Love it!! Absolutely respect watching another tradesman lay it out there. Pass the skills on we need more quality, even showing the home doer, show the right way.
I just found your channel ! I am a finish carpenter/ cabinet maker in Nor-Cal ( I know I am sorry too) & I just found your channel ! What a pot of Gold! Keep throwing them out ! I started late in life ( had to raise a family) and I had all this exp and education in another field ? I walked away and grabbed my passion ! Finish Carpentry! I do crown but kitchens for me are bears and twice in 14 yrs I walked away ! Then I seen your kitchen crown video ! Problem solved ! This I will try it on my shed 1st ? How u like those Akibus bags ! They looked like that anyway! I wish I was close to u I would pay you to apprentice for you! Thanks buddy!
Thank you for the kind words! Cmon out to Michigan for a summer and we can build some stuff. Always have room on the crew. Yes those are akibus bags, love em. The speed buckle pinches my belly if I don’t where a shirt, which is often, short of that they are the best bags I’ve ever owned hands down.
@@Redoakcarpentry I own a trimmer set I designed thru Akibus (Luke). I am all in I hv my others in a box! I wear the suspenders and a pair of “Whites” Perry Mocktoe boots! I am on the 2nd set of soles on them (get about 8-10 months from 1 set of soles). It get so hot here (last two days 107 degrees) u can stroke out if your not careful & pace yourself! I tell guys all the time “U want to trim” ? Buy good tools that R accurate and tough! Then read, study the pros, take notes, learn to use a calculator for formulas ! Hey I don’t want to take up your time! I appreciate the channel and there are only two channels out there that do this ? 1. Inside Carpentry ; Spencer Lewis 2. Next Level Carpentry ; Matt Jackson That’s it ! All the rest is BS music and 100 x the speed where u don’t learn squat! My Name is Jim Duncan My business is “Kings Table Custom Finish Carpentry “ License #1060479
Cool. I figure the radius and cut the commons. Place a hip temporarily. Tape a carpenters pencil on the bottom of straight edge and slide the straight edge(keeping it square to commons) up the commons and scribe the hip. The thickness of the pencil is usually close to the drop amount. I don’t frame anymore, but I used to love doing stuff like this.. If you don’t have access to internet, a great formula for finding a radius is C squared divided by 8 h + H divided by 2. C is the cord of the segment and h is the longest measurement between the cord and arc.(height). Good stuff!
This is brilliant. I'll have watch this slowly, and over again and...then find a large piece of cardboard, very large at the recycling center to make my templates. Build the template, then add the flat 'roof' front and sides and trace the radius for the hip. Thank you for sorting this out. It's like, sort of, launching a ship.
Hey lad! I think the solution to not having to take an extra 3/8's off the length, is to actually take the height dimension of what would form the backing angle of the hip, off the vertical height of the stand up/seat cut. That would have allowed the whole hip to drop down vertically. It would look wrong at the back of the fascia/frame , but the height of the fascia, and the imaginary centre line of the hip would match. Where I'm from, everyone is too lazy to do backing angles, and reducing the vertical height to the birds mouth by the backing angle height is how we compensate for the geometry. I imagine that this would have solved this problem for you, without throwing the hip into a slightly incorrect angle.
Hey brother, I considered this as well, and I’m accustomed to “dropping” the hip the same vertical amount as the backing angle in order to get a “non-backed” hip into plane. However if consider that the slope is steeper at the top of the hip than at the bottom due to the curve. So what would “drop” it appropriately at the top, would drop it too dramatically at the bottom. Notice that it’s basically flush at the bottom. It’s more complicated than a straight slope backing angle issue. In a perfect world it would be a rolling backing angle that becomes less steep as it gets closer to the bottom. I’m not sure why this issue isn’t really discussed in any of the literature. If I were to install that hip without the adjustment, use a straight edge on top of the commons to project and scribe a line on the side of the hip, it would fade into nothing at the bottom. You follow what I’m saying?
Nice tutorial! Thanks. I'm getting ready to build one over my side door and this was helpful. I've only ever helped do one before and we basically just scribed the hip rafter by setting it in place uncut and then sliding a long piece of wood, with a pencil attached to the end of it, down the curve of the front rafters. It worked pretty good and didn't require any complicated measurement transfer like you were doing. And it let you to adjust the length of your hip rafter Before the curve is cut, which gives you a very accurate curve. As for the backing angle... You can just leave it long and then shave down the high edges so that it creates a point on the top of the curve that matches the one where the front and side rafters meet at the top and then it dissipates and flattens out as you move toward the bottom of the curve. That way your roof deck meets on the ridge point and sits solid against wood instead of having a gap behind it. Only takes a couple minutes with a plane. Or a belt sander also works good.
Thank you for the comment! Yeah I’ve done that as well. After 25 years I find more pleasure in trying to understand the geometry of these scenarios than just knowing a functional way to produce the product. I’ve put together a lot of complicated shit in the past with scribing and guess and check methods, often that’s the fastest way. Good luck on your project!
Traditionally, or originally. The type of roof you’re building. Was made from raw tree branches. Plained down to shape. From the curve of an oak tree branch. The branches were steam bent or dried into shape. A good saw mill would have had these curved rafters on hand. Since it was a common shape used in caravel boat building as well as victorian roof construction.
Then 1x4's or 1x2's stick sheathing yeah? Thats what we used to stay with the contour of the curves in the roof framing and it worked out for us. Idk if the roofers shingled it or copper tin roofed it we just framed it on one of th houses we framed.
That is a good idea to draw it out, but for me it's so much faster to throw in my commons, then tape a pencil to a damn 1x2, scribing the hip onto an 8/17 2x10 cut like a regular hip.
For sure, I would probably do something similar 9/10 times. However there’s occasions when it’s useful to understand what’s happening. I’m with you tho, it’s rough framing lol I cut corners every day.
If i did this id have a ledger. Is there a reason not to? How did you secure it? Great work btw. Im still stuck on scribing in my hip. Need to rewatch and wrap my head around your technique
I always make sure you have 3 1/2 " height at the plate, it also matters what's going on the gable behind it brick or rock or siding that determine the ridge width Good video tho
Good question! The maximum sagitta (sag), for this use case, is approximately 8.96 inches. Anything beyond that value will break the "aesthetics" of the curve. You can verify this by solving a quadratic equation for the sag and taking the smaller of the two results. A sag of 6" produces a perfect integer radius of 42 inches. For this use case, the radius simplifies to R = (234 ∕ H) + (H ∕ 2) where H is the sag and 234 is (24² + 36²) ÷ 8.
Cool... I was thinking.. You could have an architect draft up a printable layout program with a model that allows you to plug in your raw digits and print out the whole template package.. Sell to the industry or. Make available open source.. That way all the little factors could are ironed out with the CAD FIRST.. Thanks for sharing
That was my solution as well after 23 years, I think in Solidworks. However, I need electricity. He could do this in the middle of a forest. so I really enjoyed watching him figure it out in "The WIld"
The reason u had to cut some off of ur hips is cuz an 8/12 is not the same as as an 8/12 hip and valley if u look at your speed square great example of something us carpenters have to deal with sometimes on a daily good work bud
Yeah brother thank you for your comment, however I’m super familiar with the difference between a hip and a common, that’s not the issue at all. The rafter is a hip. It’s a issue of determining backing angles on a curved slope, which is a more complicated problem than just backing a hip. Do you know how to determine backing angles?
@@Redoakcarpentry never built one but looked fun I love challenges like these we are fortunate in this day and age to have computers in our pockets so I'm sure with a little research I could figure it out as u did
I think you could have done it on a 8/17 with the 6 inch arch and did the radius. I am not perfectly sure because I am just laying in bed and haven’t cut a roof in, in about 12 years
You can absolutely do a similar maneuver. The hip is never going to be a true radius, it’s going to be an ellipse. But for the sake of being productive it’s possible to just cheat. You have to do a larger radius for thd hip, one that’s closer to the actual ellipse. I’ve also just cut the rafter and scribed it, and figured the curve to it that way. super easy and quick. I do like to understand the technically correct way, even tho it’s not always practical to do it.
Years ago i framed a very large bell for a gazebo. 3x12 actual timbers that would be exposed underneath. What a pain. We did it the same way, plotted it on the floor. So much work. The backing angle actually varies along the hip as well as you move from concave to convex. Thankfully never did another.
@@daversj I know right!? I have been looking for a good resource on the backing angle issue, I didn’t back my hips here, but I had to fudge it a bit to deal with the backing angle issue, it would be way worse with 3” material. How did you go about plotting the backing? Any resources on that?
