Game-changing investment? Why VW is spending big on electric car innovator Rivian | DW News 

Gelly? lmao

BYD software is not that good given they are a very new company. Furthermore as a western company you don’t want to rely on Chinese software for your products.

True, the irrational fear of superior Chinese software is a factor. Especially when you're misspelling their names.

@@ev.c6 BYD has WAY better Software than Legacy Automakers in the US and Germany. And Tesla is NOT a Legacy Automaker, contrary to what the guest said. They're disrupting those Legacy Automakers and will continue to cause LESS vehicles with ICE engines being made. They're profitable on their EVs and others are not, other than maybe BYD, depending on how you allocate.

no, they're not. Rivian is a premium American brand, not a shady Chinese one

The point is that VW is trying to get a better foothold on the US EV market with this deal, but I also asked him specifically about competing with "the likes of Tesla and BYD" in that interview

US returning to save Europe, once again. By inches and miles....

They don’t generate a lot of money like consumer

It was only about 6 months ago that Rivian was "Allowed" to start selling Delivery Vans to companies OTHER than Amazon. They will continue to ramp that up over the coming years. Both Ford and Rivian will benefit at they continue to make more Delivery Vans / Commercial Platforms.

Not really. Rivian has great products, with the second best infotainment system in any car manufacturer in the western market. Audi, Mercedes, and BMW have all shown how incompetent they are building software. They have no idea what they are doing. This is a good move by VW. Let’s see if it pays off.

And VW is now a badge engineered Xpeng.

Add the tariffs to that fight

Chinese EVs? No…. LOL. Nothing Chinese made is a threat.

Not really. If it goes to quality, all 4 suck. If it goes to tec, tesla is miles a head to anyone. But chinese EV makers are by far the cheapest and fastest in production. To this u may wanna add that at least in europe nb really trusts them. Most people think their is a good chance that the chinese EV burst at random into flames (no matter if its true or not). Simply said their is still nb out their selling mid range (price) high quality EV's. I think thats what they are aiming for

True but China's EVs won’t come to Europe, either. China desperately needs an open EU market to outlet their BEV b/c of their overproduction, but that’s the exact reason why not. Saying as if Chinese cars were an another option is a delusion.

Wow. Is that the way the do it Europe? US refineries have their own power plants ran on natural gas. They aren't on the grid.

As a chemical engineering student I can tell you that this doesn't work out. The most energy is used as heat. This is mostly produced by burning fossils not using electricity.

He's NOT doing a good job on analyzing Tesla, if he thinks that VW is going to catch or surpass Tesla in EVs. If you mean the "Tesla and Apple are both Special" then Yes. However he contradicts himself by stating that VW will catch them.

Thanks for the pretense.... Shame it's devoid of any relevant knowledge... "It's not what we don't know that gets us in trouble, but what we know for sure that just ain't so" Thank you, for the proof of that Axiom,

@HenkvanHoek Maybe there is a master plan, to let Rivian fail and buy tech. VW can make Rivian vehicles at a much lower cost than Rivian can on its own. Rivian doesn't have the economies of scale to be as competitive. Almost no startups have been able to survive in the Auto space....it is a tough business.

They supposedly did. Audi secretly shipped some vehicles to have rivian software was encoded into them before the investment.

VW did waste around $4 Billion on their software unit however they already fixed most of the issues. The software is way better than it was. VW also has a partnership with Xipeng and their software is apparently very good.

YT experts are always perfect.... In hindsight....

Legacy automakers aren't able to create EVs because it is a completely different engineering mindset. Rivian's electric motors, battery pack design and software is on par with Tesla. The Rivian trucks are incredible, but they are too damn expensive. The pandemic had a devastating financial impact on the company and now they don't have the $$$ to scale up manufacturing to production costs. Remember, it took Tesla 11 years to reach profitability. I hope this works because the ONLY way we will see widespread EV adoption is if there is real competition with Tesla. Right now, Tesla is the only legitimate EV on the market in the USA. That's a terrible thing, not a good thing. I really wish Ford would do the same thing with Lucid.

Rivan lost $1.45B a quarter. That $7 Billion wouldn't last long.

@@almac9203 they are gross profitably this year they don’t NEED it to last that long

The past is not a reflection of the future.... For example the R1 models have just been revised to drastically cut their production costs.... And 7 billion is what they have on hand right now of course they will continue to accrue revenue through sales... But if you think they're going bankrupt soon feel free to short them.... I'm sure the short sellers are feeling terrific since the Volkswagen deal went through

High performance seems like a ridiculous requirement, if by that you mean "speed". It is about price/overall cost, range, safety, reliability, service availability, looks, cool factor, i would say. Almost every time i see Tesla they are going very slow😀 200hp car with EV torque and no manual transmission is rocket-ship for most people in Europe. Even the 150hp VWs are quite easily doing 200kmh on German highways.

What are you even talking about? R u saying a VW can drive faster than a Tesla?

@@Joe44944 no. Where did you get that idea from?😀

Is Rivan tech as good as Lucid? My understanding is Lucid has cutting edge EV technology.

@@almac9203 It is not about which tech is better. It is the cost of mass production of the tech. Lucid can built a cutting edge EV that cost so much that only a few people can by it. This true for Rivian right now. If They can't build a car that they can make money on then it don't really matter.

Luxury brands tend to produce less, but tend to have higher profitability.... And long-term profitability is next to impossible to determine for a startup, except for true believers and YT experts... Who are proven to be clairvoyant or fools in hindsight.

Stahlwille are the BEST

Not so much any more too much out sourcing!

For ICE tech but not EV tech and infrastructure

Obviously they suck at EV tech, that’s why they need Rivian. And Rivian needs the capitol infusion. This collaboration should work if they don’t screw it up.

German technology is for those who are enamored with over engineering

What do you mean?

Plug in hybrids with 40-50 range in the US where the average commute is 40 minutes is farcical. He’s a corporate stooge.

VW has a 200B debt just like Toyota. Tesla has no debt.

''Tesla has no debt' ? lmao

No problem, Elon promised again it is just around the corner... If you believe that I have a bridge I need to sell you ;)

Peter Rawlinson (Lucid Motors CEO and former Tesla chief engineer), May 10, 2024.: Chinese automakers are still *"years and years behind" Tesla on EV technology.* *"If you look at the advance in core EV technology, they're still years and years behind Tesla,"* The former Tesla engineer said that Chinese EVs had progressed "immeasurably" in recent years, and were now superior to their western counterparts "in terms of fit and finish quality." However, Rawlinson thought *their engineering was still lacking.* *"In terms of the elegance of their drive train technology, the batteries, the way things are integrated … it's not even close," he said.* *"I was looking at a number of the units on display at the Geneva Motor Show and the engineering was very disappointing."*

Lies. Tesla and Chinese ev's doing great and very affordable

Good luck with your bus pass

Teslas are amazing,,,,, except when it comes to resale value,,,,

Porsche Taycan beats Tesla

Tesla beats Porsche and parents company VW, where it counts.... Market cap....

@@nc3826 In EU Tesla counts as chinese import. We do not need chinese imports

@@KozmikGizmo I'm glad you prefer dieselgate over Chinese Imports.... But all the worthwhile EV IP is coming from China, or America..... Close the door after the last EU car is built

it keeps evolving. Japanese manufactures have been prosper for decades. Then it was Korea. Now it may be turn for China.

I miss their lovely reliability

After the protectionist IRA, the EU might make it hard for VW to bring US cars into the EU.

they have a very good chance. Remember when Huawei was gonna beat the west in 5G, and then they just got banned? Same thing will happen with Chinese cars...

VW is the world's biggest automotive company by revenue (and second only to Toyota in terms of units sold). Hardly a "European loser"!

Europe is the only place where they pretend a continent is a country.... Except Australia of course where a continent is a country lol.... VW is a German company,..... And don't say some of its production facilities are outside of Germany, and in the rest of Europe... Some of its production is in China and the US, it doesn't make it a Chinese or a US company...

Why do you think a 55" lcd TV is now 400$ and it was 4000$ 15 years ago? Wouldn't manufacturers just keep selling it for 4000$ if they could go away with it? Why can't they? Yes companies are here to make money. But they are generally making money by providing value to customers.

@@lukazupie7220 The price decline in large screen LCD TV's is largely the result of a these (list not exhaustive) factors: (1) Basic research in electro-luminescence to create improved backlights; (2) Improved fabrication, particularly in ITO printing o circuit traces in the panel; (3) Improved manufacturing of the polarizing filters in such displays; (4) A rapidly growing market, compared to tings like cars that most people who want one already have (5) Lack of viable alternatives -- projection TV and LED-based ones exist in niches still. Projection TVs in particular require decent quality optics. (6) Room for innovation in things such as surface coatings. (7) More diverse manufacturing landscape. There were far more companies either already making televisions or computer monitors than there were automakers large enough to even contemplate pivoting to electrics. TL;DR: "competition" Note that the word "software" did not occur above.

VW Cariad users might disagree

@disorganizedorg Those are some really good points, but I would add using standardized software, would be short term gain at best. In a competitive market a company has to make bold moves, that provides value for the customer. To be a leading company, it has to lead the market in areas where others can't. Tesla hasn't refreshed its models, because it was so far ahead, it didn't have to. It used its lead to build its profits margin and CapX. Tesla isn't holding back on expansion, it is refining its expansion moves. The next refresh will disrupt the industry, again. For example they Cybertruck may look strange, but it based on some really advanced tech: 48v architecture, steer by wire, 800v and etc, these are bold moves. By the time other automakers realize how important they are, it will be too late to catch them. Many question Tesla's "FSD", but this is important to many drivers, who are not the most comfortable driving. I don't think partnerships with other competitors is the way to go.... because it limits the speed a brand can develop. In a fast developing sector why would company make itself less nimble by teaming up?? It makes more sense to buy or make a startup, develop new tech and products. Once that tech and products are mature, bring to the parent company. Hybrids cost more to make and maintain. It may seem like a good transition point, but the transition to EV will be rapid, this lull is temporary, due to higher inflation and interest rates. EVs where very expensive and now that they are on par with ICE, it is too late for hybrids to really be truly competive. This is not to say there isn't a market for hybrids, but EVs will rule in the end. What many legacy Automakers aren't realizing is that Chinese Brands are spreading World Wide. This means that most legacy brands will struggle to export leading to higher costs in the domestic markets. Exports, increase the economies of scale and this is the key to reducing costs. Tariffs will only slow the Chinese brands market penetration, not stop it. Eventually, consumer demand and General Economics will overwhelm the political will to maintain high tariffs.

@@tonespeaks what will happen is the Chinese brands will get made inside tariff umbrellas and its game over if the legacy manufacturers haven’t adjusted. The US dealt with challengers in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. They adapted and survived despite how bleak it looked at times. This is just the first time Europe and Japan had to face a newcomer.

Not everything is about USA, VW mostly sells cars in Europe. I think 50mile range cars should definitely exist, even EVs, not just hybrids. I don't even do 50miles a year on my electric moped.😀 imagine paying for big battery, it would make no sense. My pathetic battery can't even hold 10miles, but it makes sense for me. Many people use their cars mostly to go to work that is few miles away.

@@lukazupie7220 when the expert is talking about the American market it is about the US. VW sells lots of cars in The US. I was at one of their dealerships two weeks ago. Conceptually, plug in Hybrids are a desperate move by ICE manufacturers to stay relevant. Functionally it is an ICE with a gimmicky 50 mile EV range added. Have fun with that. It effectively is an ICE with a second gimmicky EV power source which just increases the parts and therefore the number of things that can break. It’s also much more expensive than a traditional ICE which brings us back to the original problem of EVs. More EV infrastructure is needed and they are too expensive for what they are.

The average driver in the U.S. drives 39.7 miles per day, according to the most recent Department of Transportation statistics.

No one can compete against high government subsidies. Its a government that tesla is competing , not byd

Tesla is one of the few BEV car companies with profit. Check the document "Q4 and FY 2023 Update". Also Yahoo finance provides this information.

@@williamzabiski7653 stop making me like china 😭

Tesla is not a car company

@@tjunglec yes it's just a money printer for Elon, whatever gets investors wet at the moment, or maybe he just makes an entirely new company that only does that one specific thing (poorly)

Where did u get that from? Cheaper to produce?

@@lukazupie7220 essentially is Electric motor controlled by computer. Amount of components 4 times less then in traditional car, and less complex to make

@@dirtyharry6297 But batteries more than make up for it, so EV is actually more expensive to make. Unless you want to buy it without battery.😀

@@lukazupie7220 nonsense

@@dirtyharry6297 can you provide any source for that?

🤣🤣🤣🤣

New Ford

I'm sorry but there was a Nikola Tesla before a Tesla EV. .

Might have been a decent start if they were the ones innovating here, but fighting tooth and nail to stick with the old system for short-term gains isn't doing them any favors now.

Hydrogen unfortunatelly doesn´t make any financial sense to go into... No infrastructure anywhere and crazy expenisve. Takes around 180 EUR to refuel a hydrogen car at current prices. Planes and cargo ships, sure but cars not gonna happen. At least if there isn´t some crazy new technology to make hydrogen production cost effective, which I can tell you is very unlikely as someone who works in a chem industry. Also the fact that not that many people would find it comfortable to sit on top of higly pressurized hydrogen tank.

@@user-bx7ye2zx5x Thanks for the input. I think providing the necessary infastructure for electric charge cars will be equally problematic not to mention how and where will all this extra electricity demand be produced, how to deal with waste batteries and indeed their production. All emerging technologies take time and money to develop as i'm sure you know, but it seems EVs are the preferred way forward. Let's hope for cold fusion. 😉

@@ronniew3229 Hydrogen has no path to affordable personal transportation. EVs, in contrast, are already much cheaper to drive than the current fossil fuels. $10 to fill up, or $200? Game over. Infrastructure needs to be built out for EVs, but China is showing us that the infrastructure is certainly doable. And the US has added capacity at a fast enough rate in the past and can do so in the future.

No hydrogen fuel, no hydrogen stations, no hydrogen cars

@@ronniew3229 i love how EV fear mongers use the same disproved talking points.... Good luck Googling them... Including a Coal Roller asking, where do you recycle your EV batteries recycled LOL... But they usually don't fantasize about cold fusion, ;) Once everybody has made a good faith effort educating themselves... Then a reasonable discussion can take place.... But it's a waste of time until everyone is open and honest and well informed.... Until then,,,,, Thanks for your disingenuous input. 🙃🙃

True, it's Elon's piggy bank.

Many things probably shock you 😂

nah, BYD is just the next Huawei...

The Morgan of the EV world? Tesla produces the best-selling in the world, EV and non-EV.

BYD is notorious for catching fire, there are low quality junk, made in China, so no.

​@@JigilJigilTesla is also low quality junk. Similar quality

ancient news

@@nc3826 cool story

for historians