I have a 1994 XLH883HUG and I do most of my work; however, I do have a guy I goto when I can't do it. It's a small mom/pops shop called Monkey Wrench Cycles in Ft.Worth, TX. Frank, the owner and mechanic, is honest. Dealer won't touch my bike, it's too old, but Frank has experience building sportsters.
For reference, I own a 2002 HD Electra Glide. Bone stock except for a cam support plate update for the hydraulic cam chain tensioners and high flow oil pump and slip ons. My local HD dealerships won’t even touch my bike for so much as tires or a wash. And while indy shops have touched it twice in the past, I’ve had nothing but bad experiences. The first was when I had the cam chest work done and they pulled off my perfectly fine and working stator and swapped it with one on their pull off shelf, simply cause it looked better and it went out two weeks later and refused to fix their screw up without me paying more money. The second shop I saw was just for a rear tire and brake pads. After they did that work, which the work done was good, I can’t get them back on the phone for additional work.
Never been to an independent shop yet but that doesn't mean I wouldn't if they were as cheap as me doing it myself. The dealerships I only had them change and balance my tires. The bad thing about going to them is the nearest dealer is 250 miles East or 300 miles West. They won't work on the bike to even remove the tires. It's a 98. Out of necessity and a lack of money, I learned to work on my bike and what to watch for. Dealerships are always going to charge more and as long as people are willing to pay it, they'll continue to do it.
Had a Harley "Master Tech" tell me the motor on my 2010 Dyna was bad when i took it in for a security issue that would not let it crank which they did fix....he offered me 2k to take it off my hands......i went home, checked fuses and relays (they had been monkeyed with), and changed battery and started it up. Rode fine for a year until I sold it and as far as i know its still going strong.....NEVER trust a dealer. Ill stick to my EVO and Shovels from now on....
I have excellent experience with Route 30 Harley Davidson in Upper Sandusky Ohio, as well as at Smokey Mountain Harley Davidson in Maryville Tennessee. Both got me in and out same day while traveling on my 2015 Ultra Limited. If I'm around home I do myvown work.
I asked about a $1,500 Sportster plus TT&T.What they didn't say was t $649 DOCFEE and the $849 dealer fee.OTD -$3,100 for a $1,500 883 Sportster. 1988 year of the bike. The greedy SOB's wanted more than the price of the bike in fees . HD thinks that their shit don't stink! Unbelievable!
Berts blackwidow in Port charlotte FL I worked there for 3 days in service/parts it was so bad that nobody wanted to help if I had a question about where something was they just roll there eyes at me fuck them
I honestly don’t see myself buying a new Harley ever again. I’ll do 90% of the wrenching on the ones I have now. The new ones are already outside of my skill level with all the new electronics. I just put a new fuel pump in my 08. The fuel pump was for an old Mustang Fox Body.
Sounds like a perfect opportunity to open a mechanic shop 😎. Personally.. I’ve never seen a small independent shop close unless the old man retired . EVER .
Being a professional automotive mechanic for a decade or three I've always worked on my own Harley, and I've owned everything from knuckles to twin cam bikes. I do know some Harley dealership mechanics that are top notch people, but they have to do what the dealership tells them to do, upselling is generally a requirement for a mechanic. I have never trusted a dealership as a whole, I would rather use an independent shop. I just prefer to do my own work, then if it fails I have no one to blame but me. Great video, thanks.
There's some damn good people working at the dealers but like you said they have to upsell as part of the job. It shouldn't be cause it isn't right but when it's your livelyhood you gotta do what you gotta do.
A friend dreamt of being a motorcycle mechanic, went to MMI and got a job at a dealership and left after years of the dealership putting the squeeze on customers and pressure on him to overlook it. Most state dealers are owned by a single company it was either uproot his family or move on.
Yesterday i went a bike shop that is about 30 miles away from me. Had new tires and brakes done. Hanging out he told me in about a year or so he is shutting it down. Age and the bs and he wants enjoy rest of his life. Problem is he is the only in this area. Its Brainerd mn area. The Harely dealership closed years ago there. The nearest one is 90 miles 3 different directions. They wont touch anything that isnt a M8 in it. Yeah they want my bikes for a trade in but cut my throat and screw me. Harely Davidsons has change and not for the good. Its about the dollar and screw the customer. Not all of us can afford 40k bikes or want this new stuff. Im in that category. Great video
I don't mess with dealerships. I have a show quality 06 Electra Glide and I love it. I do my own work and what I can't do myself I sub out to a very good independent shop where I live.
Dude, this trend is going to bite Harley-Davidson right in the butt!!! S&S started just for the same reason. Harley was in trouble, and they forgot about customer service. I think the aftermarket is going to really boom. I hope so!!!!! I believe there is plenty of folks out there to spike more innovation. This will really pick up the competition. There is quite a bit now, but i think there's plenty to come.
I hope it does for Harley, funny you mentioned S&S. I had a friend buy a T111, had it installed at an authorized S&S dealer, well it blew up. S&S sent a new motor, paid to have the old one removed and the new one installed. They wanted that motor back, they wanted to know the who what when and where of what happened. They wanted to know what rpm, what he was doing when it happened, what led up to it, they were truly interested in knowing exactly what made it fail.
Hola, lost my charging system in Wales 🏴 on my 2009 CVO Ultra. Was travelling to Ireland 🇮🇪 at the time. Called ahead to Waterford Dealership, they couldn't do enough. Collected my bike Saturday morning, Diagnosed the Problem. Ordered parts from Belgium the same day. Shop was closed on Sunday and Monday. Parts arrived by Wednesday, and I was on the Road Again. Big Big shout to these fantastic People.
This reminds me of a nightmare I had many years ago on a Honda Shadow. Except in my case it was only a flat tire. Unfortunately I was riding a bike with tube type tires, so, unlike with tubeless tires, I was unable to fix it beside the road. I had just gone out for a Sunday morning ride, and was about 200 miles from home. I had to call a tow truck, which cost a small fortune. They hauled it to the nearest motorcycle dealer, a multi brand "powersports" dealer. Of course they were closed on Sunday, and also on Monday. So I had the tow truck driver drop it off at a motel a couple miles down the road. I got a room for Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday. I walked down the street several times for fast food. I called the dealer first thing on Tuesday morning. About three hours later they came and picked the bike up. I waited for hours at the motel, then walked down to the dealer. They hadn't touched it yet. They wound up getting it done just before closing time. They refused to just replace the tube, they had to replace both the tire and tube. So I got charged for having the bike picked up at the motel, and for a new tire, tube, and labor. They knew I was stranded. I rode home that night. Between the towing charge, three days at the motel, and all the dealer charges, plus missing 2 days work, that one flat tire cost me over $1200. I never road that bike again. I parked it and listed it for sale. I replaced it with a bike that had tubeless tires.
That's horrible, there are some places like that won't touch your bike and it's disgusting. Harley dealers won't typically touch anything that's not a Harley but I have seen times where they will help someone out with another brand of bike for a tire or something I would call universal.
That's the way to do it, I understand not wanting to take on the business during the busy season cause it does take time work on the older bikes and do diagnostics.
They should come with no suspension, seat, handlebars, and windshield. I bought a new 2023 Tri Glide and went 635 miles the next day and I felt comfortable. I have since added a floorboard extension, rear shocks, heel shifter, handlebars, road zeppelin seat, backrest, shift link, full exhaust, stage one air filter, rear bumper, windshield, extra lighting, CB radio, WHIM, hand grips, lighted hand controls and now I'm doing the oil filter relocation. The dealer gives me a hard time because I do it all myself. I have been riding for 54 years and working on bike as long. This is my first and last Harley. I have over $50 k into it.
I have been riding for 49 years, and have always worked on my own bikes. I was also a professional auto mechanic my entire life. I have plenty of older bikes and cars. I refuse to buy anything I can't work on. I actually have plans to convert my 2006 Sportster 1200L into a trike when I can no longer safely ride a 2 wheeler. I'm not throwing my money away. I'm putting away all the money I can for my kids and grandkids. They have provided me with a lifetime of happiness. It's the least I can do for them. To me, an under $10,000 non computerized bike (or trike) that sounds and feels like a Harley is more fun than a $50,000 smooth, quiet, computer on wheels. To each their own however. Whatever makes you happy. I grew up in a time when cars and bikes were machines. Mechanical devices. They didn't run on software. They could be worked on with wrenches and screwdrivers, and as far as the electrical system, you never needed more than a simple multimeter.
@@geraldscott4302 I agree. I still have my timing light and dwell meter. I still remember changing jets and advance weights. When I would pull a motor from a old Chevy from the 50 and 60's, would climb into the engine compartment.
Pocono Mountain HD is my local dealer and I think they are pretty darn good. If I’m not mistaken the guy that owns that group helped finance Willie G to buy Harley back from AMF. They will work on Evo’s and shovelheads, but I do prefer my local shop or to do the work myself.
Not that the local H D shop in town won't sell me parts for my twin cam (not stock has a 95 kit ) just worried about the quality of the work since it is older but concerned about them returning the bike as is was sent in for repair I have heard some interesting stories about delays and overpaying for work not done or parts swapped out. My only choice is to do myself even though it takes more time I have found information on the www that provides me with all that I need in order to repair my bike. J
Best Harley Davidson mechanic on the planet that I know of is a little shop in Albany Louisiana called George's garage I think, that's ALL HE DOES and all he's ever done is Harley, knows them inside and out but I hear he's booked solid especially this time of year.good guy and a class act!
Great video as always. I bought a 2018 Fat Bob this past November from my local family owned dealer Suburban Harley Davidson. Fantastic sales experience too to bottom. They also hold dealer events for the community to attend and go above and beyond for the customer in all respects. They represent what dealerships used to be like and what they should continue to be like. It’s a real shame to see what’s going on right with many other dealerships. Also, many of the employees at suburban ride older bikes so I bet their service department has no issues working on them. They also have their own custom speed shop so I’m fairly certain they will turn a twin cam into a fire breathing force to be reckoned with!!!
That's the way to do business, I love open house events at a good dealer. They make it feel like you're at a second home and they aren't just there to get your money. I love a good dealer like that!
That's really bad if they won't go back 5 years, that's insane. Small shops are getting harder to find but they are usually cheaper especially if they have less overhead.
@@GixxerFoo I got the impression that one dealer in particular did not want to work on bikes he did not sell. The one independent shop does not want to work on Twin cams now, just young kids working. It is back to the point in the 1970s where it cost more to repair a Harley than what it can be sold for. Many Evos and Twin cams sitting in garages with dead batters and old owners like me.
After the local dealer botched an oil cooler install on my friend's 2017 Fat Bob (something we discovered when I installed mine myself on my 2008 Fat Bob), we've written off dealer services, except for state inspection. Changed my tires the other weekend. Saved over $250. The 3 local HD dealers are are going to become the HD "boutique" style dealerships, more interested in selling clothing than motorcycles, it seems. I don’t think it's a viable long term model. HD would do better to offer high end total restoration services like Mercedes Benz, and/or make new copies of some of tbeir classics, like Jaguar did with the XK-SS. I think that my generation (I'm 60) may be the last to give a crap about riding HDs. My next HD is probably going to be a BMW 1800. Base model is significantly cheaper than a HD.
I went to 3 dealers in my town Tuesday to sell my 2020 Heritage with 13,800 miles on it. Every single one of them only offered me 10.5k. Sorry but no thanks since there were selling other Heritages 18-22 with various miles on them for 17k to 20k.
I had a very clean and nice sportster 1200 custom vivid black , 30,000 miles one owner till I bought it, was going to trade on a at the time new 2020 heritage that they wanted $23,000 for, and low balled me at $3000. I was so pissed I sold it for $4000 cash and now don’t even have a bike. I’ll never own another Harley!!!
The dealer refused to repair my 1999 EVO. They stated that they do not repair older than TC ones, and even TC ones only include those with fuel injection.
Got any new revelations regarding the EPA and performance parts? I talked to the local HD dealer in my neck of the woods. I was told parts for late model twin cams were abundant, in other words as long as parts are available they wont turn anybody away. And yes the owner of that particular dealership sold out to a corporation. Im always on the look out for independent shops with competent mechanics... JCS Performance in south texas is probably one of the best.
There's still parts out there for Twin Cams and Evo's but it looks like any new production exhaust are going to be compliant pieces for emissions. It doesn't look like it's going as far as sound just yet, some of your best mechanics out there are at those small indy shops.
Most dealers have that sign posted. What most dealers don't want to work on is junk that should have been scrapped.. They will usually work on a well cared for older bike.
@SmittyAZ Not true. My bike is pristine, not a scratch on it, and it looks better than it did the day I bought it. By the way, there's no signs posted.
@@tjmayer9103 I was speaking from my own experiences. As a matter of fact, my '68 Yamaha AND my '99 busa are in a shop that has the sign posted. Of course, I spend a small fortune there and I've purchased several new bikes from them. Have you actually been told NO! by that dealer?
I only have bought 1brand new Harley. A 2014 Tri-Glide. I guess I'll never be buying another one if they don't want to work on my bike. I guess I'll go back to a Japanese bike for my next purchase.
Harley Davidson started making motorcycles in China and now I refuse to give them any of my $$$. I will keep the 2 I have now and buy after market parts to maintain them.
Fortunately for us that's a model for that particular market, the bikes we get here are made in the US albeit with globally sourced parts. They are scrutinized for quality at least.
They have a couple plant overseas, that way they dont have to pay the import tax on the countries they are going to. When I was stationed in Japan they are very strict on emissions there. Easier to build a bike a factory over in another country that already meets the emissions. A Harley built in the states wouldn't. Also the cost of a new Dyna over there from a dealership in 2010 was about $33k-$36k due to the taxes and import taxes from being brought in from the states.
Myers Duren is going to be my new go to now that Forman in Stillwater is closing. Route 66 is corporate, Myers Duren is a good dealer and they will treat you right.
I rebuilt a transmission myself for $380 cuz it needed a couple extra parts. Harley charged me $3500 to do one for me and I wanted to get them out of my life forever. I will never go to the dealer for anything but warranty which I don't have. I will do everything myself from now on. Screw the dealerships. All dealerships.
I was looking to buy a 2023-2024 Road King. Every Dealer website had listings that read “call for quote”. That just says we are ready to Eff you over. Pass. Went with another brand.
I don't play that game, just tell me the dang price. Quote means well there's MSRP and then we have dealer fees, prep fees (I get freight and prep) but it's all the doc fees, floor fee, roof fee, whatever else the dealer adds on.
Our local dealer sold to a group that owns 3 other dealerships. I has changed a lot. They charge $90.00 and hour for labor now. It was 60 at the old dealership. I went to an independent to install my 14" fat bars and saved $100.00 on the parts and install. Shout out to PinupBaggers.
It's night and day with the "investment group" takes over ownership, they are all about making money and the ones that invested making as much money back as possible.
Great video. I only go to the indie shop I trust. I know the mechanic personally and he warranties his work. I still like my dealer, but I'd much rather give my money to a small business, a guy who works really hard and does an amazing job.
Thank you, I appreciate the support! It's just gotten so bad from where it used to be, it's rare to even get to speak with the guy doing the work these days at a dealer. Sometimes they have multiple people doing the job on a bike.
Better known as "stealerships" they lie, cheat, and steal! I will never walk into another HD location as long as I live, These days I got enough cash to take advantage of a desperate R.U.B. getting rid of his bike and if something goes wrong, I'll fix it. If I don't know how, I'll find someone who does right here on YT and be all the more wiser and fatter of wallet. Thanks for the info, love your vids man! You keep making them and I'll keep watching them, LOL!
Thank you! I really appreciate that! I have a lot of people ask why I don't work on camera and the truth is I don't do it full time and when I do have a job I am really focused on the task at hand. I would love to put how to videos out there but it does take a lot of time to video the work and still do the job right. I will do some how to videos on my own stuff in the future as I have work I am going to do.
@@GixxerFoo That's awesome, I know your subscribers including myself would tune in with bells on, lol. The great thing about content creation is there are many ways to do it. Like you'd probably like to film it and then voice the instructions after? Of coarse I'm just guessing but I don't have to guess that they would be good and appreciated by all who view them. I would have bought a bike myself by now but I got fired yet again. I work in the craziest industry where you can do everything right and go above and beyond and still get canned, LOL! All it takes is one D-Bag to get a hair up their six and make up some fabricated BS and out the door ya go. I feel bad for those people because Karma has visited everyone who has done me dirty and used them as her own plastic f*ck doll.🤣😂🤣 Not to worry though, I'm alright and not looking at being homeless or going hungry. Despite living in a city that bleeds its people dry and gives nothing back, LOL!
We have great Indy shops around Cleveland Ohio. Plus a lot cheaper rate than Harley. $95 Indy. $175 hr HD. I have an 06 Street glide and I think the last time HD did any service on my bike was when they changed my cam chest and new cam. 7-10 yrs ago. Plus I do my own oil change every year. Indy all the way.
A couple years ago, I bought my used 2019 Tri Glide and aside from warranty work, I never go back to the dealer. I go to a local independent speed shop. Now that the bike is basically done with the warranty, I had a bunch of after market mods done that don't use Screaming Eagle crap on it.
Go to a Indy Shop . Better value and service , seems like most really want your business . My guys in south central Wisconsin ROCK COUNTY CYCLES are the best in the business , Harley Davidson has gotten out of helping there older folks and motorcycles .
My RK is twenty years old,a rat bike that I love. Homemade exhaust pipes and homemade jockey shift, truck bed liner for paint. I can do the majority of any repair myself, as I was a mechanic back in the 1980s. If it’s something I can’t do at home, I have an independent shop nearby that has an excellent reputation that I’d take it to.
There's somebody in nearly every town that works on Harley for money, and a lot of them are Harley trained......because they don't make $300/hr like you pay at the dealership........My Kaw dealership has a Harley trained mechanic because he couldn't pay the bills out on his own....too much competition close to Lexington. I do my own maintenance, and now tires too, but I don't remember ever having a Harley that needed fixed......I also don't do performance "upgrades"
There's a lot of damn good mechanics out there in the shops, I love it when a shop will take a bike in cause they have someone capable of working on them if even if it's not the brand on the front of the building. I worked at a Kawi shop and we rebuilt a guys Yamaha FZR 600 engine for his road racer. We had a guy that could do it, we had good relationship with parts suppliers and the Yamaha dealer so we did it.
@@GixxerFoo Once I was interested in a TW200. I went to the local imported dealer and was ignored for 15 minutes. I walked out, and they closed down after a year.
As someone that has bought a Harley new,rode it 108,000 miles and am a PHD certified Harley mechanic, I can say that they have been plagued with a myriad of problems. The Evo sportster was the exception, a phenomenal machine.
What's concerning is roached M8's with 60 to 80K on them for various reasons. It's like quality control is non existent anymore not that the design and choice of components is great either. Evo Sportster is what I like to ride for that very reason as it was the exception. I would of love to see some big inch versions on that design.
This man is speaking the truth, good, bad or otherwise. Here's the good news. Someone, somewhere, no matter what year HD you own, you can get what is needed. How many OEMs can say that?
That is quickly coming to an end, as new bikes (and this applies to cars as well) are being designed to run on software, and are wirelessly connected to the manufacturer. Software is NOT a part, and only the manufacturer has it. Without it, the vehicle won't run.
@@frankfurther3828 There may be some Twin Cam parts that would be hard to find, but every single part of an EVO is available, including complete engines, transmissions, frames, wheels, suspensions and forks, and all the little bits to put it all together. You can build a complete EVO powered "Harley" without a single H-D part. Brand new Twin Cam engines are also available. And ALL EFI Twin Cams can now be converted to carbureted, eliminating all the problematic electronic garbage.
@@geraldscott4302 You drive a very real point on the software along with computer control. That said, I have never junked a car or bike because of the software as it has always been for other reasons. Yes. Electronic parts in a ECM can go bad causing a malfunction but there are junk ECMs and rebuilders of ECMs. There's always the aftermarket manufacturing that can and do build ECMs. If one is worried about telemetry, that can be worked around as well. There is and has always been workarounds. The aftermarket builds complete engines and transmissions a!ong with every other part for recent models. Don't believe for one minute the electronics aren't or won't be there as well.
My local dealer growing up was Harley-Davidson of West Palm on Cherry Road owned and operated by Charlie Jones. He had two mechanics named Bruce. Those guys were great. They worked on everything. When I was a kid just starting out, I could go in there, hang out, drink coffee, and ask questions. When Charlie got older, he sold his dealership, which moved over to Park Place, and they had to do all the updating for the boutique stuff in the 1980s. Dealerships like that are far and few between and rare. Another great dealership in Daytona Beach was Robison HD creator of the "Thunderhead" Sportsters based on the xr750 style heads. He was forced out because he wouldn't update for all the Glam stuff.
I hear you there, I miss those days where their owner had a name and face. You could knock on the door and have a chat, anymore these days it's a "general manager" and you never get to meet the owner who's a CEO of the company.
I've been investing in my own tools and doing it myself . Last time at the service center the guy laughed at me . Been an automobile mechanic for 43 years . Everything and anything . I'll fix my own .
My folks at Wesley Chapel HD are top shelf! From Matt in the Service Department to his team of technicians, I've received exceptional service. They even pick-up and deliver my carbed 2005 Xl1200C here in Brandon, which isn't a walk across the street. Yes, they do service older bikes! 👍♥️
This is so spot on I bought my 03 softail brand new they did alot of work for me great service 👍 Then 2 years ago they told me they don't work on anything older then a 08 All I wanted them to do was change all the fluids and change my tires I had the new tires Wow what a shock that was
@@craigkemmerzell5741 reach out to Matt! I know he owns Sporties and has access to many things Sportster. However, If we can create the relationships, we can continue to have our older bikes cared for...otherwise, we can go to The Ride Factory and get our needs addressed there. I feel MOCO is missing out by turning away older bikes for service....HUGE opportunity to drive deeper relationships and retain loyalty. 🙏♥️👍
I keep hearing this 10 year limit for working on older bikes. Guess I'll find out next year when my 14 Limited turns 11! So far no issues getting multiple dealers to take and work on it around here (Denver), but we'll see. I feel like many of the Rushmore upgrades are still in use so maybe that will extend the 10 year rule.
I have a buddy who bought a bike from a dealership that was still under warranty. Where he bought it was from a dealership that was 200+ miles out of his hometown. He had something break down on it and went to the dealership where he lives and they refused to work on it because he purchased it somewhere else. It wasn't a HD but it still wasn't right, and it was still a new bike.
Harley offers mechanics a lot of options and directions, but it put them in a position to train on what's going to make them money. Harley still offers those guys shovel head training, but how many of them is someone going to see these days. They don't want to take the time to learn them when they may never see one.
I had an Indy do my 10k. When I went to do my 15k the oil plug was finger tight and the oil filter was torqued on so tight I had to use a special wrench to get it off. Check their work.
That's really sad to hear, I've had that happen to me before and had those kind of things brought to me. I hate to tell people what I've found before cause sometimes I don't get the story if it came from a shop or it was diy. If it's from a shop I know and I know who's there I will have a casual conversation like hey did you work on this.
My carbureted Sportster rarely has any problems, and can usually be fixed with basic tools. My EFI Twin Cam 88 Softail is nothing but a headache and I wouldn’t dare travel far from home on it.
@@earlmarsh2285 2004. It’s not too difficult to work on, but it has given me a lot more trouble than my old Sportster. It’s just not as reliable as I’d like it to be.
Had taken a bike in once . They told me they didn’t work on the older stuff 😳. They offered to sell me a new one . Lord help I some what lost my composure . I looked at the man and said “ why in the hell would I buy a new one from you when you can’t even fix the one I have ? 🤬 We don’t !! I can’t … them SOB
I work on my own, but I would prefer an independent shop. Usually, a small shop is going to give you more personal attention, and you won't have to put up with Harley's BS. One thing I learned about the dealers is that although they may have great techs, it always seemed to be the new guy working on mine. I can remember when Harley dealers were usually in a small old garage on some side street. Things sure have changed.
My local dealership (Walters Bros. near Peoria,) Solved my problems under estimate and were great to work with. Hadn't had a Harley product since my late sixties Aerromachi HD's. Oh, and my bike is a '10.
Wow, I have been thinking that because of the takeover of the corporations of the dealerships, there will be a huge opportunity for these indi-shops very soon. I was also thinking we may end up like CUBA. Instead of older cars we a will be fixing and driving older motorcycles. I see the gap getting much bigger and very soon.
Cool to see the photo of Formans HD. It's been my local dealer for 40 years. Sad to see them close. The MoCo hasn't given them much of a choice on closing. They have completely forgotten where they came from. I'll keep my current Harleys along with servicing them myself. But other than that. I'll never spend another dollar with Harley Davidson. Another good informative video Gixer. Keepem coming.
Thank you for the support, we really appreciate it! Forman is where I bought the only new Harley I will ever buy, Lynn is always great! Sad day to see them closing up shop.
@GixxerFoo Saw Lynn just the other day. Nathan sold me my VROD back in 03. Rolled a few other bikes out those doors. My shop is less than a mile from them. Lots of good people work there. Hate it most for them.
I have an ‘07 CVO Ultra Classic. Nobody has turned me away when help was needed, yet. Rapid City HD was great when I had an electrical system failure in 2016, while on the Sturges run. Here in the Austin area, not turned away yet. Not saying they won’t, but I have a great Indy mechanic who does most of my work when needed anyhow. I can do most external work, but internals are not my bag. I’ll leave that to the guys with the proper tools. Been riding since ‘67 and will keep riding as long as the good Lord allows.
What happens 11 years from now, when you take your 2024 M8 in for an issue, and the dealer can't fix it because they can no longer get the download? 😮 I do all the work on my '02 Dynas, but I don't touch my '19 Triglide. Just had a buddy buy a used '21 Freewheeler with just over 3k on the clock. First Harley he ever owned. He is now asking me questions about his harley, and all I can say is ,"I don't know, don't have a clue." Seems like they are trying to make Harleys disposable, I don't know, I'm rambling, sorry. Great video, as always 👍
Great comment. Have a 2003 road king that runs better than any of the 2024 bagger and rev max turds that already have umpteen recalls, break downs, catastrophic engine failures, internal cooling and no start issues.
@madfzr Gixxer did a great video about '17 to '19 M8's and the venting, sumping, and oil pump issues. After I watched it, I commented that he was full of good news today. 2700 miles on a '19 Triglide, extra wheels and tires? Anyone? Just kidding, I'll get it right.
They do need the updated oil pump and even with that the vented dipstick and trans cover isn't a bad idea in my opinion to reduce the crank case pressure.
Thank you! That's a good question on software and updates with all the new electronics and the years to come with the 10 year rules. I am confident the aftermarket will have picked up the slack by then, they've always taken care of us with everything Harley in the past.
I bought an extended warranty on my 16 Lowrider, and have personally had great experiences with my Dealership. If you have an awesome Service Writer, it makes all the difference.
In other words,,,, no longer CUSTOMER oriented ,, only MONEY oriented,,, imagine the old days when a customer would bring in an older bike for work ,, and while waiting for the repairs,, he spots a new bike he loves sitting on the showroom floor ,,, WHAT A CONCEPT !!!
Just got a bike last week, today i went to a powersports dealer near me to see about getting tires changed. They sell used bikes, atvs, etc. He cant get me in to even do tires until the first week of June. So i went ahead and got in line. Wish id called a few weeks ago.
At least they are willing to do the work, tis the season right now trying to get work done. Just happy to hear they are busy right now and doing business. CycleGear is a joke trying to get tires done, anything corporate really. They relegated to 1. if we have anyone to do it, 2. if they can get away from the front and have time to do it.
My 2017 TriGlide is at an indie shop right now getting worked on. Oil pump died, damaged the chest plate, lifter crapped out and now there is aluminum dust all thru the engine. Indie shop had me come out look at all the pieces and allowed me to get my hands dirty looking all the parts. The point is, I have never been allowed back into the local HD shop area but each time recently I have had to fix something that they missed. Now my 2012 VROD Muscle is going to be interesting to service in the future but I'm at least collecting parts for it now when I can get them. The indie shop will work on VRODs.
Vrods are kinda hard to find parts for, there are some places out there still providing performance parts with them. Is your 2017 and M8? The 2017 through early 2019 production had oil pump issues and they updated the oil pump for the 2020 model year.
My experience is the dealership where I bought the bike was way to expensive and did crappy work but always had excuses. I began doing as much of the work as I was able to. And everyone that I talked to in the waiting area said similar things about them. I had heard the owner, (not a corporation) was the problem. He was a known shyster and caused super low morale and high turnover with employees.
Honestly, my advice is buy used from a private seller, especially in my state. They literally don't sell anything at MSRP, try to put a financial squeeze on you and will not negotiate on price when you know their markup for used bikes is generally 3-4K higher. I think it's because most dealerships in my state are owned by a single entity. I like Harley's, owned a few but I'm pretty much over the dealer experience and I can live without the brand. If you have to have a new Harley the dealer will put the squeeze on you.
I went out and found a bike shop that can replace my tires 450 bucks new tires worth it I recommend everyone work on your bike it's cheaper and get to know people and pick theyre brains learn something new but today's Harleys with the technology it's more problems in the fuif you have a digital screen have fun replacing it I recommend speedometer and tachometer they are simple and easier to replace or fix
I love places like that, that's how I got hooked up with the little shop in OKC. They charged me like 30 bucks to swap a tire I brought in, dealer wanted 110 dollars to change my tire. It was a carry in and they wanted an hour of labor to swap a tire on a rim.
Great Point you make , I have seen it about 20 + years ago. Sell New bikes . But the Parts sales is where the $$ is , Now Car Dealership's are Beatong Those Drum's , all the Bean Counters are Seeing the Big Money made up Frt. Parts and Shop Labor is Where the $$$ is If you Have a Great Parts Person, And Great Service Department !!! They Will Beat New Bike sales if Those 2 Are Doing a Great JOB !!!
I’ve spoken with the parts man at my local Harley dealer in Madison, WI about getting my bike tuned and run on their dyno and they seemed willing to do that on my ‘06 FXDWGI. For about a grand between the tuner license and labor but I wasn’t asking them to turn any wrenches which it sounds like from Foo I might get a different response if I were. I’m going to be ready for new rubber by the end of the year so I plan on bringing both my wheels to them for spoke tightening and wheel truing when I have the new tires mounted but it didn’t sound like they’d turn that work away either. Maybe I’ve got one of the good dealers or maybe it’s still family owned and operated I don’t know. Thanks for the video Foo, even with all the arguably negative things that you say about Harley dealerships, and I tend to agree, who do you thing RU-vid placed next to your video but an ad for H-D’s Test Ride Days | May 10-18 so they must not hate you!
I am not trying to be negative about dealers, they are there to sell new bikes and make money. I can't fault them for that, it's just not like it used to be years ago. Sounds like you have a great dealer, I don't see why a dealer wouldn't take the opportunity to make a buck on tuning and some little stuff. A lot of the dealers won't though, they want the new stuff which is quick and easy.
Kansas is losing another dealership. Now down to 2. I still have to go 2 hours to get to and independent shop. The life of being a Harley Davidson rider is getting harder and harder.
Hey brother great video as always! 100% facts. My local dealer broke their own rule worked on a 20+ year old basketcase to help a guy and it was a nightmare for both parties. Dude took out a loan and everything kept breaking. He never could afford to get it out of the shop and it wasted everyones time. They do want quick in and out repairs on newer stuff. Warranty work its less drama and they do push trade ins. If you have an old bike its a no brainer to go to independent anyways. same with sportbikes
Thank you for the support! That's exactly why they have that 10 year rule in place, I worked in a dealer and saw that very same thing. We still had to pay our guys, out the money are parts and it was just a nightmare for everyone involved.
@@GixxerFoo right on, i also worked in service at dealer. It definitely was a nightmare for the customer and everyone involved. Saw soooo many issues with the 2024 baggers and anything rev max. Including catastrophic engine failures, cooling issues wiring harness, anything with an infotainment screen run away. The FXBB/FXBBS , FXLRS and road king were pretty solid.
I travel for work and take a bike along. I have a new 23 RGCVO. I’m afraid to take that bike to any dealer. I also have a 02 classic. I have taken the 02 to multiple dealers and have never been turned down for work. I decided, after watching your vids, to change my cam tensioners. I was in Alabama at the time. The Harley dealer did the work and more. As you know Harley has a kit for this. This dealer would not charge me for the kit but charged me for each part. It cost me about $800 more, but they did the work. There is a dealer in Atlanta that works on twin cams too. Dealers DO NOT know anything about the 23/24 bikes. It’s best to go straight to Harley.
It's going to take a bit for the newer stuff to get mainstream at the indy shops, same thing happened with the M8's. Now it's game on at the indy shops for M8's, new bike under warranty I can see for sure wanting to do dealer work.
Santa Clarita Harley in California wouldn’t even put ape hangers on my 2002 Heritage. Referred me to an independent shop nearby. The dealers excuse was we might not be able to get parts that we need to complete the job. There’s 100 different catalogs out there with cables, brake lines and handlebars for sale. They just lie.
Let’s not forget that techs that worked on the older bikes or cars don’t want to work on the later models due to all the computers there is to deal with, lots of new learning. Many will retire and not wrench any more or work for an indi shop. It’s a constant cycle and best to find a trustworthy shop or individual and support them for as long as you can.
I test drove the HD Breakout the other day and the sales guy didn't want to tell me what the price would be for it OTD. 🤷🏼 He kept asking me about my credit score and what payment I am comfortable with. I told him several times that I would pay cash. I left that dealer disappointed
My local dealer closed up that I had a long relationship with. I miss it. Fortunately, the service manager opened his own shop. And he’s awesome. And we do it aftermarket. I just rebuild my 110 freshen up. I went with Andrew. S&S can plate and all the good stuff. My 110 is pushing 120 hp and torque. We didn’t think it would go more than 110 hp.- torque . The other local dealer I still have an extended warranty on my 14. It’s good next year September. I can’t get them to do nothing. From the time it was. Blew my speakers out didn’t want to replace them on the #Warranty all kinds of problems #Warranty work. I think the aftermarket is the way to go. I did so I did everything because my bike my 2014 CVO to me is a better bike. Maybe not in the horsepower as a M8 now that they are more dependable. But a better bike more for the money. Bought it new.
That's what's happening to me, my local shop is closing. I've got another locally owned place to go to but it's gonna be an hour away and well worth it.
This is why I will never buy another new Harley Davidson again. There is no more dealer support for my bike. And they wonder why people are not buying new bikes from them. When I got my first bike from Harley Davidson I was told Harley Davidson would always be there for me. If they will only work on new bikes with all the newer electronics and will not release any information to work on them, who is going to be able to work on the new bikes when they are 10 years old and Harley dealers will not work on them. As far as I can see Harley Davidson just put the nail in their own coffin. LOL I'll just go get myself a Honda shadow. F*** Harley Davidson because that is what they just told me with my 100th anniversary Dyna that I love and can still work on myself without there so called long time customer support. (Or lack there of)
I buy my parts and do all my own work harley forced me into it but I do not regret it saves a ton of money just make sure you have your complete service manual and proper tools
I remember the one time they didn't work on my 93.. I had a local guy work on the motor he was an independent shop a single.. person shop high performance shop.. they would even send stuff to him to take care of when a customer wanted high-performance cylinders bored out and so forth.. can you put different types of clips to hold the wrist pin.. in the piston and they couldn't figure out how to take them out he had to go over and show them...😮
Great video. I've got an independent here in Delaware, Ohio, who rocks. Kelly at a republic Cycles. I rode out to Colorado last summer on my 05 road king and had a throttle cable snap. I called ahead to Teddy Morses HD in Grand Junction, and they were really great. They sourced me a cable that was surprisingly hard to find. They had it shipped overnight from California, at my cost, of course, so that it would be there waiting for me when I arrived. They got me back on the road for my long trek home.
Thank you! Having a great dealer and independent shop makes life so much easier. I would love to have more shops that way but sadly they are getting few and far between.
I live in Waterford Mi. and their isn’t any Ma & Pop shops in the local area. And I definitely cannot rely on my local Harley dealer. They show u the front door. Time to start looking at the Indian dealers.
Indian dealers are following the Harley business model pretty closely and I hate to say that. It's for sure harder but getting better to find local indy shops that will work on Indians.
Absolutely will never go to dealership! Most of work has been done by me and my trusty repair manual. I’m going to do a new crank in winter and have been researching a good Indy shop and have found one to do the biggest overhaul on my 07. I’ve put 100k on my rkc since I bought it in 07.
@@GixxerFoofollowed almost everything you've ever said! Bike rebuilt around 70k with woods 555, s&s cam plate pump fuel moto 107 etc! Your advice is truly very helpful! Ride safe bud!
I went to a Harley shop in 2018 for a quote for new tires on my Sportster. Almost $800 with a 10% discount. Local guy did it for retail out of the book. Only go to HD for warranty work now which is almost never because the bikes cost as much as my cars now.
Harley dealer wanted to charge me an hour of labor at 110 bucks plus paying full retail at 250 bucks for the tire and I was going to bring the wheel into them. I was curious to see what they would charge me and trying to support them, ended up doing tires myself.
If you are an enthusiast, develop and cultivate a relationship with an indie shop near you. Do it. Do it now. If you already went and acquired one of the two or three wheeled computers, understand your warranty THOROUGHLY. Above all, be kind to your dealership service manager or indie shop owner. A little kindness (and an occasional bottle of bourbon) will go a long way toward keeping your scooter in running order. That is all...carry on.
Do my own work, Indy 10 mins away for any advice or challenging tasks. I got laughed at for riding a 1995 FXD by the parts guy. I laughed back and asked him what bikes on his stock floor would even be running in 25 years. He mumbled something about me being out of touch and went out the back.
The guys today have to take the classes for what they are going to see the most of and a lot of them go for the M8 for sure and Screamin Eagle parts installs.
The difference between having a harley and a Honda is an old Honda doesn’t need repairs. 🤣🤣🤣 corporations have destroyed everything along with government help.
Any time you have a car or motorcycle that is one, ESPECIALLY 2 or more models older than the current one they are selling NEVER take it to the dealer to get worked on. Most places focus their mechanic's training and current abilities to work on the brand newest stuff. I took my 06 Jetta to a VW dealership a few years ago for tires and a battery and they fucked it up so bad they dropped it off the lift. Bent the frame. Destroyed the bottom half of the Audi 5 cylinder motor. Took me 3 months to get it back since they had to just about rebuild the engine at that point. The doors still don't fit right but it's a 20 year old car so I figure I'm lucky the thing still works at all. As for my bike I have an 81 FXW with an Evo motor in it and the local shop I work with has some really knowledgeable guys that do a pretty good job. Harley dealer in town won't touch it. Their loss.
That's a great point, Twin Cam, Evo, and Shovel training is still available through Harley to its mechanics. As a mechanic they won't see many of those older bikes so for them financially it doesn't make sense to take the time to learn Evo or Shovel for the younger guys.
Up through the EVO, Harleys were uncomplicated. Now, with all the electronics and water cooling and fuel injection, they have made it harder and harder to work on. The auto industry has done the same. My first two cars were a 37 Chevy and a 48 Ford flat head. My first Harley was a 42 "45" flat head. I was 14 at the time but had a machine shop owner who took a liken to me. With His help we kept the old 45 running. Now everything is computerized for a reason. No more shade tree mechanics. Carburetor's were simple. You can change jets in a few minutes on an EVO without removing the carb. Simplicity has it's advantages. With a VOM and a few standard tools you can fix about anything on EVO's and earlier bikes. But we live in a different world than us 80 year old guys knew. Everything is made to be obsolete in a few years so we have to just replace the whole thing. The EVO is just an improved Shovel head. The problem with the EVO is if taken care of can run 200,000 miles in stock form. That is why there are so many out there yet. I have one friend who bought a twin cam, and a few years later, traded it for an EVO. Both of the Harley dealers where I live have closed in the last two years. They were both 20 miles from where I live. But I have an independent about a half mile from my house and these guys can work on all the old bikes.
Back in 03 when I had a 93.. what I got was a lot of parts are going to be worn out on it and we're not going to want to have the bike go out the door without all the repairs done and the client the owner does not want to pay for all the repairs.. they just want one thing fixed. And they have insurance their liability insurance or something happens to that bike. Accident ..etc .. while the owner is riding it... The owner or Rider can come back and sue the dealership.. because they did not perform the repairs.. meaning there's too many things to repair on an older bike.. they won't let it go out the door and let its perfect shape... That was what they told me they don't work on them ......
Honestly that's the right answer, it's kind of a long winded response for we don't want to fix one thing and then have it come back with something else broke unrelated and get blamed. The place I used to work had issues with that and that's why the 10 year rule went in place. It eliminated the why will you work on this bike and turn that one away, it was crappy.
Those a lot of the places local to me, that was the original Harley World in OKC when it was on Agnew. Elsie was awesome, she sold the dealer and retired. After that it went corporate and move to a new botique dealer.
The dealership I got mine from was owned by a guy i went to high school with. A few years ago they were forced to close by HD and now the nearest dealership is 20 miles away. I'm lucky that I can do my own work and have two indies within five miles of home.
That's sad, that really blew my mind that owners had to close their dealers and honestly they lost their business to a corporate owned one with more money.
