How to Deal with Christians Who Are in Favor of Abortion or Same-sex Marriage 

Here are some additional resources that will help you to respond to self-proclaimed Christians who are pro-choice or who support pro-gay theology: What Would You Say to a Professing Christian Who Is Radically Pro-Choice? rsn.pub/429pnUV A View More Troubling Than Pro-Choice rsn.pub/429pvDT A Question to Ask Those Who Adopt Pro-Gay Theology rsn.pub/47wl0nF A Response to Matthew Vines: The Bible Doesn’t Support Same-Sex Relationships rsn.pub/4b5mN6t A Reformation the Church Doesn’t Need - Part 1 rsn.pub/3u5Y4hE A Reformation the Church Doesn’t Need - Part 2 rsn.pub/3vQ3GNw

Who else is here because of Koukl's book tactics?

Cracks me up how you tube has to offer their opinion on abortion. "It's a procedure to end a pregnancy." No its a action that kills a human life.

Right. Thanks, Greg. The PC culture has even taken root in the church and it's good to get Christians to think about that and reassess their stance. It's much easier to talk with Christians, imo, than nonbelievers about these things. We certainly have to live with people on both sides of the issue, but as a Christian whose extended family is made of liberal agnostics and atheists, I've been accused of "forcing" my views on them since 1987. I would tell them they're free to hold their views regardless of my argument, but I'm also free to challenge their views in meaningful discussion. My family barred religion and politics from holiday gatherings, etc., after that, only to break their own rule next time we met. Therefore, I explained that if the rule was only meant for me to follow, then I refuse to follow the rules also. It's either for all of us or none of us. We've moved across the US since, and I don't have many family gatherings with them anymore. In a way, I'm sad that our influence is not there, but on the other hand, there was always so much stress, tension and pressure that my holidays were not always pleasant, so I'm also glad to be free of the stress. Yet both my mother and my oldest daughter (who they won over) called and Messengered me to tell me to vote for Hillary this year. (As my mother would say... oy vay! She was raised Jewish, but is only culturally Jewish, not religious) I think prayer is powerful. Sometimes, it's the only thing a Christian has left in these situations. I'm articulate enough to reason and ask stone-in-shoe questions... you, Greg, have been instrumental in my conversations with family. Am I being selfish for feeling glad that I have a little more breathing room now that I'm so far away? I often wonder if moving was a mistake. Difficulties with the family were not my main reason for moving, but they sure made moving so far away sound far more appealing than if they were not so difficult and undermining to my parenting and lifestyle choices as a Christian. I was especially relieved when our car broke down before driving across the states to get the rest of our things out of storage and meet the family for Thanksgiving this year. We had to cancel the trip because the cost of repairs ate up our vacation savings. I have two other children who believe and support me... one who lives where they do with his wife and children, and I'm very thankful. He won't take their nonsense and he let's them have it when when they spout off at my husband and I, which really makes me proud. But I still have a thirteen-year-old home schooler that I don't wish to subject to their opinions any longer. She's fully aware of their stance, but when she was only five, my Dad was caught telling her that there was no such thing as hell and he also tried to persuade us to let her see Valentine's Day (a PG-13 movie about lust, not love) on Valentine's Day. When we said no, he threw a tantrum and couldn't let it go, driving away in a rage while my son told off his own Grandpa. Such drama! I never asked for this... but then, who ever has. As my now thirteen-year-old would call it, I ended up doing a big face-palm, while my oldest daughter (then in college) sarcastically thanked us for ruining another family gathering, and then she left with her friends to go see the movie.

Thank you!

Going with the flow. Wow! That explains Sunday keeping, to a T.

*_God Bless_*

Well said

I have heard people say "but I wouldn't get an abortion myself..." And I really like your response to that, asking them why. 👍 I have a few loved ones that are basically pro choice and pro same sex marriage and some of them.claim to be Christian. But these individuals don't really value that Bible as far as I've seen.

You tell them they’re not

My parents are dead but back when they were alive they were very strongly supportive of same-sex marriage and abortion and they were very intolerant of conservative people and Christian people like their son for example well I'm raising my kids Christian and conservative but if they choose not to follow in my footsteps even though I won't approve of it I'll still be supportive of it because it makes my kids happy because even though my parents didn't know this, when I become a parent and bring up children of my own I'm going to acknowledge that even though when you have children you do what you can to raise them but when they become grown adults you have to let them move on and decide for themselves God bless 😇🙏✝️✝️

Same-sex marriage. - I spent the first 60 years of my life being told by the state that marriage is between a man and a woman for the purposes of procreation. Now, for the last 10 years I have been wondering why we were all lied to about this until March 2014, (in UK). - (Or maybe it's the new legislation that's an untruth). 🙃

Many years ago, after church, I heard a small group of women discussing the case of a young Christian girl who had been raped and so became pregnant. She had an abortion. The only unmarried woman in the group retorted; "God could have stepped in at any time to stop that attack and because he didn't she should have had that baby!" I was appalled at her ruthless, uncaring attitude towards both the rape victim and the potentially huge lifechanging consequences for both her and the baby for the rest of their lives if nature had taken its course. Suddenly abortion sounded like a less cruel option. There is a lot more to the subject of abortion than just holding up a red card and proclaiming: 'SIN'! Who can truly know the right answer to a dilemma such as this; no matter how much you 'take the spin off of it' ?

First of all how can they be Christians if God is against them - they make themselves at war with God.... Matthew 10:34-39 New International Version 34 ‘Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn‘“a man against his father,a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law - 36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.”[a] 37 ‘Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

Question is are they really Christians? Is it about forcing one's view or telling them God's truth?

Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body. 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 Once you “chose” Jesus as Lord, you now have no choice

Thank you 🙏 very helpful

Let me get this straight. You want to allow people to get equal rights?? Oh no

Your argument seems to forget that along with a belief in Jesus comes forgiveness for all of your sins. So what is the problem with someone saying I can only control my own behavior towards abortion? Someone who makes a decision to have an abortion will either be forgiven through Jesus or not. Anyone ( including yourself, sir) who is not Jesus and who attempts to interject himself between someone who has committed a sin and their relationship with Jesus is a blasphemer.

In Romans chapter 1 Paul gives us a list of sins - remember he had got direct information from Christ Gal 1:12 KJV - that God would not charge men or women for. What is the unrepentant sin: There isn't one: Some may say 'sin against the Holy Ghost' - but broke that one many times before the Damascus Road. If a sinner has faith in Jesus and follows Paul 1COR 11:1 and begins to learn Paul's books of Grace then he/she will be made perfect; and goto heavenly places with Christ Eph 1:3 .

Romans 1:26-27 which says: "Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion." How can one read this and conclude that sexual acts involving same sexed individuals could be anything but "shameful lusts" "unnatural relations" "indecent acts" "received...due penalty for their perversion"....... Did you hear that?...." due penalty for their perversion"......Perversion of what? "natural relations". This passage is plain and clear God called homosexual acts "shameful lusts"" "unnatural " a perversion" and will have a "penalty". End of story. Don't get me wrong.....God gave man free will. And here in America one is free to love whom he/she pleases. If one want to satisfy their lust for each other in ways that God did not intend, then by all means let them go for it. Just do not say that God's word justifies their actions. If one sticks up their middle finger at God in rebellion and say " I don't give a sh__t what you want. I am going to do it my way." Instead of confessing that they are a sinner and are trying their best not to sin, then they will get exactly what they wanted......the rest of eternity without God. This goes just as well for every other sin under the sun not just homosexuality.

Many Evangelical Pastors unwittingly play into the culture's hand so to speak by not teaching parishioners how to think! They have a statement of beliefs they make every member sign. Rules are followed, positions are articulated but without any understanding why. People, who have been steeping in a cultural tea for 20-30 years are going to take awhile before their minds and hearts are renewed. Learning how to think, learning how to express oneself in language that avoids slogans (I would never impose my view, what is true for me is, etc.).

Very Important topic... & I saw a round-about question posed in the comments here regarding this topic questioning if "belief" plays a role in detemining how we should proceed & behave... especially if we saw a person trying to murder another person in front of us... my response to one of the comments made by one man, & I paraphrase & quote: "you say, Helping another person when they are in trouble (i.e. seeing a neighbor being murdered) doesn't have to do with Belief. Well, actually it does. If I believe it's correct to help someone I will act/support it on a multiple of different paths. Which includes trying to stop someone murdering my neighbor..." Oddly on this point I agree with this non-believer's comment... because really what he is saying is it is "Belief" in doing what is Right... I agree on many levels with this... but the real question is how do we know what is Right & what is Wrong? My answer is, God; our Creator saw the depravity of man and gave us "commandments" to live by... because God in His infinite wisdom saw we as His children needed guidance & He needed to teach us Right from Wrong, as any good parent would do.. So taking it a step further, if I see someone trying to murder another human being, I would do whatever I could to help save that person, because i know we are commanded by God, thou shall Not commit murder.. so to stand idle & do nothing while seeing a murder committed makes me just as guilty in the eyes of God if I could have done something to help save them... Then it stands to reason that the same principle stands true with regards to the topic of Abortion.. because in God's eyes life begins at the moment of conception... a spirit & soul from God is given at that precise moment and a new life is beginning to grow inside the womb.. so for a believing Christian to take the stance that 'it is not my place to force my views on others ' while they believe that Abortion is murdering an innocent child (but they in effect are saying they ALSO believe a mother has the right to take away that innocent life - but you can't have it BOTH ways!), then that so-called Christian is not helping anyone when staying silent on the issue & looking the other way.. & certainly not helping the mother who might be contemplating abortion because perhaps the woman is ignorant of God's laws... & certainly not helping their own walk with Christ by looking the other way while innocent babies are murdered (I ask, how is looking the other way & being OK with allowing abortions to take place any different than standing idle & doing nothing when seeing your neighbor being murdered?).... ah but, having ignorance of God's laws does NOT excuse anyone come Judgement Day... and as Christians we want every person's soul saved... so you see, by Not speaking out against Abortion is fundamentally WRONG - and by not doing so makes me just as guilty of murdering innocent babies as the mothers aborting the babies themselves... as Martin Luther King Jr. said so perfectly, "He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it."... So thank you to that non-believer for commenting, which inadvertently helped subtainitiate the Christian belief on this topic..

Regarding the issue of same sex marriage, I do not agree with your remarks about its impact. None of the legal rights or recognitions that currently exist are being taken away from marriage between a man and a woman. The legal status and recognition of a marriage between a man and a woman will remain as it always has been. Nothing is being subtracted from it by allowing two people of the same gender to enter into the same kind of kinship contract and have that recognised by the state.

Love Greg's thoughtful approach. It is either true or false that Same-sex marriage and or abortion are immoral. Now how humans recognize these wrongs or rights is separate. It has always been wrong to enslave others. It has always been wrong to demean people do to race or gender. But we have only recognized these things as wrong within the last 200 years of a 6000 year old civilization. For abortion to be wrong we would have to present arguments for humans having immaterial souls, leading us to believe that we are as scripture says, "Image-bearers of God." Second we would give counter arguments asking questions about how traveling 9"s down a birth canal conveys "humanness?" Or ask isn't viability just a measure of the current state of medical technology and know how. So babies in the 19th century weren't human until 8.5 months, babies weren't human in the 20th century until 7 months, and in the 21 century it may drop to 4 or less months. Again this seems absurd. Great video

I think that Christian believers just need to ask themselves the following question ... "Father, what would be most pleasing to you?". I'm not a theologian but I don't think that having an abortion or being part of a homosexual relationship (or marriage) would be His preference.

They feel embarrassed inside, because they know they are wrong........

I see your point on abortion, and agree with it wholeheartedly, but don't see your point on homosexual marriage being a problem on the points you mention. Please clarify. Thank you.

I agree completely with the abortion issue, but not with the homosexual marriage one. Granted, it may have an impact on religious freedom in the future, but it will only be in small ways. Not a way we really should be worrying about- particularly taking into account the persecution Christians will expect when Antichrist rules. The world will always be opposed to Christ, so I say let them have this one.

This book should be no one's source for morality......... Leviticus 25:44-46New International Version (NIV) 44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

Yes, Greg. People have indeed "thought this through." And that is why they have come to the conclusion that you cannot force your beliefs onto another human being. That is the logical conclusion to come to when you think it through. Don't believe me? Have the pro-choice folks ever been able to force their beliefs on you? Not hardly. It works the other way 'round, as well. Obviously. And now that the law has "weighed in" in favor of same sex marriage, we'll see what the impact on society is. It's also obvious to me that we will become a more accepting and compassionate society, as a whole, as a result of this change in the law. Except for the fundamentalist bigots; they will remain as divisive as ever. Pity

Nobody is Pro-Abortion--I am pro-choice because it reduces abortions(check the last 60 years of Democratic admins and GOP admins-- many less abortions in the Dem administrations because we preach education and birth control and hence abortions go down- Whats the goal? less abortions or more abortions? Less Abortions! also Christians that think you can have conversion therapy for gay folks is crazy-- Gay people were made gay by God the same way I was made to love women- I know many hundreds of Gay folks and less than 5% could go either way- They also all say its not a choice to be gay--- So while im a christian and loves the scripture- Im positive when we get to Heaven God will let all you right winger fundamentalist that you misinterpreted the bible... God bless!

I think that this is more likely to push people away from religion. Take it from a hardcore athiest.

You thank them for being decent humans and move on with your day.

First of all, I am not homosexual nor do I plan on aborting a child of mine. I have no intention to offend or to seek attention. I am simply attempting to get people to see and think of the world in a different way. I just have a few questions for whomever is reading this. Does an entomologist feel remorse for the insect specimens he's collected? Does the hunter feel sorrow for the dear he's killed? No. Both involve the destruction of life. Both serve a roll. (i.e.) in the entomologist's case, furthering knowledge for the rest of humanity. In the hunter's, feeding his family and/or population control. The human ego and society tell us that the amount of neural connections in our brain make us special, that intelligence some how makes us better than animals. If every human were to disappear at once, you no what would happen? Nothing. If anything earth would be better off... Humans are animals. Kingdom: Animalia Phylum: Chordata Class: Mammalia Order: Primates Family: Hominidae Tribe: Hominini Genus: Homo Species: H. sapiens Notice the very first word on the list, Animalia. It literally means animals. So if we can justify the killing of animals more intelligent than a fetus, why is so insane to think we can kill an animal(human) to better the rest of them. In the deer's case, it's better to sacrifice even one of them than to let them all starve. If you were a child born of unplanned pregnancy (rape, accidental, contraception malfunction), how would you feel knowing that your existence was never meant to be and to know you are a burden on your parents? I'm not saying that all parents hate unplanned children, this is simply a theoretical rhetorical question. On a different note, many Religions state that gay sex/gay marriage is "unnatural". In nature, a variety of animals display homosexual behaviors. Here is a link with a list of animals that display such behaviors. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animals_displaying_homosexual_behavior. Why is it only unnatural for humans? Coming full circle, humans are animals, making whatever behavior we exhibit, natural. We can never display an unnatural habit because anything we do is considered natural. Like fainting goats. Just because they faint doesn't make them less of a goat. We don't say those goats are unnatural, we identify them as slightly different... All in all I am an Atheist but do not hate Christians or even dislike them in most cases. I share morals with Christians and have no problem with that. I'd also like to acknowledge that religion has done some good things for this world. Earth would be much worse off if not for religion. However it is my personal opinion that religion was a key part of human development but, is no longer essential to the advancement of the human race. Please consider my points and rebuttal if you feel so inclined. If you choose to do so please use science as evidence, the bible is for Christians which I am not.

Guy sounds miserable...

100% of aborted fetuses go straight to paradise, never having experienced suffering. If they are not aborted, a majority will spend eternity in Hell. I'm confused about Greg's reasoning. Greg is confused about Greg's reasoning.

I have no problem with women having the right to choose and early abortion is fine but I am not in favour of Christians demanding more unwanted babies in a world where people are hardly in short supply yet resources and welfare is.