Have you found ways to grow as a person despite really frustrating software projects? What are some of the circumstances you're facing? What is the adversity teaching you?
This channel is a real lifeline thank you :-), there was an inspirational quote I try to keep in mind when facing adversity. "If you do what is easy your life will be hard. But if you do what is hard your life will be easy". This current job has been a real tough one, but definitely as a result I've been forced to look at my weak points! I still haven't owned everything I'm faced with. It's great to see a video affirming this
Thank you for this. It reinforces the fact that character (not technical ability) is the limiting factor for any industry, and also for society at large.
I think there is a reasonable limit, though. I have gone through this sort of thing recently and I did find myself building resilience, but there is only so long you can toil away under someone who throws their underlings under the bus and/or sabotages them. So, yeah, try and learn more about yourself and increase resilience but not to the point that your career suffers for it
Agree completely. I tried to qualify the message early with the statement that it's a situation you can't get out of (yet), but that may have went by quickly. No reason to suffer if there's nothing to learn from it.
@@HealthyDev Thanks for replying :) I suppose what I'm getting at (but didn't fully say 🤣) is that it can be a bit difficult to figure out if its a situation you can still learn from, or if you've gotten all you're going to get from it
Many juniors do not even have experiences to differentiate between a good project vs toxic one, so they think to themselves this is how the "job" is and start hating the industry.
I realized that I hate being a software engineer. I used to love my job until about 3 or 4 years ago and suddenly just started getting exploited and treated badly. Then it just seemed like I have just been going from bad to worse as these "best-buddy" companies claim to treat people really well, but under that guise overload you with busy work that doesn't fall into your contract hours causing overtime that you don't get paid for. Not just that, but engineers appear to be becoming even more arrogant and rude than they were before, probably because we're all being forced to interact with other people a lot more, and also because we have a pile of admin paperwork to do on our desks everyday in order to get anything done. And to top it all off, just because AI makes you work faster, it doesn't mean you work less hours, it just means your employers expect more from you now. I'm done with it.
I’ve been wrestling through some burnout and learning concepts and things I didn’t know a few weeks or months ago. I prayed to the Lord for help and got it through a chance to communicate my concerns to my support group (both in and out of work) along with my manager. I’m nowhere near “fixed” but there’s still enough about software dev that I like (ignoring any of its current trappings like scrum) that I’m willing to learn and build some tenacity. God bless you and praying you get a chance to recover.
I am engg. manager and listen to your videos to learn so much that I don't know. I have faced every situation as an engineer and manager both. I have chosen to side with engineers most of the time as always felt responsibility for people in my corner. Its not only engineers but managers also get thrown under the bus or sabotaged by their managers. I have learnt from adversity in hindsight, discovered that I had sleepless nights and wonder if it was worth it. Its really leaders who can make a situation good or bad regardless of problem. Engineer managers are just sometimes helpless reflection of that leadership. Listening to you for half an hr is worth reading many self help books. Thank you for sharing these pearls of wisdom. I hope that many people find solace in knowing that they are not alone in this misery and there is way to deal with it or its time to figure a way out. We don't choose the situation but can choose to how we respond to it. Nothing is worth losing your sleep or health or peace of mind over, absolutely Nothing!
Thank you for sharing your faith in this! I myself recently went through the book of Proverbs. It's great to hear how these verses apply so much to everyday life!
Up to a point, exactly, unfortunately you learn mostly from hardships, how to estimate better etc, you dont learn from things you already confidently know. Which is weird because it would be too convenient if it was the other way around.
Man i love this video. You're such a gem! Just what i needed to hear right now to gain some perspective, own my behaviour, and take steps to salvage what I can from my situation so I can leave on a good note
You're great 👍 I love the soothing American accent. I like to think about the people who travelled across the world to spread the word of God. I partied ways with God in my late teens, but I am now realising the virtues of Christianity. It's easy to pick holes but if you weren’t given it to challenge or found it late in life it would feel revolutionary. I'll say it again you are great! ❤
Actually after several attempts to fit into projects and codebases, finally I got the opportunity to work on my own project from scratch and I feel very proud with each step forward, I'm glad I've got to a company that appreciates innovation at it's raw state.
I think I worked on one project that _wasn't_ crappy ;) Technical challenges, dependencies on vaporware that was never delivered, scope creep, clashing architectural egos, other teams sabotaging our project because they didn't want to look bad, ever changing requirements and requirements that break the laws of physics, and the ever popular "that's exactly what we asked for but not what we wanted" ;) You name it. I just stayed calm and repeated my mantra "the paycheck spends just the same". Thank heavens I had some good mentors in my early career that were great at laughing off all those little things - and they are little things.
Those toxic people need to go. I've had more than my share of those people, and sadly they were better at kissing ass than anything else. Building resilience is a skill, but it takes a huge toll on your mental, emotional and physical health. I've had to let go of a lot of anger over the years, and it's made a difference.
Thanks! I hope so. I know I focus a lot on programmers, but I've worked with many different tech roles. I try to make at least some of this stuff universally applicable.
Great video...I can so relate...been on the shittiest projects...toxic, etc...I wish I watched such a video as yours decades ago. But on the flip side, when you are on a fantastic project, its the best!!
Wow this so true about a person's character and appreciation. People who got lucky and never had a toxic job will never appreciate a healthy company no matter how awesome it is compared to market standards! The same way smart people also sharpen the ones around them, the same way resilient characters also passively/indirectly inspire others to build resilient character, unless their ego is too high of course, then there is no hope for them.
Does it make one stronger or does it make you into a toxic person? Product of our environment etc. But recognising toxic behaviour and moving on from it like you have is the best approach.
It's an interesting question. I remember once I heard "The same bad thing can happen to two people, and they can both deal with it different ways". I guess that's what I'm hoping for with videos like these. Toxic projects are horrible, but hopefully we don't let it turn us into worse people.
I try to stay positive myself, but I'll agree with others that there's a breaking point. For the past 6+ months, my project has been in "we need to finish next month" and failed every time. At some point along the line I think I lost hope. Probably the worst part for me, is that I can't even tell why this project is even being made. When I ask the VP who gets credit for the project, I get vague non-answers. And when we demo to staleholders who supposedly care, they're either indifferent or disappointed that we aren't workimg on other features. Makes it feel like the struggle is ultimately pointless.
I'm sorry. I've been in this situation too. In those circumstances I often have to remind myself I'm not being paid to ensure the company is successful. I'm being paid to build what they want. Whether what they want is useful to the customer, isn't technically my job. While I love being at companies that let me influence the product as a programmer, it's not always a luxury I have. Hopefully you can stick it out and find a way to let go of what you can't change until you find a better fit.
This man speaks to my heart (not the part about vices) I may hire his services as a mentor, I always wanted one, too many courses and not enough mentorship.
Absolutely. People are always more challenging for me than the technical hurdles we face. Hard to believe sometimes, but when I really step back and think about it more objectively, that always seems to be what I experience at least.
My PO is shouting at people during meetings because we don’t agree with her (she has only 2YEO in IT). Manager doesn’t do anything because he seems not to care. People stopped giving suggestions and basically started just working on their own skills for their themselves. I do same thing. Do you have advice for this? I might be getting promotion next month due to performance but daily meetings 50% are horrible to attend. Switching to another job won’t increase salary at this point
Leave. If the management won't do anything, you decide how long you want to suffer. Don't worry about a salary increase, just get somewhere you can function as a next step.
Maybe, just maybe, all companies finding their nearest 23 year olds and having them read 2 pages of a scrum pdf and declaring them to be product owners was never the best of ideas.
@@HealthyDev Thanks. Other devs are super nice to work with but SM and PO are another story… I even suspect that tech-lead is also searching for other job due to his recently decreased motivation and performance. And I fully understand him. I will send few CV’s today
The project I'm in currently is not toxic at all, but I have been somewhat struggling with a fellow co-worker who is simply... absent. Even when he knows we are discussing his code in slack in a group of 5-8 people, and clearly there are things he wrote that we don't understand, then we have a huddle (slack meeting) about it and he's invited, STILL doesn't show up. Eventually he does respond, but not in any helpful manner, and eventually the rest of the team just ends up fixing the issues or refactoring the code.
Why is the team covering for them? That makes no sense. It sounds like someone in authority needs to tell them what their expectations are and what will happen if they don't meet them. Letting someone be a grifter with no clear set of expectations is demoralizing to everyone else who has to essentially do their job for them.
Thanks for sharing, it's funny that I believe God got me working for a Medical cannibis company building a react app for sales haha. Proverbs true wisdom :)
I feel like a toxic coworker in one of those projects as you describe and I'm trying to be more positive, but I find myself really struggling with this. Being an inspiring leader sounds nice, but it feels like it's a bit higher in my Mazlow hierarchy then what I can currently afford. I don't have my own home, a partner, or a child to provide and care for. So naturally, my job is going to be a bigger part(or at least, priority) of my life. I think that's where the issue lies. It makes it so much easier to let it get to you more. Don't get me wrong, I have friends and hobbies, but they're not as special and attention-demanding as raising a child, or being a loving partner. I think if that higher priority was there, it would also be a lot easier for me to 'switch off' from work. I'm not 'choosing' to be toxic, My job just gets to me too many times lately, and I feel like either that's just me, I'm not the target audience, or it's being glossed over too much in your videos lately. This 'tough love'/'bootstraps' mentality therefore isn't really cutting it for me. Anyway, this is just a train of thought. Likewise, take it with a grain of salt. Appreciate the content nonetheless. :)
It doesn't sound like you're toxic. It sounds like you're just at a stage of your life where work is the most important thing in your life. Nothing wrong with that.
Hello there. Was finding myself in such a state. You've said something that triggered me the most "not as special and attention-demanding". You don't need an excuse to not doing your work more than the contract says. Having a partner doesn't solve this problem, actually, it just tears you in half harder... Being more demanding by yourself might be healthier. Like you deserve to live your life after promised amount of work is done. You deserve to have your part of the contract to be respected as well as theirs. Being not demanding enough can ruin any relationships, not just working ones. I failed too many romantic relationships by skipping my needs to the point I can't take the person I'm with anymore. I'm not telling about stop carrying about anything but your needs. Rather finding a ballance when your needs' weight is just enough for you to feel good. 😌
I totally get what you are saying. I'm gonna talk about tools here in a second but let me first say that what you're talking about, tools shouldn't matter. You ought to be able to find a way to succeed no matter what tools you have. But ... wouldn't it be nice if you had a really good tool to help you stay focused, organize your work, research the relevant problems, do deep research on the tasks you've been assigned. Collect up source code and documentation. Search it. Tag it. Label it. Bookmark it. Organize all the relevant material for a bug or user story. Write notes about the best way to go about implementing it. Then be able to share that whole body of work with your colleagues to get their feedback on it before you spend a month implementing it only to have your PR get rejected in the 11th hour. I think I could be even more resilient, more focused, more positive, and more productive if I had a tool like that. That's the tool I'm building.
Just trying to solve it with no full understanding of implications may be good for short time, on the log term it just creates a lot of tech debth and then you will pay King Time. You may be lucky with doing it, but schedule time to put in all needed solid understaning work.
When I worked as a dev I tried to be resilient all the time. Everyone is busy doing their stuff and so tired few bother to appreciate their work each other. I consider this as opportunity for my growth and acceptance, but several years of this made me clinically depressed. All I learned was, toxic environment is toxic and there is an adaptability limit which differs from person to person. Your advices sound very dangerous without good monitoring of one’s mental health.
It does take some discernment to know when enough is enough. I'm not advocating being a doormat. If you watch my burnout episode, I suffered from chronic burnout due to too many bad projects, so I can relate. This episode is really mean to encourage people to make the best of the situation when they're stuck and can't just get out.
Sorry, sounds a bit too much like wishful thinking. If you are in a toxic environment, don't waste ypur resources on trying to be a hero, just survive and gtfo. And yes, appreciate good place after ❤
@@HealthyDev That's why I wrote survive first. Look, you have tons of experience and have grown into a resilient, resourceful and compassionate man. Now hwen you imagine yourself in a toxic project, you feel like you should be applying those qualities and maybe you would. But the premise that someone can actually develop them in the first place while being in a toxic environment is, to my mind, wrong. Like try to become a leader for colleagues who only seek to shirk responsibilities or stand up to a narcissistic boss who is only waiting to crush somebody. Are you sure that we would grow like that and not disintegrate?
@@eelbothanks for expanding on your thoughts. I see what you're saying and I agree. It took me years of bad projects, learning from each, to get better at dealing with them. You're correct that if you're early in your career or haven't encountered this before, it's unrealistic to expect yourself to handle some of this well. That's OK. We're all human. I'm not trying to put my ideas out there as a measuring stick people should use to determine if they're doing good at their job. I'm just trying to offer alternative ways to look at your suffering so people don't fall into complete despair. Hope that helps a bit.
@@HealthyDev Primeagean is a christian but you probably already know him. He's a bit different than you. I don't watch anymore because he does "politics" too much. It's been a few months though so who knows.
Being a Christian myself, not sure if adding more Christian stuff to your channel is a good thing. Mentioning it once or twice per video seems like more than enough. Btw, I think you ARE really wise. The mistakes you went thru made you who you are and this is why people watch your channel. You weren’t born wise, but your experiences really resonate with people, and I think that’s one of the big reasons why people come here for your advice (and not cherry picking bible verses). Ultimately, you do you, and if it’s working for your channel then that’s awesome. Just one person’s opinion.
If you've had past bad experiences with Christianity, I truly am sorry. I learned since returning to faith 6 years ago that it is not practiced in America anything like it should be. We're a nation of hypocrites, so that shouldn't surprise you. But regardless, this is me, and y'all say you like my authenticity. That's going to sometimes include things that might make you feel uncomfortable. I don't speak about my faith all the time, but it's incredibly important to me (really the only thing that gives me purpose for living) so it's going to make it into content sometimes. I don't have plans to include scripture in every episode, but I also won't hold back if I feel something the Bible says could help developers struggling out there. If it pisses off 10 people but helps one, it's worth it. I'm not on here to blow up a channel, I'm here to truly help people. And sometimes that means upsetting their sensibilities and pushing them out of their comfort zone.
Thanks for sharing the strenghts that can flourish within us during adversity ♥️ Wise people learn from mistakes and from difficult situations, and will look to evolve their inner self. Asking positive questions during adversity might help to open new paths/opportunities, and to take action. If we ask, for example, what is this experience trying to teach me, instead of victimizing yourself, you might find the answers you are looking for within yourself. Love the music by the way!
Honestly. All of this frustations is because coworker devs programming skills are not on par with yours. Just accept that it is what they can do and don't over invest in what fancy/ugly code they write. It is more peaceful than ovethinking their code if they code it right or not.
In my view first point about resilience is kind of walking on a thin ice. We are already more than two thousands years from the times when bible was written and we should know already there is a lot of morons and toxic people around us. Especially in a work environment there are limits on tolerating incompetence. Through many years I learn that I don't have to shut my mouth and tolerate people who waste my time or even take advantage on me. Especially when at the end of the day success is delivered by hands of smart people but credits to it are shared in the whole team. Lesson from that may be clear - being incompetent and ignorant is beneficial, being resilient and hard worker is naive. There is a blurry line between pushing ourselves to walk through difficulties vs being naive and wasting our life on collaborating with or working for incompetent idiots. From those two - I rather to speak out and if necessary to quit the project than to be naive loser working for shared success.
I'm definitely not advocating being a doormat, which is what you seem to be implying from the video. I'm not a perfect communicator, so maybe I should have been more explicit. It sounds like the experiences you've had colored your view of the video as well in some ways, which would be understandable. The one statement you made that has me confused was this: "being incompetent and ignorant is beneficial, being resilient and hard worker is naive." You go on after that sentence to describe a blurry line, but the statement I quoted draws a hard one. Which is it?
