Is Toyota the Next GM 

It's deeper than just being unforgiving for something GM did 20 yrs ago. These American auto makers hate the consumer. They have effectively killed the 4-door sedan to justify selling bigger more expensive vehicles and lining their pockets. They have effectively killed the budget starter car. They were also super arrogant when the Japanese automakers first came to the U.S. They foolishly assumed that American consumers would simply accept their poor quality simply because the vehicles were made in America. More than just making poor quality vehicles, these companies have kind of been antagonistic to their customer base. And worse, they have robbed the consumer of options and variety. I now understand as someone who prefers 4 door sedans that my only future options will be the foreign automakers. The bad reputation GM (and other American automakers) has earned in the past 50 yrs has been well deserved. And there's little that is "unfair" about it.

Hi Jon. I think I agree with you. When Toyota has recall it is applauded for doing the right thing, when GM or Ford issues a recall they are condemned.

Hell yeah Toyota is forgiven for their screwups more than any automaker, including even GM in their glory days. Their quality has slowly gotten worse and worse but people still blindly believe that theyre the best cars ever. Their impenetrable reputation is just insane to me at this point. Ill give it to the Toyota fans for being loyal but damn. Shows how much a good reputation can carry a company, staying sterling even as theyve slowly started making missteps and getting lazier with their quality and their overall product as time has gone on.

Give a man a reputation as an early riser, and he can sleep 'til noon - Mark Twain

Old News,I knew that 20 yrs ago,I really don't believe in GM anymore ever since they buried Pontiac 😥😥

Toyota is still by far the bastion of reliability. I see some people in the comments saying that Toyotas aren’t … that’s just wrong. Check Consumer Reports, any honest publication. You’ll see Lexus and Toyota at the top.

Wake up!! have you ever owned a Toyota? Why don't you read your own comments lots of pissed off Toyota owners sounding off with great experiences about things being fixed when they were found wrong. Unlike gm, ford and whatever they call Mopar these days, whos dealers fuck them over and just put a Band-Aid put on to get you out the door or deny or charge for recall service.

The issue is that GM wants to charge as much as Toyota for their products but GM doesn’t stand behind their products. Just look at the half assed fixes for the Chevy bolt or the Saturn ignition switch. When Toyota found out about rusted truck frames theu replaced them, when there were bad piston rings in 2.4L engines, they fixed the engines. GM just doesn’t care.

I say no though I do understand and respect your point. GM's (and the rest of the US automakers) history of resistance to responding to market changes until foreign companies (Japanese in particular) had taken a big market share away from them has me slower to forgive. Add to quality issues the blatant planned obsolescence and general "made to break" details, and a good portion of buyers will pivot to other makers. The malaise-era American cars were conceived and made by a generation that had yet to fully experience the effect that FAR more reliable options would have. At that point Japanese cars were seen more or less as cramped, underpowered and cheap econo-boxes so GM, Ford, Chrysler, and AMC could get away with the low effort engineering offerings. Toyota, Datsun, and Honda paid attention and evolved. They offered models that actually addressed customer needs. They marketed cars that we actually wanted rather than relied on marketers telling us what we wanted. American automakers only seemed to grudgingly adapt after imports took away market share- rather than actually paying attention to buyers' concerns. To be the new GM, Toyota would need to set a course to their own demise and I do not think they're to that point yet.

Stellantis is the new GM.

Yes (In a bad way). The new Tundra and Tacoma are selling more than ever, but they have a ton of quality issues. Including failing engines in the Tundras and failing transmissions in the Tacomas. It's like they tore the page straight out of GMs book.

Toyota also can't escape the warranty denial stories for the GR Rolla and GR86, cars bursting into flames and RTV in the pick up tubes yet Toyota see's no problem.

I have an anecdote that illustrates the dichotomy. In 2000 GM and Toyota produced both the Prizm and Corolla in the same plant in California. It was found to have bad rings and sludge build up. Toyota recalled all the Corollas and fixed the problem. GM decided to let the customer eat the problem and did nothing. Today Toyota still makes the Corolla. Gm no longer makes the Prizm. This explains the difference between Toyota and GM, today. In 24 years since nothing has changed. I am sure this lesson is not lost on either Toyota or GM.

This video reminded me the good book I read, written by former GM CEO (and an automotive legend) Bob Luts: "Car Guys vs. Bean counters", it explains why GM lost it's lead in the global auto industry.

I don't know... the current narrative that the Tacomas have underbuilt transmissions seem to be pretty prevalent. I think there are a lot more eyes on what Toyota is doing now than there have been previously. Especially with their recent pricing ballooning to what seems like unreasonable territory... I fear they will become the next GM (in a bad way) and build cheap sell high because they've got their brand loyalists and fanboys... We'll have to wait and see I guess. I hope I'm wrong tho

Why can't we have good cheap vehicles anymore?

Any company who feels untouchable is destined to allow decline in quality. People give Toyota a pass because their issues are more recent and people have faith they’ll pull it together. Toyota has stood behind their mistakes in general. Their mistakes are still viewed as uncommon and their bad is far from terrible in in the opinions of many. With GM, we’ve had decades to accept their decline and have much lower expectations. We’ve seen GM have widespread issues throughout their model line. Badge engineering doesn’t help that. Their bad can be absolutely terrible and GM didn’t always want to stand behind it. If Toyota doesn’t get back on track, people will absolutely view them the way the average consumer views GM. Toyota is about 5 years away from a major shift in consumer confidence. Consumers will be a lot less likely to give them a pass. People see GM in many cases not want to admit to mistakes and require major legal action to make it right. I have had good experiences with both. But I drive v8 rwd GM sedans. The only fwd GM I’ve had is a Buick LeSabre 3800. It’s as good as any Toyota I’ve had. But those I knew that had GM compact.. fwd 4cyl had terrible luck. GM never regained full confidence after the Malaise era. Toyota has never really had a malaise era. They’ve had mistakes, but they’ve never had a Chevy Citation or Chevy Vega. I’m trying offhand to think of a Toyota that was as bad as either of those two. I can’t offhand.

Robert Macnamara once said, "What's good for General Motors is good for America." Secretary of Defense. Wow. Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.

If Toyota keeps having problems with their products their sales will stay at an all-time low.

Hey Jon, I bought GM products for about 35 years, then I took a chance on a Chrysler mini van with a 3.6 Pentastar. I couldn't believe the quality. I am very happy with my now 10 year old van. Then GM had trouble with AFM & DFM for their trucks and could not bring myself to risk buying one so I bought a Ram instead. I love the truck. I do wish it was called Dodge. Before I settled on Ram, I sat in a new Toyota Sequoia. The seat was too small for me and not enough leg room so I did not buy. Toyota is not built for people over 6ft.

I had a few GM cars (70's era) when I was younger, and I've had 7 Toyota/Lexus cars since 2002. The GM cars rarely, if ever, gave me any trouble despite them being 15+ years old by the time I owned them. All the Toyotas I had were brand new when I acquired them, and none of them gave me any trouble either. I've rented several late-model Chevys in the last couple of years (post-pandemic) and their quality was average, at best. Cheap plastics, weak transmissions, Chevy's focus on quality seems to be less evident to me.

I get what youre saying.... But GM was way too into cheaping out on their end product, no matter the ingenuity in the build process. Ive never felt that way with Toyota products. Yes they had issues head gaskets early 3.0 and more recent turbo and engine issues, theyve made sure to handle them properly (especially after the throttle issues).

I think it depends on the demographic because I personally know some people on this platform that have a burning hate for anything Toyota or Japanese and would use any historic blunder as an excuse to defame Toyota. Personally, I think GM gets more of the historic grudges than Toyota, but Toyota haters do exist and I feel with the polarization that Toyota has caused with their winning bet to go against immediate EV adoption has increased the number of them. Especially the fans of the Korean and Chinese brands tend to harbor hate for Japanese cars because now they think their cars are superior. My two cents.😅

TOYOTA probably is the best overall builder. This includes the LEXUS division. They are at least shrewd enough to still offer sedans. GM still does but quality is still not quite as solid as TOYOTA. GM had way too much overlap and duplication. They pretty much fixed that too their credit but GMC and CHEVROLET are still twins. This is so BUICK dealers can sell trucks too like the CHEVROLET dealers. FORD is becoming the new STELLANTIS given their quality problems.

"The Reckoning" by David Halberstam is a great book that juxtaposes Nissan with Ford in the early years and in so doing, it illustrates the hubris of Ford and the American auto industry of the 1950s thru the 1970s versus the continuous improvement efforts of the Japanese auto industry at that time.

Funny this came up as I mentioned to you about trading in my older Sonata and getting a new Buick Envista or a lightly used 2017 Hyundai Azera. In the end I thought screw it, I'll just be better off buying a new or lightly used Corolla like a lot of my neighbors have. Decisions decisions ...

The very high complexity around all new automotive products due to Government Regulations and advanced computerized systems has brought everyone’s quality performance down. Could Toyota still build at the perfection level they once did with those very same products? Yes. Could the GM of even today achieve the same from any of their past products? No. Unlike Toyota GM products have always been hit or miss model by model and buyers who easily experienced a miss twice rightfully walked away forever. Not many Toyota buyers ever experience a miss twice. Toyota was crucified in the past unfairly for the gas pedal fatals too. The Government over reacted beyond belief on that. GM proved far better at causing fatals around ignition keys yet Toyota suffered further from their misleading press. I have worked for both companies in the past and while provided with new vehicles every 3 months from GM I can’t tell you how many had issues within even the first month on the road. GM has had too many misses in quality expectations going back to the 1970’s.

Toyota is the new GM in the way that they're making unreliable vehicles with not enough QA or R&D, charging a premium for that and devaluing their brand. Penny pinchers calling shots, uninspiring and outdated vehicles even when it's a new design launch and not listening to customers at all. New tacoma? 20% overpriced, too small, an engine the consumers hate and not really a step forward. Tundra? Engine that is unreliable and hybrid options nobody cares about. New landcruiser? A vehicle that shares the name only with not enough landcruiser or FJ DNA to make it compelling. 4 Runner? 20 year old technology but people buy it because it's the most reliable option. Grand highlander was a great idea with poor execution. Their engine options in it are terrible and it's made like a tesla. Their new camry is good, but why did they pull the avalon for the Crown which is not selling and not what anyone wanted. The Signia is destined to be a failure as well. I think we are seeing the decline of Toyota who got too big for their britches and are lost. I think they peaked in the last generation. I will say the new prius is very good and their rav 4 was a compelling vehicle in a crowded market even if it is long in the tooth by now. Don't get me started on the sienna which lacks AWD and the 2.5 is a terrible engine choice for a non prime minivan.

Great video as always, Jon! It’s an interesting topic to consider, whether Toyota ever gets to that point, if everyone buys the vehicles regardless, should we (Toyota) care about quality?

I dont know what Im going to do in 20 years when I need to buy a car. I dont think there will be any car that will be a option. Hypothetically, even if every automaker made a reliable car, no premature failures, just things wearing out, we will not be able to repair them. You cant change a simple bulb for the head and taillights. All the cameras and safety tech with sensors that may go out. Many automakers are famous for their horrid electrical systems. You cant just put in a new screen if the orginal dies. They will all have turbos and hyrbids or maybe BEV power trains that add complexity. What are poor people suppose to do? Their will seriously be no options. Many many people have cars older than 10, 15, 20 years. We cant afford them. I bought a 2018 Honda Fit because I though Honda was a good brand. Man oh man was I wrong. The quality and reliability is just not there. I dont know how Honda ever made a reputation for reliability. The Fit has so many issues no car should have. How do you have water leaks in the products you have been building for decades? Youd think these brands after making cars for decades if not 100 years would have a exact science down. I genuinely think there need to be regulations demanding reliability for cars. If governments care about the environment then they shouldn't want throwaway products. As long as you follow basic maintenance every car should at minimum last 30 years or 400k miles in my opinion. Should be required by law. Because modern cars are so expensive and they leave so many out of luck. Unless the government wants to start making public transportation and option?

I don't know Jon. It's pretty obvious Toyota isn't building cars as reliable as the Corolla and Camry were up through the early 2000's.

First

Interesting perspective on the phrase 'Toyota is the new GM'. I took the phrase to mean that Toyota builds so many kinds of cars... something for everyone. Not that it's a good excuse, but I think that just about everything that we pay for today is of lower quality than 30 or 40 years ago. Clothes, cars, customer service, food, appliances, etc etc.

Toyota will continue to thrive & gain even more trust, until the day profits become paramount over pride & reputation.

I owned several Toyota in the passed few decades. They all burnt oil. I finally ditched Toyota and go for Honda.

I've got a lukewarm take I'd love to hear your thoughts on: Is Stellantis becoming British Leyland? I'm leaning that direction as time goes on, and I was fairly optimistic about Stellantis when the partnership was first announced

The Japanese automakers are in a different world than the Big 3 American. The Japanese care about quality and their reputation whereas the Big 3 Americans care mostly about their bottom line

It's not the manufacturer it's the UAW. The unions need kicked out of the plants

I don't think Toyota is the next GM. For one thing, they never had too many car brands competing against each other and all of them were the same lazily rebadged vehicle. Toyota launched Lexus in '89 I think, around the same time Honda launched Acura and Nissan launched Infiniti. I will say every car manufacturer has issues with their vehicles, but I think it really is about what company cares about the concerns from their customers when they buy their products. I see Toyota and Honda caring about their customers more than GM and Stellantis. Ford is a very mixed bag.

Toyota is having some engine issues right now and it's very prominent currently but I believe these issues will be solved the storm will pass and people will move on. GM simply suffers from making moves that save money in the short term but hurt reputations in the long run do this to much and your post 2007 Nissan or Leyland 2.0 I mean stelantis.

Good. Thanks.

Isn't it funny how people want to run GM and Ford in the ground but love Toyota. When the 5.7 in Toyota is a Chevy engine. The ride of a tundra is Fords design.

Toyota didn't have problems with not thoroughly cleaning out the engine. That's a lie. How could all 110,000 engines have the same problem. The Car care nut did some digging. He found out the 2024 models went through a parts change in the engine. He doesn't know what but he thinks it was the bearing assembly. It's not just the failed motor. They're having troubles with transmission with the Tundra. Little brother Tacoma is also having problems with the front end and shock mounts breaking due to not having the bump stops. Something all Tacoma trucks had in the past. Is Toyota still reliable for the price? Toyota of today is just as greedy as GM and Ford. Their 2024 models are 25 to 30% higher than the outgoing 2023. We need new competitors to enter the market like the Japanese and the Koreans did in the past. They are no longer affordable. Let the Chinese auto makers come in and wake some stubborn greedy minds.

I think GM made their best vehicles in terms of build quality and reliability starting from the 1950’s-60’s. The full size 70’s GM cars were good too ( mainly Cadillac, Buicks and Olds) but you can tell a lot more cheap plastic parts made their into the interiors and they just didn’t feel that well put together like the previous decades. But as far as engines and transmissions went, they were solid, smooth sailing boats that just floated over the roughest pavement. It’s just everything else around the car is what fell apart to a certain extent. Flash forward to the 1980’s, and this is when I remember my parents telling me that they would never buy an American car again. So many problems from the downsized GM models, plus they looked stogy and lame compared to the previous generation. So my mom and dad bought a 1985 Toyota Camry brand new, and they never looked back. I honestly hated the look of that Camry, it was ugly as hell compared to my dad’s beautiful 83 Buick Regal with pillow top cushion seats. The Toyota was sparse and rode like a truck. But that thing was still going after 300k miles until my brother crashed and totaled it. As time went on, Toyota products improved immensely, especially in the 90’s when they truly were at their prime. The most reliable, well built cars were 90’s Toyota and Lexus vehicles, I definitely remember that time period, it was really good years for the brand, including Honda. Now, I can’t say the same anymore about Toyota products. They are getting cheaper and cheaper feeling every new generation as you can tell the quality just isn’t the same like it used to be. For instance, last year I rode in a 2022 Lexus ES 350, and the car had small rattles inside, including a chassis flexing when driving over uneven pavement and a crooked driveway. The flex was really bad and made the entire car feel so poorly constructed. The car only had 16k miles at the time, so it was very low mileage, maybe this could have been a fluke or a one off, but I was very disappointed and surprised how cheaply made the car felt. I’m at odds with new Toyota vehicles, a lot of recalls lately from them, which goes to show that they are having quality control issues more so than usual. I do remember Toyota saying that they were going to use suppliers that don’t meet some of Toyotas standards because they were having a shortage of certain parts, and were going to still use those suppliers for now? I could be wrong but I do remember reading an article somewhere stating this. So I do believe Toyota has lowered their standards or requirements for certain parts that were previously rejected, is now to be accepted by Toyota. This is a cause of concern for sure. GM suffered serious damage for decades building horrible products in the 90’s and into the 2000’s. I will say that they’ve made huge improvements since then, and I personally used to own a 2017 Chevy Impala with the 3.6L V6 and it was a very reliable car that was well built and pretty comfortable. It never gave me any trouble whatsoever either. I think all automakers make good cars today, it’s difficult to differentiate between brands anymore as they all look and feel the same inside and out. I mean a lot of the different auto manufacturers use the same suppliers, such as interior components, seats, glass, wheels, electrical components, and other parts that really it’s like if one bought a Hyundai, you might think you were driving a Honda or even a Ford, that’s how similar they all look and feel today there’s not much distinction anymore. This was never the case many decades ago when many different automakers built and designed their own parts in house. This includes sheetmetal, wiring, rubber components, window/windshield glass, all engine molds and materials, interior fabrics and leathers, and so on. GM did outsource some of their parts, but they eventually came to own those companies so in a sense it was in house, like the Fisher/Fleetwood plants which is where “Body by Fisher” came from as well as “Interior by Fleetwood”. Not too mention the AC Delco/Remy division of GM which made all the electrical and ignition parts. On the other hand Ford made everything themselves literally. From the massive foundry’s to the immense mining fields they had at the old Rouge plant, when you bought a Ford, you knew Ford made just about everything inside and out of that car, nothing was outsourced. And there was a time when you could easily tell the difference between a Ford, GM and Chrysler built vehicles. The smells, the interior material quality, the way the paint looked, how the doors and hood shut closed, the fit n finish, all that is gone now in new cars.

Love this discussion. I honestly don't think that Toyota was as great as people hyped it up to be during the '90s. Toyota had the oil sludging problem with the 3 L V6 and the 2.2 L four cylinder used in much of their lineup. I personally knew people that had problems with these engines before 200,000 miles that didn't even make it to that point. The main area that I can tell that Toyota did better during this time is they had the best transmissions. While I will argue that the Chrysler 3.3 and GM 3800 and Ford Duratec or Vulcan V6 engines were more reliable The transmissions connected to all of them were inferior to the Aisin supplied units that Toyota used. The other area Toyota did better was the build quality. The interiors wouldn't fall apart as easily or as quickly. Even if Toyota is not as great as people want to believe the '90s was, by comparison they are still among the best. Any new model that Toyota releases is going to have teething problems and it's always been this way. The difference is Toyota will eventually fix it under a normal circumstance. The car care nut pointed out that the iForce V8 used in the second generation tundra had tons of problems when it was first released but because of the kaizen model they were able to fix it and it earned a good reputation. The two GR V6 had quite a few problems in its early years with the variable valve timing, rubber oil lines, and various other things that eventually got fixed. I would argue that if not for the timing chain driven water pump used by Ford on the cyclone V6, the cyclone V6 was actually the more reliable engine. But because Ford engineered themself into a corner with a timing chain driven water pump the problem could not be fixed. That is the difference between Toyota's problems and some of the big threes problems. GM's LS V8 and Chrysler's Hemi engines on the surface are good engines but because they have to rely on the cylinder deactivation they are fundamentally flawed and are not going to hold up and Honda has the same problem with the J engine which would not featuring the cylinder deactivation is a great engine but with it it cuts its life short. Modern cars are question of picking which poison you thank you can survive most easily from. A lot of Toyotas engineering while not as perfect as some hype it to be, by default is one of the better ones. I will state that I don't think the difference between a good engine from Chrysler is that different from a good engine from Toyota, but the bad engines from Chrysler are so much worse than the bad engines from Toyota. And how widespread the bad engines are from Chrysler is not as widespread from the bad engines from Toyota. That's the way that I would explain it. I would also say John with all respect intended, Mary Barra has certainly improved general motors in terms of the interiors, the build quality, the styling, and intangible things, but I don't trust it and I think it's reasonable not to trust it based on their ongoing powertrain problems. There are lawsuits over the eight speed and 10 speed transmissions in the trucks and it seems that the front wheel drive 8 to 9 speed transmission they are still trying to figure out. I'm also not convinced that they have the high feature V6 fixed. I don't trust the ecotec engines. And they obviously haven't fixed the small block v8s because they still have problems with the cylinder deactivation. This is why I don't trust them. I will acknowledge that it doesn't make sense to say that because I was burned by an Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera that I shouldn't trust a last generation Impala which shares absolutely nothing with the Cutlass ciera but I can understand a person's reluctance If they've been burned numerous times by the same brand despite owning unrelated models with unrelated engines despite the good reputation a brand might have. It may not be scientific, but a trend that I've noticed is some people in some brands work while other people and other brands don't. In my case, we have never had good luck with GM. My brother's 2002 Grand Prix with a 3800 left him stranded over and over again with only 104,000 mi. The engine was the only thing that wasn't failing on our 96 Cutlass Ciera (transmission, ABS, interior, countless sensors failing, even the tire iron) at 113,000 mi. My mom's 82 Cutlass supreme left a stranded over and over again and towards the end wasn't running right anymore and we were done with it at 100,000 mi. Then, after talking to numerous owners of their new models experiences with engines failing consistently are 120k miles, transmissions failures happening pre 100k miles on trucks, why should I give them another chance?

GM or Ford would not replace the engine. The Big 3 doesn't want to spend money on fixing a problem if they don't have to. GM is known to fight recalls and if they have to do a recall, they come up with a cheap fix. They seem to care more about their finances then pleasing their customer

I have owned a number of different brands. The way I have approached it is to stay with a brand until they do something to lose my business. I have owned four GM’s, four Mopar’s and for the last 20 years have driven Toyota / Lexus. So far Toyota has not given me a reason to look elsewhere. That may change someday. If I decide to move on to a different brand due to a bad Toyota experience there are other options available besides GM or Mopar. However a major problem now is with all of the burdensome regulations everything has gotten so needlessly complicated that the reliability of all brands is suffering.

In the entire world it's really Volkswagen that is just like the old GM. With their common platforms sold under at least 4 Brands sometimes 7 or 8

I got a 2003 Toyota hilux for free (last year made in Japan). I Said I would take it, sight unseen. I was telling friemd about it the other day, over lunch. He offered to buy it from me, if I ever wanted to sell it, again sight unseen. FYI, that is the third time I have committed to aquired a Toyota or Lexus, essentially sight unseen. I would never in my wildest dreams do that with any other manufacturer.

The new President at Toyota, does not bear the family name. He doesn't have a name to safeguard, he did not build the company to what it is now. That's the danger.

Jon, you can be an absolute GM fanboy sometimes. GM is probably the worst choice you can make in cars.

The short answer is (sorry): this is not going to happen unless Toyota is bought out by an American company.

Are we not going to talk about Toyota at the same time refusing to take responsibility for the GR Corolla fires?

Good video Jon. I’m willing to forgive Toyota for their problems because of the way they step up. Your example of the Tundra engines, and further back was the rusted Tacoma frames. Contrast that with Ford, who did essentially nothing for the dual clutch transmission problems in the Focus. Many of the automakers just try to minimize their immediate costs when a problem occurs, and don’t think about the impact to their long term reputation. I don’t want to buy from a manufacturer that won’t stand behind their own product. Additionally, I don’t think Toyota of today can be as reliable as Toyota of the 90’s because of emissions regulations and fuel economy standards. These just force a level of complexity that is at odds with maximum reliability. This may change with full EVs, though.

The Camry that I maintain just blew the engine at 178K.

No, not even close. Toyotas old cars will live forever. GMs cars never lasted

but who is the new toyota?

There's points made that prove that gm actually hated their customers. A funny comment by regular car reviews on how the shift gate had a part that was used by gm executives to clean their golf shoes rang so true it might as well be gospel.

Nothing have been innovative in the US auto industry. A 1970 Chevy is basically the same as a 1930 Chevy. Front engine, rwd, leaf springs/live axle etc. Corvair beeing a rip off the VW concept. GM is far from the innovative company as for example VW or Citroën.

Toyota backs their vehicles and does not give you a hard time about it at the dealership. I'm not sure what this theory of giving a passes for a break for their mistakes in the media or whatever you're thinking GM fanboy...

I've received 3 Free frames In my Toyota trucks over the years on recall without fighting or arguing. The First with a 95 Tacoma that they bought back at one and a half times Kelley Blue Book regardless of condition or mileage at 272,000. The 2nd truck 2004 tundra with 100,000 Miles that they did in 2020 and the other is a 2009 with 250,000 miles that they did in 2019. Gm has never done that for anybody without a fight. All three of my friends were done under a week I was given rental cars and treated quite fine no extra charges

Thumbs down for the Toyota hater who I don't know or probably never owned a Toyota.