I use my mini bolt cutters for all kinds of stuff! But mainly to clip my tig wire. After 10s of thousands of cuts on stainless and harder materials they can still clip a piece of scotch tape cleanly!! May not sound impressive but if u know you know lol. Kleins and other top brands (that aren’t much cheap) could never hold up like the knipex
@@TheUncleRuckus I pronounce the M in knife (Messer)! 🤦 I assure you as a native German speaker: the K in Knipex is actually pronounced quite clearly. If you say Nipex in Germany or Austria you will not be understood or looked at strangely.
@@TheUncleRuckus Look up any video on the Knipex company YT channel. They definitely pronounce the K. Also, they pronounce the i with a long e sound, so it's kuh-nee-pex. Here's an example: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-p6QkcDRTtCc.html
I have spent my entire life calling straight knurling: "reeding" as we find on the edges of dimes and quarters. (and I am older than Mr. Pete) There is no such thing as over explaining details. The details are important to the observant. Ron W4BIN
@ 2:09 Kinder-garden Grammar... Or this side of the Pond;... Infant School... ... It is spelt with a "K" but the K is silent as in... Knife;... & many more;.. Knack. Knave. Knead. Knee. Kneel. Knell. Knickers.
Your the best Lyle. I really enjoy all your instructional videos it takes me back over 50 years to my metals shop classes in High School. I wish you would put a disabled Veteran discount on a complete set of your training videos , I know I want a set. I can’t afford them separately.
Diameter isn’t important for cut knurling but is, theoretically, for form knurling if you want to form a perfect knurl. In practice, most formed knurls come out absolutely fine unless the diameter is way off and then it’s only only an issue precision work such as instrument making or watchmaking
Depending on which cutting roller you used, would you see that one line of diamonds were a bit shorter than the rest for example? If the circumference of the stock used didn't allow for equal bites of each tooth of the roller. Is that what you mean??
Very true about that nonesense of diameters and pitches on knurls. That "B&S" knurler is great adapted to the lathe. I have several videos of adapting screw machine/ turret lathe tooling to my Logan 10" lathe.
Mr. Pete, you know darn well that the knurl on a micrometer is there so you don't have to squeeze your water pump pliers so hard when making fine adjustments.
Lyle - Good explanation of knurling. I agree completely that there is no rational relationship between work diameter and knurl pitch. At least in this old engineer's mind - does not make sense.
Mr Pete, I greatly admire your presentation and teaching techniques. This vid could/should be used as a guide for those who want to know how to put together a teaching vid properly. I hope this day finds you well and healthy.
As for pitch / circumference relationship, I believe that you can usually get a good knurl if the "agreement" is anywhere close (meaning that the circumference is nearly an even multiple of the pitch). In fact it is more the reverse: if the "disagreement" is nearly perfect (that is if the circumference is nearly equal to a multiple of the pitch plus exactly 1/2 of the pitch),, then your chances of a bad knurl are much increased. Disagreement *does* mean that the knurls will be formed by pushing and displacing metal more from one side of the ridges than the other. This can result in occasional ridges or points breaking off or being weaker than they would have been with closer agreement. And it doesn't need much adjustment of the work diameter to come into agreement. For a 21 pitch (medium) knurl, the change in diameter to achieve perfect agreement will always be less than about 0.007". [(1/pitch)/π/2]
Indeed. I have found that agreement is more important when knurling on small lathes that inherently lack stiffness. I think being closer to agreement probably reduces the load and hence flex in the machine. So, I always make my knobs diameters close to the pitch diameter for knurling as actual diameter is not important for decorative or gripping surfaces.
I got a chuckle out of that too and also from your comment. I can see an English teacher at the head of her class saying in a very stern voice; “You there Mr. K, just sit right there in your desk and stay silent and don’t you correct me. Do you understand?”
Hobby machinist from Kankakee. Been learning from you for years. Thanks for posting all the information. Definitely going to track down a hand knurler.
Thank You Lyle.... So I get up, make coffee, turn on this lap top, and find a new show from "mrpete222" .. I watch and I think back to my early shop days in 1971. My shop teacher talking about knurls. I so much wish I could briefly return and express how much my teachers efforts have influenced my 49 years being a machinist!!! .. LYLE I appreciate ALL YOU DO!!!..... TM
I was first exposed to knurling from my shop teacher Mr. Morrison at Kewanee High School by making a ball peen hammer handle. The method I learned was to keep the rollers engaged with the cut and use multiple passes back and forth by reversing the feed and increasing the depth until the desired result was achieved. It would not be a high production method but was very good for learning the process and making a great project for a budding machinist. Thanks Mr. Pete for another interesting video!
I believe the bump knurled earned that name because you want to come in hard and fast so the second roller is forced to track the lead roller. If you feed in slow they will possibly not acquire timing and will not make a good knurl.
As a retired tool, die and gagemaker I've knurled lots of round hand held gages. I only had the bump style knurling tools to work with and it took a long time for me to find a way to knurl that doesn't double skip on one side. I never worried about the pitch either. I liked to start my knurl at the headstock where the part was the most rigid and use a center to keep it from pulling out of the chuck if possible. I purposely tipped my knurler at a slight angle so the edge nearest the headstock was touching and would put the lathe in neutral before I pushed the tool into the part, then I would rotate the chuck by hand so the knurl didn't have an opportunity to skip. Once I made a couple of revolutions and could see everything was tracking right, I would put it in gear and power feed it out to the tailstock. I could use either coolant from the lathe sump or brushed on oil, both worked fine.
Thank you Mr Pete. I have the Armstrong with the three way head and have made good and bad knurls with it. I agree that it puts way too much stress on my old machine but that all that I have to work with and was happy to get it, but I will definitely be looking for better options. So far I have not seen anything in the wild that I could aquire.
Hi Danny, search for "scissor knurling tool", there are some kits too, James from Clough42 and Quinn from Blondihacks both have youtube videos building some.
I need help identifying my south bend lathe mr. Pete ! Just picked up a 9” south bend lathe but I’m a little confused. It has a 7 foot bed. Could I get your email and send you some pictures ?
I own a scissors type knurler it has no manufacturer name but , it produces very nice diamonds. With that type of knurler its all about adjusting the tool to the work piece, the one drawback of said tool is it is awkward to work with ( albeit I don't use it alot) but, once its lined up she produces.
The bell has rung. Class is in session. With respect to the knurl pitch vs diameter discussion, as always, there’s a big difference between theoretical approach and practical application.
Over the years working in the aerospace and defense industries, I can't tell you how many times I have come across the same argument of pitch and knurl. The proof is in the pudding and have never had a knurl fail due to diameter. The only issues I had as an engineer, was trying to convince DCAS inspectors otherwise. (Got written up several times for arguing with government "experts".)
Great video mrpete. BUT I must disagree with you about the Aloris 250-110 knurler. I cut the tongues off using a disc cutter on mine. I then put it in the mill and used carbide cutters to clean the end up & cut the tool slot all the way to the end. I even drilled and tapped 2 new set screws into the newly formed end. It makes an excellent extended tool holder and is much more use than a knurler. Most toolholders are only surface hard so not as difficult to cut as you may think. Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to the next in the series. ATB regards from the UK
To be honest, I don't think that the "perfect" knurl is always the perfect knurl. That is, sometimes, I like the "cross-threaded" knurl, as it's essentially a finer pitch knurl, and much more comfortable than many common knurls. However, I don't have any knurl wheels specifically made to produce such "fine" pitches. However however, with a little "care", I can "ruin" a good knurl "perfectly" fine! :)
Always enjoy your videos. As an old math teacher I've always used the pitch and diameter method with a bump tool. Have stopped knurling because of the bump tool. Would sure like for you to take the B&S tool apart showing all the details. Thanks for the instruction.
Yea, the "bump" knurler is a horrible design concept. It puts an exponentially larger radial load on the lathe than "clamp" or "scissor" type knurlers. Sure, with larger lathes, maybe that doesn't matter. But for smaller home shop/hobby lathes, an excessive radial load is significantly less than ideal. On cutting off the wheel end of "bump" knurlers, I have done just that. It was slightly hardened, but not so much that my hacksaw had much trouble with it. I then milled the slot out the rest of the way. I now use that holder to hold a "clamp" style knurler. (or any other tool I need at the moment) :)
I'm with you. Using formula doesn't make sense to me because of reason #3 - to increase diameter. What diameter would you use? The initial or the final? Seems it is a deforming operation not a cutting operation. Oh well, tomato - potato.
I hope in your next video you'll show us the scissor type &/or the parallel arm type of pinch knurler, since they are by far the most popular type in use today. Over the last year or so all the cool kids on YT have made the parallel Hemmingway Kits knurler. (I think it's an elegant piece, but needlessly complicated.) As for your bad knurls, I had a lot of trouble with one wheel double tracking, making asymmetric knurls like you showed. I was about to give up and order a new pair of wheels when I read the knurling advice in MSC's Big Book. It said to be sure the wheels are matched in diameter. I miked mine and, sure enough, they were a few thou different. So I stoned the larger one down to match its mate and got much better performance out of them. That said, I knurled two parts yesterday. One wheel double tracked on one part, and both wheels double tracked on the other. The knurling gods are mercurial. 🤥
AS to your observation about proper diameter of the part... I've done it both ways. I've not had any issues either way. So, I quit worrying about it. Time waits for no man....
My cheap Chinese tool holder/knurler was not hardened as I was able to cut it off with a band saw. I use the holder with a chamfering tool to chamfer the ID of a bore.
How about knurling with a pipe wrench? Keith Fenner runs into that once in a while, and naturally we are all guilty. I prefer a very shallow knurl on a punch, so as to not lose to much skin when it slips through my fingers. Please keep cranking out your stimulating videos
I just did a project in hot rolled steel that was difficult. I am spoiled by aluminum. I wonder if you could cover different steels and their ease of working?
one of the things i'm trying to get my head around is the number of teeth on the knurl cutter (the pitch).. when it comes into contact with the work piece it will start to turn with it.. so if you have an OD that doesn't divide into the number of knurling teeth you will get an overlap or a gap.. how does it equally divide the OD by the teeth so the gap between knurls is the same? btw, i am a complete newbie when it comes to this, so someone please school me.. 🙂
Bump knurlers work better on larger machines, but have no place on 9-12" machines. I converted an AXA bump knurler to a pinch type which works pretty well, but only on smaller diameters. Among my other knurlers, I also have hand held one, but it's not the "pipe-cutter" type- it relies on hand pressure alone, so it's not very good, but I've used it for aluminum on the lathe with good results (for light knurls). I've heard that diameter thing too. It's garbage by people who don't know what they are talking about, or need an excuse to justify their lack of skills!
Mr Pete I have a off subject question, its about making chips especially in the basement and, not carrying them throughout the house..i.e shoes ( i think)... have you come up with a way to mitigate chip dispersion in your house ? Signed barefoot chip finder in Flushing
Two things. Number one I sweep the floor almost constantly in the shop. Then I wipe my feet off before going upstairs. But I think the main thing is that I have an extremely tolerant wife that has never ever ever said anything about chips. Also, we only have carpeting in one room, and I would like to tear that out and burn it
You can also shrink a bore with knurling. Worn valve guides are often knurled then reamed to bring them back into spec. It's done with a single wheel knurler that makes a spiral knurl.
True! I have some of those. Use them for engines that are not used frequently because the guides wear faster. I used mine for quick renovation of worn stone holders that are used for grinding the valve seats. Knurl and ream, next time I will use the K line inserts…
Hi Mr. Pete....NO HURT FEELINGS HERE! I hate those DANG Armstrong bump knurling tools too! Just about gave up on them too....put them all away in a drawer....then one day I took one out and grabbed a piece of leaded steel 1 1/4 in. dia. I had the tool on center and square to the axis of rotation. Then I rotated the knurling tool about 10-15 degrees CCW and locked it down. slowest speed in direct drive on a South Bend 10 lathe both tumblers set mid way, position C on left tumbler. With the corner of the knurling tool digging in and doing all of the work, I GOT A NEAR PERFECT KNURL EVERY TIME !...I'LL BE DANGED...AFTER ALL MY YEARS OF TEACHING MACHINE TOOL TECHNOLOY, I STUMBLED ONTO A METHOD THAT SEEMS TO WORK CONSISTENTLY....GO FIGURE !!!
A fix for worn valve guides in an engine was to knurl them with a drill driven knurl, as it used to be called where I worked. It looked like a modified tap that had six of eight "flutes" and would spiral in just like a tap but it did not cut metal, just moved it about while making a groove similar to a thread and decreasing the inside diameter. It had to be followed with what we called a broach. That was a shaft with a an enlarged dimension close to one end that would be driven through the guide to flatten the knurls to the proper size for the valve to fit properly. It also allowed oil down the guide and usually that is something you really don't want too much of as it will destroy the valve seat and valve face during combustion causing pitting. Both the knurling tool and the broach were piloted to keep them aligned when starting. Thank you for this video topic being covered. I feel I will kanow everything about kanurling after the next video.
Mr. Pete, you and Tom are (somewhat) wrong. you CAN get a good knurl without calculating the diameter of the work and the diameter and pitch of the knurls... BUT, if you get "chasing" like you saw on the Aloris knurled nut - you CAN adjust that by changing the diameter of the work, the knurl diameter or the pitch of the knurl. (I was an engineer in a screw-machine environment and specified the knurl tools to be used for specific jobs to achieve clean knurls...
As for the pronounciation dilemma, if I may correct you: There is no such correlation. To knurl is (pretty obviously) an English word with English etymology (meaning something like wooden knot in Old English), so the pronounciation is just like an English or American person would naturally pronounce it. Much like "knife". On the other hand, Knipex is a German brand name, the etymology being unknown, but it can be guessed it probably comes from knipsen (which is, ironically, what you do with a tool that's called nippers in English, note the absence of "k"). Granted, the people in Wuppertal do speak some weird kind of German, it's not the weirdest dialict, but still. Either way, the correct pronounciation is very clearly, without any doubt, Knipex, as in K(e)nipex, not something akin to Neepex.
My experience .. Never heard about the "pitch formula " untill I had made loads of perfect knurls. If it is perfect you have to hit it harder untill it is. That is why bump knurlers are a nonsense. Totally agree with you Lyle.
As for sizing, the same principle of upsetting material in order to increase diameter can, in some cases, be done with something as simple as a tubing/pipe cutter. I've used that method to improve the fit of a new wheel bearing on a spindle, where the previous bearing had seized and spun the inner race on the spindle. It was a desperation move that worked way better than I expected. At the time all I was after was a fix that would get a bearing to last for more than 10 miles, allowing me to get the car home for further repairs. It ended up lasting for the remaining life of that car, about 7 years. A few of those years involved several trips to either coast (dragged or driven) while moving trucks. One can experiment with a bit of scrap mild steel and an old, dulled, pipe or tube cutter, and look at the profile it makes under magnification, to see what happens.
Hi Mr Pete! Wondering if you can use the Brown&Sharpe knurling tools positioned 90 degrees? Hold it in a side holder for internal boring bars in the radial direction of the work piece. Then it should be possible to knurl longer parts. It should at least work at the 45 degree position of the B&S tool..
diameter does have an impact on knurling and there are a multitude of knurl designations. The screw machine guy who laughed at you has probably used nothing but Diametral Pitch knurls. These knurls are designed for knurling standard stock sizes up to 1in.
I have a die set for broaching straight knurls onto shafts. it was designed for instrument grade parts. I believe the clock/watch industry uses knurling broaches for small shafts as well.
To belabor the obvious (my specialty), a primary task of an educator is to correct the incorrect opinions of his students which must be done to make room for the correct information, regardless of subject. Pointing out the near uselessness of bump knurlers should not hurt anybody's feelings any more than correcting an arithmetic error. You're just trying to make room for the knowledge of a better way.
Lyle, what is your opinion about the fellow who made (IMO) a very nice cut knurling tool for use on his mini-lathe? The little machine's bearings simply can't take the stresses applied by conventional knurling devices. FWIW, I like the man's work.
You can see the knurling pattern ( called checkering when done on wood) on the handles of medieval swords in museums. There is a tactile advantage that is hard to duplicate using other methods and the practice persists on firearms.
Ah the ever elusive chase to form the perfect cylinder to be knurled. I remember forming on back in 1975 that came out perfect. It must have been that Southbend Heavy 10 I was running. Thank you Lyle I look forward to the follow up.
Thank you Mr. Pete. The more information the better. I read something about turning the part to the right size for the knurl a long time ago. That put me off knurling. I never tried it. We used to increase the size of pistons by lots of dots from a center punch, then file to the right size. No sandpaper. It would leave grit in the metal. It always worked okay.
