I've got an e400 rattle on start-up, and I think I've got the same problem. When warm it's ok I can switch it on and off with no rattle. Can I drive the car like this or do I need to sort it asap?
I don’t give any videos thumbs down. I’m not a Mercedes tech but I have a 2010 C300 and the M272 Engine. I do my own work and know the M272 well. Your engine like mine, is plagued with timing issues after 100k miles. I know you did other things but it looks like all you needed to do was replace the oil control valve on that one cam. All you need to do is remove the magnet, then place your socket on the oil control valve head, AND SIMULTANEOUSLY take the oil cover on the back of the camshaft and counterhold it with another ratchet (I believe the back is a 60 mm) and then rotate counter clockwise. No need to take off the valve cover and all that jazz. I did the above on my left intake cam, took the oil control valve out, cleaned it with carb cleaner, then put it back in and my timing issues completely went away. Sometimes they just need a cleaning not even replacement.
ive just had all new timing gear on my m271. chains, guides, gears. 3 weeks ago. started rattling on cold starts a few days ago and got worse and worse and now has thrown up the engine light. could it be what you have described? i will be taking the car back anyway for them to look at and i dont have my obd to check what code its thrown up.
im having the same issue i replaced my sdjusters i think ima do the timing kit , my middle timing mark keeps smacking like this one in the video, i get the same rattle
ordered a timing chain kit... saw your video... recreated it on the exhaust side... returned the chain kit. i performed the bulletin work 2 years ago, didn't solve the startup rattle. many thanks for documenting your diagnostic process.
glad I could help you get down to the root cause. this one almost got missed I wasn't happy with how it was puking oil and as I dug deeper I noticed it jump and decided to make the video
@@glasser2819 in some of cases.. I ask my self wy they ad .somenny think. When I look in to a 70s car .. but . This is something my boss sad one day.. ingeniers build that not a gypsy.
Hi everyone, I had a same issue with my C400 (M276- 3000cc V6 Twin turbo) I replaced my check valve and tensioner earlier but that couldn't fix a problem. I had some rattling early morning and weird rattling when warm engine was sitting for 20-30 minutes. I took a car to another local general mechanic and he quickly figured out my intake sprocket is faulty, I ordered OE quality from eBay for something about $125 and he replaced it for me, not any issue at all🙂👍 You don't need to open valve cover, this part is like a plug and play and entire job is taking about 2 hours
Variable actuator and cam spocket are same, just called different names. Amazon sell a set for$400+. Thanks for sharing. Once rattles start it is useless to replace secondary tensioner & check valve, according to MB tech.
@@inakalimba9428 don't get distracted by check valve and tensioner, I did both of them and wasn't solution! I did intake sprocket and fixed my problem Thanks for your reply!
@@ckmckc hey buddy, don't get confused, u need to change either one or two. Due to nature of M276 engine and strong pressure of turbo on intake, 90% of time your intake sprocket gets failed not exhaust. Use an obd2 tool to identify your problem area. Get a part from Amazon for less than $140 and entire replacing process getting less than 45 minutes. Don't get distracted by wrong advice from non-German mechanics. Let me know if you need any other help
Hi Mr GOAT thank you for your videos and information. I have installes updated tensioners and check valves in my 2012 mercedes E300 M276 engine. I checked all my camshaft acutators they were fine but my tensioners were no good. I now know how to set the engine timing as well. The rattling is now gone and car is running beautiful thank you.
I have a 2017 c300 with 57k miles and I just recently had the rattling issue . About 2 weeks ago the car started stalling (no longer starting ) and the dealership has quoted me $7282 to fix . No other shop in the area I willing to work on the car because the miles are so low . If you’re having this problem, try not to ignore it
I love your attitude. You gave the engine the level of respect it deserved (not much) with the non MB approach. Long time MB owner and IMO their new engines are turbo POS so who gives if you use a vise grip on the camshaft.
@@bm-rf4bc OK my bad! This was the normally aspirated M276 DE35 used on passenger cars like the E and C Class. I have a later variant M276 DE30LA which has an inter cooler and turbo added to the engine. It is on my GL/GLS SUV and was put in some AMG passenger cars. The base engine with the intake removed looks similar to the one on mine. I just had the covers resealed for oil leaks. MB was so cheap they didn’t even have a gasket for the covers.
@@sfneurosurgeon I did some research myself and found that there are turbo variations of the engine - Very cool. I'm a big fan of natural aspiration for daily drivers, one less thing to break, and the c300 we have is pushing 130k mi, so - def a daily driver!
Hi, well done!!! Like you said it was not the way MB technicians do but the most important thing is the result! QUESTION: WHAT ARE THE TORQUE SPECS FOR TENSIONER BOLTS. THANKS AHEAD)))
It would be nice to see through the whole process of you doing the work rather than cutting out clips here and there. Just a thought maybr for a future video.
Based on three other videos i've watched on roughly the same symptoms and fault, there's a failing lock pin that is supposed to hold the adjuster mechanism in-place during cold start. I think my ML 350 may be experiencing the same.
Thanks for sharing. Mechanic verses MB Tech. MB tech.: hours @ Xentry diagnostic🤔...Mechanic: hours @ repairing a car from visually looking at the signs of a malfunction.😃 previous owner of my m276 C300 ignored the oil leaks around the cam gaskets ,ignored the low oil dip stick levels. Just added oil and kept driving. Now, tensioner is failing, ppl check for Engine leaks and repair in a timely manner. Owner man. Says check @ 40K. buy a Ford when you want low repair cost instead of MB.
If you use vice grips? Clean lobe or shaft with Brake clean on a rag wipe clean and dry. Put some brass shim stock around where your grip jaws will be. It will help protect lobe or shaft where your jaws will bite into.
Quick tip there is a torque fitting at the end of the camshaft which is an T60. Use that and breaker bar to hold camshaft as the pluse rings are removed/ cam adjuster
Mercedes dealer did this, still rattles after sitting five days. only use car once a week. Tried a thicker oil, helped slightly. No rattle if driven daily.
Love your SO CALLED Mercedes certified tools LOL, just heads up on my issue, i was 100% sure that i have bad timing gear just like yours, span the engine by hand and no jumping like on yours, my problem was bad tensioner
I’m I certified Mercedes Benz tech ! First of all you fixed the car ! Which is good and I happy for that. Second next time that’s is a 40 min job and i quote like 15h to make my money . I get paid for what I know not for I how I do it . Yes 40 min , which means you don’t take the injectors, coils, fuel lines , pump , nothing at all not even the intake manifold .Why because I know my tricks, third you we’re lucky this time you get it on timing and no skip any tooth. Having said that I want to congratulate you for doing ! You did a good job but no good work .
Hi. I’m thinking the intake cam adjustor should be able to come off without removing the valve cover, right? Question is where do you keep the crank position when doing it? Also would be ok to hold the crank bolt when opening the cam adjustor bolt? Thanks bro
@@mchaudry9811 Yes, no idea why that dipshit was bragging about ripping people off... but the backside of the cam shaft accepts a T60 socket so you can provide resistance when removing the actuator bolt in the front. You just remove the small covers in the front, determine which one is bad, figure out how to get to the back of the cam shaft (remove a little plastic cover or the high pressure fuel pump, etc), then you can confidently remove the bolt once you have the engine rotated to the appropriate spot to remove the tension from the chain.
@Roberto Vidal Garcia Hi Robert the guys here on canada is very expensive especially in BC. Cant find anyone who will do it cheaper. Does anyone in Canada knows if somone can do for 1500 or 2000?
Hi. Have got this code( P0454A00) the outlet camshaft (cylinder bank1) position differs from the specified value in direction ‘Advanced’ during cold start accompanied by P001464 and p002164 on Benz GLK 350 2014. So the clack sound while turning the engine proves that the cam phaser is bad
I'm Going Through This Too. The Car Doesn't Have The Power that I Feel that it Should. Its Pointing To That One Camshaft Actuator. I Have Replaced The Magnets Several Times But The Code Remains. So I'm Suspecting This is The Issue. Car only Has About 50K Miles. Sad I Have to Dig into The Engine To Do This.
Oh my god, to change, camshaft did YOU open the engine cover? I change it in an hour, you need two sacet and that's it, and that someone would help you hold the second camshaft.
Hello, Thanks for the video, it goes a long way to get the job done, Great Job, I have one questions, i am about to instal check valves on both cylinder heads, please can i know which one goes for bank 1 and bank 2, because the look diffrent. Thanks
Just wondering ,see how close the engine coolant valves are to the cams. Would you say those engine coolant valves get old,brittle breaking down the effectiveness of engine pressure. With high internal engine pressure, oil expansion occurs,leaks and slipping chain in engine result. Sensors get oil drenched and become useless. As they say, it becomes a mess.😖
I have an 06 ML 350, always getting a loud rattle for about three- four seconds, then it goes away and no noise. Mostly cold starts, but even after one hour or two Can I just leave it? Is it something with oil pressured Tensioner’s? Drivable with the noise on start up?
Should be fine. Mine is same year same model as yours. Same symptom. however you should give it a short burst of gas to raise the rpm to 1500 to 2000rpm at start up.
Can this clacking sound from the cam adjuster cause the engine from spinning freely when turning manually. This one does so bad that when ever it’s started it acts like engine wants to lock up. Now after replacement of the oil breather valve which would require you take out high pressure pump, I decided to turn the engine over manually to get the clacking noise from the cam adjuster and it was a terrible sound and it did turn. I tried to crank the vehicle after the job was done(replacement of pcv) the sound came up like it usually did cos of the bad cam adjuster but I had to put it off. Now on turning over the engine manually it turns to a stage and get stuck somewhere. Could this be a case of the cam phaser going out completely. I kindly await your response to this. Thanks
Bill, thank you very much for this video. How long did it take you to perform this fix roughly? Wondering what kind of labour time I’ll be into at the mechanic. .
Thank you for this video sir. I have a Mercedes Benz e350 2013 and I have rattling noise mainly cold start but some time it rattles when the engine is warm. I have 200k miles on it and I’m not sure to just replace the tensioners or also the chain? Or of I just replace the tensioners do I have to align the timing ? Thanks
Thank you for your comment make sure you acquire the proper service procedure for the engine and the revision of your engine. check most current TSB bulletins. Make sure to install check valves with the tensioners. in my experience with replacing tensioners as long as the engine is in the appropriate "slack" position you will not have the timing chain skip time. Just changing out the tensioners vs changing the chain is much less labor
What happens when the dealer replaces the adjuster and tensioner but nothing changes? I noticed unplugging the oil diverter solenoid in the oil pump reduces the chance of rattle. Oil analysis shows normal wear in engine. Maybe I should just leave the solenoid unplugged and let engine run at normal oil pressure and forgo the low oil pressure better fuel economy.
Bro you got her done with no BS from the “Mbz tech” and you didn’t pay an arm and a leg for the actual repair! My car is doing the same thing after it was supposedly repaired by the mbz dealer !
HI Goat Garage, I have an M274 engine and my timing is off. I get code P0017. I do have rattle noise that mostly comes at start up. My valves are fine, doesn't spit out oil. Actuators seems to be fine too. it is just timing alignment. What indicates that my timing is dead one aligned?
Hi I take it that to change only the tensioners and fitt check valves, you don't have to remove the cam covers. Good video although its a shame you did'nt show the timing marks on bank 2 as I want to fit the check valves but cant find any info on the timing marks.
I believe you need to rotate the engine a additional 40 or 60 degrees and that puts the other side into the appropriate position. I do not totally remember. Sorry
@@billgoatgarageThank you for all the responses to comments, and the video. On bank two for the chain tensioner, I am wondering if I took one of the spark plugs out on that side, then inserted a long thin rod, then turned the engine with my ratchet, would that be a good way to find tdc with the piston, then figure out the 40 degrees after using the crankshaft degree markings? Does it matter where I am in the compression stroke as long as I found tdc? Speaking of finding the resting position to remove the tensioner.
I am hoping that Bill, or anyone else that has experience with this can help me. I have a 2012 E350 Coupe. 276.957 Engine, base model. I have the cold startup rattle/rough idle, then it disappears after a second or two. Engine feels strong, new spark plugs, coils, camshaft sensors, crankshaft sensor, no leaks, and the gas mileage is great. I am also only getting the P0300, P0301, and P0304, P0346 codes. I am going to start with making sure the check vavles and new tensioners are in, but does it sound like I may have bigger issues than the valves and tensioners?
Good job! This video is giving me courage to do mine as well. Same issue. Tensioners and check valves didn't fix the rattle. Where did you get the camshaft adjuster?
@@billgoatgarage I have recently had my timing chain and tensioners replaced, however the noise is still present. The garage has said the camshaft adjuster is not showing a fault code and could not locate which one it would be if it were a cam. Can you advise where to go from this?
M276.821 throwin p001685 and rattle on cold start up got everything off to inspect and on first rotation by hand skipped and center stopped a couple of times but now acting normal as im turning by hand...just really early into the failure ya think?
Hi I have a 2014 CLS550 wondering how do I remove existing check valve I was able to pull the threaded piece out seems like there's a steel shim that presses into and then the check valve behind it how would you go about removing the old valves your help would be greatly appreciated thanks
I have a ‘12 C350 that rattles from driver side timing cover and also the timing cover is showing a leak. Could this leak also be caused by tensioner or is that most likely a bad actuator ?
Hi. Nice video! I’m getting a P0016 code on my m278 engine (2013 gl450). No rattle on startup. Hard start sometimes. Will do the engine turn while looking at the intake adjustor to see if it jumps. My question is that will a bad adjustor always make rattle at cold start? Is it possible the cam sensor, cam solenoid or the cam pulse ring is bad? Any thoughts? Thanks a lot.
I believe it's 40 degrees for Bank 1 and 60 degrees for bank 2 however I do not remember exactly and you should find the appropriate repair information to help you along. best of luck
I really appreciate u and ur video . Just wondering during removal of cam adjuster no need to lock up the cam to prevent it from spinning? Thanks again
There is a plastic cover on the back of the valve cover that allows you access to the back side of the cam shaft so you can get a socket in there to stop it from moving while removing the actuator bolt from the front of the camshaft. Valve cover removal isn't necessary.
Hi....A quick question. Does the tensioner check valve come out of the head when you remove the tensioner or does it have to be pulled out? I'm going to be doing the same job. Thanks!
depends on what's been done to your car/engine. this one from factory did not have the check valves which is why there is a tsb to install check valves. if you already have check valves installed chances are you do not need to replace them. however if you still do want to replace them yes the need to be pulled out.
@@billgoatgarage Oh, OK. It's never been apart. It's a 2013 E350 with the W212. It rattles on cold startup for 5 seconds or so. 180 thousand miles. I'm thinking tensioners and I'll look at the VVT sprockets. Thanks!
i have a problem on my e63 model 2014 and also it says there's a problem with camshaft exhaust but i have checked it its fine so do you have any social media to message u ?
@@LoveKindSunshine i made the bone head mistake of turning the engine with the chain tensioner off... got to learn about timing too that day... have you looked for the rear access on the cover? You should be able to pop off a plastic cover and use a T60 on the back side of the cam to turn it or provide resistance when dealing with the adjuster bolt
Most of the time. What fellure is vanos actuators. But customers don't fix on time and. The guides worn out and gob extend. And about question. Yes the earliest mileage i se on 2018. Car only has 86. Thousand but when I open the front cover I see oil never be changed
question, did you turn the engine 360 to change the drivers side tensioner? working on one now and left side doesn't want to come out with marks all line up at 40 atdc
Not sure about M276's, but in the case of the previous M272 a very short 1 second or so rattle on cold start is normal as long as it instantly goes away once proper lubrication has occurred
I don't understand why not counter holding the camshaft with a wrench at the opposite end and torque it properly to 130Nm as per specs? You already have the valve cover out, might as well do it right. It may work fine now but what about in 100,000 km? That's the problem with DIYs, they think that if it works fine it's ok but when you give 2 years warranty on a job you might approach things differently. Same goes with using Chinese aftermarket adjusters for a couple of hundred dollars. If it fails in a year you'll have to do it again but as a repair shop I'll have to do it again for free, so no Chinese aftermarket crap is ever installed by any reputable shop.
I know when you take the right( passenger) tensioner off you have to be 40 degrees past TDC but what about the left ( driver) ? I can't find anything on it can you please help
Umm? I thought they are supposed to "jump" or go back to idle cause there is no oil pressure when then engine isn't running. You are turning it with no oil being pressurized in the actuator.
trust me as I assure you this is not normal and fixed my issue and has helped point numerous people to fix their issue as well. they are never supposed to jump like that
@@billgoatgarage I guess the way this cam gear style actuator works is different, from a pressurized cam chain tensioner found in the heads of older Audis and Volkswagens and Skoda. The way those work is when it comes full circle, it will snap back and have all valves in a closed position, cause there is no oil pressure to fight the compression of the piston inside the VVT actuator.
I hear ya...however I don't know how you would hold the camshaft without having to atleast take off the high pressure fuel pump to apparently hold the camshaft at the back? I understand people don't think the tear down was needed. but I don't see a better way of doing it especially without having the special tools needed
@@billgoatgarage I know. I was watching the part about holding the cam in particular. Seems like there should be a way. Partial to vice grips myself. Some of the OEM cam vises are insanely expensive and complicated.
@@nashidpeyvast3848 There is a plastic cover on the back of the valve cover that allows you access to the back side of the cam shaft so you can get a socket in there to stop it from moving while removing the actuator bolt from the front of the camshaft. Valve cover removal isn't necessary.
I have a 05/13 prod date m276 e350. The engine number is after the dates where the tensioner and check valve needed to be serviced. I recently been getting a rough warm engine rattle mixed with a “playing card in bicycle spoke” effect after letting it sit for 10-15 mins after a drive to work. During a full cold start, I don’t experience these things. It basically only happens after the engine been warmed up and it’s cooling down. I have 0 codes when I scanned so I’m confused as to what it might be. I was told that this is an early sign of cam adjuster if I have no codes. Should I be ruling out the tensioner and check valves and look into replacing adjuster?
If you have the 276 engine like me, from the front of the engine, it is one on the driver's side bank, underneath the intake manifold. First one from the left on the driver side bank.
Hello GOAT Garage. - great practical video. Thank you. Couple of questions: (1) what year M276 was? I'm guessing early in te engine numbers, since it needed the check-valves; (2) do you think Timing Chain cover leak and rattle indicates likelihood of the VVT unit failure? (3) Could you hear the magnetic clack when the valve cover(s) were on? (4) Is that clack characteristic of the VVT module failing? Hopefully this is not annoying and the questions knot two stoopid. I am justing asking a practical expert, before I buy a 2014 M276 (post-TSB engine) GLK. Still has those VVT units! Thank you, Best, KenH
(1) 2012 as stated in the video (2) timing covers leak on them all (3) rattled on startups (4) rattled on startups if the vvt jumps like shown you have to visually confirm I'm not a proper Mercedes trained tech. I just a general repair who knows a thing or three
But sometimes is cam problem to .. very gently lift valve cover en see the pasages of the oil if is worn out. Oil pressure drops before getting to actuator
@@rolls-r0yce613 There is a plastic cover on the back of the valve cover that allows you access to the back side of the cam shaft so you can get a socket in there to stop it from moving while removing the actuator bolt from the front of the camshaft. Valve cover removal isn't necessary.
