Yeah totally agree, it's hard but you need to try and fine people who work in your niche, but do YT in addition rather than their main job. I'm a developer and Alex Ziskind has an awesome channel, he's still a developer as well as a RU-vidr (as far as I can tell from the content in his videos as he mentions working on client work, without going into detail). There's still some good tech youtuber's who have valid input, but yeah video editing is what they know so it's what they focus on. You get the same issue with RU-vid videos about iPad as well, they all want it to run MacOS, and want it to work just like a Mac - They have no concept of newer creators who grew up on iPads wanting it to work the way it does, and that's even within their own niche.
@@HeroDadGamesI disagree. Even my non-tech savvy 67 year old parents noticed the increase in perceived smoothness when phone screens got higher refresh rates. Not while changing to the higher refresh rate, but rather when changing it back to 60 "because the battery drains quickly".
@@netnomad47 See that white box on the floor in the background? That looks like a high end gaming PC to me. If not, I know he owns one, as he has mentioned it beofore.
I've been looking at reviews since this came out but I think i'm sold. Your reviews are the best I've found because I feel like I get a realistic view of how it will work for me. I also really appreciate that you don't have any bias towards MS/Apple and are just looking for the best computer for your needs. I appreciate that because I feel the same and also have a mix of products.
Oh God yes, every time tech RU-vidrs start showing the processor speed benchmark bars, and listing measurable nits of brightness in the monitor, I just glaze over. Just tell me if it works, or if there are noticeable irritations!
Surface Pro user for years. I have to say I agree with you on every level. What a device. For people who don't know, the Surface IS a PC. It is not LIKE a PC. It is not SIMILAR to a PC. It IS a PC. Once you get that, you are good to go, and the world is your oyster. You have a PC with you whenever you need one. I have a sling bag which I throw mine into, and I take it everywhere. It is amazing. I have the SP9, so I also have a battery pack and a charging adapter, which is a bit of a bummer. If I had the SP11, I would just leave home with the device and be good to go. I am looking forward to that day. I might wait until the SP12 or 13 when all the kinks are gone from Windows on ARM. Also, my device is just over a year old and does all I need, so I will keep it for a little bit longer. The SP line is amazing. I have no real use for a tablet of any other kind because I have a 13-inch tablet whenever I need one and I have a PC all the time. Since I got the original RT, I have had a Surface and I would simply never go back. Of course, if I had needs that meant the cooling was a problem for me, I would change, but since I don't, I am good to go and loving it. It is so good to hear someone who is used to having a Mac and still uses one enjoying the SP11 so much. It kind of means that Microsoft has really upped their user experience game, which I think I can agree with. Windows 11 has some road left to travel in becoming a good tablet interface. Let's be honest, it is NOT a good tablet interface, haha, but apart from that, everything works and the workarounds are great. Small keyboards, pop-up trackpad - a godsend. It all works and will get better now that the tablet can be an all-day tablet. I am so looking forward to what happens next. Great video. Thanks for making it.
But not all apps have arm supported .. which is unfortunate tbh. I wanted to buy my first surface pro for coding and also drawing for game development etc. im just worried the app that i wanted to use on the surface pro would not be supported on arm despite emulation 😢
@@twitte0king Understood...however if you are an office use and that is what I am, with a little adobe and a few others .. Then this IS a PC. It is NOT a desktop. If you have a desktop - there is probably a reason for that and you probably don't need a tablet sized PC to do the same thing. I have a tablet sized thing that is everything I need from a PC. It IS a PC for me.
My honest opinion is if someone doesn't go outdoors to edit and likes to stay in his room to do stuff on his device then a Desktop PC is preferable and also has many customization choices
Thanks for the review. I agree with your assessment. Been using it since launch day last month. Love, love, love the flexibility of this machine. It's worked great for Office apps, Teams and Zoom calls, Photoshop and the (non-classic) version of Lightroom have all worked flawlessly. Only hiccups wee with the Davinci Resolve beta... but it's not a critical app for me. I can wait for the official ARM version. Only issue I had so far: the Flex keyboard wouldn't work when I detached it from the SP11. The pen did, but the keyboard didn't. Microsoft's recent hardware update fixed the issue for me. I'm really happy with the performance, the battery life and the flexibility of the Surface Pro 11.
I've been using a SP9 for a while now as my daily driver. Not the fastest machine (but in my line of data analysis when I need fast i need to connect to a remote machine) but flexibility and portability are unmatched. You need to join a meeting, it's a nice note taking device, you want to share slide or show videos to colleagues... It's a gorgeous screen, you want a laptop... The keyboard is very comfortable. The only downside has been battery life that doesn't do more than 5ish hours... If arm fixes that, it's a killer form factor.
Good point about Windows 11. I use a Surface Pro 8 (with i7) and am trying to find out if upgrading to Surface Pro 11 is a better idea than upgrading my iPad Pro 12.8 inch 2018 to Surface Pro M4. I like Windows a lot. Not sure if it is because I have used Windows 11 a lot more but I really prefer it over MacOS though I cannot say anything about either that I really don't like. I am leaning to upgrading to Surface Pro 11+ when Lunar Lake comes out and upgrade my iPad Pro to iPad M2 11 inch rather than a 13 inch. This will depend a lot on how well the Samsung Ring works and how well it integrates with the Samsung S24 Ultra and the Galaxy Watch. I expect Apple will come out with Apple Ring but not until likely 2026 which is a long time. I am an artist and prefer the iPad Pencil 2 over the Slim Pen though the Slim Pen is fine. If Microsoft would upgrade to a Surface Pen that is a complete rival to the Apple Pencil Pro I will go with upgrading Surface Pro.
@TheEverydayDad - If your dock is a Thunderbolt dock, it'll have issues with non-Thunderbolt systems and multiple monitors - because when using the Thunderbolt chip to provide multi-mon, it only works with Thunderbolt hosts. If you want something to be truly universal, you need a non-Thunderbolt dock that does DisplayPort MST over displayport or USB-C. If you want a dock that works with the Surface port on the side that the PSU plugs into, you'll want to get a Surface Dock 2 (and make absolutely certain the firmware on it is up-to-date) - if you absolutely need to use a Thunderbolt dock with something that doesn't use Thunderbolt, you'll have to plug an MST hub into one of the video out ports on the Thunderbolt dock (and test it to validate that it works with the dock it's plugged into as well) to get multi-mon out of a Thunderbolt port that does DP alt mode.
I am in a more "managerial" position, meaning, office work all the time, messaging, zoom meetings, google sheets, etc... and I use my Tab S7+ with a logitech mouse and keyb (yes the Master 3 mouse) and everything works fine... connected to my external display and wired network, no problem... and I take it home and use it as a tablet the rest of the time, couldn't be more happy with it. A glitch here and there, but nothing noteworthy
I said it on the last video and I'll say it here: stop bending the keyboard backwards. It detaches for a reason, and if the ribbon cable under the cover cracks the entire super expensive thing has to be replaced. It's happened to me. More than once. Otherwise, I mostly agree with everything said here. I think the Surface acutally works very well as a tablet, it's just a tablet that turns into a laptop with a single gesture. And yes, those of us who bought into this idea ages ago have always known. We just kinda needed all the annoyances of Win x64 regarding battery life and sleep states and noise to be resolved. Which they have. I weirdly agree that the Pro 11 is a game changer but coming from the other side: it's not a new concept for a laptop, it's the hardware catching up with the old concept for a 2-in-1 and making ti as smooth as an ARM tablet. I love it.
the keyboard ribbon cracking due to bending backwards used to be a problem on earlier surface keyboards but I believe it's been fixed now. Being able to bend the keyboard back like the cover of a book is one of the main selling features of getting the Surface Pro or any other 2 in 1 for that matter, you don't want to be constantly attaching and detaching the keyboard all the time.
Thanks for postiing this. I'm currently using a Surface Pro 9, my third surface. I don't think I'm quite ready to upgrade just yet, but the 11 looks very promising indeed.
This looks awesome but I've been thinking lately that I very rarely use a Windows device outside of my job, which they supply. Between my S22 and Tab S9, I only use my laptop when I need to use a windows only program. I think the last time was when I did my taxes. I'm just not sure I can justify a purchase like this considering how little I use my current laptop, which runs all the windows stuff without having to use a compatability mode.
Have you tried the Minisforum V3? I can't help but think at the moment Ryzen might be the way to go while ARM Windows finds it's feet. Also love that it can be used as a second display, making it a great personal device to add a second screen to a work laptop when travelling.
Surface pro 11 is a step in the right direction. The rest (or most of the rest) depends on compatible vs emulated vs native performance. Pretty much like iPadPro M4, which depends on iPadOS. Hardware wise surface pro 11 still takes the crown because it can do much more. I don't think Microsoft surface line waa ever about the 'best'. I think the tag line was 'original by design'. Anyway, marketing aside, it still took them up until surface pro 9 to get close to my goldilocks case. I can't use XElite yet because my apps are niche and not supported. So I am satisfied and happy with my 32GB ram surface pro 9. I did upgrade to the new flex keyboard though. Which you can't with apple because my partner can't borrow my apple pencil 2 anymore to work on his shiny new ipad air. Honestly though, it is 'cheap' of apple (or any company) to bring out products that's not backward compatible. So while Microsoft is taking a step in the right direction Apple is going down my value and perception chain. Maybe that's another reason new copilot 2-in-1s looks like a better option to spend. Most of us have to choose one and surface pro is still best spec on any 2-in-1 category
I had one of the early Surface Pros and was impressed with the build quality, it was an excellent device, but these days I like the new Surface Laptop better.
I agree with you! I would say this is the first time the Surface Pro "really" did what it should do. I think in the past few years, the most pain point of the Surface Pro is it does not have a really suitable chip. The Snapdragon X chip (especially X Plus) really solves this pain point!
Yeah.. That would be awesome.. But would would be super awesome is if Nvidia succeeds with the own Arm GPU and partners with Snapdragon and Laptop makers to bring a good and very very very efficient gpu to these laptops.. Maybe not exactly x86 dedicated gpu level, but very close and very very very efficient. That would be incredible.
Even this elease could improve just by having applications built for it. Every developer and company is ignoring it, not releasing native builds for it. Probably will be abandoned in 6 months.
@@bassyey I think this time is different. All prior ARM pushes for Windows have essentially failed, but I think Microsoft fully on board this time. I have the new Surface Pro tablet because I'm a developer and wanted to try Windows on ARM. I think Intel has Lunar Lake (is that right) that might bring it back into the game, but I expect that ARM will finally take this time.
Finally someone did a 1 week review instead of just the 1st impressions review. Because I can't find a review between the 3 different softwares (Windows, Android, iOS). seeing you have experience with all 3 ecosystems, can you help me answer this aching question I have : The price for all 3 are around the same ball park. With a limited budget, I could only get either one of these base models, (+ with a pen it would be great to use it for ideas drafting / sketching) 1. Surface Pro 11 (Snapdragon X Plus, 16GB RAM, 256GB Storage) 2. Samsung Tab S9 Ultra (Snapdragon 8 Gen 2, 12GB RAM, 256GB Storage) 3. iPad Pro 11-inch (M4, ?? RAM, 256GB Storage) A little background for what I'll use it for, I'm working in a remote/hybrid office so I travel with my laptop everywhere, along with my 2nd portable monitor, Logitech MX Master 3 mouse, Bluetooth keyboard, etc etc) I mainly will be using it for work, chrome based sites, with usually 30+ Tabs open (some just sit in the background) and sometimes would be using it for Fusion 360 for 3d modelling and 3d printing slicers But which would be worth the money? in my head, to go with the Surface Pro because theres little to no learning curve as I use Windows on the daily as well. But I'm afraid of making the wrong decision and burning through a lot of money for something I might regret buying. 💸 Thank you in advance for those answering 🙏
The other two tablets you've listed are just expensive toys. The Surface will let you get shit done as long as the software you use has an ARM version (I don't believe the translation layer is very good yet although I still have an x86-based Surface so can't really comment on it).
Goodnotes is the way to go. At the moment windows is a second class citizen but it has most of the capabilities it does on iPad and is single payment unlike notability.
You said it is like how the M1 macbook air felt when it came out as far as a game changer. I adopted the M1 MacBook Pro a few years ago and have no regrets. I'm looking for something like this. A fully functional laptop with great battery life and performance. So far I'm leaning towards this one. Not sure any of the other Snapdragon laptops match it overall.
I have the exact same spec of Surface Pro 11 and just love the device. For me, it's the first Windows laptop I've ever had that can truly do everything! Work stuff (courseware testing though a Remote Desktop connection)? Check. Games? Check. Media consumption? Check. Long battery life? Check. There's still going to be a few snags with this transition from x86 to ARM, but Microsoft definitely seems to be giving it their all this time around!
Interesting competitor to the M4. I'm not a super user who likes to get on the action at the beginning. I can hold out for more apps to be available and it becomes a seamless integration.
This is the first product from Microsoft I’m actually considering to purchase, as this is what I’m after now in an everyday device. And this is from an Apple user since 2009. Just wish Apple did release something similar to what Microsoft has done with the surface pro (know they won’t just yet). They have the hardware (iPad) and accessories (Magic Keyboard and Apple Pencil) to do it, but iPadOS really limits it.
In the same boat. Been waiting for years to see Apple release a touch laptop or a solid iPad OS lite variant... Apple is committed to keeping their touch interfaces and desktop OS' separate... and I have paid a lot of money for it. For the first time I actually enjoy Android and Windows 11 more than Mac OS or iOS. May be moving to a Surface Pro as well.
They just let you dual boot and macOS on just the most expensive iPad pros or something that would be useful. Or if they were less stubborn about supporting touch on Mac OS. Don't nderstand Apple fans who defend that because you don't have to use a touch screen it's optional. Having the option to buy one even if it's an additional cost would be nice
Surface Docks can be a little finicky, especially the older ones. Try downloading firmware for it (not always done automatically). Try unplugging everything and plug the monitor in first. If you have more than one monitor, the reverse the monitor inputs. Because most USB devices are turned off when the laptop goes to sleep, it can cause issues when waking up. When plugged in set the Surface to never sleep. I have tried setting USB devices to always on, but that doesn't stop all the problems. Ethernet on the Docks is usually slower than 1GB and it is also possible that stray voltages on the ethernet wire is causing some of the problems. Using a USB3 ethernet adapter often works better. Surface also works well with USB docks. A bit of a shame to not completely use the Microsoft power port, but that's mostly your OCD talking. I've never really had issues or limitations using a USB dock. USB docks are cheaper anyway.
I am a fan of Windows 11 arm. I've been using it for the past 16 months daily to see if I could live with it, and the conclusion is a big yes. I plan to purchase a Surface Pro 11 when the 5G models become available. This will be instead of upgrading my M1 12.9-inch iPad Pro to a M4 model, because iPad OS has too many limitations, wasting the performance of the underlying hardware and is not a desktop class OS. I now consider iPad OS as iPoor OS, and a M Series iPad Pro will never be capable of replacing a laptop due to the OS limitations and being locked into a closed ecosystem where most of the apps are mediocre and written for smartphones.
Another youtuber asked do u want a lap toppy tablet or a tablety laptop? As silly as it sounds that is an accurate question when deciding what device works best for you.
according to other tests, around 45 °C because the cpu/gpu throttles down to prevent overheating and excessive power draw (depends on energy profile in Windows)
Still waiting for a good NUC-like ARM PC or All-in-One. Although I prefer Mac for personal use, I manage a large fleet of Windows PC's (~250) and can't wait for them to have similar efficiency as the M-series chips!
It's basically an i5/r5 performance at price of almost i9/r9 but arm too. Looking forward to its 2nd or 3rd gen when softwares be better optimized so the gap is just i5 vs i7.
My only concern is: is it useful for Programmers? like Python and Web Development? As it's battery life is great and they are cheap, I am thinking of going for one but I am not sure about programming.
@@ahmetenesbozcal2627 Yeah, some apps work, some doesn't like SQL isn't arm based yet but Python is. So it's a tradeoff but SQL will work on it as x86 app.
After throwing my money away on a Surface Pro 7 that overheated any day of the week ending in the letter "y," no, I'll never consider another Surface product. That being said, I noticed a lot of the positives in this review were about the form factor of the Surface Pro, while most of the complaints were about Windows on ARM issues. Mind you, a Windows build for ARM CPUs has been a thing for about 9 years now, with commercially available Windows on ARM devices around for about 7 years (I think). That so many applications are either just now in beta for Windows on ARM, or still relying on emulation to run, with so many PC manufacturers on board is, well, something.
if you can check, check out the temps based throttling because Microsoft chose to force low wrist-wrest temps. This to me is the death sentence. My AMD 8845HS is faster and well cooled minus the keyboard temps but for never throttling, I am super happy
In the UK, it is £1050 for the base SP, £340 for the keyboard, and £100 for a pen. The OLED is at least another £500 more. The base SP only comes with 256GB, so as most people complain, it costs another £200 for 512GB. So the non-OLED could set you back £1700 for the above-recommended specs. That is awful value, especially as some videos show it has performance issues.
I have the surface dock 2 that I use with my surface pro 11 and it works perfect. I did buy it now paid full price. I use it with my old surface nine so perhaps your doc is broken but a good doc goes a long way.
AHHHH, Coke Zero. I love it. lol. The fans and the battery life are absolutely what are keeping me away from any Windows laptop. Nothing can compete with a MacBook's battery life and magnificent sound of silence.
I'm curious why you bought a Surface Dock if you already have a Thunderbolt dock for yoru Mac? I'd be curious if you had issues with your existing dock! (I bought an SP11 for personal use, and it works with my work Thunderbolt dock just fine, so I can just flip between work computer and home computer)
Zero guarantee it will objectively get better! Microsoft has danced with ARM before and lost focus when Intel/AMD made improvements. No reason it couldn’t happen again.
Warning, if you use the SP outdoors, it is unusable unless you find the shade, too reflective. Maybe a matte screen protector would help, but it is a major problem if you are a road warrior.
Im definitely looking forward to the next few generations of arm windowd surface devices. I own a surface pro 6 with an i7 16gb ram abd 512 ssd and had no isuses with it. I use it for everyday usage as well as web development and video editing. I dont game on it and never will do. I own a rog ally with a 3080 card for it. But for me i can't not recommend the surface decices as they for me are best in class with all their own laptops. I have a dell 2 in 1 dor work and its not anywhere near as good as my surface 6. Thay said with Arm im excited to see where things go once the app supprt is there as i have fallen to the arm sucker punch before with the original surface rt
So if i wanna edit videos i still better use apple? I really dont wanna support apple, but video and picture (raw files) editing on the go is what i need...
The thing I like the best about this review, is Apple is going to see it, and it is a slap in the fact to what Apple is doing. The iPad is an outstanding piece of hardware, but purposely crippled for the purpose of Apple's bottom line, at the expense of capability to the consumer. Everything you said about this, the iPad could do, if Apple had allowed it to do so. This level of enthusiasm could have been directed Apples way, but Apple wants you to buy two things, and not one. Good on you Microsoft. Thank you for making a product as good as you technically could, and not have a meeting internally where you say "yea, we could allow it to do that, but let's not, so we sell more Mac Books."
Apple is expected to sell 9 million iPad Pros in 2024. The Surface Pro will sell a few million. Most people do not want a laptop-hybrid-tablet; they want the best tablet, and they use a separate laptop for a no-compromise solution.
Most iPad owners don’t buy the pencil. Should they remove the feature because most people don’t use it? No. Having pencil support takes nothing away from those that simply don’t care about the feature. There is nothing architecturally different about the iPad, then the Mac book air. It would be simple to offer a feature, to allow desktop mode when the keyboard is plugged in, and disable the screen. I am sure they have already done something like this internally. And, if you don’t want it, don’t use it. But not having it is a numbers game Apple plays, and not a technical decision.
This die hard Apple fan boy is certainly considering the Surface Pro 11. Apple is not moving in the right direction with their OS, iOS, or their crippled hardware. Apple is also losing much of their market in China and has never had as commanding a share in the EU... Apple needs to take notice and truly start innovating again. Steve Job's created a trailblazing empire with the release of Bondi Blue, now they are in many ways copying or playing catch up. With Jobs we got iPod, iPhone, iPad, Logic, etc. etc., Sans Steve Jobs we are getting a new calculator and movable widgets as WWDC highlights! Losing their one ace in the hole with their Apple Silicon (Arm chips) may be a financial game changer... and the drama continues.
well i have to ask.... how does it really perform for gaming? if im gonna spend a lump sum on this device, i want to know how it performs for *light* gaming. nothing insane but just casual planet coaster or nolimits2. (roller coaster games)
If it can run warcraft enough for me to do dailies while I'm travelling in Europe, I will be stoked. I'm getting older too, so my choice of games doesn't have to be the flashiest with the best graphics. So it doesn't have to be a 10 pound fan machine of a laptop. Just let me run my basic shit on low settings so I can do the "mechanics" of it, and I'll enjoy the flashy bits at home on my big-boy PC.
Nice. If Qualcomm can catch up to the M Pro and M Max chips, I'll be very interested. Really need more power for high-res photo and 6/8K video editing. Yeah there are workarounds, but I'm happy to wait until that day. I'll stick with my M3 Max until then (and my Samsung phone lol).
