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is this integration trick TOO POWERFUL? 

Michael Penn
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30 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 126   
@MichaelPennMath
@MichaelPennMath Год назад
🌟Get AtlasVPN and support the channel🌟 Protect your internet for $1.83/mo for 3 years plus 3 months free: get.atlasvpn.com/MichaelPenn
@bjornfeuerbacher5514
@bjornfeuerbacher5514 Год назад
Another way: Split the original integral into one from -1 to 0 and one from 0 to 1. In the first one, change x to -x. Then combine the integrals again; the same simplification will happen.
@samwalko
@samwalko Год назад
I'm pretty sure this method and the method splitting into odd/even functions are exactly equivalent (at least for all "nice" functions). The 2 and the 1/2 will always cancel.
@lucyg00se
@lucyg00se Год назад
Yes! It also generalises: if you have an integral from 1/A to A, you can split it into two integrals; one from 1/A to 1 and one from 1 to A. Then do a substitution of x -> 1/u in either one, and recombine. An example of this is the integral from 0 to infinity of ln(x)/(x^2+1) dx (though you need to worry a little about convergence when you limit A to infinity)
@richardfarrer5616
@richardfarrer5616 Год назад
It seems a lot easier to multiply the second term by e^(1/x)/e^(1/x) rather than multiplying both terms by their conjugates.
@thomasdalton1508
@thomasdalton1508 Год назад
Yes, that's much quicker. It requires you to spot that that's going to work, though. The method he used is the natural thing to do if you are just following your nose and don't already know what the answer is going to be.
@richardfarrer5616
@richardfarrer5616 Год назад
@@thomasdalton1508 It's a fairly standard trick when you have something of the form 1/(y + 1) + 1/(1/y + 1), which is effectively what the terms in the video are, with y = e^(1/x)
@adriansison1503
@adriansison1503 Год назад
Man.. I sure wish I didnt have to go to other classes and just self study math full time.
@Mathman-rt4xz
@Mathman-rt4xz Год назад
If I had to self study math I would SUCK. Classes make me do the work
@ruferd
@ruferd Год назад
"I have never let schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
@charleyhoward4594
@charleyhoward4594 Год назад
@@user-ct1ns6zw4z but evariste galois was a certified GENIUS - ARE YOU ? not trying to be a smart alleck, just saying ...
@lmaorofl3229
@lmaorofl3229 Год назад
i am 14 years and I already know calc pretty decantly
@YaamFel
@YaamFel 11 месяцев назад
Oh boy let me tell you about math graduate school
@parameshwarhazra2725
@parameshwarhazra2725 Год назад
Mad respect to Michael for introducing this awesome concept.
@maalikserebryakov
@maalikserebryakov Год назад
Poo in the loo !
@parameshwarhazra2725
@parameshwarhazra2725 Год назад
@@maalikserebryakov what do you mean?
@xizar0rg
@xizar0rg Год назад
That construction of f0+f1 seems to fall into that 'just stupid enough to work' category... It's like, duh, of course you can multiply by 1 and add zero, but the effect is unexpected.
@goodplacetostop2973
@goodplacetostop2973 Год назад
10:07
@Noam_.Menashe
@Noam_.Menashe Год назад
I would say it's overpowered by I haven't yet been able to use it for any integral not built for this technique.
@MrMctastics
@MrMctastics Год назад
This techinuqe is critically important in analytic number theory and in combinatorics. Also, I dont believe you :p, there's just no way that's true. Maybe if you're just out of calc 2 or something
@Noam_.Menashe
@Noam_.Menashe Год назад
@@MrMctastics I read an entire two volume book on complicated integrals and this technique didn't show up. I'll take your word for this because I've yet to take analytic number theory though.
@MathOrient
@MathOrient Год назад
Nicely done :) Learned something new 👍
@saritatanwar6003
@saritatanwar6003 Год назад
Deepak JATAV DJ
@matematicacommarcospaulo
@matematicacommarcospaulo Год назад
I'll start to teach integrals in two weeks... This definitely will be part of my classes
@hgh468
@hgh468 Год назад
Looks like this method also applies to decompose the square matrix into symmetric and antisymmetric matrices, but in a slightly different way.
@robberbarron8161
@robberbarron8161 Год назад
What about segregational calculus?
@christopherpeters4285
@christopherpeters4285 Год назад
I teach a signals and systems course, and instruct my students they should always look at the function first without just jumping into the math, in the hopes of simplifying their approach to the solution. When it comes to the Fourier series and transforms, this can make a very crazy looking function so much easier. Students get amazed how something so simple can save them hours of work. I'm very glad you cover this approach here. Will show my students this video!
@FreshBeatles
@FreshBeatles Год назад
4:32 A Good Place to Start
@mujimuji6002
@mujimuji6002 Год назад
Oh neato, the even-odd decomp; Just learned this! This is onna those tricks that i wish was taught like the kings property, Weierstrauss sub, and complex subs.
@dbmalesani
@dbmalesani Год назад
This works for any bounds of integration, as long as they're symmetric around 0. So, one can write: sin(x) = integral between -x and +x of cos(t)/(e¹ᐟᵗ+1) dt.
@wqltr1822
@wqltr1822 Год назад
This reminds me of of cosh and sinh in the sense that if f is e^x then f0 and f1 are coshx and sinhx respectively.
@oom_boudewijns6920
@oom_boudewijns6920 Год назад
How can he even decompose a function into 0 and 1!? I've never seen anything like that before?
@wqltr1822
@wqltr1822 Год назад
@@oom_boudewijns6920 I dont think he does. If you are referring to f0 and f1, that is just notation for a function. Could be replaced with g and h. The Idea is just to use notation similar to f to denote hes splitting f into two similar functions.
@vladimirrodriguez6382
@vladimirrodriguez6382 Год назад
Wow, beautiful trick. Thanks Michael
@akshatjain4283
@akshatjain4283 Год назад
students here in india learn this in 12th grade, in fact we learn even more of these integral "tricks" to solve questions as quickly as possible, they are used very oftenly in competitive exams aswell.
@Yt-ff6hn
@Yt-ff6hn Год назад
The words of a true jee aspirant 😂
@sycration
@sycration Год назад
They are used in symbolic solvers too, anything to speed up that descent of pattern matching
@gingerwiththreer
@gingerwiththreer Год назад
everywhere i go i see these comments bhai yaar 😭
@jeanveramorocho9307
@jeanveramorocho9307 Год назад
Man, if I had a penny for every indian person saying they learn a math concept or trick when they were in the womb I could retire at 23
@integration8274
@integration8274 Год назад
​@@jeanveramorocho9307 no bro ,he is right this integrals can be solved in less than 30 sec
@LumenPlacidum
@LumenPlacidum Год назад
Did I miss where he dealt with the improperness of the integral?
@JamesLewis2
@JamesLewis2 Год назад
No, but at least heuristically, the integrand has only a jump discontinuity at 0, so it can be integrated over the interval: As x→0−, the denominator approaches 2, so the integrand approaches ½, while as x→0+, the denominator approaches +∞, so the integrand approaches 0+.
@JamesLewis2
@JamesLewis2 Год назад
A slightly easier simplification involves removing negative exponents from the right term: Then you would have 1/(e^(1/x)+1)+e^(1/x)/(1+e^(1/x)), which more obviously simplifies to 1.
@richardheiville937
@richardheiville937 Год назад
Your computation is too complicated. 1/(exp(1/x)+1)+1/(exp(-1/x)+1)=1/(exp(1/x)+1)+exp(x)/(1+exp(1/x))=(1+exp(x))/(1+exp(x))=1
@joeyoest1105
@joeyoest1105 Год назад
So is the integral from -1 to +1 of (1/x) just 0, then, by similar logic?
@JamesLewis2
@JamesLewis2 Год назад
In the sense of a principal value, it is, but to be more careful, you do need to show that the integrand is sufficiently well-behaved near singularities.
@lucyg00se
@lucyg00se Год назад
There was an Irish Maths Olympiad (I think?) question that used this trick: the integral from -1 to 1 of 1/(e^x + 1)(x^2 + 1) dx :)
@General12th
@General12th Год назад
Hi Dr. Penn! The ad was a little long.
@MichaelPennMath
@MichaelPennMath Год назад
It's a long story but I do appreciate and take on-board this feedback. trust me when I say it's not on purpose or what I'm aiming for, just how it shook out this round. -Stephanie MP Editor
@richardheiville937
@richardheiville937 Год назад
The computation relies on 1/(1+X)+1/(1+1/X)=1/(1+X)+X/(1+X)=(1+X)/(1+X)=1
@orthoplex64
@orthoplex64 Год назад
Huh, I'd learned you could explicitly decompose a function into even+odd from a linear algebra exercise, but I didn't realize you could use it to help solve y-axis-symmetric integrals since you can both ignore the odd part and only worry about half of the even part.
@nicholasmoore5168
@nicholasmoore5168 Год назад
why would anyone say this integration trick is "too powerful", this technique only applies to a relatively small number of definite integrals, and most aren't going to work out this nicely
@wagsman9999
@wagsman9999 Год назад
Wow. Didn't see that coming. Very nice.
@Mephisto707
@Mephisto707 Год назад
There is a discontinuity at x=0. Doesn't this make this integral divergent?
@BrollyyLSSJ
@BrollyyLSSJ Год назад
The integrand is undefined at x=0, but since both left and right limits exist and are finite, there's no issue for the integral.
@ScienceTalkwithJimMassa
@ScienceTalkwithJimMassa Год назад
I have a couple of Paul Nahin's books. One is about i and the other is about Euler's Fabulous Formula. If I recall, he is a retired professor of electrical engineering from the University of New Hampshire
@user-en5vj6vr2u
@user-en5vj6vr2u Год назад
Interesting how any even function e(x) can be integrated with 1/(1+exp(1/x)) over a symmetric interval to yield half the integral of e(x) over that interval. Actually this can be generalized even more: replacing 1/(1+exp(1/x)) with 1/(1+exp(o(x)) has the same effect, where o(x) is any odd function
@user-en5vj6vr2u
@user-en5vj6vr2u Год назад
And you can use the above to derive the property that the integral from -a to a of 1/(1+exp(o(x)) is equal to a, for any odd function o(x)
@charleyhoward4594
@charleyhoward4594 Год назад
( exp^(1/x) + 1 )( exp^(-1/x) + 1 ) = ( exp^(1/x) )( exp^(-1/x) ) + exp^(1/x) + exp^(-1/x) + 1 = exp^(1/x) + exp^(-1/x) + 2 right ???
@dakotapearl0
@dakotapearl0 Год назад
Mathematicians hate this one simple trick!
@nickharland9207
@nickharland9207 Год назад
What are you talking about? No Mathematician hates tricks. Mathematicians want students to know when and why the trick works. The trick is fine. However, it only works for symmetric integrals when f(x)+f(-x) is easier to integrate than f(x) which is rarely the case except for functions that were odd in the first place or were easy enough to integrate without symmetry.
@yuseifudo6075
@yuseifudo6075 6 месяцев назад
It's sarcasm​@@nickharland9207
@DrR0BERT
@DrR0BERT Год назад
Did I miss where the improper integral was addressed?
@MrLemonsChannel
@MrLemonsChannel Год назад
Too bad the AP calculus exam was yesterday
@shivanshnigam4015
@shivanshnigam4015 10 месяцев назад
JEE mains favorite category of integration
@tolberthobson2610
@tolberthobson2610 Год назад
Reminded me of Fourier series from my PDE class
@gp-ht7ug
@gp-ht7ug Год назад
Please, more vídeos on functions decomposition!
@wyboo2019
@wyboo2019 Год назад
seeing the f0 function: (f(x)+f(-x))/2 obviously reminds me of the definition of cosine with complex exponentials: (e^(ix)+e^(-ix))/2 but also reminds me of Binet's Formula for the fibonacci numbers: (phi^n+(-phi)^(-n))/sqrt(5) which motivates me to try and see if binet's formula can be written in a form involving a complex argument for cosine (real argument for a hyperbolic cosine?). that would be a really neat little identity; the fibonacci numbers in terms of complex trigonometry
@gileadlevy9055
@gileadlevy9055 Год назад
You can write the Fibonacci numbers as follows: (e^(n*ln(phi)) + e^(-n*ln(phi))/sqrt(5) = 2cos(i*n*ln(phi))/sqrt(5) =2cosh(n*ln(phi))/sqrt(5) Thus we get from the definition of the Fibonacci numbers: cosh(n*ln(phi)) = cosh((n-1)*ln(phi)) + cosh((n-2)*ln(phi)) Hope it helps!
@Ayush-yj5qv
@Ayush-yj5qv 5 месяцев назад
Frequently used in iit adv
@psymar
@psymar Год назад
Betteridge's law of headlines.
@FranciscoMNeto
@FranciscoMNeto Год назад
Mind properly blown
@Mystery_Biscuits
@Mystery_Biscuits Год назад
Looks like an application of Papa Flammy’s int even(x) / (1+a^odd(x)) dx result
@rwprobst
@rwprobst Год назад
Since exp(1/x) is not defined at x=0, that's an improper integral - should have been a little more careful there...
@manucitomx
@manucitomx Год назад
Will this trick end the gnarliness of all integrals? It makes me giddy. Thank you, professor.
@AndreasLindae
@AndreasLindae Год назад
Wow! wacky concept, a good place to click the thumbs up 👍
@TheEternalVortex42
@TheEternalVortex42 Год назад
Don’t we need to be a bit more careful since this function isn’t continuous at 0?
@Mephisto707
@Mephisto707 Год назад
I was think the same thing. Especially since the limit as x tends to zero does not exist.
@BrollyyLSSJ
@BrollyyLSSJ Год назад
Limit doesn't exist, but both left and right-sided limits exist and are finite, so you can split this integral into two convergent parts, which makes it fine.
@depressedguy9467
@depressedguy9467 Год назад
done with this paul j nahin book and i think you should make a video on optical integral which uses riemann sum approach
@mathprofessor-11235
@mathprofessor-11235 Год назад
I covered this same topic on my channel a few weeks ago!
@joansgf7515
@joansgf7515 Год назад
Flammable Maths did this too some years ago if I recall right.
@nathanmorlonski1265
@nathanmorlonski1265 Год назад
I like how you guys solve problems, not that I can solve them
@brianjones9780
@brianjones9780 Год назад
This looks viable for climbing the ladder in the new math meta wonder if we'll see it permabanned next season
@DavidFMayerPhD
@DavidFMayerPhD Год назад
You have not shown that the integral EXISTS. E^(1/x) is UNDEFINED at x=0. You simply ignored that issue. I am not saying that your solution is incorrect, but that you never demonstrated that it existed.
@yoav613
@yoav613 Год назад
When x goes to 0 1/x is inf from the right and -inf from the left and e^1/x goes to inf from right and 0 from left so cosx/(e^1/x+1) goes to 1 from left and 0 from right very rapidly. So it is easy to see the integral exists. There are also tests to see if the integral converges,and michael did it before.i do not think he should show this evry time.the goal of this videos is to solve nice tricky integrals this is not math lecture.
@ThePingouin2ter
@ThePingouin2ter Год назад
Is it possible to learn this power?
@sycration
@sycration Год назад
he just explained it lol
@markocsaba1
@markocsaba1 Год назад
"Not from a Jedi" :)
@Felipe-sw8wp
@Felipe-sw8wp Год назад
Here in Brazil we learn this in middle school this is ez
@Felipe-sw8wp
@Felipe-sw8wp Год назад
I hope anyone who reads this get that this is a joke
@mcgamescompany
@mcgamescompany Год назад
@@Felipe-sw8wp did you travel back in time? why does the reply says 50 minutes ago and the comment itself 47 minutes ago!?!??
@Felipe-sw8wp
@Felipe-sw8wp Год назад
@@mcgamescompany I didn't but maybe my future self did.
@rtheben
@rtheben Год назад
I watched one and three quarters times 😂
@TronSAHeroXYZ
@TronSAHeroXYZ Год назад
2:20 Stop watchin pron.
@kirksneckchop7873
@kirksneckchop7873 Год назад
Interesting trick!
@hanswoast7
@hanswoast7 Год назад
Can you show how to use hyper real numbers / infinitesimals to integrate?
@luckyluckydog123
@luckyluckydog123 Год назад
hyperreal numbers (or other infinitesimals) are IMO extremely interesting but I don't think they'll help one bit in computing antiderivatives of elementary functions...
@maxdipaola196
@maxdipaola196 Год назад
Cool
@christoskettenis880
@christoskettenis880 Год назад
It is indeed OP!
@sriprasadjoshi3036
@sriprasadjoshi3036 Год назад
We learn this is 12th grade...
@LucasDimoveo
@LucasDimoveo Год назад
not in the US
@integration8274
@integration8274 Год назад
​@@LucasDimoveo in which grade u guys study it ?
@LucasDimoveo
@LucasDimoveo Год назад
@@integration8274 never, at least until university
@integration8274
@integration8274 Год назад
@@LucasDimoveo ooh nice, it's actually good to not put that much pressure on a student, here we have to study this and much more in order to clear entrance of college to get admission
@sriprasadjoshi3036
@sriprasadjoshi3036 Год назад
@@integration8274 you mean university right?
@bjorntorlarsson
@bjorntorlarsson Год назад
Crazy stuff! I can follow it all (except that even and odd thingy, which I suppose one could look up), but I could never find a solution like this.
@abdulhadiashrafi1342
@abdulhadiashrafi1342 Год назад
Michael, Can you please tell me which book is best to learn Calculus?
@MrMctastics
@MrMctastics Год назад
Jon Rogawski Calculus gives you all the basic tools with plenty of practice problems. A little light on multivariable, but that's ok. I would then recommend a book like schaums outline of calculus to keep you fresh and give you more practice.
@MrMctastics
@MrMctastics Год назад
This channel takes alot of inspiration from interesting integrals by nahin. A little advanced though edit: oh wait he recommends it in the video😂
@abdulhadiashrafi1342
@abdulhadiashrafi1342 Год назад
@@MrMctastics Thank you very much.
@utkarshanand9706
@utkarshanand9706 Год назад
Does anyone want to try this as a general method in similar integrals? Substitute, x+1/x = u x-1/x = v Then, use Arithmetic Mean - Harmonic Mean inequality on x and 1/x. Then, calculate u^2 + v^2 in terms of powers of x and replace the powers of x in the inequality with powers of u and v. You will get something like u^2 >= 4-v^2. Then you calculate the integrals only in terms of u, followed by calculating only in terms of v and compare the results. You should get integrals that are greater than or less than the original integrals. Sometimes, it's a good idea to discuss what they mean physically. (Take care of the 2nπ periodicity).
@peterbenoit5886
@peterbenoit5886 Год назад
I have the Nahin book you mentioned; it is indeed one you can use for self-teaching and I have recommended it to several students and colleagues.
@RTD553
@RTD553 Год назад
My Dad taught this to me before I was 3 yrs old.
@silver6054
@silver6054 Год назад
I taught it to my dad when I was 2 yrs old He probably showed it to your dad
@RTD553
@RTD553 Год назад
@@silver6054 Well I was considering odd and even functions in the womb. Born prematurely through boredom, I fine tuned and improved my incubator.
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