Jarl Elisif, Incompetent?! - The Elder Scrolls Lore Theory 

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If the Empire were to take Skyrim I'd say a pragmatist would be a better high king (or Queen) than Elisif. I'd say Balgruuf is the only choice. He isn't corrupt like the Jarl or Markarth or isn't out for his own gain like Maven. He's also willing to work with the Empire but won't bend over backwards like Siddgeir

jarl ballin' should be high king ballin'

I think her main problem is actually confidence. She's not confident so she lets others rule for her. Her husband also died two months ago so maybe she's letting people with cooler heads make decisions until she's finished mourning. Hell Falk even says that. "She still mourns greatly for her husband, High King Torygg. So she leaves many of the courtly details to me." During "The Man Who Cried Wolf" she takes Varnius warnings about the cave seriously and wants to send a legion to scour the cave but Sybille and Falk talk her down. Now her initial response was over zealous but still correct. She wasn't dismissive of it like Falk and Sybille. Falk Firebeard is her steward and is fiercely protective of her in some kind of fatherly or brotherly kind of way. If they made him Jarl he'd probably give it back to her. She's certainly more competent then Laila Law-Giver or Siddgeir. Skyrim has a problem with incompetent or corrupt Jarls. Maven? Corrupt, though her becoming Jarl just means she rules directly rather then through her puppet. Thongvor Silver-Blood, super corrupt he had to know what his little bro Thonar was up to with Madanach. Dengeir a touch crazy, Korir blames everything on mages. Elisif the Fair at least knows to delegate responsibility to people who know what they're doing and cares for her people.

Elisif is a puppet of the Empire. As stated in your video, yes she's a symbol, yes she is incompetent to rule. However, what you forget to see is that Elisif KNOWS she is being used a puppet. She herself says that the steward does all the 'ruling' and Tulius deals with the war. She understands that she can't rule and she understands that she is but a mere place holder for the throne. Another reason they chose Elisif to be appointed Jarl, is because a Jarl is a target. An assassin or a Stormcloak spy, would much more prefer assassinating a Jarl than a steward. Not to mention she agrees with EVERYTHING her advisers throw at her, this results in that the council can rule from behind a scenes.

Balgruuf would make the best high king in Skyrim as far as I'm concerned.

Thinking about it I feel so sad for Elisif. Poor woman.

Originally, The Last Dragonborn would have been able to marry Elsif, but that was unforchunly scrapped, as was being able to marry Serana or Haelga.

Jarl Elisif always seemed a bit naive to me. She probably grew up in a rich family, and pampered all her life. She's probably never picked up a sword in her life, and her idea of a battle is something out of a fairytale. Compared to other Jarls, like Bulgruuf the Greater. Who seems like he was a brave warrior in his younger days. Ulfric Stormcloak who served in the Imperial Legion, and a few others. Seem to have a more realistic grasp of the world they live in. Where Elisif's world is just the walls of Solitude and that's it. She doesn't even carry a weapon of any kind. Elisif is simply in her position of Jarl for political reasons and nothing more.

To be fair she's incompetent because she was never meant to be High Queen. She was merely the wife of the murdered High King. She is merely a placeholder. As a figure head until the war is over and Skyrim can be removed from martial law.

Why howdy fellow elder scrolls lore creator. Why have I never heard of you before :O

I also see Elisif as incompetent. In the Thalmor Ambassy (in diplomatic immunity) she thinks the thalmor are skyrims allies beacuse of their partys while it is so obvious that they just want the empire and its subjects to think that. But at least, she is not as incompetent as Siddgeir (Jarl of Falkreath). He is the definition of incompetence.

Can you please be kind to her? -She just lost her husband, who clearly loved and was loved by her. -Was forced into a position she is unprepared for, and possibly never wanted to begin with. -Sounds like a particularly young woman, I would say in her early twenties or so. -Has to face the fact the Trump-fric who killed her husband caused her nation do descend into a pointless civil war, caused a heavy interference by the Empire in everything, made her beloved husband the topic of mockery and despise, possibly going down in History under a bad light that he clearly never deserved; has to manage the most impossible cultural and political crisis in recent History just after a extremely costly phyrric war against the Domion, all meanwhile the End of the World flies about. -Has to accept her position as a figure head for the Empire, her insolent traitorous court, the blasted Thalmor and the rebels who portray her in a terrible light to their own political gain. -Is talked down by everyone, as afore mentioned, while genuinely trying to learn her duties and honour her late husband's legacy. -May be blamed if assorted members of the Imperial Family are murdered in her city. -Is under the influence of a vampiress, by Julianos' beard! -Have I mentioned how she genuinely loved her husband? The one who was considered a good ruler, but fell from grace thanks to Trump-fric; the one who is now remembered as a weakling and subject to mockery, the one who was wrongfully taken from her when (1) Trump-fric could just have asked the High King to declare independence, instead and firstly than challenging him (2) needed not to kill him (3) needed not use the Voice against him, since he was more of a aristocrat than a warrior and (4) have I mentioned they clearly really, really, really loved each other and she is beyond heartbroken? Conclusion: She is not incompetent. She is just inexperienced and young under the worst moment in Skyrim's history since the Oblivion Crisis. That does not mean she is incompetent, she is just way over her head. If you want to talk about incompetent leaders, go to Markhat or Winterhold. I just would never call High Queen Elisif a incompetent leader.

Why can't the dragonborn just take the throne

I don't think Jarl Elisef is incompetent for her role, but I do think she is being manipualted and used by her court wizard Sybele Stentor as when Varnius arrives from Dragonbridge to ask the Jarl for help, Elisef immediately wants to send a full legion to secure the town but is stopped & interrupted by Sybelle who says her scrying has revealed nothing of note at Wolfskull cave. Yet when the Dragonborn goes to Wolfskull cave there is a group of necromancers trying to summon Potema. Sybelle is a vampire and we know vampires are able to manipulate others. Everyone in the Blue Palace fears Sybelle and even the headsman in Solitude says Sybelle takes prisoners from the dungeons. Even the wizard Melaran fears Sybelle a powerful ALTMER wizard. Sybelle is in control of the court of Solitude, she openly confronts Falk Firebeard, Elisefs steward and Thane Bryling telling them that they wouldn't be able to defend the city without her scrying. She openly tells Falk that Elisef is only Jarl cause her husband was, she'll be replaced in a matter of months (hint Potema). On the matter of ulfric's duel with High King Torygg, Ulfric used the vocie to throw Toryyg to his knees before killing him, a Nordic duel is to be used with sword or axe, like Balgruuf offered to Ulfric before the Battle of Whiterun which Ulfric declined - that duel was to be in the ways of their ancestors according to Balgruuf, yet Ulfric refused the duel, to instead besiege Whiterun a city full of innocent civilians and some who even supported his claim (the Greymanes), those fireballs launched by Ulfrics catapults could've killed anyone within the walls of Ulfric including the Greymanes. Plus neither Ulfric nor Galmer Stonefist come to Whiterun themselves to lead the battle and instead leave the battle to their subordinate, yet the Empire has Legate Rikke at Whiterun, Tullius's second in command in Skyrim.

Elisif is a good person unlike some jarls like Siddegeir, but she doesn't seem to be the ruling type.

I like her as a friend, but yes she is greatly inexperienced, young, native, and incompetent. An example of this is when she wanted 1,000 troops to parade through Solitude to raise morale, during the Civil War.

When she shows up in diplomatic immunity, there's an option "are you with one of the jarls?" like she was some unimportant retainer of a nobleman. Lol

i respect Ulfic has the voice and if he's in a battle he most use it to survival, but in a duel for the throne, it should have been a normal duel, like when Ragnar fought with Earl Haraldson.

I think her inexperience makes her incompet But in time it could be diff...but who knows

You just triggered all the Elder Scrolls feminists

I would say that the only reason that Elisif is even jarl or have a claim to high King/Queen is since the empire is backing her & that's percisily because she's incompetent. This makes here easier for the empire to control since if they did put Fulk Firebread or some other lord on the throne thier going to have different ambitions plus experience. Making them harder to fool into making deals that heavily favour the empire. For example. No sane ruler would let hundreds of foreign troops with one of the finest generals anywhere near their hold. Since this would cause a massive rift between the people & the crown since these men are also likely going to be policing the area as well. This makes the local population feel as if their under the boot of a foreign power making more likely to rebel. Plus these men aren't loyal to you their loyal to the empire meaning that as soon as the war goes south their simply going to pullout & throw you to wolves it's the same conundrum with as sell swords. One last thing if your entire military relies on foreign support what stops them from simply toppling you when the war is over & no other force can challenge them.

for a person who has only been a ruler for a few months shes doing fine in my book. she also is doing a damn fine job being a figurehead against the thalmor puppet known as Ulfric Stormcloak.

Anyone remember the nord thane in the solitude? Well in one scene he talks to his high elf advisor or whatever. They were discussing bringing new weapons for the imperial army. He then proceeds to say he would sell those weapons to the rebels I'f they had the coin. So obviously the imperial thane is corrupt and if the empire wins the war, maven, folk reach, and the corrupt thane in the court will all have power and not for the benefit of Skyrim

Someone else has probably said this but could the Thalmor want her as leader so they could easily control her?

Everyone knows by now that Sybille Stentor is the real power in Solitude

"A contingent of soldiers to safeguard our people? NAH!!!!!! This guy we'll give 500 gold to is enough, right, that's not gonna blow up in our faces at all right?" lol

When -aren't- monarchs incompetent?

I had always assumed that Elisif is just a temporary Jarl given the fact that it 1, allows general Tulius to easily take command without a more confident Jarl standing in his way and 2, she is the legal heir under the assumption that the duel was not fair and so they can't just depose her. Plus a woman is better while Ulfric is still leading the rebellion because it would I'm guessing be far more politically incorrect for him to challenge her to a duel and kill her in a similar manner to her husband, something which if you side with the Stormcloaks does in fact come up as Ulfric spares her life instead forcing her to abdicate her claim to the throne.

She's not incompetent. Just inexperienced. I believe she will make a great queen.

I think Jarl Elisif can stay as a Jarl over that region because she is motivated to do what is right plus still grieving over her husband's death. Elisif being Jarl is helping her cope with her husband's death. I think Jarl Elisif does not need to be high Queen of skyrim though. I would pick Jarl Balgruff the Greater or Jarl Igmund if I was the empire though. Jarl Elisif is just very incompetent but Jarl Elisif is trying to do her best though. so i can see Jarl Elisif improving with experience and turning into a great Jarl over time but as of right now in the time of events in skyrim. No to Jarl Elisif being high queen of skyrim.

Ulfric also fled as soon as he killed Torygg. So it can be said he abandoned his claim. Ulfric is only brave when he thinks he can stack the odds in his favor. It really sounds like he was a better man when he was younger. Elisif is like most Jarls. Ignorant. Some are just more so then others. They know their traditional place and customs and that is it. Sad fact is most of the Jarls could stand to be better educated. Elisif ,while well meaning, by her initial order it would have been terribly imprudent. A legion? That is an unbelievable amount of people for what is essentially a scouting mission. That is why Falk scolded her to be more tempered about it. She was throwing an entire army at what could be wolves. And soldiers kept busy bearing bushes for what may or may not be a threat cannot defend your city from invasion during a time of civil war. What she did wrong was trying to send more firepower then the problem warranted. I see her court as not undermining her but trying to reign in her excesses. Falk, at least, seems to want to guide her towards the correct path. Who knows with Sybil. She never made it clear who she was loyal to besides Torygg. Who is dead. I do get the idea she is currently just serving her own self-interest until either she has to pack up or another worthy high king shows up.

Still better than Ulfric at least.

WOW You seem to Forget that The MOOT which is mentioned repeatedly in the game Is the one who assigns the High Kingship While it is generally Passed By Blood line any Jarl Can become high king During the moot.

great video yet again. has some really good insight on this political issue

Elisif incompetent.. Theory you say?? It's a fact even though I do like her. Why does the Empire support her? Yeah the reasons given are valid, but I believe it's mainly because she makes for a fantastic puppet. With her on the throne the Empire is almost directly running skyrim. Unlike someone like Ulfric who would still for the most part be his own person as a ruler who may or may not go against Empire directives. Elisif on the other hand would never put up any resistance even to directives she frowns at (or she may attempt to resist but could do nothing at the end of the day

The problem with Elisif is that she's young and naive, inexperience, and puts her emotions before her logic until she is questioned. The fact that she wanted to have a parade using all Imperial soldiers during a crucial time, she's out of her mind. She may have been the wife of the high king, but that shouldn't be a merit to make her high queen. I think thane Bryling would've made an excellent choice to replacer her as a jarl. She has her head on her shoulders. She doesn't back down to the court wizard meaning she doesn't seem to be intimidated thus showing strength. She's also nice and shows concern for the citizens when you go and deliver the note from the small town with the mine about the order. She also seems to have a level head.

You should do a video/theory on vampire houses in different provinces.

Elisif was just never expecting or even expected to be anything but a fuck doll, in the most vulgar of words. She's certainly no gold-digger or a worthless brat, as her drive is there and a genuine care. As our man here stated she's just overshadowed by a court that doesn't support her. Which means they'll reinforce bad court choices and ultimately be weaker as a Hold in the later years. Especially considering if the civil war keeps dragging on that whole time... yeeeeesh... yea prosperity is gonna drop and safety to boot. The local recruitment and garrisons help for the time being until they are moved out towards more of the Stormcloak lines. Granted that the Stormcloaks are not as well equipped and just as poorly experienced on such a grand scale, but at least they have actual unity and lack of hesitation in their decisions both locally and on a wide scale. Admittedly Elisif's counterpart on the Stromcloak side would be Lala but ehh reminder that Maven already run the city pretty damn well aside from the bullying. If you look at Riften's security both militarily and locally, it's pretty damn safe. Basically the bandits are more or less likely employed and thus controlled generally. And as well the city remains in great shape as opposed to the other Stomrcloak Holds. And under the table politically it's set for either outcome. Able to be taken or retained by either side with minimal damage to trade routes and the city itself. 👏 Still kill that bitch though. If Lala didn't have to please Maven, and got them coffers stuffed, Lala and Mjoll would be truly bringing justice for all and the more patriotic spirit would be instilled in the Hold.

keep this up and you will become big soon

What if the members of her court actually are thalmar sell outs. Afterall we know that titas mede. Doesn't want to send more numbers up to skyrim. What if the thalmor aren't just pressuring him. But threatening those around him.

do a theory about Talos' true origins such as him being hjalti of alcaire, wulfharth, turin arctis, or as I believe, a combination of all three

It is not a politacl cluster fuck Ulfric won Halgrin, Tullius says fuck nord tradition due to it threating his reputation he love so much

What is the name of that beautiful soundtrack you have playing in the background?

Falk is in an adulterous relationship. If he's cheating with that chick he can't be trusted to not cheat on his people.

At least she is better than the jarl of Falkreach or something. That bastard don't even try to gorvern his hold.

I think elisif is jarl and high queen because she is a puppet.

Falk FireBeard for high king 2020

you know that elisif would never become high queen ? she would become a ruler so she would become a high king even as a woman i even have a historical evidence to back it up check on wikipedia person :Jadwiga Andegaweńska she was the only heir to the polish throne after Kazimierz III the great and evena after she was married to Władysław Jagiełło the great dutch of lithuinia she was still a king but she later abticated and in this period poland had two kings at the same time

Elisif becoming queen is stupid and exactly why I supported the Stormcloaks. She legitimately has no claim to anything, unless she is related to Toryig which Bethesda never really clarified where she would have the right to ascend the throne or Lordship. No where in history did the wife of a ruler take their place when they passed. She might not even be of noble blood.

i can't blame her, her husband was killed only recently. in front of her eyes i assume.

I feel bad for her

what if thalmor ordered somehow someone who works for them and is also in elder council of empire and got more power than most of councelors to put Elisif on throne of Skyrim just to make weaker ruler and make more public unrest about who need to be true high king.skyrim woud be so much easier to conquer then(sry if i made some grammar mistake english is not my native lang)

but what if the canon nord dragonborn marries elisif and gains claim to the high kingship, with bend will and other shouts dragonborn could be pretty rad ruler, since dragonborn knows the people of skyrim and has a better sence of what right and fair and most importantly possible at the moment and if the imperial victory is cannon then dragonborn would have empire backing him up as well and yeah elisif the fair is dummer than left leg´s boot

make skyrim great again

Elisif + Amorous Adventures + OSEX = Not Incompetent

Could you do a video on the history of Elsywer Because whenever I look for a video on Elsywer lorist have different stories on so I want to know what you think.

#First Notification Squad

You can become thane of solitude. It sounds to me like if you're a nord and side with the imperials the dragonborn can become that jarl and high king!

pretty good vid dude, ur Videos are getting better and better. Keep it up

Lets not forget that Torigg was elected by the Moot which I think Ulfric was in. As you said, I don't think the one on one battle between Torigg and Ulfric was viewed legitimately, Torigg had deep respect for Ulfric and would have joined him in the rebellion if asked. As you said, I think the Empire is keeping Elisif as a symbol of Ulfric's quote on quote greed. I think the competence of Elisif doesn't matter as any leader siding with the empires knows they are in the yolk of the thalmor, and on the other hand a leader like Ulfric leaving the empire would make the second war with the empire a inevitable win for the aldermi dominion. BTW could you make a video on your choice between the Empire and the Stormcloaks? Who do you think is right?

#NotMyJarl

I wish Elisif was more like Rikke. It would make her a more reliable ruler. I usually don't like women in positions of power because they tend to make decisions based on emotion instead of logic and they almost always fail to consider the long game but if it were someone with a certain discipline and resilience like Rikke then I would be ok with that. But Elisif is too soft.

Can you do a video on Black Marsh?

Hey Imperial knowledge, who do you support in the civil war have you done a video about your stance

Was Ysgramor the original High King? Didn't he establish Windhelm as the original capital so is Ulfric his descendant. That's another claim. Not sure if my lore is right.

the collage of winterhold

So Ulfric by right of Halgirn (political duel) note Halgrin to win you either kill or make him/her summit

Cause his recent theory on Ulfric being an imperial agent.

There was no murder! Ulfric just kicked the shit out of that weakling Torryg. According to everything we have heard from the lore Ulfric challenged Torryg to meet him as a man blade to blade. Ulfric has the voice yes. But guess what so did the Nord chiefs in the first era when these laws were created. So by law him using the voice is not breaking the rules. The only reason why this is a question on if it is ok is because the Empire does not want Skyrim to secede from the Empire, and if Ulfric was High King they'd be gone faster then you can say fuck. If Ulfric had said he'd stay with the Empire but with him as High King of Skyrim the whole thing would have been glossed over because the Empire does not give a shit who rules as High King as long as that High King kneels before the Emperor.

Nice vid

buddy fix your audio

My theory: Elisif is the Empires bitch. Elisif had a lot of luck to be the high kings wife. High King dies -> she gets to be the high "king". Everyone is happy, Empire can do what it wants as theres no Jarl denying Tullius orders, Elisif enjoys the advantages of being a Jarl (wealth, position of power -> authority -> feeling to be someone useful, ...) and her advisers rule most of what happens. Anyone disagrees the situation? No.

According to most succession rights spouses have no legal right to the throne at all torygg probably has a cousin or brother with a LEGAL right to the throne or it wouldn't be too outlandish for him to have a distant relation to baalgruff for example

Ehh... Just make General Tullius Jarl of Solitude. He is better.

She is the rightful High Queen and is deserving of every respect.

My solution to this issue is a political marriage between Elisif and either Falk Firebeard or General Tullius, preferably Falk Firebeard as he is a Nord and a local the only problem in thesw unions being Falk's status in the Hirarchy of nobility the other Jarls most of whom come from proud Noble families will likely not rake kindly to a minor nobleman being given a potential claim on the throne and Tullius being a forigener and admittedly ignorant of Nordic customs and culture Tullius marrying Elisif would also be fuel for the Stormcloak cause with the proud Nordic people resenting some foreigner just marching in with his army and proclaiming himself king