How The Pokémon Community Got Exposed. 

Yep. Weak egos call for (unjust) nerfs and bans.

Seems like a fair assessment to me! 👀

But in YGO it's usually because strategies are so polarizing and your deck so linear you don't have enough room in even your side deck to combat everything.

yugioh has regular bans so i think its' a lot more reasonable than in something like pokemon that doesn't@@PathBeyondTheDark

yugiohi s the exception to a lot of things that apply to "card games" in general though

Haha the ol Barrier spam 😂 wotc times were wild

I agree! Signs of a good meta when all playstyles are good 🙏

Agreed. Decks like this are necessary, because they prey on Manaphy and Jirachi, and at times Radiant Greninja, in decks that can't get them online for attacks. Support Pokémon shouldn't be that free.

@itsquinnyp fair point!

@@BurtsPTCG a good meta is when skill matters most. diversity of decks or playstyles doesn't matter

@@itsquinnyp why should cards that are needed to combat the meta be punished? that's some wacky logic

People will just have to adapt I think! 🙌

Just add minior as the counter

@liltone9614 or spirittomb 👀

Not sure tbh! Hopefully still casting events will be on the cards and the channel will be much bigger :p appreciate your support 🙏

Haha! That's a good point actually never thought of that 😂🙌

You think gen 1 lax was absurd? Wait until you see gen 2 lax.

Thats actually a good way of putting it! 🙌

@@BurtsPTCG Thanks brotha! Love your content🙌🏽

Ayo! Glad you play pokemon now too! 🙌

No beat down! Didn't expect that :p

Sounds accurate😂

I can't argue that's its truly entertaining to watch but i think its good to have some diversity in the format outside of just different ways to attach energy and do damage 🙏 Appreciate your constructive comment by the way 🙌

Playing the counter to the counter mind games would be interesting for sure!

No side deck? Cram random non-engine into your deck to combat specific rogue strategies you may never even play? That doesn't sound very reasonable.

​@@PathBeyondTheDarkThats one of the major flaws of the Pokemon TCG- some matchups are pretty much an auto-loss, and trying to tech to account for that makes the deck worse overall :/

Cards that improve your win chance are by definition not sub optimal.

An unrestricted sideboard of even 3 cards would destroy Pokémon. Sideboards only work in other card games because you rarely, if ever, have individual cards that are capable of swinging matchups by 10%+. They're common in Pokémon naturally because of the weakness mechanic. As a result, we cannot have a sideboard, and the game designers print tech cards that are balanced accordingly-which is something people coming from other games have trouble understanding. We don't have weak tech cards, they're all swing cards that are balanced to make them worth debating including in your main 60 cards. Jirachi from Paradox Rift, for example, is designed to be equal in power level against Sableye to as if you were teching in a cheap grass-type attacker to help against Charizard ҼX. If we had a sideboard, a card like Jirachi could've been made weaker (they could make it only work during your opponent's next turn after you put it into play), but they can't make all grass types weaker, that massively restricts game design.

I agree a 10 card side board would fix this

A ten card side deck makes mew unbeatable in a b03 scenario imo doesn't a side deck in yugioh just make the high tier decks just unreachable by anything other then another high tier deck?

I agree I prefer pokemon not having a side board@@BurtsPTCG

@@BurtsPTCG Yes and no. Sacking/getting lucky is very common in Yugioh Best-of-1; so the side deck in yugioh reduces variance due to the ceiling Yugioh inherently has. Pokemon's gameplay loop is a bit harder to justify a side deck because the games are imposible to end in 2 turns meaning you see more draws for turn and Pokemon's ability to see whatever card they want via absurd plusses. Subsequently the side board full of silver bullets in pokemon is theoretically more powerful than in Yugioh were our silver bullets are mostly unsearchable and have harsher restrictions on free plus cards.

​@@BurtsPTCGSIDE decking in competitive Yu Gi Oh is EVERYTHING. If you know the meta, what card to swap between duels (SIDE decking) and have a little bit of luck, you win duels. A lot of tournaments had been won doing this.

Haha probably not Im too busy trying to make Kyrurem playable 😂😭

Yep i agree! Switching cards ans resource management will become more of a focal point 🙏

Haha your not wrong😂😭

Very accurate🤣

Seems pretty fair to me! Like its okay to not have perfect matchups everywhere 😂

One thing that ties us all together 🤣

Garde and Lost Box I guess! Appreciate your constructive comment my friend 🙏🙌

@@BurtsPTCG As an avid Lost Tina player I agree haha, I think lots of things in the game can be frustrating to play against and it's important to realise that. Snorlax stall is frustrating to play against however getting donked or turn 2 sableyed or Iono spammed etc is also highly frustrating. It's important to realise that because everyone has a right to be frustrated in the moment it's just important not to let that frustration make you irrational after the fact.

It is a bit of a bop 😂🙌

Haha exactly! 😂🙌

I agree! 🙌

Ayo let's go! 🙌

That seems very sensible to me! Appreciate the well thought out comment! 🙌

Getting there yeah haha! Appreciate your support! 🙌

Haha come get back invovled! 🙏🙌

I think it is!

Haha 🤣🤣 man said skill issue 💀💀

That's the idea! Appreciate your support my friend! 🙌

Ayo appreciate you! 🙌🙏

🙌 Appreciate your support! 👌

In Yugioh alternate wincon decks are all about making sure your opponent never plays the game at all if they don't open the out in their starting hand. They never promote healthy gameplay. You can't easily tech into counters since 1. they're too niche, and 2. your chance of actually seeing them before the alt wincon lands is minimal.

@@geek593 as far as ive seen it while some alt-wincon decks are about performing the condition before the opponent can even play, theres a fair few that can't be played that way or are playable more under the stall umbrella as an option. even so many a non-alt wincon deck is focused on blunting an opponents plays to the point they have to have specific techs to make it through the opposing board effectively anyway to even have another turn due to a standard loss, thus the meme of "theres a turn 4?" being a thing. especially because I prefer decks that aren't as modern usually, that's something i see a lot. I'm not sure what you define as Healthy gameplay. Sumo dice Games, Angel of mischief, and deep draw exodia are all often run as turn 1 combo builds, but considering the nature of especially the first two, it makes sense. that said Exodia can be played a few different ways, with crooked cook stall being annoyed in itself, but I myself ran a Paleozoic variant that while janky got through certain bad boardstates using exodia as a fallback, though it took more games with the Paleo's themselves playing normally when it did anything. some have to just mount a defense of some kind because they just can't secure the win so soon. final countdown, destiny board, and the pure Runick variants are examples of that one. doing mill nowadays in yugioh Runick or not is an iffy venture not just because of trying to hold a board long enough. not-runick and you could set off a number of your opponents own effects (most notably the remaining tearlament players), Runick and you autolose some matchups the same way if you can even secure a hold and how you do that. Yugioh in general is like the madcap fighting game of TCGs as far as I understand it, where turn 1 holds so much power that unless you design your deck to blind second and get second your probably in some level of trouble from the outset. you can't counter everything in the first place, just the most common threats to make your winrate better. Personally over in master duel im far more concerned about vanquish soul, purrely, or Kashtira (still not a fan of that name) or even labrynth then any strategy that is going to be cornercase. I still haven't seen many snorlax stall myself in pokemon despite the wins it's sad. if anything I've seen more people willing to try counter catcher wugtrio, which honestly makes me smile, even when i lose to it. I just like it when people are trying more mechanics than just the one the game is primarily tilted for.

Yeah I think Lax just capitalised on peoples lack of preparation (which was strange cause lax did make top 8 at laic) I think it has peaked but we will see!

Ayo! Appreciate it my guy! 🙌🙏

Actually played against Zam at locals the other day! Was pretty interesting! 😂

Haha you do! I never finished it tho can't lie 😂

Yep exactly! While it might not be the most popular it definitely isnt going anywhere!

What's a counter spell? 👀

This potential solution could also make for interesting lead choices. In the Gardevoir matchup, maybe you’d see players choosing to start with Radiant Greninja to make sure it doesn’t get prized, which has an obvious risk of running into stall or otherwise bricking, but is also a viable choice for consistency since it’s such an important card to not prize.

Blockade was absolutely brutal 😭😭

@@BurtsPTCG right! These players need some Vileplume in their life.

That will teach um :p nothing can prepare you for turn 1 item lock before uve had a chance to play a card 😂😭

Haha good point actually! 😂😂 And you too buddy! 🙌

Very sensible conclusion! 🙏

Ayo thank you so much! And that's an interesting way of thinking about it yeah 🙌

Haha exactly this! Imagine the absolute horror of that 😂😂

The universal hate tying the fan base together 😂

Yeah t1 Plume before uve had a chance to play a card was madness 🤣

Yesssss! Iron valiant is a problem! The fact you can lose a game before you've even played a card is WILD

True true but if iron valiant kovs your lone Ralts or frigibax before you've had a chance to play a card you don't get to play the game eaither 😭

@@BurtsPTCG Yeah it's very similar, at the end of the day I'm happy people playing the decks they want to play! I think why people feel more against Control than Iron Valiant is that it falls off a bit after those early turns, so there's some give, where control doesn't peak or dip if it's doing what it needs too. I think a lot of people are happier being donked than draw passing for 30 minutes as well. It's definitely an interesting topic though, great video as always!

Exactly! And ur right! Plasma snorlax was much more scary :p

No pause definitely takes some getting used too 🤣

Exactly!

Arceus was smiling down 😂

Well both things can be true I guess 😂

If they want decks that can viably use alternate win conditions, stall really wasn’t the answer. If anything, they should have at least made an aggressive mill card/engine so you can rip through the opponent’s deck instead of the slow, painful death by killing one card per turn-from your opponent’s draw at the start.

The tweets I had in the video then? 👀🤣

Exactly! Or iron valiant who can ko your lone 60hp pokemon before you've even played a card 😂😭

Trainermart on insta :)

My man, thank you.@@BurtsPTCG

Must be feasting! 🙌

More then Yugioh?! Really? 👀

@@BurtsPTCG not more yet per say, but after I went back to all my old PTCG RU-vid's to find out all the new shit (I stopped playing during crimson invasion) I realized that half of the people that used to post awesome varied deck profiles and meta breakdowns just post stuff complaining about the game. I didn't really put 2 and 2 together until I saw your last couple of videos but yeah, the PTCG community is really starting to catch up with Yugioh 🤣 and that hurts me to say bc even though I played Yu-Gi-Oh for much longer I have way more respect for pokemon players

Aha! Appreciate you! 🙏🙌

Trainermart on insta! 🙌

Haha this is very true! Silver tempest format Lugia was too much 😂😭

Interesting, why do you think Lost box needs a ban? 👀

@@BurtsPTCG It is too OP and so annoying to deal with. They set up too fast.

Was interested to see if anyone would notice 👀🤣

Search it on limitless! Was used loads but Sander popularised it 🙌

@BurtsPTCG couldn't find it on limitless but I found a video on it. It's not caturday. It's Persian and oranguru the only caturday card is they chose to use the arguably more useful caturday meowth over other meowths.

limitlesstcg.com/decks/list/3391 i remember watching this Deck in action, caturday was used to draw cards🙏

Haha! Now we are talking 😂

Mystic mine is/was such banter 😂😭

👀

Do you want Snorlax to be banned then? 👀

Haven't been keeping up with yugioh much recently! What's it like? 👀

@@BurtsPTCG I don't play it myself, but from the looks of it the amount of combos you need to set up in one turn and having to be 6 parallel universes ahead of your opponent, and especially crud like timing and other vaguely defined but specific wording is...not ideal, to say the least there's a reason that there haven't been any new players coming in for a while

You don't/can't tech for everything at the same time and the idea of a deck like mew Vmax that could now have a side board is very scary 😭

Ikr! Like Melo can still drop 240.damage t1 and iron valiant can ko your lone 60hp pokemon before uve had a chance to play a card! But lax is the card that needs to get banned 😂😭

@@BurtsPTCG I feel as though generally the metagame is ridiculously fast paced, and this seems to have gradually increased over the years. If games were generally slower, more methodical affairs like years ago then nobody would bat an eyelid at this snorlax deck.

@mattutter3525 seems like a fair assessment I think!

The main issue I see is how big of a joke energy acceleration has become. I won’t hold anything over Baxcalibur because ‘rain dance’ cards have been around since the literal base set, and it’s balanced by the need to have the energies in your hand in the first place. Charizard ex is stupid, because you can just conjure 3 energies and accelerate them however you want. And because its attack only needs two energies to function, it can set itself up as well as a benched attacker (because at that point, you can still attach an energy for the turn). Two ways I’d balance it would be if it can’t accelerate to any Charizard ex’s, or make all 3 go to the same Pokémon, similar to how PikaRom functions. Next is Electric Generator which is also stupid, because it’s an ITEM card that can accelerate a potential 2 energies. Because it’s also on a reveal system, it makes it way too highroll-y, frustrating your opponent when it works, and frustrating the user when it doesn’t. Just toxic design for that one. Elesa’s Sparkle, while not as bad as the previous one, is incredibly obnoxious because all attacks utilizing Fusion Strike Energy count for the ones attached to all of the Pokémon in play, as well as the fact that FSE blocks abilities, covering up yet another weakness that Mew VMAX should have, but (unsurprisingly) doesn’t. Sada’s Vitality is in a similar boat to Elesa’s Sparkle, but is much worse because it can draw 3 cards on top of its effect. The point of “draw 3 cards and ____” cards is that they’re not supposed to be a direct upgrade to the standard “draw 3” cards, as there’s a reason as to why one wouldn’t want to use it. Worker can get rid of your own helpful stadiums, and Avery can give your opponent an opportunity to get rid of dead weight like Lumineon V. And finally we have Gardevoir ex, which is probably the most balanced of these. At least with this one, you need to discard the energy, and you damage the target when accelerating. It’s powerful, but not overpowered. All in all, if they stop adding stupid ways to artificially speed up games, things would be a lot better. If you read the whole thing, I’m sorry. I really didn’t mean for this to be so long!

@@TwilightChomperEnthusiast You know, I was having this discussion with my friend as well, I think it's a valid point. Baxcalibur is fine in a vacuum but Cien Pao makes it stupid at the best of times... Having decks that accelerate energy wouldn't be so bad if there was downsides/costs to it, or if generally pokemon did less damage, which is where I feel the other problem lies. So many pokemon can swing for well over 100 damage, sometimes for just 2 energy, and when weakness is a factor then most things are in KO range at all times. I'd personally prefer if generally attacks of 100+ were more reserved for high cost and/or drawback attacks for risk/reward. This means that in a format currently dominated by massive HP eX cards, you'd have more chance of using single-prizer decks including stage 2's.

Long live Klawf

@@BurtsPTCG i sat on it a bit more and i have to respectfully say that I disagree with Dark Souls comparison even more. First of all is what I have already mentioned - nobody forces me, you or anyone to play Dark Souls if they do not want to. This is a completely different game - Pokemon Trading Card Game. I did not sign up to play against any stall by accepting its ToS. However, even if it was perfectly okay and without any problems whatsoever (more on that later), you can lose in Dark Souls and it will lead to you knowing more about your enemy... but you can also retry that battle, and only that battle - not the whole game - without any consequences. The same cannot be said about losing a tournament game to this. No matter how well prepared you come to it, PTCG is ultimately also a game of chance. You can have your planned tech stuck in prizes or at the bottom of your deck without a chance of getting it. All players can do is do their best to mitigate the chance of this happening, but it cannot be completely nullified in certain lists. In Dark Souls you can study the exact patterns of enemies to respond accordingly and, eventually, after several trials and errors, you will take down said enemy. However, no matter how many times you prepare for a stall deck, through no fault of your own, you can lose to it, including losing a tournament game. Of course, because of the nature of the deck you're up against, any attempt at playing to win in this situation is a lot harder, if not impossible. While you could argue that for every game lost to getting prize-locked, at the very least other playstyles do not actively hinder your attempts at getting unstuck. Pokemon is unique in this situation compared to other games - the sheer concept of prizes makes it so. This is why I believe something like stall should never have any place to exist here. Some forms of disruption are acceptable, but an outright debilitation shouldn't be a thing.

Are you a yugioh player?👀

People find getting their lone ralts ko'd t1 via Iron valiant before they played a card boring. Lets ban that too then shall we?

Im not familiar! Could i get a tldr? 👀

@@BurtsPTCG typically Smash Melee is played super fast and aggressive and it’s mostly why it’s so popular but Hbox (Hungry box) was the only top player to play a very slow and defensive style and won a lot. People were crying for Bans of his character Jigglypuff who is oddly enough a Pokémon also soft and lovable like Snorlax! :D

@GarredHATES oh i see! Now that is strange and doesn't sound warrented 😂😭

I agree 100%! A healthy game is where all these decks can shine 🙌

Love that!

That will do it 😂

Pidgeot is a bit good all things considered yeah! 🙌 Appreciate your support! 🙌

Im not familiar with that! Who was it? 👀

@@BurtsPTCG aDrive lol

I think thats a sensible way of looking at it! I think its at its peak of popularity and will only go down from here 🙏

@@BurtsPTCG Getting called sensible from someone who can make a video this well produced and thought out really just made my day. For someone who knows their stuff to suggest I'm on the right track means a lot. Thank you so much.

Ayo! Your too kind! 🙏 It's always refreshing to have a sensible well thought out comment so you made my day haha! Hope to see you in the comments again soon!🙌

@@BurtsPTCG Thank you. I'll be around for sure. You can count on that. I've been poking my head into Pokemon TCG off and on since the Sword and Shield era (specifically Rebel Clash/Darkness Ablaze) but I didn't really start digging in and building decks until Obsidian Flame. I feel more confident now about knowing some of the interactions or at least picking up on what casters such as yourself mention during games. It has been a blast so far, but I haven't had much of a chance to compete though I do try to play online every day when I can. Primarily I like collecting the rewards, but it's also fun to evolve as a player. Taking frustrations in stride and using losses as learning experiences are some of the best parts of TCGs. Stall is just one more strategy I'm gonna have to try my best against or look forward to rotation lol. The next one will be my first as a player. It's a little intimidating, but that's what channels like this one are for.

The ban cycle 😂

Yep I agree! And now the Meta develops 🙏

Sounds pretty decent can't lie!

This take is a bit weird. The issue is not that people do not have attackers to knock out Snorlax, but that the Snorlax player forces other Pokemon into the active spot. How would one copy of Mew help at all in this case?

@@marcfelix1006 it's not just Snorlax but not all decks have an answer for Mimikyu and Mew ex would help with that. Like I said it's not perfect but imo a much better 1 card tech than Minior. And you can play around Erika and EHorn sometimes with a good hand.

@michielschrauwen Spiritomb is probably the best answer imo, stops them drawing and can return itself to hand if they gust it 🙏

@@BurtsPTCG True if you want to build your deck to beat Snorlax Stall definitely the best. I brought up Mew ex because it has uses against a wider variety of decks rather than Spiritomb or Minior especially if you have energy acceleration for it. But like the video also showed if you don't want to play techs against it pray you dodge it😉

Haha i was just thinking about what 10 video to do 👀 i will add it to the idea list :p

Thx I would really like that

Gengar mimi was wild!

We need something different then just attach energy and smash 😂

Fantastic point!