High Elves TIER LIST - CAMPAIGN (Total Warhammer 2) 

One of the best things about starting armies is it gives you a taste of different units from T1 and beyond. Some units are "tier appropriate" but on higher levels of play, the desire to favor effective buildings means missing out on some options. Tyrion starting with horse units is a nice touch for this reason! EDIT: Also, thanks heaps for sharing and supporting the channel. Appreciate it mate!

Hearing it's helped out is a great reward. Thanks for the comment and sub mate!

This is pretty on point. I'd argue the Phoenix Units bring more to the table that complements the rest of the roster, compounded by the fact the Dragons make better mounts than standard units, particularly in WH3. The Arcane Phoenix is now their best monster if in the hands of advanced play.

@@ElvenPlotArmour For me it depends on the composition of the rest of the army(Lords, Heroes, Magic) and the synergy found there. I usually go for either a Archmage of Life or Light as my generic lord choices. If I have a Life Archmage then I forgo the Lore Masters and take three to four Arcane Phoenix. These combine with my Fire Mage will be my highly mobile flying goon squad dropping down on the enemy, tying them up and using the Fire mage's spells to do serious damage to infantry blobs. I like the Phoenix for this setup due to their high fire resistance and small size making it easier to escape. If I have a Light Archmage to spam Net of Amyntok then I'll use two star dragons with two Lore Masters and a more range heavy army. The net allows me to lock down an enemy and if it's a single entity unit I can use the star dragon's breath attack to delete it completely.

Thanks mate. Means a lot to hear that. I genuinely put a tonne of work into the placings and presentation as a well designed tier list can really add some campaign context... I also can't stand poorly made ones, thrown together quickly, full of rushed conclusions and errors - so hypocrisy holds me accountable haha.

Stoked to have you on board. Cheers for the kind words and support mate!

The High Elves just have good options that focus on their strengths, eliminating the need for using their units which expose their frailty.

Appreciate the support mate. Many thanks!

Haha, they're definitely a divisive unit. Some players can have so much economy and good micro to avoid needing them, but that doesn't prevent a unit having great utility. Especially in terms of extending the life of a basic army, for any player using a lineholder style, they are the best in this roster.

Couldn't agree more with you there mate. Quite a different game. One you need to find the best spend toward an army to win any battle, just a single time. The other you want to spend a single time to win several battles in the long term. Also, sometimes alternatives simply 'exist'. High elves don't do offensive melee as well as the dark elves, but at least we get the choice :)

Or lower difficulties as melee infantry really suffers from the AI bonuses from increased difficulty while ranged units don't since those bonuses only apply to melee attack and defense values thus no change in terms of taking missile damage. But yeah even in lower difficulties in order for the melee infantry units to actually be good they need to be able to outperform the archers, which I can't say any of them actually do, especially not the Sisters of Avalon.

Have a blast, Immortal Empires closed the gap on most of the tiers too :)

Thanks mate. The High Elves Race Guide I have for WH2 is virtually the same for WH3. I think there's a few handy things in there if you're interested. Cheers!

A lot of work went into this one so stoked to hear. Cheers for the support mate!

Appreciate the comment mate!

Love it, adds some serious flavor and dynamic into those early/mid fights too!

Thanks mate, appreciate the support!

Thanks mate. If you're newer to TW Battles I recommend my latest video breaking down battlefield roles. Has some handy tips on how to quick read stats that might help inform your decisions! Either way, cheers for watching!

Cheers, thanks mate!

Thanks mate, appreciate it!

Thanks mate!

Thanks mate. Recommend my Dark Elf Playlist, the race mastery guide is among my most proud vids. Also, here's the Dark Elf Tier List ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-zUo6stR_ELg.html Cheers for the comment and sub!

Thanks mate, worked long and hard to try and do it justice. Glad you enjoyed!

In WH2 I was very anti-horses but in WH3 I actually prefer my nobles on horseback in many cases and think it's a pretty safe bet to have them on horseback as a default. Good comment btw.

Thanks mate, appreciate the comment and sub!

Thanks mate! Cheers for the comment and sub!

Appreciate the comment mate. Thanks for the support!

Thanks!

Cheers mate, I put a fair bit of time and testing so my own playstyle doesn't distort it too much. Nagarythe is devastating late game. Enjoy cleaning up ;)

@@ElvenPlotArmour I’ve only ever used shadow walkers and shadow warriors LOL they’re all super high experience so they wreck armies on normal (I’m too much of a dunce for hard or higher, I just graduated from easy)

Pretty much everything is exactly where it was, except I'd move dragon princes up to C Tier. When they get new units I'll release an update :)

Appreciate you champion!

I think your idea has merit, but perhaps have a fixed garrison but instead of a T2 upgrade, you can choose whether it's ranged, cavalry, etc. That'd be a fun way to taylor to the opponent it's guarding!

Cheers for watching.

Glad to have you each time brother haha

You might be interested to know I'm currently working on my next confed guide? Hint: cruel, bbq, mommy's boy

@@ElvenPlotArmour that's going to be awesome. My favorite is always gonna be my edge lord malus, but I admit his mechanics really really are underwhelming sometimes

@@Darien_England He's been reworked in the past few months to have less negatives modifiers on his Possession Level to make it easier to play. He's much stronger now (not as top tier as some claim) but it's made his campaign far less painful and more enjoyable. You may have already played it and not been impressed, but I found the rework to be one of my favorite campaigns!

@@ElvenPlotArmour I admit I haven't taken the time to try the campaign again yet as I was practicing other races. I should give it another shot, I admit I dislike how weak the monstrous cav are when in the books those things are so cool.

@@Darien_England I agree, I'd like them to have some "jink" like ability (dmg resist) to help them live longer and/or increase their foot speed. Riding on a giant raptor should 'never' be a bad thing! lol

Honestly, I come from the camp of either fun or effective. Doomstacking is fun, but is typically inefficient. Your army only needs to be as strong as it needs to "Win". Why crush an army 3-1 when you could expand/defend 3 areas with 3 separate armies? With this philosophy, I find myself running Imrik's with 5 dragons and his fire mage. You can keep the legendary dragons in reserve to drop down and immmediately fix any issue you're in or ride them with Imrik and benefit from his buff/discount. Throw in 1 Loremaster to heal them all with earthblood, 1-2 noble for replenishment (on foot to defend archers), 1-2 silverin guard and the rest archers. I actually keep my original rank 9 archers through to the late game but you may need to trade them out for Sisters of Avelorn if there's too much armour in your way. A full dragon stack is a good laugh but even with Imrik is expensive, takes ages to win battles and is more clunky to use than many give credence. The above build provides 7 dragons in total (including mounts) and a defensive firebase to fall back to and heal via earthblood. Remembering your fire mage should always deal the most damage and this army should be able to handle everything, is flexible and balances fun and efficiency very well in my eyes ;)

@@ElvenPlotArmour Awesome, thanks a lot man! I eventually got my dragons up to like 80 upkeep each, but the early game damage from being broke af was done haha. About to start a new run with your strat.

Thanks mate, no problem. Growth buildings are useless after you get to Tier 5, so yes, when upgrading that main building, trash the other building for either more economy or Hero Capacity :)

Hey that's actually a really good point with Eltharion. In Ulthuan there isn't much benefit but in the badlands there are a tonne of enemy summoners and that could help. Summons are such a good tool against defensive gunlines!

Honestly, not much is going to be able to handle that haha

I know! Sadly cosplay horses as dragons can't compete with dragons!

All units have a "base" number of turns, Spearmen is 1, Sisters are 2 turns to recruit. Some faction or Lord traits have means of reducing this recruitment time but it is uncommon. The most common method isn't well known. If you have 10 of the same building, it reduces the Global recruitment by 1 turn (note that is global), but late game this can stack up to easily get 1 turn Sisters of Avelorn, as you will have multiples of this structure to get more handmaidens. Hope that helps, cheers for the comment and sub!

@@ElvenPlotArmour I hadn't subbed yet, but now I have. I always sub when a channel owner replies or takes the time to read my comment - seems fair. I'm enjoying your content so far as it helps newer players. Other channels are for veterans who play on legendary :)

Good strat in WH2, especially as it's easy to bait the AI. In WH3 the AI is much smarter. However, this is why I recommend getting mages on horses ASAP. Deal your damage and retreat. While personally I go through campaigns without hiring one, they are a definitely a solid unit. They answer enemies with shields which shut down elves 'hard'!. They fit the defensive HE playstyle, but they struggle for glory because basic archers with research + Lord buffs can perform above Tier 3... Sisters of Avelorn take over after here and deal AP with decent melee support to a degree which shows the Bolt Thrower really is a mid tier artillery piece. Good unit, great for Tier 3. It starts losing serious steam against Tier 5 threats.

A lot to unpack here, so apologies if I miss something, please let me know if I fail to address anything. Firstly, High Elves have very clear strengths (missiles) and weaknesses (offensive melee). The meta of WH2 is missiles so this places them strong and they don't need support buildings to build their high tier units like other factions, so this makes me hesitant to buff them them in any way. Honestly, I think they need one nerf: Sisters of Avelorn upkeep increase. Immediately this would force HE players to look to the cheaper options for efficiency. As a legendary player (contrary to popular belief) doomstacks are horribly inefficient - your supply lines mean you only want your armies to be as good as they "need to be". You can conquer twice as much with 2 balanced armies rather than 1 dragon stack. So, shadow warriors? They're honestly fine where they are imo. One of their lords makes them front and centre and very good so I'm ok with them, they're also a flexible support unit if you so wish. Again, it's Sisters being so cheap is why you don't use them at high levels of play. LSG with shields are still an incredibly strong and forgiving unit. The reason why I don't recommend them is because of the way the campaign plays out. If Sisters were a T5 unit then you'd get enough use out of LSG to consider them, but T4 being right around the corner, I've never been let down by upgrading my spears with Silverin to support the (excellent) basic archers before moving onto Sisters with future armies. The truth is, magic does so much damage you could finish a campaign just fine with armies of LSG or Shadow Warriors because Magic should do your heavy lifting and the rest is more support, but Sisters are honestly just OP, and can become broken if you stack the correct traits (making them dominant at both casual and high levels of play). That said, even Legend will say "you can't just hire a stack of sisters and expect it to win everything" because you need to stack 'Resistant' on them, so you have more flexibility than you think. I always try to bring semi-balanced armies and have no trouble on legendary, the need to spam/doomstack is a myth that needs review, but you should always have as elves 9-12 /20 units archers, only 4 melee infantry and the rest heroes/cav/monster support. This build applies to Avelorn who you absolutely can have those Tree units in your ranks. Just as I mentioned, these units simply aren't as efficient but are perfectly usable (which I again, stress is not a dirty word). High Elf basic spears and archers are simply very effective against other elves (which is what she faces early on). I'd recommend trying this (see my formations video): x11 archers (in 3 groups as per the vid) x2 spearmen (up front on each flank) x2-4 Tree units (behind spears) x1-4 heroes Appreciate the comment and sub - hope that helped? haha

@@ElvenPlotArmour I feel really bad about this comment a year later, its so noob, yeah shadow warriors and LSG do have strengths to make up for their lack of AP, I underestimated the strength of vanguard, and fire whilst moving at 180 range, shadowwalkers add poison, and you can get away with mixing an army of all three and just keeping some sisters of avelorn to only shoot at the high armor or units with physical resistance. Shadow Warriors always seem to get good value at the end of my battles because they can keep shooting nearly all the time, you just got to look at what units the enemy has and tailor how you are goign to use them in the upcoming battle. And bolt throwers are good early on for sieges, and to put the hurt on any shield/high armor units and to focus things like Hydras down so they are already weakened a bit when they come into range.

@@MusMasi Nothing to feel bad for brother. You were sharing you experience at the time and that's how we collaborate and learn. Comments are a great way to learn new things and see the general sentiment. Cheers for taking the time!

One of the best things I can recommend is to not explore out further than you need and to try to have wars on only 1 front if possible. Don't sign alliances unless you're willing to get roped into conflicts and you can typically stay as friendly trade partners unless you plan to confed eventually. This is why defensive alliances usually help. I'm fairly certain removing fog of war does wacky thins to the AI (many mods do). In WH2, Morathi is very aggressive but if you can break 1 or 2 of her armies she'll run out of steam. Don't be affraid to give some small gifts to Alith if he's hurting! Regarding autoresolve ... it can be a strange beast haha. Sounds like it's coming together though!

This list applies 100% to WH3. I wouldn't change anything, what was strong before is still strong. Sorry for the late reply!

@@ElvenPlotArmour No worries, most tubers just don't respond on old videos like this, you're the best :D

@@1001airstrikes I try haha hope it's useful!

They perform much better now. Martial prowess got buffed to stay active until 25% remaining health (was 50% prior) so HE are now better in melee now, but that also means so are Silverin Guard and their cheaper units. What stops Swordmasters jumping up to B is Sisters also got buffed by virtue of magic damage now bypassing all physical resist. But would I now hire 1, maybe 2 in my balanced armies? It now can form part of a sound strategy and more flexible builds can now be played which is a win for everyone :) Cheers for sharing!

If you want to throw a unit in your army it won't hurt you ;)

20% is epic, but it comes at a time where you are in the campaign. Much of your combat will be sieges which melee infantry won't contribute to as much as sisters or monsters. Phoenix Guard can be situationally very strong, but by Tier 5 (remember you get the Arc Phoenix from this buiding...) you'll have several instances of T3 and T4 buildings so you'll be able to globally recruit several alternatives better and have the heroes to gain the traits you need. Also, as much as I love halberds, the H.E. are obsessed with spears and most buffs go to them. 20% physical resist is boss but your economy will be so strong by this point you will have outgrown a heavy lineholder approach. But if you want to have these guys in your armies because you're a fan, they are still usable. 4 of these to guard your sisters isn't going to be a min/max strategy, but if someone said it's a stupid idea I'd disagree. Just because there are better choices doesn't mean all sub-optimal is bad. Like all things in C Tier, if you love it and want to make it work, you can still win on legendary without exploits, you just need to know what you're doing and the ways to make that unit work.

@@ElvenPlotArmour yea hamstrung by being close ranged even with this bonus. I think one Phoenix guard and one sword master together with two silverin guard is good fun for semi roleplaying. Feels like it's what should be put in a balanced army led by someone like Tyrion. Thank you for the detailed breakdown.

@@jellydamgood Mate, that's honestly perfectly workable around the moment you just reach Tier 5. Tyrion's 1/2 price Silverin makes this even more affordable. Remember, you'll be facing garrisons against troops of mixed levels so there's plenty to carve up. As long as infantry are there to protect and not spearhead you still have an effective HE army. Until very late, the core concept of 4 infantry 11 archers with characters/flanking units is a roleplaying setup that serves me well on Legendary every time, much later than many would expect.

@@ElvenPlotArmour hohoh I shall have to try this setup then.

With tech, skills and a diamond guardian phoenix you can get 45 or 50% physical resist on Phoenix Guard. Takes abit of work, but worth in imo.

Appreciate the level of effort into your insight. Rangers are honestly lucky to hold onto a C Tier and can only be considered B Tier against certain matchups, and are D Tier against even more. The way you're using them by counter charging into the enemy flanks is excellent and this can give good results... but seeing as your Tyrion, you're fighting other elves which aren't great in melee. Try this against orcs, dwarves, etc and they'll deal damage, but that 20 melee defence and low HP will see them drop like flies and the spearmen will last far longer here. This offensive infantry role is much better performed by the excellent HE characters (Nobles, Loremasters, etc) who deal meaningful damage and can also hold the line. Whatever damage your Rangers are dealing, master you archers who can multiply it several times and are good against ALL early threats, not just the soft ones. Also, once your enemy reaches Tier 3, those rangers are going to be useless, while your spearmen will still be excellent in doing what elven infantry should be doing: defending your archers. I hope this didn't come across as dismissive! 1-2 Rangers in an early army to counter charge can keep the cost down, but they won't deliver anything the famed archer+staunch spearline can't. Rangers are still usable for 2 reasons: large blob and cheap.

@@ElvenPlotArmour Thank you and I largely agree on all. :) I changed my view to; Rangers are less-good after higher tier units are introduced but it's fair to compare them mostly by their role very early game. So IMHO 1-2 Rangers still contribute well during the important initial expansion "fighting other elves" and conquering Saphery asap. I play Eltharion (the Tyrion reference above was only to get their stats at campaign start) and use 1-2 as flankers, glass cannon DPS or chasers. I like their upkeep of 100 gold (meaning they are your cheapest way to improve your power-balance for better diplomacy), large unit size and weapon strength of 36 vs infantry (nearly DOUBLE the archer's damage). Eltharion recruits them at +3 ranks (which is not the case for archers). In a crisis they can also help spread out the damage your spearmen take (something the archers have problem with) - which otherwise can slow you down when a couple of spearmen units are beaten so badly you need to combine them or rehire new (to keep up the initial speedy map-expansion). On a personal note I find they make battles more varied and fun at start (when you can only recruit three unit types; archers, spearmen and rangers). :)

@@littlegreen6355 Really enjoyed this response. You hit the nail on the head. If you want to use them for fun and variety? Well they're cheaper so go nuts, it won't hurt you. Just be aware against the wrong enemy or later on this won't work. You're talking to a guy who deliberately plays varied armies that don't min/max to prove you can have fun on legendary. Sounds like some enjoyable battles!

I'd say the Loremaster is one of the most underrated units in the entire game. You'll have a tonne of these and it gives Earthblood to your armies. This alone is enough to make something A Tier when you put it on a good offensive infantry unit (something the HE are notoriously bad at). Even playing as Imrik, a stack of dragons is fun, but it's not efficient even with half stacks you'll be at the point you can autoresolve all your battles. having 1-2 Loremaster to even just hiding to heal them is arguably more utility than another 2 dragons. Plus, you need some land units so you don't lose ;)

@@ElvenPlotArmour i still feel like I prefer to have a life mage being the ground unit and put them on a horse so they can run away if discovered

Definitely stronger than the Prince, the biggest issue of the Princess isn't that she's bad, it's the H.E. Arch-Mages are insanely overpowered and get Arcane Conduit Level 1 (which is crazy). Combine this with strong mount options and the terrible combat stats are largely negated. Princesses have some great Upkeep reduction traits which certainly have utility on the higher difficulties and they are also just cool. They're just competing against one of the best non-LL's in the game when they are coupled with Light/Fire/High Magic. Thanks for the feedback btw, I'm inspired to raise an Ardent Princess in the next stream ;)

Thanks mate. Discussion round these things is great and important, so cheers for the input. I'll share my own thoughts on the points you shared. Regarding LSG w/shields, I agree I never use them but this is only due to Sisters being nearly available while spears/archers are still dominant. In a game where every shielded unit is good LSG are a great unit, but I do say here that "with DLC they're only a solid unit" but without DLC they prove they can still hang well for a T3 unit. Reavers w/bows can perform very well if you have the patients to micro and cycle charge. Even a single unit vangard deployed vs any enemy with artillery can have value, particularly since the HE may not have any artillery in the early game. Cycle charges and missiles in the rear are good for leadership shock rather than damage. Regarding Diplomacy Rating, I try to keep videos quick and to the point, so I maybe don't make it clear enough. The diplomacy rating is more a measurement of the faction's ability to control its engagements rather than their use of the diplomacy screen. You're right, other dark elves do hate Malekith, but even on legendary, unless you don't have enough military they'll never declare war on you. Dark Elves tend not to attack other Dark Elves. On the flip side, other races are very keen to at least 'join' wars with Dark Elves. This allows the Dark Elves to be very effective at divide and conquer and can usually score non-aggression and trade under the right circumstances. Lastly, confederations are a factor here and Malekith has very strong confederation opportunities with Morathi and some minor factions being the only obstacle. Malekith's geopolitical position simply allows him to dictate his wars and has many options to control his fronts and can confederate any underdogs (Crone, Rakarth, Lokhir) at will. Please feel free to counter any points, this can all make us better players :) thanks again mate!

Nope. Everything operates the same in WH3 for the High Elves. Keep yourself centred around S, A and B Tier and you'll have a strong campaign!

@@ElvenPlotArmour Thanks for responding and agree

Haha I don't hate it, I just consider it mid and consider it among the HE less flexible options. Having, say, a phoenix affords you the ability to harass and disablle their artillery and backline while moving your archers up to deal you heavy damage. Sitting back and shooting will work in many cases, but many factions dominate high elf artillery, meaning phoenix and heroes on mounts provide a counter. If they don't have artillery arrows and magic should win the day. TLDR: HE Artillery can work but in the grand scheme it doesn't solve any problems that can't be solved by units that contribute more flexibility. A mage on a sun dragon takes a bit to level but is a sure way to get siege attacker on those secondary armies, along with sacrifice to vaul until you get those levels.

Group Hug is a term I use for characters, typically, to heal them up post battle. The main point I'm trying to push here is Loremasters are incredibly overlooked when they make Life Mages nearly redundant and free you up to take different lores of magic. Agree healing infantry isn't going to help much haha

@@ElvenPlotArmour Yes they seem awesome. Just dont focus on healing inf after the battle... Btw im really strugging with imrik economy after i got caledor. Not sure how best to build the economy and which buildings i should put where...(wh2) Im used to playing only vampire counts...

@@cobrazax Imrik's economy is notoriously bad in WH2. In short, Entertainment building in each capital, tradable or trinket makers where possible in minor settlements. Taking ports will give good wealth. I recommend my HE Mastery Guide. I might be biased but it's excellent ;) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ZjYCLy8wgm4.html

@@ElvenPlotArmour Thanks. I do these as u said as that seems to be a smart way...but not sure about how to deal with the high cost of having an army in caledor when u got low relations with high elves, when u barely get any money from there. Also not sure about embassies. Thought of putting one in every minor settlement that has no resource or port... Should i keep units like sea guard? Got several at caledor... Even got a princess with upkeep discount for all archer unit types. Still not nearly enough. Also i dont see how i can build the inf and cav buildings...if they are even needed. Not sure if i need the Phoenix building too except to recruit them or vs corruption. Same with the blacksmith building as it doesnt seem useful at all.