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Is Jesus' Resurrection literally true? - Iain McGilchrist & Sharon Dirckx 

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Iain McGilchrist and Sharon Dirckx discuss miracles and the Resurrection of Jesus: are they literal or metaphorical? Watch the full episode here: www.thebigconv... 🧠
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19 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 68   
@CedanyTheAlaskan
@CedanyTheAlaskan 2 года назад
I think a conversation between Jonathan Pageau and Iain McGilchrist would be excellent given some of his comments here
@synesthete23
@synesthete23 2 года назад
God cares. I love Sharon Dirckx’s response to Iain McGilchrist’s obvious struggle with miracles given the evil and suffering arising from a world with free will. We are on a one-way track to death, but God intervened with the greatest miracle - Jesus Christ coming in the form of a man to take our place on the cross and rise again.
@2l84me8
@2l84me8 2 года назад
Go to a 3rd world country and see how much your gods cares.
@georgenorris2657
@georgenorris2657 2 года назад
I struggled for years with the dilemma about the miracles and especially the resurrection. If only they weren't so pervasive in the gospels it would be much easier to believe! For years I sort of made myself believe that the bodily resurrection actually happened. All the great theologians push this truth so hard, and surely to deny it is heresy isn't it? Now though I have found a balance which has given me much peace. John Crossan and Karen Armstrong have helped. Armstrong writes a great deal about the importance of Myth. Not just for the Christian but for everyone one way or another. Shortly afterwards I read John Crossan stating that it was quite likely that Jesus' body was thrown in a limepit. Shocking stuff! Having read the Psalms daily (well most days) I have realised that it is there that "Chiristianity" really has its roots. Aspects of what has become Christian doctrine occur in almost every psalm. This, I think , is where the disciples, and especially the authors of the gospels find their inspiration. One sees time and time again how the gospels tie in verses of the psalms with the life of Jesus. The reality of Jesus death has become "glorified" for us in a way which is profoundly misleading and the gospel writers are perhaps largely to blame. They played down the horror and emphasised the glory because that is how they had come to SEE- but very much in retrospect. THere was no glory for Jesus and only horror and misery apparent to everyone else that day. And yet there IS a glory. And it is this hidden glory that gradually dawns upon the disciples as they are huddled fearfully (but still together btw) in their room in Jerusalem reading their psalms and discovering, just like we do, that there, in black and white, is the key to the mystery. This indeed IS a resurrection! Jesus DOES appear to them - there in the texts - just like He does to all of us "with ears to hear." God does not intervene in natural events. I firmly believe that he mourns with us over every terrible event and would act if He could. But the only way that He CAN act is through us. We are indeed sons of God: an essential part of this story; HIS story. If we fail to act then God cannot act either. "God's will be done" yes but so often we read that as a submission. It isn't! It's a call to action. Here endeth the sermon! Sorry. Too long! I got carried away. And it just dawning upon me that the majority of viewers of this channel are probably staunch atheists!
@PC-vg8vn
@PC-vg8vn 2 года назад
I cant say Im impressed by Crossan. He was part of the Jesus Seminar which quite frankly spoke much nonsense. As for the resurrection, I think it did happen. Without it the church would never have happened, the disciples would have just turned to another 'messiah' hoping he was the real one, unlike their dead 'master'. But the resurrection of Jesus from the dead showed them they had no need - He was the real thing.
@mikemorris2867
@mikemorris2867 2 года назад
I'm an agnostic myself but I enjoyed your comment. I have read Karen Armstrong too. She is an interesting writer. The apostle Paul seems to point to Jesus resurrection as a transformation rather than a resuscitation. "Sown a physical body raised a spiritual body" - whatever that means. I think that the early believers are trying to describe something they experienced and can't explain in terms of something they do understand borrowing the vocabulary and imagery of their Jewish scriptures, particularly the Psalms. Was the source of their experience divine or solely psychological? I've no idea.
@martifingers
@martifingers 2 года назад
@@mikemorris2867 I think also the early believers borrowed from Greek religious traditions notably the dying and rising God since there are way too many contradictions with the Jewish Bible and traditions. On George Norris's main point, though I am an atheist but have always wondered why the Jesus myth must be literally true to be meaningful (pace C.S. Lewis of course!) The stumbling block would seem to be The Atonement doctrine as much the rest of Christian morality can inspiring without any notions of divinity (although its exact content is very debateable). The Atonement (and the accompanying doctrine of "sin") seems to be to be totally incoherent even if patently extremely powerful for many Christians. A quick glance through the literature (even amongst different Christian writers) and a few hours watching Rabbi Tovia Singer will (or should) give very good grounds for questioning it. I have my own notion about why the Atonement has such emotional appeal but that is a whole other story!
@georgenorris2657
@georgenorris2657 2 года назад
@@mikemorris2867 WHy does there have to be a difference between "divine" and "solely psychological"? I am officially a Catholic. A very bad one of course but my main problem with "Protestantism" is the way in which it distances God. For instance in the denial of transubstantiiation they have unwittingly pushed God to somewhere outside of direct human experience. There was fairly recently a resurgence of interest in the old Celtic way of faith. Protestants would probably call it naive but the Trinity were seen as absolutely Present in daily life. If God really IS, then He must be HERE and not somewhere else.
@mikemorris2867
@mikemorris2867 2 года назад
@@georgenorris2657 If you are a Catholic then there need be no difference. Revelation can operate through natural channels. There is still a distinction between God and nature though and it is still possible that what you think of as revelation is mistaken. So yes it is possible that the disciples subjective experience might have been a divine revelation but equally they may have been mistaken.
@Indorm
@Indorm 2 года назад
No wonder God does more miracles in places like South America and Africa where people simply believe without talking so much pedantic nonsense.
@martifingers
@martifingers 2 года назад
So miracles happen to keep people in the faith rather than draw people to it?
@gjeacocke
@gjeacocke 2 года назад
McGilchrist seems to be the one kind of a person who really thinks he knows but never really tests his knowledge like the apostles did. to test your truth of your beliefs you set yourself up in a court of law (which is relatively safer).
@trevorbates9017
@trevorbates9017 2 года назад
When Amighty God made the universe He put electromagnetic force in everything...and Jesus was just showing us that despite opposition from hostile thinking we can all harness this invisible, electromagnetic force if we follow God's righteous commands, as Jesus lived them because then we too enter into an electromagnetic science with so much to offer...especially after Wormwood has passed and all hostility has been dealt with.
@chrishand9324
@chrishand9324 2 года назад
Amen!
@2l84me8
@2l84me8 2 года назад
Cool. Can you prove or demonstrate any of those claims or are we expected to just believe that at face value?
@trevorbates9017
@trevorbates9017 2 года назад
@@2l84me8 Well...will you understand the Grand Unification of the Four Universal Field Forces, sufficiently, to understand how it is written into the Holy Bible, or, how the living cell uses mechanics it shares with atoms...or even, how all the invisible energy that surrounds us is compacted into every science in the universe...if the answer is yes you will already be praying for forgiveness and hoping that your spirit is successful in the resurrection induced by Wormwood.
@gerardjayetileke4373
@gerardjayetileke4373 2 месяца назад
@@trevorbates9017 There has not been a unification of the 4 forces, only 3. Besides, the standard model is still incomplete, and we may never know if it has to change at some point. Your use of "electromagnetic force" makes zero sense. You can't just hijack and string together a set of sciency words, expecting them so make sense. This is some deepak chopra level nonsense.
@trevorbates9017
@trevorbates9017 2 месяца назад
@@gerardjayetileke4373 When your scientists realise that gravity is caused by mass in the cross-winds of the combined gravitational forces of the Sun, the moon, the Milky Way, and the black-hole at the centre of the galaxy...as is the higgs-field...they can join in the argument...else leave it to Almighty God.
@chardo24
@chardo24 2 года назад
If you want to know about real miracles you shouldn’t look for the weird or the paranormal miracles in the bible, because the real miracle is just being alive. I don't deny those other kinds of miracles are true. I just saying those are “small-stuff ” miracles and that we really ought to focus on the much more astounding miracle that we are even here to talk about those other miracles at all.
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 2 года назад
👍👏👋
@matthewstokes1608
@matthewstokes1608 2 года назад
Precisely so - but without those smaller miracles - those shocking magic acts so necessary ( so adroitly calculated) to blow the minds away of all those near to GOD on Earth, during His short and truly Miraculous visit (to change, after all, the entire nature of our future), the mission of our Salvation would not have been completed... And we would now not be gathered here, able to see the unbelievable beauty of this Created world as the undeniable daily Miracle it is to true believers like you, my friend. "I have overcome the WORLD"... said the Son of God - (And that was a prophecy said 33 years less than 2022 years ago... A Prophecy of Eternity). He certainly succeeded - how could our Almighty God not succeed? How blessed we are - if we want to be. In Christ's name.
@LAdavidthompson
@LAdavidthompson 2 года назад
The real miracle is being alive? Total garbage....your parents had sex.
@dulls8475
@dulls8475 2 года назад
Yes.
@ronaldlindeman6136
@ronaldlindeman6136 2 года назад
Explaining Story Magic. In the stories of Star Trek, they have great advances in technology, I'm going to call a word I created called Superscience. There are advances in technology described like Warp Drive Star Ships, Transporters and Photon Torpedoes. Now do we think those technologies actually exist? I'm going to say no, we think that Gene Roddenberry made those up. How much does it cost to make up Warp Drive Star Ships and use them in stories? Very little. If someone was to do the actual research into matter-antimatter energy process and then getting that energy system to bend space to allow the Star Ship to travel at tremendous speeds would take a lot of money and research and time. Trillions of dollars and sometimes failed experiments. But to put Warp Drive Star Ships in stories, the cost is not much at all. Consider making up stories about a God. How much does it cost to make up stories about a God that can walk on water, turn water into wine, tell fishermen on which side of the boat to throw their nets to catch a great amount of fish. How much does that cost? Also very little. How much does it cost to write stories about a God that can die a horrible, painful death, but then comes back to life 3 days later? Also the actual cost is not that much. There is a phrase from History 'paper holds still.' What the stories of Christianity and the Religion of Christianity has done is try to claim that the writers of the stories paid a huge price by being tortured and many times killed for the stories. But lots of people in the same time period in History were tortured and killed for many different reasons. Does not make the stories true. But what does Jesus do or not do to make us think that the stories are not true? It is all the other knowledge that a real Nature's God would have that is valuable information to humans, but Jesus of Christianity does not tell us. Jesus is a Supernatural God. Jesus of Christianity is never a Nature's God. A Nature's God would have all sorts of knowledge about Nature. A Nature's God would know about Physics, Chemistry, Biology, Geology, Geography, Mathematics, etc.. A Nature's God would know about printing presses, eye glasses, great ideas on how to advance economics. A Nature's God would know best ways to prevent all diseases. Such as Hippocrates suggested that diseases are natural, they are not caused by the Gods or were superstition which advanced Medical Science and was the start of Medical Science. Why would a God bother to Supernaturally heal humans he came across? If Jesus really wanted to do good for humans, Jesus would have told us how to prevent disease naturally and that would have been a million times better. Does your Christian God like to watch from heaven humans suffer and die to diseases that could have been prevented if only your Christian God spoke up? Modern Science and modern medicine must really piss off Jesus. Jesus just does not know enough about Nature. Jesus has some clever parables, that people in the ancient world might consider coming from a God, but to those of us in the modern world, we should know better. Jesus can do the Supernatural, which any storyteller can have their character do. But knowledge of Nature is not easily made up by human storytellers. That was why Thomas Jefferson put in the Declaration of Independence of the US the words, 'Laws of Nature and of Nature's God.' Jefferson read a lot from the Philosophers of the Age of Enlightenment and did not think that Christianity was true, that Christianity was from a God. Jefferson thought Christianity was from human story tellers. Are the events of Star Trek miracles? Or are they human created stories?
@beauc.diamond7410
@beauc.diamond7410 Год назад
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. Romans 9:10
@marklister5519
@marklister5519 2 года назад
My thoughts on Miracles are, if god granted Miracles to everyone the world would descend into hell. People would wish for their loved ones to never die. People would wish for conflicting Miracles. Free will might not be possible. I believe there is a reason Miracles are few are far between. Maybe there is a reason we don’t get what we want, not immediately anyway.
@doctorisout
@doctorisout 2 года назад
Miracles in the Bible were rare.
@dulls8475
@dulls8475 2 года назад
Some times hundred's of years passed between them.
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 2 года назад
It's funny people doubt miracles yet they cannot explain why and how they're alive and others are not Science cannot explain how and why you're alive today That's an everyday miracle....
@dulls8475
@dulls8475 2 года назад
@@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 I agree and points to God the creator. None so blind as those who dont want to see.
@fukpoeslaw3613
@fukpoeslaw3613 2 года назад
@@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 There's a huge difference between real every day miracles and made up ones.
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 2 года назад
@@fukpoeslaw3613 So what are you trying to say buddy?
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521 2 года назад
If God created everything, why wouldn't He be able to interact with His creation in ways we would call miraculous? His ability, power, and understanding is greater than ours. We send metal tubes with people into the air and keep it aloft by harnessing our own powers and understanding of propulsion and aerodynamics. Normally such mass would crash to earth and, unfortunately, sometimes has. Nevertheless we interfere with a ballistic trajectory by countering gravity with different forces. Similarly, if we accept the possibility of God, then we must also grant the possibility of miracles. Indeed there can be no defense against it. Nature, as a "very gracious host", would simply work with God's actions rather than be irreparably disrupted by it.
@fakename3208
@fakename3208 2 года назад
In a game of chess you sometimes give concessions to your opponent. You might play without a castle or let them re-do a move. But if you allow every concession he asks there would be no actual game. What you are asking for is a great grandfather in the sky. Just a benign power that wants to “make you happy.” God isn’t interested in that. He’s a father, not a grandfather. Love does not equal kindness, and love without kindness is sometimes really hard. When you raise a child to be a good person it often involves a lot of suffering on the child’s part for their own good. You want your child to be able to function and be successful in society, so you teach them they can’t just eat candy for breakfast lunch and dinner. Likewise God wants us to be creatures who can even stand for one second to exist in heaven. In order to transform into that it requires work on our part. If he came in and did everything for us there would be no existence.
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521 2 года назад
@@fakename3208 Hold on there, Chief. We're mostly in agreement. You’re preaching to the choir. God loves us and is our Heavenly Father, and I agree that doesn't mean doing everything for us or even wanting us to always be happy. My point about miracles is that God can do them and perhaps has done them. That's not to say He will always do them because perhaps there's no need to do them with any regularity. Nevertheless, if God is possible, then so are all of God's possible interactions with the universe.
@fakename3208
@fakename3208 2 года назад
@@thoughtfulpilgrim1521 sorry, I spend too much time arguing with people on the internet and didn’t read your comment closely enough.
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521
@thoughtfulpilgrim1521 2 года назад
@@fakename3208 Fair enough. Go in peace ✌️
@2l84me8
@2l84me8 2 года назад
No we don’t. I’m not even convinced there even was a jesus, let alone believed he preformed magic tricks.
@martifingers
@martifingers 2 года назад
Sharon's Dirckx comments on "probabilistic laws" are incoherent really. I know they were off the cuff so to speak but all we got was an irrelevant example (ie in what way does someone intercepting an object in flight contravene any law of nature?), then an example of what Basil Faulty would call "the bleeding obvious" (miracles are contrary to the laws of nature) and an appeal to authority fallacy (Luke the Physician said it was true). I don't want to be unkind but this surely should not be taken very seriously.
@mikemorris2867
@mikemorris2867 2 года назад
If God exists then miracles are possible including the dead being raised. That's the 64000 dollar question though isn't it? Does God exist? How do you go about establishing that or does it come down finally to faith?
@martifingers
@martifingers 2 года назад
Hi Mike. Not sure that follows. It depends on what qualities a god could have surely. I think the whole notion of god is, as Sean Carroll says, not well defined.
@mikemorris2867
@mikemorris2867 2 года назад
@@martifingersIt is my understanding that the possibility of miracles follows on from the classical view of Theism.
@matthewstokes1608
@matthewstokes1608 2 года назад
Of course... It is Faith - just as explained in the Gospel. It IS all true my friend. It is ALL TRUE.
@mindymild
@mindymild 2 года назад
It’s almost certainly did not actually happen… Saying it did is a demonstration of arrogance
@Ak_guy907
@Ak_guy907 2 года назад
Somebody bring this guy to Bethel church in Redding already 😂
@allanhutton
@allanhutton 2 года назад
Whats he going to find, pirates with one short leg getting a little adjustment
@vanoroce64
@vanoroce64 2 года назад
Miracles don't happen. This is the basis of the scientific endeavor. It is simply unscientific to say they do without overwhelming evidence.
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 2 года назад
Dreams are unscientific therefore are dreams unrealistic? Every academic discourse does probability but not actuality... Science doesn't give us what ought to be Max Planck said, at the trance of scientific temple, it's written, ye must have faith.... Brett Weinstein accepts that Science like any other field does probability
@gerardjayetileke4373
@gerardjayetileke4373 2 года назад
But I don't think claimants of miracles expect it to sound scientific, and by that we mean empirically observable, testable, reproducible, predictable, etc. It's precisely the opposite isn't it? And a secondary argument is that, not all phenomena in reality falls under the category of" scientific" as we understand it so far. Or rather, it doesn't have to.
@PrognosisNu
@PrognosisNu 2 года назад
@@gerardjayetileke4373 those are good arguments, they can happen and since they're miracles they can't be reproducible since they're random.
@PC-vg8vn
@PC-vg8vn 2 года назад
Most scientists would probably argue that science has little to say about miracles because science deals with the 'natural'.
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810
@dei-gratiagratias-dei7810 2 года назад
@@PC-vg8vn the fact is, miracles are phenomenons beyond our abilities and capabilities. So no field deals with miracles except the religious discourse
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