So #5 actually happened to me and now it’s hard to like tell people why without like telling everyone why. Any tips on how to tell people that you ministered or fellowshipped with why you left without telling everything?
I’ve had to leave a number of churches. I must live in a bad area spiritually, but at any rate, you can tell people that you believe the Holy Spirit was leading you out. No further explanation is needed. If someone pushes you for more, you tell them that is your only answer and if they want more information they need to talk to God about it themselves. They are either a spy, or they are on a pathway out as well.
I told people at the church I was leaving for personnal reasons. Do not tell them why, they will come after you with a vegence, the likes you have never seen.
I just want to say, first, I am so sorry- and I agree with the other comment, just say personal reasons and let God handle it... the good news is, the longer that you're away from that situation, the easier it will get. Praying that you found a new church home too!
I told them why. At first was all the blood thirsty oaths as a Christian I had taken. After years studying what freemasonry is at its roots. The occult connection. Google it yourself. I have been warned many times. I had my own tracts printed to pass along at lodges and churches. I still do this.
#1 red flag for me is people/churches who persecute people that don’t believe like them…and then call themselves a victim of said persecuted people. Always leads to more red flags.
If leaders cover up, make excuses for, or minimalize sexual abuse enabling the abuser to get off with just saying "I'm sorry" but not major discipline then you need to leave the church. Also being spiritually abused through manipulation and gaslighting taking advantage of your loyalty and good nature is a huge red flag.
I feel like I need to make another video on this- I am just so naive sometimes and forget that sexual abuse does happen in church- which is horrible and wrong and we need to do better... and spiritual manipulation is a terrible problem in so many of our churches... you're so right... and I think I missed 2 major red flags
"Of course...there's the elephant in the room..MERCURY: It's not great stuff!" Same goes for anything that hijacks the quest line/sensors of your own body of the body of your children or loves ones. Sexual Abuse...It's not great stuff! (TM.) Don't be in a church that leaves you in the dark about an event that left you in the dark.
I left my church after 20 years of attendance/membership. I was saved in that church, baptised in the Holy Spirit and in water. (I didn't know anything about doctrine when I first started attending). I was quite idealistic about the church environment in the beginning, but I didn't expect perfection in the church. I naively believed that everything that came from the pulpit was the gospel truth. I served in the hospitality ministry and was prominent in the weekly church prayer meeting. My disconnection was a process which took years and was not painless. I can identify with some of the red flags that you have indicated. I became increasingly disillusioned as some of what was being preached was not the gospel. I think you can ruin a sermon with one or two false statements. There was also an unhealthy subtle aspect of manipulation and control, I often thought that the senior pastor was put on a pedestal. Sunday sermons eventually became a test of endurance, and I often left feeling frustrated and angry. I now attend a different church where the preaching is focused and relevant. As I said I don't expect perfection, but when the same untruths keep regularly popping up, then for me that is a big red flag.
Ooooooof. Conviction!!!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 I used to change church like underwear 😢 I've always wanted to be what I hoped to find in the church: open and authentic. Unfortunately I was met, a lot, with people who saw openness and authenticity as crazy. Many were playing church, and they believed if you are experiencing hardships, then you are in sin and God is mad at you!!!! I was in an abusive marriage and when I tried to talk to church family/leadership about it, I was met with: are you giving him enough __x? Are you cooking dinners on time? Are you submitting enough to him? Then: pray harder, don't nag, read the Bible more, etc. Oh, man.
Reading the Bible and cooking dinner is never going to stop the abuse. The abuse is The abusers problem. They are just projecting their issues on you. I think it's extremely disappointing the way churches deal with abuse especially in marriages.
My ex pastor used to lie by omission all the time to me. Absolutely used and abused me by manipulating me in ministry, it was so subtle and yet eventually completely undeniable. You cannot reason with such people
these issues all have one thing in common: layers of man-made control here are some of the best safeguards: -KNOW your Scripture (a deep, rich, growing, refining, transforming, perfecting understanding of all Scripture is part of the glorious inheritance in Christ) -consider the sufferings of the early church (in particular, those of Paul, whose apostleship sits as the anchor for church among the gentiles) -understand the difference between the New and Old Covenants ... in particular, understand that the Old Covenant has been cancelled -understand Grace and Law and the relationship of the two -understand that you are not UNDER law ... rather, the Law is now your kind advisor (because you are in Christ)
This includes not offering a tithe. Tithing is not actually biblical. In the old Testament people had to offer tithes for the temple Service. In the new Testament, people give what they can but it doesn't have to be exactly 10% of their income. It doesn't even have to be money. Biblically speaking, we are to give cheerfully knowing that God will use our giving for a greater purpose for other people and sometimes ourselves. we are to give without expecting anything in return. giving is voluntary, so we don't have to do it.
I have known of more than one pastor who, on more than one occasion, has had affairs with members in their congregation to only be transferred to another church when found out. I have see pastors admit to being addicted to porn while serving in the pulpit to only be transferred to a bigger congregation when found out. I have seen U.S. military chaplains have affairs on deployments to only be promoted and awarded by both the military and their particular denomination for their bad behavior. All the while i was consistently told I did not qualify for christian ministry even after completing a bachelors degree and a masters degree and the course of study for that particular denomination. And the American Christian Church wonders why people are leaving the church in mass.
What happens if you discover something about your church after being there for 2 years and it fundamentally changes what you understand about the teachings? I was told recently by a junior pastor that the church is “seeker-sensitive” and I need to be mindful about not discussing certain things.
Oh, yes! The accolades are there! I've been to churches where the pastor is named for a street, a baseball park, an annex building, a sanctuary. And yes, I've been to the ribbon cutting ceremony.
I met a lady who was a CNA and was doing a lot of good deeds. She opened her home on Friday nights for Bible study and prayer so I went there as she was inviting more people. Then I told my Jewish friend to come also. Then Covid hit so I could not go. However, when I returned, this lady who isn’t Jewish was telling people she was. She started buying and constantly giving my Jewish friend gifts. My friend is disabled and easily manipulated so I asked this lady to stop trying to buy my friend and she said no because it’s ministry. I told them that was causing a painful situation with my friend. Then they started going out to eat without inviting me and I asked them to include me but they continued only inviting my friend. This lady then told me everyone there was Jewish but they aren’t. She further astonished me by saying Jesus is not the Son of God, He’s a created being like an angel. So I said He claimed multiple times that He is. She then told me that the New Testament isn’t accurate and those verses were added later. I stopped going but my Jewish friend is still talking with and going to eat with this lady. I’m extremely upset and feel deceived and hurt.
Pray for wisdom and discernment, pray for your Jewish friend that her eyes are opened to this deception, and keep in touch with her, don’t cut off ties and hopefully she will come to realize she’s being manipulated. But definitely pray for her and for yourself that you can be a steadfast believer and friend.
praying for you- this is a hard situation, praying that you receive peace and comfort and agree with the earlier comment, praying for wisdom and discernment as well
what if the pastor is preaching about money way more and tithing 10% and the pastor bought a home that cost $800,000 to a little over a million dollars?
So tough to know which advice to follow when it comes to finding a good church and leaving a church. I've been following advice from Christians on RU-vid on leaving a church that uses females as pastors because it violates scripture. Other advice I've heard is to avoid churches that play worship music by Bethel, Hillsong, Elevation, or Maverick City Music. Also, I've heard to avoid churches that have pastors that associate or connect themselves with prosperity Gospel Teachers. I know these RU-vid videos on people giving their warnings on churches to avoid, but with the criteria they give makes it very hard to find any Christian church that would pass the "test."
First, I will graciously overlook the rude tone of your comment, let’s both assume that we’re all reading our Bible and that we both love God. Second, I have addressed this in other comments- I’m not saying Baptism isn’t important- it is, I encourage all believers to follow their profession of faith in believer’s baptism. However, the question is, is it absolutely necessary for salvation… and Jesus tells the thief on the cross that he would be with Him in paradise… how is that possible? Did the Romans stop the crucifixion so that Jesus could baptize the thief. Also, baptism is a work, it’s something you do; and salvation is a free gift lest any man boast. I have several scriptures and examples that back my interpretation of this topic- which is why I believe what I believe. I am also humble enough to know that I’m a human and can possibly be wrong. If you have multiple scriptures and can provide an explanation of the two points above that I’ve addressed, I’d be happy to have a discussion with you about it. And again, I’m in no way saying baptism isn’t very important for a believer- I’ve been baptized, my children both followed their profession of faith with baptisms… the statement was, it’s not necessary for salvation. Meaning, if a person accepts Jesus at my church, we don’t have to run and find a creek or pond to baptize them to get their profession to stick- they’ve believed with their heart and confessed with their mouth… they should follow in believer’s baptism, but if they die before they can get baptized, they’re still saved, according to my interpretation of the Bible.
What about when Jesus Christ prophesied to the Samaritans on the mound it states in Scripture the spoken word of God that they were instantly filled with the holy Spirit but baptism is a sign of your testimony confession publicly that Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior however if you repent and confess and you are truly repentance in your heart he will be with you in heaven by your faith Jesus Christ you are saved
Number 4 is the one that sits strong in the church i was going to. Pastor says he is a non confrontational pastor. This one family has caused numerous other families to leave.
Some people find this controversial for some reason but I follow Jesus not any one denominations he said we are the church all of us and people are going to interrupt the scriptures differently we are human where the problem comes in is people condemning others for not believing exactly the same thing as them and worse treating people badly for it. I alway think how would Jesus act in this situation and he was always kind, accepting and hung out with sinners and people of other cultures. The thing he didn't tolerate was misuse of God's word to gain power or money. When people where using the temple as a marketplace he lost it when the Pharisees where twisting the word to act elitist and shun people instead of helping them Jesus had harsh words to say. When Jesus died the curtain in the temple tore and God left signifying he isn't in one place anymore he lives in all of us we are the temple now and we can visit him whenever we want. The purpose of a church as we know it today isn't evil or wrong but it's more of a way to fellowship, discuss scripture and I really think should include eating together as Jesus always did with his followers. But we should never just accept everything the preacher is saying without checking it out ourselves cause unfortunately some people have agendas or biases that cause them to interpret the Bible in a way that suits them instead of a way that's true
I observed all five of these red flags and then some in the last church I attended. It took me eight years to see all of these and some of these I should have seen right when he was interviewed for the position. There is one more red flag that you haven't mentioned; the church leadership having a network of informants to the pastor so that anything you say goes immediately back to him. This was the straw that compelled me to finally leave after ten years of all the rest.
@@panga_latrice It is very difficult to leave an abusive situation. I have seen it in marriage relationships as well. The abused doesn't know quite how to leave or have been told that bad things will happen if they leave the relationship. The same is true in a church. It takes a great amount of courage to leave but leave if you can otherwise you will lose all trust of any church leadership. Not all are that way.
The 2 young pastors of our Anglican Church are pushing the gay and transgender activism. In addition to declaring pronouns, they now have ceremonies similar to baptisms they can perform for people who are going to have gender reassignment surgery. We asked if they approved of children being involved in this and they didn’t know. Their exact words were “in order for me to grow in Jesus I need to affirm and provide hospitality” to everyone. My husband and I love everyone and accept everyone into the church, however, are we not supposed to be working on repenting our sins and not repeating them? Their stance is that God said to love everyone. One of the parishioners believes the Bible was written a long time ago so it’s ok to rework God’s message to fit in the issues of the day. We have spoken to all 3 pastors and have decided to leave and go to a split-off of the church that does not promote gay and transgender agendas. Instead they welcome them with the intent of helping them learn God’s word and lead them to a Godly life.
I didnt feel the Holy Spirit in the house of God. I heard so many elders gossip and say the most horrible things about other church members and watch them smile in their faces two mins later. It was the same with the youth.The youth was really clicky kinda like a 90s high school movie. The pastor would openly mock and make fun of the pentecostal religion. Many things taught i didnt find in line with my beliefs but i was ok to disagree it was the coldness the lack of openness on the topics that didnt sit well with my soul. The pastor would go.out of his way to tell my youngest son how there is something speacial about him and how he saw him doing great things. My son thought the world of the pastor until one day in the hall he overheard the pastor feed the same script to another child word for word. It broke his spirits and he didnt open up about it for weeks. During those week i watch my very egar to worship son disconnect from all things religion. If you arent tithing your stealing from the Lord was often mentioned. He would often throw his opinion in to his teaching. He said one day, i think if you're wearing sports logos to.church you are causing division in the church and continued to proceed and say unless its ohio state. His sports team to turn it into a joke. If as grown people we are divided by sports i dont think the person wearing the logo is the problem it you and your heart. Id get anxiety going in and would often drop my kids off for sunday school and sit in the car bc i didnt feel right in there. The final time i went the pastor said if you were once a member of this church and decided to switch churches you were never really a member of this church. I got goosebumps and knew i was never truly a member of bethel babtist and that there was something wrong with these teachings.
5 points discussed are very true. So, the pastors are the real problem in churches today. Very sad because the problem is happening globally. The devil and his cohorts infiltrated the churches.
Well Baptism seems to have been the initiation rite for the early church. In Acts, in Paul's letters. And Jesus' Great commission at the end of Matthew..
What if the feuding has nothing to do with me? I’m in my husbands church from childhood. I want to know the lord. I want to learn. This church is full of sarcastic women feuding over nothing, peacemaking has been rejected. We just lost our pastor too. My best friends are doing exciting things in their church and I’m just feeling so…idk. On the other hand, I don’t want to make it easy for the devil to destroy a church.
Don't you believe we can be more believable if we don't say..." I feel..." Feelings are not facts, feelings are not dependable..."beliefs" from scripture is more believable....
*slowly raises hand- I regularly fall on my sword and tell people I’m wrong- I believe in being authentic and honest about my shortcomings, I’m sorry you haven’t met a pastor that wasn’t arrogant- they are out there, I have several pastor buddies I’d say are humble and authentic as well
#1 reason I will not join a church is if I sense some pride in the pastor. Pride has no place in the Christian life and I think if you want to be a purveyor of God's truth and teach good Bereans, you MUST be humble. All that to say, obviously there are lots of great humble pastors that welcome being challenged or questioned. They know they are fallible humans and may be wrong on something. Also, they don't have all the answers to everything. They must be willing to say "I don't know," "now that's a controversial issue, my stance is ____". They should welcome and be encouraged by someone in their congregation searching out the Scriptures and looking for answers.
here is a red flag from a local church right here in town ... on their web-site, they ADD this to their "beliefs" section: Holiness: We Believe that the Christian is to live a righteous, pure and holy life; that he is called to be a witness for Christ; that he is to be faithful in attending his church; AND THAT HE IS TO SUPPORT HIS CHURCH BY HIS TITHES AND OFFERINGS they are pushing into making tithe DOCTRINAL. that ALONE is a problem as it becomes hierarchical and coercive and can be used to slaughter those who don't comply. at the very least they are saying you aren't holy if you don't tithe and have license to create a black sheep. are poor people who make $25K a year expected to cought up $2500 a year when they are lucky just to save a few hundred a year? fact check: pastor's home valued at $779K ... ooooh, thats nice!!!! quick comparison: median home value in area = $508K ratio: 1.53 ever go to the bank for a home loan? first question: what's your salary? if the home is valued more than 3.5x your salary they pretty much won't give you a loan for that home. to be fair, when he purchased it, it was valued at $480K ... let's do some math shall, we? 480K / 3.5 = $137K but to be "fair" to the other side, that was in 2016 ... extend to today's dollars (i'm going to go with 3%, and given the huge inflation there for a couple years, i think that's more than fair): $137K x (1.03)^8 = $173K NICE, DON'T YOU THINK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that $173K is MINIMUM if that isn't the prototype definition of being hierarchically propped up, i don't know what is the only reason he's there is all those people with incomes well below his pumping dollars at him in perpetuity could one make an argument that, if he really loved Christ, he would get paid $100K and send $73K to orphans/widows/poor? you betcha! ever read this verse: 2 cor 8:9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. is this man closer to the pharoah end of the spectrum or the Jesus end? meanwhile there are single moms just down the road living in a trailer home working 2-3 jobs just to give their children a fighting chance at escaping human traffickers ... maybe we should coerce them into going to this man's church, pump even more dollars at him (i don't know, maybe so he can have a nice deck or patio added to his home) and they can go even deeper into poverty ... then, when they are finally kicked out on the street, let's march them down to the pastor's home, show him the new features on his beautiful home, and announce that "thanks to you he was able to add this! isn't Jesus wonderful?" sound good? but remember, DOCTRINALLY, he has every right to such a standard of living ... and when that single mom hears about the pastor enjoying that standard of living in perpetuity, not worried about how HIS bills get paid or HIS retirement works out, protected in the law of large numbers, while she struggles in tears, she just wants to come to Jesus right now, right? these men will tell you "God has blessed me for preaching the Gospel" or some similar line ... i guess God cursed Paul for preaching the Gospel (in chains in Christ, beaten, homeless, persecuted, reviled, despised, poor) ... you decide ... if you can come up with ONE SAINT in the NT, named by name and given as an example to follow where God pampered them on the socioeconomic level from ministry money, please name him (or her) ... yeah, i hear radio silence, don't you? this is a man who is using church to pamper HIMSELF, a sign of deep immaturity and a constant expression of the adamic nature hiding behind churchiness, some technically accurate preaching and so forth ... it shows total contempt for the sufferings and sacrifices of the early church fathers and is borderline on trampling the cross of Christ under foot i'm astounded how stuff like this goes on in plain sight ... no wonder the church in america is so anemic! ever see this Scripture: eph 1: Therefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, do not cease to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers: that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give to you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Him, the eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that you may know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, and WHAT IS THE EXCEEDING GREATNESS OF HIS POWER TOWARD US WHO BELIEVE, according to the working of His mighty power ... think about it: written from chains in Christ ... men who fair sumptuously don't think like this!!!!!
You can't make the perfect church on Earth and you won't find it anywhere. If you can prove me wrong and find this church DO NOT JOIN IT!!! If you do you will spoil it!!!
Well, I'll take that challenge that baptism is how you enter into the Kingdom of God, the fellowship of Christ and His body, the church, on earth. John 3:3,5 Jesus teaches one must be born again, born of water and spirit, or one cannot see or enter in. Jesus proclaims in John 4:23-24 that true worshipers will worship in Spirit and in Truth. In Acts 2: 47 we learn the early followers of "The Way" praised God and each day the Lord added to their numbers. They were worshipping in truth, knowing Christ as Lord and Savior Acts 2:36, and in Spirit, having been baptized and given the Spirit of Reconcilation in Acts 2:38. How did God do that? Acts 2:41-42 describes 3000 people being baptized and being like a family to each other. God's newborn, new life in Christ family. Romans 6:3-4. One must be baptized to see the Kingdom of God. One must be washed in the blood of Jesus to be reconciled and that is how God is at peace with us, or we deserve His wrath., his justice, the wages for our sin, death. Thank God through baptism, he takes our place. So be it. The Church you choose should have a leadership structure. It should have elders. It should have pastors. It should cast lots to choose leadership if someone dies to replace them. Also, there should be no women pastors. Why? Because that is the example set in the scriptures and the command of the Lord through His chosen Apostle. Women should be silent in all the churches of God in Christ. Trust the scriptures. They come from God. Lean not on your own understanding. American feminism is not Godly. It leads to all kinds of evil. The Scriptures are the source of authority, not just a preacher, nor yourself. Yes, be humble. Relationship conflicts certainly are a major red flag. Iron sharpening iron does not mean conflict, and sparks flying. Iron sharpening Iron is a training process, a discipline to learn how to properly use the Word of God. It is a meticulously done thing and proceeds not from forced conflict. Most of your points I liked overall. Thanks for sharing.
First- the water birth is referring to your physical birth- not baptism… second… women can be leaders in church- Paul references several women leaders as well as Jesus revealed himself as the messiah to the Samaritan woman at the well… and she was the first to go and tell people… really you should just watch my video on it… or, NT wright is a fabulous theologian and explains it far better than me anyway… I am with you on the church having multiple leaders and not just one person in charge… that was certainly the model used in the early churches and one we should bring back… as far as baptism being a part of salvation, that can’t possibly be as salvation is a free gift and not by works… see Romans, Paul explains that very well… honestly just substitute baptism where you see circumcision- now that isn’t to say that baptism isn’t important, of course it is, Jesus was baptized… but Jesus also told the thief on the cross that he would see him in heaven… so, while baptism is important, its belief and confession that Jesus is your savior that saves you
@melvinaprilify - Yikes. Paul is not the only authoritative writer on baptism. John, Mathew, Luke, Mark, have a few things to say along with Peter. You said something in the opening on this video that you didn't "feel" that baptism is required. Our feelings are not to be relied on. The heart above all is decietful. Our emotions are not equatable to the truth. That , going by feelings, is what it means to lean on your understanding. Should the faith always be comfortable? Will it always "feel" good? Learning suffering and humility come at a cost. Roman crosses, used for execution, last I checked, are pretty rough. Jesus commands you and I to take ours up. I have heard your understanding of John 3 to mean the natural birth, but that is the epitome of eisegesis. Jesus was not speaking of natural birth, Nicodemus's question to Jesus should be a dead ringer that he was not speaking of natural birth, but birth from above. Clearly, ole Nic did not understand the analogy of being born again. How can one be born a 2nd time when he is old? Who isn't already born that could hear and have the seed of the message of the gospel heard and it take root? His words are Spirit. We must be born again, washed, killing our old sinful self with Christ and raised out of the waters of baptism to new life. Romans 6:1-4. Paul teaches baptism is the beginning of that new life in Christ. The exact same as Peter.....Romans 6:6 Peter teaches us that baptism saves us by the resurrection of Jesus and compares the waters of baptism to the flood of Noah. The flood of Noah teaches us that all sinful flesh died under the waters of the flood that emmersed the sinful world. As our old sinful self goes under the water, it dies in the flood. Christ's Spirit, hovering above the waters, as in creation, as Noah's family saved in the ark above, greets us as a new creation, indwelling us reconciled and at peace with God. A good conscience. Peter calls this an anti-type. What once brought death, now brings life. 1Pet 3:18-21 Acts 22:16. What are you waiting for? Women "leaders" are not the same as pastoral roles. Sure , women can share their faith. By all means! But put down that fruit of elder. Those are mens roles. Men must take those roles , and if there aren't men available or willing, you ladies should be praying to God to provide them. The Scriptures do not teach a woman to have any authority over men. In any capacity in church leadership. The Head of Christ is God. The head of man is Christ, and the head of woman, man. That is the order of things. Remember, this might hurt your feelings, perhaps your religious pride. But lean not on your understanding. Trust God's word above all else.
You shouldn’t be in a brick and mortar institutional “church” with a professional paid clergy to begin with. It’s unbiblical! You are the church. Fellowship amongst yourselves and carry the gospel in your daily living.
Not sure where you are reading in the Bible where be baptism is not a qualification for salvation. It says in the Bible we must be baptized in Jesus name.
I believe at that time the thief did not have an option to get baptized so that is why that was said of Jesus but it one has that option then it is biblical to be baptized
The church is not a building. The church is our true believers in Christ. That's the church it doesn't mean a building or go to a building or that type of thing. God didn't offer us religion he gave us a personal relationship in Jesus Christ. Also remember Jesus said there's only one way not 10 million different religions😢😮 I do not believe in any religion but I do believe Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior. Not man-made religion.
Well, then I guess every church is in violation, because every single church has a female teaching something… you should watch my video on Thursday where I explore and provide context to that verse and topic
You do need to repent , be baptized , so your sins would be forgiven and only than ! You receive the gift of Holy Spirit ! Read your Bible , all of it . Don't take only parts of it .
Listen- I hear that you are passionate about the Word of God, and that's very admirable. But- I am also passionate about the Word, and I have read the Bible, and I also believe that it's important to take in all of the Bible. I think you may be missing the parts where we're commanded to love one another- your comment doesn't seem very loving or kind to me. In fact, what would be far kinder would be to email me directly and have a discussion about this point rather than make a rude comment on a video that I made 2 years ago. Also, I admittedly do not profess to be a Biblical scholar by any means and I'm also willing to admit that I am capable of being wrong. Actually one of the best things about being a Christian is for the community of Christians to help uplift and edify each other as we do study and try to understand this very complex text that we were given by our infinite and incomprehensible God. Finally, as we're discussing this topic on Baptism- 2 things... one, how could Jesus tell the thief that he would be with Him in paradise? Was the thief already baptized and did Jesus know that? Two, isn't baptism a work? Paul spent a lot of time talking about the dangers of equating work as necessary to salvation and that salvation is a free gift. If my salvation is dependent on me being baptized, that seems to suggest that I have work to do in order to receive salvation which seems contrary to all the other scriptures in the New Testament. What you are your thoughts on this? Can we discuss this with kindness and grace for one another as fellow believers and sisters in Christ?
@@melvinaprilifyIs there a way to email you? I couldn’t find one on RU-vid and unfortunately I don’t have a Facebook account so the link to your Facebook group wouldn’t open for me. I would love to discuss your video with you more, if that’s alright with you. I’ve been trying to make this decision for months but not able to discuss it with members of the church without them getting defensive.
3:00 Baptism in the Spirit is a requirement for membership and salvation. "He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit," (Tit 3:5) "Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him." (Rom 8.9) "For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father. 19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God." (Eph 2:18-19) So if one is a Lutheran or a Catholic, their belief is that water baptism = spiritual baptism, then yes water baptism becomes a requirement for membership and salvation.
@@chriscosby2459 nothing- it’s just funny to comment on a Christian RU-vid channel when you seem to not believe it… I do appreciate the comment and the chuckle
Other than the basic gospel salvation message there is a lot more false teaching in the church that is leading people astray including new age ideas, prosperity gospel which to me are huge red flags.
I'm 24 working on a minimum wage full time job and living separately from my parents since I'm 19 because they didn't get social benefits for me from government (Northern Europe) after I turned 18 , it's the for my younger sister now she doesn't bring anything so she's seen as worthless although she has the upper hand and shuts him down when he starts bullshit given that her personality is much stronger . My 48 years old violent , covetous , deceptive and malignent father is a non diagnosed narcissistic pervert and he belongs to the prosperity theology he always says very hurtful things about me especially that every "believer in Christ" in his congregation sees that I'm doomed and hated by God due to being a lower middle-class young woman and that God hates me so much ( for not submitting to him and letting him enslave and mistreat me as he wishes ) that God will punish me and that I'll be dead by 40 after agonizing in a harsh condition of material and psychological misery through the punishment of the Lord who considers him as the " elected one in the family " 🤮🤮🤮What kind of father can wish this to his children ? As a result I'm permanently disgusted by this cult and anything related to pentecostalism 😑😑😑😑
Sadly I left my home church because of all the divisions that was happening due to gossip that wasn't being resolved. Also I left because some people tried to get rid of our first pastor. But he died in 2016. Then our second pastor left because of controlling people who always challenged our pastor and always wanted things their way. I was controlled, gaslighted, and abused constantly by that church. Now I am praying and asking God to help me find a church that God wants me to be in.
Lots of real flags in there, but I don't think questioning the pastor is bad. A pastor is just a person. They don't have direct messaging from God, and aren't infallible. If I had a church where I couldn't disagree with the pastor, I'd be gone.
Membership, tithing, dedication of babies, women teaching /pastors, trick or trunk😢 . Feel good watered down message, served with great coffee and plenty of activities.
Single women - if the married pastor shows a sexual interest in you, and/or touches you in a sexual way, no matter how 'insignificant' it seems - it's time to get out.
No 5 is truely the biggest red flag especially when it comes from the mouth of a leader and used to manipulate or make a church member feel guilty for brining a legitimate concern to the leadership's attention.
Excellent 5 flags. I've been a believer for over 30 years and I've witnessed all of this. Currently at a church that is not perfect, because there are people in it, however it's healthy! Thank you April.
Human weakness of gossip and bad mouthing come in any size group overwhelming real issues such as biblical issues and all,religious needs--control comes from the pulpit
I needed this video!! We are in the process of leaving a church and I have had some doubts about doing this. I really hate it because we love the people there. As I listened to this I realize that the first four of your reasons are exactly what is happening. #4 issue, we have seen others told to not come back because of some talent/gift they have attempted to use that the pastor doesn't like. He is a one man staff. He doesn't see the need for deacon/elders. No accountability!! We have toured for 30 years as musicians and are not able to be used because the pastor does not like our Southern Gospel style. He calls it show off/hypocritical. There are several other areas I have tried to get involved and have been shut down ETC. For instance, We had no usher staff so I tried to get one going. I received a letter stating, "This is the way we want you to do this". His way or the highway. Fortunately God is using us in other churches now where praise team or pastor is off. Nuff said!!
it seems like that there are churches/church goers that don't want you there. i didn't go to church until i was a teenager. the first church should have put a sign on the building KIDS NOT WANTED HERE. the next church i left due to gossip . those 2 churches no longer exist. the next church would judge you based on your career/income.
So I'm a wandering Bishop, I take it upon myself to visit churches to see if they are corrupt or God fearing. The last church I visited was very loving and family oriented. But the so-called pastor, who was not ordained. Started telling me that I cheated becoming a Bishop and that he wanted me to go through his church's process to become as he said "a proper minister" even though I am already ordained and have been elected a Bishop by my holy counsel. The goal of this so-called pastor was to shame me and embarrass me into following his denomination. This is a huge toxic trait of churches these days of trying to fill as many seats as they can and gain control over the people that attend their church.
Respectfully, how does one become a wandering bishop? Genuinely curious as it is not a term I am familiar with. For full disclosure, I'm not entirely familiar with how someone become a bishop at all, but that seems more self evident than a wandering bishop.
There are actually a ton of verses on baptism... Acts 2:38, Romans 6: 3-4, Mark 16:16.... just to name a few... other than that, very insightful video.
Woooooh! #5! Seriously, we had a pastor once sit down with us for a Matthew 18 conflict conversation, to call US out for sin in a situation where he had directly lied to me (in an email conversation, so there was proof), and I had very gently responded with no, that was not the case. I remember being super nice about it, assuming he simply did not remember the conversation correctly, but because I dared to challenge what he had said, he met with us to tell me I was sinning by being insubordinate to his leadership. We stayed for nearly two years after that incident, but we learned to never challenge anything he ever said, right or wrong. When we did finally leave, my husband looked back at the day he sat us down in our living room for that conversation as the day we should’ve left that church. 😔 The only other things I would add to your list of red flags are pastors who compromise on sin issues, and those who are unable to take helpful criticism from staff serving beneath them. We had one pastor suggest we should’ve aborted our oldest (who was like 5 or 6 at the time), and another who defended the “benefits” of abortion 🤔 That plus, the number one thing we’ve learned from serving on staff at churches is, never ever ever, even suggest your pastor made a mistake, even unintentionally. Needless to say, we no longer serve on staff at any church; it’s a million times easier to be volunteers 😂😂😂
But this is where the pastor slips up and commits sin then. It's gods leadership we should be under, the pastor is there to help us understand God. Yes the pastor is a leader, but he doesn't have authority over God.
When he returns Jesus will judge everyone. Pastors included. But what you are saying about baptism is rather missleading. You don't seem to understand the bible. There are countless examples of believe and be baptised. 'Repent and be baptised everyone of you and you will receive the Holy Spirit' Acts2:38,Acts2:41 Matt:28:19 Jonn3:22. Baptism was a priority for those being added to the church.
This is called the spirit of Nicolaitanism, where the Pastor, Priest, or Bishop assumes an extraordinary control over the Laity or members of the Church.
I think my problem relates to honoring those in authority especially as it relates to church leadership. Even with those who aren't outwardly proud and self seeking, pastors don't want to hear anything negative about them or their churches even if it is constructive. For example, 4 of us in our church went to the pastor to discuss the importance of prayer for effective ministry. We had been praying together for an increase in the church but felt that more people needed to be praying, especially the church leadership. He assigned an assistant pastor to work with us to facilitate this but nothing really came of it. From then on, I always felt like he was giving me a cold shoulder. I had a similar response from another pastor who has a real gift of teaching but rarely made a call for salvation. There was one night I really felt conviction of the Holy Spirit after a powerful teaching but it just grieved my heart that we just went on to a closing song. God wants people getting saved!
I left my Church when my brain was at a capacity that no longer tolerated the utter BS rhetoric that Christians like to vocalise on an industrial scale. If that’s how everyone’s gonna talk in heaven then to me it sounds like hell. There’s something intrinsically false about being around people who converse in such a manner. There is something more real about living within a secular framework without all the hooey that goes along with being a component of the body of Christ.
I understand -- I try hard not to talk in "church" -- but it's a shame that you turned away from Christ -- it's not his fault. Jesus didn't call us to be religious but to be loving and faithful to God and to each other.
I read the Bible as often as I can and when I go to church, I listen to what's being said and I talk when I need to. I also don't treat Jesus Christ as a religion. To me, he is a personal relationship and to me he's God, he's God of this universe. So it's not his fault if churches screw up. He will be coming back to judge those wayward churches one day. whether you like to believe it or not, this is what I'm choosing to believe.
Most Churches are Socal Clubs 😉...I left the church I used to go to.... when I needed their help...they reneged on it.... People follow a Man...and they forget God and Jesus...the more...U look...it gets to be a socal club....now it is going g to a Rock concert...The Music is Horrible...😮.... today a Church is a Cult 😮... everytime U turn around someone is setting up a so called Church...The Money is the biggest problem.....The Leadership is always bringing U are issue...one way or another...I love the Lord....i left the Church world...now it is about prayer Bible and loving The Lord 😊
So, I accidentally stumbled on your video, and I want you to know , (I'm SURE you won't even read this,) 'cause you think you know it all, and we lowly people who read your posts, are not so smart, that is the way YOU come across. Now, about baptism, YES WE MUST BE BAPTISED... Have not you read the very LAST thing that Jesus said to His apostles before ascending back to the Father? In Matthew 28: 19-20 JESUS CHRIST SAID, " Go ye therefore and teach all nations, BAPTIZING them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, (KJV), also, byw, is the only version that still uses holy ghost...teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you:" end quote. How could someone who claims to be so smart and sit there and tell others how to worship and whatever else you do, MISS THIS?? This is literally the VERY LAST WORDS JESUS SPOKE ON EARTH....how is it that you haven't read this? Do you not also know that Jesus HIMSELF was baptized? Baptism is an outwardly way of showing inward change in us, change for the good and the holy bible speaks of baptism all through the New Testament. Also, in Acts 8: 26-40, Philip baptizes the Ethiopian eunuch in the desert. And I could write more, but, I find it very odd , to say the LEAST , that YOU, the wonderful person that God created you to be, could not believe in baptism...hummm I'll be waiting on your response, hope I don't die first, LOL
On Baptism being required for salvation- Jesus Christ said in Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved, but he who disbelieves will be condemned. Also we see in Acts 2:38 Peter says that baptism is for the forgiveness of sins. We can look at Acts 22:16 Ananias had come to Paul who had been praying for 3 days and he said "And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name." It is true the bible doesn't say "Join the church", but Acts 2:41 tells us after the people were baptized then they were added to the church. The Lord is the one who adds us to the church.
Baptism is a proclamation of faith; it is certainly not necessary for salvation, nor does it mean you are saved if you are baptized. Case in point; the thief on the cross who believed Jesus to be the son of God was not baptized yet he too was saved by faith alone.
“Climbing up on the cross”You staying with that and expecting people to stay with you here? 45 seconds and you lost me. Climbing up in the Cross, Lord help her.
We had a serious problem with another couple about 7 years ago and they went to every minister brother and sister and said my husband was trying to get romantically involved with his daughter and wife. This man called me yesterday and said he wants to go to church but he basically won’t go cause we are there
Wow...that happened to me at a job I had once, with me getting fired over the LIES that were spread about me. And yeah, I'd be outta there in a heartbeat!
I and my family were tossed out of a Methodist church. All elders were freemasons and oddfellows. Not the pastor. He let them control the church. The masonic lodge has occultism roots. Salvation by works also.
I have to say, first off, I am [so not] a fan of social media for many reasons! It condemns, word's are harshly misconstrued, and people can be very mean when they only know and / or view half the truth, but I had to respond, having listened to your video post! With that being said... I personally agreed with your points, all except the final red flag being, as you called it... "The icing on the cake!" In all honesty and being inclined to biblical truth, you did speak of Yeweh pastoring in the synagogue on the Sabbath, which is truth! But you failed to mention the "actual" day of serving our Sovereign Creator, which is ON the Sabbath. In my opinion, that should have been not only the icing on the cake, but a DEFINITE RED FLAG! Please note that this is all in good taste when preaching and studying biblical "TRUTH" no matter how painful it can be! And our pain is not even close to what our Savior died on the cross for in terms of [HIS] glory and the shedding of blood. Please let me know what you think, for I am prayerfully curious! We continue to condemn our very existence when not delving deep enough into those 66 books! Shalom!
I guess I’m not entirely sure what you are asking? My fifth point was about someone in leadership lying- not necessarily misspeaking a doctrine (listen, we’re all human, we all make mistakes- we’re doing our best, with our very finite minds, to try to understand our infinite and incomprehensible God); so I’m not even talking about that. I mean an actual lie, like the pastor said he did one thing and he actually did something else and just wanted to cover his backside (if you know what I mean). Our church leadership should have integrity. Now, we all misspeak and we all make mistakes, I’m not talking about that- I’m saying a bald faced lie… that is a red flag, in my opinion. And it’s a red flag because we need to be able to trust them to speak the truth of God (as best they can, they’re still human). I’m not really sure what you mean about the Sabbath. I’m sorry, could you explain it?
While we're on this topic about red flags in the church, it's totally necessary to add another red flag which is #6!!! Inappropriate touching of another church member! Starting back when I was 7 years old, some creepy "pastor" of a church (Eagles nest Christian fellowship) he started kissing me and I HATED IT!!! My parents didn't do anything! Fast forward going into my teenage years I was a victim of getting touched inappropriately by two women who happen to be in the ushers ministry at another church (Impacting Your world Christian Center) around 17 or 18 years old! In my younger adult years I got touched inappropriately by an Elder in another church (Brand New Life Christian Center) and also got touched inappropriately by the pastor's wife! (Crown of life ministries) the reasons why I left these crooked places of "worship" was because of all of the sick twisted individuals I've faced in all of the churches mentioned in this comment. Now in the present time, I'm at another church for the 88th time. (City Life Church) I want to leave this church too because the pastor's wife screwed up with me by not respecting my privacy when it come to telling another church member I don't know from a can of paint my personal details of where I work! I honestly was pissed at her for telling her my business when in fricking reality, IT WASN'T HER BUSINESS TO TELL IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!! 😒 At 40 years old, I should NOT have been disrespected like that in any way shape or form!!!! It's like who the hell should I trust? Because people who I've met in the church have really showed their true colors and as a chuch goer for many years off and on, I'm sick of it!!! I should resort to having church at home because people that I have encountered were/are shitty and it shows!!! I'm done fed up and the like!!!! SEXUAL HARASSMENT IN CHURCHES AND OUTSIDE OF CHURCHES IS NOT OKAY 😒 I DON'T CARE ABOUT WHAT TITLE 7:03 YOU HOLD NOR POSITION YOU ARE UNDER! IT'S NOT OKAY PERIOD!!!🤬
I am so so sorry- you are absolutely right- red flag 6 is this- and as someone who was also molested as a child (although not in church) this is one I'm disgusted we even have to think about happening in church. Jesus is very clear about how He feels about children, and we should be protective of them as well. I am so sorry you had to endure that at church, it is not okay. And for your latest experience, that is also incredibly frustrating. Please don't give up on church though. I know that sounds crazy for me to say- but there are some good ones out there, I promise. I am praying for you, and thank you for being brave enough to share this- we need to take this issue very seriously in church.
What about a pastor who uses the Chosen to try and get new church membership? I know the chosen is no good. My pastor has just let people go who leave because he plays clips in the service. I am having a very hard time with this. I think he just has misguided good intentions. Good video. You are a beauty by the way. God bless you 🙏🏻
Well to give you the most blasphemous scenes quickly, you have Matthew critiquing Jesus with the sermon on the mount. Jesus also has to "practice" what he's going to say. (Wow. Almighty GOD needs to rehearse. Lol. ) Read John 12:49. Second, Jesus tells the Pharasees He is the Law of Moses. That line is nowhere in the bIble. It is however found in the book of Mormon. 3Nephi 15:9. The desciples are portrayed incorrectly. They suggest that Peter is a gambler and an adulterer. (Not biblical) They say that Matthew is autistic. Really? And they all say John the Baptist is "Crazy John". Really? A man filled with the Holy Spirit bringing the greatest message in human history. Joseph says that Jesus sinned and Mary Magdeline gives John the verse in John 21:25. No guys, the Holy Spirit inspired John to write that. Those are just a few. The list goes on. It is long. The director Dallas Jenkins says in a video I saw that 90% of the show isn't biblically accurate. Wow. Why would any pastor use it then to present the Truth? Read 2nd Timothy 3-16,17 Jesus gives us a warning in Revelation 22:18 Do not add or take away from this book. The Chosen does both. Look into it. I do love my pastor. I just think he has misguided zeal using this show to attract new members. I was going to talk to him 🙂
I think you mean women… and I have a whole video address that misunderstood topic- you should watch that one, I think it clears a lot up in regards to women in leadership positions
I definitely don't take changing churches lightly at all. If there is any trouble in the church that I have to get away from, I do everything I can not to take similar issues to other churches. I don't go spreading around everything that's wrong. if somebody must know what happened at another church, I tell them in confidence, making sure they know everybody else doesn't find out. I also make sure the issue I'm leaving is actually very bad. It's not just an issue that I can disagree with peacefully.
For me, it was when I realized that I could not in good conscience invite anyone to our church any longer; new church, the first ones I invited came and stayed. And I see God-changed, formerly desperate lives on a regular basis now.
This was all so very helpful thank you god bless you sister for me i just want the truth and to live my life untoo the aduance of one as iam god fearing woman pls pray for me for more wisdom thank you elsine
Well, Sister, you haven’t gotten to the five red flags yet bless God, but I’ve been struggling for almost a good seven or eight months about leaving the church and I’m in leader ship. There’s a lot of issues going on. It’s just I’m not finding scriptural or common sense business for I’m not being critical. I’m praying diligentlyand it’s just time for me to leave my church and that’s what God put on my heart to Ministry in the streets and possibly a street church. OK back to your commentary in five flags thank you for your message. God bless you.
One time I visited a close friends church. She has a God given _beautiful_ voice and this church doesn't allow women to sing on the worship team 😳 So, I emailed the pastor and asked him to share what His church's doctrin and beliefs were and he dodged my questions and then told me to continue to attend and I would "find out" what kind of pastor he was. 🤦🏻♀️ Huge red flag for me. I didn't return, my friend is still attending and she is incredibly hyper-religious. Cutting out anything secular, no makeup, no using her voice, submissive way too much and one day I posted a meme about self love and self healing, she commented underneath, adding glory to God. It felt shaming, like she was upset I didn't post something that *didn't* include God. I love our Creator but I don't think He's an egomaniac that needs to be given credit every single time I open my mouth or post something on social media. 😢 I used to be like this but I've grown and healed a lot over the years within my relationship with God. I'm so tired of Churchs pushing this idea that we are all pieces of crap that don't deserve God's love~ if that were true, He wouldn't have sent Jesus. And if we get saved but then are taught to focus 24/7 on our SIN....that teaches us Jesus' sacrifice wasn't powerful at all 😢
What about prayers causing people to collapse,, and people laying around the floor about with blankets on their faces after being delivered? I feel a lot of that is showboating. Or speaking in tongues? Unpopular opinion, speaking in tongues is to be interpreted because it’s an actual language. A lot of people just babble and think they are speaking in tongues.
