Have you watched any videos from Audioholics? Proven, repeatable results based on real science. I agree with a lot of what Gene says, as it's based on solid knowledge.
My best friend is an absolute passionate person for audio since forever, and currently does repairs and upgrades to amps and speakers. Back in the day when he talked about speaker cables and crossover stuff I thought it was a bit too much and over the top... until I gave it a chance. Now.. Speaker cables are probably the least important of those 2 things, but they do make a difference. That high-hat may sound crisper, or the drum punch more dry, which it can arguably make the music sound better, but I do agree that for the average person, you have to be thinking about it to really notice it. As for crossovers... That's another story. I currently have a set of speakers which can only be described as "Frankenstein" and they are sure to make anyone roll their eyes and be confused. Why? Well, Dynaudio tweeters with... 16" car audio Focal woofers. The magical piece that makes them work? The crossover. My friend made it from scratch and built these speakers for me because the (fairly beat up) woofers were the last gift my late grandfather gave me and I wanted to use them at home. He used high quality capacitors and cables, took a month to tune them to his liking and this weird thing that shouldn't work (and didn't using the crossover that was originally packed with the woofers), turned out to be simply amazing. I have no words for them, clean, crisp, perfectly balanced sound whether I'm watching a movie or listening to music. You're going to think I'm crazy and I understand that... But hey, crossovers saved my speakers.
Been using WBC and Monolith speaker cables for a while. Not much sense in paying more for copper that comes from the same planet. Stands for bookshelves are a must. Hi Res audio does sound better.
Hi Rez audio probably doesn't matter when dealing with cheap ass audio. Glad to see this channel maturing. Measurements are important so manufacturers can make the 1000th piece sound similar to the first.
@@carlosoliveira-rc2xt Cheap or inexpensive audio components can put out some pretty damn good sound. OTOH, many of the specs with high-end gear are solely academic. The weakest link in HiFi is the human ear. Even to the most fastidious listener, performance and fidelity are subjective. Even with a live performance indoors, no auditorium has perfect acoustics. The only way to virtually eliminate acoustic distortion is to listen in an anechoic chamber with no furniture. Even then, sound quality is subjective, even though "performance" and "fidelity" may be partly academic. I know. I've lost several wives that way.
@@gyrgrls Not true. In an anechoic chamber you'll be disturbed by the sound of your pulse. My point regarding cheap audio was not that you can't achieve pleasant audio experiences but specifically Hi Rez audio and for that matter anything that enhances nuances probably can't be resolved by cheap audio gear. For example a $200 SACD player playing an SACD will not sound better than an expensive high-end player playing a regular CD. You may not even be able to discern the difference on that cheap player.
@@carlosoliveira-rc2xt or an expensive one either. The hi-res thing is something of a marketing football more than a real thing for a start. I understand there is no standard and there are are few real "hi-res" masters, just resampling of CD quality masters. How can that be hi-res if its just a resampled CD? I can't even imagine why anyone would go to the expense to remaster just for streaming anyway.
My rule of thumb is if I have to strain myself to hear the difference, it's not worth it. Never critical listen. Life is short. So much music to enjoy! My gear upgrades simply fixes one annoyance or another. 'Good enough' is end game.
If you must 'have-it-all', ask WHY? Deciding to reach beyond your grasp isn't a lot of fun,. It's a lot of effort for small measures of temporary bliss. Learn how to be content and then going about other 'fun' things. Much easier on your nerves.
You're the man Randy, to admit to a change of point of view takes guts, a lot of people fight tooth and nail for their original point of view no matter what. The truth is that we learn and grow as time goes and get more exposure to new experiences.
Love this channel! I have more respect for anyone who can admit a mistake- big or small. For playback resolution, (and this is just my personal opinion which means nothing in the grand scheme of things) - the recording quality is just as important if not more than a good DAC or good equipment. A crap recording can still sound crappy with good equipment.
And it goes the other way too! An expereience: Get your friends over let them play their music. Not really reacting positively to probably the best speakers they ever heard*. And i was confused, why arent they hearing it. But it only took me a few minutes to decide to play my music, which is chosen much more carefully from not only music i like but also well produced sound. And at this point i have people saying oh you have such good taste and i love that and that track. But really what they like is just the sound quality itself. Sure maybe also the tracks to some degree, but because the whole sonic experience was so much better than usual they also just enjoyed the music that much more. * not saying my system is amazing, rater that usually people listen to something that is quite bad(Gaming headset/most consumer products) or at most decent(parents old setup).
True true. It gets worse as you go up the food chain. Classic example is the Rolling stones. I love the Rolling stones but it doesn't matter if it's original vinyl reissued vinyl Remastered vinyl 24 bit digital remasters DSD or SACD. They sound pretty poor. Whereas the Beatles sound great on plain cd or 1970s vinyl and wonderful on hires DSD etc. Quite like oasis almost unlistenable on CD. Trip hop and stuff like William orbit sound incredible. Engineers and producers have a lot to answer for
good recording and mastering is actually far more important than the DAC during playback. Because if the recording is crap and they've mastered it poorly, it doesn't matter how good your DAC is, you aren't going to be able to fix it. You can't make up for poor gain settings, lost dynamic range, clipping, etc. The best you can do is mangle it just right so it doesn't sound terrible. But therein lies the significant appeal behind tube amps and vinyl. It's analog signal manipulation that gives you a sound you like, even if it isn't the most accurate to the original sound. And that's really all that matters.
As a headphone collector I will say that nice cables make a difference in the overall experience since you're constantly touching them and swapping them out with different headphones. A cable that looks and feels premium and durable, has a nice tactile feel when you plug it in, doesn't kink or snag or tangle, etc. definitely represents a quality of life improvement. It might also have a psychological impact - handling the more premium-feeling cables is a constant reminder that you're using nice equipment and might help to convince yourself that the music sounds better as a result. That being said, if someone blindfolded me and made me A/B test two different cables I'm almost certain I wouldn't be able to tell the difference via sound.
The only thing this video proves is that you are a reasonable man and reviewer. So many folks want to make everything about hifi cut and dry, black and white and as you perfectly explained, it’s just not that simple. I wish more folks would understand that maybe, just maybe “both camps” are “right” and there is no “correct” answer …Unless we are talking about salsa. The correct answer is Andrew Jones Brit’ select. It tastes like ketchup and tomatoes had a baby. Delicious.
@@cheapaudioman Albums recorded in 1971 & before, were all recorded 100% with tube Analog recorders. Everything recorded in 1972 & after was recorded with digital transistors. All cds are recorded with digital transistors. The 1971 & before cds are partly vinyl recordings & part digital. Yes, older recordings on cds are part vinyl recordings. Some people discuss that cd is better than viyl, some cds are part vinyl. I would rather have 1971 & before recordings on cds, than new cds. I would rather have older recordings on cds , than 1972 & after transistor digital recordings on vinyl. There are still some people who record their new vinyl & cds with more expensive tube analod tape, like Kings Of Leon, & a few others. Most people like analog tube guitar amps, over digital transistor guitar amps. Most of todays digital cds have bands playing with analog tube amps, so most cds arent 100% digital. Many people like tube amps, or tube volume control on a transitor amp. Early seventies Sony & Pioneer had better hand wired with better parts transistor amps than today's integrated circuit amps that have to much wiring.
I've used all kinds of cables over the years and have found that most expensive cables are snake oil. Typically the only way you're going to hear a difference is if one cable is literally defective, has no shielding, is improperly assembled, or doesn't make a secure connection. I recently started making my own cables and have been very happy with them. The last RCA's i made used Viablue T6S RCA plugs and Viablue NF-A7 cable. They cost about $50 for 1 meter + $10 each additional meter to make, which isn't cheap. Of course you can buy them pre-made, but that will set you back $190/meter.
Agreed. A strong conductor and heavier gauge wire will always outperform a lighter gauge wire as you are flowing more electrons. Your amp also has to work less. Outside of that, everything else is snake oil garbage. You can get 12-14 gauge wire from Home Depot. It’s not going to be the purest form of copper but it’s not going to cost you thousands for good results. You have electron bottle knocks in the solder Joints, the components, the circuit board clads and the lead wires of the speakers. From the source to the radiator (speaker). All sorts of impedance mismatch opportunities, even if your high end amp is a T plus A. All the best speaker wire in the world is not going to compensate for that. -And finally the human ear can only discern max freq range between 20hz - 20khz. So unless you got the ears of a Dog, it doesn’t matter what falls outside of that range. At the end of the day, physics is still physics. Be warned of salesman who try to substitute intuitive feelings for science.
@@jamestavella1398 If you measure the ohms and the cables are ok, use them. Special "pure" copper? You need ordinary cables on 99.999% of stereo systems out there. Some systems are built bad or cheap in their power output section. There you have to be particular with the kind of loading from the spakers you put on your system. If not, use the ohm rating that sounds the best.(If you run 100's of feet of speaker cable? then you perhaps need to think about upgrading). While true that a heavier gauge wire will be able to transmit higher power...I bet you'll find it comical if you just sit down and do the maths on it. How much square area is needed for a 50W stereo to drive its speakers? Generally there are some 20-24 volts out on the line, but it will be different from system to system. Obviously you don't need cables that can handle 40k Volts :) Only reason for me to use better quality cables is that they tend to keep soft and clean. If you invest in better connectors on the cable they will also attach better to the stereo and speakers.
_that most expensive cables are snake oil_ yes indeed, no major company would kill it's name by supplying bad cables and most supply cables supplied cost less than 5 euros
Not every cable will fit to connect 2 gears. BEsides, for really good build cable you need a proper equippment to hear the difference. Sometime means having few hundered k of some currency to hear the difference. That's whay the setup should be balanced from acoustonc and finance perspective.
Before I get to this book of a comment, I have to say I really love your open minded and experimenting tone on this channel, and the topic choice is also top notch. Sadly the distributors put different masters on different mediums. When you compare the CD, streaming, and download waveforms, sometimes even on different sites, it might differ substantially. The dynamic range database has data of multiple versions of many albums, that's a good start if you want to find the best version. Resolution does not matter, because 16 bit roughly equals 96 dB of dynamic range, and if we take the average room's background noise of 40 dB, you literally have to listen at 136 dB to even physically be allowed to hear the difference between 16 bit and 24 bit, but you won't, because this volume is 2 orders of magnitude larger than instant hearing loss. 24 bit was made for studios to lower distortions when mixing, and it does help, but not when playing it back. It's a good marketing point though, because if you look at it scientifically, yeah, 24 > 16, but you don't need it, just like you don't need a 10 kW power supply for a light bulb. You can wire them and it will work, but why would you? Sampling rate does not matter, because you can mathematically prove that if a frequency can be contained in two sample rates, perfect time alignment is possible by downsampling. Newborn human hearing range tops out at 20 kHz, so a 40 kHz sampling rate would be way over the top (Nyquist theorem, you need double the sampling rate as the max frequency). 44.1 and 48 was chosen only for synchronization with other signals like TV and movie frame rates and equal frame sizes, not because they're needed. Humans are physically unable to hear very high frequencies or the usual audiophile bullshit, the changing of the waveform because of high frequencies. High frequencies in recordings do not propagate down, frequencies only propagate up, and that is called THD. When a speaker stand makes a difference, it means the speaker resonates like hell, and it's either poor build quality, lost its rubber legs, or is just simply old. Measure decay with REW from a short distance, it'll tell everything about the case. Measurements don't matter when you don't know what they want to mean and what to compare to. An SPL curve can mean anything, can be interfered by many factors, etc, but what you can't say is they don't tell the whole story. They do, even if they're done wrong, but they tell the exact properties of the test environment. The data obtained is very valuable, and as seen in the previous paragraph, it carries the answer to all questions. The math behind this is so powerful, you could literally transfer one speaker's sound character to another. This would have been the topic of my PhD if I didn't back up because of my health, but I published everything I finished so far (in the Cavern project on GitHub). You're right that speakers should have character, but you can easily give them that through software (not simple EQ tho). Actually, nobody likes completely flat frequency responses, and everyone have their taste even with decay. Tube amps have brutally long decays, which is technically an imperfection, but it's literally what people call a warm character, and it's calming. The uncanny valley effect also applies to sound. Analog cable differences are caused by their resistance and how much that adds to the target system's input impedance proportionately. What you can hear, is a volume difference (I have a calculator to exactly tell you how much), and volume difference can have huge psychoacoustic effects. There is a video on this platform titled "Think you know what your music sounds like ? Think again...", and it serves as a test to experience what you feel as a volume difference. Many (including you and me) heard an expanded space, but it can be also achieved by turning the volume up. This happens because we hear a flatter sound on higher volumes (Phon curve). Noise because of no shielding can also be a factor, but this is rare. In this case, shielding is worth the investment. Because it can be so cheap, you should recommend it anyway. Any claims about the actual quality are still snake oil though. Electrical components have an accuracy factor. Usually they can vary by 1%, so even 2 of the exact same crossover can have up to 1% change in anything compared to the other. For a very detailed crossover, you can literally put up to ~100 Hz on a different driver with the exact same crossover because of this. There is QC in place for matching similar speakers when they're sold because they can sound (measure) so different.
I disagree with you that sample rate does not matter. The problems with low sample-rates (44.1 ksps for example) are primarily due to the analog anti-aliasing filters necessary in front of the ADC. If I want a 20 kHz analog bandwidth, and also require 60 dB attenuation at 44.1 kHz to prevent aliasing artifacts, the filter will be very steep (10th-order), and will thus have huge phase shift in the 20 kHz passband. And its not just the total phase shift/delay, but the differential between L/R channels that cause imaging and localization problems (as you mention, analog components have tolerances on the order of 1%). The Nyquist criteria you quote is relevant for amplitude, and ignores the real-world problem of phase delays due to anti-aliasing filters. By sampling at higher rates, lower-order filter responses with more linear phase characteristics in the audio passband can be effectively deployed, making the music sound better. So sampling rate is not about capturing ultrasonic sounds, it is about getting better phase response in the audio passband during recording.
@@ericpersson8753 We're way past the times where filters are IIR and phase matters. ADCs have a very high internal sample rate (sometimes even 8x the nominal), and that can be easily brickwall filtered with super low distortion into 44.1. We can have intact signals up to 22 kHz. Yes, you're true that hardware with higher sampling rate is required, but it's unnecessary for storage.
For 2022, a suggestion. Find a solo piano recording that suits your taste - real concert grand, not a keyboard. Add that recording to your reference tracks. You'll be stunned at how it may alter your perception of some items. It won't change your taste in music, but it will reveal some new aspects to rooms, gear placement & speaker capabilities. Loved ALL of your 2021 work & eager for the new year. Thanks for making the hobby fun again!
I concur. Reviews should include a large variation in music styles and of course mastering quality. Classical, jazz, reggae, birds singing, dolphins on acid......huh, Randy, huh !
@@georgedomse For those allergic to classical, I'd point to several Ennio Morricone movie soundtracks (e.g. The Legend of 1900) and/or some of Dick Hyman's CDs on the Reference Recordings label - Fats Waller, Duke Ellington, etc. Chesky Records has some "ultimate test & demonstration" CD's that are useful as well.
Yours is one of my new favorite channels man. The right amount of good, usable info with a bit of levity which this hobby can absolutely use. And I really like the interviews too. Great stuff! 👍🏻
That is why I subbed to you in the first place; as you're one of the few audio tech channels that creates a video admitting to the mistakes that you have made.
You're one of the most knowledgeable yet humble high-fi reviewers on RU-vid. That's why I'd have to rank you number one amongst your peers in this genre. You do not come off condescending or have an air of superiority nor an air of arrogance but yet confident in what you say. I happen to agree with most of your conclusions and opinions. You sure do deserve more views and subscribers. The real viewers know what is quality in terms of a refuge channel like this because real recognizes real! Rock on brother and keep up the grind! Thank you for all the time you put into this.
I've always wanted to chime in on the subject of digital cable quality. I've been an EE/CS man for almost 39 years, with a severe infection of hi-fi in my youth when I had a job at a high end audio shop during the 70s and attended the infamous 79 atlanta show. Fast forward, and I see a heated debate about the quality of digital interconnects in the audio community. From my work in high speed data interconnects between computers and storage systems, the conclusion is rather obvious to someone trained in the discipline, and I am perplexed why this continues to be an issue. If one can perceive a change in sound quality from a USB digital connection, for example, the problem is not the cable, assuming it meets specs and is physically robust, but the equipment to which it is connected. The equipment is not terminating or processing the signal sufficiently or properly to reduce noise. I've helped people with ground loops on USB connections, clearly something is not being done correctly. Optical has its own set of problems, where the physical quality of the fiber and the connectors are analog-like in their resulting variations of sound quality.
i can't hear much difference between hi-res and CD, but i can tell the difference. i have slight synesthesia as part of ASD (part of sensory weirdness i have with it), and hi-res looks bigger and brighter with more colours.
I wasnt able to hear difference btween 24bit audio and 16 on my on-board soundcard, but lately iu bought a 32bit dedicated soundcard and the audio is much more crisp and dynamic. BUT to be honest its indeed not much diffirence with a good CD. yes bands can even burn mp3's on cd and sell it so you really need a CD which the band or group provided the highest quality of audio.
@@rb032682 the sparkly imaginary lava lamp effect in my head is bigger, brighter and more defined. But as I said hearing, not so much of a difference. Sparkly imaginary lava lamp big difference. Hi res and mp3/aac in a random playlist.
@@millar876 - LOL! Everything comes through your ears. Maybe some bone conduction in lower frequencies. If you are perceiving a difference, there is a physical reason for that difference. That difference, if true, is measurable. Current tech may not yet be able to measure the difference, but there is a difference. This is physics, not magic. Of course, humans can be easily led astray by smooth talk and slick marketing. And, there is always a possibility that the listener may be a little teched. 🤣🤣
As others have said - Kudos for admitting to "mistakes" - but then we're all (hopefully) learning continuously and today's assumption might be tomorrow's "mistake"... A couple of thoughts on these subjects. As to stands: Two items - placement in the room can have a HUGE impact on sound, so if the speakers aren't in the exact same spot with the stands as they were with something else, that is a new variable. My studio monitors changed characteristics very significantly by shifting the mixing table a foot and turning it by a few degrees. My other note on stands is that you can get some of this effect by placing your speakers on foam. I use square sound absorber foam to support my studio monitors - or you can buy more expensive speaker isolator foam, but that isolation from the stand is significant. Then speaker cables: This can be mathematically explained, felt and heard - assuming you have an amp with a low enough output impedance. The first time I tested this many years ago was in changing from 18AWG to 12AWG on my home stereo. The first thing that happened was that I turned it up and knocked a picture off of the wall. :) O.K. - that's subjective. But speaker wires do have impedance and if you have low enough impedance at the output of your amp, then speaker wires add impedance (resistive and inductive) to that, reducing your amp's effective dampening factor presented to the speakers (deeper subject). Do you need super expensive cables? I don't know of any reason it would make any significant difference, but you can get 12AWG high strand speaker wire for about a dollar a foot, so going beyond that is probably irrelevant. (I did go to 10AWG on a PA installation where the total speaker load was 1 Ohm to a parallel amp (rated for 1 Ohm loads) with a dampening factor of well over 1000 after I did the math on it, but that's a very unusual case.) I've already blabbed on too long, so I won't go into why, but I would argue that going from 16-bit to 24-bit resolution is significantly audible - but higher sample rates might be harder to hear. As Cheap Audio Man said, specs aren't everything and Nyquist is not the whole story... Thanks Cheap Audio Man!
I find the cable thing to be pretty straight forward. There is such a thing as a "bad" cable... and when you have a bad cable, it messes everything up. However, the difference between a good cable, and an extremely expensive cable provides very diminishing returns... There are some caveats to this, if you have ground loop issues, RF interference, electrical noise issues, or high current applications, then the quality/type of cable will have increasing importance.
There is a lot of bull's excreta around cables. Provided you have the right sized cable to the max current flow then the cable is not the problem. I would argue that it's poor installation or faulty connections that contribute to most problems.
You just have to understand that extremely expensive cable is around 15-20$ for high gauge while good cables are around 8-15$ and bad cables are somewhere bellow 1$. Now the actual cables that are priced 100s or 1000s of dollars are not better then "good" or "extremeley expensive" cables and actually very often worse then "good" cables. They don't have anything special. It's the same exact element with the exact same fabrication of the wire. It's just that the wire is packaged to look "ultra mega resonatingly quantum reverbatingly" premium to make you think there's more to cables and it's designed to trick the ignorant, the stupid and the uneducated customers. As long as the wire is isolated (which even sub 1$ are as that is requirement), with decent gauge, there won't be any issues as wires transfer electrons. Not soundwaves. So there is no "frequency extension" or "enhanced low end" "improved breath of sound" and all other bullshit. So if you want to improve sound, get 10 gauge cable for 15-20$ per meter, and invest the other 1000 dollars into bettering the room acoustics AND THEN better speakers and good measuring electronics (amps, player, DAC, etc).
Finally! An audiophile who believes personal experience and objective measurements can coexist... Not "I am right and measurements guys are haters" kind of mentality. I think Andrew Robinson can learn a lot from you, not block everyone who mentions Erin or ASR, thinking they're just haters.
@@sbwlearning1372 Too many sand cast opinions, cheap wifing posts and drama resonances. Danny Richie mixes the measurements with the "HiFi fluff"...oh well, partial fits me better than pure fictional I guess. But I have to say, many of these guys seem to be salesmen, any disagreements are quashed or met with some kind of marketing reply/ignorance is bliss ;p
Its extremely refreshing. I made the mistake of going to r/audiophile the other day where someone asked a simple question about studio monitors and was met instead with people claiming that studio monitors are...and I quote "a marketing gimmick" and have no reference curve...
Always good when someone is prepared to change their viewpoint based on evidence / experience. In particular, measurements do have a definite place (as I scientist / engineer, I know this) - but may not say everything about audio. Thank you for everything this year - particularly enjoyed your conversation with the British Audiophile (since I am on that side of the Atlantic but more in your price range!)
Well shielded cable with good RCA plugs can make difference. Speaker cable, use 16 gauge zip cord, works fine. It's only when you have radio frequency signals ( Not HiFi gear) that special cabling is need. If you have a choice of RCA or XLR use XLR obviously. try to keep cable length only as long as needed.
Totally agree and well said! I would go as far as to say the loudest components in my setup where my unshielded cables! Mind you at the time I was running a 5.2.4 setup! One should prioritise the most important speakers with the most important cables but saying that it's the cables of length that actually needs to have the better shielding! Unshielded cables act as antennas for attracting RF, so it goes without saying cables of length actually needs to have the better shielding! But here's the catch the better the cable the better the shielding! 🤔
#6 thing you may want to change your mind about is putting coffee on top of a pair of reference speakers....it drives me nuts 😊🐿 Really appreciate this video. Not many people admit that they were wrong or have changed their mind. Thanks Randy, love your channel!
Anything you change in the audio chain changes the sound. that's physics. many times, it is not listenable or even measurable. But the most important thing is to find the right value of things, that really improve the experience of listening to music. that's what this channel is about. Accepting that you have changed your mind and / or attitude towards some issue shows growth, thank you for continuing to help us to find the best audio equipment at the best value
I just heard from this guy the term, "I A-B'd (whatever different things you compare between each other) and it is a term I had never heard before. It is one of the best invented terms I have heard for a direct comparison. After listening to the videos for a while, I figured out it WAS saying he compared the directly. Someone has to make up the new slang/jargon/terminology. I don't know if he did, but it is a good way of expressing it. Congrats.
That's a great video. I don't think many audio guys on RU-vid are ready to ever admit they had it wrong. Thomas and Stereo is willing to come clean when he changes his mind and I am still waiting (but not holding my breath) on Andrew Robinson to admit that some equipment needs to be burned in. But the biggest disappointment to me was Steve Guttenberg, who will shadow ban you if you politely disagree with him once too often. So Kudos for ending this year with a clean slate.
Steve is a bit of a salesman, I mean he does write for stereophile right? Can be fun to watch, but definitely keeping in theme with the "hardly anything below 3 stars", so naturally disagreeing comments get deleted
@@sheerenergy8602 lol some people just rub you the wrong way off the bat. I frequently find this to be the case when they are spending time in their videos bickering over parts of the audience/trying to belittle etc. For me it's "stop begging for subs and creating drama", but that's what seems to sell these days
I love Qobuz, because it takes you down a rabbit hole of so many styles…listened to Halsey produced by NiN, then Schoenberg, Frank Zappa in 70s NYC, etc…the quality of sound didn’t seem to track with the bandwidth. The engineering quality of the track makes a huge difference too, like old vinyls…some 50 year-old recordings sound like they’re almost surround sound out of 2 channels. A pair of Prime SVS Speakers literally can sound like built-in TV speakers, then sound like they have a sub hidden somewhere, then bordering on sublime…all while using the same amp, same room, same Qobuz randomly playing CD quality to 24hz/129hz as a control…just listening to different tracks.
I made my stereo speakers from two plastic swing bins, with no cross overs (like tone controls they dilute the signal) and they sound better than Glastonbury. I use used bottom E acoustic guitar strings as cables due to their audiophile windings. Amp is 20,000 watts into 2 ohms as I hotwired my local energy substation. Source is a reverse cone car speaker acting as a microphone. This is pointed towards the tops of my trees....yes that's right, I only listen to hi Res nature. It's no wonder that everyone faints when they get near to this 5D system, although there may be some grounding issues. Just saying......
@@pjo1964 But Elixirs will last longer, although they will sound brighter and thinner, lol. D'Addarios will provide the best balance between the two, hahaha
Cables make a difference, different materials and what not basically eq-ing with different cables. Audiophiles will poopoo eq-ing but then they will tell you to buy crazy expensive cables and basically do the same thing. Cheapest most effective tool is an EQ. It corrects most short comings in speakers and or room placement.
I'm with you on specs and measurements. They are a guide for me, not the be all and end all. Analogue cables do make a difference. I've swapped both interconnects and speaker cables and definitely heard a difference. Digitalcables? Not so much. HDMI cables either work or they don't, analogue cables can make a difference.
i would love to see you or someone who's had your experience do a blind test demo on a video showing they can identify which speaker cable is being used (or even just being able to detect if/when it was changed by someone) - i can believe it with low level interconnects, but if two speaker wires are of adequate gauge and resistance, you shouldn't be able to hear a difference between the two (any capacitance/inductance is just so negligible) hopefully that isn't abrasive, i would love to have my mind blown.
@@vinylcabasse I can't explain the science of why this wotks but it certainly does. My wife is about as far from an audiophile as you can get but she could hear the difference when we tried different cables. Not all cables will make a difference but some do. The changes are not huge, it won't really blow you mind but they are noticable where they exist. I would not buy a cable just beacuse I was told it will "improve the sound" but I wold certainly try it out. There is most certainly a load of guff talked about cables and mostly by the manufacturers of said items but don't dismiss the whole idea outright. Try some and hear for yourself.
@@grayfool what's the control and test - what wire were you previously using vs what you switched to? if they are generally similar gauge/length, i'd love to see a video of you identifying which wire is being used (after being swapped by someone without you being able to see)
@@vinylcabasse As I said, I can't explain the reasons why there is a difference. All I can say is I heard a difference as did my wife who is not a technical person at all. I can't make you believe me so just try out some different cables for yourself. If it works, then great. If not youv'e lost nothing.
Hey Randy, you’ve pretty much described my personal voyage of discovery over the last couple of years. I’m using Mogami interconnects, which I made myself, and I’ve changed out the crossover components in my Monitor Audio GR20 speakers. Both significant upgrades. Other upgrades I’ve tried include: Converting the speakers to tri-wire, they’re three way designs; Using Mogami speaker cable in tri-wire configuration; Replacing the electrolytic caps in vintage amps with Elna Silmic II, Panasonic FC plus DNM slit foil for the main smoothing caps; Replacing key resistors with high quality alternatives from Mills or Takman; Fitting RC snubbers on the bridge rectifiers, a 0.01uF capacitor plus 10ohm resistor, in series, across the AC legs of the BR. The last one in particular, made an incredible difference. It removes the noise created by the bridge rectifier as it switches. This noise, although it’s in the power side of the circuit, does find its way into the signal to be amplified. It took me ages to do this, as I just couldn’t believe it would be so significant but boy was I wrong! It was my highly qualified buddy who taught me the value of high quality components, and he finally convinced me to do it. If you haven’t done it already, you’ll be investing in a de-soldering machine I expect. 😀 All the best for a great New Year!
Glad you mentioned ESR and other parasitic values for the components. That will certainly change the sound. My thoughts on crossovers parts is like going out and buying A5 Waygu beef ($82/lb from Costco) vs. A "normal" NY Strip ($12/lb) the meat has differences but what really matters is how its prepared and the talent of the chef preparing it. Crossovers are the same way. A talented designer can make a world class crossover with "cheap" parts, and you'd be better off with that than an amateur that just throws in whatever is most expensive.
The other important factor on inductors, is if they are metal core, or air core. Metal cores make it possible to use fewer number of windings to get the value you need - but that metal "holds" the magnetic field for a short period of time, and this *will* affect the sound quality. Air cores can't be saturated, and they don't delay the changes in the magnetic field, that are inherent in a dynamic music signal.
@@NeilBlanchard sure iron cores can become saturated but they will have a saturation rating. Its very unlikely to saturate unless the audio signal produced jet engine levels of noise. Again this goes back to the competenacy of the designer vs the problem with air vs iron. As far as magnetic hysteresis when it comes to iron core inductors I have never seen evidence of this. If there were any truth to that causing an issue I would think that crossover location relative to drivers would play a larger role since the magnetic field around the driver is certainly of higher flux than the iron core of a crossover inductor.
Cheap components like capacitors will need attention earlier than better quality items. And recapping is a hassle. OTOH, if you raise the price of a speaker 200 or 300$ you put it into another category and it won't compete in the marketplace.
@@HiFiTurtle Simple experiment: wrap a wire around a nail, and connect the ends of the wire to a battery. Pick up a small metal object with the electromagnet you have made - then disconnect the wire from the battery. Does the metal object fall off the magnet instantly, or is there a time delay? If there is a time delay, then there are eddy currents in the nail that "hold" the magnetic field. To apply this to audio, you can get an metal core inductor and an air core inductor that are each the same gauge wire, and the same mH value. The metal core coil will probably have a lower ESR - but the air core won't have any magnetic eddy currents. Compare the *quality* of the bass with the two different coils. The air core inductor is going to have "tighter" and more precise reproduction of the bass; because of the lack of smearing that occurs with metal core inductors having magnetic eddy current.
@@NeilBlanchard let me rephrase, I realized I had bad wording. Not that I dont believe magnetic hysteresis happens, but rather if it is truly audible or if air cores are outright superior in comparison to using iron cores. I have not seen evidence magnetic hysteresis leads to bass smearing, and outright changing iron cores for air cores changer ESR as you pointed out which will absolutely change the sound for that very reason. I think this still goes back to my original point. Everything has give and take, its up to the designer to put together all the pieces to make a competent product.
I’ve watched a ton of your content. This video is the one that made me sub. The level of honesty and the transparency I’ve seen today is something I will never stop appreciating. As the top comment said, it takes a big man to admit that you changed your mind. I appreciate that immensely.
I have to say, I prefer it when reviewers talk about how something sounds, rather than just a graph. What would be interesting though is how all your preferred speakers would appear on a graph. There may be similar themes which could help you make informed decisions on future purchases. Just my thoughts.
Cables make a difference. I was training to be an electrician, and thought a cable is a cable, then I learned about resistance and impedance in cables and how signal drop happens over length an diameter and composition, but as long as you are using cables that are rated for the distance and wattage you are using there should be little difference, the problem is on a lot of occasions people have a habit of getting the wrong gauge cables for their speaker runs and that definitely makes a difference, the longer the run the larger the cable you need to transit the sound, but there is also a point of diminishing returns on that. People, and I include myself in this, tend to forget once the sound leaves the amp it is analog, and analog sound can be heavily affected by the conductors it moves through and the power handling of the wires. I really like your talks about htis.
When you A-B speakers on speaker stands vs. on a shelf, are you A-B testing the same speakers, with the same music, and with the speakers placed the same distance apart?
Usually not. That's why A-B testing is so hard. Unless you can get the placement, angle, listening location... etc to the exact inch. Something is always going to sound different.
It's not the cables that make the difference!! Placebo affect. Ask an electrical engineer if a decent quality cable, at the same gauge, and with the short length that most cables are, have any effevt (and relative to the frequencies most people can hear, not some stupid high frequency range we can't even hear). Do a double blind test if you actually want to know if there is an actual difference, anything else is in your head. It's hilarious how much people will spend on cables compared to the wiring in your walls (for like 2 feet runs no less). It's like when HDMI started people would pay 3x for a 'nicer' HDMI cable...it's either 0 or 1. Bring on full digital so we can end this BS. Audiophiles and their money, quickly separated.
FOMO explains that if you dont put enough money into something, you always feel that you miss something and that you can not get the best out of it. Yes placebo effect is strong if you are happy with your spending, not your equipment sound.
@@craigtomlinson2075 ok take your speakers apart and look at the internal wiring. Chances are the wiring is the cheapest Chinese zip cord the manufacturer could buy.
Speaker stands make a difference! Also, if don't have room in your setup for speaker stands: IsoAcoustic stands will improve your low end a LOT! I use them on all of my speaker systems now.
You are correct about 'high res’ music files. If you take a cheap, unbranded ultra hd tv and compare it with a premium branded standard hd set, chances are the picture quality will be superior on the standard hd, premium tv. The same principals can be applied to high res music played on substandard equipment, vs cd quality music played on premium rigs!
I appreciate the reviews of inexpensive, high value audio gear. That said, if you can't hear much of a difference between cd quality and high res file rates on well recorded tracks, it's the limitations in the quality of the gear you're using. That's not a knock, simply reality. Inexpensive gear has to be built to a low price point. Great engineering can lift it above the norm but much more expensive, equally well engineered gear is going to far surpass the fidelity of the lower priced gear. That's why companies offer entry level and up, to much more expensive reference level. Some of its marketing hype but few will pay 10 times the entry level for little apparent gain in fidelity. That much more expensive gear has to be persuasive when auditioned. Of course the whole system has to be of similar quality, its a chain and only as strong as its weakest link. It's also a case of diminishing returns, the higher you go in price, the smaller the gain over the next lower level.
Most people cannot tell a difference between 320Kbps MP3 and CD (talking scientific studies using really expensive gear in a treated room, including musicians and studio professionals). If you claim that CD vs Hi-Res is easily heard on a higher end system, you are fooling yourself (like literally, placebo).
@@homeboi808 I know I can hear the difference and I do not have exceptional hearing. Rather than descend into who you going to believe, the experts or your ears? I'd suggest that double blind tests could easily determine the truth.
No-one has ever heard any differences between cd-quality audio and higher resolutions in a control listening test. If so we would have heard about it by now. It's probably possible to tell CD and high-rez by maxing the volume during a silent or very quiet part so you expose the noise floor of CD audio which kicks in earlier. But no-one is listening to at those levels when playing actual music, at least not at home. The "if you can't hear any difference your gear is not good enough/enough resolving argument is an old one". My take is that a lot of differences people hear (apart from expectation bias/placebo and level mismatch) is that most hifi focus today is on headphones, mobile devices, dacs and dongles. Most people are not able to bypass their phones/daps circuits and software. For instance; one of my phones imposes a volume limit and some native/hardcoded eq which you can't bypass even when using a usb-dongle like a Dragonfly or similar. I will not be able to get around that without jailbreaking the phone. All reasonably competent dacs, digital sources and amps sound exactly the same no matter the price. It has been that way since the late 80's (at least).
@@felixfranzen7318 I see you belong to the, "if it can't be measured, it doesn't exist" crowd. When digital was new, jitter was unmeasurable and many to your way of thinking dismissed it as imaginary. But once it became measurable, then suddenly it was an acceptable metric. Our minds adjust to what we are used to, so much so that often it is only after listening to a higher fidelity component or system for some time and then, listening once again to what we previously used that we realize the difference. But OK have it your way. I'll rely on what my lying ears reveal. “There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." William Shakespeare "To the scientific mind, experimental proof is all-important, and theory is merely a convenience in description, to be junked when it no longer fits. To the academic mind, authority is everything, and facts are junked when they do not fit theory.”. -- Robert A. Heinlein It appears that you imagine yourself to be factually oriented but in fact, you're basing your opinion upon what authoritarian, "the science is settled" types have proclaimed.
@@geoffreydebrito2653 You are so right. A lot of people are like "I can't hear the difference so none exists". For me, the difference between CD quality and say DSD through the same DAC is night and day. One sounds closer to the sound of live music.
If you A/B systems, the best A/B is live to recording. Went to a CES a few years back and they had a system that impressed me. Walking down the hall, passed a room with refreshments and heard a Concert Grand piano being played. Enjoying live performances, I went in to listen, and there to the left was the Concert Grand, roped off, but nobody was on the bench. Having never heard a player grand, I went up to look at the equipment, and found on the floor next to the piano were 2 3 way speakers. Yes, a pair of 12 inch 3 way speakers fooled me until I was about 10 feet away. I asked about the recording. It was recorded the day before with no compression or processing of that piano, but on good microphones. The problem with most produced consumer grade sound, is it is compressed to sound like a recording.
Can't believe a guy your age didn't know about stands favoring the sound. Maybe you might also believe system synergy sometimes trumps their measurements too. Love to listen and listen for the love. May the passion never end.
The room is the most important component in an audio system. A speaker could measure bad, but actually sound good in a room if it was complementary to the issues in the room.
@@vinylrules4838 It can lead to a long rabbit hole trying to find the complimentary items ;p If possible with a good room it will be easier, though you may find that multiple speakers sound nice in there, and now you have a new problem of which ones to let go
@@garynilsson416 A friend of mine built his own speaker system and had it in his basement. He had no problem reproducing 16Hz. He could not turn it up too loud as his kitchen cabinets started separating from the wall! I heard or I should say "felt" 16hHz reproduced on that system (pipe organ) and it was amazing!
Fill those speaker stands with sand, I've got the same ones, and filling them actually made a difference. Great stands for the money especially once you get the hollow columns filled.
Great video Randy. Some really good points. I tend to agree with most of your new opinions. Measurements is one that always struggled with when I used to sell hifi back in the late 80's and early 90's. While they are important to a point I have always felt that you had to listen to gear and not put all your stock in its measurements. If something doesn't sound good, does it really matter how it measures. Maybe there is something we haven't figured out how to measure just yet that makes a big difference in the sound quality aside from what we are currently measuring.
The point is that if something measures well, it sounds well to most people. If it measures bad, it will probably have some issues that pop out that most find annoying. You can derive the basic sound signature of a speaker from its measurements. Then, when listening you might find the more subtle aspects that are hardly read off measurement data
Excellent point...knowing what to measure. If you can find it Floyd Toole working out of the national research center in ottawa canada made a really interesting observation. What makes speakers sound "real" is actually something not measured before his work in the very early 70's or thereabouts.
@@Pentenfi Thanks for your reply. I disagree that if something measures well it sounds good to most people. There are flat out certain pieces of equipment, that on paper have great measurements, however don't sound good to most people. So my take on gear like this, is there are things we don't measure which have a negative impact on the sound. So that is why I advocate for listening to a piece of gear carefully to decide whether you like it regardless of the printed measurements. We can't take measurements written on paper as gospel. I doubt anyone who goes to buy gear takes measurements with proper devices along with listening to evaluate.
The reason why you can't rely of measurements 100% is because everyone's ears are a bit different. That doesn't mean there's aspects that can't be measured it just means you personally can't be bothered to learn the science.
@@dontron810 So...if people...with different ears are hearing a guitar live....yeah, their brains "hear" differently.....but if you reproduce the guitar perfectly....both will say yup , thats the same guitar. So...especially with amps, complete specs tell 99% of the story. 1% is in your head.
I gotta respect the intellect. I came for the reasoned response and I'm never disappointed. your views are relative but clearly expressed, and I find that enjoyable.
You lost me on cables. But I appreciate that you are thinking in terms of rethinking your opinions. I’ve AB’d and blind AB’d cables and am positive the ROI on expensive cables is pretty horrid. I also think none of us spends enough time working our listening spaces. Equipment means very little in a room that sounds like $&@?$.
Re: Listening rooms. I am in the midst of renovating mine. I am torn between hardwood floors or wall-to-wall carpeting. Thoughts on the effect of either on sound quality?
@@JimSamuel267 You may need to consider rugs on the floor between the speakers and you. Otherwise the regular treatments are good. Some people like live rooms too
@@RennieAsh I tend to like live rooms. My biggest concern is that I will be using the same room as my home office and do not want it to have echoes when I am on Zoom. I will be facing a wall when I am on Zoom meetings so I think some well placed foam squares could take care of that problem. Thanks.
My Best speaker cable discovery was using some 12 gauge Romex from home Depot,that I split and removed the red and black solid core cables,and twisted them with a drill to braid them,created incredible sounding cables,eliminating RF frequency completely.try them!
Do you review active speakers? I got a pair of Kali IN-5s this year and I was blown away by them. I think even if a manufacturer isn't targeting a flat frequency response, active speakers with amp and DSP integrated still allow them to achieve the desired sound profile with less compromise by utilizing both acoustic engineering and DSP during product design.
The best thing about measurements is they help you weed out the garbage. Not going to name names. Things that don't measure well are usually adding distortion that helps improve something too harsh going on further up in the signal chain. Great video.
Thanks Randy. When you were talking about speaker measurements and how important they are, and how they are not everything. I felt the need to add something. People need to understand that every listening room is different. Each room has different acoustics, And just because one speaker sounded good at the store, Does not mean it will sound the same at home. I have experienced this many times. Some of the speakers i have enjoyed the most at home sounded bad when i brought them to a friends house for audition. I auditioned a pair of Yamaha NS-777 speakers in a garage before taking them home and was blown away, But disappointed when I got them home. The listening environment is easily overlooked and measurements mean nothing.
I tend to agree with the first point, physical Redbook players as a source almost always sound better than anything streamed, regardless of resolution of file. One thing that struck me though is when I listened to Blu rays when they came out was that the audio sounded better than my CDs, even same song, same player. Like compare Micheal Jackson This is It, the movie vs the soundtrack on the cd, the Blu ray sounds better. Is it bitrate which is much higher on blu ray? Maybe it's mastering.
I was actually happy to hear that on this channel, because I bought a relatively good vintage Technics CD player a while ago and my thinking was always first of all that there is very little to be desired when it comes to that player. But then also I thought, I must not be able to hear anything better because surely all this modern stuff that all these reviewers rave about have to be be so much better... So what is it then that others can hear and not me?
Back in the early nighties Tower Records put up a store here in the Philippines and I was able to buy US made CDs. I was shocked to discover that locally made original CDs sounded muffled compared to the ones made in the US. Someone told me what Philippine record companies were using at that time are first generation CD making machines most probably handed down by US record companies that changed their equipments. As to Blu Ray audio vs CD audio, according to MindsMIrror (Head-Fi) : Redbook audio CDs are 44.1KHz, 16 bit, stereo, while Blu-rays (or DVDs) can contain many different formats. I have some which are 96KHz, 24 bit, 5.1 surround. So technically Blu-rays can hold higher quality audio. Certainly if you have surround speakers the Blu-ray will have a clear advantage, but in stereo the higher bit depth and sample rate doesn't really add anything. The biggest difference is often due to the different mix and master that may be used on the different formats. That is totally subjective as to which is better. You have to evaluate each CD and Blu-ray on a case by case basis. They may use a mix/master on the Blu-ray that you think sounds better than the CD, they may not. There's nothing stopping them from using the same master for the Blu-ray and CD. Of all the albums I have in CD and DVD, I prefer the DVD mix, but that doesn't mean you would think the same, or that it applies to every CD and DVD or Blu-ray.
I agree with all points in this video! Especially the crossover components. I upgraded one of my speakers crossovers at a time and did some a b comparisons. I was shocked. It was like id released the potential of the drivers, as if the old components were holding the sound back.
That is often true, but not always. In one speaker I tweaked, the high quality Solen caps sounded more harsh to me compared to cheap electrolytics. In another speaker, the Solen caps sounded much better. i have no direct experience with iron core vs. air core inductors, because I always have used air core ones
@@DougMen1 Sometimes, changes in ESR is not for the better as original design may have taken that into account. Same with inductor DCR. And lastly perhaps the drivers just work better with whatever effects older components have :) I once swapped new caps (admittedly still electrolytic), but the sound just seemed harsh. A pity as some of the old caps were wrecked so I had to put new ones in.
@@DougMen1 so I should have probably said what speakers I did this A-B with. They we're the b&w 601s3s I re used the standard air core inductors and changed the other components to mills resistors and a mixture of cmr and CSA clarity caps. So some pretty high end components compared to the value of the speakers. In my case it was a huge improvement but yes in other crossover designs there may be more or less of a difference. Maybe with the solen caps it smoothed things out but reduced details?! Could have been a good tradeoff! That's the beauty of tweaking you can never be sure as to what your going to get bit it's fun to go on the journey!
If you ever get the opportunity to go for a fully active crossover solution, that's the only way you're going to get the most efficiency out of your speakers and amplifiers. You won't have any losses to the crossover network, so you'll have a cleaner crossover and a more efficient system. It's just complicated and expensive and irritating to configure.
@@mndlessdrwer If a passive crossover is good enough for high end speakers it's good enough for me. I have dabbled in an active crossover for a sub and had good results but as far as stereo speakers I'd rather tweak and mod each individually, it's more fun for me that way however I'm sure active crossovers are very popular in the professional audio industry.
I like the way you articulate the argument for testing cables. I've done a number of blind tests with friends, and I'm convinced that, at the very least, decently shielded "entry level" audiophile cables sound better than the freebie spaghetti noodle cables you get included with budget electronics, but I've run into quite a few people who are so adamant that "cables don't matter and anyone who thinks they do is brainwashed and unworthy of being listened to ever" that they never even properly test it themselves.
The problem is, I've done tests where it was found that my bias swapped around when I forgot which thing was plugged in. So I'm a bit sceptical of when people plug things in, knowing it is plugged in, and then say it's better ;p I still think there is a minuscule difference with some products, especially if said products are sensitive to inductance/resistance/capacitive changes. At the same time, I use audiophile's nightmare stuff at times, and if other's don't know, it still sounds fantastic to them XD
High resolution is OK, but let's not kid ourselves. The specifications for CD were well considered by the manufacturers in the late 1970s/early 1980s when it was rolled out to the public. They took the sonic characteristics needed to meet the human range of hearing and great dynamics and worked to meet them - mostly successfully. Very early CD players suffered a bit due to their use of brickwall filters and such, but that was quickly remedied and wasn't a reflection on the actual specifications of the audio on a CD. Having "better" than CD quality sound sure doesn't hurt anything now that technology can easily handle it, but can you really hear a difference if you are older than around 20 years old? Seems DSD *might* be the way of the future with crazy oversampling rates that leaves CD Redbook quality in the dust. We'll see if it continues to take hold with labels and recording studios. Have a Happy New Year! If Spotify lies and doesn't roll out their Hi-Fi by 11:59 PM EST on December 31st, I'll be subscribing to Amazon Music via your link... ;-)
I don't disagree about the sound quality of cd's but the primary factor in the use of 16 bit/44k as the standard was the state of technology/manufacturing around 1980. At that time, 16 bit processors were the state of the art, i.e expensive, and cd's would have to be the size of LP records to manufacture an hour of music at a higher resolution. Also the problems with high frequencies were not quickly remedied. On a high resolution system, it took over a decade before cd's were listenable. The fingernails on a chalkboard like distortion were still evident in most 1990's cd players.
@@artanderson8827 yes, I knew an "enthusiast" who spent $2000 on an early CD player around 1982 - the first I'd ever seen. It loaded the CD onto a spindle vertically so you could see it spinning. I think that was the selling point. They chose the minimum specifications for what was needed to give 20 Hz to 20KHz with a 96 dB dynamic range, and that was achievable at that crazy price point. Fortunately, as they caught on, and as the digital technology progressed rapidly, the prices finally came down. I got my first CD player in 1984 a Hitachi for about $600. Funny thing is that I actually bought two CDs months earlier (Billy Joel and Fleetwood Mac) just to have them and admire. LOL. I think the high frequency ringing of those very early players was fixed within about 4 to 5 years, at least at the higher price points. But yeah, magazines like Stereo Review and others kept discussing it. I kept that old Hitachi until it died around 1992 and replaced it with a Sony that was still in the $400 range. That Sony was so much better and offered so much more functionality and a remote! I still have it but it has been replaced by a Denon recently. I'm sure the DAC and its implementation in the Denon beats the old Sony hands down. And with a digital out, I can play with using an even better DAC one day.
@@artanderson8827 the Ares II at around $1000 is likely about as much as I could justify given my 63 year old ears, but glad to know the Pontus is great at $1700....I know there are even more expensive DACs out there, but getting a good R2R might be the best architecture. And support of DSD makes it "future proof".
I got trashed by a bunch of people on Reddit for saying you need good speaker stands. Thank you for this. There are plenty of relatively inexpensive choices, you don't have to go spending $500 on a pair of stands. The Dayton Audio stands cost like $75 a pair and sound great once you fill them with sand. Those super cheap ones made of some cheap wood? They're crap, don't bother. I feel pretty much the same way about cables.
I remember the blind speakercable test that used a metal coathanger and people could not hear the difference between it and an expensive (i think monstercable) cable. I tested with my normal speaker cables and a powercable and was not able to hear the difference. That was a bit painful.
Great video. Always respect people that can admit that they have had a change of heart or maybe they got something wrong and want to own up. A little story about cables....I bought some fairly expensive interconnects and told a coworker about them. He wanted to come hear the difference and said if he could hear a difference (improvement), he would purchase the same cables for his system. Well, he heard a clear improvement and still has these cables in his system to this day. :) Another A/B test I've done with people is to A/B the same song on vinyl versus CD and everyone has picked the vinyl every time. And thats comparing a $2000 CD player to a $500 turntable setup. I was surprised by the results but agreed. I prefer the laid back sound of vinyl. Keep in mind, hearing is different for everyone, some folks can hear things others can't, people prefer different things in their sound...some love mids, some love bass, etc. The only true measurement is what sounds best to YOU. Thanks for the great videos!
With regards to bit/sampling rates, the recording/mastering trumps every time. I'd even venture to say compressed music well recorded beats out hi-rez garbage.
Hi Randy, Live metal can make your ears less responsive. 1% of us are so-called audiophiles and of that 1% of audiophiles can hear large differences in cables. On my main system (not a zillion dollar setup) I tried like 5 upgrades to my speaker wire. I stopped because the used Wireworld Luna speaker cables made my speakers and my ears very happy. Instruments and vocals suddenly sounded extremely close to live. Even my late dog all of a sudden started reacting to knocks on doors and animal sounds from my system. So I believe that most people can't appreciate the difference, but those who can do. When I was younger I played in bands and the drummers always had me pick out their new symbols for their drum sets. Now I can't hear over 16,000 hertz, but I can sure tell a difference below that. Thanks Bob
In my experience. High Res Audio - Unconvinced , CD quality still sounds great. Analogue cables do make a difference, although cost may not equal performance. Resistance, Impedance, capacitance, inductance and shielding. If the first 4 jive well with your system (damping factor etc), and you have good noise rejection you should be grand. I don't believe skin effect makes a difference for audio signals. Digital cables - Not so much.
Sort of agree about HiRez. 24/96 is as far as I go and it's benefits are debatable. Equipment is important but if the mastering is bad you can't make a silk purse. Good video!
Hey, it was a great year learning about audio gears thanks to you! It was my first year starting with audiophile stuff and I find love again in my music :) I hope you will continue to share your journey with us! Have a great year and Holiday! :D
Thanks Randy, looking at things from a new perspective is always a good thing, keep up the good work and best wishes for the coming new year. Just over a year ago you were trying to get to 1k subs and were giving away a pair of speakers to get there, this year pushing 70k. That just means 70k different opinions and not all will agree, but I come to hear yours.
I've made comparisons on speaker and RCA cables myself: As long as they're decently made, THEY DON'T MATTER ONE IOTA. Nothing. There are no "warm" or "analytical" sounding cables, it's ALL a rip-off. The only adjective in there that matters is "ANAL".
Well yes, but there's likely a difference between a $1 RCA cable and one costing $10 in better materials, shielding, and workmanship. So yeah, I'll buy in to World's Best RCA Cables, but not buy into any snake oil that spending $200 on them will make any appreciable sound difference. As far as speaker cables go, well, using short runs of relatively thicker copper cables can make a sonic difference and make life easier on your amp. Most people know to not use thin gauge wire. I use 14 AWG cables from SVS which were very reasonable in price. I can't see buying anything more costly. If people really wanted to make a decent difference, they'd pay an electrician to run a 20 Amp dedicated circuit from their junction box to their high powered amp, but most people never do. Fortunately, with all the more efficient speakers available now, the days of having to own a 200 W or more per channel amp to drive acoustic suspension speakers are almost behind us. I'm keeping my old Carver gear and AR-9 speakers though. I can't see ever replacing them. I'm 63 so I figure if they'll last another 25 years or so, it won't matter to me by then.
As someone who is new to the audiophile hobby but not new to sound equipment (worked as a sound engineer, made electronic music for over 25 yrs and install home cinemas for work now) I’m super surprised on how many audiophile reviewers dismiss balanced audio. I found this very early on to have made one of the most profound differences in sound quality, even with budget studio monitors in untreated rooms. A/Bing one speaker with a balanced 1/4in Jack and one with a mono Jack you’d have to be severely hearing impaired to not notice the difference
This is really funny. It just goes to show how the majority can be so dead WRONG. There is more difference between cables qualitatively in sound quality than between the very finest bottle of wine ever made and what Aqualung would have under his raincoat to take a nip of. In the defunct Audio magazine they had a classified section and stereo shop owners would take out classified ads saying nice things about a new product they carry (maybe 2 or 3 lines). One time I saw about 8 classifieds in a row, right down the column, of different store owners raving about a certain new phono cartridge that just hit the market. I talked with one of them and said "Wow there are lots of other stores really liking that cartridge too". "There are no less than 7 other stores proclaiming its virtues right under your ad." He said "It's not that great". "The manufacture had a bunch.of us dealers put in classifieds, all bunched up together like that, so it would look like the phono cartridge is the greatest thing since sliced bread". "To tell you the truth, I don't like it that well." Majority opinion is not the way to decide who is right or wrong about anything, including cables. Haven't we already learned that from the politicians we have actually elected?? If you use either an integrated amp or a preamp with a headphone input. Buy a good pair of headphones. Even ones that are only around $100 like the AKG's Randy was talking about several days ago..Plug your headphones in and listen, REALLY LISTEN to how much purer and cleaner everything sounds. How much less colored and how much more detailed your favorite oft played music is. Doing this you are hearing your sound quality up to the point right before your speakers cables come into play. If you are using speaker cables the ilk of what most people on here are using; you will clearly hear serious degradation (like 50% or more) in the detail and purity of sound as soon as you go back to listening through your speakers. Of course with speakers the sound will be bigger and in the air vs. headphones, which can only put sound into your ears for the most part. Inexpensive cables (some are a bit better than others) really don't cut it. Your wouldn't be hearing that kind of loss of detail, purity, transparency and transient effortlessness if they did. Hearing how good your sound quality is, just up to right before the speaker cables will make your feel sick at how much sound quality your cables are losing you. Your interconnect is losing you plenty of sound quality too. If there was a way to listen through your headphones PRE-Interconnect, you'd hear another 50% or so drop in sound quality after your interconnects come into play. If you visited a plant that manufactured quality audio cables where they draw their own metal, cool their own metal, put the metal through various treatment stages, ( the same metal that is going to end up inside of audio cables conducting the sound), you would realize how many stages there are (maybe 40) and that there is a lot more to making high quality audio cables than meets the eye (or ear). Each stage being important and a little different in the ways different factories do things. Just like lp's, the ones that are made with the most care sound the best, and with cables there is the additional factor of material used, although there are probably different quality vinyl too, when making lp's. The few of us on here who have invested a significant amount of money in cables (and thrilled we did so) after the fact, we shouldn't be mad at all those people giving each other the wrong advice on cables. It's their sound that's lacking; not ours. Maybe 30 years from now some of them will hit the lottery or be promoted, and on a whim buy an expensive but worth it well designed cable, and think to themselves "How dumb I was, I could have been having this kind of amazing sound quality far 30 years; thirty years ago."
The reason for what you describe is that you take the room out of the equation when listening to headphones. This is also true in a nearfield setup for example in a studio or at a desk, but even more so in a normal living room. So that's not the cables, but the room acoustics that mess with your sound. I am not saying that cables don't make a difference. I have expensive cables because I hear the difference. But what you are describing is most likely the room. Assuming you don't have your room treated and/or using DSP room correction.
Great video. I was in the "cables don't make a difference" camp for years. Used Van Damme RCA's. Changed the preamp to amp RCA to Atlas OCC and couldn't believe the difference. Not just change of sound, but an improvement. The RCA is circa £100. Worth every penny.
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One of the most honest end of the year clips I've seen. Bravo! I agree with you 100% The middle ground is where it's at. Good shielded cables, nice connections, CD Quality or better and good power supplies and my system sounds amazing.
The issue with measurements is that they provide a baseline for an audience as a reviewer. My problem with a guy like Steve Guttenberg is that he makes recommendations but eschews blind listening and measurements and any sort of science. Speakers and amps and such may be subjective but cables really aren't. The science is clear that differences in cables are not audible in a home audio context. Refusing to agree on that is a big red flag, and the only conclusion I come to is that someone like SG isn't impartial and is just selling equipment. So, his opinion is useless.
SG is a guy with tons of experience, full of anecdotes that are worth listening to. But THEN listen for yourself to the component you intended to buy, THEN check with the "quants", THEN listen again knowing what to listen for. THEN, if it passes that final test, you are in business. Don't buy without listening. Tastes may vary.
totally, complete agree with your assessment on speaker cables. any possible effect they might have (as long as the measured resistance value and gauge is sufficient) would be due to high capacitance or inductance, but the values are still so tiny compared to the level of signal passing through that it is essentially impossible that they would have an audible effect. the measured effect is insignificant.
Welcome to the world of educating your ears. You will find as you go along that everything makes a difference to you system, and the more expensive your gear the more differences you will hear. It was hard to take anyone seriously that said speaker stands wouldn't make a difference in sound, so I basically ignored you for years. But this reaction caught my eye. You've learned that the more you listen to music through equipment, the more refined is your ability to pick out differences, especially when you use reference gear and music that you are well and overly familiar with. Frankly I think I said this to you over a year ago when I first came across your channel. I'm glad to see you've allowed for your experience to inform your listening and your ideas.
I borrowed 3 speaker cables from the store, not knowing anything about them other than a rough price range. None of them sounded bad but there were definite differences and 2 were clearly better. I ended up choosing the one that majored on clarity with a little less bass (wanted to be considerate to my downstairs neighbours!). The better 2 turned out to be the more expensive ones, with my choice being the middle price of the 3. It was interesting having no preconceptions about what I was listening to and had they all sounded the same I would've happily gone back to the store and said I'll take whichever was the cheapest. 23 years later and I'm still using the same cable!
I've just got the BD DT 1990 headphones, sourced them only by measurements and reading reviews. They're a perfect fit for me, especially love the bright top end then coupled to a Little Dot Mk 3.
I'm a musician and have been for 50+ years. I have Sansui amp and Spendor speakers with various sound sources. Sounds good to me. All my many musician friends, over the years, listen to music and not their equipment. Audiofiles on the other hand listen to their equipment bypassing the reason they got into their hobby in the first place - music!. I'm all for trying to achieve the best, neutral sound possible. Ideally, what the recording and mastering engineer heard, but there are so many variables along the way. Eg. Was it recorded in a bright room or a dull dark room, for starters. I could go on, but you get my point. I just love music. Equipment, er, not so much. Is that a Stradivarius i hear from one of the violin players in the orchestra? 😁
Randy, I was the same about not believing in expensive cables until i replaced my 12G cables on my front stage with a pre-built Blue Jeans cable. The whole front stage opened up. Like you I am not talking about $200 ft cables, but these were $45 per speaker from amazon which for me, $150 for 3 speakers is more than I ever spent. I am in love with them for sure tho.
When I started out mixing and mastering on my new monitors, I tried 6 DIY stands before I designed and made one that was sturdier and less resonant and I've been using them for 4 years straight. Still nothing better on the market or higher priced that would do a better job.
I actually used to make my own interconnects from Prefer MGK-18 microphone cable and some solid plugs. Soldered them myself. They were solid and sounded good (but probably normal). I've given up on audible differences between cables in general because I always think I hear something. If there is a positive pseudo-acoustic effect of having build the cables myself, I will take that. I will say I heard a difference after I upgraded a DAC I had (Beresford Caiman TC-7520SE, the upgrade was the so-called "Gator PCB"). However, some time after that I decided to try to simplify my setup, and so I compared to the DAC inside my TV. I heard no difference between that and the _upgraded_ Beresford... No difference = no problem. Just pick what you like most and stop worrying. If you worry, maybe stop listening to music and go outside. At least that's what I think. :)
Polk Lsi7 's on the stands you mentioned make an excellent 5.1 system ! Oppo 95 playing all the Steve Wilson remasters on DVD Audio or bluray audio . Marvelous.
Crossover points make a noticeable difference in how a two or three-way speaker system sounds. Speakers are mechanical motors and each has its own sweet spot - the frequency band where it works most efficiently and has the widest dynamic range. Measurements can help identify a speaker's sweet spot, but there's no substitute for listening to it yourself, mounted in its cabinet and positioned where you need it in the room. I use a tunable crossover or parametric bandpass filter to audition each speaker, and then dial in the exact crossover frequency while listening to the entire speaker system. If it sounds good, it is good.
I didn't discern an improvement jumping from streaming quality to lossless, but jumping from streaming quality to a Masters recording was a noticeable upgrade to my ears
Everything makes a difference. Including the audio resolution… yes there are priorities in every system and room/place. Resolution still matters. What’s important to you and your system differs from others…
Randy. I ordered a Sith Audio Audiophile Smoked Turkey 🦃 and @$103/lb is a bargain! I ordered a 20 pound one for $2,060! This turkey 🦃 will surely "smoke"! All seriousness aside, we all learn continually. Your admission is admirable and I salute 👏 you as you close in on 70K subs [not as in 🔊 s though!] which could happen before 2022!
As a wise man once said, a speaker designers magic is in how he manipulates the response to his design. Like a painting, flat is not the goal, but the color, and layers he adds, that creates the ultimate end result.
