IS THE RAPTURE BIBLICAL? 

Futurism is a counter-reformation false teaching, spawned from the pen of the Jesuit monk, Francoisco Ribera. circa. 1585 A.D. Preterism is a counter-reformation false doctrine spawned from the pen of the Jesuit monk Luis de Alcaser circa. 1601 A.D.

You guys are doing way too much twisting of scripture of your own to get out of the rapture ideas. This isn’t new friends idk why you have a hard time with it. The real topic is when it is not if it’s real.

@@elgindor please provide specific examples of how we’re twisting scripture. INSIDE we went over each specific verse associated with the rapture and brought context from the actual narrative and story of the Bible. Please do tell🤷🏻‍♂️

@@ringthembells143 You are twisting the verses to mean what you want them to mean. Revelation in particular. Rapture isn’t new Justin M, Celement,Didache all spoke on the rapture. Michael heisler would be disappointed by your lack of objectivity. He covered the whole concept of the rapture. You’re wrong it’s an American idea but right American church’s hold to it more than Europe or Auzzies. Which both have bent the knee to the Catholics and their false doctrine. Which gave rise to the reformation. Rapture isn’t a Darby thing that’s lazy. Do better brothers.

Thank you so much for sharing, it actually made even more convinced that there is a rapture. My church does not believe, but this video has really made me lean more towards a rapture.

Yes he is my favorite

We aren't the bride. We're the guests of the bridegroom who is Jesus. Israel is the bride. This is a reconciliation from when God divorced Israel (Jeremiah 3:8).

The Church isn't the Bride

@@markd3250 The Church has been grafted into Israel… Romans 11:11-31

@@TomLongusa Jesus is the vine, and we are the branches. The church hasn't been grafted into Israel. If anyone believes and accepts salvation through Christ, then it doesn't matter what race, or anything else; we all become one in Christ, even if they're already Jewish. The issue with Israel is they believe in the Messiah, but don't accept Jesus as him. In their case, when they finally recognize and accept Jesus as the Messiah, they will become the reclaimed bride that God had divorced, as was recorded in Jeremiah 3:8. Those members of the 'church' that are with Jesus in heaven, are the guests at the wedding banquet to celebrate the reunion of Israel with Christ. At that time, we all become one; all of us having been grafted into the vine who is Jesus. It gets confusing because so often things are pulled out of context.

that's right. I remember him saying that.

True

I agree. They used an edited version to push their version of the Bible. What kind of reward would it be to bring the wrath of God unto believers? It's the Time of Jacob's Trouble not the church.

Heiser for sure didn't have a dispensational theology with a rapture.

Long live Dr Mike! ( through his teachings)💖💖💖

@@duketta nah.. through Christ

Absolutely i don’t think there’s a pre trib but maybe there is don’t know don’t care it will be however it will be. Just stay faithfull and strong. 🙏

I really appreciate this perspective. I suppose it always boils down to faith in the person of Jesus The Christ!

Walk with Jesus according to His Word, overcome through Him and regardless of what the timing is… in the end you will be with Christ!

Unless of course you believe there are false teachers and anti-Christs that are pushing a futuristic, dispesational, literal reading of apocalyptic literature to disarm and cripple the Saints of God in Jesus Christ. To push back and overcome the forces of darkness so when our King returns to His creation, He will know who are the good and faithful servants. If you believe heaven is a destination after you die or are "raptured" off the earth, Then get in the back of the bus and shut up. You are not helping prepare young, naive souls for the complete revelation of God in Jesus Christ. You are hindering the development of these people to become the elohims God has intended for them to become. And if one wants to minimize the effect this escapist, weak message of "the world is not my home" has had and is having on God's Kingdom on earth, then let us go in the spirit and go before the Throne of the almighty creator and His Holy council and let us ask for true wisdom and truth. Those who have a vested interest in the status quo of Western pop-eschatology that there vocation depends upon have a lot to loose when it becomes revealed they have believed and taught a half truth their entire ministry.. Udo has spoken!

Jesus was talking to Israel according to their prophecy. The context of what He told them was that they were about to go into their 70th week of their prophecy. Israel doesn't get raptured before their 70th week begins. It's their prophecy. What came instead of Israel's 70th week, was Paul's Dispensation of Grace for the Gentiles (Ephesians 3:1-2), because Israel rejected their Messiah and their kingdom, they fell and diminished (Romans 11:11-12), so salvation (was of the Jews) came to the Gentiles through the Dispensation of Grace. Israel doesn't get raptured prior to their 70th week, only the Body of Christ Church gets raptured before Israel's 70th week begins.

Except that those who believe in the lie of the rapture will not prepare their faith. The faith that they do have will be sorely tested at about the time the mark of the beast is rolled out. The Scriptures DO NOT teach of a rapture. Even I Thessalonians 4:16-17 is the same event Yahusha tells us of in Matthew 24:29-31.

@@jannaswanson271 Preparing our faith is not a thing. Believers already believe and are already saved and sealed. Adding something to what Christ did on the cross is a no-go, "Janna".

@@doncleveland1245 Then the demons are saved as well because they believe He exists. The Parable of the Sower makes no sense then either if you cannot turn away from the Path. We are told constantly to run our race well. Why would we strive any longer if we are "sealed"? Even Paul knew he could still be disqualified. I Corinthians 9:27 Those who follow Christ have ceased from sin. (I Peter 4:1) Mark 16:17-18 describes a believer as, "And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up snakes with their hands, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not harm them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will be made well.” "Once saved always saved" is something the church teaches, it is not what the Scriptures teach.

Yes!!! And it's freeing!

@@stephanieedwards3341 The Bible specifically says when Yahusha will collect His Elect. In Matthew 24:29-31 and other places it is very clear.

Listen to Pastor Allen Nolan. He’s a biblical Scholar. He knows Greek and Hebrew and teaches from the original Bible with KJV. You will learn exactly how to know and understand the Bible. His church is Cornerstone Fellowship. He also puts his videos on RU-vid free to all. His knowledge and of the Bible and history of the Biblical times is astounding.

The acceleration of technology is a game changer in this regard.

Well actually he told them when, "some standing here will not taste death" until they see him coming back, this generation will not pass, the ones (generation) he was speaking to, etc etc etc, this is why they have this thing they call Apologetics in Christiany, when thing don't come to fruition

Just take St. Paul at his word. He speaks the truth.

Read about tradional Jewish weddings at the time and it will make sense. Another important point of delineation is that God is dealing with different groups of people through time. The Jews are his chosen, but they rejected him. The gentiles became the bride. You also have the unsaved. The bride is separate from the Jews getting their promised land. This is why the bride is not present when God is pouring out his final judgment on the Jews and the world.

The one way that it makes sense to me is terms of the OT stories were the likes of Noah and Lot had to be removed from the Earth in order for destruction to take place. I have mixed feelings about Rapture Theology. The biggest misconception is that it is new.

@@ThursoBerwick yes that is definitely pointing to something. The issue i see is people focuse more on the removal of the good people for a time, but forget that the removal of the bad people was perminant. The Gods chosen ones were brought back down to rule in the earth.

Studying under the influence of the Holy Spirit will interpret the rapture for you. The Church is not appointed to wrath, There are many examples of the Harpazo in Scripture. Catching Away of the Bride of Christ

@@BoDog713 I Agree. I have been called a heretic because I am a dispensationalist. They will not be convinced until it happens.

I think Calvinism is ALMOST right. Just too much emphasis on the fact that God's foreknowledge makes some elect and some destined for destruction. It erases all freewill and emphasizes that God hates some people. But I think that God loves the world and wishes that none would perish but that all would come to a saving knowledge of the gospel. I don't think He takes away our choices by His foreknowledge but that He just already knows what our choices will be

ok so he wont be coming back then

ok so he wont be coming back then

He says it - love your neighbor as you love yourself.

You might want to read your Bible, the answers are there….God bless

Well that’s not what Jesus says ,wars rumors of wars ,nations against nations,fathers against sons ,,the love ,love movement and the world peace movement is of the devil,,

When was the end of age? The Bible clearly teaches it was to occur during the lifetime of some of his apostles. The second coming has already occurred.

There are people I dont see because thats all they talk about. What a shock they will get.

@@kyleChat Who do you know that is in glorious form like Christ? The Church will be glorified immortal after the second coming, and we will help many during the Millennial Reign. Sin will be almost completely absent during those 1000 years, do you really think we are there?

It is a well known and accepted fact that this is is almost exclusively an American concept. Obviously other countries will hear about it from America and emulate, but it is rare. The concept of rapture is an American phenomenon.

Yup. I were thinking that as well. I'm Australian but didn't grow up in the catholic church. Rapture is very much a doctrine in Australian churches.

That's fascinating. Like you, I was raised Catholic (still am) and when we got involved in the Charismatic Catholic movement, the rapture was also taught; but never from the alter/pulpit.

Americans are so naive. They think they invented everything. ​@@ringthembells143 No. Almost all the evangelicals in eastern Europe are pre-trib millennials, because this is a common teaching in neo-protestant churches, due to Darby and the brethren. Actually, I don't think I know anyone there who doesn't adhere to a pre-trib rapture view, it they are evangelicals. When they hear that Americans are abandoning this doctrine in droves, they stop in horror and disbelief, and think that God will be just in punishing the American culture into oblivion. I, myself, experienced many types of churches in the West and read arguments of many escatgological systems, but nothing convinced me against a pre-trib rapture, which is the most logical and beautiful conclusion I could get so far. It just makes sense. I just expect that God won't take everyone in the Church, in the same way it made it known in the scripture. One taken, one left behind to continue into a new age. Enoch&Noah, Elijah&Elisha, Moses&Joshua, etc... There is a pattern in this game called life. Also, most anti-pre-tribs don't understand the arguments and mock a caricature of the doctrine out of ignorance. They understand two separate "second comings", while Rapture is never understood by its proponents as a "coming", because Jesus doesn't really come. He takes us away... Well, some of us.

@@ringthembells143 Negative ghostwriter. Early Church Fathers all taught a pretrib rapture. This information is not a secret, but it is something you will not look up because of your refusal of the love of the truth.

Mark 13:27 “And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”

There’s honestly nothing awesome about it. Their interpretation of the scripture is based on liberal theology. Liberal theology is what brings forth the great apostasy and the coming of the Antichrist.

Unless, one believes that the escapist idea of the whole church being raptured OFF the planet before it's destruction and the associated man created scaffolds of dispensational theology have been and are being perpetuated by anti-Christ spirits that influence spiritually ignorant souls and convinces the people that heaven is a destination after you die or are raptured off the earth, then sure, it probably doesn't matter. But I contend it does matter. If a seaman heads out leaving the West coast of America from The Port of Los Angeles on a trip to Hawaii, and he plots his directional course from the port, but the information of the exact location of Hawaii was not correct, he will miss any signs of land and travel off into open water to his death. It is similar to young souls that think they "Hear" the calling of God upon their lives. (Which I believe some truly do, but I question many) They enroll in a Bible college or seminary out of exuberance and youthful passion with flannel graph theology in mind and a world changing belief that vocational ministry is where Jesus Christ is at. (Which I believe He is to some extant) And what we have now leading the church's is 2 or 3 generations that were given the wrong directions to heaven. They have been taught a theology, eschatology, and hermeneutic that "Scripture says this, and this is the only way to interpret these passages." Primarily in the West, this has been futuristic, dispensational, pre-tribulation rapture belief. Which is just that, A BELIEF. But it is not THE truth. It may be A truth for it's adherents, but not for me and many of my archetypes. This "BELIEF", built upon a "System" of Biblical interpretation, has woefully ill-prepared young souls to properly interpret what is happening in the realms of the spirit right now that directly influences culture and society. Not to mention, equip the next generation to kick in the gates of hell through the Power of Jesus Christ in us, walking on earth in the Power of the Holy Spirit. To prepare for the 2nd appearance of our King. We are not going up to heaven to meet God, God came down to earth to be with us in the form of His Son Jesus. "All authority in heaven and on earth have been given to me," Jesus said. I'm not quite sure why people seems to believe that power on earth has somehow been given back to ha Satan. It hasn't. "The kingdom of heaven is at hand," Jesus said. It hasn't gone anywhere, except where the mostly sincere souls but spiritual morons have convinced people who are naive, ignorant or deceived otherwise. This is where I see the problem. Young souls, taught to believe in dispensational time and 2 distinct people groups in Gods Kingdom, with 2 distinct blessings and two distinct futures. One is Israel, whose blessing is earthly in the future. One is the Church, whose blessing is heavenly in the future. There is one flock, and one shepherd, and that is Jesus Christ. He is the "Thura", and through that door or portal or gate, we can enter into the heavens and find rest for our souls, and vision for the age to come. It is in the Spirit right now. We are waiting for the return of our King, who still rules in heaven and on earth, because all authority has been given to him, to consummate His Kingdom here on earth. Time is not linear. It is cyclical. The 1st isn't like the 2nd, and the 3rd isn't like the 1st. It is called eternal life. John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life; the one believing in Me, even if he should die, he will live. and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?” I don't think many Christians believe this, because they have never died. But I know a man, who in 1987 died in a horrific auto accident. I saw him slumped over the steering wheel of his 1967 Super Sport Camaro, head split open like a dropped cantaloupe, side of his body shredded open from car door metal, internal organs crushed with broken ribs. I was one of two eyewitnesses to live through this, many onlookers also saw the aftermath and have their own stories of this event. But somewhere between when they put the corpse in the ambulance and before in was put in the ground, the spirit came back into this young man, and after 3 days in a coma, a similar person came back into a paralyzed, dysfunctional meat suit, but not the same person. It was a person and a Spirit. As God as my witness and the heavenly courts above will bear witness to the truth of this testimony if you go into the spirit and ask, that man still walks about with us in this age today and you would never know the great tribulation this being went through unless he told you. It is the resurrection power of God through the Son of God in the Holy Spirit upon the earth today. That is eternity. That is everlasting life in the Son. For some people, it is like the forest through the trees metaphor. They cannot see the Kingdom through the people, or the religion. Relying on their 5 earthly senses, they are "looking" for the Kingdom of Heaven and the signs that precede it's coming. Allowing the narrative of today to influence and manipulate their lives and souls into believing a lie. Remember, it is ha-Satan that is speaking these lies, and he has his purpose until the Son of Man arises in your heart and we all welcome Him back into our world like the returning, conquering King He is . Book of UDO - A Transition of Ages

That was Awesomely said!!! Thank you Agree to disagree I lean towards pre trib Always have And frequently go back and re check my position and still come to pre trib ❤

❤

to suggest that John 14:1-3 is about a rapture is to suggest that Jesus flat out lied to those He was directly speaking to.... every argument for a rapture is birthed out of deception.

Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead. 20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. 21 For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

@@timbuckman4578 Isaiah 26:19 was fulfilled with Matt 27:51... notice how verse 19 states that the dead rise with Christ when He arose from the dead..... Scripture shows the division on how to rightly divide... please begin.. Every argument for a rapture is birthed out of deception. I did a video on this passage on a live video recently... there are several others that show the same prophecy that the rapturists confuse as "rapture" passages.

@@RandyRoth-mo3lz 1 Corinthians 6:14 And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power. 15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. Revelation 2:22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

Thanks 🙏🏻 and Welcome aboard

That’s the people who become Believers in Jesus call the Tribulation Saints. They will be martyrs. There is a 7 yr Tribulation. 1260 days first half 1260 days second half. Called Daniels 70 weeks. Read Daniel. Everything is perfectly planned by God.

Yea, the best part of the whole video is at 46:31, I really liked that part

You are most welcome ❤️🔔✅

WOAHHHH!! So youre reading another man's opinion on tbe Bible instead of reading it for yourself. 💀💀💀 Thats messed up

@@nyxspirited272 you are an angry internet Troll. Get back from here Satan!!!

@ringthembells143 That's what YOU THINK. Im not the one here acting like im so good at the game and rejoicing in calling God a liar every other minute 😯😯😯😯

Every argument for a rapture is birthed out of deception... Its not about interpretation... but deception... Matt 24:3,4, 2 Thess 2:1-3, 2 Peter 3:15-17

Mark 13:27 “And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”

God's word is truth.

Long Biblical answer- ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-T2Q0Ee2U7Sc.htmlsi=MWM4qP-srLKY0Wgx

Amen !!

Of course there is a pretrib rapture. Paul's "the dead in Christ raise first" is not a link to the first resurrection of the dead in Revelation 20. It's "FIRST" before "we who are still alive are caught up with them." FIRST they rise, THEN we all are caught up. We can't all rise at once, unless they are raised FIRST. Revelation 20:4 the only ones raised are those who made it through the Great Tribulation without taking the mark. No one else.

Here's how you or I paint ourselves into a corner if we fail to consider ALL the scriptures. In Daniel ch 12 a question is asked " How long until ALL things are fulfilled?" and a very precise answer is given "1290 days". That's 1290 days from the day the antichrist declares himself to be god in the temple in Jerusalem until Jesus Christ returns...because Jesus is the fulfillment of ALL prophecy. So if the church is not raptured and goes through the Tribulation. they will know that from the day the antichrist enters the temple in Jerusalem, Jesus will return in 1290 days...so they WILL know "the day" of Christ's return. Didn't Jesus say , "no man knows the day nor the hour ..." ? That's scriptural evidence #1 of about 10 that show there will be a pre-trib rapture. Scriptural evidence #2...Jesus gave the church the "great commission" to preach the gospel to every nation tribe and tongue, before He ascended into heaven. So how come in Rev ch 14:6 we read " And I saw an angel flying midair with the eternal gospel to preach to every nation tribe and tongue." How come an angel is preaching the gospel instead of the church??? Because the church s not present during the Tribulation. There are just a few scriptural examples showing that the church will not be present during the Tribulation. There are many more.

@andyderksen8455 for the Body of Christ Church the resurrection and rapture happens consecutively. Israel's resurrection (Revelation 20:4) has no rapture. It doesn't have any alive and remaining. There is no meeting the Lord in the air. There isn't even a physical bodily resurrection (I saw the souls of them). And it only includes those who died during the Great Tribulation.

@andyderksen8455 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 does require a pretrib scenario. The falling away or Departure happens before the man of sin is revealed. The man of sin is revealed when he confirms Israel's covenant with the many for one week: Israel's 70th week.

@andyderksen8455 Israel's first resurrection (Revelation 20:4), has no rapture. There is no meeting the Lord in the air. There is no alive and remaining. There isn't even a physical bodily resurrection (I saw the souls of them...). Israel does not get raptured before their 70th week of their prophecy begins. The Body of Christ Church is raptured before Israel's 70th week begins. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8. The falling away or Departure happens before the man of sin is revealed. He is revealed when he confirms Israel's covenant for one week.

It's well known in Australia, Canada, the UK and Ireland. Not sure about non-English speaking countries so much.

The teaching of the catching away did not originate with Darby. The early church fathers also debated the timing of the rapture. Did Martin Luther invent 'saved by faith'? No, he rediscovered it after the Roman church had buried it.

The rapture, while being lumped in with dispensationalism, is in the Bible and was taught by John and Paul. The problem is everyone seems to start half way through the scriptures on this topic....and then their explanation isn't very convincing. The starting point for Biblical proof of a pre-tribulational rapture is Jesus Christ...His person and His work. This can be found in 1st John 4:1-3 which says " Dear friends, do not believe every spirit but test the spirits to see if they are from God because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God but every spirit that DENIES that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not from God. This is the spirit of antichrist whom you have heard is coming and even now is in the world." What bearing does this have on the rapture? Notice John's emphasis on Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. Becoming flesh was the only way He could take our sin upon Himself on the cross as an acceptable substitute before the Father. But He also took something else upon Himself on the cross...God's WRATH...the WRATH we deserved for our sin. When somebody believes or teaches that the Church will again be subject to God's WRATH, which is what the Tribulation is, they are saying that He never dealt with it on the cross. This is a form of DENYING that He came in the flesh and it weakens His person and diminishes His work and the costly salvation we received! Where does John say denial that Jesus came in the flesh comes from? The spirit of antichrist...the demonic. Now look how John's teaching with it's implications for the satisfying of God's WRATH is picked up by Paul when he writes to the Thessalonians on the topic of the rapture. Paul writes " You are NOT appointed unto WRATH..." Everybody gets that part but look at the rest of the sentence ..."But to receive SALVATION through our Lord Jesus Christ!" So Paul ties the escape from WRATH, which is what the Tribulation is, to the person and work of Jesus Christ on the cross...where He dealt with God's WRATH so that we are saved from it. John also repeats this warning about people who teach anything that DENIES that Jesus came in flesh in 2nd John , where he also says do not receive such a person or you will be part of their wickedness. This is a much more serious topic than simply a disagreement about what scripture means...John makes that crystal clear...twice! Everything must start with Jesus Christ including prophecy " For the testimony of Jesus Christ IS the spirit of prophecy (Rev) .

@@DebraCarey-h5t You stated, "The early church fathers also debated the timing of the rapture." I'd say, "No, they did not," In my experience, the only usage of the word "rapture" carries with it the idea of euphoria, never ever any resurrection event. Thanks to modern .pdf versions of the ECFs that are word searchable, it is now easily demonstrated just what they believed about the resurrection of the dead, the joining of the living and Second Advent. Whenever I encounter well-meaning believers in these forums who think something akin to, "Irenaeus taught the Rapture.", I simply challenge them to cite the passage or passages from the ECFs. So far, I'm batting 100% and none have been able to do so. And when you search the ECFs for words like, 'resurrection' and 'advent' it can be easily seen their position(s).

Greek word Harpazo is to snatch away living people and transport them to another place or time , it was translated into the Latin as rapiemur in the Latin Vulgate , then translated into rapturo in English and then rapture , the KJV uses " catch away " or " caught away/ caught up " People that think the bible was originally written in English have a lot to learn

There is scripture that clearly shows harpazo prior to the Tribulation , but the Churches do not see it because they are not interested in anything not taught by seminary , it is very very clear , however you must see it in it's original language , big problem people have when they expect it to be in English and do not study to learn

2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 says the Body of Christ Church is raptured prior to Israel's 70th week. Israel doesn't get raptured before their 70th week begins. That wouldn't make any sense. It's their prophecy. I think the confusion comes from not knowing the difference between Israel and the Body of Christ Church.

@@bugsocsollie1694 Wrong! There are 4 events supplied to us in these verses. 1) The coming of our Lord verse 1 2) Our gathering to our Lord verse 1 This event is referred to as The Day of the Lord in verse 2 3) The rebellion and 4) the man of lawlessness is revealed. We are to that the first two events, reterred to as The Day of our Lord will Not occur until event 3 & 4 take place. The rebellion is, obviously, the 3.5 year period we have named The Great Tribulation, and the man of lawlessness is, obviously The Anti-Christ. Verse 4 goes on to describe the man more. The following verses go on to describe The Great Tribulation and the Anti-Christ activity and destruction by the word of our Lord Jeshua. You need to research matters more thoroughly and carfully. You are conversing with a man that has spent his life researching all of the Biblical controversies people argue over ad nauseum. There is no such pre-Tribulation rapture. People only teach it because it is so scary a period of time for christians. Btw, the reason The Great Tribulation is named as such is because it will be an unprecendented time of persecution of the church. Read Mattthew 24 and all of the other verses regarding this period of time throughout the Bible. Some people teach this falsehood also because westerners think so highly of themselves that they don't want to accept our Lord would let his people experience such persecution. I've got news for you. The jews have suffered great tribulation, and the 1st through 3rd centure church suffered atrocious persecution. Believers in many countries suffer terrible persecution to this day! Sorry. I know it's scary, but that is the truth. Take care.

@@bugsocsollie1694 Wrong! We are supplied four events in these verses. 1) The coming of our Lord (v.1) 2) Our gathering to him (v.1) These events are associated with The Day of our Lord (v.2) 3 & 4) The rebellion, and the man of lawlessness is revealed and destroyed (v.4) In verse 3 we are told The Day of our Lord will not occur until AFTER the man of sin is revealed and destroyed by our Lord Yeshua. So, just like in all other rapture verses, we are told our gathering to our lord is at the end of The Great Tribulation. Verses 4 thru 10 go on to describe the man of lawlessness in greater detail. This man is obviously the anti-Chist, and this is obviously during the 3.5 year period we have named The Great Tribulation. You need to research things more thoroughly and carefully. You are conversing with a man that has spent all of my adult life researching all of the Biblical controversies many argue over ad nauseum. The only reasons this false teaching is pushed is because preachers do not want to teach this depressing material to the flock. Also, westerners think too highly of themselves, thinking our Lord would not let his people go through a time of unprecedented persecultion. I've got new for you. The jews have suffered much persecution, and so did the 1st thru 3rd century church. Even today, persection of believers is extreme in many countries. By the way, the reason this period of time has been named The Great Tribulation is because of this unprecented persecution of the church by the hands of the Anti-Chist and The False Prophet. You need to read the many more verses throughout the Bible that discuss this matter. Sorry. I know it's scary, but that is the truth. We must persevere. Take care.

@@bugsocsollie1694 Wrong! We are supplied four events in these verses. 1) The coming of our Lord. verse (v.1) 2) Our gathering to him verse. (v.1) These events are associated with The Day of our Lord (v.2) 3 & 4) The rebellion, and the man of lawlessness is revealed and destroyed (v.4) Verses 4 thru 10 go on to describe the man of lawlessness in greater detail. This man is obviously the anti-Chist, and this is obviously during the 3.5 year period we have named The Great Tribulation. You need to research things more thoroughly and carefully. You are conversing with a man that has spent all of my adult life researching all of the Biblical controversies many argue over ad nauseum. The only reasons this false teaching is pushed is because preachers do not want to teach this depressing material to the flock. Also, westerners think too highly of themselves, thinking our Lord would not let his people go through a time of unprecedented persecultion. I've got new for you. The jews have suffered much persecution, and so did the 1st thru 3rd century church. Even today, persection of believers is extreme in many countries. By the way, the reason this period of time has been named The Great Tribulation is because of this unprecented persecution of the church by the hands of the Anti-Chist and The False Prophet. You need to read the many more verses throughout the Bible that discuss this matter. I know it's scary, but that is the truth. We must persevere. Take care.

@@bugsocsollie1694 Wrong! We are supplied four events in these verses. 1) The coming of our Lord (v.1) 2) Our gathering to him (v.1) These events are associated with The Day of our Lord (v.2) 3 & 4) The rebellion, and the man of lawlessness is revealed and destroyed (v.4) In verse 3, we are told The Day of our Lord will not occur until AFTER the man of lawlessness is revealed and destroyed by our lord Yeshua. So, as all other verses regarding what we have named The Rapture, we are told it takes place at the end of the period of time we named The Great Tribulation. Verses 4 thru 10 go on to describe the man of lawlessness in greater detail. This man is obviously the anti-Chist, and this is obviously during the 3.5 year period we have named The Great Tribulation. You need to research things more thoroughly and carefully. You are conversing with a man that has spent all of my adult life researching all of the Biblical controversies many argue over ad nauseum. The only reasons this false teaching is pushed is because preachers do not want to teach this depressing material to the flock. Also, westerners think too highly of themselves, thinking our Lord would not let his people go through a time of unprecedented persecution. I've got new for you. The jews have suffered atrocious persecution, and so did the 1st thru 3rd century church. Even today, persection of believers is extreme in many countries. By the way, the reason this period of time has been named The Great Tribulation is because of this unprecented persecution of the church by the hands of the Anti-Chist and The False Prophet. You need to read the many more verses throughout the Bible that discuss this matter. I know it's scary, but that is the truth. We must persevere. Take care.

Jesus tells us he came for the lost sheep of Israel. Matthew is for Israel, and they are 99% unbelievers as we sit...

You don't know a blessed thing about persecution

And Matthew 24 is a second coming verse Look at the questions the Apostles asked Jesus There are three

I didn't find it that way at all. Sounded to me like the man took his own pre-conceived biases, found a few "scholars" to tickle his own ears, which in turn made him feel warm and fuzzy. Let me ask you a question, those like you who condemn American's Evangelical Community? Which side of the debate is quickly becoming irrelevant in the cause, and which side still influencing new disciples in numbers? Just the numbers. If you are sure there isn't a rapture, show many anywhere where in the Book of Revelation the "Church" is even mentioned after Chapter 5 to the beginning of Chapter 20? I dare you... Frankly, I find people like you and this Ring Them Bells site lukewarm and have no further need to listen to you.

Without seeing the Dispensation given to Paul for the Gentiles, you can not fully understand Scripture. You'll probably end up thinking that you are Israel and that you get all of their promises and their inheritance.

@@bugsocsollie1694 But the Bible DOES say the promises to Israel are to Gentile believers too. We too are called a royal priesthood. Dispensationalism is a dead end of many contradictions.

@@Boxerr54 Show me where the Bible says that we are a royal priesthood. Show me where the Bible says the promises to Israel are to the Gentiles, too.

@@bugsocsollie1694 You will only learn when you find the contradictions for yourself. Best of success in doing so.

The blessed hope is seeing Jesus, not escaping.

There is something wrong with that hope because it's false hope. The Bible nowhere teaches a pretrib rapture. It teaches that the coming of our Lord and our gathering to Him are one event.

YeShua already reigned His 1000 year reign,.. we are living in the short season of Satan’s release.

@@Strongtower actually the bible give evidence for a pretrib rapture, as this and the 2nd coming are tow distinct events, happening at different time periods.

@@remnant8898 Can you give me any Scripture passages that say this?

Except for the pejoratives such as "Humanist" they are quite happy about the Heaven AND NEW Earth that were the expectation and focus of Jesus' teaching. I hope you will reconsider. There's nothing threatening or frightening here. They're simply pointing out one area where perhaps the Church has missed the point a bit. But it's a disagreement between brother and sister Christians. We should all be on the same side, ultimately, even in disagreement.

Amen! Its Amazing how when TRUTH is spoken you just KNOW it's the Truth! Praise God!

Mark 13:27 “And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”

@andyderksen8455 it’s not an assumption. It’s the way a first century believer would have understood the words. Quoting a random passage from Acts has nothing to do with a passage from Thessalonians. You can’t take a little of this and a little of that out of context and create a doctrine.

"across the pond" is an expression commonly used to refer to the separation of England and the US. The person mentioned it tongue-in-cheek as the US and Australia, making a parallel to the actual use

To your actual point, no, not only US churches believe this, but it is a distinct doctrine created and exported by the US

@andyderksen8455 I agree. But I believe, from what I gather, they are talking exclusively of a rapture happening pre-Second coming when they use the term rapture. I too dislike this oversimplification

Praise God🥳🔔❤️

2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 tells of two different comings of the Lord. One is the day of the Lord when He actually returns to earth and sets up His Kingdom. The other is our gathering together unto Him. One of those Comings, Paul was looking for (1 Thessalonians 1:10, Philippians 3:20, for example). The other coming, the Day of the Lord, Paul was not looking for. He said THAT DAY (the day of the Lord) will not come except... Actually, Paul was the only NT writer to say that day shall not come, the Kingdom is not at hand. Because Israel fell and diminished because they rejected it all. So, salvation (was of the Jews) came to the Gentiles (Romans 11:11-12) in a Dispensation of Grace (Ephesians 3:1-2).

@@bugsocsollie1694 it doesnt tell of two. You are presupposing that.

@@Bazooka_Sharks I just proved to you that Paul was writing of two different comings of the Lord. I understand that you don't believe it, but if you have issue with my "proof," let's hear it. But I'm not going to reject the Word of God just because you don't believe it.

@@bugsocsollie1694 you didnt prove anythjng. Paul says “Now we ask you, brothers and sisters, regarding the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him.” It’s literally the same event.

@@Bazooka_Sharks Actually, Paul is beseeching them with one coming that they be not worried about the other coming being near. Read it... without the presuppositions.

The spirit attacks false beliefs in order to encourage believers✔️🎯🔔✌️

@@ringthembells143 Touche' See you in heaven since this is not an issue of salvation, only quarrels of earthly men!

@@RoseAngel65 This is the way ✌️🔔❤️

Fully aligns with it , it is Jesus confirming the covenant made to Abraham , when Daniel was praying to GOD to forgive Israel for being disobedient praying That GOD would not cancel the promised covenant with Abraham

There is no word " church" at all in the Greek / Hebrew in revelation. Nowhere!

@@patriciabarron7707 Revelation 3:1 (CSB) “Write to the angel of the church in Sardis: Thus says the one who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars: I know your works; you have a reputation for being alive, but you are dead. (ESV) “And to the angel of the church in Sardis write: ‘The words of him who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. “‘I know your works. You have the reputation of being alive, but you are dead. (ESV+) “And to the angel of the church in Sardis write: ‘The words of him R9who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. “‘I know your works. You have the reputation R10of being alive, R11but you are dead. (Geneva) And write vnto the Angel of the Church which is at Sardis, These things saith he that hath the seuen Spirits of God, and the seuen starres, I knowe thy workes: for thou hast a name that thou liuest, but thou art dead. (GW) "To the messenger of the church in Sardis, write: The one who has God's seven spirits and the seven stars says: I know what you have done. You are known for being alive, but you are dead. (HCSB) "Write to the angel of the church in Sardis: "The One who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars says: I know your works; you have a reputation for being alive, but you are dead. (KJV) And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead. (KJV+) AndG2532 unto theG3588 angelG32 of theG3588 churchG1577 inG1722 SardisG4554 write;G1125 These thingsG3592 saithG3004 he that hathG2192 theG3588 sevenG2033 SpiritsG4151 of God,G2316 andG2532 theG3588 sevenG2033 stars;G792 I knowG1492 thyG4675 works,G2041 thatG3754 thou hastG2192 a nameG3686 thatG3754 thou livest,G2198 andG2532 artG1488 dead.G3498 (NKJV) "And to the angel of the church in Sardis write, 'These things says He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars: "I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. (NLT) “Write this letter to the angel of the church in Sardis. This is the message from the one who has the sevenfold Spirit of God and the seven stars: “I know all the things you do, and that you have a reputation for being alive-but you are dead. (YLT) And to the messenger of the assembly in Sardis write: These things saith he who is having the Seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars: I have known thy works, and that thou hast the name that thou dost live, and thou art dead;

Please produce evidence of these Church fathers specifically talking about the rapture. You won’t find it described like American Evangelicals do. Also ONLY three of The Church Fathers even knew Hebrew. They are not a The Source of Truth. The Hebrew narrative and scriptures are our guide and they DO NOT support the theology that God is coming to talk anyone back to Heaven with him🙏🏻🔔❤️

Ken Johnson is a Hebrew scholar that studies the Dead Sea scrolls. He often references the early church father's that mentions the fact that they believed Jesus would come for his own before coming with his own. Proving that the theology of a rapture isn't new. Right or wrong the fact that it was taught in the first century is undeniable.

Perry Stone has a few videos giving quotes from historians Hypolitus, Origin ,Irinaius Athenatius and more. The info is there

@@lawrenceebert8461 sure they are 👍🏼

@@lawrenceebert8461 No it is definitely deniable. Trust me most every scholar in the biblical world denies this✅ church fathers are not the source of truth or the best examples. I can give you actual written examples from these men of how racist and hateful they were towards the Jews. I’m not saying every church Father or that all church fathers were bad. I’m just saying they are not our source of inspiration and truth. The Bible is. And once again the Bible does not teach that God is coming to bring you to heaven. The Bible teaches God is bringing heaven to earth🥳❤️🔔

Hello sister or brother. I see in the New Testament that Jesus's coming and our gathering to Him (rapture) happen are the same event. Can you show me any Scripture passages that show pretrib?

No, they can’t because you have to assume and have your mind already made up for you from your “tradition” to see that in the text. Could it be? Maybe.. do I believe in a pre trib? I used to.. cause my “tradition” told me I did.. until I just decided to read. If we all just took Jesus’s word and called no one out “teacher” and stuck with His word and not the “tradition” we swear by then we would be having very different and much more fruitful conversations.

@@BecauseGrace Yeah, what a crock, you are deceived, so you can only speak for yourself... you're just spreading your 'rotten fruit', NEXT !

He clearly doesn’t have a grasp on any of the rapture positions 😂 it was comical.

It is a new theology…160 years is new.

You are so dishonest, you leave out 2 Thessalonians 2, the entire chapter, where he is clarifying his first letter because the Thessalonians thought they had missed the day of the lord. 2 thes. Chapter 2 completely negates your pre trib So does 1 corinthians 15: 51-52. So does matthew 24:29-30. And thats Jesus saying this so, is he wrong or are you?

@@Bazooka_Sharks No need to be rude…no point in talking about 2 Thess if you dont know 1 Thess. 1Th 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. aka 2 Thess.

@@Bazooka_Sharks Nothing to negate. 1 Cor 15 is the second resurrection when death itself is destroyed. It has nothing to do with the catching up. See Rev 21 :4. Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death

@@carlcizek2189 sorry to be rude, im working on that. But it seems you dont understand Thessalonians, either of them. We arent appointed to Gods wrath, true. But The tribulation is satans wrath, you know, the fallen angels who are loosed. God pours his wrath out on those who take the mark. No mark, no prob. martyrdom, natural disaster, etc isnt out of the question, though. 1 corinthians is the second coming, and the events after. Revelation 21 the kingdom of God is here on earth. So…not sure how that helps pre trib theory. Anyway, i was raised in pre trib. Then I studied the bible and its not there. I decided i would believe the Word over baptist tradition. People have a hard time letting go of mans tradition, even if its not in scripture.

​@@Bazooka_Sharks Actually 2 Thessalonians is Paul trying to restore their hope. Compare 1 Thes. 1:3, to 2 Thes. 1:3. It's Hope that is missing. Not because they thought they missed the day of the Lord, but because they thought the day of the Lord WAS NEAR, meaning they were in Israel's 70th week, meaning they missed the coming of the Lord and our gathering together unto Him.

I think the escapism theology became a good way to fill pews, haha.

Yeah, I never could understand the view that the Church, the Bride of Christ should get mugged right before the wedding. That just doesn't seem kosher.

Post tribulation, but pre wrath. It is quite clear in scripture.

Hi! God is not going to destroy the earth, he is going to cleanse it. He is going to judge the lawless. A new earth and a new heaven does not mean start from scratch, it means heaven and earth will come together again and YHWH will establish His Kingdom on earth again. Humans (saints) will dwell on earth with Christ, we don't go anywhere; if we die before His return, we will temporarily go to where God is, but will come back with Him. Please pay attention to the information he brings, there's Truth. Let's have a teachable Spirit. God Bless!

​@just_me2797 Obviously it isn't clear. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 makes it absolutely clear that the rapture of the Body of Christ Church is before Israel's 70th week begins. THINK ABOUT WHAT THAT MEANS. ITS TWO DIFFERENT CHURCHES. Jesus comes back immediately after the Tribulation of those days, and that is after the vials are poured out.

@@bugsocsollie1694 I am talking about the "30,000 foot view" so to speak. One MUST study all of scripture and put the put all of the pieces together with deep consideration. I was raised as most people were going to church and simply giving credit to what was taught without doing my own true studies. When bouncing around from certain random verses and putting puzzle pieces where they do not belong it paints a picture that never should have existed. I even went to a Christian school for several years where part of the curriculum was to memorize certain verses each week and to "ponder" what we were told that they meant. It wasn't until I was in my 40's that I actually sat down with multiple bibles so that I could do full cross referencing and begin to accurately tie scripture together that I saw that most church doctrine is in fact WRONG. It is utterly moronic the way that most ponder the individual verses without giving full consideration to the entire book. It is a bit like having a large picture and covering it up with the exception of one small hole and then giving an opinion on what that picture portrays based on what is seen in that one little spot. I certainly have not come to my understanding easily nor by being influenced by others. It has been through prayer and study, THEN going to other sources that have reached the same conclusions.

You won't be if you watch and wait for him... Looking for him is our instruction from him Look at this verse, Hebrews 9:28 so Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many and UNTO THEM THAT LOOK FOR HIM SHALL HE APPEAR the SECOND TIME without sin unto salvation Paul said there's a crown laid up for those who loved his appearing Jesus said let no man take your crown from you How can a man take your crown from you when you don't get the crown until you cross over, at the bema seat of Christ, Man can take your crown from you today by talking you out of watching waiting and expecting him to come and get you pre-tribulation. That's how a man can take your crown......

Thank You for bringing some sanity to these high & lofty ones who speak in circles with phrases, maybe's, in a manner of speaking. Whew these people can grieve a Happy Joel Osteen message. Unlike Joel who gives positive uplifting ....which is some imbalance. But these people like this Matthew Halstead ....wow are like so high & lofty the atmosphere from where they come from is very thin air. I don't think they are getting enough Oxygen! Ha! Jokingly having some fun....but MAN....just believe the biblical worldview ,the simple gospel and be content.

Its not that simple to understand, every Christian has been taught by a denomination and thats what they believe. What their denomination teaches is not what the bible says. If it was we would all believe the same information from the bible.

Welcome aboard🥳🔔✌️

Hahahahhahahah, Scholar, nice joke bro 😆, thats the kind of material they need at stand up comedy. The way you made a juxtaposition when you refered to those men as "scholars" but the irony is that none of them have actually read the Bible. And then you added the dichotomy of appearance vs reality, where they actually pretend to know the bible. That's 3 SOLISTIC DEVICES :O in one creative piece 😮. My english teacher would be proud of you 😉

And only one of the seven letters to the churches is there a mention of the tribulation, the church at Thyatira, Revelation 2:22, where Jesus says I will send you into the Great tribulation unless you repent. Yep ONLY this church is told such a thing. God always makes his well known ahead of time for his people, Amos 3:7 Surely the Lord God will do nothing but he reveals His secret unto his servant for prophets

Hi Mario. We address that specifically inside this interview. Check it out- ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-86WZ8-rmoCU.htmlsi=J3gDmFiRbjkPitAv

Thanks! That really means a lot!🔔❤️

John 14:1-3 1 Let not your heart be troubled, you believe in God believe also in me 2, In my father's house are many mansions, if it were not so I would have told you..... (he says this cuz he knows there's a lot of people in the latter days who will be telling us this is not so) I go to prepare a place for you 3, and if I go and prepare a place for you I will come again and receive you unto myself that where I am there you may be also.

That’s not true…2nd Esdras and several church fathers taught something like a rapture. I’m on the fence. It doesn’t really matter to me but I’m trying to be honest. It wasn’t started by Darby. Just like in Genesis, God may only keep us safe from the tribulation like he kept the Israelites in Egypt. I love Dr. Heiser and J.T Wright but they may have never seen the early information. I don’t know and won’t argue with anyone’s interpretation. I’ve also read that Israel will be the main group punished in the tribulation. We have clues but like Mike says we don’t have enough information!

@@Paul-zf8ob "like a rapture" not a rapture as being taught today. Before commenting please know EXACTLY what you are talking about.

@andyderksen8455 you are incorrect! Know what you are talking about from a biblical scholastic viewpoint before throwing ignorant comments out there.

There are mentions of Rome, India, Ethiopia and maybe Spain and China in thr Bible, which are not Middle Eastern.

@@ThursoBerwick That is true, those mentions can be discerned as being those areas. But when the bible says the whole world traveled to Egypt to buy grain, it did not mean the whole planet.

@@MichaelDFortner That's a colloquialism, like saying, "Everybody was at that party." But the Revelation references are cosmological. The end of everything on Earth and the start of something new.

@@ThursoBerwick Exactly, a colloquialism of the bible. The cosmological references are just that. I did not say, that every mention of Earth referred to only the middle east. If a cloud covers 1/3rd of the earth, then it refers to the whole planet. If 1/3rd of the ocean is turned to blood, that is not 1/3rd of the Middle East waters. I never said that. You just have to understand the difference, which people do not, which is why they believe the Antichrist will rule the entire globe. He will not.

You haven't read the bible. Jesus is coming in the clouds to rapture his church, not on the last day.

@@lwittrock1 ???