Is a Heat Pump Cheaper to Run Than a Gas Boiler? 

Adam was so patient. His confidence in his skill and knowledge spoke a thousand words. Well done Heat Geek.

Thanks again for the collaboration SB! Great to see it still running at 520% efficiency for the last 30 days as anyone can see by following the link. Heat geek guarentee the efficiency due to our belief in the ability of small family run businesses putting their heart and soul in to their work, with a bit of help from our training. This has resulted in an average SCOP across our installations of 4.44 to date. Here’s to the next!

I had a heat pump installed under the old gas boiler replacement scheme. The first year it was expensive but not a big problem but one room was struggling to make temp. After the original installers could not find fault I found a heat geek from the website and after a one hour visit the controls were adjusted and a blending valve turned off the system has wor,ed like a dream all winter with much smaller bills and all rooms working. I cannot speak more highly about the heat geek and skill builder videos.

Adam sitting very patiently waiting for the data to do all the talking 😂 smashed it heat geeks!

Even though Roger has been critical of heat pumps in the past, it's great to see him bring in people who know about them, shows they can be good etc as long as it's done right. The scare mongering around heat pumps need to end and this level headed showcase has been great

Rooftop Solar, Inductioncooking, HT Heatpump. No Gas. Makes a lot of Money. Power from the Sun, heat from the Air. COP 4. Works for 12 years now.❤👍

A briliant set of films.Thanks to Heet Geek Skill Builder and the gentleman who allowed us into his home.Entertaining and thought provoking.

I’m a heating engineer for the last 25 years and I think you may have started to convert me to the idea of heat pumps Thanks for the great videos

Roger. Ive been following this poor guys saga from the beginning. I love what you said about the space under the kitchen cabinets. Thinking outside the box that. 👍👍👍

I moved from the UK to Finland 20 years ago. I'm amazed at how our radiators never get hot like my radiators in the UK but we are always at 23°C room temp. They feel warm (but only at the top) when it's minus 20 C outside. Insulation is great. Our building is moving away from multifuel district heating to ground source heat pumps with Solar panels on the roof as of next winter. Also our powered ventilation is going to start heat recovery so the warm air will no longer be vented. It will last 20-25 years and will repay the loan taken within the first 7 years. After that we will be quids (euros) in for the next 15 years

This is a brilliant series of videos. Really enjoyed the journey. Glad to see John has a functioning, efficient system and a comfortable home now. It's no doubt been a stressful and expensive few years for him and the good lady. All the best and hopefully we get another follow up video at some point.

I was previously rude to you SB and I'd like to apologise, I'm glad Adam reached out to you and ha shown you the positives of heat pumps and how to design them.

Damm Roger, Adam and John for ruining my day because I have to watch it before doing anything else and damn them again for compelling me to waste time writing to say how good it is.

Great collab. Loved watching this all the way through, great stuff!

As smart and invested as John seems to be, I am surprised that he hadn't done the ceiling insulation first. I am extremely pleased to see that the system is now working for them. Well done Heat Geeks, John and SB.

what a fantastic journey from youtube beef right through to diagnosis and science behind the whole system. well done to all parties, I have learnt a lot from this

They are absolutely correct about searching for a company who has well trained fitters before you consider having a heat pump.

Congrats to everyone for a balanced and grounded discussion - plenty of food for thought.

Adam explains things so well - he simplifies things, which really helps to learn about this "new" heat pump technology (the Scandinavians have been using heat pumps for decades!).

HGeek clearly a super decent honourable outfit 👍

For a true comparison it would be interesting to compare apples with apples, i.e. a gas boiler system with ASHP, both with similar standards of insulation and weather compensated to really compare like for like. A few issues, they use gas for cooking so the standing charge saving is a non starter unless the cook with electricity in which case the electricity cost would rise. Without the grant and favourable electricity rates currently offered for ASHP heated houses, the payback period would be significantly longer, so making it much less realistic an option for many, particularly if you aren’t in your house for life and plan on moving. The original install was circa £16k, heat geek suggested £20k, I’m guessing that the cost of the refit was significantly more than £20k if all hours were charged and not done for promotional reasons. I’m guessing, but i imagine that the greater percentage saving comes from upgrading the insulation, windows, draught proofing and weather compensation than from the heat source itself, ASHP or new gas boiler. I admit i am biased because i don’t believe the cult of saving carbon, so that factor would never enter my thinking, albeit that i accept the government have already and will increase taxes to manipulate the carbon net zero ponzi schemes. I’m open minded to any heating system though and my son is a heating engineer, fitting ASHP on new build schemes and gas boilers

I have enjoyed watching this series of videos. Thanks for always coming back with feedback... The heat geeks are real pros

Well done for the collaboration. It shows talking to each other is always the best way.

I want to see how these work with a standard semi-detached house from say the 1930's. Not to mention a terraced house! Space for all the gear, what would need doing with pipe work, radiator replacement etc. etc. etc.

Love it!! Such great publicity. ❤

Really enjoyed these videos guys, excellent

Great follow up, thanks!!

Always nice to see Glyn Hudson on the leader board with 4.7 scop on his self install!

We just need a lot more heat geeks

Amazing job Roger, this is a well applied scrutiny in a civilised manner, we need more of this from everyone!

Incredible job all involved.

Now that small water heater is very interesting if it can fit into the space where my combi boiler was I would be very interested

I'd love this but honestly the amount of highly skilled people needed to sort this all out is just beyond us regular folk. Indeed, what would be the labour cost of all those 'Heat Geek' engineers required for this particular installation? The science and engineering is fascinating and clearly it can all work but I don't think it can be replicated for us regular folk. The skills are not out there in the numbers needed and even in this case, with all the knowledgeable pre-work (and previous efforts and results all noted), the actual cost of the final skills & labour required in this example looks to be extreme. I'd sign-up in a heartbeat if this massive team was available to me at an affordable price. However, skilled people do not work for peanuts (nor should they, their enhanced skills have to be rewarded) - even if you could find them.

Finally some sense talked and whilst not in the market for getting rid of our gas boiler heating just yet, it gives me hope for the future.

Big thanks to John for letting us in on this saga. It's a great example of the benefits of this type of heating system, but also how it can go wrong, and hopefully will help people to make the right choices for their own situations.

Great vid and explanations. I keep tossing between the comfort idea. I accept a steady constant temp is comfortable from the point of view of being awake and moving around the house, feel of drafts, radiance from heatsink walls etc. Where I struggle is the idea of a constant temp day and night, I value the significant drop in temperature at night, 18c is an absolute max for me to sleep and lower is much better, then the room warming in the morning naturally wakes me as an alarm. With a more consistent day to night temp this comfort goes away for me, I don't sleep as well and I don't wake up as well.

Spend £20,000 to save £1,100 a year is not a true comparison. As you need to compare the cost of an original installation (say in new builds). Retrofitting say if you gas boiler needs replacing. That £20K for £1.1K saving gives a return (not accounting for inflation) over 18 years. Of course the technology in that install won’t last 18 years. So you won’t actually get that return. I think the comparison with two new builds same house design one with a gas boiler and one with a heat pump, is the only way to get a true comparison. You will see the impact in terms of original instal costs, running costs, and how the technology impacts the space within the House.

Great series with a satisfying ending. Would also be interesting to compare maintenance costs for gas vs heatpump over that period.

Well done everyone for the input to this collaboration. I can only dream of that kind of COP. My system has higher COP (3) running the Mixergy than our heating! (2.5)

Okay, if I can get a heat pump I'll definitely go to heat geeks for install direction.

Here in Iceland we use geothermal underfloor heating to keep the rooms at a constant 22°C. Whilst it's not a heat pump, it concurs with what you were saying about a constant background heating is much better than the Yo-Yo heating method of gas boilers

Even with heatgeek approved installers, I’ve had two quote for my three bed 10 year old semi you can’t be sure of a good reasonable price installation. The first estimate was £15000 and the second was £15000 to £20000 dependent on a £250 survey. The second one said we didn’t need to change the cylinder he would use an external coil. Octopus installed for £8800 all in with new cylinder and two radiators and the deposit was fully refundable if we chose not to go ahead. We did and it’s working great, what’s more it’s cheaper to run than gas. The only thing I would say is Octopus are very picky on where and how they’ll instal.

An excellent video, gives a great insight and perspective of a heat pump system. I live off the Gas grid and rely on multiple sources of heat to warm our 100 year old + house. We have a pellet stove, an oil Rayburn, open fires and a multi fuel stove ! we hardly have the CH on. I agree with Rodger, with the perfect scenario a heat pump will be excellent, however for some folks it just wouldn’t work.

Great it sounds grand, I still prefer a wood burner,Simples. Great video Roger many thanks bud.

Insulation done. 9KW of PV, full house MVHR, 16 KW of battery storage. Next month the ASHP. Goodbye gas. The 12 year journey is nearly complete. Great set of videos.

For older buildings vacuum glass is great. It allows you to retrofit into the existing frames a glass with an U value of less than 1. Even better than triple glassing for Benglass for example with U=0.4W/m2K. We are doing a retrofit of a listed building in Holland right now and we do have to ask for permits but it should be approved, and we can definitely not have to be cold.

Well done to all involved -- very interesting series.

Me again! I have never had gas CH/HW as I am off the gas grid. My old solid fuel CH/HW was decommissioned when I had ASHP CH/HW installed on a Scottish Gov. 100% grant. Since I do not have any other form of heating to fall back on - which Skill Builder seems a tad fixated on, i.e., gas - I am 100% dependent on my heat pump system. Yet on the NW coast of Scotland, where winter is longer if not actually much colder than the south of England (Gulf Stream/maritime effect), my heat pump is just brilliant, the house is very cosy, I have no complaints at all. Yet in this video, SB dude seems to want 'back up', 'just in case'. Why? I have never been cold in the two years since my ASHP was fitted, and I spend on electricity - and I'm serious - less than 40% of what I formerly did on coal and wood. If I had gas heating I wouldn't need or even want a back up, so why so with a heat pump system?

Lovely to listen to, yet... the UK has had an "unusually" mild winter (again!!!). In the UK we are positioned geographically between the Arctic and the Sahara, the Northern Atlantic Ocean and the Eurasian continental mass. Depending upon global climatic variations, our weather can be dependent on prolonged Zonal conditions - basically air flow from similar latitudes, roughly East and West, or Meridional - from similar longitudes, roughly North and South. These highly unpredictable variations result in phenomena such as "The Beast from The East", "Spanish Plumes", and "blocking Highs". April 2024's continuing chill results from a northerly Atlantic High drawing down polar air from Scandinavia over the UK. Had this Meridional airflow occurred in midwinter, instead of the mild, wet Zonal weather we had from the mid-Atlantic, I'm not sure this video would have sounded so positive.

Really enjoyed this real life problem before and after videos.

absolutely brilliant..open mind, fair minded approach and great insight..fair play lads..this is top

Not convinced on heat pumps yet. Not been around long enough, plus I'm sure the designers can make them more efficient and more rapid whilst taking up less space.

Anything wrong with just adjusting the radiator flow temperature between 34 to 45°C as I do with our Vaillant LPG condensing combi? Easily modified to maintain 24/7 20°C in every room with adjustment to radiator valves. 3 bed semi in a rural situation, cavity and a bit of loft insulation. £1000/year cost.

Great video and a highly impressive result on the revamped system. Its quite fun to see the arguments against heat pumps. "Oh well why dont you try fitting one to an igloo in the middle of the arctic circle and comes back tk me" 😂

This is great to watch, 2 conficting opinions managing to find common ground. We the consumer benifit from both parties opinions and i really appreciate your mature approach to a controversial topic.

I personally had a condensing gas combiboiler installed just 2 years ago, I have a reasonable heating bill and my electricity price is still about 5 times higher than my gas price (it is going down, 2 years ago it was over 7 times), so I'm not changing over any time soon since it would take many many years to earn the investment back. Heatpumps are definitely the future, they're getting more versatile, more efficient, cheaper, the knowledge in the field is improving thanks to people like Heat Geek. However, a lot of the tricks to improve efficiency of a heatpump can also help the efficiency of a condensing boiler: oversized radiators or in floor heating, as low flow temperature as possible, weather compensation, lower hot water temperature with legionella cycles instead of maintaining a constant 60°C, improving insulation and draft-proofing, having an appropriately sized boiler instead of one that's 3+ times more powerful than necessary...

Just to try and add a bit of balance, personally even after all these videos on this installation, I'm still not convinced that they've really made a strong financial case for installing a heat pump system. Firstly I'll freely admit I'm not a massive fan of these systems so may be I'm showing a little bias but when considering the two systems and the real overall costs I think the arguments regarding cost savings aren't that compelling. For a start as it was said in the video the original installation cost I believe was around £20,000 including insulation. Had the insulation alone been done and then the overall running costs re-calculated for the gas only system I doubt the benefit would subsequently have been so large. Next the system cost £20,000 when it didn't work effectively, so how much more did it cost to actually get it to work properly and how much additional cost was incurred whilst it was being fixed? A heat pump system uses more hardware and has more moving parts that can wear out, has a larger overall foot print, and from my experience cooling fans tend to get noisy as they get dirty/wear and external pipe insulation can crack and deteriorate over time. If the system takes 10 years to payback the investment and that was after discounting the BUS money I believe, then even at that break even point what is the remaining expected lifespan on the equipment going forward? I suspect the cost of maintaining a heat-pump system is also greater than your average boiler system. Don't get me wrong I'm not against Heat-pumps and EVs for that matter and I'm not just trying to be a miserable old Luddite, it's just that I'm not totally convinced that financially the claims that are made for them are really that strong. I appreciate the desire to be green and for those that are happy to pay the premium to support the cause, fair play to you and well done. However I'm more interested in taking up new technology once the financial case has been proven, I've no desire to be an early adopter if financially it is going to come at an additional and avoidable cost to me. Once the financial argument and overall benefits are beyond doubt then I'm more than happy to consider adopting them provided I am not required to make any other unreasonable sacrifices. Until then I'm happy to stick with my old boiler and an airing cupboard with space to air clothes in, rather than one with more vessels, pipework and valves than you can shake a stick at.

brilliant video... great information .. thanks to you all

Looking at moving house and thinking about buying one that needs new heating and this is giving more confidence in a heat pump!

If we are going to rely on windmills for electric and it isn't windy what will the scop be on a calm day?

Great video series, I am on board with everything up until the upfront installation cost and it's a shame it was glossed over in all videos here. £20k (£13.5k with grant) for an installation is insane, I have been quoted £3.5k from octopus energy which is easier to stomach but still struggle to understand how they can get away with charging £11k. 5 years ago we had a combi replaced and all radiators for just over £2k all in. I appreciate the savings generated but upfront costs are what most people will base their decision on!

Two adult engineers coming together and having a good discussion. Been ace to see this guys. May the love continue 😃

£754 to heat a 6 bedroom house for the year. But apparently heat pumps don’t work. Well done Adam.

The point about horses for courses and gas boilers still being around for some after most homes have heat pumps has a major flaw. As the number of gas users falls, at some point the cost per user to maintain the required infrastructure for supply gas will become unfeasible. It will cost too much to sustain the gas supply industry in order to support as small number of thinly scattered gas users. It will be cheaper to put in electric (non heat pump) heating - even if those customers require subsidies.

Definitely the next video for skill builder and heat geek is to fit one in rogers house ! I think that’s the video everyone wants to see lol

Just found your channel. I work as a QS for a plumbing & heating company & we work in the new build environment so are currently working with ASHP & UFH systems. Going to share your channel around the office as the knowledge & opinions all match what we're working within now. We're all privately waiting for hydrogen production & infrastructure to get going to be honest.

It's good to know that this man, with a big house, has got his heat pump working quite well. However, he's been set up with a very knowledgeable, and experienced installer, who rectified the previous set up. How many installers are this experienced? Let's also note that the new installation needs a significant amount of room, and many houses have not got enough space. It doesn't seem like a solution to everyone's needs.

Wow! Who would have thought that insulation comes before heat pump!!! Shocking!

Don't doubt the COP when it's a bit cold and windy outside. My garden is a frost pocket, have 100% doubts when it's still and freezing weather. Annualised is no good, need most heating when it's really cold. All the hot water takes less than 3kWh/ day with resistive. (e.g. 1.2kWh for a shower).

Loved the video, nice to see you all collaborating and getting along. I think it would be good to get Rodger involved with Szymon on a full Install and Commissioning of a Heat Pump System.

A wood burning stove will warm your house, cook your food and dry your cloths...and never goes wrong!

Electricity prices are volatile esp since privatisation.

Yes they are well cheap if installed correctly! Great job heat geek !

With weather compensation on a replacement gas boiler installation like I designed for a small business office complex using Danfoss equipment made for this purpose the system runs automatically 24/7 with good insulation and correctly sized radiators all with rad stats. This was over 20 years ago and worked efficiently and at much lower cost than the original gas boiler installation. It did, however, require the first electrician to be replaced as he could not understand the wiring! Some tech: The boiler had input and output boiler temperature sensors which enabled pump overrun without firing and there was an outside temperature sensor so individual rad heat output was system balanced. Nighttime system temperature was automatically lowered as the offices were unused during this time. Hot water was zoned.

16k many years before you get a saving. 10 or 11 years. But no mention of the repair costs in case it goes wrong.

There’s no way I’d have that big ugly box in my garden. I’ll stick with my combi and log burner thanks.

Absolute great result. But as said, insulation should be the starting point. Having my house well insulated now gives me more comfort. I did external wall insulation, new windows and a new warm flat roof on the extension and garage, and the difference is huge. No cold drafts and with the bit poor April weather now, 10°C during daytime and around 0°C in the morning the small wood stove downstairs is still enough to heat the whole house. I'm typing this behind my computer upstairs, no heating on since the end of March, and still 18,5°C. When the woodstove isn't on I use air to air to heat, and the downstairs 7kW unit runs at 20% modulation (which is the minimum) and keeps it warm. A lot comes in draft proofing as well, but ventilation must be assured. Old houses without draft proofing however have a much higher air replacement rate than you need for the air quality to stay good.

Very very interesting thank you

I am leaving this comment here so that after some hours, days, weeks, months or years when someone likes or comment on it, I will be reminded to watch this video again😄

I went from gas to a heat pump and a very large battery, annual costs have dropped from £4k to £1.5k - nice

So glad the customer is happy. Well done guys. I'm not converted myself. I still much prefer the ability to zone my heating and cooling zones.

Thanks for all the brilliant and informative videos. I also have a heat pump and they do work. As you say, it has to be designed and commissioned properly. What was the total heat loss of the property? Many thanks.

Roger is gutted that heat pumps work 😂

My issue is every time there is a comparison its against a combi thats not set up properly get a gas boiler install thats got oversized radiators and on weather comp/mixed circuits etc and then do a comparison

I see loads of heat pumps when I’m out n about. Most are in the Badenoch and Strathspey area, where there is no mains gas. Think Cairngorm Mountains and Aviemore ski resort. They must be replacing oil fired boilers and LPG with a heat pump. I’ve asked a few about it, and everybody seems very happy.

I have a flat, I will be putting in a heat pump later this year. I can't wait.

If only everything was done correctly then heat pumps could be more accepted.. And for some homes heat pumps will never be a solution..

paid off in 10 years but how long does the system last 10 years ?

great video as always

Can I ask what the square meterage was please ?

It only depends on how much you pay gas and how much you pay electricity in any particular country. In Germany for example it is impossible: heat pumps and gas boiler from a pure cost perspective are equivalent. ( Without PV ) And and and. The above is true only if the property is well insulated. If not gas will definitely be cheaper.

Totally insulate your house before getting a heat pump fitted and you will save money. How about totally insulate your house and then save in the cost of a heat pump (and all the duff engineers calls associated), and see how much you save then.

If my gas boiler fails tonight, how long would it be before my replacement heat pump would be up and running & fully tweaked? Compare this to a new gas install.

Here is my experience. The house is a 1960s 4 bed 2000square foot bungalow that was extended to its current size about 6 years ago and brought up to current (then) insulation standards. A year ago I had an 11KW Ecodan ASHP installed and a 11KW solar system installed. I retained a 4 zone programmable controller with 3 zones UFH and 1 radiators in the old part of the house which are mainly bed and bath rooms. The installation was done by a firm based 3 hours away. Comments on ASHP. - The house was quite comfortable over the winter months although during rapid cooling cold snaps we did use some additional electric heating whilst the ASHP caught up. We are on the Octopus Cosy tariff where electric is cheaper from 4am-7am and 1pm- 4pm. My main concerns are (1) it wasn't that cold this year as last, so I am thinking of more permanent additional heating in the form of fan heating. (2) There is a lot in these videos about running the heat pump continuously at constant room temperatures, I didn't do that allowing the temperatures to fall over night. (3) The installers had to come back to correct some plumbing errors where radiator zone was becoming warm when off, this was due to backflow from the UFH getting into the radiator loop and was only solved by me after two visits and after I had done some research watching RU-vid videos and taking temperature reading! (4) Service costs and getting people in to do it are proving about double or treble that of a gas boiler. I've been waiting for over 6 weeks for Mitsubishi to get back to me to arrange the annual service. There seems few if any people local to me who could do it. Ironically part of the sales pitch for ASHPs is there lower requirement for maintenance and higher reliability but what’s the point if when it does require work there's no one around that is available to do it! Comments on 11KW PV installation with 2 x 5KW batteries. - I maximised the size of this array knowing that the output would be poor when I needed it most for the ASHP. And yes your right the output in December and January comes no where near suppling the heating. The batteries help by giving me another 16KW of cheap electricity per day. The way I look at it I'm using Octopus energy as a "Seasonal battery". That is to say I sent them a lot of electricity in the summer when output is high and take a lot back in the winter when the ASHP needs it. Currently my cheap energy times are charged at 12p/kwh and my export is paid at 15p/kwh, I can't believe this will last, but even before the recent price drops the incoming cost was 17p, so a marginal cost of 2p/kwh is not bad. I have had a problem with the inverters disconnecting from the grid under certain circumstances which is still an outstanding issue with the installer who is ignoring me after they sent a man in, blamed me for changing a setting which was within the permitted range and after they changed (which the should have been able to do remotely but didn't) tried to charge me. I pointed out that the fault was present before I changed the parameter and also after they changed it back and obviously refused to pay. Conclusions - (1) Get local suppliers if possible. (2) I am concerned about service and maintenance for the ASHP especial in winter if a fault occurs. (3) the combination of PV panels and ASHP is a powerful one. Its difficult to calculate the exact savings because of price and weather variations however I can say that I have saved in the order of £3000 using this years prices against my gas and electricity consumption for the previous year. This far exceeds the amount of interest the installation cost was earning in my savings account. I think the adoption of both these technology’s together can have a significant effect on bills and emissions.

I heard Adam say that even with the high COPs of the ASHP, that gas boilers adjusted for similar flows etc in similar conditions are not much worse in efficiency. Given that, why force everyone electric at great cost? I suppose it depends on whether you believe in the net zero project or not. But for the heatpumps to be "green" they need "green" electric, which could only be notionally achieved if you believe nukes are "green" and they can roll them out fast enough.

having constant low heating isnt specific to heat pumps surely gas can be run like that so irrelevant

Ground source heat pumps are the best of the heat pumps , put one in a farm 14 years ago & still going strong . Alot of factures to make sure you can get the best out the air source heat pumps ,miss one thing off and they under perform !!

Speak to heating engineers, and telling them that the boiler will be replaced with a heat pump - they are fixated on telling me that my electricity bill will be higher than my gas bill, my living space (open plan living/dining/kitchen) has only one or three rads working for years - expect to change in next 12-24 months

Spend £20,000 and save £500 a year? will take 40 years to get your money back and will the heat pump gear even last that long

Entire Heat Geek team working on this one installation so probably done at a loss as its for skill builder, 20k is an immense amount of money that will pay for 3 boilers installed then it needs replacing every 12years, 20c is not hot enough for many ladies for sure more like 23c and only 2 people using hot water so it wont be nowhere near as cost effective if those change, 90% of people don't have the space, very good insulation is required or it wont work, it wont perform as well in the depths of winter below 2c so you will need the boiler, many more components that can go wrong and will need replacing. This is a good example of how it can be done with a whole team of people working on it but a little unrealistic.