I Tried The NEW Prayerbook, This Is What I Found 

Sax's write up for cruor's vow - Cruor's Vow Rework Short desc. Successful attacks on an enemy add bleed stacks. Moving enemies bleed out. Less effective on very agile targets. Long desc. Each successful hitsplat on an enemy adds bleed stacks. The more bleed stacks on an enemy, the more stacks the next attack will add (up to a cap of 50 stacks). Each tick that enemy moves, half the stacks will be consumed (rounding down) and deal damage based on how many stacks were on the enemy prior to its movement. Sounds familiar? Zebak's chomp already has a similar effect! For example, let's see how this would work on Bloat from ToB with a Scythe, [the best possible damage output case for this prayer]: Bloat "goes down" (For simplicity, let's assume your scythe always rolls 3 successful hitsplats.) You attack Bloat. (Bloat has 1+2+3 = 6 stacks.) You attack Bloat again. (Bloat has 6 + 4+5+6 = 21 stacks.) You attack Bloat again. (Bloat has 21 + 7+8+9 = 45 stacks.) You attack Bloat one more time (Bloat has 45 + 10 = 55 stacks, rounded down to 50 because he's at the cap.) (Let's decide for now that 1 stack = 0.5 damage, rounding down. This can be balanced later.) He stands up for the first time and moves, He takes 50 stacks worth of damage (25 dmg). He moves again. He takes 25 stacks worth of damage (12 dmg). He moves again. He takes 12 stacks worth of damage (6 dmg). He moves again. He takes 6 stacks worth of damage (3 dmg). He moves again. He takes 3 stacks worth of damage (1 dmg). He moves again. He takes 1 stack worth of damage (0 dmg). All of the stacks are now consumed. Let's assume you decide to hit bloat while he's already moving. He moves on the next tick, consuming the stack immediately, taking only 1 stack worth of damage (0 dmg). It's completely useless again targets that always move and less effective against enemies that move frequently as you won't be able to gather as many stacks. This prevents the prayer being too strong on targets that you would already normally kite (Zilyana for example). You also don't have to *camp* the vow, only turning it on when the opportunity arises. This enables a minigame that can be played to make the most of this prayer. Players would now have the choice of thinking about an NPC's positioning and their own. For example, "pogtanking" Verzik p3 would now have a big benefit, as you could stack bleed onto her and move her only after she reaches her cap. Thoughts? Feedback? Feel free to leave a comment!

this video is based more towards pvm so i understand why you said metabolise is bad, i believe it will be great in pvp/pking since combo eating IS something that happens during combat

Metabolize is good for pvp where you do use hard food. Getting your attack in 1 tick faster is huge. Keep it. I love your changes to the Vows. I have a good one for Fumas tho. While poisoned, Fumas vow slows prayer drain based on poison severity, and all poison damage dealt to your hp is equally healed as prayer points. This could work to offset the intense prayer drain of the spell book in some circumstances at the cost of further loses to your hp.

“Ya BuT wHaT dO yOu ThInK aBoUt OdA?”

another gnomonkey banger. always great to hear your take, very informative and well-thought

Scrap the whole book

I don't know how Reddit thinks these Prayers need to be scrapped when they can't even do content that requires them to leave the Woodcutting guild or Giant Mole.

"Not sure about the perfect solution" - in regards to overhead protection What about the original pitch: 2 sets of protection overheads (absorb/ dampen), one chips prayer the other chips health?

Vile vigour is really good for ZMI on iron when you dont want to use stams.

I can't stand those reddit mouth breathers begging them to scrap this. Its insane that Jagex uses reddit as the games official forum to begin with.

curses were rs2 not rs3.

I would keep Metabolise because of pvp but it probably needs to have either a lower drain rate for the 15 second ramp time or keep the drain rate the same but lower the ramp time to 10 seconds or so.

Omg finally a well crafted and thoughtful take. Thank you gnomonkey you’re the hero we need but don’t deserve

ill tell ya you missed nothing using the prayers in toa. the reflects were okay, i even put on quiet prayers to let it really work for its intended purpose but didnt seem that beneficial. without quiet prayers it was basicly the same as norm book except you have vows which heals did lots of nothing and the poison you could only use certain rooms. gambit seemed to really shine, maybe instead of a whole new book we instead have a prayer expansion that adds the vows in a less buggy/more beneficial, gambit and the prayer boosts seems pretty significant all of the rest just looked like filler for an excuse for a new book instead of a set of prayer prots/boosts gambit and vows we could just unlock

Alright, Jagex, here it is. Some of the only feedback actually worth listening to

the prayers largely do the same things and are used in the same way as the old ones, whats the point?

6:50 whatever makes scythe more useful in this game i will vote for. its so useless rn and out matched by shittier and easier weapons to obtain

They stupidly tried to make a 'risk vs reward' prayer book to sit alongside the vanilla version, without realising maybe it would've just made more fucking sense to have it 100% specialised and focused around streamlining basic slayer further and/or giving a new angle to PvP. This idea by Jagex that it should at all even be considered for raids or bosses is awful, and feels like a massive waste of energy pursuing it design-wise.

We definitely need curses.. these prayers are trash

Are they still making it one tick unflickable? That was the worst thing to hear imo as I love 1 ticking.

Been waiting for this video. a bit sad you didn't put any footage of using the new prayers.

Add protect item Pls gagek

as someone who did some 500s on beta worlds due to a spooned yellow gem, can say that prayers definitely aren't unplayable and theyre very good, zebak with essentially more accurate quiet prayers chip is as annoying as ever, but very doable and the prayers are very good. as a question, do you think its ever worth taking the b ring upgrade or new magic ring over lightbearer even as something like a switch or is the quality of life of having more spec too good to pass up? great content as always

Honestly, just give us Ancient Curses. It won’t be the same as RS3 because there is no EOC.

thoughts on Mod Trident and Stella?

I would love to see vows be more situational than they currently are. They’re interesting and different. Anyone who thinks the prayer drain on the new book is too high is *probably* camping vows, without them the drain feels really balanced for the increased dps and utility. I also like the chip damage personally, it does restrict some content but I think that’s healthy, I’m not sure I like the reflect damage though as it’s just additional dps coming from a mechanic that doesn’t feel good to begin with.

I guess I missed the required reading assignment because I don't know what any of these prayers actually do.

I know you do only pvm and propably hate pvp. But if you are judging prayers as they are, you have to include all sides from them - pk aspect as well.

Man I have zero exp to make an opinion here I just want to thank you for reminding me baba is you exists

all your ideas are great and wont actually fuck pvp very nice vid

By far one of the brightest minds in our community. It blows my mind you dont work for Jagex yet.

Thank you for this! Very well explained as always

Always love the in depth content from ya

Accursed sceptre would be nice on beta worlds too :)

Would be more fun if that pray adding mage dmg to attacks was 3 prays each converting ur hits into mage range or melee. Could be kinda broken tho i guess

Great video and suggestions

Forget the calculations for a second. I want the prayers effects to draw thematically from what one could think of as being at the root of these ancient powers. Creativity people!

Omg so nice the baba is you soundtrack

Hello, I agree that changes should be made and that some of the prayers are useless as is. I feel the book should benefit all player skill bases not just the elite and should be best for pvp and pvm needing a grandmaster quest to unlock it. Also I like that the rs3 curses have the best damage boosting prayer at 95/99 as it gives people a reason to push high levels, I feel the most powerful boosting prayers at lv 76/80 is to low and should minimum be 85. The average player will like extra damage to help them overcome bosses they might not be able to do with out the extra help and damage. Maybe a tweaked ancient curses is the way?

I'd rather Jagex poll Ancients Curses Pre EoC circa 2009 (RS2) with a rebalance to the Soulsplit Healing effect vs Npcs in PVM since that's where all the complaints are coming from, over this rsps styled themed experimental "new prayer book" doesn't fit at all. It's completely alien. Is this RS4?

While I agree with most of your changes and recommendations, I think you're overlooking the average player. The average player is not a god tier pvmer like you, and therefore some of these can be too punishing for them. For example, I agree that the higher level offensive prayers should have negative defense, but I worry that -25% may be too much. I disagree on changing Fumus vow. It does need to be fixed where broken, but I otherwise really enjoyed the risk vs reward of that prayer.

as a top 0.01%er as a pvmer, your opinion matters but these prayers are boring af and super underwhelming for probably a high majority of the player base. I don't know if I'd prefer curses but I absolutely would prefer to scrap this new book as is. It doesn't change anything except make the game more sweaty for literally the top 1%.

Is that Baba Is You as the background music?

love the FTL music!

ill never get it, why they didnt add turmoil prayers.

FTL soundtrack is amazing!

hey, what addon is that which displays the percentage number/health colouring? cheers

New skill, new prayers, new irl goals. Appears my rs career is soon to end

sounds like power kreep

loved the vid and thought everything you said was perfect. are ancient curses on the table though? i'd +1 that

One of the vows should:if you miss an attack with melee for example, it would reroll a rebranded mage attack with your mage bonuses to the target. It could be for like 1/10th the adjusted possible max hit.

This is the same as EOC

the solution to chip damage is to add the chip effect onto the offensive prayers so if your using offensive prayers your taking 10% damage through your protect so if you want to prevent all damage you have to flick your offensive prayer

Getting ready 4 Leagues boyz?

I think we could also fix Cruor's vow by making it heal more (maybe around 3-5%?) but only having it be usable for for a period with a cooldown after. Would allow it to be more impactful while also adding an element of strategy in to how / when it would be used. The percent it heals and the cooldown (maybe 30 seconds up with a 2.5 minutes cooldown after?) would be, in my opinion easier to balance than the razors edge that is adding an up 100% of the time you have the pray points pseudo soul split. I think in general if we treated all the vows like this (by applying stronger effects but varying cooldown times) it would make the whole concept of the book feel more rewarding and change the way our character interacts with the prayer book in a similar way to how the ancient Spellbook changed magic back in the day. (BTW you could also take the cooldown idea and apply it to the Cruors vow bleed rework Sax and yourself came up with. I think it could be helpful to add a cooldown, if having a bleed effect up every time it would be useful proves to be too powerful when tested.)

CG test possible?

Very much agree with this assessment (though Im not at this level of PvM). The problem with umbra you didn't really mention is that the amount of defense you lower is tuned a little low. It can take hundreds of damage to get anywhere close to the 15% reduction. For example I only was able to lower 3 or so defense against a dark beast (220 hp) while camping it the whole kill. It would need to be buffed just a bit since you have to hit high to overcome it rounding down.

Nice FTL music. Love that game

You seem to be near the top of PvM content so I'm glad you made this video to give some insight, but I do have a couple questions. Mainly, how necessary do you feel this type of content is at this point in the game? For instance, if they had actually released a prayerbook entirely dedicated to skilling-related prayers, essentially leaving you and others that share the same preferred gameplay loop as you with no new content outside of the DT2 bosses. Would you feel like you're close to running out of content you're interested in doing at the moment? Also, with these prayer suggestions, personally I'm beginning to question Jagex's quality of theorycrafting. If releasing these prayers, do you trust them going forward to release content that now has to be balanced around both sets of prayers? It already seems difficult considering all the factors that have to be weighed, and its becoming clear that they don't have anybody on staff that understands them as well as somebody in your position. I feel like this content cycle is a lot all at once. I don't think it should all be scrapped, but feel pretty confidently that most of these things could be trickled into the game after more R&D and feedback, however I'm not nearly at the level of nitty-gritty top end game knowledge as yourself, so I'd be interested to know your perspective.

Now it’s scrapped lmao

complaining for 10 minute voice over a random raid instead of showing us at least some content of you using the prayers...

Gameplay aside the color pallette is reason enoguh for me to vote no

Cruor’s is hot garbage. It’s a 10% chance to heal 10% of the damage dealt. So a 1/10 chance to heal roughly a 2-4 on average. It’s literally the worst passive healing in the game. Blood fury is 20% chance to heal 30% of damage dealt; guthans is a 25% chance to heal 100% of damage dealt. Bloodfury and guthans obviously have downsides; fury consumes a bloodshard; guthans degrades and isn’t too accurate. Even so, cruor’s vow should at least be a viable option/alternative. It needs a buff. Something like keeping the 10% chance to proc heal but the % heal is between 35-40%, making heals still a little rare but they heal a good amount when they do go off; or a 35% to proc heal while keeping it at 10% heal from damage, making it more consistent small heals for better longevity over the course of a fight, but not a saving grace from big damage. Also the deflection prayers suck and it’s not what the player base had in mind when they voted for them. Players wanted deflection prayers as they were when ancient curses came out. 90% protection with 10% deflection 100% of the time. This nonsense or 90% protection with a 50% chance to deflect 10% damage is not what we wanted and Jagex knows that.

Agree totally with the changes to deflects. Taking massive chip damage from jads was really dumb. I thought they'd do something similar to rs3s prayers, where certain monsters would just be blocked 100% of the time. Jads on rs3 last I checked still do no damage if you pray correctly, but almost every other npc hits through prayer slightly.

This gnomo guys ideas are completely a joke and is just trying to make rs easy scape. As a elitist member of the high level HLC level community I completely disagree with him. Colorful prayers and widespread layout tests a players eyesight and apm. Grouping them together so it's easier to click may as well be the new auto hot keys. And so what if everyone plays with quiet prayers on? You're supposed to tick eat guthix rest + magic imbue every single second for max efficiency anyway. Too poor for blood fury? Too bad, maybe run a vyre alt? Not my problem that a dude who got 8 undeserved shadows can't afford to use blood fury for the new deflects. This gnomo guy needs to stay quiet and listen to reddit instead of blabbering on about his opinions when he still constantly planks at cms and toa.

Bruh..just go work for jagex and make us a perfect game :D

great stuff thanks

Thank you father gnomonkey, for without you I was blind.

What music did you use in this video?

Dammit. Now I gotta go play FTL.

You da best ty 🔥

that sheesh was so cringe

Maybe less chip, 5%? Unless they make the blood vow more soul split like deflects chip damage are too much for osrs as praying correctly is half the game

The GOAT has returned to bring us wisdom.

Metabolize has a number of uses outside of the echo chamber of high end raiding that you live in smh.

6:28 No to all these stack affects trying to be introduced. This isn't league of legends.

Overall I find the new prayers entirely uninteresting. They're just broken extra damage combined with boring and tedious chip damage. We don't need this. What gap is this filling?

Rebuke doesnt need a 15% self dmg buff, with out overheads your already losing 100% of your overhead, i think jagex overlooked this.

SHEEEEEEEEEEESH

"Curses from rs3" they were introduced pre eoc and aren't the reason people quit until osrs. Stop parroting the reddit cry baby bullshit about everything currently in rs3 being a result of eoc/rs3. A lot of pre eoc updates were fine and a lot of content in osrs is just reskinned pre eoc content that people enjoy using.

I still think curses would fit better in osrs

The deflect prayers, new damage prayers and metabolize are wayyy too OP for PVP. If this book releases, I hope it isn't allowed there.

So why aren’t they like (temp) hiring people such as yourself who truly know the mechanics of this game. People who play constantly and know the content in and out. Also have some well versed PKers. Make the game for the people. Not just random thoughts from people who farm and play 2 hours a month on the game they work for.

Great breakdown/ explanation. very well thought out, thank you.

pog

Theese prayers need a pvm only variant of soul split or it wont work or be fun for a casual like me 💓

I got downvoted on reddit for saying it would be a shame to scrap the prayer book and provide an opportunity for the games skill cap to increase lmao

Pog

we really shouldn't be listening to reddit for anything, i'm not gonna lie. they're gonna be crying about anything and everything

Lmao I hope jagex doesn't watch your useless video You already had your chance bud

Yayyy finally some real criticism from a content creator

buy a new mic my dear friend, if not possible please do some eq work man

First!

Remove the whole prayer book. Stop making osrs similar to rs3. Yall rs3 Andy's will kill both games. More and more of you guys are headed to OSRS leaving rs3 behind. Not only do you actively kill your game (rs3) you divide the osrs community

as a player base, why do we allow updates like this to be even humored anymore? why arn't we demanding better Dev's that arn't a complete joke? the game barley has at most another 5 years in it. the main player base is 30 and only came back because of covid, mobile, and original old-school. Once we reach another 2-5 years the average player is going to have a family or other responsibilities that wont allow the same player base time for runescape. I turley believe this is the ending all update to the game.

Complete rip-off from rs3 I see people soulsplitting at the inferno……… quitting the game when it comes out. Game is heading same direction as rs3

"Curses from rs3" they were introduced pre eoc and aren't the reason people quit until osrs. Stop parroting the reddit cry baby bullshit about everything currently in rs3 being a result of eoc/rs3. A lot of pre eoc updates were fine and a lot of content in osrs is just reskinned pre eoc content that people enjoy using.