Thanks again to Babbel for sponsoring todays video! Start speaking a new language in 3 weeks with Babbel 🎉 Get up to 60% OFF your subscription ➡️ here: go.babbel.com/t?bsc=1200m60-youtube-coffeehousecrime-aug-2023&btp=default&RU-vid&Influencer..coffeehousecrime..USA..RU-vid
I like the way you named your channel. I think most presenters use their names? Even among those that don't, I think yours is what would you say "catchy"
he wasn't trying to avoid shame for his family, he wanted to escape the shame he would have to face when his parents found out. He didn't to it to protect them like he claims, he did it to protect himself and not have to see the consequences he deserved for his lies.
Dude. It isn’t even hard to get into York for engineering. Worst case there are many more options in Ontario where the admissions require lower grades or the schools will provide transition courses to bump up your grades and get you read for university.
I agreed with you until you said "consequences he deserved for his lies". I don't agree with the murders obviously, but sometimes parents put so much pressure on their kids, that the kids have no other choice other than to resort to lies and dishonestly to avoid their parents wrath and to give themselves breathing space. Not surprisingly, the powder keg of lies, tensions and anger, mostly created by the parents just explodes. While I don't condone murder, parents like this know the rules of the games they play and the potential consequences. As the saying goes, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
This is why I never pressured my sons to become whatever I wanted them to be...I'm a single mom with 3 adult sons..I told them whatever their dreams were I would support them...My oldest son became a Police Officer, my second son a Math Teacher and my third son became a Dentist...I'm so proud of them
Good parenting, well done! I was pushed by one parent a lot, who didn't understand I was a totally different person to them. We were at loggerheads all the time. Every dalliance I was interested in, that beloved parent was the one obstacle to me being comfortable with enjoying it. I never became anything special career-wise. Though I totally deplore what this evil young loser did, I partially understand what he may have felt before his psychotic deeds.
@@domoetker3967 ??? It's definitely not a muslim only issue! There's alot of similar cases and most of them aren't muslim, it's just shitty parents pushing their shitty children to the edge! Anyways your hatred is showing..
That's actually amazing of you! Your sons are contributing to your community in multiple aspects and that's all thanks to their supportive mother(and of course their personal hard work and skills). Much kudos
@@domoetker3967 more like Asian thing. Two of my online friends are harassed by their family for not being something they wanted to be, none of them are muslim. In my own case, a muslim family, my parent min maxed both my and my brothers' educational path. My brother live in our hometown and married, I went minimum contact with the rest of my family and live in the capital city. Only my sister is free to choose whatever she wanted for education, but even then my mom forced her career choice All of those mentioned in my story are Asian
@specialforcesNinerNinerLet's see how well that part of him living in his own terms works out for him in prison...🤦😂 Sub human is right!! Pathetic is right also!! What's wrong with these people? Why would you do something like that to any humans let alone your family, mother, father,sister, grandma and he would have killed the whole country if he could....did he think he would live happy for the rest of his life? Idiot people, hope he dreams with them,about them for the rest of his life, so he can suffer like they suffered those last minutes, seconds as they Saw their son killing them....R.I.P. Rot in prison worm!!! Now i finish the rest of the story still have'nt seen it all just had to write this down... Blessings to you all from Puerto Rico with lot's of love
Coffee says "he craved some kind of control in his life' - he had total control of his life. He chose to lie about the college, do no work in community college, and play games all day. He could have gotten a job and moved out. Or did any other of the things above differently. He was mad because his parents wouldn't financially support him to play video games all day. Then when it came time where the gig was up, he went on a murder spree because "his life was so unfair". He had complete control over his life, and made all the wrong decisions.. so saying "he craved control over his life" is a bullshit copout.
He also said he did it "so he did it so his family members wouldn't have to feel shame for his failures." However, he did it so that HE wouldn't have to feel the shame from his family members. He then gave himself up to police like the coward he is. Because the only person who was important to Man-Azz was Man-Azz.
Him letting everyone of his contacts know what he did while sharing the pictures... Disgusting. He was absolutely showing off, it was an accomplishment for him. The constant self flagellation was pure theatrics.
Malesa was my daughter’s best friend. They went to Bur Oak high school together. We went to the pre-trial hearing and not a single member of her extended family was present. It was just us and a young guy who lived in Markham and felt bad for the deceased family. Malesa’s brother didn’t shed any tears. He just stared at us. We didn’t attend the trial because at the pre-trial my daughter was and is still grieving and I knew she wouldn’t be able hear the details. Malesa still lives in our memories.
I think most of their families were in Bangladesh and India and because of this most likely they couldn't come for the trials of the case because of financial issues. Going to Canada is EXPENSIVE from here in India(i would know, I'm still trying to get their throw the legal system). They probably only sent two or three people from family for the trials.
@@RandomSwiftie13 You obviously don’t know anything about the families here in Toronto. Don’t “think” and assumed. Look up who funded the burial, it was Malesa’s other best friend. She sat up a Go Fund Me page. Why didn’t the relatives in Toronto do that? There is a whole lot you don’t know. However, I gave credit to Malesa’s other best friend whom I wouldn’t name because I don’t have her consent to name her. To this day her other best friend is traumatized by the senseless act of Malesa’s monster brother.
I have no doubt. But locking them out of the house at night, being extremely controlling and not giving them the opportunity to choose their own life, career, friends, partnerships etc. is... definitely below what most can and will do.
There was no "delicate balance" here. They were typical abusive asian parents. Doesn't justify murder, but I think we can be pretty sure that it wouldn't have happened had they just not been assholes.
@@kuro9410_ilustI used to hang out with a very asian friend of mine every summer. I would stay with him and his family all summer because they were pretty sweet to me. but his parents and older siblings were really brutal with him in terms of pressure. and he was really intense with them. he often told me that he wanted to kill them... I thought it was weird but hey for some reason all that crazy yelling at each other didn't bother me as much. Probably because it was an a language I didn't understand. I was actually always really worried that he would harm one of his parents one day.
His sister is the only one I truly feel sorry for. She was as much a victim of their environment and abusive childhood as he was. If she had had the chance she might have escaped, she was already taking the first steps. I may be wrong, but I suspect he killed her because she was there and would have prevented him from killing his dad. Of course there is the chance he hated or resented her too, there is the dynamic of pitting siblings against each other in scapegoat/golden child. Her murder is especially tragic.
That's nNOT when it starts. It starts with the parents pressuring a kid to become their personal project. University is just the last stop for the results to show up. Naturally, that's when things will be discovered. Fear, panic even, shows up... reactions can be extreme.
@@Sputterbugno. The problems starts when parents are pressing through harsh discipline they kids to become something they are not. Ofcourse I'm not saying that as an excuse for his actions. There is no excuse. But if they would not pressure and discipline him so hard there would not be need for lies and there would not be such a fear for telling the truth.
This is such a similar case to Chandler Halderson, Jennifer Pan, Sef Gonzalez, and Bart Whitaker, people who turned on family just to cover up the shame of not meeting academic expectations. It's so scary to think that they would rather end their families rather than tell them the truth and deal with the fallout. The judge and prosecutor of Halderson's case made excellent points: We all had to walk into uncomfortable situations at some point in our lives, such as talking to an angry boss or an irate parent, but a normal person wouldn't and shouldn't go into extreme lengths to escape the discomfort of dealing with shame.
I was just contemplating this exact thing - I wonder if there is any research specifically on this phenomenon - it's so strange given these people have such a massive negative feedback loop of deception and shame that they choose the absolute worst outcome for themselves and loved ones over potential disownment or even just a standard argument - I suppose the situations like these that end more peacefully aren't widely publicized though..
And isn’t it uncanny that both Jennifer Pan & Menhaz Zaman lived in the same town, Markham. Their situations, family expectation & compulsive lying seems to be quite the coincidence. Crazy!
Sure, but it seems the large majority of desi parents stifle and oppress their children, forcing careers on them, foreclosing alternative futures for them, and in the case of this Muslim family, preventing them from smoking, drinking, dating, anything they irrationally consider haram. They didn't deserve to die, but their son was also a victim in some sense.
Although I agree and feel fof those poor kids. I also think people either turn on those who hurt them, or on themselves by suicide. Its extreme either way.
@@bhavikasicka7871I seriously wish that committing these kind of minor "Haram" wouldn't be punishable by family shame, or anything violent. Haram's like murder though, are a different story.
He annihilated his entire family, boasted about it, continued to play video games as if nothing happened, and didn't get a life sentence!? If this lunatic can take out his family he'd have no problem killing anyone else. I know Canada has no death penalty, but how many murders does it take to get life without parole? Outrageous injustice!!!
Unfortunately Canada's judicial system is often extremely lenient compared to the United States. In the early 2000s we had a schizophrenic man murder someone on a greyhound bus and cut off his head. The killer spent a few years in an institution and was let go without any need for regular checkups or anything. It often makes me wonder how many murderers there are walking around.
I experienced a similar case as well when I was in my final year and couldn't graduate yet because I hadn't finished my final project, It was the only thing left to do for me to graduate but I was really tired mentally when my parents kept asking when I graduate. The question was asked several times a month. It's not that the final project was hard, it was the pressure of them to keep asking me the same question when I was trying my best to finish it, they only wanted the result but didn't care much about the process. I got so burnt out that I stopped working on my final project. I never told them how I was or the final project progress I had made, I turned to video games to forget everything. This brought time and peace for me, but only for a while. Eventually, my time to finish the final project is coming to an end. I had to finish it within 6 months or I would drop out. I still remember that night of being helpless, having no one to talk to or even give me advice on what to do, I couldn't sleep till the sun was about to rise. To be honest, I also felt a bit suicidal I kept thinking what if I disappeared? or what would happen if my parents didn't get to see me anymore? Stuff like that. Then I decided to "Fuck it, I'm gonna call my mother and tell her everything". I called her at 4AM, broke down, and cried like a little boy over the phone, explaining everything about how I had been so far, how I was burnt out due to their behavior towards me, and how I felt helpless. It felt like a huge weight had been lifted off my shoulder, all the peace that video games have been giving me so far was nothing compared to finally telling the truth to my mother. Luckily she understood me very well and tried to comfort me the best she could over the phone. The next day I bought a last-minute ticket and went home to talk through everything again with both my parents this time. In the end, I managed to finish my final project in time and finally graduated. I hugged my parents so hard and I cried during my graduation ceremony (it was online and at home due to covid) I thanked them for all the support they gave me and I should have been more honest with them instead of keeping everything to myself and lying about it. Sorry it got so long lol. I just always relate to cases like this because I went through a similar case and I believe that talking things over is a lot better than keeping to yourself. Find the right people (doesn't have to be your parents), ones that you know will support you and let it all out, you will feel MUCH, MUCH better. Thanks for reading all this lol - Random stranger on the internet
It was a similar case for me when failed a year in university, I kept it secret from my family for few months, but then ended up telling them, and surprisingly my father was very understanding and he supported me, same as my mother. Now I am doing way better at university, I passed the year I failed in with high grades when I repeated it
I watched the ID Channel's multi-part show about this case, and was absolutely gobsmacked with this kid's actions. He not only murdered his family, he traumatized his online community of friends.
Yeah, I felt bad for the friend he privately messaged. The friend had to share them again in order to let everyone know it wasn't a joke. Must have been traumatic. Then with his other friend "Do you want pics?" What a scum bag!
@heehee___ Some people are really sensitive to that. For instance? Mods that work for big corporations have been known to develop PTSD from the images they have to deal with daily. In the NSA, it's actually fairly common? They basically get to look at CP, snuff, and extremely graphic murder images all freaking day. That's what entry-level NSA agents get to do.🤮 (I honestly never thought I'd feel sorry for the people surveilling me, but here we are.) (EDIT: I'M AN ACTIVIST. Not a k1ller or any variety of kiddy-fiddler. Just realized how that sounded. 😬 The US gov doesn't like left-wing activisty people!)
@heehee___ Exactly why they aren't my focus. Their suffering has ended. He didn't need to scar other people, who will carry that with them the rest of their lives.
@heehee___ Yeah, probably so? I mean it takes a bit for most people to get PTSD. Brain resilience is variable. I edited; the censor robot ate that reply. Oops.
I think part of Menhaz's motive was envy that his sister's life was actually real. Getting into the uni he was rejected from. Building a better relationship with his parents. And, we all know what it's like when the 'prodigal daughter' returns.
@@carolinebrennan3864 No one's blaming the sister. Ezin is simply pointing out a motive for her murder. By all accounts, aside from being someone who would expose him (which he turned himself in anyway, so that wasn't a reason to kill her) the fact that he killed her despite her pleas and cries makes envy a real possibility. He was truly a sick and twisted individual.
I don't understand why someone in a case like this would EVER be up for parole. Lock him up for the rest of his life. He does not belong in society, he is not a human, he said it himself. He's an animal. Four lives gone, and for what? So they don't "suffer the shame" of him being a lying rat? Despicable and sad. May they rest in peace.
If he thought he was such a shame, he could have just ended himself.. but of course, he is a selfish coward.. like there's no shame in being a murderer..? I don't understand his logic. Narcissistic family annihilator.. their image is more important than the lives of their family members..
It's because it's Canada, they don't lock people up forever even when they commit murder. They work on rehabilitation and stuff, but I agree. There's just some things you can't come back from.
@@aydadae7337I mean technically we don’t, but many many offenders will never actually get parole. Even Paul Bernardo gets parole hearings, but he will never be released.
There are many similarities between this case and the Jennifer Pan case of 2010. Both happened in the Toronto suburbs and are both stories of immigrant families pressuring their children to reach success academically - resulting in them leading double lives and eventually, committing familicide.
Yes I agree. I get there are no perfect parents/families, ppl need to learn to get help or walk away. I don't see how red flags r missed this badly. 4 years of this huge school lie. Who was paying for the classes? Idk.
I am the child of immigrants. And I struggled with the weight of expectations, parents who see you both as an extension of themselves and their retirement plan, and I had to deal with all of that plus emotional abuse. I understand his pressure and started feeling so bad for him then I was like WAIT …I went through the same shit and didn’t kill anyone. We can’t help who we are born to. We CAN help how we process it. I can’t help to wonder that if we allowed men the space to process emotions freely without the weight of societal expectations, could we avoid this. Still his fault though. What a creep.
🇵🇭 Hi. Yes. Our levels differs. I guess, you can still find other ways to go on even though Not what they want or expect. I hope you'd become successful in another way or some small scale business. As for me, it's all too late now. I retired early, messed up my good life, lost my mom, lost my life savings, I'm sick and I can't work anymore. Please be strong. And always believe in God.
I already knew about this case but I wanted to hear how you'd cover it, Adrian. Menhaz is absolutely despicable and I agree with him on one thing: he was and still is a Coward. His family deserved better and had Menhaz just told the truth, even with the discipline he would've faced, his parents would've eventually forgiven him. They forgave and supported his sister, after all. He killed them all because he wanted to. He actually reminds me a lot of Chandler Halderson. Both are lying wastes of oxygen and both should've taken their own lives instead of destroying the lives of the people that loved them most.
They both had mothers who coddled, overindulged, and had low expectations of their sons. Their fathers both had expectations of them, but the mothers excused their sons' behavior and continually rescued them. That's not love. That's very unhealthy parenting. All of those actions have consequences. Unfortunately, sometimes it can end very, very badly. It would benefit society to recognize how children are affected by their upbringing in order to prevent some of these negative behaviors from developing.
I live one street away from the crime scene, I occasionally think about it as I drive past everyday. It's still so surreal to think something so horrible happened so close to home.
@@ArthurBeerman-u3f it was listed and sold, not sure if anybody lives there now. it was high profile and there are clauses for these things. i recall in the listing some of the carpets were ripped up. found the listing. sold for $981k cad in 2020
Murderers are already awful but it takes a special kind of evil to beat your own family members to death, especially when they're fighting back like his sister did. He had so much time between the murders to sit and think about it and still went through it all. And then to share all of that online...the incredible trauma and possible guilt at not having been able to do anything the users must have felt. I myself am a failed golden child of an immigrant family, but no matter how heavy the pressure gets I could never imagine doing something like this. There's so many cases just like this one though and it's scary to even think about.
I was a gifted child that lost motivation as an adult. My mom always told me it's each generations job to do better than the one before. Because that's why our great grandparents came here, for better lives for the future generations. I'm the first generation to go backwards. I know I disappointed my parents and grandparents. But I'm happy. They're disappointed but happy. So I like to think that if my great grandparents knew that I don't go hungry and lead a happy life they'd still think their sacrifice was worth it. Because at the end of the day, I don't care what my daughter does with her life as long as she's safe, healthy and happy
Great comment. But you are not a failure for not meeting other people's expectations. It's a difficult thing to experience that pressure from family, but in my view that cultural tradition of expecting your kids to be perfect is the problem. Never the child who can't meet their standard. I hope you're happy no matter what you're doing.
This is why you don't spoil your kids rotten. They feel the world owes them something. This is also why you have to let your kids decide what it is they want to do in life, not what you want. As long as they have a legal realistic plan for taking care of themselves after high school, support them, everyone does not want to be a damn doctor!!!
Exactly. My son leaves for university next year. He is trying to apply for Oxford uni and I have told him I don't care about the prestige as I am worried about the pressure. Let your kids find their own path.
he literally wanted nothing but to play games all day, this is why you Muricans end up dorpping out of high school and living on benefits while complaining about how unfair the world is to you.
The fact he has two parents, a nice home and all he had to do was finish uni. As an immigrant child, I had to contribute to the household while attending uni, yet I managed to graduate and cherish my mother. May God have mercy on those poor souls and may he rot in his grave!
We had similar case few days ago in Bosnia and Herzegovina. A guy recorded live on Instagram the beating and murder of his wife, and then a father and his son on another location, for full two hours before the police reacted to calls. He had numerous audience chearing him on to continue hitting his wife - all of their data has been collected and they're going to respond in front of the court under the Bosnian law of "encouraging a person to commit a murder instead of fulfilling the obligation of reporting a crime." I watched the video on a wedding party while my boyfriend's friend was showing it to him, and I was sick to my stomach. The video had been re-recorded by someone and put online again before being finally removed from all sources - she was continually beaten, taunted for full two hours, and then shot in the head. The baby was left on the floor crying, while he left to find those other guys. He was a criminal and he had bragged how his "connections" helped him avoid jail. I don't know what's worse - what he did, or the fact that so many people enjoyed the live torture and murder of another human being. Makes you think how many sick, hateful people and psychopaths live among us freely and share the same air with us. I don't think most people are good. I think most people are sick and evil but they fake normalcy on a daily basis because the system we live in expects it so.
I had a cousin like this, kept to himself and went to college. At graduation, he disappeared and my aunt and uncle found out he didn't attend the school for the whole 4 years except for one semester as a freshman. He took his own life in a different city about 90 miles from where they live.
It's awfully sad. And stories very similar to your cousin's are tragically common right around the world. I'm from Australia and I understand that here, when end-of-high-school / university-entry scores are released to graduating students, this is a time of year when there's an increase in deaths of young people due to suicide. They're unable to live with the pressures and stress of not getting a 100&% perfect score - the one their parents want - to study medicine or law (for example) at the top universities.
I live just north of Toronto. Heard about this on the radio while driving for weeks but they never released any details, just that a family was murdered and the suspect was most likely another family member. First time I’ve heard real insight into it.
This is a horrible story. While inexcusable, I understand where the killer comes from. I myself was so obsessed with not disappointing my family and boyfriend, that I ended up lying for years about my academic failures. I was just not in the right place. I would never kill anybody for that of course, but I can tell you that a simple lie from which you feel you can't escape will drive you insane with time. I ended up depressed, then I gave my life a new direction, after a broken relationship and parents who loved me anyways. I give you all this advice : don't underestimate the impact of a lie. Living a lie is a terrible fate indeed.. You're worth more than that. Peace
Same I had broken down after losing a family member to the point I failed classes and stopped attending college. I never told my dads because I was afraid they’d hate me and would disown me. Then I nearly ended myself but got help and figured out my built up issues. Plus my step dad figured it out and they both were supportive in having me get help.
That is the tragedy of it, the breaking point was trying to stay in the good graces of his parents, to make them proud, but it was through a lie, because the expectations they wanted were too much for him to burden. So rather than live with the fact of seeing them disappointed he chose to take their lives because that become the path of least resistance. Sadly I feel in cases like these something could be learned from both sides, like it's ok to have expectations and hopes for your children however when it comes to a point that you are actively causing strife in their life, you have to know where to pull back and just appreciate the fact they are trying. if the parents expectations were for their children to try their best and to do what they could to achieve a better life then them, then the expectations wouldn't have been as stressful. However being put on the pedestal to achieve great things and nothing less, can break a lot of people that are not prepared for that type of sacrifice.
@@airget In my case it was my own hybris that was the cause. My parents were supportive and I was supposed to be very smart, but I was also too proud to acknowledge my shortcomings. Worst part is I have a lovely career now, but at the time I was just not following my own dreams. My history being what it is, I was used to lying as a mecanism of survival. It seemed easier. Bending reality to make it as you see fit, or as you think people need it to be to perceive you in a way you can control. I was young, stupid and selfish. But we all learn from our mistakes. No preaching here, but it's my faith that saved me. I experienced the burden of lies first hand, and came back from it. I'm still not exempt of sin, but I make progress. I value the worth of mistakes in one's life. Reading the comments and the number of reactions shows me that we all go through parallel experiences. And it's ok. We all can grow up and become better people, and in that endeavor lies the true grace. Listen to yourselves and embrace each grace you are granted.
If you like true crime then you will love this channel!! Adrian is one of my favorite true crime story tellers! He does stories nobody else has done and he delivers them very well 😊😊 not to mention he's absolutely adorable lol
Many families in countries in Asia care a lot about their own image and reputation more than the care of their children. Pressure is horrible and has bad psychological outcomes. I always tell my kids success is doing your best regardless of the outcome. I don't care what the others think of you and will always be there for you. His name in Arabic means the troubled man.
How ominous that his name should mean this. I wonder if his parents knew or considered this when naming him 🤔 You're absolutely right. F what other people think. Encourage your kids to be happy and to work hard at whatever it is they want to do or be in life. It's a short one and it's only once. Best to try and live it happy. Peace ✌🏽 Ps. No amount of pressure should induce a person to kill. I do believe that you have to have this capacity within you in the first place.
Not necessarily 100% true (I’m East Asian who grew up there) I personally think it’s better for most kids than what they’re doing to them here in the West. Id much rather my kid worry about not falling behind and finishing his work in time than worrying about their genders and shit. Middle Eastern countries however, I heard are different
Well said!!! 👏🏾 I tell my children the same exact thing! 💯 As long as they try their best then it's a win for them! 🥇 Their expectation for that culture is unrealistic in my opinion! 🫤 I often wonder why ur image and or family image is way more important than sharing ur love with ur family and growing up as a strong, deep rooted bond! 👨👩👧👦 Life is what u make it not working hard to please everyone in ur community because at the end of the day ur family will be the ones their to have ur back not the neighbors next door! 🏠
This case is heartbreaking, but there's a silver lining that always impresses me. You often hear about Discord/gamer types not taking stuff like this seriously, thinking gore and edgy shit is funny or cool. But then you hear a story like this and you realize no, that's not indicative of the real world or how most people operate. Major props to those folks for putting their best foot forward to try and help, even if they couldn't save the rest of the family the family it shows that unlike Menhaz they have real heart and humanity. I hope they don't blame themselves for the loss, it's not their fault that another guy decided to be a psychotic piece of shit.
They shouldn’t blame themselves at all, the only one to blame is the murderous lying son. They have never witnessed a crime like that happen right in front of them. I can understand them feeling helpless. They are the real MVPS, while they couldn’t save the family, they managed to get him put in jail so he can’t hurt anyone else. While I do believe that a parent wanting their children to take a certain career path is not good, as that takes away their freedom to do what their own hearts desire in terms of a job. We all have our strengths and weaknesses when it comes to that. Not everyone is a perfect fit for a job. I can understand that he went through that pressure, but the way he handled it was disgusting. Murdering your entire family just to cover up a lie instead of facing the consequences of your actions and tell the truth shows how rotten he became. While I maybe struggling with getting a job, I will NEVER RESORT TO THIS!!
I was in the same class as the sister in primary school and my grandma would briefly greet their grandmother during her morning walk everyday. It was truly a shock to the community.
While mothers who do absolutely everything for their sons think they're doing them a favor, they don't realize that they're doing them a huge disservice. You have to teach your children how to be independant, how to take accountability for their actions, how to fix their own mistakes, you cannot do everything in their place, or you create babies who are going to have a hard time facing the world and adjusting to society. I come from such a family. My mom did absolutely everything for my brother, and she still does to this day even when he is 36, still at home. She even removes the crust off of his bread and the skin from his cheese. She has to clean or unplug the toilet when he clogs it because he doesn't want to have to deal with it. She created a man child. She complains about it, but she still enables this behaviour. Now, I know he is an adult who needs to take responsibility for his actions, but she cannot be surprised when she babied him to the extreme all his life. There is a fine line between loving your children + doing things for them when necessary, and creating irresponsible cowardly babies who cannot fend for themselves. Now my brother cannot adjust to society. He does not work and he is depressed. I wish he could find peace of mind realizing that he can achieve things by putting his mind to it, being resilient, honest and by not giving up. Growing up, he was the golden child because he was the eldest son. He was never told no, was never punished for his bad actions and was never given reasonable boundaries. I used to envy and resent him because I was never given such attention as the second daughter. Truth be told, I now feel sorry for him that he was spoiled rotten. I notice that people who are raised that way are ticking time bombs. I worry for him because he can have violent tendencies. If I ever have a son, I'll learn from my parents' mistakes.
Definitely comes down to accountability for ones actions. I agree with you, this guy blamed all his problems on his parents when they did everything to support him. He never even tried to do anything to better himself because his mother was a safety net for his actions. He continued to fail, got upset at the world and took his anger out on others when he had nobody to blame but himself. Lazy sack of shit. We have a big issue in America with accountability for ones actions, things are just getting worse and worse too.
Some parents do this though because they don't want their children to ever leave them and some use it to say "Look at everything I ever did for you and now you're not going to take care of me?". It happened in my family and created a really toxic situation.
I agree with your two comments. He is responsible for his own actions and doesn't deserve to be ever let out into civilized society in my opinion. Obviously, his family didn't deserve to be brutally murdered and they did their best to their knowledge. At the same time, I can´t help but think that they fostered unaccountability by doing everything for him, all the while setting really high long term expectations. It's like expecting your kid to run à marathon when you don´t even let him do à single step by himself. Some kids in that environment still manage fine if they have strong moral value but it can be a recipe for disaster as well if your kid is obviously not well-adjusted (ie: living his life exclusively online).
I’m 69 y.o., and my 64 y.o. brother was the youngest and only boy of three. My mom ruined him by doing everything for him including raising his two kids. He hasn’t worked in decades, and she left her $700,000 home to him.
The weird thing about this is an eerily similar case happened in the very same town back in 2009. Jennifer Pan lied about attending the university of Toronto pharmacy program. Ended up asking her boyfriend to kill the family when graduation time came. Both happened in Markham. That's so weird
Both aspirational immigrant families with imported strict cultural norms which jarred with the more liberal laid back Canadian culture they failed to absorb or adapt to.
He was jealous that his sister was able to be herself & still make it to his parents good graces. Meanwhile, he felt like he had to lie and had no room for error in order to be in his parents good graces. He knew he couldn’t fake a graduation so his parents were gonna find out his lie and he would fall heavy out of his parent’s good graces. He would have been better off going to school for gaming engineering or coding, something that would tie into his hobby.
If anyone's interested in hearing this story more in depth, Peacock has a 2 part documentary called Perfect World about this story. They interview everyone involved from his relatives, the people that were playing the game with him and trying to find out where he was, and they police who investigated the case. It's really good.
You know... I had those parents with the too-high expectations and felt like I would only get love if I lived up to them too. Way better to just burst their bubbles of unrealistic expectations while still in high school and let them adapt and accept that they're just glad you're healthy and hopefully happy with the life you can achieve. Or they don't and you go no contact. I'm no contact, but it's way better than A MURDER SPREE. I let go of that resentment, still love them, just know it's more maintainable this way.
Yeah exactly this. Those who condemn him for his attitude probably doesn't know how it feels like to grow up conditioned to be a perfect being by parents. Murder is still not the answer but the parents should have known better too than to have unnecessarily high expectations and pressuring their kids to succeed. I wonder when will parents learn that pressure doesn't help kids succeed, it does quite the opposite. I also wonder how he would have turned out if he was born into a normal family. Probably wouldn't have become a murderer....
@@jaydentoth there are millions of parents who want the best for their kids and those kids grow up just fine. If there's an issue, its the kid. Because their.minds aren't developed yet they can't grasp anything past immediate gratification. Seems like your just using this story to insert your own personal dislike of having parents who wanted you to grow into the best version of yourself.
Yes happened to my cousin. This kid perfect SAT scores so smart but literally pressured by his parents. Could have played college football at Notre Dame Wisconsin Ivy League schools with full scholarships. Nope he didn’t want to play any more. So went to Madison he never partied a day in his life. Wrong school to choose. Dropped out after 1st semester disappeared for 2 years because the pressure put on him by my Aunt and Uncle. He obviously didn’t murder but it took them forever to get used to him doing a regular job and life
This kid mustn't EVER be paroled! He not only planned these gut-wrenching actions (knowing full well just how wrong and horrific they were) and follow thru with them, but tormented a community, with what he considered, the ideal ending. He'll get his in the end 😢😪
This why the term touch grass was invented. Also have friends at least one in the nearest location. Being social and having friends online is not a replacement for having them in actual physical space.
Being too caring of a parent and not allowing them to learn responsibility, like cleaning up by yourself and doing chores, can be very dangerous. Especially for someone who has mental or developmental issues. Compounded by sheltering and the child being reclusive, its a recipe for disaster. Watching many of these videos, many cases involved reclusive kids on computers, claiming successes they didn't earn, to only fall apart when the lies catch up to them.
Now we see the cliff that is Social media and how Kids, Teenager's and young men and women are constantly bombarded and in many ways pressured to be as successful as those supposed Influencers and Celebrities when in reality it is all fake and most of the time just a fantasy image that these people are trying to push on the masses. Kids and teenagers need to be taught that things aren't always as it seems and whats most important is being themselves. With all the madness of trends and fake glitter, 9 times out of ten we are seeing people act out a cry for help. Thats why the youth of Today act like they have no care in the world anymore, They have been shunned caused by this very system that takes peoples attention away from what's most important in their lives.
Oh my blood EFF! I've recently moved backed into my family home watching this with my mum, we live a 40 minute walk from their McCowan area and only now learning about this true crime story through your channel. Mind Blowing 🙏🏾
Yeah... many folks in Bangladesh have no idea about this, cos it barely hit the news cycle. The political situation is usually what takes precedence. Thanks for covering this.
Spare them the disappointment? As if they didn’t feel plenty of disappointment as well as fear as he was murdering them… He would’ve been better off just offing himself if he felt so bad about himself, as opposed to killing his entire family
Well psychologists say people that threaten suicide have a 50/50 chance of committing homicide instead. Actual depressed people will not threaten suicide but just do it, potentially homicidal people will threaten suicide while simultaneously contemplating homicide. They're the narcissistic sociopaths who are not suicidal like a good person who is truly hurting but a controlling selfish person that wants a certain outcome in their favour.
Congratulations on your successful channel/RU-vid career, Adrian. I subscribed to you when you had a much smaller following, and I’m so happy to see that number has surpassed 1.5 million, and it continues to grow every day. Keep up the great work, brother!
I enjoy how you tell these stories but as someone who knows someone who was directly involved and endured his vile antics as he did what he did, this kinda made me have to finally put down true crime videos as a medium I watch and finally leave it behind. Thank you for re-telling it in a respectful manner.
As migrants myself, my parents especially my father put pressure on me and my brother to do the same. I think a lot of migrant families especially those that come from hardship always put pressure on their kids like this. It’s only because the parents want their kids to be in a better position than they were themselves. Unfortunately things don’t always work out and in this case the situation became deadly. RIP beautiful souls
Maybe the parents should try to advance their own careers instead of expecting children to succeed. And what is the deal with engineering? There are many other professions that pay well.
Some engineers and programmers tend to make $260K right out of the gate. I know people in Colorado who make $250K and only from their job out of college, which usually doesn’t happen to most. Also, parents do to their kids, as growing up, it was too late for them to do anything great, as they had to either drop out of school and work on the family farm or they were too poor to even go to school. It sucks, but life ain’t fair.
That's fine but they take it too far. It seems like these abusive parents just want to live vicariously through their kids, who have no obligation to dedicate their life to financial advancement.
@@denisehagwood4542 That is true, my father wasn't bad when I was a teen in high school. I will say, he would be upset with me for skipping school and sleeping in class. Thankfully I graduated and as of now I'm saving up for college and focused on getting a bachelor's in computer science.
Im amazed this channel has 1.8 mil subs now. Long time watcher, keep up the great work dude. Some channels r crass with details or really play up the violence of a killer almost glorifying them. Im glad the goodness of this crime channel shines through.
As someone with overbearing parents with expectations, I can empathize with the guy. Not defending his actions obviously, but heavy pressure from your parents can definitely send you down a spiral. I had a stretch in my life that I'm not exactly proud of because of it. Fortunately for me I've never lied to my parents and once I had a deep talk with them about my future and how I'm not at all interested in becoming a chemist, they were willing to let me be independent. P.S. York University isn't exactly a "prestigious" school btw. It's pretty much a failsafe for people who couldn't get into University of Toronto😅
Oftentimes, the parents' behavior is totally ignored. Not only was he under intense pressure, but he was extremely coddled by his mother. Adrian described his mother as loving, but that's not love. That's unhealthy parenting and is a recipe for disaster. Having two completely opposite parents can have damaging effects. Having both high and low expectations simultaneously can really warp a child's thinking. Sorry to hear about the pressure you were under as a child. It sounds like you've been able to work through that. Good for you.
My empathy stops at murder. No killing is justified at all. His sister had the same pressure as him, and she moved away for a while to clear her head. He could have done the exact same. To escape the household would escape the pressure.
@@sarahmelody9366Me too, but..I have a feeling that some, who watch these crime videos, can.. like LISK, obsessively watching/reading/saving everything about his crimes.. some definitely watch these as "what not to do"..
@@bosunbill9059 He would have gotten caught by calling the cops himself.. he wanted fame.. narcissistic family annihilator. Their own image is more important than the lives of their family members.. he pretended to be depressed to get a smaller sentence. That's just my opinion though.
A lot of people in gaming communities are neurodivergent and a lot of neurodivergent people make excellent detectives, it's pretty amazing what they can do when they pool their talents. Also want to add, thank you for not blaming the game or video games in general. So many people will because it's an easy scapegoat for a side of human nature we often try to find excuses for.
In the words of 4chan: weaponized autism at its best. Yeah a lot of us are neurodivergent and oftentimes that comes with a sharp increase in pattern recognition compared to neurotypical people. I believe that pattern recognition plus different ways to process information (kind of a "if you've never been inside the box you can only think outside the box" type of thing) makes a part of us go "oh, puzzle solving time" and we end up spending 12 hours straight trying to figure something out. Now, one person alone doing this might not be too useful, but take a bunch of us and let us coordinate our efforts and you get the scariest most efficient puzzle solving algorithm you can imagine... wether that puzzle is an active crime scenario or an escape room or even just some easter egg in a video game doesn't matter, we're just happy that brain go brrrr
These families can put an overwhelming amount of pressure on you and they can even disown you for not being a high achiever. Not justifying what he did, but this is psychological abuse. I dont praise him at all. But i dont feel bad for the family either. They created the monster that ended them.
I have been a fan of this channel since 2020 but I never imagined the Coffee house crime to visit my country. Thanks Adrian for explaining our country’s vibrant culture so delicately with your fans. Thanks a bunch!😁
That last excerpt of your statement before you wrapped the episode up was beyond gutwrenching. It made me reflect on how much I appreciate my family even more for their sacrifices they've made for me to be where I am. Cherish and appreciate those that are around you. Love on those that believe in you.
How can his mother wanted him to be successful in life and independent while at the same time she was cooking his meals, cleaning his place, driving him everywhere, paying his bills etc??
Probably because in her culture, she expected his future wife to do exactly the same for him. His only responsibility in life would be to go to school/work and "succeed". Not the healthiest attitude, for sure. At best you smother the child's hopes and personality... at worst, you could create a selfish monster.
Dude. The Zamans were multi-millionaires when they moved to Canada. They weren't just 'ambitious hard-working immigrants'. I mean, they were but they had a shed load of money behind them. How many people can buy a 4-bedroom house in downtown Toronto?
I wondered about that myself...I couldn't believe that anyone could live in Toronto working as a Taxi driver, much less save up money to buy additional properties.
The pressure from my dad to do well in school led me to have a nervous breakdown and eating disorder when I was in university. My professors noticed and insisted I seek help before my parents did.
its a joke because of how stereotypical internet mods are on any platform. the joke exists for a reason, hence stereotypes being founded in truth, spend your time on the internet from 1995 until about the early 2010s, you might get it then.@@FlamingBasketballClub
Hey Adrian, these videos are high effort with excellent quality. Hope you've been doing well Though seeing your schedule of uploads every 3-4 days, I hope you can get some rest if you could as well.
imagine being a father and disciplining your daughter by locking her out of the house. every honest work is truly heroic, commendable and respectable, but imagine being a f-ing cab driver and pretending to decide for your children what career is good and which isn't. that father was a monster.
@@Riceordie Thank you lol I was sitting here thinking I needed to google if Hindus did the third eye too. I didn't think they did. However, I find myself to be mistaken quite often, so yeah.
I'm in Toronto and I don't remember this, but I swear crime is covered up by the media here. There have been several shootings and killings in my own neighborhood and it didn't even make the LOCAL newspaper.
@@phoenixrising4995 There was also the G20, which was one of the first big black bloc events. They didn't even call themselves antifa back then...and aside from the innocent, non protesters that were rounded up, I wish they used that sonic cannon.
Unrelated but it’s honestly incredible how you upload such long, detailed, well-narrated and well-researched. and edited videos so often. You must work flat-out every single day to keep up so many amazing uploads! Smashing it, thank you
he is entirely accountable for his actions and there was clearly something wrong with his brain, but we can't pretend that strict parenting and overwhelming expectations don't play a part in cases like this.
l got only one burden from my Dad, to be out of the house by 18. 🇨🇭this was the best lesson a young man can learn. to stand on his feet and hold down a job. 25 years later. my dad now is ill, lost his apartment and lives now in one of the houses l bought in Switzerland🇨🇭
This isn't because of pressure from his parents. He wanted mommy and daddy to keep taking care of him. All that time he spent pretending to be at school, he could've gotten a job and been earning money to be able to move out and live his life his way. But no, he wanted to be a selfish lazy liar instead. What a pathetic waste of space.
Lesson to learn . Invite , encourage and love your children to be the best they can be . Never ever force or pressure them to be what you a parent desires . Let them follow their own path . Also life is sacred
How surreal that this is nowhere near the only true crime story we've heard where someone spins a web of lies and ultimately decides that committing one or more murders is their only acceptable option to having their lies exposed.
I know it's not the point, but it's so interesting that they just moved to Canada. being able to move without a prior job or marrying into a citizen is such a luxury. It's 'been such an insane, long, expensive time for me to be here, and have only been able to go based on my partner's job saying specifically they required their skills.
I like the idea of the shorts. There's plenty of interesting true crimes that simply aren't covered enough or have enough background to make full video documentaries from, and it's something I'd definitely find interesting to see
This case is a lesson for both parent and child alike. Parents be kind and love your children unconditionally and equally. Don't force or pressure your children too hard, it'll only push them farther away. Not every child will succeed and you should love and accept them in either case, academically, romantically or financially. Children should learn it isn't the end of the world if you fail, just do your best and parent will (and should) love you regardless. They won't think less of you. Parents shouldn't also use their child's success as bragging rights to other people. It creates a toxic culture that's both damaging to the child's psyche and unrealistic. There ends my rant from the child of loving Asian tiger Parents...
Actually some parents will love their children less. As unbelievable as it sounds. Will Disown them. Stop talking to them and even cut them out of their lives. It’s the worst kind of destructive parenting - control and manipulation disguised as love and caring. Smh
@@thomaswatson1739 There is a healthy balance between the two extremes. We can give encouragement, guidance and support without taking away someone's autonomy.
It is sad that there are other cases, just like this one: Chandler Halderson, Jennifer Pan and others, who killed their parents and/or whole families because of the stresses of success, keeping up appearances and so on. No matter what, all of these adults could have told the truth about their lives and what they wanted and needed out of their lives, instead of what their parents wanted for them. They all were adults, who again could have walked away, even if their families protested, threaten with lossing finanical support from them...I, personally would rather walk away instead of doing what these idiots did. In time, rather there was acceptance or not, they would have gotten on with life. Nope, they choose the even more dumba*s route and now, are sitting in jail, locked up for life...they left one prison of family life they could not or felt like they could not get away from, to spend the rest of their lives in another prison, they will not get out of for sure.
This has nothing to do with the case, but being from Canada (Vancouver specifically, on par with Toronto in terms of unaffordability), the term "investment property" fills me with such rage.
What a shame they seemed like a good family and it’s scary how many young people are not living in the real world Thanks for another great job on the video
That downward spiral of depression from overbearing pressure can really mess up your mind. I've been in that position before where I lied about failing multiple subjects, keeping it up and felt the pressure of being the oldest son. On top of that, my skill of conversing with other ppl was subpar, my family dotes on me just like his family and just like him, I was an avid mmo player back in hs. Almost eeriely similar in fact. While the thought had cross my mind before, it didnt go through. Over time, the thought of it slowly directed towards me, but that also didnt go through. I'm just glad I came clean about it, while things didn't go smooth or well after that, I just kept working on myself. Just a heads up, you cant rush these things, working to better yourself (excluding financial/material aspect) takes years. My family has better relationship now, but that journey WILL be rough
For anyone stuck with a strict parent, remember you can always at least try talking and bargain for your freedom. Yes, there will be conflicts and arguments. Yes, you might ends up become an embarrassment to your family. But you'll never know if you haven't tried. Who knows, they might changes their heart. Even if all fails, what would you expect from going to prison? You'll ends up doing nothing for yourself. If your family disowns you, take the opportunity to at least do what you love. Explore the world, play your favourite games, go living with your partner, etc. Even if you're an atheist, spending the rest of your live in a prison is a dumb decision.
Your right. While I'm not going to kill anybody, i feel like I needed to hear this. Its hard feeling trapped under the weight of parental desires. Somedays I wish to run away and others I wish to die
If you are of age LEAVE home! Start your life independent of your parents. Nothing is ever carved in stone. You may not have the education paid for by your family or a free roof over your head but is a trapped life worth those things? If you are of age leave and build your own life. I am a much older woman now but I left home at 14. It was a huge struggle but it made me the person I am today with NO regrets. I did not become the doctor I wanted to be but I lived on my own terms and have had a wonderful life to date.
@@k_j_n1242 Nothing at all. Just makes us look bad?! We should protect our status here. Just because we don't believe in YOUR imaginary Santa Claus that does not turn us into a serial killer. Everybody chillax!
Im from Scarborough, love true crime and somehow never heard about this case. Thanks for covering it. Poor family. Glad he got a real sentance unlike all the murderers now who are out on parole with 40 prior convictions.
I say this every time, but I love that you're covering cases in my local Toronto area. This discord case reminded me of Bianca Devins case :( and Scarborough is an area I used to live in so it's always interesting hearing about cases from there.
Adrian, you are next-level, top-drawer indeed. Always gripped by your videos. Your compassion and objective presentation is so rare, Love Nero too. Love his rare "cameo's" ("cateo's?)
