I joined an 8.5 room with my $200 Inalla deck. I told them I didn't know where it was rated but it had cheap lands/mana stones and no thorical. They got mad at me when I won on turn 8 and I tried letting them know I was playing Spellseeker and if no one interacted with any of my next cards, I was going to win. They got mad at me and said any decks with combos were CDH.
If it's the spellseeker line from the cEDH deck, I'd be kinda annoyed about that. 3 mana "I win the game" is pretty non casual, especially since it doesn't rely on anything else. You just win because eminence is ridiculous.
@@Blacklodge_Willy yes. At the time I just believed CDH was sometimes winning turn three or four and always winning by turn six. If you come to that then it was high-powered
I absolutely LOVE that you guys brought up Kaalia as an example of a deck that will probably under preform at a cEDH table. We, my playgroup and I, have been strictly playing cEDH for a while now and we have attracted a lot of attention from the other non cEDH players at our LGS. One night a more casual player came over to our table and seen we had an open seat, so he wanted to play. We told him right from the start that these are competitive level decks and that they are highly tuned and very fast. He wanted to test out his Kaalia deck against our cEDH lists to see where his stacked up. We all shuffled up and I happened to resolve an Ad Naus on turn 2 from 38 life and proceeded to win. He looked down at his two lands and a mana rock and was very salty and upset that the game ended so quick. We did warn him... This is an amazing video! Thank you for sharing this!
Just because a deck "can" win, doesn't change the fact that Kaalia gets massively outclassed by other mardu decks and mardu itself isn't even a top tier color combination in cedh. Kaalia won exactly 1 tournament in february btw and never had any other relevant results. Look at edh top 16 and check the scores, ALL of them are like 1-4, 0-3 etc.@@redrum923
@@redrum923 let's not pretend that list is even remotely close to how the majority build Kaalia. There were barely any targets for her ability. Just the ones that end the game when they hit the table when used in a combo
Definitely agree about your guys' point about everything being 'fair' in competitive. It's very difficult to get people to agree on what casual really is.
My kaalia is high power, but she has stomped decks that have won tournaments in my state. In saying that, I think it's also important to talk about pseudo cedh decks that walk the line enough to be viable in the format but don't have the competitive edge.
Honestly sometimes you can look at a commander and wonder "Will this be good enough? What about if i added stax?" the answer to that is Phage the Untouchable instant kills, and there are many ways to cheat it out without dying to it. DO NOT try to turn a deck into a stax deck just to make a cEDH viable as that is the worst idea one could ever do if they don't know much about cards or the meta game. But a good thing about a Phage deck is it's Black so you could put a Ad Naus and Necropotence in it and even a K'rrik with the Aetherflux reservoir line as a plan B win. Of course i could always fast mana into Karn the Great Creator and a Mycosynth Lattice to just win through combat with Phage, obviously would need set up like Painter's Servant with something like Deathgrip preferably over Thrull Wizard so i can perma counter their spells at any time and just cast Mycosynth and win Don't get me wrong i wanna win and i winna win my own way so there others at the table are stuck with me till i do or they knock me out first
I play cedh and casual and the casual that traditionally cedh players believe is casual. If you can win at instant speed, consistently, while having answers or, playing turbo fast. Your in cedh. If you are playing high powered synergies and aristocrats that generate value or insane cards but still are only winning at sorcery speed or inconsistency winning at instant speed your in high power, it can feel like cedh even but often is differentiated by when players win and how often & quickly. & casual is more or less a mentality; if I am trying to encourage, fun, powerful, bad, janky magic for the whole group. Insert any adjective really. That is more casual. & you can be in Cedh with bad cards, looking ar CPDH it's a competitive mentality with casual level cards. Where high power can often be cedh level cards at a casual mentality. I think cards matter but mentality matter more. Just my opinions 😅
I break it down to speed and interaction. If a deck isn't expected to win within a handful of turns, it probably isn't cedh. Also, if a deck lacks the interaction to stop others from winning or protect its own win, it isn't cedh. Required speed and interaction are going to change over time but a deck, regardless of what it is running, isn't cedh without both at the required level
I've debated on moving into the cedh realm but the current decks I have all fall on the 8 to 9 level with one sitting around a 7 that is a casual zombie deck with 2 combos. The trouble I run into, is budget. Some of the cedh staples like the fast mana and lands are a barrier even when the rest of the deck is finely tuned. Part of me wishes a dragon deck could be cedh but the pure cmc of a dragon tribal just isn't feasible imo. My ur/tiamat deck can win by t5 to 7 or more often grinds out with combat damage. I have a najeela deck that I know can go cedh but again the cost factor. At the end of the day I think high power is just as fun but allows flexibility without breaking the bank.
Ive notcied recently a lot of people played edh jusy to chill with friends and the game is jusy the lubricant to that social environment. Where as cEDH is lets sit down and actually play this game with full focus on the game.
cEDH and casual are the same game. The entire point of cEDH is to push the format as far as possible. You could ban 1,000 cards and a deck that is optimized to win will still have an advantage over a casual deck. You could define a combo however you want and ban that too, and then cEDH would just use whatever synergies that are still just barely allowed by the rules. cEDH isn't the oddity. Casual is the oddity, with it's rule zero.
EDh was always meant to let players play with all their cards and create crazy decks. The day the term "Cedh" was created it divided people and made deck construction boring imo. Some people consider any deck with a demonic tutor in it Cedh. But Green ramp is ok in a "casual" deck. Lets just be honest. It is just people who want to fishbowl with no interactivity against others who want to play a game with interactivity and strategy. I have played hundreds of games of commander. NOONE is honest about there deck power level. I have had groups say they are playing casual then that one person combos off on turn 4. I have been in casual games where people got upset I played a dual land. I have had people get enraged over ONE board wipe I have done. I wont even get into players lack of threat assessment. My point is commander has a huge issue. The "rule 0" thing hurts it more than helps. It creates clicks and elite groups. It was never supposed to be for that. EDH doesnt have tournaments for pairings to be created. So if left to the player base it will be divided into the haves and have nots. And Cedh seems to be a label created by the HAve nots to the haves (not our fault we have been playing longer) You also throw in that commander is now the biggest gateway format for new players and it creates a sour environment. What I personally do is I start off with what I consider a medium power deck (no tutors, no combo). If I find that players are fibbing I level up. If my deck does to well, I power down. (This doesnt always work. I had someone counter 5 of my bears in my bear deck, while another player was building their combo) I think people should make decks with this thought in mind. "do I want to win? Or do I want to have fun?" If you view it that way, you stop worrying about what others are playing and focus on making your deck the best it can be for your style.
yea show up with an urza artifact deck, or a korvold treasures deck and see how they feel. spend like $300 and put trinisphere winter orb and stasis in an urza deck, with like 6 infinite combos. is this cedh? no but is it casual....not really.
As a top 4 / top 16 cedh player, i used to think the difference was mindset. But I've changed my opinion. My goal when i sit down into casual pods is always to win (with a similar matching power level deck). That's whats fun for me is pushing / challenging myself. So i think the difference may have some aspects of mindset going in, but it has to be first and foremost based off the power level of your deck and strength of the player. Even high power can win a cedh game every now and then. But how consistent is it? Are you running the best cards possible to increase to consistency to win as much as possible?
I see "cEDH" as no limit, no restriction of any kind, you play the best of any type of card regardless if it's 1 $ or in the case of Mox Diamond, 700+. If you are not, because you have a budget, it is high power, because you have budget replacements for these cards that cEDH decks would never play. For example: my temur pirates deck doesn't have intuition, because that's expensive, although, looking at it now, the price of it has gone down, I might buy one. it used to be over 100 €, now it's like 88, instead of that, I run "long term plans" which is under 1 € hehehe. it's not as good, unless you follow it up with a brainstorm. but yeah, in short, for me, it's the budget limitations that makes a deck high power. The commander I think also limits how powerful the deck can be. Combo commanders are usually preferred.
I want to say, when listen too you two, you guys really don't sound like you enjoy the game. Even in cedh your enjoyment of the piloting of the deck should be in the mind, cause otherwise why are you playing that deck. Yes being able to win or stop a win the fastest is game, but being able to enjoy yourself while doing it should be part of your game plan. You could play Blue-Farm an win 4-5 games you played but if you felt like you were miserable doing it, then who really won.
do cedh players hate it when high power casuals bring their decks to a pod??? does it ruin it when you have 3 classic cedh decks in a pod and then the village idiot running around causing chaos because they just aren't capable to help??? I'm gonna bring a deck to cedh tournament and I'm curious... as a deck that will 100% feed rhystic studies and docksides to a max with no blue to help the table
I always have this problem at my LGS. Most of my decks are high power (maybe 8; no infinite combos or instant win style) but definitely not cEDH. What is most annoying though is that when I beat people down, they say it is cEDH and bring out their cEDH decks.
Alright y’all need to not be in charge of these videos, all you did for 20 minutes was agree that a cedh deck should be trying to win. Get to the damn point. Lost interest because you said almost nothing of value. This made people even worse at deckbuilding
I do not get why cEDH is a thing ? Everyone is trying to win ? Power levels are just silly. My 7 could equal your 5, it's subjective... So have a rule 0, and ask 2 things: What is your wincon and how fast do you expect to win? Now before the comments of offended cEDH, loyalists lose their mind. I do, in fact, follow cEDH, I also run many decks that one would call cEDH. I also understand the meta game as well. The issue to me is money, period... The more powerful a deck is the more it will cost. An example is a pre-con vs a tuned deck with a ton of fast mana, interaction, and fetch/dual lands. I think we all would agree having a turn one dual land, into Esper then a mana crypt into mana vault and Key or Jeweled Lotus cracked for your commander can win a lot more games than a swamp, pass turn. My EDH group has been playing together for a long time, and we all have a lot of money in our decks, so to me, cEDH is just EDH. Just like Modern is well, modern...
Krark/Sakashima. I realized the interaction after browsing through the set and was so excited about it that i called my friend and for an hour we chatted about busted cards that go in it. It started as a 6 or 7. Then Strixhaven came out and Modern Horizons 2 and it immediately jumped to a 9. Recently ive taken the jump and turned it into the offical cedh power level and ive never been happier. This is and will forever be my favorite magic deck i own, it does something so unique and powerful and plays such goofy cards and no other deck will come close to the joy this one brings me. Coin flips in cedh... who would have guessed it
Recently built it myself as high power as possible minus LED and Mox diamond. Love it so much went and bought tons of special arts for it also. So so funny to run while being so powerful.
I had this deck ever since commander legends came out and feel exactly the same. Its the most fun deck I own and have played but it gets tedious in casual games. Sometimes you don't know if you are winning so you take the turn and in casual you also have to explain everything you do and keep track of all the triggers. Everyone but you is annoyed so that's why I'm trying to get it to cedh level aswell. Just to have other people who are not mad when you do everything you can to win.
Been playing comp 60 cards 5ever. Fairly new to the cedh/casual debate, its becoming readily apparent to me that 2 things are really driving the distinction: 1. Net positive mana rocks 2. 2 card combos
I definitely agree that a big difference between the two is that there isn’t necessarily a social contract in CEDH. In my play groups, there aren’t any feel bads or any spite plays because at the end of the day, we are all trying to win so we all make plays that increase our win percentage. I’ve certainly played in casual groups where even attacks with 1/1s get so many complaints when everyone is at 40 life because of the social construct whereas in CEDH the turbo naus player can be at 10 life compared to 40 for the other players and still get swung at
I have that mindset aswell. Do everything you can to win, I'd do the same. But last Monday when that one dude bolted my ob nixilis 3 times even going so far to use an underworld breach just for the lightning bolt because "I just had the mana open" and "i was scared of your next turn", I kinda got a bit pissed ngl
Yes and if you can choose between hitting a 40 life player or a 10 life player with a 4/4, hitting the 10 life player is probably actually going to do more.
If someone complains at me for attacking them I just focus them down and never play with them again. I run Mind Twist in my casual decks and only ever cast it when some douchebag complains
A little disappointed in this episode. You guys talked a lot about mindset, but I was hoping for more specific cards, fast mana, commanders, # of tutors, etc that defines a cEDH vs High Power deck. Where's that line? Most people who enter tournaments truly believe their deck is competitive enough to win. That's why it's not just mindset, it's also about the cards, the combos, the commander, etc. The "will" to win isn't enough, the cards are what make the win.
The problem is that commander doesn’t have a meaningful banlist, there’s just too many broken things you can do. Neither competitive nor high power decks are fun to play or play against, so the distinction is really null imo Infinite combos shouldn’t exist, they trivialize the entire game
Tivit, seller of secrets. I was playing him as a blink commander with my playgroup, with time we all kept finding cool new and powerful cards and slowly creeping the power of our decks up. lo and behold I figure out Tivit is a cEDH commander. we had a talk and all agreed to take one of our current decks or build a new one to max out its power. And that's how I ended up with a pseudo cEDH Tivit deck that plays almost none of the same 99 I was playing before.
You don't have to use terms like "pseudo cEDH". As long as you, in your quest for making the deck as good as it can be, disregard budget, flavor and any sort of pet card inclusions, it's a cEDH deck regardless how good it is. If you disregard flavor and sense of "fairness" in the quest for power, but use real cards without proxying, it's a "budget cEDH deck". CEDH is binary. It either is or is not a CEDH deck.
cEDH is a deckbuilding approach and also a playstyle mentality. I dont think cEDH players should be afraid to say "my main intent is to win." Yes, you can have fun while playing cEDH AND trying your best to win, but winning is your primary goal. You're not going to pass on a counter that would prevent an opponent from winning because it is their first time at a tournament and you want to help them have a positive experience. Whereas when you are playing EDH (casual or high power), hopefully your main goal is to have fun, which may not result in a win. In a high power pod, I can play high power cards and pass on a win for the sake of the table laughing so hard that we start crying.
Zur is pretty oldschool cEDH commander. It used to be one of the best commander in the format, and now it's a bit of an underdog but you can still win just fine with Necropotence + Borne of a Wind
I feel like I fall in between the two types of people that were talked about. Im all about running the deck as strong as possible and super focusing on the win but at the same time im definitely not building a deck unless I really enjoying piloting it. Not bothering playing a cedh commander just to have the best chance, im building the cedh commander that seems fun on top of being super viable. Building najeela next. Love a good 5 color build
I love cedh, but my playgroup don't like proxies, and I don't have that money to invest in a cardgame , so I aim tonhighpower as high as my budget allows it
I enjoy watching cutthroat games with cool interactions and great sequencing. The competitive aspects of any hobbies I pursued in my life were never as appealing to me as the community/culture that is cultivated in those environments. There’s a certain level of commitment that has to be invested whether it’s time, money and/or mental capacity I have a hard time justifying at this point in my life.
I didn't really think about pet cards before, but I definitely have an unconscious bias towards Magnetic Theft, not for its almost free equip, but it's ability to steal an equipment in response to being attacked, and blocking someone's best thing with their own thing
I play on a tabletop simulator discord, and one thing I've seen plenty of times is people joining up with their pubstompy casual deck because people chased them out of the casual server, saying "it's cEDH", and then they try to play with us and are completely overwhelmed. Usually they don't stick around either, despite us trying to help them get their deck up to snuff or with the play patterns etc.
Hi, could I get a link to this discord? I'm looking to play test a budget cedh list before I commit to irl cards and need to figure out what expensive pieces just can't be cut and which ones are manageable to go without.
Can anyone point me to a place that builds "high power" decks and NOT cEDH? Some of the folks I play with like playing higher power decks but I don't want to show up with what they might deem cEDH, AKA Thoracle packages, LED Underworld breech packages etc. Stuff like crypt, fast mana tutors etc all fair game
I’m a newer player started a month ago and I’ve had a lot of fun playing. Some people at my game store play high level cdh decks and I just wanna get a small board-state and play a little bit and have fun I don’t care about winning. They’ll ruin it for me all the time and I just don’t have fun sometimes. My friend told me if I’m building high level and don’t have a win con by turn 4 it’s most likely not high level. I’m gonna proxy a high level deck just so that I have one and can at least compete with them but I prefer the precon power level where everybody gets to do something at least.
I built a zada commander deck out of bulk commons and somebody was attacking me all game cuz he’s like you can win as soon as Zada comes out and I told him multiple times my deck was not built that way. His brain couldn’t comprehend a non optimized deck im like this is not a cdh deck 😂 it’s commons
Hard disagree. A deck could be over 70% cEDH staples and fail to take down even a mod power table. The context the cards are played in is far more important. You could throw in Thassas Oracle+Demonic Consult into a precon and the power level will still be precon level. It’s just a that 1/500 games you’ll win turn 3, the other 499/500 you’ll lose against high power
@@hellproof2379100%. After I started playing CEDH I realized are so different. A lot of non-CEDH players have a different perspective/grasp of the CEDH realm
I've actually been scaling up Admiral Brass, Unsinkable. After coming to the realization that she has some infinites very easily that use her (mainly because I was looking for a deck I could use my new pretty underworld breach in, I haven't actually built any decks beforehand that could), I still have my basic pirate deck built around her off to the side that I can swap between playing her in a pod that's around an 7-8, compared to a cEDH pod. As I just find her extremely fun after having picked up the precon deck. But who'd guess (Note: everyone who plays cEDH and reads her first line of text) that she doesn't even need LED to go infinite with displacer and breach? Lotus petal can do it too. Sometimes I like having a mini brain freeze in the command zone, that also can just reanimate good value cards like Malcolm/Glint-horn (for another infinite combo to win the game), Dockside, and hell, if it ever comes up, the damn MONKEY (Ragavan), or even other useful pirates like Kitesail larcenist (to do some mini removal stuff from people's boards), Timestream Navigator (Oh look, extra turns!), Dire fleet daredevil (yoink some spicy instants/sorceries), Ghost of Ramirez DePietro (annoying to block and it brings stuff back sometimes) or even siren stormtamer (no targeted removal allowed), while also being allowed to run a basic grixis shell as well.
I really enjoy watching cEDH content but will probably never actually play it because I don't have the cutthroat mindset. I play fairly high power decks but I make deck building and gameplay decisions to slow the game down and avoid winning too fast because I want to see everyone have a chance to "do the thing" before I (try to) take over and grind out a win. One thing I do agree with from the mind set conversation is going for a decisive win. It's no fun for anyone having someone sitting on the side-lines for hours while everyone else goes on. so I have 2 basic rules for how I approach ending the game 1: If I'm actively trying to win I'm trying to take out everyone as close to simultaneously as I can 2: If someone has been eliminated I'm going to try and end the game as soon as possible so that they aren't side-lined too long I may take my time getting to the end game but when it comes it's going to be clear and it's going to be for everyone (except for a couple of pet decks, never gonna give up my Krenko, TSK Voltron) On a slightly different note. One thing I've done to avoid pubstomping new groups is to over-hype the power of my decks so that I start as archenemy. the first few turns are usually enough to get a feel for the play level. If all three players are having difficulty keeping me down then I'm running too high, if one player alone is shutting me down completely I'm too low.
One thing about the fighting game analogy: when it comes to playing anything competitive, you still need to enjoy playing what you are playing. Unless it's your job to win and you are sponsored, the only person you are playing competitively for is yourself. So if you are playing a deck (or character) that is really good but doesn't excite you or bring you joy, you won't be motivated to play as much and likely will find yourself falling off the competitive scene. Conversely, if you don't think you would normally enjoy cedh, try taking a deck you have alot of passion about and tuning it to its absolute highest degree. You may find you love the format when you have a deck you love fine tuning and pushing to it's limit (same can be said of a mid or low tier character in a fighting game). My least favorite argument against a deck being cedh is the commander. We have seen a huge influx of great commanders in the current meta that would have been laughed at 5 years ago for even being considered. It turns out even if a commander isn't a draw engine or costs 5+ mana, if you build around it as powerfully as you can, you can end up with a deck that can hang with tier lists.
I had a korvald deck which was the first deck I built. It ended up being way too strong for almost any table I sat down at unless I played vs cedh decks. I wasn’t ready to play cedh at the time and when MOM came out I ended up turning it into a slimefoot and squee deck which then turned into a 1v1 slimefoot and squee deck. But funnily enough I’m looking at making a 4th cedh deck and planning to do Korvald.
My first foray into cEDH was because I made Krark sakashima after seeing its first game ever on PwP gameplay vid and thinking that would be really cool to make a casual deck of. During playtesting I realised just how strong it was and when I finally brought it to the table, I warned everyone to bring their strongest decks. I still won T6 through multiple layers of interaction and I figured it would just be too powerful for casual tables and I looked into upgrading it. That was about 3 years ago now.
I think the concept you were missing was the idea that cedh is objective as possible and the further you get removed from that the more it's okay to be subjective in your deck building
I just judge it by the turn the deck consistently wins on. If your deck is consistently winning on turns 2-5, its cedh. Period. I would say winning on turns 6-8 is high power edh, and 9-12 is edh/precon!
I always believed 9's and 10's were cedh you may not have all the og duels or you might not be running the absolute best cmdr for your strategy. But its consistent fast strong
I've been working on scaling up Lurrus to a cEDH deck. I'm still making some improvements and doing testing, but I've made a ton of progress with it.At this point, the deck can impact the table pretty consistently and can present win attempts more regularly. My next iteration plans to have a broodlord combo.
This echoes a lot of thoughts I’ve been having lately with EDH, I’ve typically always used cEDH lists as a starting point when brewing decks and despite not running all of the best mana rocks I’d still run into issues where I felt like the asshole at the table. “Power level” is an inherently flawed concept IMO, there are too many factors at play aside from what cards you’ve included in your list. If you don’t know how to properly pilot a deck it doesn’t matter what’s in it, someone piloting a casual/high power deck will probably beat you 90% of the time.
I scaled up my Raggadragga GoreGuts Boss deck. It started as mana dork/big spell tribal and transformed into a deck that hangs with Najeela, Urza, Tyma/Rog
Kess maybe but it will detract from the main win con I think. I run a version that does reanimator to lock out and gain advantage but I still win with thoracle, it makes the deck a lot slower tbh and less focused but I just enjoy reanimator strats
Scaled down Yisan recently so I could play it at casual tables. It's still too strong so I find myself intentionally making suboptimal play allowing for the table to have fun. I had someone start to tell me my deck was too weak for 2 turn cycles while I was telling them I had enough on board to win. They said I was lying and told me to prove it so I pumped a bunch of mana out with my dorks, dropped great oak guardian untapped them cast a shared summons then a Zopandrel and Craterhoof. Game over.
I really believe yisan is not viable in cedh anymore because people is paly adnaus and turbo stuff by turn 2, and Yisan always stopped people from 4 on, or with luck in turn 3, but never at 1 or 2...so no, monogreens are unviabke at cedh. Rather, magda and kirrik they can handle the cedh, because one is fast (kirrik) and magda responds fast (shencan stop turn 3 decks)
@@diegorezi5760 I agree with you for the most part. However, Yisan is a great learning tool. Teaches people to see intricate lines and the proper mentality. It won't be winning tournaments but it definitely takes games from people that don't respect it and it is possible with a turn 1 Yisan and an untapper to win turn 2. Trust me, I played against an amazing Yisan pilot for a long time. However it is not resilient and lacks proper interaction and removal.
Just 10 minutes into this video and I am done with it. It very clearly illustrates the overarching problem with the format and all this turn 0 discussion and nonsense. It's 100% subjective and all you end up doing is dancing around each other's opinions trying not to offend. It's a game. You're trying to win. That's the way it should be played. Winning is fun. Losing isn't but perhaps it was a close game or an epic game and you're able to glean some enjoyment from it even if you didn't win or you learn and become a better player going forward.
A lot of EDH players don’t play this way. Hence “c”edh. Competitive EDH is all about trying to win and that’s great. A lot of people play EDH to do very silly fun things that you couldn’t do in other formats and winning is a secondary goal. The game still needs to end, but it’s more about assembling kaldra. Or flinging a 90/90 at your opponent. Or whatever. The conversation is “What priority is winning to you and how fast are you trying to do that”. cEDH answers “winning is very first priority and I’m trying to do it as fast as possible”.
I’m 9:09 into it and stopped the video to come here and say this. “Is it technically CEDH?” Makes me laugh out loud. Pilots can enter bad decks into any format and still win and vice versa you can lose with a meta deck all day long. We should all stop trying to define this game and experience and attitude taken towards it universally and for others. Competitive edh is just that, competitive. End of story no conditions. Please stable your high horse.
It’sdifference between EDH and “Commander”. EDH: I came to play competitive magic because that’s what I’m used to. Commander: I play for fun because it’s a social game not to be taken too seriously.
My hot take today is Cedh is the direct result of wizards involving designing xards with the format in mind. Before it was finding wacky cards in wacky commanders that werent designed with a format in mind Casual edh is more akin to coffee table magic where you wanted to playing silly things with your friends at home.
I think power level should be defined as the turn the deck is designed to most consistently win on. Period. card quality doesnt matter if your deck has no plan. My rule zero convo is always, my deck wants to win/stop wins by turn xx. To me t3 is a cedh deck. T5 is high powered. This is how you have the convo so the feel bads about t9 cradle with 2 creatures on the field or a random t4 win with a "battle cruiser" doesnt kill a table.
It does though. Clarify, win on or stop a win on xx turn. I usually say both but I accidentally overly simplified on here. Ie if your dropping t1/t2 hard stax that locks out t2/t3 wins common in cedh then your also cedh.
Also, sorry if Im coming off overly aggro. Ive been pushing for this definition forever. Its really the best way to look at this convo. I hate not being able to use my cradle. I love that card and jam it into my awful t10 deck.
From a casual EDH POV, there's no such thing as "high-power" casual. If it's too broken for casual EDH, it's by definition cEDH. The Play to Win cEDH channel have spelled out their own guidelines for casual EDH deck construction, which serve as a good dividing line: * NO infinite loops * NO "I win right now" cards * NO mana-positive rocks (except Sol Ring) * NO unrestricted tutors for less than 3 mana * NO cost-free counter spells * NO card priced over $100
Dont know I habe rebuild Omo, Queen of Vezuva completely ,high win rate,3 Instant win Combos ,very fast on Combo and creatures , definitively Not Casual (wins Turn 6-7) but also absolutely Not cedh There is Something between Casual and cedh
Do you have all fast mana and multiple combos? Cedh. If you have some fast mana and maybe 1 combo? High power. Or does it win in turns 1-5? Cedh. Win in turns 6-10+, high power
Explorer's of the Deep has been my recent major scale-up. I've swapped 33 cards and plan to swap another 3-4. I've added a ton to the mana base (partially to show 1/2 my play group why lands matter lol), stuff like cavern of souls, Boseiju, Otawara and Nykthos Also leaned more into Hakbal's +1/+1 generation, adding in doubling season, Court of Garenbrig, Ozolith the shattered spire, The Ozolith, the great henge and The Skullspore Nexus (insanely fun to flash in when a board wipe resolves. "Table, meet a 40/40 fungus dino") Swapped a handful of merfolk out for Lord of Atlantis, Vidalia hexcatcher, Tishana's Tidebender. Some none merfolk: Nylea, God of the Hunt, Roaming Throne, Kodama of the West Tree, wildgrowth walker, Cankerbloom and Kami of whispered hopes. Added several others, Agatha's Soul Cauldron and Sensei's Divining Top being the two most fun I upgraded it because I really enjoyed the process with this deck, falling in love with tribal synergies recently. The other reason is to have something to play in higher power pods. I've had pretty good success with the deck, normally winning the first game every time, but then I become the target of the table for the following game, so now I need to brew another higher power deck so I can swap lol.
Haven't finished the episode yet but just wanna say a PL 10 deck isn't cedh, it's high power and people need to stop ranking every deck they own is a 7 and just admit there deck is highly optimized or high power or even a very strong archetype naturally. With precons being the standard anymore those should be 3s or 4s
Commanders for CEDH need to check these boxes. 1) Consistent benifit or self buff. 2) Consistent Win Con. 3) Consistent removal/tutoring/mill/draw. 4) Consistent ramp or tempo plays.
Currently working on a pair of decks before I decide which one I start entering CEDH with for the first time! Chatterfang Aristocratic Squirrels, or Kinnan Thoracle :3
Chatterfang Aristocrats is gonna be tough to make cedh and Kinnan should really not be playing thoracle. Go to the cedh decklist database and see what other people are on. You don’t need Thoracle in Kinnan. If you go infinite colored mana you will win the game you don’t need to play a card that’s useless when you aren’t winning (Thassa’s Oracle) just to win more when you get your combo off.
@@NewSchoolPOKERstrat yeah I know, I have edits planned, but currently Kinnan Thoracle wins with a mass of sea monsters and like 20-30 devotion. It’s hilarious and I’m leaving it as is until I get some stuff I ordered.
I think if you play against real cedh decks being piloted by cedh regulars you’ll find those ideas are too slow and clunky compared to what a finely tuned cedh deck is doing
At that point either an infinite mana outlet into a finale of Devastation or Protean Hulk lines is likely your best avenue. But no reason to not play Thassa's if your deck is really cedh.
If you play at LGS I imagine it goes a little something like this: "Guys, we're playing a 6-7 casual game" "My decks are my decks" "OK..." *turn 3 absolute destruction cEDH combo win* "My decks are my decks, did you have fun?" ???? PROFIT?
