Wow. This story echoes so much of my experience with smaller magickal groupings here in the US. There seems to be a pervasive tendency for personal egoic conflicts to take on mystical qualities, thus obfuscating their otherwise rather obvious human origins. I look at doing magick with someone similarly to doing LSD with them. You only want to go into that territory with another person if you are fairly certain they will handle it in a way that's compatible with how you handle it. Otherwise, weird schizoid conflicts like this one almost inevitably emerge. I get the feeling that this phenomenon is part of why the most effective magickal groups are quite small and unknown.
I'd not heard this story before but it's certainly an interesting. I don't think I'll ever grow tired of occultists' ability to make otherwise mundane tiffs, spats and disagreements sound like epic battles.
Its amazing, lots of occultists are basically edgy theater kids. Not that that's a bad thing, they make everything more interesting, but it can get exhausting lmao
Peter Carroll and Frater V. D are two of my favorite magicians. And the authors of whose books I have learned the most about the practical application of western ceremonial style Magick. Even if I don't share many of their views. But neighter of them believe in dogmas anyways nor teach them. In the jungle of useless literature on Magick those two authors really stick out and altered my life. Or rather I altered it by practicing their exercises, rituals, spells and teachings. Which lead to very impressive, tangible results in initiator Magick and sorcery. As opposed to 99% of the books on similar topics out there. Peter Carroll's "Liber MMM/Liber0/Psychonomicon" and Tegtmeiers(Frater VD) "High Magick" Vol1 and 2 are really worth reading and practicing. And can help you start your magical journey on solid ground. No bs and much practice leading to real life effects when practiced with discipline.
Chaos magic at its core is a willed attempt to select one out of the almost infinite possibilities that can occur for any given event and bring it into existence.
The Otto link is fantastic. Also he has a bunch of internet links which will obliterate my schedule for this afternoon. At least nobody got hurt! I was thinking Fr U D was Johnny Depp and Carroll was Balkan in Ninth Gate and somebody was going to light them self on fire.
Another Very Excellant Presentation. I love send your vids around. I was thinking, the "Order of 9 Angles" could use such a treatment. I think they are sketchy , if not dangerous. But I know so little actually.
My goodness, this is the most epic thing I have ever heard: "magic battle in tavern, where the first to leave... LOSES" I am so loving everything about this!!! I LOVE Tegtmeier's response to Carroll's insistence that he wanted absolute power. He's like 'naw, I was just going to quit being in power.'. Epic!
It seems a sad fact that every spiritual or magical practice always degenerates into some form of religion, which in turn breeds political strife and infighting. Interesting video though. Thanks
Once Again! Very interesting..! Good Work.👍 Quite simply, thank you. I wonder how much of the energy effects went out into the world and effected society.. There were many changes at that time..
MY GOD! is there a topic that you do NOT know about in regards to the occult? 😂😂😂 Im rather fixated on these Kinds of things myself. But you take this to places I wouldn't even have known about in a 1000 years. Amazing depth of knowledge.
@@drangelapuca Domus Kaotika and the Merauder Underground, a decentralized chaos magick iniciative to connect (us) all, it's been long since I don't dwell in the sewers
Quite an interesting topic. It seems that the events of every 'magic war' in the occult world mostly existed in the imagination of one of the participants. There was another , earlier, 'magic battle' between some martinist factions in France, I believe towards the end of the 19th century, or perhaps in the beginning of the 20th. Could you make an episode on it? I would he interested to see it presented from an academic point of view.
Frist thing, looking good with a mustache 😀, second I'm thinking we have the next Netflix show, just add a few ice spikes and fire balls.😁 and third. They sound lime ever other group or organization I've been a part of. 🤣. Love the video.
If you don't mind a suggestion, I would love to see a vídeo on the french War of The Magicians, wich involved martinists lodges and Eliphas Levi was in it.
You know? After limiting myself to just reading the basic description of Chaos Magick and the classics Liber Null and Psychonaut, learning about the actual history of the movement and the political turns it took is both rather disappointing and illuminating. Maybe it should be unsurprising after being alive and experiencing human nature (and how all ideologies seem to inevitably self-refute and become incoherent messes). I didn't know about this and never would have guessed that something like this happened. I never would have thought to research this of my own volition either. I owe it to you that I now know about this. This also goes to show me, again, that thinking that I know enough about a subject -- ANY subject -- is always a mistake. That, and grande principles in books and mission statements are always worthless -- the REAL proof is always in the fruits of one's labor. Reading the brochure (or the equivalent) NEVER tells the whole story and can never be enough -- maybe one day I will actually remember that. Again, THANK YOU.
🔱➿🌒❤️🌘➿🔱 So this was a pretty substantial rift. I'm my own mind it matters not what fellow Humans judge, but what the Eye of the Universe (The Undulating Serpentine force of Magick)...It is what this Force might think of My actions and the piercing of It's fangs upon the wayward Heart that would give Me pause. Well that, and I've learned that thoughtless actions often come to bite Me later when I learn firsthand what it feels like to have that done to Me... I'm only now beginning to learn so this may sound juvenile...I have memories and have had weird things happen as I grew up; but only now seriously throwing myself to study. Not really sure why I'm writing this now but it's good to know that.. Not sure how to express this; good to know that Magick is Alive and Well. Anyways enough rambling and Thankyou for Your videos. It is important to help shed Light upon the fact that Shadow is much more than We have been conditioned to believe ✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨✨
Just a note: tegmeiter was excommunicated at the end of the war. Nowadays he does not have any conection to the I.o.T. Also worth noting: any form of discrimination or supremacy is not tolerated within the order.
Interesting bit of magickal history! It all sounds, well, a bit silly really. However, I do think that Carroll was onto something, but he just got his wires crossed. He did pick up the future return of a certain political movement to Europe, he just got the target (and timing) wrong.
Speaking as a member of the IOT I can say that this is just a footnote in IOT history and not as interesting as what's happening in the order today. I don't view it as a war it was just an argument between a few occultists.
The Illuminates of Thanateros is quite the rabbit hole. The author and former IOT member Nathaniel J. Harris has some pretty dark things to say about his experience with the order.
The name Ice Magick does sound similar to the Cosmic Ice Theory entertained by some Nazis. In my opinion, Frater UD is way too smart for this to be a coincidence.
@@drangelapuca Hahaha😂. No. Both of them are too cringy for my taste when it cames to this "war". You should make your own faction called "Occultists that Lift" or something so I have who to side with. Hahaha.😂
You have a good grasp of what happened but I will say that when you invoke Chaos one should not expect order. As befits magick so much of the Ice War is a matter of perspective.
That's not chaos magic. Chaos magic is sending something into the primordial and selecting one of the many alternate outcomes that you desire to manifest. It's literally attempting to create order out of chaos. Every event has multiple outcomes and with chaos magic you attempt to select one and bring it into existence.
@@aleckcain4142 not really. are you familiar with the Chaos Theory/Butterfly Effect? A butterfly flaps it's wings in the Amazon and creates a storm over New York? How is that not "magic"? The magician is the butterfly, hoping their ritualistic flapping creates enough ripples in the chaos to achieve the result.
There is no information about what ice magick really is, some sort of martial arts chi manipulation or something? Unless you can read German. Funny if it was the best thing since sliced bread, why Ralph didn't promote it more and seems to be these days focussing on his medieval and chaos magick writing. Makes you wonder if it wasn't overhyped. What were these 'incredible feats'? I read that his mentor gave someone at the IOT a nosebleed, could have been a coincidence if she had been picking her nose too much.
@@drangelapuca true and you do a good job at that. If your free sometime, I would like to chat if you want. If your busy that’s fine. Trying to understand on how this reality works more.
4th Wall guys and gals... technology's treat this year I really hope none of yall leaked anything. I'm so old I can't remember my ass from my mouth now but assume positions. If you literally get petrified this year um... all I remember is something about a Basalisk. So... I'm probably not going to remember either so. That "internet of all things" yeah just remember hephestos himself couldn't chew smoking tobacco. And the point of course is to make him feel like the antichrist remember if he actually becomes it again... well Zeus is standing next to the plug at least this time this year. --- oh um why did I get linked here? IOT was out years ago I thought Grandpa sit down right the fridge orders replacement food with blockchain now? Oh God I just wish the antichrist would came back already and maybe Jesus, isa or whatever could have mercy on my soul as I can figure out my ass from my head. --
Well, he is German after all. Alles muss in Ornung sein! I say this in jest (as a joke). I can't speak to the ultra-right wing part. That's too common a criticism lobbed at Germans. It's cliche really. But the German culture does trend towards deferring to authority and towards organization. But your report does persuade me that Carroll was a little yahoo
@@drangelapuca I am only joking and it does seem like Carrol was making these kinds of assumptions. It's a very silly story, worthy of all the eye rolling. In any case, thank you for another interesting report
Last thing from what i understood the end goal is to merge all into one in the material world with transhumanism but this is no sense because we are already one,we just don't realize it,at the core everything is made of Consciousness,the all black that you are in what we call deep sleep transform itself in dreams and what we call the wake normal world,so in reality is nothing other than Consciousness (God inreligious terms) so we are already one the subject and object are already one,that's the real highest goal of alchemy,plus what we consider the subject the body/mind is seen so in reality is still an object,so all the world and what we call ourself is the object and Consciousness is the real subject,at the same time they are both Consciousness so they are one and the same,it Consciousness aware of itself that's the real highest goal of alchemy which is the same of every great tradition and order.
@@drangelapuca no problem i may be wrong on everything but one thing is for sure what is Real is the end goal for every being who has the necessary level of Consciousness,not just humans,so people should never feel superior or inferior of course to anyone and this is for everyone regardless the body they have and if people think that they can unite the opposite just by changing the body they are for a rude awakening or think they are better than the rest of the population,of course they should not feel inferior or not accepted but how the dynamic power has shifted in the last years is crazy and now it's them that want to force their way on the rest of the population,the oppressed become the oppressor it's always like this the dynamic power,anyway we have to do the Work it's the more important thing so whatever happen in the world we can be at peace and do the best for understand and help everyone,instead that enter one "group" that always have to end up against someone else,that's the problem of identification.
@@drangelapuca scrivo in italiano ma invece delle altre cose che scrivevo cosa ne pensi ? conosci queste antiche pratiche occulte o forse non ne hai mai sentito parlare ? o forse hai sentito solo certe versioni meno materiali e più sottili (che a mio parere sono più efficaci)? cmq se vuoi che cancello i post dimmelo che posso farlo senza problemi,buona giornata ; )
@@drangelapucaquesto è un'altro esempio scusa se è fuori argomento ma è fondamentale per capire il mondo dell'occulto, tipo seguo diverse persone che sono totaltemente devote a crowley e devo dire son le persone più brave e pacate che uno possa avere l'onore di incontrare,non farebbero mai male a uno mosca,viceversa ce ne sono altri tipo tutta la cricca del dottor Kinsey (quello della rivoluzione sessuale degli anni 60) per dire loro facevano esperimenti con sesso di gruppo con animali e bambini non è una cosa nuova,anche negli aghori i rituali di incesto e sesso con il cadavere di vergini e meditare sopra un morto e altre cose sono delle pratiche,la differenza è che il loro settore ha prodotto degli esseri realizzati che capiscono la Verità Ultima,invece il settore occidentale ha prodotto solo persone depravate che fanno ste cose come dipendenza che è tutto l'opposto,gli aghori fanno certe cose x dissolvere l'ego nel momento che diventa un piacere è da abbandonare,io spero solo che i gruppo piu "estremi della mano sinistra" chiamiamoli cosi riescano a prendere spunto ed imparare dalle correnti come quella degli aghori o dell'ordine del drago o anche dalle persone che seguono correnti thelemiche in maniera "pacifica" il primo gruppo che descrivevo all'inizio,oppure un gruppo estremo come il culto sabbati però hanno capito qual'è il vero goal finale,è una corrente estrema che però a mio parere è valida,quindi non pensare che sia uno bigotto o coi pregiudizi,mi piace solo cercare di capire quali sono le migliori possibilità per i diversi cammini dei diversi esseri umani,scusa di nuovo se questo è un'altro argomento ma visto che sei parecchio informata più di me sugli ordini mi sembra mi interessava sapere se avevi un'idea di queste cose o come le vedevi ,buona giornata ; ) (e se devo cancellare qualche post questo compreso dimmelo che non c'è problema ciao ciao : )
