Graeme Thomson on John Martyn's "lifelong grudges and huge, messy explosion of records" 

Saw him at Reading Hexagon, he came on the stage completely drunk, slurred to the audience, almost fell, sat down picked up his guitar and gave one of the most amazing concerts i have ever had the pleasure of attending. How he did it i have no idea but im so glad he did..

I've read Small Hours and found it an interesting read if not a little embellished in places - however the above discussion is thoroughly disrespectful (guffaws and all) and one gets the impression those involved have a very limited understanding and glib view of John Martyn's music and personality. To contrast him with Van Morrison and label him as 'even more difficult' is utterly insulting and remiss. I attended many John Martyn concerts (most absolutely incredible, some less so) and met him on several occasions. I never once saw him be dismissive or sneering towards his fans, neither did I see him turn his back on an audience whilst playing to them - other than to adjust his amps/equipment or communicate with other band members. He often joined fans in the bar after gigs and bought them drinks - he could be very generous with his time in that respect. Van Morrison on the other hand is a total narcissist, thoroughly unpleasant towards his fans and audience (I've literally seen him turn his back to the crowd and not address them once) and has absolutely no generosity whatsoever inside him - he genuinely IS a nasty piece of work. John Martyn was no doubt a complicated and difficult individual at times as many artists tend to be, especially with management. He had plain to see mental health and addiction issues. But he wasn't in any way comparable to Van Morrison and that should be made very clear.

I was personally acquainted with John thru a mutual Scottish friend of his called Alan who like me had left Scotland to go live & work in Hamburg in 78/79 and so it just was that if John was playing in Hamburg we would catch his gig and go for a few pints together before or after the gig or both throughout the 80,s to mid 90,s. It also always amused me as a Scot born and bred how John would flip between his articulated English accent and a very Glasgow accent, often mid sentence which he did with ease and himself seemed to love doing. Obviously I cant incriminate myself as to what I had that John was rather partial too but when ever we went to a bar toilet cubicle together it wasn't for a cuddle lol. So yes myself, Alan and John all had our wild sides but every conversation I remember us having was I would say of mature adults albeit 3 adults age wise all influenced by the 60s 70,s era and goes without saying how that would influence any artist or music lovers of that time. One of my favorite after gig memories was after he had played in the Markthalle and where I met Annie for the first time who was accompanying him on that tour and while Alan & John caught up myself and Annie had a great blether and devastating when I heard not long after of her fatal accident. Anyway after a gig it was often down to the Zwiebel pub which was one of Johns favorite down near the Fishmarket on the banks of the Elbe. It was the most unassuming dark, smokey, tucked away bar you could imagine but always full as it boasted the best Guinness in Hamburg and also popular for Scottish Irish music and on one such occasion I was fortunate to have an early SD camcorder to capture Hamish Imlach playing there and a good one hour of that evening uploaded to my own youtube channel. Hamish as most know was a great friend of Johns and perhaps one of the best live performances of Hamish that was maybe captured with all his banter. I did see John play in Edinburgh and Glasgow a few times but loving the man and his music so much it became too painful in later years to go see him playing in a wheelchair and also vocally a shadow of his former self. Anyway, anyone interested I was also fortunate to record to VHS tape one of his best gigs in Germany when he played newly recorded material from Grace & Danger and also to be found on my own youtube channel after digitising and improving both video and audio using modern software and worth a listen. Anyway, was just interesting to hear others talk about someone I was acquainted with myself and he was for sure a larger than life character, uniquely talented guitarist and super unique vocalist albeit a man flawed in many different ways, but then aren't we all.

Among the many times I saw him was at Warwick University in the late 1970s. He came on stage with a bottle of red wine and a pint glass full of something which may not have been beer. At one stage he had to borrow a pick from a member of audience. Played a beautiful set, then someone asked him if he'd make an appearance at a sit-in protest that was being held somewhere else on campus later in the night. He said he would, but I'm sure many of us were thinking that he was just being polite. We went up to the sit-in anyway, and sure enough he turned up and sat on the floor and jammed for quite a while. Magical evening.

I wrote to John Martyn (c/o Island Records) just after 'Sapphire' had been released as I was hoping he'd tell me where I could obtain a copy of 'Live at Leeds' which at that time was the only album of his I did not have. I'd given up on receiving a response, but months later a letter did arrive. In it John Martyn explained that he didn't even have a copy of it himself but that Island might eventually release it. The letter appeared to have been dictated by John and written by his then wife Annie. The signature 'John Martyn' was almost indecipherable, but alongside was written 'John Martyn honest!' and also 'Annie x'. So John was probably drunk at the time......

I fell in love with John Martyn’s music as a 16 year old, and whilst not always loving everything he produced, I have always held him in the highest esteem, as a musician. I was fortunate to see him in the 70’s and into the 80’s, and I always marvelled at his performances, whether solo, or with an 8 piece band. That said, I have to admit to being a particularly huge fan of his 70’s performances, where I’m sure he was at least as stoned as most of us in the audience. And I’m quite definitely a fan of his 70’s recordings, although certainly not exclusively. But he was an incredible artist, and was certainly one of the pioneers of ambient music. And he certainly made a huge impact on me.

Great show....i worked for Island Records between 86 to 92 and every opportunity to meet jonh , i was told to avoid him..wished i'd ignored them...x

John was a legend. Great musician and singer-songwriter.😊

My brother Peter went to see John Martyn and decided to down a few pints beforehand. Peter was in a pub and saw a bloke start arguing with another fella and then wallop the big bloke decked the other one. My brother thought 'kin ell' and also thought 'That big fella looks a bit like John Martyn'. Peter went to the gig and John walked on stage and Peter thought 'That's that bloke who just knocked someone out in the pub a bit earlier!' It was !

John was always a mystery wrapped in an enigma

Graeme, I had no idea that there was a book on John Martyn out there. I'll be getting a copy as soon as I can get my hands on one. The guy was a complete renegade who wasn't afraid to give the finger to 'the industry', even if it cost him. His live shows were erratic but always brilliant. I miss him.

I saw him probably half a dozen times through his career. Whenever he talked to the audience or the band you could tell he was on something. Sometimes he was very lucid, others he'd ramble and mumble as if he were talking some odd language from Middle Earth. Yet whenever he started playing, he was completely into the song, and always sung clearly and from the heart. He clearly completely immersed himself in whatever piece he was playing, and that intensity projected into the crowd, resulting in a spiritual connection, which is the only way I can describe it. He was truly unique, a one-off, and I' so glad he came into the world, because my life and my musical journey would have been ever the poorer if he hadn't. It's almost like he sacrificed his own life in the end, in order to give us, his audience, something so special that no other artiste could ever come close when it comes to the way he connected with us as we listened. Had he not self-destructed, we wouldn't have this wonderful body of work to delve into, which I do constantly.

Love John Martyn's music and I feel sad that he seems to have been so self-destructive. It's testament to the powerful charm of Martyn's personality that he was apparently well-loved - in spite of his quite 'monstrous' behaviour. I saw him live, playing a mesmerising solo electric set at Glastonbury '84. I remember it being pretty 'far out' and very loud, the musician barely acknowledging the crowd as he went his own merry way, in his unique musical bubble. Special.

Great interview. Love JM . This book looks very interesting as I am intreaged by his life. That first line in Bless the weather album ' looking at me you'd never find out what a working man's about, raving all night sleeping away the day' I think sums up what John Martyn thought was his path. His musical legacy is right up there.

The really good ones are always hard to deal with. That level of talent and commitment is its own curse... or blessing. Johns' music was ahead of the curve. He pushed the envelope to destruction.

Saw J.M in Chester in the 70s..I've never forgotten it !! RIP big Man😎

I've seen jm live many times and met him on a number of occasions each time I met a different person. Love his music so much

I appreciate it’s a three way conversation, but I felt there were too many interruptions when Graeme was trying to answer their questions, which felt a bit disrespectful towards him. Anyway, I first saw Big John on that famous first Old Grey Whistle Test appearance and was really taken aback by his performance. In the end I saw him more than any other artist, all around the country from Redcar, Kendal, Warrington, Manchester, Liverpool, Sheffield, etc., and he always was very entertaining and funny. My favourite. RIP Big John.

The three-way split-screen works brilliantly. Great to see a bit more of Mark. I met John Martyn once after a great concert in Edinburgh back in the 90’s. It wasn’t a long conversation or especially enlightening but it was still one of the thrills of my life to meet one of my absolute musical heroes. The concert was also absolutely brilliant. I’ve just ordered the book now. Another superb episode.

I'm a music book junkie - I've read four in past ten days, for example - and Small Hours is one of the best I've ever read. An excellent read, whether you know much/anything about Martyn or not. 👏🏻 👏🏻

Thanks - great interview - looking forward to getting a copy of the book. John Martyn is one of my most loved singer-songwriters. I saw him twice - albeit in the 90s - and both times the audience was treated to an evening of sublime music and drunk, offensive behaviour.

Bless the weather that brought John Martyn to us.

Fascinating discussion. I adore John Martyn’s peerless ‘70s records, I think they just sound better and better with age. I’m pretty sure this was mentioned on a podcast when he passed away, but there were clues to his self-destructive behaviour even when he was onstage. He’d finish playing some exquisite piece of music like ‘One Day Without You’ and then immediately make a grotesque noise hacking up a big lump of phlegm. It was as if the dark side of his personality couldn’t bear too much sweetness and light. He had to do something to burst the bubble of his own talent. It’s never a good idea to confuse the man with the music he makes; John Martyn is a classic example of the deeply flawed genius.

Graeme Thomson should write a book with Beverley as she must have some really interesting stories pre John about her musical career, life and inspirations, her love for John and how it was coping on benefits in the 70’s raising three kids, how she managed it all. Then her picking up the guitar again. Beverley is often said to be bitter and holding grudges but most women would in those circumstances and she’s an interesting character in her own right and shouldn’t be solely defined by John. It would be a really cool read I think and would give her a nice retirement fund perhaps? Now I need to buy Small Hours the book online...

I am old enough and first saw John way back in the early 70s, I never did go to see him when he lost a leg, wanted to keep the image I had of him from previous times. Not that long ago I was asked what I felt was the greatest song ever made by a Scot, for me it is Solid Air, I don’t think I have ever seen a singer put absolutely every emotion in his body into performing it.

His Mother was Belgian. I had a fight with John Martyn in a pub in '92. Didn't stop me appreciating his amazing talent. Had a massive effect on my songwriting and playing. Have a listen.

What a brilliant interview.

Lived his last years round where I am. Never heard a bad word said about him here.

Coda - I saw John for the last time at one of his last gigs doing the whole of Solid Air at the Albert Hall fom his wheel chair. I was furious that the Albert Hall was nine tenths empty for such a great man. When he was wheeled off at the end, he raised both his arms to say goodbye and flapped them as if he was a beached whale with wings. His grin was as wide as existence itself. I cried. Such beautiful music from such a great man.

I worked at a record One stop wholesaler in Pennsylvania in the late 1970's. Our Polygram salesman was very cool. One of the promos he gave me was John Martyn, One World. I have the Deluxe addition CD for years. Every February- March for the last 43 years, I take ole Johnny Too bad out for a spin! Great album! I read an interview with John- he's off his nut drunk and he describes that US YES tour. It was the Tales from Topographic tour. I am a YES fan of 50 years, and when I read it, I went with drunken description. I am surprised he never hooked up with Rick Wakeman! Rick was quite the boozer at the time! Rick had played with the Strawbs, recorded with Al Stewart and Magna Carta. Martyn would have gotten on with Rick, and maybe even YES, had he tried! Oh well... Fatally flawed yet fabulous !

Fantastic interview with the author of an outstanding biography of John Martyn. It really is a wonderfully written book.

a word in your ear evening in the cosmic household.i was thinking to order and import this book to the netherlands when i red an article in the latest uncut edition.huge john martyn fan here.another terrific job done!

John and Beverly did not meet at the Chelsea Art College. Or at least that is not where John Martyn had his gig that week. It was over the road at Chelsea College of Science and Technology. A previous Bat Cat it had just joined London University in 1966. On the same day that John Martyn did his gig with us a girl in my maths group told me, because she knew I was interested in folk music, that quite a well known member of a jug band had just moved in next door. This happened to be Bervely. I think she was contemplating introducing me but within a few days John Martyn had moved in. Where they actually met I am not sure, since Beverly was not playing at our college that week. Maybe he also had a gig at the Art college but that seems unlikely. I was a big fan of his music but it was unforgivable how John Martyn treated Beverly.

Lovely interview thanks!

even after his death his ghosts can't be laid to rest

A fascinating interview, many thanks!

Great interview.I saw John in concert many times and it was never the same - which was wonderful. One of the last times I saw him was a Sunday night in Carlisle. I was visiting a friend who lived in Dumfries who is a massive JM fan we discovered the show was in the day before and got tix. He was promoting a new release called And and he and the band played a great gig.

Fantastic! Love John Martyn - same age - witnessed his decline first hand. I think his later album The Church with One Bell pretty much sums him up. Off to buy the book! Cheers.

Excellent stuff, gents. The book sounds right up my street, I'll be buying. Hoping the story about his "altercation" with Sid Vicious is in there! Particularly enjoyed your chat about "One World" too. What. An. Album.

I love road to ruin - they sounded great to me.

Thanks for covering John Martyn great stuff !!

I sat on the floor directly in front of John Martyn and Danny Thompson at a gig in 1986. They were drunk and sweaty and playing brilliantly. The between songs banter was intense and a bit scary...especially when J.Martyn mistook me for a girl.

33:24 'Van Morrison has never bothered a chart anywhere really has he' - Hmmm apart from THIRTEEN top 10 albums he's had in the last 20 years then

I learned to deal with the dichotomy man-artist with John Lennon. I learned English because of the Beatles, once I started understanding them in interviews though, I quickly realized that John in particular had a quite unpalatable side to him and would often just run his mouth and make little sense. It has affected my appreciation for his music a bit, hard to listen to Imagine and stuff like''Imagine no possession'' when you are singing from an estate in the English countryside which your assistant has found for you. Same, with Working class hero which is a completely delusional self-portrait. I could also mention the whole Love is answer thing when in fact all his life he has been quite belligerent and an absolute ass to his first wife and son. Still, a great artist who produced some amazing songs. I understand John was even a bit more troubled and I remain neutral not to speak ill of the dead but he was never preachy and that avoids a dangerous juxtaposition of the art with the man. I don't want to use the word ''genius'', it's an abused term and it's being thrown around too much, but he was a true, unique artist.

I’m revisiting a few of my favourite episodes and this one has to be right up there. John Martyn reminded me of my dad so much. He was an incurable alcoholic and could be a real nasty piece of work. He had two major stomach operations, the first at 30 when they removed half his stomach and a second at 50 when they removed have of what he had left. This, I hasten to add, never compromised his alcohol intake at all, if anything it increased. Before his second op, he went for a blood test and before he got back from the hospital we had a doctor banging on our front door saying he had never seen a lower blood count in a person who wasn’t dead. Apparently he had so much ulceration the only thing that kept him alive was the booze. And did he change his ways after that reminder of his own mortality? Well, I leave with a quote from the old bugger “If this didn’t kill me, nothing will.” He said that to me after he made me bring 4 cans of Stella into the hospital.

My mum took me to see john at Durham university i can get only have been 10 maybe older but he didn't turn up . I never did get to see him live . I would have loved to . My mum bumped into him once is skye and he invited her to a party but she didn't recognise him then he said" do you know whoi am John Martyn" and that was that 😊

16:00 I think perhaps that these are somewhat glib assumptions. I tend to believe that John was more concerned about being constrained by record companies, and management. And, in my, and a considerable number of my colleagues, would completely understand that. John Martyn wanted to embrace as much of the musical world, as he could. This meant that inevitably, he would occasionally fail. Or at least, fail in the eyes of those with vested (financial), interests in his “career” trajectory. The notion that John was “fearful” of success, is to diminish his courage, to take on the mainstream, and forge his own path. If he had spent the 80’s and beyond, attempting to replicate those beautiful recordings of the 70’s, he would have doubtless been castigated for not “moving on”. I can’t claim to love every track on Grace and Danger, Glorious Fool, etc., but I have found absolute gems on every album since One World (Despite this album representing the epitome of his writing and musicianship, for me, at least). Including in genres that I had never considered that he would embrace. This man wasn’t afraid of anything, but constraint.

I saw Jon three times, the first was great, the second he was pissed but brilliant and the third I left because he was obliterated. I saw Van at a music festival and was told to go to the first performance. Not sure how a saxophonist could play drunk, but we watched him do it.

I've found John Martyns music later in life. I absolutely resonate with it. I went searching on who he is. His destructive way of life is sad. Interestingly enough he was a virgo. I've met many virgo men that are charming talented souls but have gone a similar way. Great interview. I'll read the book. Thank you

I knew John for a short while in London. Our tipple of choice was a cocktail which consisted of Woods 100 dark rum with another Woods 100 on top.

Sang harmony with John in the early 80s on his Well Kept Secret album. Hugely talented but troubled man. Told me stuff that he said not to repeat, so I'll stay shtum for now.

Walked onstage at a Lake district gig - late. I was arguing with my girlfriend and she stood up and left. I left a few seconds later. Never heard a note of the performance. It was one of the worst nights of my life. And missing the gig was the least of it.

JM was the soundtrack of a flat I lived in as a student in Glasgow, which was, coincidentally, in Shawlands. Alas, the only time I saw him live, at an arts centre in Brentford many years later, the concert was a late-nighter and JM was off his face. Others, as described in the comments below, may have had better experiences of his inebriated performances, but I can't pretend that I didn't find it a tragic performance.

The three-way screen works well. As already mentioned, nice to see a bit more of Mark.

Solid.

Great book

He made awesome music.

John Martyn, interesting character. However, they say you can know someone by the company they keep. I think of him in the same context as Bert Jansch and John Renbourne and all these other itinerant muso's. You could see them play and how good it would be depend on how much they'd drunk. None of them really wanted to be famous because you have to actually be quite TOGETHER to do that. 🤣 Its also just not cool. Fame is for people who are not "genuine" and not usually great musicians really. At least that is the way they appeared to think of it.

Great.

More and more I hit play with trepidation as the internet deconstructs people I admire as artists into a pool of gravy on the floor..but bless the weather and solid air will always be heard without any visions of the background story influencing my enjoyment..best wishes.

Hello. Does anyone know if this will be available to download as an audio book please? Thanks.

Well Kept Secret is underrated. Could've been me is up there with John's best.

I thought that "May you never" was brilliant even though it brought home the fact that I was without a girlfriend at the time and had been so for some time. ps The "Yes" anecdote was a killer.

John never had any redemption whilst still alive...he did get that award with Philo might be the closest he got...JM was a complicated fellow...I always said that about the Edge and his sonics...BTW half way through the book and its a tough read. I miss John in all his messiness

I've just left a comment on a JM tv gig, saying something like " you can see he's virtually schizoid from his chats with himself between tracks " . Another one said something like " when he says I thank you. I thank you, between tracks, that's bus conductor speak " .

I saw John in Santa Barbara in a small club when he still had his leg. He showed up drunk with a red bucket which he used to throw up in. He seemed to have lost all his teeth so his singing was nearly unintelligible. A very disappointing show. I wanted to talk to him about Nick Drake but after seeing his condition I changed my mind. I still can't understand anyone drinking every night to the point of being sick and not curbing their intake or changing the mixture or quitting altogether. What is a normal built in limit for most people seemed to instead be his goal. It was sad and appalling. Even the music wasn't good although he could still play the guitar ok.

Great when he wasn’t pissed!

Best album : 'One World'.

Graeme Thomson looks a bit like Alan Partridge's offsider

As a woman I wanted to hate him after watching the infamous documentary but I can’t. I love the music, but dislike the man.

Identity confusion.?he had many selves .his true self coming out in his music.

There is a real disconnect between the man and the music. The music got worse as he did. The early stuff is fantastic.

The only person I ever saw skinning up for John on BBC was Garry ...................

Bacardi and orange was a very nice drink. Perhaps not in pint glasses though.

Like John Martyn, Warren Zevon was also not a nice person, a boozer, alienated people & was self-destructive. He hurt many people including people who loved him. I enjoyed Warren's music & writing but I wouldn't want to be his friend. In reality, Zevon, as famous as he was, died alone. John Martyn -- for some reason I always thought I could be his friend because he was an interesting tragic figure. Probably the reason he befriended Nick Drake. A shame John didn't work with Van Morrison. Could've been an interesting duo. For awhile.

Ah! The Mean Fiddler - must have had its fair share of crap, weird or disastrous performances. I went to see Roy Harper there and for once, because he often threatened to, got his member out.

Solid Air is a classic, might be one of the top 100 Lp's of the 20th century. His others were unremarkable. I saw him play once mid 90's, he'd had a few drinkies pre the show, or during it and appeared to struggle to stay on his chair at times, but moments of magic in the 1-2hr set.

I have loved this man's music from the first time I heard "May You Never" back in 1977. Utterly sublime. It is tragic that alcohol had such a malignant hold on him. It is interesting to hear this talk and ponder his life and the astrological correspondence to it. Sun in Virgo would certainly make his storytelling shine. He had a Moon in Capricorn (rules the mother and any woman he would take up with) opposing Uranus in Cancer. Uranus tends to bring shocks and interruptions to the child, particularly when it is opposing the Moon (nurturing just doesn't happen the way it ought to). The Capricorn Moon suggests that his capacity to nurture is not predictable at all. Opposing Uranus will seriously disturb relationships with women. Anyone with a Moon/Uranus opposition has the capacity to charm and electrify but the problem is, sometimes being in an intimate relationship with them is like repeatedly sticking your tongue into an electric socket. There is no recorded birth time for him but I think he must have had a Sagittarian Ascendant. The Ascendant is the style with which a person responds to life. Jupiter ruling his chart suggests a tendency to say yes to every excess and has the quality of a "hail fellow, well met" type of persona initially. Couple that with a Virgo Sun? You'd be seduced at first by that expansive quality and then knocked on your ass by the razor sharp excoriations when he was in a vile mood. It ain't pretty. Sagittarius rising types tend to be impulsive, too, so it would make sense that he would chuck people out on their arses when he was in a mood. The temper was likely exacerbated by Mars in Scorpio conjunct the South Node. That would tempt him to gut people without a second thought. Mars is libido in the broad sense of the term but it's also how temper is expressed. It isn't enough to be pissed off...there would be a profound temptation to grind "the enemy" into the floorboards. Not pretty. Not even a little bit. But there is a real depth of feeling which can be beautifully expressed in his music (and it certainly was) which is probably the best of what he had to offer of himself. That South Node intimates that he's had lifetimes of fame (or notoriety) because it sits right at the top of the chart. His voice was bewitching and that Mercury/Neptune conjunction in Libra underscores this. Neptune is the higher octave of Venus and it literally suggests his voice could seduce but it also underscores the trickster quality this combination. Folks with this combination "don't think straight" and genuinely do have exquisite sensitivity. It would have made him fascinating and terrifying in one fell swoop. You never knew if you'd be in the company of a god or a monster. I could go on and on but this is getting to be ridiculously lengthy. May his soul rest in peace.