stay be significantly cheaper than if I just booked the room direct through Disney? Sorry if it’s a dumb question.
Generally, yes. Two things you can play around with to compare prices would be a DVC rental calculator (Google that) and the official Disney website that will show you cash rack rates for the rooms.
What about the length of contract? Beach Club expires 2042, Saratoga is 2054 and Copper Creek is 2068. Why does the cost per point not go down based on when it expires? You get 26 more years buying Copper Creek compared to Beach Club!!
Appeal of a particular resort is what drives the price up. Beach Club and Boardwalk are within walking distance of Epcot and are very popular during the cheap point seasons of Food & Wine. Copper Creek is less desirable because it's not within walking distance of the more "adult" park and the rooms are smaller. Plus, I've heard average age of ownership is about 12 years, so people tend not to think that long term with their purchase. It's difficult to imagine your vacation desires in 50 years.
IT does, sort of. I think Key West has the 2 exp. date contracts. I would think the earlier dated contracts would be slightly cheaper on the resale, as woudl you pay $100 for 20 years of vacations or $100 for 30 years of vacations?
@ghosthost my take from all of this is to do what Pete Werner is doing. Buy 75 points direct from Disney, then resale for the balance I want/need. Market on resale dictates price based on resort and length of contract. But Disney still has right of refusal. Which isn't a bad thing, since it helps maintain value...I'm catching on...lol
I know a lot of people who will say DVC isn’t worth it. It’s all so relative and personal. Whether a DVC membership is “worth it” can only be judged by the family using it or buying it. I know people who aren’t big Disney fans or who maybe plan to go one or twice in a lifetime and for them, I can see their perspective on why it would not be worth it for their family. If going to Disney is a huge stretch on your budget and you have to save for years to go, DVC is also probably not for you. If accommodations are the last thing on your mind when booking a Disney vacation and you don’t care about room size or location and are happy to stay anywhere, on or off property, DVC is probably not for you. I didn’t know I was a Disney person until I met my husband, whose family have gone since WDW opened. My brother in law built a spreadsheet to show the break even point at how many stays it would take to be “in the money” on your DVC purchase. He did it to convince himself it would be worth it and eventually did it for me too. Our Disney sales rep actually had my brother in law help him with another client because of his math skills on proving DVC is worth it to the right people. Between all of us we own points at Bay Lake, Beach Club, Old Key West, Boardwalk, and Saratoga. My personal favorite is Bay Lake. Accommodations are important to us and when we travel, we want to do so comfortably. We all have budgets, of course, but I am the type of person that would delay a trip if needed so I can buy first class seats and enjoy my flight. The same holds true for my hotel room. We will soon have two kids under two so having a full kitchen and laundry when we travel is a non-negotiable for me. I won’t even look at anything else, if I’m being totally honest. We took our 17 month old son on his first trip to Disney in Jan. We used our points for our home resort at Bay Lake and having walking, instant access to Magic Kingdom is priceless when you have children. I could go on and on. I sincerely dislike when folks make blanket statements about DVC being a waste of money bc it implies that those of us who own it haven’t done our research and are stupid (hint- most of us aren’t). For the same reason I would never say everyone should buy DVC, because they shouldn’t.
Question: what is your experience with availability for the concierge level at AKL? I'm looking in November 2019 and there's absolutely nothing. Is there any chance that waitlist would work in this case? Thanks! And love these DVC episodes!
Member since 2004 (direct) and added more points a few years ago. Today, could sell all 300 points and get 100% of what I paid for them. So 15 stays for just maintenance fees. I won't sell but that's some serious math.
pete there is no equity in any timeshare doesn't matter if it's DVC. You can't give these things away since you're stuck in them for life and can't get out.
Historically, that's not been the case with DVC, unlike other timeshares. Some people bought in at $50 a point and could now sell their contracts for $100 a point, or more. Of course, there's no guarantee those sort of gains will continue, particularly as DVC continues to restrict resale and contracts get closer to expiration. I would argue the value of resales will either flatline or begin to slowly decline because of recent changes DVC made to resales, but that's really just a guess on my part.
DVC members do not pay for parking when staying at ANY Disney resort with points. They also don't pay for parking when staying with cash, but only at DVC resorts on a DVC reservation. DVC members DO pay for parking when staying at a Disney property paying with cash, in a regular non-DVC hotel room. It's a bit confusing to remember, but those are the 3 situations. Hope that helps.
Just to follow-up, I should clarify that I'm referring only to parking at resorts, not at the parks. Parking is free at the parks for annual pass holders and those staying at any Disney hotel. So for example, if you are a DVC owner with regular park tickets and you stay at the Econo Lodge, you still have to pay for parking at the parks.
Particularly the part where they shrug off a 10%+ interest rate just because that's around what you pay for credit card debt... YIKES!! You guys really need to get a finance guy on this show. I'm embarrassed for this channel.
Could you please address using DVC points at foreign parks? We are scheduled to be in Paris at Disneyland the end of May, and the points charts for the hotels haven't been released yet. Is this normal???
not sure if normal, as DVC doesn't "extend" to the foreign parks. Now, you can probably trade the points to use ad the "neighborhood" hotels that work in conjunction with DVC, but the conversion rate is bad.
DVC IS NOT AN INVESTMENT!....ITS JUST PREPAYING YOUR DISNEY VACATION. RENTING POINTS FOR THAT EVERY OTHER YEAR DISNEY VISIT IS LESS COSTLY WITHOUT THE COMMITMENT! Studios are hard to get at 7 months out and 11 months out for holidays weeks!
investment - the action or process of investing money for profit or material result. I'd say DVC, by definition, IS an investment. the question now becomes, how good of an investment is it? IF you konw you will take X number of Disney vacations in the next Y years, then it might actually be better.
What about the term of the timeshare. If you pay $20,000 for your points and then you have 20 years left isn't that like $1,000 a year for the timeshare on top of the maintenance fees?
Yes, that is correct. But if you are planning on a vacation hotel that would cost you $1,500 (and go up every year), you still are saving. (even if the maintenance fees go up, they still haven't surpassed the rack rate for said room)
Ten thousand dollars for one week's accommodation!? How is that justifiable when you can rent a huge house for less than three hundred dollars per night? What am I missing here - is it about insisting on staying at Disney?
There’s a company that doesn’t care about your credit and will finance any property for DVC? Sorry, but that doesn’t sound like a good company. Take care of your necessities before your luxuries.
@@wickedwood04 not the daily like in daily rate room. They come on every 4 days or so. But these units have washer/dryers, so if you really need your towles done, just wash them at night, put in the dryer in the morning, and boom clean towels.
When someone uses the term "investment" in talking about any timeshare, you know they are trying to sell you rotten goods. If you do want to enjoy DVC renting points will always be a better deal than buying , every single time.
Investment is definitely the wrong word. You're pre-paying for your hotel room at a discount. I'm curious about your statement about renting points, though. At $17/pt rental, it would cost you $1190 for 5 nights next week at the Boardwalk (Sun-Thur). If you bought DVC at boardwalk, it would cost 70 points. For 70pts at $115/pt resale and $7/pt/yr for maintenance, you would pay $19,320 total (I know maintenance goes up, but so will point rental costs) for 1610 points until 2042. This works out to around $12/pt over the life of the DVC contract. So you DO save money ($5 x 70pts x 23yrs = $8K), but you DO have to pay up front.
Actually, that is 100% incorrect. Unlike any timeshare I am aware of, there is a huge resale market for DVC. I have watched the “used points” market skyrocket the last 5 years. Disney holds a ROFR on every contract and buys back many, many contracts every month. This helps hold the prices higher on the resale market, thus allowing Disney to continually raise prices for “new points”. Amazingly, even though a contract sold 10 years ago is 20% “used up” it sells for more today than at any point in time previous. At some point, that will no longer hold true, but that day is still in the future for every DVC property.
@@keiththompson1265 -- The only reason why DVC has any sort of value is because Disney's ability to manipulate prices with ROFR and the Disney name adding "magic." There's no actual real estate value to Magic. If DVC was truly confident their product is worth what they claim it is, they would not need ROFR.
@@JustPeople which is why I did not refer to it as "investment property". It is not. It is, whether by manipulation or otherwise, a time share that is currently increasing in value, and quite easily resold by the purchaser. My comment was in regard to the post stating you can't get rid of a DVC contract, or at least not get your money back.
