I read this controversial fantasy series and it was a disaster 🤯 

I wasn't aware Malazan was controversial? Honestly I think its complexity is overemphasized. What really sets it apart and can make it a bit difficult to approach is the fact it is not written like most current fantasy. It really helps if you have read other genres of fiction, literary fiction and modern short stories in particular because Erikson uses a lot of techniques from outside the rather narrow confines of contemporary fantasy. Beyond that, having a community to talk to, ideally at least one person who has already read the books and can do the job of your hypothetical app, makes it easier to get through the books. But then, why read it if you don't enjoy it, no book is for everyone and reading it just for the bragging rights is not a good reason I think.

Your experience is totally valid! As much as I love this series, I do not recommend it lightly to most fantasy readers. I understand the “go with the flow” advice, but I don’t think that works for most first-time readers. I did find it easiest to “flow” with it when I was focusing more on themes than plot, and I also gave up on looking up material to confirm what I read-that was too much of a chore for me. Loved the Erikson not spoon-feeding part 🤣!

Hello, Johan! I’m sorry to hear that Malazan didn’t work out for you, but I think you explained your experience very well. If you do end up deciding to give it another try, of course I wish you the best and would be happy to chat about the series anytime with you! ⚔️

I still don't understand why people find the series confusing. I never felt confused at all. Maybe it's because I tend to just "go with the flow" as you mentioned. Granted, there is a lot of things that the reader doesn't know, but if I don't know something, I just file it away, figuring I'll find out later. Sure enough, later on, I usually find out and then I'm like "Aha!". It's like a jigsaw puzzle in some ways, I suppose.

I’m sorry you didn’t enjoy it! It’s not for everyone, but very cool that you’re giving it a shot. You don’t need a PhD to have an opinion on books, and I appreciated hearing your views. Will be cool to see what you think if you ever decide to finish it off. Happy reading!

Lol Malazan fan here and I'm not triggered at all 🤣 Sorry it didn't work for you. It's important to enjoy what you read!

I always say, if you can’t get through the end of deadhouse gates and start enjoying the series it isn’t for you.

I had a very similar experience with yours starting out, but I stuck with it and Malazan became one of my favorite series. Here’s what I would recommend if you decide to continue: 1. Dedicate a good chunk of time to reading each book. I found that I struggled understanding what was going on initially if I just spent 40 pages a day reading. Once I committed to reading close to 100 pages a day or more, all of the characters and plot fell into place. 2. Read through book 3, Memories of Ice. If you’re not sold by this point, I think it’s safe to say that you won’t enjoy the rest of the series. I was sold with the series after this book. 3. Go with the flow, like Phillip Chase suggested. You won’t understand everything, or even most of what’s going on initially. Give it time though. You will start to pick up things. Reading Malazan has made me a better reader. It truly is an amazing series. I think what gives people the most trouble is not giving the books enough time. You really need to shut things down and just focus on reading. I couldn’t do this initially with my work schedule and my reading suffered because of it. However, once I had free time to read, I dedicated a lot of my time to reading this series. My enjoyment picked up immensely. Best of luck! No series is for everyone. I appreciate your channel and insight to fantasy!

I tried it for the first time over a year ago and got halfway through book 7 before stopping when I realized life got in the way and I had read like 50 pages in a month. I took a break, read some familiar books to readjust, read Abercrombie's First Law Trilogy for the first time, and then decided to dive back in. I read the entire series in 3 months, finishing about a month ago, and I'm diving into the other canonical books outside of Book of the Fallen, and it's been an AMAZING experience. It knocked Wheel of Time from my number one spot which I never thought would ever be possible, but it happened. The best worldbuilding, some of the best characters, and just some of the most emotions I've EVER felt reading fantasy.

Three years ago Gardens became my first fantasy book. I had no idea that fantasy could be written like this and this well. And I obviously had no other fantasy to compare it to. I was hooked and have been reading only fantasy ever since. Took me 14 months to read, while reading no other book. My suggestion - and it's just a suggestion - the first five books can be read as stand alones, so just read them as standalones. They each have their own stories with beginnings and ends. It's only during Bonehunters, book 6, that they all start coming together and by that time you will be familiar with the major characters and world. I also found that I don't need to know all things, just as I still don't know and will never know all things of our own world.

I loved the books. And the first one had me totally baffled. I figured pretty early that it's ok to be in a scene and not understand a damn thing. It's like when you're a kid and you go somewhere in your town you've never been and everything feels so alien and different that it's a thrill.

Actually read them twice. It is interesting seeing these type videos as the reasons people love or hate them are the same. But I wish you would finish Deadhouse Gates. You are introduced to perhaps the most co traversal character as well as one of the most beloved. But either way, avoid the Wiilki at all costs.

80% through the final book, The Crippled God and have to admit that half the time I have not a clue what's going on. Just want it to be over at this stage

This is absolutely valid and honestly if the reading experience doesn't bring you joy and it leaves you feeling like rubbish, it ain't worth it. I have a couple of experiences exactly like yours. Life is too short and we should stick with things that we're passionate about. You do you mate!

Oh dear, I'm so sorry your experience was so unhappy. I was fortunate enough to start the series a month after 'Gardens of the Moon' was published. Thus, had no choice but to go with the flow, and jump right into it. Your research and prep work is what doomed you. Additionally, because each book (mostly) took a year to come out, I did a full series re-read with each new publication. Made it so much easier and enjoyable. ⚔

Best part about reading Malazan for me was being immersed in the scenes, feeling just as confused, just as terrified, and just as devasted as the characters as they experience everything. This also rings true for my first read through of the first book. I didn't try to figure shit out nor did I try making conjectures with what is happening because I was seeing things through Paran and Crokus, who are just as confused as I am, so I felt like I experienced the book as it should be, from the eyes of an outsider.

Whilst I have loved my experience of Malazan so far, I completely understand and experienced the difficulty of not knowing whether I should know something in the story. It's hard to know whether information is being withheld or if you've just forgotten at a certain point lol. It also doesn't help with having some unreliable narrating adding further confusion haha. Fair play to you giving it a shot though! Great video as always.

Hey man I just finished my third reading of the main 10 books and just now feel I understand maybe 90% of the entire story. That has been one of my favorite parts of this series is every time I read it I discover something I missed or didn't fully understand the last time. Also the secondary novels by esselmont really adds more detail to the whole story.

The biggest hurdle to understanding Malazan is your own expectations. The second is patience. If you keep going, it gets easier, not because the material is simpler, but because your brain gets used to processing information the way Erikson wants to feed it to you. My advice would be to take breaks between books, but don't give up.

⚔️ thank you very much for this overview. I am definitely curious for this series, but your explanations told me that I will need enough space and energy for that series. so, it is on my tbr, but I must say, at the very end 😄

I think I've tried about three times to read this series, and each time end up giving up somewhere around book 3 and moving on to something I can actually enjoy reading.

What an excellent description that mirror my experience of the start of my Mazalan journey, current half way through The Bonehunters some 6 or 7 years after starting Gardens Of The Moon and am loving it. Sometimes I will stop reading one of his books and not come back to it for months. The books make you work as a reader and consequently are deeply satisfying even if some parts of the story leave you bewildered. I intend to read the entire series again once I have completed the series (if I live that long 😂)

It's a valid point when one says it's a chore to read through, not everyone has time to connect a story that is meant to be read in a confusing order. Not to mention it is daunting in scale, and jumping from, not one character to another, but one whole group of characters to another, in another area. Definitely hearing it described like this is enough to make me go nope.

I’m just a casual reader of Malazan, not one of the huge fans. I read them while the second half of the series was still being published, reread only the first few a second time. Gardens of the Moon is a pretty terrible book with many of the flaws of a first novel, and IMHO it wasn’t a great idea to make entry into the series THIS hard. But the book gets better once you’ve read the second book in the same arc. However, Philip was right: there’s only one way to read Malazan, and it’s to go with the flow and not worry about “understanding”, just absorbing what is going on, without seeking for explanations that won’t come… yet. It’s not a puzzle to decipher at first (though it will become partially that later on), it’s deeply ancient and lost knowledge you won’t understand until you meet characters who do understand them, partially. Malazan in many ways is a quest for knowledge, and it’s one for the readers too. What makes no sense whatsoever in GotM will later become simple and easy to follow. The second book is already a much better story (alas you stopped before reaching the “good part”, it’s really the last act that’s amazing and gruesomely tragic) that has all the power of very ancient epics. It’s with the third book that you start really being dragged in and start to understand a bit what is going on. After that there are certainly very puzzling and very baffling things going on now and again, the cast and world keep expanding, and some of past history in particular is steeped in ambiguities and mysteries, but the series as a whole becomes more “intricate and captivating” than “complicated”. I was able to enjoy it as a casual reader picking up the new book each year. But GotM I only appreciated on a reread. I initially hated that book and most of the characters. But by book 3 they turn into old friends. But if you’re ever tempted to give it another try I’d recommend going back to the essence of what Philip said by “going with the flow”. Just dive in and let it wash over you. Don’t try to do research or to understand beforehand the world. For good or bad (and with the first book I think there’s quite of bit of bad that will be turned into good only books later) being quite lost most of the time is an intentional feature of the early series. It’s like being an anthropologist discovering a new continent full of mysteries going as far back as prehistory, and having to pick up the threads one by one. It’s not a series to be too analytical with, not initially and until the rules of the game are explained, or it will drive you pretty crazy. It’s definitely not a matter of intelligence, I think it’s probably more a matter of expectations and placing the bar for yourself too high in regard to how much you should understand by book 2. But it’s also not a series for everyone. It has put off A LOT of very experienced Fantasy readers. Not everyone enjoys an experience as confounding as Malazan can be, nor everyone finds the world building and characters nearly captivating and intriguing enough to make the massive efforts necessary to plow through the more difficult early books.

As a Malazan fan, I'm gonna be the first to say that I would NEVER recommend it for everything. Yikes. It's a lot of book, and it is super dense, with a lot of lines to follow. I'm also the type of reader who isn't possibly going to catch everything when I read dense and detailed fantasy series. For me at least, what I loved so much about it was the profound character moments. Deadhouse Gates is still one of my favorite books of all time. I go with the flow very much when reading these, and not trying to obsess over the details, but I also totally agree with your idea of a "should I know about this by now" app for this series XD Honestly, kudos to you for sharing your opinion about this, and I think it's super cool that you read it and shared your thoughts. I totally get that it isn't for everyone. I'll be re-reading it, but that's not a commitment that everyone can or wants to make, and I don't blame them for that. ⚔

You've earned my subscription because I completely agree with on Malazan. I couldn't understand it and I tried super hard. (I also went to school for Business Management and also abandoned the series during Deadhouse Gates and only got that far because everyone talked about how amazing it is).

I made it 6 books before giving up. I love the characters and the world, and most of the 'micro-plots' are pretty great. But the 'macro-plot' still made no sense, and was just needlessly complex.

regarding your comment about wanting an app that can tell you whether you should understand something by a given point. I think this highlights one of the pitfalls we have as readers: we view understanding as a boolean. we either understand something, or we don't but that model doesn't really apply to a text like Malazan because our comprehension of most concepts is built over time, piece by piece. and that's done very purposefully as Erikson uses these piecemeal reveals to re-contextualise his concepts. our understanding grows but it also changes.

As many others have said it in your comments already - I, too am very sorry that the series didnt fully pull you in until the end. And granted, I also found the first book very, very weird, but it had something that made me want to continue, so I did some side-reading, just to gather if it was supposed to be like this, or if I was missing anything. So it seemed fine, and I decided to keep reading. Meanwhile, Im reading the series a second time, but even halfway through I was already decided, that for me, it is indeed one of the best series I have ever read. And I would really, really strongly recommend to give it another go (for anyone who just couldnt go on in fact) and read it through to the end. Nearly everything will make much more sense and if you then decide you didnt like it, fair play, but I am almost sure, that if you give it a full go, you cannot help but come to love it whole-heartedly. Keep doing your good work. :)

Loved hearing about your experience! I definitely don't think this is a 'disaster' though, the series just wasn't for you and that is absolutely fine. Different readers, different tastes! There are plenty of other books out there for you to enjoy, you don't have to drag yourself through a series that isn't working for you, simply because it's supposedly 'one of the greats'. You do you! Anyway, this is probably the one series that I am most intimidated by, for exactly the same reasons that you pointed out... I tend to be a very charcter-driven reader and I am a bit concerned that I won't be able to connect as much as I would like to, since we are hopping around different casts of characters throughout the series. And I read for enjoyment, so the fact that I hear so many people say that this feels like a damn study doesn't sound too appealing to me. All that said, I still want to give it a shot some day, just to see how I feel. Hearing so many reviewers that I look up to just absolutely gush about this series has really piqued my interest. I think it's good to hear a different opinion from you though, I hope it helps me go in with the right expectations (if that is even possible for this series). Also, I just want to say that having a literature degree doesn't make another reviewer's opinion more valuable/correct than yours. We are all readers and we all have our own reading experiences, which are worthy of sharing. This was a great video!

Hi, I'm currently on book five. I'm constantly challenged by these books as I read them. The struggle is worth it because I don't just breeze through them and I see possibility to reread them someday. I like the advice of going with the flow and don't be afraid to look something you're confused by. Even if there's spoilers it won't spoil the way it's written for you. I sometimes read the spoilers on purpose so i can better understand what I'm reading for the first time.

I wish you had been able to make it through Deadhouse Gates! That book, just by itself, really is mindblowing. I hope you'll pick it up again someday. You were right to not google, btw. It's very hard to avoid Malazan spoilers because things so often connect in unexpected ways.

I just finished the whole series two weeks ago (I started because of Mike's Book Reviews too!), and I found there are a few types of confusion I went through, over the course of the series. One part is confusion because I didn't know enough yet, as a lot of things are discussed more in-depth in later books. One part was confusion because things were happening in other Malazan books that weren't part of the big ten (like a MAJOR CHARACTER DEATH that is hardly touched on in the big ten). One part was confusion because I just wasn't paying close enough attention; I've gotten used to being able to skim books because most authors hold your hand through the story, but Erikson trusts you enough not to do that. I decided around book 7 that I wanted to re-read the whole series after I finished it, and I plan to start that in another year or so after I've decompressed from the ending. I like that you are giving your experience on the books; it's definitely not for everyone, and that's ok! I spent the first six books thinking I was going to DNF the series, and now I'm glad that I didn't, but I think it's equally valid to say it didn't capture you and move on to a different book/series. I was also helped along a LOT by the Ten Very Big Books podcast, and Iskar Jarak's youtube channel, both of which pointed out things that I missed, and reinforced things that I thought were important.

"I just wanted to read. I didn't want to study a book." I felt the exact same way when I tried reading Gardens of the Moon. A lot of the fans also just take for granted that a lot of the books must be re-read, but I just don't think that's for me at all. Reading fiction for me is about entertainment and excitement and it felt by reading Gardens of the Moon I was studying or that taking a studious approach would be the only successful way of getting the book and enjoying it. I don't enjoy complexity for complexity's sake, but that's just me, after all. I'm glad there are many others who enjoy it!

Honestly I hate understanding thr complex stuff, but grow to lobe it after i begin understanding with time Is this book like that or is it gonna confuse me till the last word Should I read it?

⚔. Thanks for this recommendation! It's been daunting and taunting me from my shelf too!

I read all 10 books with the support of Mike’s read-along, as well as various other online resources, many of which you listed. And while these well-intentioned people did help my ‘understanding’ of the text to some extent, they did little to advance my enjoyment of the series. There were a few entertaining aspects of the series, but preciously too few of them to offset the consistently irritating writing style of the author. The biggest obstacles I could not get through were thin character work, lack of a coherent plot, and needlessly endless obfuscation for its own sake. Many devotees have quoted such characteristics as part of the series’ charm. I don’t get it. Not my preferred bag of bananas.

A couple of thoughts.. Your points are 100% valid and I agree with them. The first book is by FAR the toughest to get through, imo, and while you may have read over 1,000 pages, reading just 12% of the entire series is simply not enough to judge it accurately. Malazan is a series that rewards you the more you read it. Yes, you are completely dropped into the middle of a story and world and have to hit the ground running, like a newborn giraffe. It can be confusing, frustrating, and unexpected. But eventually, as long as you keep moving, you are rewarded with an experience almost unparalleled in fantasy literature. It is a series that requires patience and determination. I only recommend it for hardcore fantasy readers as it can be very intimidating. I read all 10 books and don't know that I've ever felt more satisfied to have finished a series. Easily on my top 3 of all time.

Todd here. Interesting video. A year ago I read the first three books in the series. I gave up on it because I had no idea what was going on. I want to give it another go to see if I could get attached to the characters the second time around.

I think the books are fun bc they're different from the norm of every other fantasy book lol. Wasn't a disaster on my end. It threw my expectations completely aside which was something I hadn't realized I needed. And I enjoy short story writing. That said, I'm not a Malazan fanboy but I liked it!

🗡I’m currently reading book 8, “Toll the Hounds.” I’m not a fan of epic multi-volume fantasy. At 60 yo, long book series feel like a life sentence. However, Malazan has its hooks in me. I Google stuff all the time. I can certainly understand why there readers who are not fans of Malazan. I’m not a fan of Faulkner, despite my efforts to read his works. Just not for me. Same with Game of Thrones. It’s all a matter of taste, not a moral or intellectual failure on the part of the reader.

This is pretty much a spot-on explanation of why I had difficulty getting into these books. I’ve tried 4 or 5 times (250-350 pages in, perhaps a bit more), but it just never grabbed me. I’ll probably give it one more shot before giving up completely.

MBoTF is a magnificent read , along with all the Esslemont contributions it has literally changed not only the course of my fantasy reading but my life, I know that sounds dramatic but I now have a core group of friends from all over the world (some of who I've actually met) and we have as close if not closer bond than my physical friends.... just finished my re-read of the whole series and its safe to say as with Tolkien you pick up on new things along the second journey along with storlines having even greater resonance... saying all that, not every series is for everyone... Read what makes you happy.... First In, Last Out

Good video. I had to put it down towards the end of the second book. Never bothered to pick it up.... 8 years later am considering it.

As other commentators have said, Malazan is not for everyone, but also, not for whenever. To put it shortly, Malazan and the timing of reading it is important. I started it once, when I was kind of in the middle of my fantasy reading career, I read Gardens of the Moon, did not get a lot and dropped it. However, at the bookshop, where I worked, other fans asked if I had read it yet and when I said that not properly yet, they had this smile of "you have an amazing experience ahead of you" that I knew, I had to get back to it some time again. So I read other fantasy, stuff I liked and also stuff that I did not think that good. And then I decided to start Malazan again and it worked amazingly. I read Gardens again and then kept reading on, knowing that the characters keep reappearing every other book and that it's just best to go with the flow. I was swallowed whole and I have to say, it has been hard to find good fantasy after that, all pales before it. So, in a way, it's best to keep it later in your fantasy reading, since it will ruin you for other series if you like it. Malazan is at the very top of my favourite fantasy series and it's been difficult to find books that come somewhat close to that experience lately (Sorry, but I don't get the hype of Name of the Wind and Sanderson's Stormlight Archive!).

I can totally relate to your view. I stopped reading Deadhouse Gates because I got very confused. Recently I started it again and I have been seeing videos from Iskar commenting on the chapters and it has helped me a lot. So I finished the book today and I very much liked it. Maybe give it another try with some external help like these videos from Iskar. Cheers!

Interesting The 3 points that were "problematic" for you are the reasons I now want to pick up gardens of the moon. Thank you again, your videos are really helpful, you clearly state facts and believe me, this is a breath of fresh air in the booktubers wilderness. Oh, by the way, if what you described had a confusing effect, don't get close to Grant Morrison's Final Crisis nor Superman Beyond 😊

i'm halfway the last book. i feel i still don't understand 25% of the things that are going on. But even like that, i'm enjoying this amazing trip and already feel that i want a re read. after some things i've read, even abercrombie (whom i love) feels simple

I've read the first three books and I've had a similar experience. I've reviewed them in Spanish in some of my first videos, when I had no experience in editing and thought that making videos more than 45 minutes long was a good idea. Some thoughts about the first three novels: - Gardens of the Moon: You're on point when you say this feels like you're beginning to read in the middle of a long series, like starting on page 500 of a several-thousand-pages book. However, I think the complexity is sometimes overestimated. Yes, there are many characters and several different plots, but the only difficulty is not getting lost with the names and changes of location. The real difficulty is the author hiding information from the reader on purpose, for example only hinting at how the magic works etc. This actually can spur the curiosity of the reader as happened in my case, expecting further explanation of the background in the following novels. On the other hand, one of the main plots of the novel, the dagger-and-cloak adventures in Darujhistan, dragged in my opinion, and since it takes a large portion of the novel I got quite bored at the end. Furthermore, one of the reason I started reading the series was because I knew that Erikson was an anthropologist, so I expected a Tolkien-like level of worldbuilding, but only found a reworking of fantasy clichés with hardly anything really new (and even some character ripped from other fantasy series, like Anomander Rake). - Deadhouse Gates: This, read separately, I would consider one the best books of military fantasy I've ever read, quite thrilling to the end (If I had to guess after reading this, I would have said that Erikson is a military historian instead of an anthropologist). However, at the end it began to dawn on me that Erikson wasn't intending to explain the background at any point and was just going to keep on throwing unexplained elements at us. Also, it started to bother me how materialistic and lacking in fascination (from my point of view) is all the magic and religion/gods (when gods appear in this series, at least in the three novels I have read, they do it in my opinion in the most underwhelming of ways). - Memories of Ice: This book did it for me about getting disillusioned with the series after the bump up of Deadhouse Gates. Curiously, the moral ambiguity is thrown out the window with this one, since here one of the sides in the war that is presented as clearly evil. Anyway, this novel just confirmed (for me) the problems of the first two and the fact that there wouldn't be any great change of gear in the series: what we saw in the first books was what we are going to probably get in the rest of the series (I say this because more than once fans of the series have told me not to bother continuing if I didn't like this book). After finishing it, I wasn't invested at all in the characters, and the world described, while very large (although for me it's not entirely clear how "continents" is not simply a transposition of "countries" in other fantasy worlds) lacked any fascination from my point of view. I just couldn't see any reason to continue reading, which probably would mean another jump to another continent and another different adventure anyway. I just don't see the point of following the story further when I haven't found anything truly original or gripping in this series. And if this is going to happen after 3000 pages, well, maybe the author should have found a way to introduce it earlier.

I remember when I was recommended Malazan book of the fallen well before booktube. It was actually done in the wild by my friend's friend who knew I read fantasy. I didn't know what I was getting into because I don't research anything I read. I tried that series twice now I have yet to finish gardens of the Moon but I do plan to try again. I just don't think I'm in the right head space to keep up with that story. I definitely want to try to give it to memory of ice because that's what everyone says is worth getting to. I want to give it at least a book three no matter what. But as someone who has tried to read gardens of the Moon two times now and failed, I totally understand the struggles.

Hi there. I have read while listening to the first 2 books in Malazan. I had to read and listen to the first book 3 times before I got anything from it. I know how you feel. I am trying to get started on the third book right now. It takes me about a month to get each book done, leaving no room for other series. Meanwhile, at the beginning of this month, I finished listening to the Warrior of the Altaii by Robert Jordan, which has been great. This week, I am listening to Nettle and Bone by T. Kingfisher. The Warrior of the Altaii was the first book that Robert Jordan wrote, but was never published until after his death. His character work is amazing.

This was a good take on these books. I have just finished the 7th book after a bit of time off, and I found myself really tiring of Ericson's style. I sincerely feel like this book could have been 1/3 its length and would have lost nothing of real value. The repetitive nature of the narrative really stood out in this book, with so many duplicated events or types of events. I do love his world building and the way he weaves in geology. I love his magic, and the comic parts and the action. And always Karsa Orlong. But I also tire of the same old pathos coming out again and again. So many characters have the same set of emotional responses that feel overwhelmingly emo and trite and limited, and sooo repetitive. I'll probably finish the series but I need another rest.

I got exactly as far as you did so far, then put it on hold. I will say I read Gardens of the Moon a second time before moving on and enjoyed it much more the second time. For me the second book wasn't so much tough to follow, but I found I didn't really care what was going on or who was heading where, I'm sure that reading to the end must have some sort of payoff. I will try the second book again soon. Thanks for the video!

Best advice: take your time! I started the read through with Mike as well. I just finished Book 9 a week ago, but I made sure to put a book or two between reading each Malazan installment. You’ll find that if you can just accept what info you’re given and let it be, it will all eventually be explained.

It's TBR for me. I have a copy of Gardens on my bookshelf that a friend gave me. Don't know when I'll get to it as I got hundreds of others on my TBR list, about to start Eon for example, and currently reading a long history book. But someday...

Your last 4 videos are all brilliant. You're putting out QUALITY

Are we the same person?? We have the same favorite RU-vidrs, reading and watching habits, and we’re in the same spot for Malazan! Good stuff, man!

⚔️⚔️⚔️ this series seems really intimidating! I haven’t tried it, but I feel like I would want to after more experience reading epic fantasy! I hope you do end up liking it if you pick it up again!

Reading "Night of knives" after "Gardens of the moon" really helped me to grasp something. Because I was kinda lost after the first book. And I agree with you, throughout the book I didn't care who would die and who would live. I'm on page 431 in "Deadhouse gates" and I'm starting to root for Crokus and Apsalar😀

what are those books behind you with the roman numerals on? the image that stretches across the spines?..they look awesome...just wondered what they were?

After a long break from fantasy, and reading in general, Malazan is intriguing for me and is definitely on my TBR. However I feel like I need to get some more fantasy experience under my belt first before tackling this series. I'm going to try and get through the WOT first and see how I fare on a series of such grand scope, then maybe I'll give it a shot. Realistically though it's probably 2 years away for me at this point.

Throughout the first book and halfway through the second (Deadhouse) I was thinking I might not see this one through to the end of the series, I was spending too much time trying to grasp everything to really let the story grip me. Luckily though I stayed the course, because by the time I had finished book 2 I was invested. Book 3 (memories of ice) hooked me in and is my favourite of the first 8 books. It's not an easy read to begin with for sure, but once it clicks it's truly fantastic. You do have to go in with the mindset that this is going to be a long road and that you aren't supposed to know everything that's going on right now. I started with the intention to just get through the 10 books and say I did it... I've just finished the 16th book and still want more.

It took me like 5 years to get through the first and second book lol. Took 3 tries on book 1, and 2 tries on book 2. I think I initially gave up somewhere midway through the second book for about 2 years before going through a book 1 and 2 recap and continuing on from where I left off in 2020. I'm now finishing up Book 5, and I have to say that Deadhouse Gates and House of Chains are some of my favourite books ever. Memories of Ice was incredible too. Keep at it. Once you get over the hump, it's vastly more enjoyable and you won't regret it. Ps. I'm still pretty confused at times lol

There is no series as rewarding to (re)read as Malazan. I think its best to go with the flow. Every time you learn something new that put previous events into a different context it just feels amazing. You have so many "oh shit" moments when you read Malazan and even more when you reread it. I absolutely love it. ^^

I've been considering startingMalazan for a long while now. I still will do it, but thanks for your advice! (Sword Emoji!) Will

Something else I want to add, and I fear I need to tread carefully because I do not want to come across condescending. Some times we just want to read for easy entertainment, but some times we want to be completely immersed in a world. Malazan calls for total immersion. I constantly find myself pausing and going to Malazan wiki for background on a Character etc, and I love that! Also, I found I had to give up on trying to understand what is going on and just allow myself to be pulled along. I really hope you give it a go again, and more importantly, I really hope you find you love it like many of us do. But if you don't, that's okay too. I have really tried to like R Scott Baker's, The Darkness That Comes Before, but simply cannot get into it. We like what we like, I suppose.

Loved Malazan, finished it last month. However, I also admit I may have DNF'd the series at some point, if it wasn't for Mike's readalong. Had plenty of help from both the vets and the noobs, and the discussions made it a lot more enjoyable. Then I'd watch a Malazan video by Phillip Chase or A.P, or both, and would figure out I'd missed a lot of things. It's that kind of a series. Gardens of the Moon and Deadhouse Gates are actually two of my favourites from the series overall.

Hope you carry on and get the chance to meet Karsa, Trull, Mappo and Iskaral Pust to name a few. This is by far my favourite world to get lost in. ✌🏻

Interesting to hear your experience! At this current stage of my life, I have no interest in reading this series and the complexity of it doesn't excite me. I like epic scopes in fantasy but have realized that it's also important to me to also get that narrow gaze that allows me to really connect with characters and experience the events with them. As ambitious and impressive as Malazan sounds, I don't think it will work for me. Maybe that will change someday though.

I love Malazan - going through one of the ancillary series at the moment. But I do understand how and why people aren't fans. Also, finish book 2. I can't remember the last time a book made me cry that much.

If I had looked into the plot or magic system prior to start reading the series, I may have passed, and it can be confusing, but the writing is phenomenal. On so many pages had I read a paragraph then stopped reading to ruminate in what was just delivered. I can't believe it sometimes, it is that good, like where is the author pulling it from?

⚔⚔I don't know whether I'll ever try this series. Part of the points in your criticism appeal to me, but then again do I want to put myself through all of that 😅😅 in any case I have more than enough other fantasy series that are higher on my radar, so Malazan will have to wait

Similar here. I am a HUGE The Wheel Of Time fan and have reread it many times. So I finally started reading Malazan, and gave up in book#2's prologue. You made it a bit further than me. LOL Anyway, I will start it again soon and see what happens. BTW, I can recommend reading along with the *TOR* first time read through. The reader is very observant, plus, there is also a Malazan fan who helps out with clues, not really going into spoilers. I suggest that you give the TOR read through a try if you decide to try it again.

What's that books series with just numericals on the shelf

What?! I was lost through the first book. Then they fell into place. Researched everything I could afterwards. My favorite books ever. Sad you didn’t enjoy them. My husband is finishing the wheel of time. We read them early on before the series was finished. I’m making my husband read malazan next. Can’t wait for him to be surprised how good they are!

I audiobooked it so I guess I kinda had to "go with the flow" the first time through. The first book was fine for me but by the end of the second I was hooked. I just started the series a second time after a few years and the first book is incredible now that I understand the world.

French guy here, I read GotM twice in english and I won't lie, I was super lost the first time, yet you adjust pretty quickly after a while. You just have to go with the flow and you will understand glimpse of it eventually. Good luck!

Well I love Erikson’s work and am also totally bamboozled by it all. Devoured all 10 books and then looked back over it and scratched my head. Really need to read them again.

Everything you said about Erikson is basically his brand as an author. A lot of the complexity in the world building, characters, and the plot come from Malazan's origins in several years of role-playing, and thanks to his background in archaeology and anthropology, he excels in handling large casts and epic plots. I personally LOVE that he doesn't believe in exposition. Once you get used to Erikson's style of using very little exposition, it does ratchet up your sensitivity to egregious exposition everywhere else...mainly because you suddenly notice just how much direct exposition exists in most fantasy. Books I would have once enjoyed without complaint prior to reading Erikson, I now usually have the reaction of "oh I liked it, except for all of the infodumping". I've read the main ten books and as long as you can roll with being confused, you'll be able to make it to the end of the series. The hardest part was getting into Book 5, because it does take you to a completely new place to the events and characters of Books 1-4 but if you can push through that, everything will eventually all come back together in Book 10, which was an emotional catharsis for me. He is amazing at delivering on emotional gut punches and narrative pay-offs. Every time I think there isn't any more ways he can make me cry, he pulls out something new and even more devastating than before. My heart just breaks for Tavore. For what it's worth, in my opinion, most of the stuff you'll be confused about at first doesn't matter. Anything that's critical to understanding the story, you will be given enough context to piece it together. Some things you will NEVER figure out and aren't meant to figure out. Example: the magic system. There clearly is a reasonably hard magic system in place (arguably several). Over the course of the books, you will come to understand enough about it that when magical things happen, they make sense. At the same time, if you asked me to try and explain the magic system to you, I wouldn't be able to. I could only explain bits and pieces, without being able to give any sort of grand unification theory. And that's also a huge part of the wonder in Malazan.

Thanks for your video. I started with the kindle sample of The Gardens of the Moon and felt somehow bad because it was intimidating, and cold and I did not know what to do with that so I cowardly left it for a maybe or never. And yes, Philip Chase even said how this series is just magistral and such good literature and still I didn't know. And I have read pieces of literature, great classics, so enjoyable, no trauma for myself LOL, So your video was so much fun and I like and respect Philip Chase so much but this is probably not for me. I am new to the fantasy genre and proud of having finished and enjoyed the two books of the Name of the Wind but they sound like kids' books compared to this complexity.

I read "Gardens of the Moon" twice before moving on. It really helped me sort out the characters I wanted to root for and those I enjoyed understanding. That being said, I would have liked some more backstop on Hairlock. I feel it is one of the few times I saw a character that existed solely to move the plot.

Hi 👋 this series isn’t for everyone, I’m glad you are honest with ur thoughts 💭I’m currently reading Deadhouse gate so far it’s intriguing I know this series very confusing but then it makes me want to read more of this series.. they are only my thoughts 💭 if you do start this series again Goodluck with it ... happy reading to you!! 🦋🎬🎥

If you ever go back to the series, a couple of bits of advice. The first is, don't try to be prepared for it, because as you said, you'll never be sufficiently prepared for it. Whenever you feel like you don't understand something, just chant the mantra of "read on and find out". Other than that, I would probably recommend the Tor Reread of the Fallen as a readalong companion. It does a pretty decent job of summaries the things you can expect to have understood at various stages of each book.

Erickson says this himself, he follows "Show, don't Tell" writing styles. While that's becoming more common (thank-e sai) Ericson takes the concept a step farther, sometimes showing the same time sequence from different POV's, and in paying attention to each POV's reactions, the details they notice, etc.. you get a much richer picture of the characters than from other traditional devices, imo. It's tricky, and you have to read carefully, but since I trust that Erickson also 'wrote carefully', I can be relatively sure that minor, but confusing discrepancies that other readers might pass over as an error are actually plot or characterisation details. Sometimes for plot/characters that we don't pick back up until a book or two later. I vall that brilliance, and appreciated every nugget I found. I listened the first time, which is hard, so I can't wait to re-read!

I agree 💯% with everything you said! Especially since we read the exact amount of the series!

I started reading this way back in high school and loved it from the get go. It definitely just drops you in media res. I think I should finally reread this series...

Awe, thats too bad. I understand how you feel..I read every book as soon as it was released so j always had a long time between books. When I did a re-read deadhouse gates was kinda eating my soul..I needed to slow down. Too much sad all at once. I've gone through it a bunch of times now and its my favorite series. A song of ice and fire, lord of the rings , a wheel of time..nothing really compares for me. Try it again after a few years. And no stress about it.

Sword? Ok. Whatever. I really hope you get back to this series. As a lifelong reader and fantasy fan who has read the whole series, what I recommend is to just read it. Don't overthink, don't try to keep too close a track of who's who. It all becomes clear in time. Entering this series is like falling through a tear in the fabric of reality into another realm, literally. Getting your bearings takes time. Myself, I took several long breaks in the beginning right in the middle of books and came back months later after reading lighter books. But by the time I finished House of Chains I was hooked. Erikson has supplanted and surpassed all others and stands at the very apex of fantasy genius. Do yourself a favor and read on.

I freely admit that Malazan does intimidate me a bit! I'll give it a try at some point, but I'm not quite ready! I appreciate your honesty in this video!

Duuuude you stopped at the exact wrong spot nyargh!!!! The end of Dead House Gates is like a tidal wave. Aaahhhh lol man I hope you finish it

Ahahaha, same! I read 1 book and I just fell off during Deadhouse gates. I got about 300 pages in when I had to return it to the library, and it's just taken me forever to get back into it. I'm here to get the hype now ;P PS. I love the series, and want to continue. I'm listening to the podcast '10 very big books' after every few chapters because I just think the podcast is hilarious. I have to get back into it soon. 🗡

I had a similar Experience with Gardens of the Moons, Decided to still atleast read till Memories of Ice and DeadHouse gates turned out to be one of the greatest books I've ever read, Absolute whirlwind of sadness and pride I felt by the time it ended was something sublime. Though it needed a lot reference to maps and some conversations with a friend who is relatively well versed in it.

⚔️ I finished Malazan Book of the Fallen a few months ago. I struggled with a few of the books but by the time I got to book 10 I was on the Best Fantasy series bandwagon. I'm already itching to do a reread. Also for me, the audiobooks helped.

Everybody certainly has such different tastes. I'd heard how "complex" Malazan was, which put me off it a while. Then I finally got around to reading Gardens of the Moon and it was my 2022 book of the year! Just Fantastic! There were a few things I didn't like as much about it (for instance this awesome buildup to this seemingly unbeatable baddy then at the end.. well..) But overall I thought it was amazing - and many (Fans of Malazan) say it's the worst in the series?! Wow that just makes me excited to read more of the series because I absolutely Loved Gardens of the Moon.

You have a good idea of what to expect from the series now, so I'd suggest you wait unti you're in the mood for the kind of experience the series provides before you try again sometime. As you mentioned, the best advice for the series is to just go with the flow. Think of reading the books as being your preparation. Pretty much anything you don't understand yet is usually because you don't need to yet. By the end of the series you will mostly know what's going on. If you ever do finish it and eventually do a reread, you'll understand pretty much everything and appreciate it 1000 times more. But like some others have commented here, it simply isn't everyone's cup of tea.

⚔️ I've heard a lot about the series, the more I hear the more intimidating it sounds and I'm not sure I would enjoy it. I appreciate your really thoughtful review.

I read Malazan BOTF quite a while ago. There weren't any videos and no way to find out information about it at that time (that I was aware of). Many of the things that turned you off were things I loved about it. It was MASSIVE and the reader is just dumped into the middle of it all as if they are already familiar with the world. Was I confused? Absolutely. And I loved every minute of it.

I've not long since finished Gardens of the Moon and I'm not sure about it. It was in a word, bizarre! I kind of liked it, but I'm more baffled about certain things and looking around at everyone loving it and I'm just not seeing why. I probably will read the second one, but it does make me worried to think that if I read it casually, I'll just miss everything and not have a clue what's happening. Having said that, the prose is truly beautiful and is a pleasure to read, even if I haven't a clue what's going on! Part of me wants to google stuff to get a better grip of it all, but part of me wants to rise to the challenge of figuring it out

I binged through the whole Series last year. Took Me 5 months of reading, some 5-6 hours everyday. It's quite the effort and requires dedication as it is, so doing all the additional research and reading up along with it will only make it seem harder and more of a chore than it needs to be. The First Half of every book in the Series is difficult to get into -New Locations, New Characters and setting up of Multiple Events that will play out in The Second Half. Every book is like a collection of stories and there will be ones that will interest you less. Best Thing to do is go with it, just keep reading, remembering names of locations, people and events that's it...don't try to force connections coz usually those come much deep into the series, if they do that is.! There is no overarching plot. It just isn't your typical series. Whole idea is being in another world as a series of epic events take place there and experiencing them through the different characters. I was told to take notes and do all kinda work that I felt would only complicate the experience further. Glad I didn't do any of that. I just kept reading and let Me tell You...It's super rewarding once You are able to get into it... Just keep reading!

I like complicated world building but i am not reading a book where i have to piece things like a murder mystery.