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Tunnel system below a city... good Idea but what about the smog destroying the aboveground? I'm guessing the system will use fans to push it outside? If that's the case then what about using vents and filters to help clean up some of that congestion? Air in and Air out, didn't they use similar things for mining?
@@will16320 Even large Sprinklers wont be effective enough at putting out these huge hot fires like the examples in the video, you would need insane amounts of water. Also water on certain chemicals or hazardous goods that may be getting transported can make the fire worse or even cause large explosions. Its definitely been thought of before, and unfortunately its not practical
@@j3sspyle Hi Jess, sprinklers would hopefully prevent a fire from reaching a 1000C temp to begin by dampening / suppressing the early stages of the fire and completely smothering it before it can become something more serious, such as a fuel tank ignition. Whilst the sprinklers at your home use water, Modern commercial sprinklers do not use water, they use foam which is effectively the same as ABC powder and can be safely used on any fire type. Check out videos of it in petrol stations and aircraft hangers, highly effective against fuel fires. There may be other practical considerations but water availability / effectiveness of sprinklers are not issues
In San Francisco we have a similar technique to Amsterdam. Except it's like the opposite. Bulldoze the Small Buildings and make Make 30 Lane Mega Highway Bridges and 500+ Floor Sky Scrapers.
its a city if you want small buildings and shit live in a town if you live in the city expect 30 lane highways i bet youd be the first to complain about bad traffic i dont go to a city to see trees and plants
Fun fact the longest tunnel in the world is not the Gotthard Base Tunnel. Its the Delaware Aqueduct, while not a tunnel traversed by freight or people it is still a tunnel. An thus holds the world record. It carries 1.3 billion gallons of water every day to supply roughly 50% of New York city's water supply. It is 13.5 feet (4.1m) in diameter and 85 miles (137km) long.
Well, this is the first time I'm watching this channel. I definitely prefer to concentrate on the technical side of things than to insist on the emotional side, as Discovery Channel or other mainstream pseudo scientific channels always do. Not convincing.
At 43:38 he says that all the cars will be underground so the air will be fresh on top. They have to vent the air out from the tunnel so people don't die of carbon monoxide, where do you think that venting goes? it goes into the air above ground. Wth
In respect of the fire in the Mont Blanc tunnel I would not have associated margarine with such a devastating and intense fire 🔥, whilst I appreciate it is a type of fat and as such will act as a fuel for fire I would never have guessed it could be so damaging. Surly in the event of fire you would always want to extract the oxygen and smoke from a tunnel fire, not draw fresh oxygen in to support combustion, perhaps I am looking at it to logically and simply but surly denying fire any one of the 3 elements needed for combustion should be a simple matter.
Extracting the oxygen is not that easy and if it was possible it would have led to the death of everyone in the tunnel, including me and the ten other survivors on the Italian side of the fire who couldn't turn our trucks around in the narrow tunnel to drive out. I certainly couldn't have run the 6.5km to the exit before becoming overcome by either the intense heat or toxic smoke as it spread throughout the tunnel once the fans failed.
That is fine for a short tunnel, but I was 6.5km in, smack in the middle of the 13km tunnel and there is no way I'd have been able to run that distance in the heat that was building up, so would probably have got in one of the shelters, where I'd have perished like those who did so on the French side of the fire as the heat passed the failsafe temperature of the shelter. I was better off waiting for the fire crews and tunnel direction vehicles to pick us up and get us out of there. Also those who tried running out on the French side who weren't already near the entrance were all overcome by the toxic smoke, so collapsed and died before they'd gone more than a hundred metres or so. They didn't realise there was a fire until they saw the smoke approaching fast towards them, once the lights failed the ones further back never even saw the smoke in the first place, so died in their cars.
I wouldnt try to pump fresh air into a confined space with a fire and extract smoke. A better idea would be to run vents for the safe rooms and have bulkheads every so many hundred or thousand meters to block airflow to deprive it of oxygen and put it out.
I believe this video is wrong, I watched a documentary years ago about it, and it says that the controller actually tried to suffocate the fire, by extracting the air, this in some respect helped, however also sucked the air in the tunnel out, meaning that people running to safety suffocated (assuming they didn’t die from smoke inhalation first), and that those trying to turn their cars around and escape in their vehicles couldn’t, because their engines cut out and wouldn’t start as there was no air, it was being sucked out by the ventilation fans, and any remaining air was being rapidly consumed by the fire.
@the fiesta guy, he didn't extract the air, that is impossible because the tunnel is open at both ends, so extracting it at one end would just pull fresh air in at the other, he tried to blow the smoke out of the tunnel so people wouldn't suffocate, but the smoke was already too thick and any oxygen not already consumed by the flames was pushed to the top of the tunnel by the heavier dense smoke beneath. Even if he hadn't switched the fans to maximum (until the wiring burnt out), those on the French side would still have perished as the lower air pressure on the French side of Mt. Blank was dragging the smoke through that way anyway (which was the normal way the tunnel was ventilated, but usually around 330 days each year it is lower on the Italian side, 30 days on the French side and around 5 days per year it is equal and the fans need to be on full blast or the tunnel closed). It is only the fact it was one of the 30 days of flow towards France and the fans blowing in that direction too, that meant myself and 10 other truckers survived.
I drive in tunnels almost daily routine, but I see that the vents almost everywhere in Europe many times doesnt work, that means you inhale carbondyoxide while you are driving ... its fucking unhealthy man, some tunnels are more than 1 kilometers long
Anyone ever thought of a sprinkler system with fire retardants mixed in to deal with common combustible materials. Or water sprinkler systems o monsoon intensity with localized controls. So ire in a sector
Why don't you place the hi-fog system station at every 500mtrs that would trigger at 60 0r 80 degrees temperature... it would be very advantageous to cool and keep cool the tunnel... and not let it spread...
Licensed background music and royalty free music that are used in documentaries are never on Shazam. Nor available to buy on Spotify etc. But in the case of the introduction, the music might have been composed for this series specifically
Does anyone know where the Löstchberg tunnel fire-train guy is from? He's speaking German but it sounds like Dutch. I'm guessing somewhere in Switzerland, but it's a very different pronunciation than the team at the Gotthard Tunnel.
That is swiss german, specifically a dialect which is spoken where the tunnel is, in the canton of Bern. there are many dialects in Switzerland, in every region they differ between one another.
In mount bland the trucks contained polethelyne? or something that was used in refrigeration for the butter etc. when burnt it creates cyanide like in the Grenfell fire tower. So people were also poisoned. Very sad
Firstly he was Belgian and secondly he was 6.5km into a 13km tunnel, there was no way Gilbert could drive it another 6.5km once the cab started burning. There's a huge difference between a hundred metres and 6,500 metres pal..!!
P.S. if he'd tried, then he'd have passed my truck 100 metres further on and I'd have died of smoke inhalation too, along with another nine truckers behind me and all the ones behind Gilbert would still have died anyway, so by stopping where he did, he saved eleven of us, not to mention the car drivers on the Italian side who managed to turn their cars around when nothing was coming in the opposite direction.
Automatic water sprinkler systems will fail to function in a long, artificially ventilated tunnels as the hot air will be blown by them big turbines causing it hard to detect where the actual fire located. Basically, it will be overwhelmed by the tunnel's airflow, so it's not as effective as it should be. Sprinklers may be used in naturally ventilated and or short tunnels.
Fire sprinkler isn't always the solution for fires. As a Hazardous material hauler myself, I carry elements that would explode if contact with water was made. Having a semi trailer that caught fire under one of the sprinkler suppression would be far more catastrophic then one would think. If my truck catches fire I have to call the dispatch to not send water trucks for the main fire but foam trucks to spray.
Baron von Limbourgh the tunnel don’t go up and down, they start at a low point and go up to the end or to a middle point and go down again, this is maid so that the rain water that goes trough the rock can flow down.( maybe they also have channels for water)
I was in Turkey in the 1950's when Istanbul had 1 million people. I know of the earthquake problems, and water disasters. A ferry sank near Izmit. We collected funds for people.
to help avoid a fire like these in tunnel's this long, is to have a water (enough fire extinguisher solution that smoothers) line all the way down the middle 🤔🤔🙏🙏🦅 - (i don't know the proper name for it)
My instant thought is why are there not 2 tunnels for the road with two lanes and emergency lane each with stops every km?. Why have traffic going both ways in a single damn tunnel one lane. Worse design ever and cheap for a country like Switzerland.
Even something like a jersey barrier would help somewhat. Maybe they don't want to do that as it would block emergency vehicles being able to drive down the middle? The reason highways are so much safer than surface roads is due to the separation of opposing traffic flows.
On May 13, 1949, a bad collision occurred by two trucks, carrying hazardous materials, in the Holland Tunnel's eastbound tube. A major fire ensued. A ceiling section was destroyed, It took both the New Jersey and NYC fire departments to extinguish this huge blaze.
The human body has a natural 5-foot long tunnel inside of it. A poop tunnel that is that transports poop to the toilet, grass, table, couch or right on the floor (don't judge).
Probably because the faults leading to that disaster were related to the train and had nothing to do with the tunnel. I don't know if the tunnel itself was ever criticized.
You know, there are some people in the German part of Switzerland and also some Germans, to be honest, a lot of them, and some of them drive like there are no laws, I can say this because I’m from the Italian part of Switzerland and my mother is German.(I know how people drive in these places)
car and truck fires happen al the time you just arent going to hear about it unless its major its usually just and inconveinace and cost to the driver but if its in a tunnel its dangerouse when you have millions drive throughe a tunnel a year your gonna get hundreds of fires its part of having a car or truck theres risk of fire learn how the engine works and youll realize why its so common
They said the first fire was over 1000 degrees for 53 hours, then they rebuild it and say it's safe because it can withstand 1000 degrees for 4 hours???
The original fire shelters could only withstand temperatures up to 800°C for 6 hrs maximum, but with no escape tunnel that made them a death trap oven in this case. The new shelters can withstand 1,000°C for 4 hrs, giving those inside enough time to be safe waiting if it's a smaller fire that can be extinguished reasonably quickly, or if it develops into a more serious fire, they can exit safely via the new escape tunnel doorway in each shelter to a central air fed access tunnel beneath the roadway level. That is what makes it safer.
😩 " ' DISASTER PROOF? ' ..... Just like the ' unsinkable ' S.S. Titanic and the ' absolutely fireproof ' Winecoff Hotel ? Don't bet your lives on It! "
Which, in many cases can make the problem much, much worse. Apparently you've never heard of Class 4.3 Flammable Solids (aka Dangerous When Wet) materials that are often transported on...wait for it...trucks!
Mount Blanc lorry must have caught fire by friction between the tunnel and corner of the lorry, that was the main reason for the fire, the tunnel bore was just too small for that sized vehicle
Apparently there was some evidence given by witnesses driving in the opposite direction, that the fire started in the engine's air-filter intake (possibly by a lit cigarette-butt)!
ive heard it all now thats not physiccly possible mate the tnnel is way higher then the lorrys and the lorry wouldent be scraping against it for miles would it now it would have been a mechanical fault like most car fires
Absolute rubbish, all normal trucks in Europe run at a maximum height of 4 metres because of bridge heights on the motorway system across Europe, but the alpine tunnels are higher than that to accommodate 'convoi exceptional' vehicles that can't normally use the twisty alpine passes over the top. The main suspects for ignition were a fractured fuel line leaking diesel onto insulating material around the exhaust, the aforementioned careless cigarette but, or an overheated brake disc that had been binding. Even Gilbert Degrave, the driver couldn't say which when we spoke in the hotel whilst waiting to see if we could drive our trucks out once the fire was out (obviously Gilbert couldn't do that anyway, but as it turned out 3 days later, neither could the other 10 of us).
Sad thing is, the truck driver in Mont Blanc could have possibly made it out of the tunnel on the other side if he kept driving or at least made it for the majority of the tunnel length, risking his own life but saving so many other lives.
We're now trained to carry on driving, only stop if you absolutely cannot drive any further at all. We're also instructed to not stop near a bridge, homes, or drainage if possible.
...also this is where autonomous vehicles could really have a great impact. Imagine if the whole line of cars could just reverse back out of the tunnel perfectly in sync!
@@sad1234ee Great point, and a good example they have fire rescue specialists tackling fire tunnels and not someone like me 😁 I'd suffocate everyone trying to get out!
@@DamianDeEu electric vehicles would be the only thing that could save people here, lack of oxygen conked out peoples car engines before they could escape