This was supposed to be the vacation expac. But no. We had to deal with eugenics, memory altering nonsense, genocide, war crimes, and an outright invasion from another shard. Vacation was cut short. Estinien got lucky.
I swear Wuk Lamat is the newest poster child for the Black-hole Sue trope. The entire cast's characterization bent itself backward to put her in the spotlight, constantly singing her praise for things she didn't do or doesn't have, all characters just have a big drop in their IQ and nod in approval no matter how many stupid things she does, all of her "quirky" flaws bear no consequences in the end, and she somehow became stronger than the Wol/Azem themselves in a fight she has no business with. And that doesn't even mention how the writer constantly glues her to the Wol's side like those self-insert OCs you usually find in fanfics, the ones that suddenly appear in the plot and somehow become the love-interest of an established main character. That's what she feels like to me with the whole asking to hold hands, staying with her in Tural and her sis-con brother acting jealous.
A lot of characters acted so strange just for Wuk Lamat. Alisae and friends calling her Llama Tea, when she doesn't do that Alphinaud or the other Scions. IIRC, Y'shtola contacted her first with the Link pearl. The writer really forcing the whole world, in-game and IRL, to love her really made her just straight out annoying and even made the dialogue options focus to just love her and cheer her on when we don't want to pick either option. She really is an insane depiction of the Black-hole Sue trope.
@@Sithalos I just did, too... I try to like Wuk Lamat, simply because she is a main cast moving foreward and she's a "good noodle" ... but where the writing is concerned there is no denying that this trope just fits her perfectly - and thats really, really bad.
This is well said. And I would add to this that she experienced no real character growth. She was the same "Lets talk, because we can be friends" in the beginning as the end and she 100% would have stopped at 1% health with Zoraal Ja or Sphene if either said "okay, lets talk, you love peace right?!" Regarding the power ups, we have in-lore Dynamis reasoning, but I 100% agree with you that it felt WAY off/odd and unearned. Wuk Lamat literally busted through a dimensional barrier like Zeno to get into the cutscene, and bust out overwhelming power that is 3x more then WoL DPS the entire fight in a single hit (5.2million) and each DPS the ENTIRE fight is between 1.3 and 2.2m). This is the same person kidnapped by common bandits just hours ago.
You didn't mention Bakool Ja Ja unleashing the monster that they set up as a world destroyer so he could get a head start on the keystones... Only to get stopped at a taco competition that apparently all the other claimants would have to wait at? He's not just a bully, he's actually a villain until the writing tells us he's not. And the saddest part is, he's one of my favorite characters from this expansion because he's actually entertaining.
Its the reason I can't watch Amazing Race with my family. It's not a race. It's a series of overwrought, manufactured scenes. Just like this flimsy popsicle stand of a plot in DT.
If he wasn't so cartoonishly evil and if he didn't literally try to kill everyone with the nuke monster he might have even been a great charter. He's definitely my favourite character of the expansion for me because it feels like he's the only character that had any growth and actually changed. Everyone else is essentially unchanged by the end of the story.
I think Bakool Ja Ja's stunt there would have made more sense for him to release Valigarmanda in attempt to flex and kill the creature himself only to get stomped like he did against Zareel Ja. And then we have to clean up his mess. That would have been more in line with what they were going for.
I just got to this part of the story, and I'm so pissed right now. I thought everyone, especially Wuk, was going to be ready for blood after Bakool woke the dragon. I wanted everyone to have a relatable and realistic reaction to this part of the story. Instead everyone was chill and happy ready for the cooking contest. Like WTF
@@sadporkbelly Here's the other annoying part. According to my friend, by the time she steps in, she's doing more damage than the whole party combined and I was like wtf
I think my main issue with Dawntrail's narrative isn't that the WoL isnt the main character, hell most of the expansions we haven't been the lead character outside of Realm Reborn/shadowbringers and the last quarter of Endwalker. The issue is dawntrail gives me no reason to care about what happens to this nation, there isn't a single plot point that forces the WoL and by extension the player feel personally invested, we just stand in the background and nod as Wuk Lamat takes all the credit for the work we personally put in. Then she has the nerve to act like Party leader in the final act despite whats going on being well above her pay grade now. Like if we had some kinda stake Id be more willing to deal with Wuk Lamat being in literally every scene desperately trying to be the MC like a self insert OC but as is, I could have solved all the problems on my own, the new villain is the weakest least threatening antagonist in the entire game, he's wannabe SMT Chaos hero with daddy issues. He got his butt kicked in his own villain reveal and had to rely on some future tech to just stand a chance. Villains dont have to be a martial threat but look at Thordon who played everyone like a fiddle before he finally took the spot light as MSQ antagonist. Its telling when the red haring antagonist is more interesting, better developed and more of a threat than the real one.
That's why people defending it by claiming that it's about the WoL being a mentor because they're "too powerful" and will only step up when needed annoy me. Because NO that's not what happens. Wuk Lamat is the main character right up to the end even when she shouldn't be. The entire story warps around a character that has no business doing what she does.
"We're just a backseater" and "Wuk sucks" are just people feeling bad about the utterly sub-amateur quality storytelling. Neither is the real answer but it's easier to say and understand than the real tragedy: They handed this platinum-level series over to someone unqualified for even a copper trophy. In ShB I thought ok, hey, maybe it's just a bad junior-level quest text translator they let translate too many scenes. But now, the call is coming from inside the house (which is in Japan) with DT and it's clear the script itself is just trash, the writer has no idea what humanity is while writing and entire 25+ hour movie about the value of humanity, and if they're allowed to do this again, the game is sunk.
@@vazzaroth Serious question. What are your problems with the ShB story? Generally it is the best received of all the expacs. And by the way, I think that movie is longer than 25 hours if you can believe it. (Personally I'm not sure. It felt more like a year.)
@@zephyr8072 So wait please explain when the WOL ever got the Credit for what He/She does in the game except by the Scions lmao? You comment makes no sense. You are not competing in the competition, and there setting up story. When you have a character who can whoop half the people in a Anime universe the story is not always going to be around them lmao. There setting up character development for future expansions moron. The only reason your character was a main in Shadowbringer's Was because they where explaining your connection with Hydaelyn and it was lead up to Endwalker. Not only that Shadow was nothing but plot armor lmao. So in your opinion A story need to revolve around your character and 100 percent nobody else whatsoever, thus having no plot development other then welp my character is really really op, Yep sound fun alright lmao.
●Dawntrail is a disaster● •Lower quality ENG VA because the new Western localization manager got her friends jobs •The script was written by an former theater playwright who was fired for his low quality works •The role and side quests were written by veteran writers and were of far greater quality than the MSQ •Jobs are all so homogenized they practically play themselves
I'm not too sure about the role quests being "greater quality" than MSQ. It felt more like a Saturday Morning action cartoon considering what they wanted to do but it mostly boiled down to being a general nuisance instead of actually real harmful stuff. I'd say the only ones who came close was the one for the Melee DPS role quest and I guess maybe the Healer role quest.
Do you have any evidence about your 2nd and 3rd point? Disagree on the 4th point: the role quests were just as bad as MSQ, probably worse. And point 5: thats a generalisation and only your opinion. I know people that would agree with you, and just as many that disagree.
This is the only expansion that Im consistantly skipping cut scenes on. Usually after Wuk says...Well anything really (why did they write her with such a gratingly naive personality and she is so poorly voiced). I want to go help Koana with thancred and urianger SOOOO BADLY. I like scenes that establish lore. But a rule of storytelling is "Dont tell a story within your adventure that your readers would RATHER be experiancing.". For me its the story of Galool Ja Ja. The tale of him uniting a continent of warring tribes and establishing a new country is INTERESTING. Waaay more interesting than completing Wuk Lamats dice collection through arbitrary tasks.
Since ARR I haven’t skipped a cutscene once. But this expansion I couldn’t handle the stupid story and dialogue. It’s about 4 hours before you get access to the first dungeon of the game. This was so bad and Natsuko Ishikawa’s absence is very evident
I read every dialogue and watched every cutscene until lvl94. At that point I just couldn't take it anymore and proceeded to skip EVERY cutscene and dialogue. Afterward I put someone else's DT msq playthrough on my 2nd monitor while doing post msq content to see what I missed when I skipped everything. Turns out I didn't miss a dam thing and had enough context clues from the settings and gameplay to piece the dogshit story together.
Yes, it is pretty god awful. I saw a great analogy on the english official forums when someone tried to claim this was your "mentor" arc and you were now Gandalf. A person replied and said "You aren't a mentor, you aren't Gandalf, you aren't even Pippin, you are a nameless random soldier of Gondor." 90% of the agency in this story is owned by Wuk Lamat. 5% is owned by Koana. The rest is owned by a combination of multiple minor characters, Erenville, and two Scions. You know who has 0% of the agency? You the player and the Warrior of Light. Even the so called main villain had no agency if you pay attention to what is being said in the final zone. This better be a one expansion story, because there is nothing in this expansion I want to revisit ever for any reason.
@@gapho5198 Yeah. My favorite part is no one even says his name again after he dies. No one sees it, no one knows where he went, but he died so hard he was erased like he was an endless. One more example of the bad writing of the expansion.
Welcome to Japan my dude. Honestly if you can name 5 shounen series that have anything to do STORY WISE with FFXIV other then Tropes then ya Ill admit your right.
I hated the MSQ. Wuk Lamat felt like a self insert by a writer because we weren't even allowed to spend one on one free time with other characters, just that one short Western section and the entire rest of the expansion is just Wuk Lamat. Her voice acting was not good, especially in the later half when the VA needed to give strong emotion and didn't. And the whole thing felt like a children's cartoon, the villains are laughably evil and then just make a total heel turn because everyone in the story is so taken by Wuk Lamat being friendly that they literally had a character tell her she ended decades of bad blood and xenophobia when all she did was promise to give them seeds if she gets the throne. Just comparing how they handled the politics vs even just Garlemald in EW, it's like DT was written for kids in the single digit age range with how "Friendship is magic" it was.
Wuk Lamat: Let's split up! I'll go with the WoL :) Me: :( Hated so much this expansion man, so much that I will have to go back to wow classic and play friking cataclysm dude, friking cataclysm
Okay I hated Alisaie and Alphinaud, because they always dropped the ball, acted like spoiled children, and Complete know it all, and i 100 percent had to be put on a leash, so they did not fuck anything else up, but I knew THEY NEED CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT!!! Endwalker paid off there characters in so many ways, watching them grow up in front of my eyes brought a tear to my eye. Wuk Lamat needs some time to cook it sounds like you just need to skip the rest of the expansion.
@@scottymorgan7868 That's part of the problem. Wuk Lamat might superficially seem like she needs time to cook, but she gets no cooking whatsoever, she learns no lessons, she just gets a dynamis power up and acts nice and it works. She's an atrocious mary sue.
>Talk to Wuk Lamat >Follow Wuk Lamat >Help Wuk Lamat >Walk with Wuk Lamat >Ask about Wuk Lamat >Carry items for Wuk Lamat >Give your favorable opinion about Wuk Lamat >Cheer on Wuk Lamat >Do chores for Wuk Lamat >Advise Wuk Lamat >Get saved by Wuk Lamat >Dance for Wuk Lamat >Grovel before Wuk Lamat >Die for Wuk Lamat
Gotta cut out "Advise Wuk Lamat" cause we dont even get to do that. Meanwhile in social media and such people are coping about us being a mentor role this time. The fuck we are. We are set decoration, no mentor character.
@@RiseInAfterlife I agree, however I will say at the very least we haven't reached "White Knight Chronicles" level of non-existence, it's a JRPG where you created your character then after the first couple of scenes, your presence is literally ignored, as if you were some ghost following the group.
if you where not braindead and actually payed attention to the story you would understand that you have not been the WOL since like the end of 6.0 lmao.
If you count how many times our character just nods in all the cutscenes it si the Nodder of Light not a warrior anymore. And the best is that in some scenes Wuk Lamat Axe covers the face of our characters that are always in background.
I hated this expansion. Wuk Lamat was everywhere...this stupid writers self insert....even at the final Boss...she had to be there and ruin a good fight which i longed for.
As I saw someone say elsewhere, Wuk Lamat at the final boss is the equivalent of the collective will of all the Scions and the sum total power of Dynamis from an entire planet channeled into the Warrior of Light. By just being Wuk Lamat. By just being there.
@@zephyr8072 The only way I can reconcile myself to this is to head canon that fight as a deranged fever dream or nightmare caused by temporary brain damage incurred while serving as Wuk Lamat's "retainer" for 30 hours straight.
@loomingdeath1758 theres a few times where she looks at you and her plans visibly change right afterwards. Also some of the meaningless dialog options have a I wanta reckless option and a "maybe blank will help" most other npcs can tell you two are not on the same level even if they don't know you. If this was another game your character would be the party member that couldn't level up was overpowered for the first bit of the game and then plot device dies after the other characters had time to develop abit
You have got to be like, racist to believe this or something man. It’s the same quality as all the other MSQs, except this time it’s about appreciating culture.
@@JackDobbs-fi6ib So I'm a racist because I don't like the MSQ? How does any of this have to do with race? The pacing is atrocious, I don't enjoy a majority of the new characters, and I'm spending a majority of my time doing chores for people.
@@Oblivionknight I wouldn’t positively claim that you are, but I certainly suspect it lol. The majority of EVERY msq is doing chores for people, but all of a sudden when there’s a moral panic about a trans voice actor and the MSQ is about the appreciation of native cultures, people are making a stink about it.
@@JackDobbs-fi6ib I literally didn't even know the VA was trans and I couldn't care less. It has nothing to with native cultures or VA. The story is boring and the pacing is terrible. There are moments that were good, but it was an extreme slog to get through. Learning about cultures can be interesting, but spending 2 hrs dealing with alpaca, 2 hours putting together a float, 2 hours cooking a meal isn't interesting.
Consistency, meaningful decisions and agency have always been the strongpoints for me. As well as showing that even the best intentions can have bad consequences. That seems to have all been thrown out the window.
It's all over the internet and it's actually crazy how similar everyone's feedback is. Pretty much every single person feels the same: - All characters are one dimensional cardboard cutouts - Wuk Lamat's english VA is terrible (to be fair tho, I didn't like the japanese VA as well, but that's more to do with the character) - The pacing is abyssmal - The cutscenes are padded harder than a cell in a mental institution - The "gameplay" outside of instanced content is hilariously outdated - Predictable Disney level storytelling etc etc
The only place that has people praising it in large numbers is Twitter. 2/3rds of Reddit are ripping into it, 4chan is having a field day, 5chan is hating it more than everybody else and even the offical forums is full of threads talking about DT's issues. Hell even critics are rating it lower than other expansions
I think the keys I've noticed that bind all of those together are: - The writer never emulates anyone else's worldview, they seem to have a mono-view of reality and think everyone ever born thinks exactly the same way they do and values everything everything exactly like they do, and they write the characters as if they all had a 'lets all get on the exact same page' meeting before every cutscene, including mind reading and ridiculous leaps of logic that are never questioned. - The writer fails at every corner to create real characterization. No one is an individual, they're just a few traits and 'quirks' that don't matter longer than 5 mins after they're introduced and then forgotten. It's like they lost their notes after writing every chapter or something. Every scene is an episodic entry in an unchanging person's life, all while they claim they're showing us growth. - They tell and not show every damn time. And then they talk to us about how they're showing... even while they tell us instead. Then they show us a teeny little bit, and go right back to telling and even re-capping the show they showed us so that no one missed anything. Like what is this middle school level writing, man?????? Then, yea, the pacing and general padding speak to some kind of poor general product/project management to begin with. It's like they need to fire the entire production company and showrunners if this was a TV show. Reminds me of how GoT went down in flames, so I hope they intervene before the next one.
i found incredibly weak the more i look into it, the second half was literally just mentally abusing erenville and his mother did not deserve what happened to her
The last raid fight when you took out the Azem gem you knew that the gloves were off and this was it, you saved the universe from The End Singer with this and nothing can stop you Yet ... someone had to come in and save the day.... no thanks, we got this
Honestly, I dont like the Azem crystal. It devalues everything we do. Hell, with duty support we cant even canonically deal with anything ourselves anymore to the point that I wonder "why am I here? anyone else with a club can do this, I'm superfluous."
@@SILVERONINappears you were correct. Not only has she sabotaged the English version, but she’s also provided her fellow cultists with an ideological/political/fetishistic defense of the otherwise indefensible story. They’re constantly repeating the claim that anyone not in love with this story is only pretending to hate it for political reasons, i.e. they feel personally attacked when others don’t worship their “representation” and believe they’re politically under siege when people actively criticize it. Compound that with this game’s preexisting “toxic positivity,” where genuine fans simply refuse to criticize the games legit flaws, and it’s a recipe for disaster…unless you’re Sony.
No, this isn't primarily on the localization team. This fault lies with the Japanese writing team. Even the JP players abhor the story, you're putting the blame in the wrong people.
@@zachhughes9149 You do realize Kate did not voice Wuk Lamat in every language right? The other three Wuk Lamats are not better and the ENTIRE playerbase has their complaints about the story. Moreover, none of the voice actors have any bearing on, or agency in the writing. Your fixation on a single person as the source, or the harbinger, of everything wrong with Dawntrail is a fairly good indication some of the things Kate has said may be more applicable to you than the average XIV player though.
Just finished DT MSQ. As someone who adores FFXIV's story and has played it since ARR, this is the first time I had to skip some of the cutscenes and dialogue for my own sanity. I couldn't take it. I liked Wuk Lamat at first but the more I progressed through the MSQ the more I felt like she was someone's self-insert OC that was constantly being shoved down my throat at every turn. It was suffocating to the point where I felt relief whenever I finally got a moment away from her to go do stuff with other characters. She had such an overbearing presence throughout the entire MSQ that other characters who I assumed would have more character development, like Krile and Erenville, rarely had moments to shine. She wasn't the only problem I had with the MSQ. Most of the dialogue and story itself read like something from a tween's fanfiction or some bland Saturday morning cartoon from the 90's. It was disappointing to say the least, but hey at least the dungeons/trials have been incredibly fun.
@@ridleyroid9060 To be fair, people were coming down from EW high so we were more hopeful and tolerant toward missteps. Zero could be a bit boring at times but she had clear character developments and didn't hog all the spotlights as much as Wuk, not to mention the plot about Golbez and Durante was quite nice too (even if the Heel-face-turn was too fast). But DT is an absolutely shitshow.
@@Maymei99 I actually disagree, the 6.X patch series had some of the most attrocious dialogue and inconsistent character writing the game has had, well, ever I wager. I truly find it to be a deplorable sham, for the way it neutered Vritras character by making him a wimpy little moron who somehow doesn't know what an "equitable agreement between nations" was and had to be told by characters who were about 9000 years younger than him and have led a country for approximatly 6000 years less. It was just poorly written, including Golbez who flip flopped between an emet selch-esque "I do this because I must" and presenting as "muahahaha I am eeeeeviiiilll muahahaha" It was completely scizophrenic and incomprehensible writing. Zero herself is included in this. For some reason, her needing to be compensated because she is a voidsent is treated as a big part of her character, AND YET, is NEVER actually a flaw they lean into in any way. Any time people needed help from her, she'd just take something stupid just to say she has a compensation and she goes and becomes the hero anyway. All they had to do for Zero was just add a couple of scenes where she legitimately lets something despicable (like letting a guy die or letting a scion get seriously injured) because she wasn't properly compensated. I know that may have made people hate her but what is the point of having a redemption and learning to follow your conscience as being your character arc if it was pointless to begin with, and you would take someone giving you nod of approval as recompense enough to save their life and save the universe. It was just an awful awful awful story and many of its writing trends (characters learning some immaculate moral lesson, then going to another character, than going "well you see I have this great friend that taught me bla bla bla" while staring at said character). I really did genuinely, for the 1st time in a long time, feel intellectually insulted by the MSQ. Comparing to that DT post 97 is much superior imo, and was more bearable up to 97. At least you were exploring new zones.
We went from becoming the hero of light, to hero of dark, stoper of the endsinger. To Wuks handler. I would of loved to explore this area on our own and figure out what's going on with the land. I think fixing this woulda been have us go and arrive and explore, maybe in the middle of the whole succession. Allow us to see how the new world is and then see who the best ruler is ourselves. Would be a lot less babysitting time and let us still feel like the main char. Feeling like the side char is bitter.
@@masterdeathize It's pretty ridiculous to say that Wuk Lamat is the only bad thing. Yes, she is annoying, but pacing is the biggest problem. And quests design. But after that boring start (first 4-5 hours), it's been better for me honestly. I look forward what is gonna be next lol.
@@masterdeathize Well, that's nice to hear. lvl 90-91 was the worst for me. Levels 92-93 had been a little bit better already. So i'm just happy to hear it will be better.
Even though ARR is better, it's nonsense to compare the two in the first place. ARR came out 10 years ago or something. You'd except something that came out in 2024 would raise the bar, not put it back to a decade in the past
The story is bad. I ended up playing with subs because Wuk Lamat sounds like a flamboyant man. It made me uncomfortable and pissed me off. She's the whole expansion and never shuts up. I also wasn't invested in the story and I felt like a babysitter dragging my feet, watching myself become the background character. I buy expansions to be involved and invested. Maybe I'm just old and it's time to go. I've been playing FF14 since 2015. This step down in story doesn't justify $40. FF14 is popular because the storytelling is usually very good. I think that's over now. The story keeps me into FF14. Not the gameplay. That's the weakest part. I'll come back when the next expansion drops. If it's good. I will not invest in a mmo that bores me and makes me cringe.
@@1337penguinman At least Lyse was pleasant to look at, and Sailor Moon, despite her love for peace and happiness, will absolutely choose violence as the first option in most situations.
Internal transcript excerpt from Dawntrail development. "Wuk Lamat should be louder, angrier and have access to a time machine." "Whenever Wuk Lamat isn't on the screen, all the other characters should be asking 'Where's Wuk Lamat?'"
1.x beta player, this is the worst MSQ ever in the history of this game. It's so sad. I'm so emotionally invested in the success and failures of this game b/c it's been apart of my life for so long. It's not just Wuk Lamat, it's the constant recapping like I don't know what I just did an hour ago, it's the fact Wuk Lamat has more than double the lines of anyone else in Dawntrail or Lyse in Stormblood, it's the insane plotholes that this game would have never looked over in the past (leaving a kid paralyzed even though we have the cure, an entire city gets wrecked by invasion but a dragoon says they weren't even hard, being ok to genocid an entire people due to their existence but they're the same as the entire populace we build up in Ultima Thule). These points aren't even scratching the surface with how bad it is, and these alone would cause me not to play any other game. It's absolutely a travesty. There's no excuse for this.
Yeah, there are just so many plotholes it's tragic, I really enjoyed the MSQ from lvl 97 onward because it picked up the pace, but so much shit was left on the table or unaddressed and there were so many nonsensical scenes and dumb actions from characters. I really enjoyed the last zone, I think thematically it makes sense we are helping these long dead souls be put to rest, but I can see your point with Ultima Thule (although I argue it's a bit different). If this wasn't the same writer as the dogshit 6.X series (which I complaind about INCESSANTLY when it was out but the discourse became not "is this good" but about whether it was filler or not, which was pointless imo, people shoulda noted the very poor writing trends that started there), then they got someone just as bad. Where is Ishikawa!? FIX THIS MESS!!!!!!!!!!!
The thing about living memory was I was fine with taking them all out, as they're just facsimiles, not the real people, they're long since gone, as you learn with Erenville's mum and several other quests. Meanwhile we're wasting time learning about them, going on gazebo rides, flying around on capybaras and other such useless things WHEN PEOPLE BACK IN TULLY ARE FIGHTING AND DYING. What the hell are we doing. Flick the damn switches and get on with it. How many lives were needlessly lost because we faffed around in there.
Toxic positivity is what will kill the game eventually. The community boosts itself as a selling point of the game. Genuinely its passive aggressive terminally online weirdos who have to stay in the echo chamber.
They are drones who turned Yoshi-P into a messiah, and voraciously attack anyone who dares criticise their saviour's works, be it FFXIV or the degenerate mess that is FFXVI. They don't even realise they're pushing the rest of us away with their toxic white knighting.
I wanted to like Dawntrail, I really really wanted to, and I kept gaslighting myself into loving the game and thinking it was an amazing story. Dawntrail has some good parts, the dungeons for example, as well as the combat for trials are not bad changes, the graphics update is drop-dead gorgeous and is so much better looking than I initially thought. The small changes like Dual Dye Channels, options to turn off other people, and the changes to blacklist are very very welcome QOL changes that I can't live without. The MSQ was marketed entirely different than what it actually is, that it honestly feels extremely misleading. It was marketed as a fun anime filler episode, one where the WOL would go on a brand new adventure and take a break. And in that adventure we would have "The rite of succession" where the WOL and "some scions" would compete against each other for their promise to become Dawnservant. But it fails on that as well, Thancred and Urianger at the beginning say "How it excites me to compete against fellow scions" but throughout the expansion we don't even get to compete with them. We don't even get a single duty fighting Thancred or Urianger, and they could literally be cut out of the entirety of the expansion and literally NOTHING would change at all. Not just that, but Gulool Ja Ja also ruins any intrigue the story could have had when he literally states that none of the would-be leaders are ready, and that the rite of succession is entirely made for that. However, this doesn't mean Wuk Lamat is good, it just means that out of all the competitors who are not Wuk Lamat (Or Koana to some extent), none of them are actually competent to become a leader to begin with. As in, anyone with a pulse could see that it would be beyond awful if Bakool Ja Ja became dawnservant, since he is a fascist who only cares about Mamool Ja (nobody would support him but mamool ja, nothing but overthrowing), Zoraal Ja is just Roman Empire generic expansionist (Boo, bootleg Garlean empire AGAIN) and Koana is a Capitalist?!?! (Kind of interesting, but isn't even competition), so even from the beginning you already see that these people can't become the dawnservant which makes it extremely predictable. Not just that, but there is no political intrigue, instead of these ideologies clashing, kind of like how America was split up between colonial entities and people vying for power, there really is none of that in Dawntrail. Honestly, it makes me feel like the expansion itself should have been about Gulool Ja Ja becoming leader, that would have been WAY MORE INTERESTING than this boring rite of succession. Imagine if maybe we only had 2-3 scions come with us, and we were in the party that helped Gulool Ja Ja become leader, and we trace our own path in this brand new continent. So much interesting characters could have been established, characters we train together with, (who are of all the different tribes in tural) and every single character could have their own time to shine as we meet them in each of the different locations. Instead, the WOL is relegated to a boring mercenary / sellsword, and is basically invisible for the entire expansion. Instead of having rivals, they are immediately established as "someone who should be stopped" and essentially it makes the story of DT more dire than it should be at first glance. Wuk Lamat's only qualifications are also that she "loves peace" like okay? She literally has nothing else to offer as a leader to begin with. It just feels like a very mediocre shonen where we are teaching Wuk Lamat very very basic things, and basic concepts. This would be fine as the first expansion in the entirety of the story, but after 5 expansions, and 10 years of development, nobody wants to go back in time to ARR anymore. Every single tribe in Tural is honestly extremely boring too, and the entirety of Dawntrail can be described as a bunch of very disjointed tribe quests masquerading as a MSQ. Pelupelu are traders? The bird people are passionate about reeds in the ground, the cat people love xibruk pibil and used it to stop fighting. The funny thing honestly, is that the only tribe that was even somewhat interesting is the Mamool Ja, Mamook actually had a pretty interesting backstory that was dark, and was very well done. It was the only part of the expansion which even made me slightly emotional. Other than that, each of the rites which you have to do are like follows: Go to place > Exposition Dump > 5 minute cutscene of only talking > One of her brothers / Bakool Ja Ja shows up > Wuk Lamat says she isnt smart / strong / good enough > Bakool Ja Ja does something dumb > Wuk Lamat talks to people in village and does very basic anthropology > Wuk Lamat does extremely basic thing > Wuk is praised as a smart jelly bean adorable kitty kat who can do nothing wrong. > Wuk gets keystoned and rants about how much she now knows about Tural. Rinse and repeat, that's the entire expansion for the first half in a nutshell.
So what happened is Natsuko Ishikawa, the writer of Shadowbringers and half of Endwalker (Banri Oda wrote the bad half) got promoted to writing manager and isn't doing the actual writing anymore. This expansion was written by people who previously had only written side stories and job quests. And they weren't even *good* side stories and job quests. And on the American localization side of things, the woke obviously got hold of this localization. Wuk Lamat's voice talent is trans. Male to female trans voices sound strange at the best of times (as a logical outcome of forcing a psheuofemale voice out of a man's voicebox), so the voicework for Wuk Lamat sounds really strange for that reason. It's probably also what limits their emotional range, since forcing their male vocal chords to produce a female-adjacent sound probably absorbs a lot of their energy and limits their range significantly. I'm in agreement overall. Dawntrail isn't just mediocre, it's *bad*. The content is fine, in a lot of places the level and duty design team absolutely killed it. But the writers and localizers dropped the ball and then stabbed it with a screwdriver.
XIV is not my main game, but I have played since the beginning. For me, XIV was always the game I could chill in, get lost in a story, and relax. The narrative has had highs and lows in all these years, and I am still a staunch defender of Stormblood post-story. So with my background out of the way. I was cautious going into Dawntrail, I tried to keep an open mind. However, I had no interest in anything going on. Nothing pulled me in and invested me. After about an hour I was like why don't I care? There was for me at least, nothing to grab my attention right away and hold it. In my opinion, all forms of media need that grabbing moment early on, or else who cares? This is the first time in 10 years that I skipped 99% of the dialogue. I would glance at it in the text box after to get the gist of it. The constant fetch quests made me want to fall asleep, and if I hadn't been playing with someone I probably would have. The cadence was slow, and it stayed there. I felt no amazing build-up, and I would have been happy with just a little bit, just a touch. It was just drudgery. Our character felt like they were reduced to just an average everyday person (and arguably babysitter), and not the gods-defeating savior of humanity. Wuk Lamat for me was underwhelming, they didn't have an intriguing personality, and the voice acting felt flat (in English at least) and unemotional. The moments that had the opportunity to be amazing just weren't. I never felt emotional highs and lows. It almost feels like they were trying to play it safe, too safe. I made it to the end and didn't feel anything. Nothing. The game whose narrative through the years could make me feel unshakable rage, and also drive me to tears, did nothing. What I did feel was relief that it was over. This is a tragedy. I probably for the first time will not play the patches. For those who are XIV main-liners, I really do hope that the patch content is better for you. I hope for you that they pull it together, and give you all that you deserve for supporting for so long. That being said, please remember that it is not bad to voice your opinions. The only way to get through to the devs is to let them know what you enjoyed, and what you didn't. That is the only way to create change. Don't listen to the people who will tell you that you are wrong, and your opinion is wrong. It isn't. You pay money and put time into the world that SE is creating. That makes your voice important. Take care.
@@minuette1752That's cool bro. Didn't do it the right way for a lot of us though. I genuinely feel like this expansion is the most divisive one, and that's coming from a Stormblood enjoyer. I feel like after getting jipped of our main character position by a new NPC, you have to understand why there are people on the player base that aren't happy with how things ended up going.
@@blaizemarquez2967 We should be the npc and not the main focus. It is not all about the warrior of light especially since well shadowbringers and Elidibus being dealt with.
@@minuette1752 Sorry, but the four preceding expansions says something different. This was like a new RPG, with our character and the scions acting as dumbed down or less driven versions of themselves being crossover characters with the new protagonist, Wuk Lamat. I ended up liking her too you know, but she over stayed her welcome and got away with too much. The merit of her claim literally came from the get go about being willing to enlist our aid. Mid way through the game she must have become a champion of dynamis after barely any struggle since she completed multiple martial feats repeatedly that were totally out of her scope, culminating in her stealing our coup de grace in the ending when we were seemingly getting recognition again. She had character growth, but it wasn't written supremely well, and came at the expense of other characters being decorations most of the time. In the end it's an opinion. If that's what you want to see, cool, but you can't be annoyed when we suddenly shift course from what we have done every expansion and part of the player base doesn't enjoy that. It's an opinion dude, comprehend your view isn't the only one, and more importantly that none of them are strictly right. Listen and stop thinking when someone says "we" that it has to include you too and you need to take up the banner to protect XIV. Clearly you aren't in the group bud. I'm glad you enjoyed it though, genuinely. That's awesome for you. I hope you understand how loud the discourse is though, trumping Stormblood's hate by far. Far too loud to gaslight them to think differently. Square is likely to not follow suit similarly again to Dawntrail's story though. It's what they did after Stormblood's reception, and I hope for the same this time as well since Dawntrail has an awesome setting and plenty of space for some cool lore additions.
@@blaizemarquez2967 Stormblood was great as well. Man you just do not understand the good guy vs the bad guy in Final Fantasy games. It is never that deep and they make moments that are actually sad, Dawntrail has a lot of them. You seem like the person who only cares about content, endgame that is and complex story, sorry this game has never had a complex story. Do what you will with my words what you will.
In the span of just 12 raid fights, Gaia from Shadowbringers had 10x more character development than Wuk Lamat had throughout the entire Dawntrail expansion.
Really needed to introduce wukky in like 6.3 or earlier, and just deny her request to go on an adventure with her, since there are more important things happening, then at after the void issue was dealt with, reintroduce her getting desperate and betrayed etc, to invoke sympathy. But as for the whole 7.0 story? Fuck, it'd need some reworks, like seriously, who signed off on this?
Dawntrail is so bad that I'm leaving the game. Endwalker was the writing on the wall, but Dawntrail is the wrecking ball. After 10 continuous years of faithful subbing and nearly daily playing, I'm calling quits. Maybe YoshiP did me a favor by letting the game go so off-kilter... he's released me to fly free.
I just load The First Descendant. Maybe that will be good! I'm just so bored with Dawntrail. Fetch quests after fetch quests. Wuk Lamat been with us 24/7 😑 She's kinda annoying, and never go away. It's just boring af. I still like the new zones tho. And maybe the first new dungeon gonna be good. I don’t know. Very bored at the moment tho. I want to like the game, but it's pretty f*cking hard to like it lmfao.
I was so frustrated playing this as i felt the WOL was treated like a background character and even when the stakes were risen after Alexandria, Wuk Lamat still insisted on taking the lead while WOL was like "kay". Hopefully Square writes her out of the story like they did with Lyse. At least with Lyse, there were less cutscenes.
I did not have a "bad" time per se, I still enjoyed it. But Wuk Lamat was too much focus on. I argue she's worse than Lyse. Anyway, hopefully they bring back Ishikawa for post-dawntrail or atleast for the next full expansion... She's the goat.
I think what makes Lyse worse to me is that they butchered what was once a fun character before dumping her into an alliance leader role to rot. At least wuk lamat had no character to ruin
@@BlaizeTheDragon Lyse was far better than Wuk Lamat tho. Lyse was dropped into the position after the leader died and was defnitely underprepared and faced with actual foes, Yotsuyu in Doma that wants to govern everyone to death and the Garlean Terminator Zenos in Ala Migho. Wuk lamat has absolutely no adversaries except a half baked character thats defeated by her (*groan*) singlehandedly after she remembers that she's awesome (*GROAN*). Lyse had to do stuff to unite the people and grow into a leader which wasnt depicted that well tbh. Wuk lamat is universaly liked from the beginning for no reason. I'd go as far as say Wuk Lamat is an absolute Mary Sue. Her appearance at the trial made me yell out in rage irl.
The first moment I knew this expansion's MSQ was bad was when I tabbed out of the game at some random point where I feel the writers wanted me to pay attention, and looked up when WoW's prepatch was. I don't even like WoW.
bfa was actually good on launch it was all the systems they added like azurite and corruption that sucked. Its story for the most part was just 'fine' one of the big criticisms bfa's story got was sylvanas basically commiting genocide to further her story, and some people on the horde side didn't liking being the villains and the writers didn't know what to do with genocide being a plot point so they swept it under the rug which is kinda funny cause hydaelyn also did the genocide thing but I guess people are totally cool with it when she does it
It's not just the worst expansion MSQ, it's one of the worst stories in any game I've ever played. There's 30 quests of meaningful plot and 70 that are contrived scenarios to get the player to do busy work to fill time. It's horrible.
Wuk Lamat is basically Naruto hell she even has the same color scheme and has the ancient power of Talk-no-jutsu “I’m gonna become the next dawnservant believe it”
Naruto but without all the hardships he endured that can make the audience more sympathetic and understanding towards him, and without all the hard work he put in to become stronger and achieve his goals. So essentially its just Boruto with Naruto's personality slapped on >.> I LIKE Naruto, Wuk Lmao is just fcking annoying.
Really worth reading her interview with PC Gamer, 'FF14 Dawntrail dev was nervous about the “bold approach” to Wuk Lamat'. She set herself up there. :D
All the characters were comically bad....they were straight-up caricatures. the lead up was boring as hell. There was zero actual motivation from anyone and it was so one-dimensional. None of them had ACTUAL policies...this was quite literally like watching the US elections with everyone weirdly culty. We stood in the background the entire time, doing absolutely nothing and just let people die knowing we could have prevented the whole damn thing because shit plot. They killed everything that we were from previous expacs (We were the first to dive in and do what needed done when our character knew what was going on only to now sit on the sideline knowing what's about to happen.) and the writers made sure to let us know this as our character gave raised eyebrows and glares at all the right people but because Wuk Lamat we decided to do NOTHING. This expac put so much innocent blood on our hands...we might as well have cut the city down ourselves.
I never really cried a lot in previous FFXIV expansion. I cried a lot in Dawntrail and not because of story elements. Things that some of the Scions did were literally breaking of their character development. At some point I just felt like "so this is what they are going to do? Just make characters do whatever fills their need at the moment?" I guess I'm more attached to the lore than any specific character and much of this expansion was depressing to me, but not because the writers intended me to be. I think I should just take a break from this game. I quit WoW once when they changed the way a mount looked so I will totally do it over writing. I never felt the need to quit WoW over writing since it's always been garbage.
I was being easy on DT giving it the ARR pass. But no, it doesnt deserve it or earned it. This is the 5th expansion, where is the talent to show for it? This is the worst expansion MSQ so far, how did this get approved by every level of leadership? Where was YoshiP?
being distracted with ff16 production i would guess, maybe its all a ploy to show whos the real boss in square enix, and things turn to shit if he is less involved in them xD
Didn't yoshi p mention during a live letter in EW they will let the young and aspiring writers and developers lead the new series of ffxiv? Well that was a mistake.
The wol never fought Bakool Jaja. He ran away before we could. People could sense how dangerous we were. Bakool Jaja's shift was because he was abandoned and exiled for failing to beat Wuk Lamat. His father was the one that urged him to be a bully. He was living up to certain expectations placed on him that he never wanted for himself. Wuk Lamat vowed to find another way for his people that didn't rely on blessed siblings, thus ending the cycle of sacrifice. His helping Wuk and having respect for her makes sense. Of much of my criticisms of the story, that followed logically.
What drives me nuts and has for awhile is how 75% of the quests in this game are "Go to 3 places" or "Talk to 3 people" or "Click on 3 objects". Final Fantasy 14 - The Quest of Three. Its so mundane and stale. And besides the story and Wuk Lamat. The expansion is a copy paste of the same systems from the last 2 expansions. Same = number of zones, number of instances and when they open, number of trials and when they unlock, roles quests, crafting and gathering quests, aether flying in zone unlocks, collectibles. There is no new gameplay its a new paintjob and not an interesting one, its pretty though.
The worst part of DT for me is that the story had potential. Complex ideas were hinted at in both halves of the story, but they were either given simple, unrealistic solutions (Wuk Lamat solving Mamook's problems in 15 minutes) or were ignored entirely in order to focus on something much less interesting and relatable (the usage of regulators in Solution 9 and the implications of using the dead to sustain the living). The story had some good characters, but they were relegated to side characters to overfocus on Wuk Lmao, which is a shame considering that XIV's story is usually great at giving its characters equal screentime.
i refunded the xpac 1 hour in. it was tolerable until, during the tour, when we got to the gate closed off barring the bridge to Yok Tural or whatever is called, my WoL was gawking at the massive Gate and Poochie went of on a little tangent, "yeah so that gate and bridge are more important than you listening to my dreams and aspirations, ok...?" ??????????????????? first off, how dare you? we came with you from malms away to place your ass on a throne you obviously have no deserving right to be on. Just cuz your Papa was a hotshot. You don't deserve shit Poochie. At least Lyse got shat on by most of the NPC's in Stormblood
Ishikawa is a great writer but so are other. Its a good thing, when the lead writer rotates, otherwise the story would get stale. However, they have to bring the quality - which wasnt the case here... I cant see how Yoshi-P or anyone really read this and was like, "yeah, the players will love this".
I honestly cannot believe how trash the story is in dawntrail, its so strange to me. I played the game from start to finish, loved it so much, shadowbringers and endwalker are so good. wtf happened? Who did they hire for wuk lamat voiceover, she clearly didn't give a shit. Its unreal how bad the voice acting is compared to others, it seems almost like a parody at times.
The reason "she" (Wookie's VA) sounds like "she" doesn't give a shit is because Wookie's VA is a man, not a woman. And if the VA put any high energy into the lines (for this very high energy character) we're gonna end up with "It's Ma'am Part 2: Electrope Boogaloo." That's why so many of the lines sound flat or under-delivered or completely unenthused. Because if the VA puts any genuine enthusiasm into the act, it'll completely break the fake woman voice and the character too. So to keep up the illusion, their voice director or the VA themself refused to employ any genuine enthusiasm for this extraordinarily enthusiastic and loud character. The reason Wookie's VA sounds like they don't give a shit is because they were actually directed to sound like they didn't give a shit by the voice director. Or because the actor actually refused to give a shit because sounding like they actually cared and inhabited the character's body as their own would completely break the believability of the character in a totally different way. Acting generally already necessitates that an actor put restrictions on themselves to help define a character. But Wookie's VA is essentially acting within an act. "Act-ception." Putting further restrictions on top of the ones already stipulated. And one of those restrictions was "to maintain a fake woman voice, don't shout or yell or give any genuine screams of excitement or pain. At best, you can slightly raise your voice to portray any kind of high energy dialogue." Which for any other actor would be considered the bare minimum verging on blatantly unacceptable for anything that's meant to be taken seriously. But it stands out even more in this game where most of the voice acting baring a small handful of characters is usually very convincing and genuine sounding. You can try it for yourself. Try to make a generally convincing voice of the opposite gender. And then try to make a happy shout or a scream of pain (preferably in a place you won't embarrass yourself or make someone think you're in danger) while still maintaining that same opposite gender voice and keeping it convincing. You'll find that for the most part, the only way you can pull off a semi-believable opposite gender voice is when you're talking at medial volumes. If you're a girl making a boy voice and you try to scream or revel in a natural manner, its almost always going to "break" the male voice and revert to a shrill shriek while a man trying to scream like a woman is going to break the vaguely female voice and its going to turn into usually a more throaty or deeper barrel-ish sound, or in some cases, something slightly higher sounding and more nasally. And they were trying to keep those throaty sounds out of Wookie's line delivery by pulling back on the energy of the delivery, which in turn makes the character sound mocking when trying to express joy or enthusiasm and makes them sound like they aren't taking anything seriously when something bad happens and they're yelling at another character in (what is supposed to be) anger. You'll have a serious scene and then that one character is just all "haha, lol, guys help me. He's trying to kill me. Lmao, I need help. This is so funny and I can't take it seriously but I promise guys, this guy is actually genuinely trying to hurt me, hahahaha," or they'll be confronting the villain and be all "haha, wow, I can't believe you actually did that, lol. I promise I'm super mad at you even though it sounds like I'm not taking this seriously, hahahaha." They should've just done the natural and believable thing and just cast a woman for the role who was actually serious about her line delivery. It wouldn't have fixed everything reguarding Wuk Lamat. She'd still be extraordinarily one note and clingy and taking screen time away from Erenville and Krile. But at least they wouldn't have been doubling down on the insufferableness by having a character who's both badly written AND badly acted.
This video was made for me. I just wanted to watch someone rant in my place because it's hard to find a better video that encapsulates the same level of frustration I had with the Dawntrail MSQ.
I completely agree with everything you’ve said. It makes me scared for the future honestly but with people breaking their stupid toxic positivity , the team behind dw can only improve now. And I was wondering , who were you referring to when you mention that person in storm blood who hated our character? I can’t figure it out who it might be 😂
The thing that people dont realize is that this writing went downhill actually in late 6.4 / 6.5 with Zero, who was really interesting at first then was written to undergo the flattest character arc in the game.
28:00 Yeah, they pulled a Zenos again. Even though people were unhappy that they pulled a Zenos with Ran'jit in Shadowbringers. But at _this_ point it's completely and utterly ridiculous. In Endwalker when they wanted to do a low point they actually put some thought into it in a manner that both put you in an actual stressful situation and demonstrated the power of the WoL. But here where RIGHT BACK to the villain with scripted immunity. It is AWFUL.
The only good thing about DT being bad is that Yoshi-P has said they dont really have any plans set in stone for future updates and are waiting to see community feedback. Hopefully he takes it all on board and writes Wuk Lumat out of the story somehow, or at least gets a better VA and reduces her screen time.
By far the worst expac story.... "but its another storytelling since the beginning and whatever.." Yes, man. I was so prepared for slow things since the the annoucement of EW, but I wasnt expecting that would be so bad... and one of the things that drives me crazy its the super cliche anime shounen friendship power, peace and love. Plus the quests are super annoying like its same thing in past expacs: - Speak with Alphinaud - Speak with Alphinaud Cs cs cs - Speak with Alphinaud - Speak with Alphinaud Cs cs cs - Speak with Wuk Lamat - Speak with Wuk Lamat At least the dungeons and boss fights are fun.
ARR wasn't this bad. I agree. My expectations for DT was to be slow, setting up new characters, worlds, etc. I liked the bones of the story (the first half) as it was trying to to that. The EXECUTION of Dawntrail is what was awful for me. No story has any hope when the story telling is this bad. I need basic levels of consistency in plot elements and a certain maturity level which DT threw out the window, opting for young readers level of dialogue and often contradicting itself to attempt to manufacture cheap and immediate payoffs that didn't make sense and weren't earned.
The bones of the story wasn't trying to do that. It was trying to do: "We came up with this place and this is its culture as defined by 1 or 2 traits, now we'll talk all about it." There was no story to speak of. In fact, for all 6 zones, the story pretty much amounted to: "We came up with this place and now we'll talk about the lore." Even the final zone was the same. Even Heritage Found was a non-story where you just talked about agriculture and the nation's favorite pastimes, which was a ridiculous wasted opportunity.
@@thuroria7631 I disagree. The bones of the story were clearly trying to establish new characters and worlds. 1) introduce the new world, 2) introduce their leaders though a changing of the guard, 3) introduce a means of traveling to other reflections. So when you say "the bones of the story want trying to do that", with that being "setting up new characters, worlds", well, im curious what you think the McGuffin Interdimensional Portal Key was? When you speak of poorly defined culture and "now we'll talk about lore", that is all execution, the STORY TELLING, not the story, and I agree that is bad. I agree completely with you, but those are how SE choose to A) introduce us to the New World, B) introduce us to a means to travel to other reflections reliably, C) introduce us to new characters was bad. Krile, for example, is a great character that was done dirty, hence the execution the problem. All the old guard are great characters that got IQ dumps and reduced to head nods or bad 1 liners, if they got lines at all. The DT zones are georgeous (the bones), the way we are presented to and 'explore' them on the stupid field trip with lectures is the execution, and its poor.
Spoiler : Sadly, the ending that you havent reached yet is not much better, tropy, nonsensical and abrupt cut with a lot of 'WHAT THE F' things going on and just moving like its been a great journey while it was an excruciatingly mid to bad babysitting session
And the godawful disney music playing everytime the power of naivet...friendship prevails makes me actually ashamed of being a fan of the game. That's not normal
@@orb8540 What game have you been playing? Endwalker literally involves defeating the living embodiment of despair with the power of hope and friendship my dude.
@@habuowe3483 I dunno what you've been drinking but no one criticizing the power of friendship, it's a staple of Final Fantasy, I'm criticizing the awful track that plays like a bad anime spinoff ost 3 times during MSQ. And the conflation between the power of conviction and trust (or friendship), and arrogant ignorance (Wuk Lamat). Basically Wuk Lamat is Alphinaud pre-crystal braves.
I haven't finished Dawntrail. I just reached the wild west area of the new theme park, and after being told I couldn't kill bandits, I lost all will to care about this story and started looking into whether the it was worth continuing or if I should just skip it for the first time. I don't care at all about being "spoiled" at this point, lol. Even during Stormblood (my least favorite arc) I was still interested in the story and avoided the internet until I was done. I've never spent this long trying to make it through the story......
Okay so this is kinda going to be a rambling about the good and the bad of the story, what kept me going, etc. THERE ARE SPOILERS FOR THE END AT THE VERY END BUT I DIDN’T TALK TOO MUCH IN DETAIL BC I KNOW YALL ARE STILL FINISHING UP. This expansion had me having mixed feelings. Overall I did end up enjoying it, despite hiccups and predictability early on. In someways despite the fetch quest and slower pace of the first half, I overall enjoyed the kind of ‘The Amazing Race’ feeling of it. I think that the biggest problem was that two of the candidates were just so obviously bad for the country and the other parts of the world that it seemed obvious that they weren’t going to make them win. I think my biggest criticism of the story was Bakool Ja Ja. I think a redemption could have been convincing, because when I got to the part where we did learn his real motivations he really was revealed to be that lame bully kind of character that is shaped by a society that rests their existence on him alone. It was harrowing in a way, and even though I was mad at him for the things he had done and was annoyed by the lack of response from the Giants examiner especially. They could have tried to make it convincing, in lore it seems that these two headed mamool ja are supposed to be some of the most powerful types of people to walk around. I could understand if maybe the examiners were afraid to deny him especially if the contest for whatever reason did go south for the other candidates, but they really didn’t give ANY reason at all, which was weird. I wouldn’t say Wuk Lamat is so one dimensional (except maybe in her humor which did get a bit grating.) I think her arc about naivety could have been handled a little better, but I think they touched on all the parts that made it make sense to me. She starts out as a character who screams for peace and ends as a character who screams for peace, but I do think that her understanding of peace does change throughout the story. At first peace is just the opposite of her Zoraal Ja, just simply not fighting. No war, no violence. But throughout the course of the expansion she realizes that peace is not an inherent trait or just simply an ideal, but is a byproduct of emotional and material requirements being met by her own people, and that the nation that her father created was not as peaceful as she was led to believe. That it still had lingering issues as a result of Galool’s presence as a leader (especially in regard to Bakool’s motivations and the problems of the Mamook). Not to say that he didn’t do a great job, but Wuk really wanted to take it a step up. She didn’t just want to preserve the peace, but she wanted to fortify and strengthen it with her newfound knowledge of what she thinks peace is. As I said before the Bakool Ja Ja bit did wrap up and 180 very quickly, which I do agree is bad, but that isn’t to say there isn’t value to come from the interactions we did get between Wuk and Bakool. In a way, a character I think we all expected to be a bigger threat being pacified by having their material needs met, and having the emotional burden of an entire race be taken away from him. He believed he was superior not only because of Galool’s existence, but because he needed to be for a society that told him to. I wish when Wuk told him she understood where he was coming from, but said that his actions were not okay, I wish the writers had done more with that moment. In that moment I wished that Bakool had become more present in the story especially going into the second half, and I think he would have served as a good counterpoint to Wuk throughout the rest of the expansion, and it would have helped make a redemption feel more earned. What I really loved about Wuk Lamat is that moment of depression where her idealistic peace is challenged by the attack on her city. She’s learned that peace is earned up to this point. She’s learned a more nuanced view of peace, and is now faced by an enemy that doesn’t care to understand, and is simply an insecure conquerer. Wuk Lamat now as a leader, has to make a decision that made her change as a character. (Zoraal Ja is also a static character, but I think that the writers did a good thing by revealing that his motivations were ultimately ridiculous. “ we must fight so people know and appreciate peace “ whatever dude. I think anyone who called him out on that in their critiques are right to do so. The story even recognizes that this is ridiculous, because when we finally get to the end he basically states that he was insecure, and that his motivations were him rationalizing this ridiculous goal of his.) When Wuk Lamat says she will kill her own brother, it felt like a major moment for her. Part of it was out of anger and frustration at her father’s death, and in that episode the WOL tells her to calm down, but it’s not like she didn’t still kill her brother, so I don’t really agree with the claim where she goes from peace to KILL BROTHER to peace. The part of the expansion that really won it over for me was the last bit. I know you haven’t finished it yet so I won’t get too into detail but it handled familiar themes in a very different way, and I think made you as a player feel so much more responsible. The final area was one of my favorite parts. And I felt for the main antagonist, and I wish the writers had shown some more effort at Wuk and the antagonist to try and work stuff out, but at the same time I’m glad that it was ultimately decided that it would be untenable. The power scaling of the story had gotten so high, that I’m glad that we had no alternative to make things work out. Especially because I feel like this whole area was the entire thematic idea of memory keeping people alive taken to its extreme. The ending was probably one of my favorite moments of the game so far, which makes me feel so all over the place about this expansion.
Sorry for the unorganized essay i didn't realize i had written so much until i finished. But tbh ive just had a lot of thoughts about the expansion and have not had anyone to talk to about it yet. I will also say that I agree the music has been amazing. I also have enjoyed most of the encounter design so much. The final boss has some of my favorite music and mechanics for a casual fight. Geninuely had so much fun, especially bc it was the first time I ever got to use healer lb3 in casual content.
I think the biggest problem is this toxic positivity culture, if Blizzard or Bungie released a blunder like this, it would be hell on earth for them. But for some reason we just allow Square Enix to get away with it. 5 years of the same exact boring and homogenized jobs, which judging by the hotfixes they already announced, is looking more like 7 and a half years. People are TIRED.
Honestly, leveling jobs in this expac I still see people with negative ability to play their jobs somehow. It just goes to show that, no matter how stupid easy you make this shit, people will still fuck it up. That being said, I did EX1 and loved it, and the dungeons have been a significant step up.
I think it’d be nice to have a balance. But I’d choose toxic positivity over some of the toxic negativity that existed in WoW. That ultimately ends up creating a really poor relationship between the devs and the player base.
@@SlinkyRock the hotfixes just announced are presumably due to negative feedback from the JP community so it’s not exactly that they aren’t working on the game. It’s just not in a direction that you like, which is an understandable grievance. I’ve mostly seen negative sentiment about those changes so I’m not sure how the toxic positivity applies in this instance.
@@supergold9390 Nah. It's been ten years with the same exact questing gameplay. Say what you want about Blizzard but WoW went above and beyond to make questing more enjoyable. This is just one of many examples of XIV being a mediocre game that doesn't get updated. It's fine to grift for SE but these people do NOT deserve your loyalty.
The hat update for Hrothgars (and Vieras) hasn't dropped. My disappointment is immeasurable and the update is ruined. If it truly was a "clipping issue" then I wonder why I can wear headwear, where my beard clips through everything and looks stupid. Another reason for why this is absolute and utter BS: Have you ever seen Au Ra wearing anything? Hrothgars and Vieras are just like blue mages, limited.
I see comments where they say Estenian had a better adventure than we did. I happen to agree. I think the route they should have went was for us to just go and explore Tural. Have our own adventure. Meet the different peoples and cultures. Maybe even meeting Wuk Lamat and the others on our journey. First as spectators in seeing them compete for the throne and hearing about it from the local populace. To then befriending Wuk Lamat and coming to her aid. Maybe we could have saved her on one of the trials against a beast or something and then parted ways. Got further in the story by exploring. Meet Koana at some part and assist him with something such as being attacked by Ba Gool Ja Ja. It should have been us adventuring and the right of succession naturally coming into our paths. For it to cultivate with us coming together to save Wuk Lamat and Koana in the end. Koana could still realize Wuk Lamat was better for the throne. Wuk Lamat would prove she wasnt as strong as she acts and realizes the importance of allies and learning about her people. We could have even been summoned by the Dawnservent in the middle of our roaming to thank us for watching out for his children and also wishing to fight us. By our wanderings we would have heard the tales of how he united Tural. We would experience the land ourselves and come close to its people to the point where, once all paths led to the golden city (a feat we would also try to do regardless of the rite of succession) we would wish to save it from Sphene. We would be exploring and shepherding its people. Which would circle back to what we did as Azem before the world was Sundered.
Lol I love that people rush to correct you saying how good EW was. EW was an abomination that ruined the story and made a mockery of everything before it. And Dawntrail is even worse.
I personally only have a problem with the first half of the story. You get a load of world building and tribe lore, without ever needing it at the end. Beginning with the 4th region i liked nearly everything. For me i also personally have much more caring feelings for Otis than wuk lamat, but i dont feel she is a bad written character, its just that the pacing in which she was present in contrast with how many excuses existed to send the scions away was horribly managed. I mean 2 scions didnt even appear until the end basically. Thats just my opinion though.
I agree, I nejoyed nearly everything from Shalooani afterwards. I really felt that they tried to bait and switch with the worldbuilding, but it didn't hit as hard because they already showed solution nine in the marketing material.
I also thought koana was going to be a low key bad guy. And then there’s wuk lamat, don’t get me started on her voice acting in English. She sounded more whiny than anything else in situations where she’s supposed to be emotionally passionate
Same, I thought Koana was going to be the antagonist, but I ended up wanting to side with him and give him the throne. And considering he's the one who actually does any ruling, planning, thinking, and diplomating, he's the real king who handles all the hard work while Poochie just off doing whatever she wants and takes credit for things she doesn't do.
Who is he talking about around 44:00, regarding the character from Stormblood? Im watching my friend go through it now, and I have no clue who he's referencing. Is it supposed to be Fordola or Zenos?
Spoilers.....Dawntrail is like 30% good, 70% dog $h/t. Dungeons are ok, some music are good, there is one music that is obnoxious as hell, the credit role one. There are a lot of recycled ones from endwalker as well. The story is terrible. The concept of soul and memory where good, the execution of it was bad. It felt that they tried to pull a xenoblade chronicles X concept where, you can recreate people that died but, is it the same person? kinda thing. Instead of dna, this was soul and memory. The "bad guy" was the most boring i've ever seen in any game i've played. Litteral daddy issues and that's it. Did not care at all for sphene, she was just there to look pretty i guess. There was a huge enphasis on, "we don't have the same blood but we are familly" crap, that line was in the game constantly. This was way worse than Stormblood and Arr. Tbis is a 4 out of 10 expansion.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Graham. I don't think I could have put it better. I was a bit less optimistic going in than you seemed to be. Started skipping story from level 92 msq onwards it was unbareable. I was starting to think I was going insane seeing little to no reviews clearly calling all of this out. Even most reviewers are just saying the expansion is good with one "but" and it be something fking ridiculous so they dont hurt their viewership and trigger the playerbase. I think its time we move on from this game. The west has its hold over it now and there's nothing ishikawa and yoshi p can do about it. Lets just be happy to have shadowbringers and endwalker.
@@Raptor4955 I was referring to the second half of the 6.0 MSQ with Elpis to Ultima Thule. I actually really liked the 6.X MSQ, and I absolutely love Zero. I’m still sad they replaced my edgy goth scythe wielding wife with a furry who can’t handle spicy food…
@@Umbruhh i know right? why did they introduce us to all the cool stuff with zero and goldbert just to give us a bad furry temple run fanfic??? WHY? i mean cmon even the voice actors sounded bored at times
I've been trying to get into it, and though I'm not quite done with the MSQ yet, it's just kind of felt very... flat. Like, I know they wanted to do a more light-hearted adventure, but there really aren't any ups or downs, and I just haven't really felt connected to any of the characters like I did in past expansions. I feel unless you stuck around to do the side content, we moved through each of the areas too fast to really, truly get to know them, and the outcome of the contest came with no real weight to it, or true stakes. After how good Shadowbringers and EW were... I was kind of hoping for more. Not that is needed to be anything world ending, or even particularly catastrophic, but it needed to be more fleshed out, with more reasons to care. We needed characters to attach to and care about. Also, a lot of the things I was hoping would be touched on were completely glossed over in favor of keeping us moving from one location to a next. And we didn't even get to see much of what was happening on with the other groups, so their motivations felt lacking. I think this is the first part of the game in a really long time that has left me just shrugging and saying 'meh.'.
I feel like the stakes were so high for the last expansion that they wrote themselves into a corner. I’m not interested in another setup that’ll last 5 years, but at the same time they can’t give us another world shattering event like in the last game. It also shows in the numbers, honestly. I have 200 people on my friend list, maybe 8 were playing? It was a good run, but time to move on. At the end of the day, this is just a videgame, plenty of them out there to play.
I mean there are like 3 threats "established" that are somewhat on par with the endsinger, and even if the stakes arent as high, i had no problem to go on an exploration with a character i somewhat care about, like... idk... Krile, would be a good hook for a story if we together try to solve somekind of mystery that ends in a worldending threat or something like that instead getting dragged around by a furry Lyse on steroids.
Yes My wife and I suffered through this together and we both agree, it seems like they just came up with something to bump ARR up 1 slot in the 'best story' rankings here with DT. Makes me happy people will appreciate Stormblood more now, I also really liked SB, and ShB is peak. Agreed. Thank the golden city's overheated servers that the community is realizing this.
We all should have seen this coming though. We got FF16 which did worse than average and they still don't have it on PC. That made me hesitant of Dawntrail. I had to wait until the reviews were out. Even if people said it was "Pretty Good" I would buy it. Now, nope. I'll wait 2 years for bargin bin pricing. I'm not going to play anymore until they stop doing fetch quest stuff for MSQ. It's same old same old and I'm just not going to bother. People have to get real and actually give them the feedback if they bought the game. People who were on the fence like me are going to keep our wallets closed, but having played since Stormblood be completly disappointed at the same time.
I actually enjoyed the rite of succession for the most part. I also liked the old west zone, though it was basically filler. But when I realized Wuk Lamat was going to come to the new content with us, and the fact that she never really got over her frustrating talks of peace, ended up killing it for me.
